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Mark Sanchez is overvalued right now by the NFL (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter LHUCKS
- Start date
Blue-Kun
Footballguy
two_dollars
Footballguy
Nailed that one Lucks.
Multiple Scores
Footballguy
Wow.
Just Wow.
Just Wow.
Masked Vigilante
Footballguy
Something to ponder. Knowing what we now know, Would Sanchez go #1 overall?
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I'm not going to defend LHucks but I think Sanchez is getting way too much credit for their success. The "it" factor is being bestowed upon him...lets see the Jets make the playoffs 1st, and maybe even win a playoff game before we get out the annointing oils.
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Ted Lange as your Bartender
Footballguy
Sanchez dynasty owner, obviously pleased that he hasn't completely crapped himself these first three games, seems to be handling the NY media spotlight very well, and he looks to be winning over the Jets' veterans thus far, but it's WAY too early to make any blanket judgments either way on his future prospects. Let him get a winning season under his belt first.
Reaper
Footballguy
I agree with that....He's going to get some nasty weather like he's never seen and some shootouts as well.So far every game has been relatively under control. Guys also need to stay healthy.
Tom Servo
Nittany Beavers
This is the take-away from this thread.
Hendo
Footballguy
I think Stafford would still go #1 esp after the Clev. game he put up and the the talent he flashed on a horrible Lion team. Don't get me wrong here I like Sanchez quit a bt but I don't think he has the higher potential that Stafford does.
Father Guido Sarducci
Footballguy
Mark Sanchez doesn't have any 4th quarter comebacks on his resume. I'm not calling Sanchez a bust but a rookie, and the Jets are built to win with defense and a running game. The Jets won today but they had a big lead in the 4th quarter and handing the ball off late really isn't the critical test for him. There might come a game where the Jets will be trailing in the 4th quarter, and the defense and running game become irrelevant for New York. That will be the moment where Sanchez can either impress me or be just another rookie learning his way in the NFL.
Of course the defense and running game also could strangle every team in the Jets path the rest of the way and they might win the Super Bowl without ever relying on Sanchez when its needed most. Who knows.
Of course the defense and running game also could strangle every team in the Jets path the rest of the way and they might win the Super Bowl without ever relying on Sanchez when its needed most. Who knows.
Mr. Retukes
Footballguy
Are you the real Father Guido Sarducci, or just a fan of his?
Father Guido Sarducci
Footballguy
Can I be both?
Happy Ragnarok
Footballguy
I'm still not a fan of his, but after yesterday, I'm closer.
If he has learned, in only one season, how to EFFECTIVELY stay out of his team's way, avoid costly mistakes, and get the easy things done with a minimum of fuss...he'll be ahead of most QB's entering year two. There's a lot to be said for finding a truly solid game manager in the draft, even if that's all he turns out to be. Teams have won Superbowls with as much.
If he has learned, in only one season, how to EFFECTIVELY stay out of his team's way, avoid costly mistakes, and get the easy things done with a minimum of fuss...he'll be ahead of most QB's entering year two. There's a lot to be said for finding a truly solid game manager in the draft, even if that's all he turns out to be. Teams have won Superbowls with as much.
phrozen
Footballguy
I hope you have learned your lesson in never defending shucks. Also time to bring out the oil. The 365 organic olive oil should work just fine and you can use your employee discount to boot.
IDrinkyourMilkshake
Footballguy
How many playoff games has Leonheart won? 
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Sanchez is tied with Roger Staubach, Len Dawson, Joe Flacco and Jake Delhomme with four postseason victories away from home.... the most road playoff wins by any QB in league history.
Oh, he has played two years.
Aww yes, the almost 2 year bump.Mark Sanchez isnt the worst QB in the NFL, I dont think anyone would even suggest it. But it makes me sound like a hypocrite to say that his post season success is no measure of his talent at all. I dont even think hes the 2nd best QB in the East, if you count Moore, Hanie or Mallet hes potentially the 6th best QB in the east.
I hope he gets better, honestly.
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Phlash
Footballguy
QBs better than Mark Sanchez:Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Philip Rivers
Ben Roethlisberger
Matt Ryan
Joe Flacco
Matt Schaub
Tony Romo
Eli Manning
Michael Vick
Jay Cutler
Aaron Rodgers
Drew Brees
Josh Freeman
You could also (easily) make a case for:
Sam Bradford
Kyle Orton
Matt Cassel
Matthew Stafford
He's actually one of the worst starting QBs in the NFL, even with his playoff wins. It's being pretty understated just how good his O-line, running game, and defense have been, and how poor his numbers have been with that in mind. He is not close to a top 10 QB, so regardless of what you think about LHUCKs, he's been right up until now. Could Sanchez be better this year? You'd hope. He still have an uphill battle considering the number of extremely talented QBs who have come into the league recently.
