I have to be honest, I have not seen LJ play a lot of games (of course part of that is because he hasn't). I can really only go by statistics and ESPN highlights. Most people around the NFL say that Tomlinson is the most talented back in the league because of his strength, speed, vision, cutback ability, recieving abilities, etc. How does LJ compare from what people have seen. Can his talent overcome the losses on the OL this year?
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What is Larry Johnson's talent level? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter lebowski
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Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Hard to say, but Tomlinson has thrived in the NFL with average QB play at times and a subpar O-Line at times (2003, most notably), which neither Alexander nor Johnson have ever done, so that is probably why Tomlinson is often called the best back in the NFL.
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MelvinTScupper
Guest
fixed
Aaronstory
Footballguy
Welbourne and Roaf?
He ran for 2000 yards in a season at Penn St. That tells me somehting about his talent. It's really hard to pinpoint his talent because there havent been many backs with his combination of size, speed, power and cutting ability. THat in and of itself tells me that he is a rare talent. The only thing close to Larry Johnson in those charecteristics is Jim Brown, and I believe that is a fair comparison to his ability.
Keys Myaths
Pokerguy
I don't think he's on LT's level as far as a pure back is concerned.
Honestly, worst case scenario, I can see LJ being one of the biggest busts in fantasy football history (and yes, I own him, before you get crazy over that).
If Roaf really retires, Richardson's gone, and something happens to the aging Shields...this is a BAD year.
Honestly, worst case scenario, I can see LJ being one of the biggest busts in fantasy football history (and yes, I own him, before you get crazy over that).
If Roaf really retires, Richardson's gone, and something happens to the aging Shields...this is a BAD year.
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
He has outstanding "wiggle", which is what I (and others) call the combination of tackle breaking ability and balance. He is very good at keeping his feet after being hit and falling forward. His vision and cutback ability is good, but not great, IMO. With the line that KC had (has?) he didn't need that. In comparison, LT2 does not have as great of wiggle, but he has fantastic cutback and vision. Superior to LJ.
I think you see this most clearly comparing them at the different levels of the defense. At the first level (DLine), LJ is not used to seeing much resistance because of the outstanding holes his OLine provides. So just getting through them quickly with a head of steam is enough. LT2 needs to use his vision more to find the hole and slide through it.
At the second level (LBs) is where the biggest difference is, IMO. LJ can use his excellent wiggle to get through glancing blows of LBs, but a LB with a read bead on him will stop him because his vision/cutback ability is not usually enough to fake the LB out. LT2, on the other hand, has outstanding cutback moves and can get through that second level of the defense easier because of them.
At the third level (DBs) LJ's wiggle really helps him shrug off the tackle attempts of the smaller DBs. LT2 doesn't have that as well, but his vision can still help him fake out the DBs. I also think that LT2 has better breakaway speed.
In a nutshell, when LJ gets through the first level of a defense in a hurry due to outstanding running lanes, he's hard to stop. But if he is slowed up some there, I think he's easier to stop at the second level than LT2, who can really get by the 2nd level and 3rd level with his vision and moves. I think that due to these differences, LT2 is the better RB with a poor to average OLine. I would expect that LJ will not perform as well this year if the OLine does indeed falter, but he still should be a great RB.
Just to add an important point: I think that LJ is much more dependant upon the play of his OLine than LT2. So I think there is more variance with LJ and that makes him more risky.
I think you see this most clearly comparing them at the different levels of the defense. At the first level (DLine), LJ is not used to seeing much resistance because of the outstanding holes his OLine provides. So just getting through them quickly with a head of steam is enough. LT2 needs to use his vision more to find the hole and slide through it.
At the second level (LBs) is where the biggest difference is, IMO. LJ can use his excellent wiggle to get through glancing blows of LBs, but a LB with a read bead on him will stop him because his vision/cutback ability is not usually enough to fake the LB out. LT2, on the other hand, has outstanding cutback moves and can get through that second level of the defense easier because of them.
At the third level (DBs) LJ's wiggle really helps him shrug off the tackle attempts of the smaller DBs. LT2 doesn't have that as well, but his vision can still help him fake out the DBs. I also think that LT2 has better breakaway speed.
In a nutshell, when LJ gets through the first level of a defense in a hurry due to outstanding running lanes, he's hard to stop. But if he is slowed up some there, I think he's easier to stop at the second level than LT2, who can really get by the 2nd level and 3rd level with his vision and moves. I think that due to these differences, LT2 is the better RB with a poor to average OLine. I would expect that LJ will not perform as well this year if the OLine does indeed falter, but he still should be a great RB.
Just to add an important point: I think that LJ is much more dependant upon the play of his OLine than LT2. So I think there is more variance with LJ and that makes him more risky.
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ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
LHUCKS points out another big difference: All those hits can take their toll on LJ. He may be able to run through them by keeping his balance, but he is feeling them on Monday morning. LT2 avoids alot of hits.
Ed Wood
Footballguy
An interesting conundrum. Like you, I haven't seen that much of him.But these things need to be considered:
1) his awesomeness last year; he often looked like a man among boys.
2) his toughness or lack thereof; it really is too early to tell. The quotes Vermeil said about it's time to take his diaper off (or something to that effect) linger. I know this was in a context of him whining about playing, but still it probably says something about him.
3) he did go fairly late in the first round (mid 20s if I recall); why did teams who probably did need a RB pass on him?
4) he did rush for 2k at Penn State.
I think the jury is still deliberating. The points made that LT is better, I think, are good one, as are the questions of how long LJ will last. It will be interesting to find out.
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
That's what I think to be honest. Keep in mind that I'm a Penn State alum who watch almost all of his games there. And I certainly would love for him to become the next Holmes or LT2 and make folks forget about Thomas, Carter and Enis. But I don't think he can thrive in any condition, be it QB, OLine, defense faced, etc, like LT2 can. If the Chiefs hit a roll like they did in his games last year, he can certainly do it again. But how likely is that?
Crimedogg32
Footballguy
I think he is on the same talent level as Portis Edge and S-Jax but below LT and Willis (yes I said Willis McGahee)
Walter Payton did okay running angry. Not sure that has anything to do with it.And LT takes as much punishment as any RB in the league. I don't see LT running out of bounds a lot to avoid hits. I see him running up the middle getting pounded.
But yes, LT2 is the most talented RB in the league. LJ probably fits into the 5-10 range. Was the 2nd back in his draft, great college career, put up great numbers so far in NFL. So LJ was a very highly touted RB coming out of college, but behind Priest, you never heard much from him his first year.
Monty Burns
Footballguy
He's a monster. I'm not a Chiefs fan but I saw him play a lot last year. The "man among boys" and Jim Brown/Earl Campbell comparisons are accurate, IMHO, for the last half of last year. Long term remains to be seen but its been a while since I've seen a guy demolish defenses the way he did in late '06.
Routilla
Footballguy
Well said. Key word...demolish.
RBM
Footballguy
Look at what this guy did the last 10 games of last year. I dont care how good you think the o-line is, there arent many backs that would even come close to doing what he did.
And remember, the Chiefs have a solid passing game, but by no means do they have the wrs that would scare Ds
And remember, the Chiefs have a solid passing game, but by no means do they have the wrs that would scare Ds
Keys Myaths
Pokerguy
RBM
Footballguy
Priest never dominated the way LJ did in that short a span
