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Is Dez Bryant really THAT good? (1 Viewer)

I think all this talk of him being a headcase or diva are being totally blown out of proportion. I just don't see it. The poor kid comes from a rough background, still has the where-with-all to go to college and become an academic all american, and kick a little ### on the football field as well. He hasn't been arrested or popped positive for drugs. He hasn't "made it rain" or pulled his manhood out and displayed it on college campuses for the world to see (atleast that we know of). All we have are uncomfirmed rumors that he was late to classes, practice, or games and that he wasn't properly prepared for his workout. He's what...21? 22 maybe? Give me an effing break!

The kid is a beast. He's a football player and he loves being on the field. His team mates seem to enjoy him. He's a friggin' gamer! Everytime I see tape on the kid I walk away impressed. Then, everytime I see him during an interview, my head doesn't hurt afterwards due to him butchering the English language like so many of these other kids do. He is always respectful saying "Yes sir", "No sir". He always has a smile on his face...like he enjoys doing what he does. Like so many other kids that have grown up with a bad home environment, maybe he uses the football field as his "getaway" or "out" and that is where all his problems go away. I can speak from experience on that. I think he'll leave everything he has on the field.

He's a young, confident, mega talented kid. I'm willing to give him a pass for his shortcomings to this point. Hopefully he'll have a successful NFL career and prove the naysayers wrong. But only time will tell.

 
Well, I have seen some in this post worry about him getting off the line, being not quick enough.

Besides Revis, and maybe a few others, who else is going to be able to jam him at the line? The guy is shredded for a 6-2, 220 pound body.

You play back on him, let him gobble up the cushion, and he's got an easy 5 yard slant, using his body to shield defenders(unless he decides he still does not like the slant route, LOL)

and he has not been out of football for a year. He was suspended in late September....it puts him out 3 months longer than everyone else. Not worried about that too much.

Lastly, he has plenty of heart. Put in the 2008 bowl game, and watch him sprain his knee, and then continually come in/out of the game limping around, and still making plays. Unless that passion eroded in the past 18 months, he has plenty of heart.

Hopefully money does not change him....

 
doowain said:
gianmarco said:
doowain said:
Yes, he's THAT good.Is this a :yes: attempt?This issue has been batted back and forth quite a few times on here in multiple threads. Do we really need another one?And, no, Crabtree was not more "decorated".
Actually, Crabtree was more "decorated". Since we're talking about their college careers and the Biletnikoff award is reserved for the top college WR, then this is how WRs are "decorated" in the NCAA.Crabtree -- 2 Biletnikoff awards (1st WR to ever win this award twice)Dez Bryant -- 0 Biletnikoff awards
I think I misinterpreted what decorated meant. I was taking it to say that Crabtree accomplished a lot more statistically than Dez.
This isn't even true either. :lmao:Bryant:Games 27Receptions 147Yards 2425Total TDs 32Crabtree:Games 26Receptions 231Yards 3127Total TDs 41Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
 
An interesting thought is that last year at this time when looking at the 2010 class of WRS there was much debate about who was better between Benn and Bryant, most early mocks (predicting a full year ahead) had Benn over Bryant. A year later, one had GARBAGE throwing to him, one gets suspended for violating rules and look at how a guy not playing actually vaulted him up the boards, I would have to guess if Crabtree and one other of Maclin, Nicks, Harvin came out this year that Dez would be a 2nd round pick without a doubt.

 
doowain said:
gianmarco said:
doowain said:
Yes, he's THAT good.Is this a :shrug: attempt?This issue has been batted back and forth quite a few times on here in multiple threads. Do we really need another one?And, no, Crabtree was not more "decorated".
Actually, Crabtree was more "decorated". Since we're talking about their college careers and the Biletnikoff award is reserved for the top college WR, then this is how WRs are "decorated" in the NCAA.Crabtree -- 2 Biletnikoff awards (1st WR to ever win this award twice)Dez Bryant -- 0 Biletnikoff awards
I think I misinterpreted what decorated meant. I was taking it to say that Crabtree accomplished a lot more statistically than Dez.
This isn't even true either. :(Bryant:Games 27Receptions 147Yards 2425Total TDs 32Crabtree:Games 26Receptions 231Yards 3127Total TDs 41Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
LOL. Doowain must own the 1.1 in a PPR or already drafted Bryant to his team. He's positive this guy is a total beast yet he must have "earned" the #1 pick in a rookie draft, maybe not the best at evaluating talent... Food for thought!
 
LOL. Doowain must own the 1.1 in a PPR or already drafted Bryant to his team. He's positive this guy is a total beast yet he must have "earned" the #1 pick in a rookie draft, maybe not the best at evaluating talent... Food for thought!
I do own the 1.01 in two leagues (both of which I traded for). I'm not sure why that makes me biased to Dez's prospects. That's who I see as the best player available (clearly not alone here). It could just as easily be Spiller or Mathews.
 
Well, I have seen some in this post worry about him getting off the line, being not quick enough.

Besides Revis, and maybe a few others, who else is going to be able to jam him at the line? The guy is shredded for a 6-2, 220 pound body.

You play back on him, let him gobble up the cushion, and he's got an easy 5 yard slant, using his body to shield defenders(unless he decides he still does not like the slant route, LOL)

and he has not been out of football for a year. He was suspended in late September....it puts him out 3 months longer than everyone else. Not worried about that too much.

Lastly, he has plenty of heart. Put in the 2008 bowl game, and watch him sprain his knee, and then continually come in/out of the game limping around, and still making plays. Unless that passion eroded in the past 18 months, he has plenty of heart.

Hopefully money does not change him....
None of that changes his quickness.

