might not be a bad idea to call this the official 2009 pre-season threadTime to retire the off-season thread and move on to the new thread for the pre-season, regular season, and post-season.
Florio apparently has connections inside the Redskins now. But he even states his information is "subtle".Don't rule out Redskins in Vick sweepstakesPosted by Mike Florio on July 27, 2009 11:03 PM ETFor now, it's clear that multiple as-yet-unknown teams are pursuing quarterback Mike Vick.It's also clear that one of the teams that has pursued multiple quarterbacks this offseason is the Redskins.And we're beginning to pick up some subtle indications from a couple of sources with connections to the team that the Redskins should not be ruled out as potential suitors for Mr. Vick.The thinking is that, if he were to land in D.C., Vick would not supplant current starter Jason Campbell, but that he instead would work in a Wildcat-type role for 2009, with an opportunity next year to succeed Campbell, whose contract expires after the season.If the Redskins truly are interested, it could create an awkward situation for agent Joel Segal, who represents both players. Then again, Segal might be able to persuade Campbell that, if Vick makes the team better in 2009, Campbell will be more attractive on the open market in 2010, if the Redskins choose not to keep him.For now, we're not reporting that anything will happen between Vick and the Redskins. But as other teams begin lining up for a crack at Vick, who's living not that far from where the Redskins play their home games, how can the 'Skins not at least do a little due diligence?With a far less noxious degree of stink emanating from Vick given the incredibly fair manner in which the league office has treated him, selling Vick to the local fans suddenly has become a far easier task. And given that the Redskins are nearly 18 years removed from their last Super Bowl win, we've got a feeling that anything that pushes the franchise toward the top of the NFC will be viewed as a positive development.Bottom line? The Redskins signed Albert Haynesworth, who is hardly a choir boy. If they can justify giving him $41 million guaranteed, they can easily justify giving Vick a one-year deal.To be clear, we're not reporting that the Redskins will sign Vick. But we've heard enough from a couple of trusted sources to believe that something could indeed happen.And if it happens, it'll be happening fairly soon.
Naw. We'll keep this thread until February 2010 to celebrate our Super Bowl win an dlook back to the year that was.buster c said:might not be a bad idea to call this the official 2009 pre-season threadTime to retire the off-season thread and move on to the new thread for the pre-season, regular season, and post-season.
That's a good thing. With Dan Snyder's growing control of local Redskin coverage, we need other sources.Marvelous said:Florio apparently has connections inside the Redskins now.
I thought I read the other day that they still needed to open a spot to sign Orakpo. I could have my stories mixed up, though.It seems a number of writers are throwing the 'Skins in the mix for possible landing spots for Vick. Not sure if it's because of any insider info or simply due to Snyder's FA history. In today's Sporting News Today, Vinnie Iyer ranks Washington as the #1 team "in terms of how much they need and want Michael Vick for the 2009 season".Skins cut FB Jonathan Evans. Opening up a roster spot?
And I guess Jarmon, too? Maybe this cut means they are close to signing one of them.I thought I read the other day that they still needed to open a spot to sign Orakpo. I could have my stories mixed up, though.Skins cut FB Jonathan Evans. Opening up a roster spot?
Jason Reid says he got a text from Vinny saying they aren't pursuing Vick.It seems a number of writers are throwing the 'Skins in the mix for possible landing spots for Vick. Not sure if it's because of any insider info or simply due to Snyder's FA history. In today's Sporting News Today, Vinnie Iyer ranks Washington as the #1 team "in terms of how much they need and want Michael Vick for the 2009 season".
I'm guessing there is no consensus. I'd say it's 50/50 among fans.What's the Skins fan consensus on Vick?
I haven't read that article, but I think Wilbon overplays the black angle too often. Then again, I'm not exactly plugged into the DC African American community.Wilbon was dead-on in the morning's Post for a change. The African-American fan base, the local ties, the bond with DeAngelo Hall, etc.
I think there will be training camp drama regardless of the circumstances, especially in DC where training camp without Vick will already be the top story. I agree we need a back-up, but I'm not sure you can count on much from Vick at QB in 2009. It will be a new offense and he probably needs a lot of work on some fundamentals since he hasn't played in a couple years. But, as long as he's in football shape by mid-season, I think he can make plays with the ball in his hands and would be helpful that way.I'd add to that the fact that we need a back-up, and in some ways Vick is perfect because his 5 game suspension clearly establishes Campbell as the starter, so you get the quality backup and the fan excitement without the traing camp drama.