So you're telling me that not many are going to be able to press him....so they have to play off and its an easy 5 yards everytime. Wouldn't that be more reason to press him, so it isn't an easy 5 yards everytime. Most CB's have help over the top...so if they were Fred Smoot weak....they won't be toasted. Also in a cover 2....it is okay to let the WR go after 10 yards.

yes in the bowl game he did show heart...but that doesn't discount getting suspended for most of the year. I also don't think we are questioning this as much if he didn't get suspended.

When has a player been suspended most of the year, drafted high, and still been a stud?

 
Well, I have seen some in this post worry about him getting off the line, being not quick enough.

Besides Revis, and maybe a few others, who else is going to be able to jam him at the line? The guy is shredded for a 6-2, 220 pound body.

You play back on him, let him gobble up the cushion, and he's got an easy 5 yard slant, using his body to shield defenders(unless he decides he still does not like the slant route, LOL)

and he has not been out of football for a year. He was suspended in late September....it puts him out 3 months longer than everyone else. Not worried about that too much.

Lastly, he has plenty of heart. Put in the 2008 bowl game, and watch him sprain his knee, and then continually come in/out of the game limping around, and still making plays. Unless that passion eroded in the past 18 months, he has plenty of heart.

Hopefully money does not change him....
None of that changes his quickness.

So you're telling me that not many are going to be able to press him....so they have to play off and its an easy 5 yards everytime. Wouldn't that be more reason to press him, so it isn't an easy 5 yards everytime. Most CB's have help over the top...so if they were Fred Smoot weak....they won't be toasted. Also in a cover 2....it is okay to let the WR go after 10 yards.

yes in the bowl game he did show heart...but that doesn't discount getting suspended for most of the year. I also don't think we are questioning this as much if he didn't get suspended.

When has a player been suspended most of the year, drafted high, and still been a stud?
Maurice Clarret? Big Mike Williams? Perhaps not suspended but missing the last year for being a knucklehead.
 
This isn't even true either. :banned:

Bryant:

Games 27

Receptions 147

Yards 2425

Total TDs 32

Crabtree:

Games 26

Receptions 231

Yards 3127

Total TDs 41

Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
OK....I'll bite.Maybe you should factor in opportunity here fella.

Texas Tech

2007

763 pass attempts

6114 yards

2008

662 pass attempts

5371 yards

Oklahoma State

2007

386 pass attempts

3161 yards

2008

326 pass attempts

3149 yards

Not to mention that Crabtree was the focal point of the offense both years as a starter. Dez was the #2 his freshman year behind Adarius Bowman. So, with his only full year as the focal point of the OSU offense Bryant accounted for nearly 50% of the teams receiving yards and 76% of their receiving TDs. He also contributed in the return game with 3 TDs.

IMO, given the opportunities that their offense afforded them....Dez's stats are more impressive than Crabtree's.

ETA:

2007 (during Crabtree's ridiculous year)

Danny Amendola 109 / 1245 / 6

:)

 
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Well, I have seen some in this post worry about him getting off the line, being not quick enough.

Besides Revis, and maybe a few others, who else is going to be able to jam him at the line? The guy is shredded for a 6-2, 220 pound body.

You play back on him, let him gobble up the cushion, and he's got an easy 5 yard slant, using his body to shield defenders(unless he decides he still does not like the slant route, LOL)

and he has not been out of football for a year. He was suspended in late September....it puts him out 3 months longer than everyone else. Not worried about that too much.

Lastly, he has plenty of heart. Put in the 2008 bowl game, and watch him sprain his knee, and then continually come in/out of the game limping around, and still making plays. Unless that passion eroded in the past 18 months, he has plenty of heart.

Hopefully money does not change him....
None of that changes his quickness.

So you're telling me that not many are going to be able to press him....so they have to play off and its an easy 5 yards everytime. Wouldn't that be more reason to press him, so it isn't an easy 5 yards everytime. Most CB's have help over the top...so if they were Fred Smoot weak....they won't be toasted. Also in a cover 2....it is okay to let the WR go after 10 yards.

yes in the bowl game he did show heart...but that doesn't discount getting suspended for most of the year. I also don't think we are questioning this as much if he didn't get suspended.

When has a player been suspended most of the year, drafted high, and still been a stud?
If they press him, he'll beat the jam

If they play back, he can shield his 220 lb body on an easy slant.

If they take the inside away, you can still go over the top, and if they bracket him, well, someone else will be open.

 
This isn't even true either. :mellow:

Bryant:

Games 27

Receptions 147

Yards 2425

Total TDs 32

Crabtree:

Games 26

Receptions 231

Yards 3127

Total TDs 41

Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
OK....I'll bite.Maybe you should factor in opportunity here fella.

Texas Tech

2007

763 pass attempts

6114 yards

2008

662 pass attempts

5371 yards

Oklahoma State

2007

386 pass attempts

3161 yards

2008

326 pass attempts

3149 yards

Not to mention that Crabtree was the focal point of the offense both years as a starter. Dez was the #2 his freshman year behind Adarius Bowman. So, with his only full year as the focal point of the OSU offense Bryant accounted for nearly 50% of the teams receiving yards and 76% of their receiving TDs. He also contributed in the return game with 3 TDs.

IMO, given the opportunities that their offense afforded them....Dez's stats are more impressive than Crabtree's.

ETA:

2007 (during Crabtree's ridiculous year)

Danny Amendola 109 / 1245 / 6

:lmao:
You're grasping at straws right now, you are twisting stats and manipulating your numbers and ignoring the stats of catches, yards, TDS. Don't hurt yourself making those leaps. What were Crabtrees numbers as a freshman? You realize that was the first year he played WR in his life. I'll help you out,

Michael Crabtree 1st ever year at WR (Freshman at TT)

134 catches

1964 yards

22 Touchdowns

Just stop already.

 
When has a player been suspended most of the year, drafted high, and still been a stud?
Maurice Clarret? Big Mike Williams? Perhaps not suspended but missing the last year for being a knucklehead.
Ouch....tough act to follow...which is again...part of my point.
Those three players arent comparable, smells like fishing.
They all missed all or significant portions of a college football season b/c of things outside of injury.

Is that hard to see???

 
Well, I have seen some in this post worry about him getting off the line, being not quick enough.

Besides Revis, and maybe a few others, who else is going to be able to jam him at the line? The guy is shredded for a 6-2, 220 pound body.

You play back on him, let him gobble up the cushion, and he's got an easy 5 yard slant, using his body to shield defenders(unless he decides he still does not like the slant route, LOL)

and he has not been out of football for a year. He was suspended in late September....it puts him out 3 months longer than everyone else. Not worried about that too much.

Lastly, he has plenty of heart. Put in the 2008 bowl game, and watch him sprain his knee, and then continually come in/out of the game limping around, and still making plays. Unless that passion eroded in the past 18 months, he has plenty of heart.

Hopefully money does not change him....
None of that changes his quickness.

So you're telling me that not many are going to be able to press him....so they have to play off and its an easy 5 yards everytime. Wouldn't that be more reason to press him, so it isn't an easy 5 yards everytime. Most CB's have help over the top...so if they were Fred Smoot weak....they won't be toasted. Also in a cover 2....it is okay to let the WR go after 10 yards.

yes in the bowl game he did show heart...but that doesn't discount getting suspended for most of the year. I also don't think we are questioning this as much if he didn't get suspended.

When has a player been suspended most of the year, drafted high, and still been a stud?
If they press him, he'll beat the jam

If they play back, he can shield his 220 lb body on an easy slant.

If they take the inside away, you can still go over the top, and if they bracket him, well, someone else will be open.
Wow, sounds like the perfect WR. If he can do all of the above, how on earth did he ever not win a Heisman, National championship, or a Biletnikoff award???
 
This isn't even true either. :D

Bryant:

Games 27

Receptions 147

Yards 2425

Total TDs 32

Crabtree:

Games 26

Receptions 231

Yards 3127

Total TDs 41

Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
OK....I'll bite.Maybe you should factor in opportunity here fella.

Texas Tech

2007

763 pass attempts

6114 yards

2008

662 pass attempts

5371 yards

Oklahoma State

2007

386 pass attempts

3161 yards

2008

326 pass attempts

3149 yards

Not to mention that Crabtree was the focal point of the offense both years as a starter. Dez was the #2 his freshman year behind Adarius Bowman. So, with his only full year as the focal point of the OSU offense Bryant accounted for nearly 50% of the teams receiving yards and 76% of their receiving TDs. He also contributed in the return game with 3 TDs.

IMO, given the opportunities that their offense afforded them....Dez's stats are more impressive than Crabtree's.

ETA:

2007 (during Crabtree's ridiculous year)

Danny Amendola 109 / 1245 / 6

:lmao:
You're grasping at straws right now, you are twisting stats and manipulating your numbers and ignoring the stats of catches, yards, TDS. Don't hurt yourself making those leaps. What were Crabtrees numbers as a freshman? You realize that was the first year he played WR in his life. I'll help you out,

Michael Crabtree 1st ever year at WR (Freshman at TT)

134 catches

1964 yards

22 Touchdowns

Just stop already.
Heh....no manipulation. No twisting. Those are facts. Sorry guy...while putting up 1964 yards receiving is outstanding, as a team they threw for 6114 yards that year. That's roughly 30% of the team's total yards. 22 TDs is also very, very impressive but as a team they threw 51 TDs. What don't you get about opportunity vs. production? Dez outproduced Crabtree in 2008 with nearly half the opportunities.I'm not knocking Crabtree, which you don't seem to get. I happen to think Crabtree is ultra talented, but I just think Dez is better (I own Crabtree in 2 leagues, so don't go there). You said Dez isn't on Crabtree's level and I disagree. I apologize for not agreeing with you :shrug:

 
I would have to guess if Crabtree and one other of Maclin, Nicks, Harvin came out this year that Dez would be a 2nd round pick without a doubt.
No. He's easily better than Nicks/Harvin/Maclin, and I was pretty high on two of them as prospects.
 
This isn't even true either. :goodposting:

Bryant:

Games 27

Receptions 147

Yards 2425

Total TDs 32

Crabtree:

Games 26

Receptions 231

Yards 3127

Total TDs 41

Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
OK....I'll bite.Maybe you should factor in opportunity here fella.

Texas Tech

2007

763 pass attempts

6114 yards

2008

662 pass attempts

5371 yards

Oklahoma State

2007

386 pass attempts

3161 yards

2008

326 pass attempts

3149 yards

Not to mention that Crabtree was the focal point of the offense both years as a starter. Dez was the #2 his freshman year behind Adarius Bowman. So, with his only full year as the focal point of the OSU offense Bryant accounted for nearly 50% of the teams receiving yards and 76% of their receiving TDs. He also contributed in the return game with 3 TDs.

IMO, given the opportunities that their offense afforded them....Dez's stats are more impressive than Crabtree's.

ETA:

2007 (during Crabtree's ridiculous year)

Danny Amendola 109 / 1245 / 6

:lmao:
So I can understand your world: 41 > 32? 2425 > 3127? 147 > 231?
 