The fanbase is certainly stronger than most NFL teams, but it is suffering. They'll, of course, sell out all season tickets once again, but the waiting list is dwindling and the ticket office is apparently having a harder time this year than previous years getting everything sold. But, I'm not sure Vick would do anything to affect that either direction.And the fanbase gives the Skins tremendous latitude, so community relations would be no problem as compared to some other destinations.
Me neither and the fact that he should come cheap is the main reason. I originally thought a one-year minimum deal would be good, but I wouldn't mind a 2-year deal considering how little he might play this year.He'll probably come cheap...
...I personally am not opposed to this move.
IMO, this is a bunch of writers not doing their homework. The Skins have been uber PR conscience since Snyder took over the team, and I would be absolutely shocked if they pursued Vick. Not to mention disrearding the pr stuff, I don't think it makes much football sense. Have they even worked on any wildcat packages this offseason? (Seriously have they? I haven't heard or seen anything that said they have been, but I could be forgetting.) So they bring in Vick and are just going to start working on the wildcat stuff in training camp?I thought I read the other day that they still needed to open a spot to sign Orakpo. I could have my stories mixed up, though.It seems a number of writers are throwing the 'Skins in the mix for possible landing spots for Vick. Not sure if it's because of any insider info or simply due to Snyder's FA history. In today's Sporting News Today, Vinnie Iyer ranks Washington as the #1 team "in terms of how much they need and want Michael Vick for the 2009 season".Skins cut FB Jonathan Evans. Opening up a roster spot?
Atlanta ran a WCO from '04-'06 with Vick under OC Greg Knapp.Now he is out of shape and has no idea how to run a WCO. they say it takes a QB 3 years to get it down.
Last week, I was chatting with Jim Zorn about training camp. It was my first interview with him since I joined the Redskins beat, and in the middle of it, Randy Thomas wandered by. Player and coach shared a warm greeting and eventually found their way into a discussion about a car.
It sparked an interesting aside in my discussion with Zorn -- unexpected in parts, but also, I suspect, encouraging for Redskins fans.
"I love that about the players, when they feel comfortable talking about real things," Zorn explained. "Do I know about the cars? Absolutely. Why? Because I take a genuine interest in what these guys are involved in. The hunting of Casey Rabach. All the different things Clinton Portis is interested in - the costumes, the cars. They know I care."
I knew where he was going, and it's an interesting way to approach the job. Typically, you'll find position coaches more likely to take an active role in the lives and interests of their players. The head coach has too much to do, too many personalities to juggle. Zorn says he thinks it's an important part of his job, though.
"I think players fully expect me as a coach to be up-to-speed with what they're into. I try to do that with my kids. That's why my music interests are all over the place. I like to stay up-to-date with music because I think music drives some of our players, the dress, the culture. I try to stay up with that culture. I'm a little bit of a square when it comes to some of the stuff, but I try to keep up with it - the language, the conversation, the music, the dress."
Zorn isn't saying that he has a replica of Portis' wardrobe in his closet at home. But he strives to understand, he says.
"So when I say, here's our dress code, it's not a dress code like 'We're all going to be in coats and ties, by golly.' That's not the culture today for a 23-year-old kid who wants to go out and buy a really nice suit. He might not want a formal three-piece with button-down collars. It might have more pizzazz to it. So why can't he wear that?" says Zorn. "These guys go out and buy $500 jeans with rhinestones on them. I think that's awesome. So why would I keep them from wearing those jeans when they paid more for that pair of pants than another guy would for a Canali suit. They should be able to wear those."
Zorn had mentioned music, so I wanted to revisit that subject. I asked if he listened to Lil Wayne.
"I know about Lil Wayne. Now I don't have him on my iPod, but I got Blackalicious, I got KJ52," he said. I made a mental checklist of NFL coaches that listen to Blackalicious: Belichick? No. Reid? Probably not. Norv Turner? Maybe.
"I can't listen to some of the hard-core rap because I don't want my kids to be influenced by all of this," Zorn continued. "I don't like to degrade women or police or all of the gang stuff. If you listen to Blackalicious, though, you hear some very clever lyrics.