So I can understand your world: 41 > 32? 2425 > 3127? 147 > 231?
Quality response here. Well done.
:blackdot:You can't justify anything you say about Bryant being better than Crabtree statistically or award wise. You just pull things from your ### and hope people don't pay attention.
What do you want from me? I said I misinterpreted the "decorated" statement. I'm not debating that Bryant won more awards.....he clearly didn't. That's over. Move on.As far as being better statistically....I don't just look at the bottom line and determine that someone is better than someone else. When I interpret the stats of these two players, Dez is more impressive TO ME given what he did with much less opportunity. If you don't feel that way, debate it. Don't just dismiss my opinion with your shtick. Once again, I apologize that my opinion doesn't align with yours.Go stalk someone else. After multiple threads, it's getting a bit tiresome.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
This isn't even true either. :fishing:

Bryant:

Games 27

Receptions 147

Yards 2425

Total TDs 32

Crabtree:

Games 26

Receptions 231

Yards 3127

Total TDs 41

Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
OK....I'll bite.Maybe you should factor in opportunity here fella.

Texas Tech

2007

763 pass attempts

6114 yards

2008

662 pass attempts

5371 yards

Oklahoma State

2007

386 pass attempts

3161 yards

2008

326 pass attempts

3149 yards

Not to mention that Crabtree was the focal point of the offense both years as a starter. Dez was the #2 his freshman year behind Adarius Bowman. So, with his only full year as the focal point of the OSU offense Bryant accounted for nearly 50% of the teams receiving yards and 76% of their receiving TDs. He also contributed in the return game with 3 TDs.

IMO, given the opportunities that their offense afforded them....Dez's stats are more impressive than Crabtree's.

ETA:

2007 (during Crabtree's ridiculous year)

Danny Amendola 109 / 1245 / 6

:shrug:
You're grasping at straws right now, you are twisting stats and manipulating your numbers and ignoring the stats of catches, yards, TDS. Don't hurt yourself making those leaps. What were Crabtrees numbers as a freshman? You realize that was the first year he played WR in his life. I'll help you out,

Michael Crabtree 1st ever year at WR (Freshman at TT)

134 catches

1964 yards

22 Touchdowns

Just stop already.
As doowain has pointed out repeatedly, it is TEXAS FREAKIN TECH. So please stop thinking pure numbers mean anything. In 2007.... Danny Amendola 109/1245/6

In 2006.... Joel Filani 91/1300/13

In 2004.....Jarrett Hicks 76/1177/13

As you can see, you must be an absolute stud to put up big numbers in this offense :blackdot:

Crabtree is a very good WR, but using his college stats as justification for anything is stupid. Bryant's numbers, consider his team passed basically HALF as much as Texas Tech, are more impressive. Bryant will be a better pro as well.

 
So I can understand your world: 41 > 32? 2425 > 3127? 147 > 231?
Quality response here. Well done.
:blackdot:You can't justify anything you say about Bryant being better than Crabtree statistically or award wise. You just pull things from your ### and hope people don't pay attention.
What do you want from me? I said I misinterpreted the "decorated" statement. I'm not debating that Bryant won more awards.....he clearly didn't. That's over. Move on.As far as being better statistically....I don't just look at the bottom line and determine that someone is better than someone else. When I interpret the stats of these two players, Dez is more impressive TO ME given what he did with much less opportunity. If you don't feel that way, debate it. Don't just dismiss my opinion with your shtick. Once again, I apologize that my opinion doesn't align with yours.Go stalk someone else. After multiple threads, it's getting a bit tiresome.
Please do not be unexcellent.I was correcting your statements of supposed facts, since they were incorrect. Your opinion of Bryant being a better WR than Crabtree is just fine. Hell, I even agree with you there. You misstated information as facts, and I corrected them. Don't get some uptight about that.
 
You're grasping at straws right now, you are twisting stats and manipulating your numbers and ignoring the stats of catches, yards, TDS. Don't hurt yourself making those leaps. What were Crabtrees numbers as a freshman? You realize that was the first year he played WR in his life.

I'll help you out,

Michael Crabtree 1st ever year at WR (Freshman at TT)

134 catches

1964 yards

22 Touchdowns

Just stop already.
Technically, Crabtree's freshman numbers were 0 catches, 0 yards and 0 touchdowns.
 
This isn't even true either. :thumbup:

Bryant:

Games 27

Receptions 147

Yards 2425

Total TDs 32

Crabtree:

Games 26

Receptions 231

Yards 3127

Total TDs 41

Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
OK....I'll bite.Maybe you should factor in opportunity here fella.

Texas Tech

2007

763 pass attempts

6114 yards

2008

662 pass attempts

5371 yards

Oklahoma State

2007

386 pass attempts

3161 yards

2008

326 pass attempts

3149 yards

Not to mention that Crabtree was the focal point of the offense both years as a starter. Dez was the #2 his freshman year behind Adarius Bowman. So, with his only full year as the focal point of the OSU offense Bryant accounted for nearly 50% of the teams receiving yards and 76% of their receiving TDs. He also contributed in the return game with 3 TDs.

IMO, given the opportunities that their offense afforded them....Dez's stats are more impressive than Crabtree's.

ETA:

2007 (during Crabtree's ridiculous year)

Danny Amendola 109 / 1245 / 6

:thumbup:
You're grasping at straws right now, you are twisting stats and manipulating your numbers and ignoring the stats of catches, yards, TDS. Don't hurt yourself making those leaps. What were Crabtrees numbers as a freshman? You realize that was the first year he played WR in his life. I'll help you out,

Michael Crabtree 1st ever year at WR (Freshman at TT)

134 catches

1964 yards

22 Touchdowns

Just stop already.
As doowain has pointed out repeatedly, it is TEXAS FREAKIN TECH. So please stop thinking pure numbers mean anything. In 2007.... Danny Amendola 109/1245/6

In 2006.... Joel Filani 91/1300/13

In 2004.....Jarrett Hicks 76/1177/13

As you can see, you must be an absolute stud to put up big numbers in this offense :thumbup:

Crabtree is a very good WR, but using his college stats as justification for anything is stupid. Bryant's numbers, consider his team passed basically HALF as much as Texas Tech, are more impressive. Bryant will be a better pro as well.
While we are throwing out WR's in previous years to the same regime that aren't nearly as talented as the players we are talking about.

Adarius Bowman

06 60/1181/10

07 67/1006/8

 
This isn't even true either. :thumbup:

Bryant:

Games 27

Receptions 147

Yards 2425

Total TDs 32

Crabtree:

Games 26

Receptions 231

Yards 3127

Total TDs 41

Maybe you are counting suspended games? Bryant beats Crabtree there. You are doing unwell. doowain.
OK....I'll bite.Maybe you should factor in opportunity here fella.

Texas Tech

2007

763 pass attempts

6114 yards

2008

662 pass attempts

5371 yards

Oklahoma State

2007

386 pass attempts

3161 yards

2008

326 pass attempts

3149 yards

Not to mention that Crabtree was the focal point of the offense both years as a starter. Dez was the #2 his freshman year behind Adarius Bowman. So, with his only full year as the focal point of the OSU offense Bryant accounted for nearly 50% of the teams receiving yards and 76% of their receiving TDs. He also contributed in the return game with 3 TDs.

IMO, given the opportunities that their offense afforded them....Dez's stats are more impressive than Crabtree's.

ETA:

2007 (during Crabtree's ridiculous year)

Danny Amendola 109 / 1245 / 6

:thumbup:
You're grasping at straws right now, you are twisting stats and manipulating your numbers and ignoring the stats of catches, yards, TDS. Don't hurt yourself making those leaps. What were Crabtrees numbers as a freshman? You realize that was the first year he played WR in his life. I'll help you out,

Michael Crabtree 1st ever year at WR (Freshman at TT)

134 catches

1964 yards

22 Touchdowns

Just stop already.
As doowain has pointed out repeatedly, it is TEXAS FREAKIN TECH. So please stop thinking pure numbers mean anything. In 2007.... Danny Amendola 109/1245/6

In 2006.... Joel Filani 91/1300/13

In 2004.....Jarrett Hicks 76/1177/13

As you can see, you must be an absolute stud to put up big numbers in this offense :thumbup:

Crabtree is a very good WR, but using his college stats as justification for anything is stupid. Bryant's numbers, consider his team passed basically HALF as much as Texas Tech, are more impressive. Bryant will be a better pro as well.
While we are throwing out WR's in previous years to the same regime that aren't nearly as talented as the players we are talking about.

Adarius Bowman

06 60/1181/10

07 67/1006/8
Nice try but not even relevant. Bowman was a talented prospect who at one time was thought of as a 1st round pick. He was in a whole other league from players like Amendola, Filani and Hicks.
 
Nice try but not even relevant. Bowman was a talented prospect who at one time was thought of as a 1st round pick. He was in a whole other league from players like Amendola, Filani and Hicks.
Not relevant??? Amendola is still in the NFL. Isn't Bowman selling cell phones with Travis Henry and Tatum Bell???
Amendola is in the NFL as a special teams player, and he likely will wash out of the league within a few years. He is roster filler. Bowman, while he didn't make it in the league, had much more talent. His not making it had much more to do with factors off the field than on it.
 
Nice try but not even relevant. Bowman was a talented prospect who at one time was thought of as a 1st round pick. He was in a whole other league from players like Amendola, Filani and Hicks.
Not relevant??? Amendola is still in the NFL. Isn't Bowman selling cell phones with Travis Henry and Tatum Bell???
Amendola is in the NFL as a special teams player, and he likely will wash out of the league within a few years. He is roster filler. Bowman, while he didn't make it in the league, had much more talent. His not making it had much more to do with factors off the field than on it.
Oh ok...so Bowman's number shouldn't count...but all of the Texas Tech's guys should....even though they r still in the NFL. Should I bust out Wes Welker's stats at Texas Tech???
 
Nice try but not even relevant. Bowman was a talented prospect who at one time was thought of as a 1st round pick. He was in a whole other league from players like Amendola, Filani and Hicks.
Not relevant??? Amendola is still in the NFL. Isn't Bowman selling cell phones with Travis Henry and Tatum Bell???
Amendola is in the NFL as a special teams player, and he likely will wash out of the league within a few years. He is roster filler. Bowman, while he didn't make it in the league, had much more talent. His not making it had much more to do with factors off the field than on it.
Oh ok...so Bowman's number shouldn't count...but all of the Texas Tech's guys should....even though they r still in the NFL. Should I bust out Wes Welker's stats at Texas Tech???
Filani and Hicks are no longer in the league and Amendola won't be for much longer. Not sure what point you are trying to prove. If you can't see that Texas Tech provided a much better opportunity to put up bigger numbers than any other school in the country, I can't help you. It's a gimmick offense that produces monster stats for average WR talents. It would stand to reason that when an NFL caliber WR comes through there his numbers would be higher. The point being, citing his raw statistics in a vacuum means nothing. Freddie Barnes just put up 155/1770/19 this past season, he must be a sure fire all pro right?
 