"I'll tell you what it does for the player in my mind. I think it speaks a lot to the player about the kind of coaching we're trying to do. If we stay up with their culture of dress, of music, of video games, of whatever - then we're also trusted with the football part of their lives."
There are limits, of course. Now, I didn't ask specifically about this next topic, but Zorn brought it up, so...
"In my whole life, I've never been on a pornography site. Ever. First of all, I don't know how the - I guess I could push pornography and see what's out there - but I don't have the desire to do that. You see what I mean? And yet, I know that there's other guys on pornography sites, but that's too much. I don't need to get on a pornography site to see the temptations that some of these guys might have. I don't choose to get into it that much. I don't go down that road. I don't try to drink Jack Daniels just to know what it's like. I'm pretty straight when it comes to those things and principled."
All in all, it's a pretty admirable goal - understanding and relating to his players outside of football. And it actually plays a pretty prominent role during training camp, though mostly behind closed doors. Preseason isn't just about teammates bonding with each other and coming together as a unit; it's also about the coaches establishing their relationships with players.
"I enjoy staying on the edge of where these guys are at. I don't want to lose touch," says Zorn. "Am I corny about it? Yes. Because I don't live that persona, maybe, but I stay up-to-date with some of that stuff. I get it."
Well I don't think the Redskins should sign Vick but what you said just isn't correct. Atlanta ran a west coast offense, he made 3 pro bowls, and got them to the playoffs once.I can't believe how anyone would be for this. The guy wasn't that good before prison. Now he is out of shape and has no idea how to run a WCO.
Agree with most of what you said, but this obviously isn't true if they bring in Vick. Vick has more NFL starts than the Skins QBs combined.I'm not just nitpicking here. This, in my mind, is a legitimate argument for bringing him in. Collins is at the age when most QBs start to deteriorate rapidly. If there's a 29 year old QB out there with 67 NFL starts under his belt who comes cheap and would be willing to slide into the #2 spot on the depth chart, you have to at least look at him. Especially when he's played in the WCO before and also worked with an elite TE.Also, wouldn't this mean they would be carrying 4 qb's? I don't see them cutting Collins, as he's the only experienced backup. Would they cut Colt and try and put him on the practice squad? That extra roster spot is pretty valuable.
There is no evidence of this. Sure, ARE can throw, but running the Wildcat involves running up the middle some. He's not suited to run those types of plays in the NFL. I'm not sure what Portis has shown to prove this either. The Wildcat involves making split-second decisions of whether to hand the ball off or keep it yourself, then it involves a decision whether to pass or not. Not sure I'd want Portis doing that.We already have TWO capable options on our Roster for employing the WildCat Formation: Portis and Randle-El.
I'm not familiar with Vick being a personality problem. Was this true in Atlanta?We have plenty of 'Personalities' on this Team who already need 'Management' - any Team with aspirations to NFL Greatness needs to keep that variable at the absolute minimum that the Management, Coaches and Players can work to keep in check. Portis, Haynesworth and Hall come to mind immediately, but there are others.
I agree with what Gibbs said recently when asked about Campbell and what he's been through this offseason. Gibbs said every QB that has big success in the NFL has to be mentally tough; they have to be able to handle these situations. If you can't handle some criticism and some people doubting you and some booing, then how will you handle a last-minute drive in a big game? So, if Campbell can't handle having Vick on the team, then Campbell likely isn't worth having as the unquestioned starter.For this Team to ultimately be successful, the last thing it needs is anything resembling a QB Controversy......Campbell: Unquestioned Starter, Contract Year, going into 2nd Season with Zorn - Golden Opp to show up or be shown the door.......A Backup QB in Todd Collins who is absolutely no threat to the Starter.
Um, so what's your prediction for this year with this "perfect" situation?Right now we have a perfect SetUp:
Agreed. I assume any signing would involve a workout and fairly lengthy interview.There's absolutely no need to mess with any of this until more is known about Michael Vick, the Athlete 2 Years removed from his last NFL Snap.
EchoI'm on your ignore list, aren't I, fatness.Well I don't think the Redskins should sign Vick but what you said just isn't correct. Atlanta ran a west coast offense, he made 3 pro bowls, and got them to the playoffs once.I can't believe how anyone would be for this. The guy wasn't that good before prison. Now he is out of shape and has no idea how to run a WCO.
Jarmon signed.And I guess Jarmon, too? Maybe this cut means they are close to signing one of them.I thought I read the other day that they still needed to open a spot to sign Orakpo. I could have my stories mixed up, though.Skins cut FB Jonathan Evans. Opening up a roster spot?
Jarmon announced the deal on Twitter, tweeting:
@DoubleJJ99 Just signed with the Redskins! Let's get going!!!
The best fit for Vick is with the Raiders...or the CFLI can't believe how anyone would be for this. The guy wasn't that good before prison.
No way. I'm just backing you up.I'm on your ignore list, aren't I, fatness.
This is good news. That guy may develop into a good d-lineman.Jarmon signed.
Jarmon announced the deal on Twitter, tweeting:
@DoubleJJ99 Just signed with the Redskins! Let's get going!!!
Wow. Very sad news. Jim Johnson was a very good DC and gave the Redskins and many other teams lots of problems.I don't know if you heard but Jim Johnson, the Eagles defensive coordinator who gave the Redskins and other teams so much trouble over the years, just died of cancer. You may want to stop over in the Eagles thread to add a kind word about his passing.NFC East fans hate each other's teams but we usually get along with each other fairly well (with the exception of that one ####### Giants fan). A lot of them said some kind words when Sean Taylor died.
Atlanta ran a WCO from '04-'06 with Vick under OC Greg Knapp.Now he is out of shape and has no idea how to run an offense. they say it takes a QB 3 years to get it down.
Sorry. Fixed.Well I don't think the Redskins should sign Vick but what you said just isn't correct. Atlanta ran a west coast offense, he made 3 pro bowls, and got them to the playoffs once.I can't believe how anyone would be for this. The guy wasn't that good before prison. Now he is out of shape and has no idea how to run an offense.
No way. I'm just backing you up.I'm on your ignore list, aren't I, fatness.
His story keeps getting better and better. He's pretty much done everything he should off the field (he blew past the weight goal of 370 before TC that the coaches set for him). Here's hoping he can continue his comeback and get it done on the field.ETA: The rest of that story is very promising for the OL in general. Guys are losing fat while getting stronger and better conditioned. Can't hurt to have a faster, stronger OL."I almost fell on the floor when I saw him," Bugel said.
Absolutely love what I'm reading in this article. Samuels lost almost 30 lbs, too. Like Buges said, this is the deepest our oline has been in a long time. If Randy Thomas is back to 100% (haven't heard anything lately) the oline is going to be significantly better than last year. And if the line holds up for the whole season, I would say we have a great chance of winning the division.Mike Williams checks back for TC @ 342 lbs.
His story keeps getting better and better. He's pretty much done everything he should off the field (he blew past the weight goal of 370 before TC that the coaches set for him). Here's hoping he can continue his comeback and get it done on the field.ETA: The rest of that story is very promising for the OL in general. Guys are losing fat while getting stronger and better conditioned. Can't hurt to have a faster, stronger OL."I almost fell on the floor when I saw him," Bugel said.
Williams went to Ian Danney of Arizona-based Performance Enhancement Professionals in mid-June weighing 374 pounds (actually, Danney says 374; Williams says 365). He left six weeks later and got down as low as 337 pounds. But that was too low, and Williams actually intentionally put a bit of the weight back on. Ideally, he wants to take the field weighing 345.
Williams says he carries anywhere from 220-270 pounds of lean muscle mass, so when he was pushing four bills and making the scale creak, he knew he could lose a lot before camp opened.
"I basically came up with a number that I wanted to lose. That was before I even signed with the Redskins," Williams said. "I was determined to get there. I know how I feel at that weight, I know how I move at that weight. If I can retain my strength, my agility and stuff like that, you can only get better at a smaller weight. Now I feel extremely great. I feel better, I sleep better, everything."
Offensive line coach Joe Bugel says that during the preseason Heyer will again see time at both left and right tackles, which means Williams will have plenty of opportunity to show what he can do on the right side.
"I'm excited for Mike because he's excited for himself," Bugel said. 'He said this is really the first time in his professional career he's gone into camp feeling this good. He feels real good about himself, and I think that's 95 percent of the battle. The guy is just a pleasure to be around. He backed up what he said he was going to do.