Nice try but not even relevant. Bowman was a talented prospect who at one time was thought of as a 1st round pick. He was in a whole other league from players like Amendola, Filani and Hicks.
Not relevant??? Amendola is still in the NFL. Isn't Bowman selling cell phones with Travis Henry and Tatum Bell???
Amendola is in the NFL as a special teams player, and he likely will wash out of the league within a few years. He is roster filler. Bowman, while he didn't make it in the league, had much more talent. His not making it had much more to do with factors off the field than on it.
Oh ok...so Bowman's number shouldn't count...but all of the Texas Tech's guys should....even though they r still in the NFL. Should I bust out Wes Welker's stats at Texas Tech???
Filani and Hicks are no longer in the league and Amendola won't be for much longer. Not sure what point you are trying to prove. If you can't see that Texas Tech provided a much better opportunity to put up bigger numbers than any other school in the country, I can't help you. It's a gimmick offense that produces monster stats for average WR talents. It would stand to reason that when an NFL caliber WR comes through there his numbers would be higher. The point being, citing his raw statistics in a vacuum means nothing. Freddie Barnes just put up 155/1770/19 this past season, he must be a sure fire all pro right?
This was the point of the thread on Bryant.Welker's stats- 259 receptions for 3,019 yards and 21 touchdowns.....and he was/is an all-pro...in the gimmick offense at Texas Tech. Please define gimmick offense for me.

 
Not relevant??? Amendola is still in the NFL. Isn't Bowman selling cell phones with Travis Henry and Tatum Bell???
Amendola is in the NFL as a special teams player, and he likely will wash out of the league within a few years. He is roster filler. Bowman, while he didn't make it in the league, had much more talent. His not making it had much more to do with factors off the field than on it.
Oh ok...so Bowman's number shouldn't count...but all of the Texas Tech's guys should....even though they r still in the NFL. Should I bust out Wes Welker's stats at Texas Tech???
Filani and Hicks are no longer in the league and Amendola won't be for much longer. Not sure what point you are trying to prove. If you can't see that Texas Tech provided a much better opportunity to put up bigger numbers than any other school in the country, I can't help you. It's a gimmick offense that produces monster stats for average WR talents. It would stand to reason that when an NFL caliber WR comes through there his numbers would be higher. The point being, citing his raw statistics in a vacuum means nothing. Freddie Barnes just put up 155/1770/19 this past season, he must be a sure fire all pro right?
This was the point of the thread on Bryant.Welker's stats- 259 receptions for 3,019 yards and 21 touchdowns.....and he was/is an all-pro...in the gimmick offense at Texas Tech. Please define gimmick offense for me.
An offense that allows the players I listed to put up those type of stats.
 
Well, I have seen some in this post worry about him getting off the line, being not quick enough.

Besides Revis, and maybe a few others, who else is going to be able to jam him at the line? The guy is shredded for a 6-2, 220 pound body.

You play back on him, let him gobble up the cushion, and he's got an easy 5 yard slant, using his body to shield defenders(unless he decides he still does not like the slant route, LOL)

and he has not been out of football for a year. He was suspended in late September....it puts him out 3 months longer than everyone else. Not worried about that too much.

Lastly, he has plenty of heart. Put in the 2008 bowl game, and watch him sprain his knee, and then continually come in/out of the game limping around, and still making plays. Unless that passion eroded in the past 18 months, he has plenty of heart.

Hopefully money does not change him....
None of that changes his quickness.

So you're telling me that not many are going to be able to press him....so they have to play off and its an easy 5 yards everytime. Wouldn't that be more reason to press him, so it isn't an easy 5 yards everytime. Most CB's have help over the top...so if they were Fred Smoot weak....they won't be toasted. Also in a cover 2....it is okay to let the WR go after 10 yards.

yes in the bowl game he did show heart...but that doesn't discount getting suspended for most of the year. I also don't think we are questioning this as much if he didn't get suspended.

When has a player been suspended most of the year, drafted high, and still been a stud?
If they press him, he'll beat the jam

If they play back, he can shield his 220 lb body on an easy slant.

If they take the inside away, you can still go over the top, and if they bracket him, well, someone else will be open.
Wow, sounds like the perfect WR. If he can do all of the above, how on earth did he ever not win a Heisman, National championship, or a Biletnikoff award???
Well, since you asked, I explained it, and slowly broke it down for you.

Bryant is a beast, don't overthink this one...

 
Wow, sounds like the perfect WR. If he can do all of the above, how on earth did he ever not win a Heisman, National championship, or a Biletnikoff award???
Well, since you asked, I explained it, and slowly broke it down for you.Bryant is a beast, don't overthink this one...
Why didn't he win any of those awards then? If playing WR, being Dez Bryant, is so easy to dominate.Please break it down for me(yes I am asking since your going to heighten the tool factor)....step by step in how he would beat a press.....run his slant route.....get on top of a defender.Time and again I have said that Dez Bryant is a good to great athlete. I will probably take him in some dynasty drafts. However, I see some spaces in his game that I'm not sure he will fill in order to become elite(one of the top 10 WR's at the NFL level).
 
benson_will_lead_the_way said:
domvin said:
Wow, sounds like the perfect WR. If he can do all of the above, how on earth did he ever not win a Heisman, National championship, or a Biletnikoff award???
Well, since you asked, I explained it, and slowly broke it down for you.

Bryant is a beast, don't overthink this one...
Why didn't he win any of those awards then? If playing WR, being Dez Bryant, is so easy to dominate.

Please break it down for me(yes I am asking since your going to heighten the tool factor)....step by step in how he would beat a press.....run his slant route.....get on top of a defender.

Time and again I have said that Dez Bryant is a good to great athlete. I will probably take him in some dynasty drafts. However, I see some spaces in his game that I'm not sure he will fill in order to become elite(one of the top 10 WR's at the NFL level).
The answer to the bolded, is easy, but since you are asking, i'll "heighten the tool factor"

Crabtree played in an offense that was basically throw all day. You have other posters telling you it's gimmicky.

Dez played what, 3 games in 09? Unless they pro-rate stats for the season, that is not going to qualify for the Biletnikoff.

Baby food goes down easier warmed up. Was this the appropriate temperature for you?

 
benson_will_lead_the_way said:
Why didn't he win any of those awards then? If playing WR, being Dez Bryant, is so easy to dominate.

Please break it down for me(yes I am asking since your going to heighten the tool factor)....step by step in how he would beat a press.....run his slant route.....get on top of a defender.

Time and again I have said that Dez Bryant is a good to great athlete. I will probably take him in some dynasty drafts. However, I see some spaces in his game that I'm not sure he will fill in order to become elite(one of the top 10 WR's at the NFL level).
The answer to the bolded, is easy, but since you are asking, i'll "heighten the tool factor"

Crabtree played in an offense that was basically throw all day. You have other posters telling you it's gimmicky.

Dez played what, 3 games in 09? Unless they pro-rate stats for the season, that is not going to qualify for the Biletnikoff.

Baby food goes down easier warmed up. Was this the appropriate temperature for you?
Do you feel better about yourself now?Ok back to football.

He played in limited games b/c of selfish factors....that is a problem.

He should've qualified for all of those awards his first two years and didn't win those.

You avoided the issue of breaking down being a WR. Without taking this to a level that it shouldn't, playing WR is the second most difficult position on offense(first is QB). Breaking a press is much more difficult than you think, running routes so the DB isn't tipped off when the break is coming, being quick enough in and out of routes, blocking, concentration, reading coverages, high pointing the ball, etc.

Playing WR isn't easy....past first round drafts have shown that. It takes another level of dedication to make it in the NFL and by getting suspended, running lazy routes, and not finishing drills at his pro day....I am left questioning if Dez Bryant can be elite.

 
Jean-Jacques Taylor: Maturity questions dog NFL Draft prospect Dez Bryant

LUFKIN, Texas – Dez Bryant is the best receiver in Thursday's NFL draft, but it will surprise no one whether he is picked in the top 10 or much later in the first round.

Column by JEAN-JACQUES TAYLOR / The Dallas Morning News | jjtaylor@dallasnews.com

Jean-Jacques Taylor

Archive | Blog | E-mail

Some teams think he is an immature 21-year-old from an impoverished background who will thrive with structure and tough love. Other teams think he'll generate a never-ending string of negative headlines once he gets the millions every first-round pick receives.

Your Cowboys? They love him.

The coaches at Lufkin High School will tell you that no NFL team has spent more time digging into Bryant's background. They sent a scout to his personal workout a few weeks ago, and if he's available at No. 20, don't be surprised if the Cowboys move up from No. 27 in an attempt to acquire him.

The question the Cowboys and every other team must answer is when the reward of Bryant's talent surpasses the financial risk.

That's when he'll get drafted.

This is really Bryant's fault. He'll tell you that.

And it's the truth.

If he had been honest about hanging out with Deion Sanders last summer, the NCAA would've never ended his junior year after three games, and the questions about his character wouldn't be nearly as intense.

Bryant isn't Pacman Jones. He isn't Randy Moss. He doesn't even belong in the same sentence with either one.

Bryant has never been arrested. He's never had a drug problem. He's never had an alcohol problem. He's never had a problem with violence.

And he doesn't come with a posse. He's had the same best friend since the third grade.

"There are no absolutes," said Dr. Herbert Martin, who has worked closely with NFL and NBA players for nearly two decades on matters involving personal and professional development. "But prior behavior is usually a good indicator for future behavior.

"If he hasn't had any issues with drugs, alcohol or violence against women when he was at his most vulnerable, then there is a great probability that by the time he enters the league, he won't engage in conduct detrimental to the NFL."

You can't find a teammate, coach or scout who says Bryant is a bad person. You can't find a teammate, coach or scout who questions Bryant's work ethic on the practice field.

His biggest flaw: He is habitually late.

No joke.

That's the most serious criticism leveled at Bryant. He can't manage time to save his life.

Obviously, that's a bad habit that must be corrected. But this is a young man who's been on his own in a lot of ways since he became a teenager.

He has dealt with a change in his mother's sexual preferences in a conservative town of about 32,000, located in the heart of the Bible Belt. He's dealt with the self-esteem troubles that accompany taking special education classes, as he did until he requested more challenging courses in the 11th grade to ensure he could attend college.

We're talking about a kid who bounced around from family to family during his high school years in a constant quest for stability.

Mother's journey

It's hard enough to be a good mother when you're an adult. At 15, Angela Bryant had no chance.

All she could do was her best.

Some days it was good enough. Many days it wasn't. She admits that.

Angela said she sold drugs to provide for her kids.

To say that she raised Dez is too strong. At various times, he lived with an aunt, his girlfriend's family and a friend. Dez also lived briefly with his father MacArthur Hatton, but the two have virtually no relationship today.

Just don't question Angela's love for Dez, 19-year Lyeddia and 17-year-old Deon, all sired by Hatton.

You feel the bond between Dez and Angela when they're in the same room laughing and joking and talking. You can sense the connection when he stares into her eyes, while posing for a photograph and when he drapes his arm around her shoulder and tugs her close.