"I'm going to work the living crap out of him because I want him to be successful and he's shown he can work hard. I think he's given himself a tremendous chance to be a good football player. If he ends up being super successful, this guy could write a best-selling book."
Joe Bugel is great."I'm going to work the living crap out of him because I want him to be successful and he's shown he can work hard. I think he's given himself a tremendous chance to be a good football player. If he ends up being super successful, this guy could write a best-selling book."
From that article:
I had heard that this program was Dockery's idea. Anyone else hear that?four of the Redskins' offensive linemen worked out together in Arizona in a unique and demanding training program and will report to camp this week significantly trimmed down.
In addition to Williams' dramatic weight loss, Chris Samuels weighed 333 pounds a few months ago. He's down to 305. Stephon Heyer was walking around more than 335 pounds, and he's down to 326. Derrick Dockery was around 327 pounds, and he'll start camp at 316.
"To see what these guys did during the offseason, it shows you how committed they are," Bugel said.
Washington PostThough Orakpo starred as a defensive end at the University of Texas, the Redskins planned to continue testing him during training camp as a strong-side linebacker. While that makes the next five weeks crucial for Orakpo's development, Zorn said he was "pleasantly surprised" with Orakpo's progress during the minicamps and offseason workouts and is hopeful that missing the early days of training camp won't set Orakpo back.
"He's a quick learner. He took to it very well," Zorn said.
Washington TimesRight tackle Mike Williams reported to camp at 342 pounds and Zorn pronounced him ready for two-a-day duty. Williams said he's lost 108 pounds and tomorrow will be on the field for the first time in three years
I think I heard that as well, but I think that I heard that from you so I don't think that counts.fatness said:From that article:I had heard that this program was Dockery's idea. Anyone else hear that?four of the Redskins' offensive linemen worked out together in Arizona in a unique and demanding training program and will report to camp this week significantly trimmed down.
In addition to Williams' dramatic weight loss, Chris Samuels weighed 333 pounds a few months ago. He's down to 305. Stephon Heyer was walking around more than 335 pounds, and he's down to 326. Derrick Dockery was around 327 pounds, and he'll start camp at 316.
"To see what these guys did during the offseason, it shows you how committed they are," Bugel said.
You can listen to ESPN980 online. They have a good bit of Redskin information now that camp is starting.edit: LinkI also want to thank you guys for keeping me so up to date with everything. Living in Hawaii makes it beyond difficult to stay up to date with Redskins info and you guys always have links and news that keep me very up to date with everything that is going on.
Jul 30 2009 | 9:51:24 am
Redskins' TE Fred Davis split two defenders on a short curl pass from rookie QB Chase Daniel and turned it in to a 50-yard touchdown.
Jul 30 2009 | 9:45:39 am
The Redskins are currently running 7-on-7 drills and the growing crowd of fans came to life when QB Jason Campbell connected with 2nd-year WR Devin Thomas on a 50-yard post pattern.
Jul 30 2009 | 9:18:43 am
Second year QB Colt Brennan has improved his delivery. He no longer throws from a three-quarters angle. Brennan's throws come from above his head and they are sharp and tight.
Jul 30 2009 | 9:08:13 am
In his press conference yesterday, Redskins coach Jim Zorn mentioned he had worked on speeding up QB Jason Campbell's drop back speed. In passing drills, you can see the difference in Campbell's drop back steps.
Adam_Schefter Laron Landry absolutely determined to make people forget the fact that Brandon Jacobs ran him over. It's his mission.
For anyone who hasn't heard yet, the agency representing Orakpo (CAA) also represents 8 more 1st round picks (a record) from the #1 pick (Stafford) to the #19 pick (Maclin). Stafford was signed pre-draft, Darrius Heyward-Bey just signed today and I read somewhere that Jason Smith's deal is close to being done. I imagine the rest of the players represented by CAA will fall in relatively quickly as more deals get done. At the moment, I'd be surprised if Orakpo's "holdout" lasted longer than the weekend.Zorn presser going on right now.
So far:
-he's optimistic Orakpo will be signed on time soon, but it's somewhat out of his hands (players around him are not signed)
Thank you very much for that link.Sidewinder16 said:Also check out CBS Sports Rapid Reports.
Jul 30 2009 | 3:12:18 pm
WR Devin Thomas just made a spectacular one-handed catch on a throw from QB Todd Collins during a passing drill.