They have the same smooth, dark skin. The same high cheekbones. The same broad smile, though Angela wears a glistening gold grill. They're really more like brother and sister, as you might expect, than mother and son.

Angela Bryant attended most of his games at Oklahoma State, making the eight-hour drive from Lufkin to Stillwater with Carldelro King, Dez's best friend. She took an 18-hour bus ride to Athens, Ga., to see Dez's college debut against Georgia in 2007.

"It made me feel so good to see her," Bryant said, "I hugged her until it was time to get on the bus."

Mother and son don't believe in secrets. Honesty, even if it hurts, is the foundation of their relationship.

That's how they worked through Angela's change in sexual preference. Dez was in high school when he learned his mother was no longer interested in romantic relationships with men.

"I didn't like it. Really, I still don't," he said. "I dealt with it and now I'm comfortable with it."

Angela broached the topic with him because she didn't want her sexuality creating a wedge between them.

"It hurt me that it hurt him. I'm very happy about the relationship that we have," Angela said. "I wasn't close with my parents, so it's important for me to be close with my kids.

"I'm not a typical mom, but my kids know I love them. They can tell me anything and I'll do anything for them."

Natural receiver

Look at Bryant's huge hands, his fingernails neatly manicured. Study his 6-2, 224-pound frame with the 4 percent body fat, and it's pretty obvious God made Bryant to play receiver.

Football came naturally to Bryant, who scored 41 touchdowns in 31 games at Lufkin.

But he was prone to angry outbursts as he worked through a cauldron of emotions created by his childhood. And like most receivers, he could be a diva.

Once, coach John Outlaw suspended him for a playoff game. Outlaw can't even recall why years later.

"We've had some big-time players come out of here, but there's never been anybody that saw the big picture better than Dez," said Brooke Stafford, a Lufkin assistant who's remained close to Bryant. "Sometimes, he'd take the path of least resistance, but he's always been able to see the draft. The decisions he made were always about getting to the NFL."

After his sophomore year, Bryant told Stafford he needed tougher classes so he could play college football. Dez never thought he belonged in special ed, but his mother never questioned it until then.

"I wasn't a dummy," Bryant said. "When I didn't feel like doing the work, I didn't do it. When I felt like doing it, I did – and it was no problem."

Bryant completed four years of math and English in his final two years of high school, then scored high enough on the ACT to play as a freshman.

"I've taught school for 35 years, and I've never been prouder of a student than I am of him," said Jody Anderson, Bryant's math teacher. "I admired what he was trying to do and how hard he worked to do it."

As he became a star in Lufkin's spread offense, Bryant became one of the state's top recruits.

Texas, Texas A&M, LSU, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State each wanted his signature on a letter-of-intent. He signed with Oklahoma State because the Cowboys' interest never wavered.

Mike Gundy's offense needed a dynamic receiver, and Bryant wanted to play for a team he could lead to prominence. It helped that receivers coach Gunter Brewer had coached Randy Moss, one of Bryant's favorite receivers, at Marshall.

Bryant earned All-America honors as a sophomore with 19 touchdown receptions. As a junior, he figured he'd win the Biletnikoff Award like his friend Michael Crabtree, lead OSU to a BCS game and become a first-round draft pick.

Three games into last season, the dream scenario fell apart.

Bryant and Crabtree became friends when they met at an awards ceremony following the 2008 season. Crabtree introduced Bryant to Sanders.

"We developed a relationship because I could relate to a lot of things that he's encountered," Sanders said. "I could relate to public success and private struggles, and I could relate to having a fairly young mother.

"I'm brutally honest with kids like Dez. Dealing with kids is like a ministry to me. They're trying to navigate the streets that I've already traveled. I'm a living, breathing navigation system, but that doesn't mean they won't make a wrong turn."

Meeting with Sanders didn't violate any NCAA rules, but lying about it did. When the NCAA wanted details, Bryant figured he had inadvertently violated a rule, so he lied.

The cover-up is usually worse than the crime, as Bryant learned, but he's never been bitter about the suspension because he blames himself for lying.

When the NCAA denied Bryant's appeal, he moved to Dallas and began training for the draft.

"I remember Coach Gundy saying, 'If you do everything you're supposed to do, you'll be out in three years,' " said Bryant. "And here I am."

Making his case

Bryant has been traveling across the country speaking with officials from a plethora of teams, trying to convince them he'll be an asset to their team and community.

He's answered questions about his background and the 18 months his mother spent in jail in 1997-98. He's answered questions about whether he forgot his cleats at his personal workout – turns out he didn't – and why clubs should invest millions in him.

Bryant invites the questions.

"It's just business," he said.

Jones has always regretted not drafting Moss in 1998. As long as drugs or violence aren't involved, Jones says the Cowboys have the infrastructure to add players who come with some risk.

"The reason my mom sold drugs and went to jail is so we could live," Bryant said. "She paid a hard price for it. Now she doesn't ever have to do anything like that again. God put me in this position to help my family and others who have helped me."

He'll be able to do that no matter where he's drafted

The Dez Bryant file

Born: Nov. 4, 1988, in Lufkin, Texas

Height/Weight: 6-2, 225

High school career: SuperPrep and Parade All-American at Lufkin, where he scored 41 touchdowns in 31 games.

College career: Three seasons with Oklahoma State. ... Standout sophomore season in 2008 included 19 touchdown catches (second in the nation), 113.9 receiving yards per game (third) and 17.94 yards in punt returns per game (third). ... Returned two punts for touchdowns that season. ... Played only three games as a junior before he was suspended for the remainder of the season for lying to NCAA investigators. ... Opted to skip his senior year.
 

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