GregR
Footballguy
Which doesn't really refute LHUCKS position at all. A team can win playoff games, including on the road, without the QB playing well. Let alone being a top 10 QB. How has Sanchez looked in his 6 playoff games, including the 4 road victories? Only 2 games out of 6 did Sanchez pass for more yards than the opponent's QB. And those only occurred when his defense held the opposing QBs to pretty amazing lows of 121 and 110 passing yards.
How did the rushing game look in comparison, for an idea of how it contributed to their victories compared to how Sanchez contributed? In the Jets 4 road wins, their rushing game went off for 169, 120, 171, and 169 yards. In the two losses? 86 and 70.
The Jets won and lost in the playoffs the last 2 years based on how their running game went, and on how well their defense stopped the opponent. In the Jets 6 playoff games under Sanchez, they've scored 17, 17, 17, 19, 24, and 28 points. In those 2 years, playoff teams averaged 24.6 points per game. So in Sanchez's playoff career, he's led his team to 1 above average, 1 average, and 1 below average, and 3 very below average offensive performances.
4 road playoff wins really isn't much evidence to the quality of Mark Sanchez. It just says he's good enough he won't stop you from winning. But he hasn't yet shown in the playoffs you can count on him to carry a team like you'd expect top NFL QBs to do.
I expect he'll improve this year with Tom Moore coaching him, but so far I don't think LHUCKS assessment is wrong.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Wrong. He said "there is no way [sanchez] is top 10 material" as far as being worthy of a top-10 draft pick.OF COURSE he was.
GregR
Footballguy
Ah, I also thought Top 10 was referring to QB, not draft pick.I agree he's proven worthy of a top ten draft pick. He hasn't proven worthy of being a top ten QB yet by a long shot. And I do think he's overrated in a lot of places like the media, where just the name "Jets" on his jersey causes them to talk him up. At least, he's not proven of the level they talk of him at.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
All the guy does is win. He is perfect for what they do and I'm sure Rex doesn't regret the pick one bit.Once they really open up the offense, you'll see his enormous talent. I hope Plax stays healthy.
nysportsfan
Footballguy
He's about to get a lot better.
What if he doesnt?How many years of <60% completion, will it take? I realize this is only his 3rd year, but hes shown little to no improvement at all.
Team ROFLCOPTERS
Footballguy
At the end of the day I want to win games and he has proven to be a winner at every step of his life. He has a winning attitude and has a killer attitude at the QB position. Besides, nobody has ever called him a top 10 QB so I'm not sure why you have that stance. The Jets have not really put him in a position to light the world on fire. He is a 3 year QB that has an incomplete grade because oddly enough, we have not been able to really see what he can do. Remember, he came out of USC pretty raw.
GregR
Footballguy
Can't we talk about something more meaningful than "all the guy does is win"? Talk to me about how he has improved in going through his progressions, or how his accuracy has gone up, or give examples of how he's shown a great ability to read the defense and audible to something to take advantage of it, or whatever else it is that you're seeing that is shaping your view of him. Something that demonstrates his ability as a QB instead of something that demonstrates the quality of the rest of the team he plays on.All the Jets need is a caretaker who isn't even necessarily a good QB but who just isn't a bad one. Someone who doesn't shoot his team in the foot because there's a good chance the running game and defense will win the game for them if the QB doesn't turn the ball over.
If he is more than that, if he is as good of a QB as you are saying he is, surely we can discuss specifics of what makes him so?
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
He upped his yardage total from 2,444 to 3,291 and basically flipped his TD/INT ratio from year 1 to year 2.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Sorry, I missed this part.I like his smarts, I like his pocket presence, I LOVE his footwork and I would actually like to see him run some more, and I think he will eventually be one of the most accurate QBs year in and year out.
GregR
Footballguy
The TD-INT ratio is definitely a good step forward. The only thing about the yardage to me that is worth saying, is that they trusted him to throw the ball 500 times instead of only 360 times his rookie year. His completion percentage and yards per attempt didn't change very significantly to show he was doing more with the chances he had, and neither of those are particularly good for an NFL QB. It seems his main improvement last year then was not throwing as many picks.He upped his yardage total from 2,444 to 3,291 and basically flipped his TD/INT ratio from year 1 to year 2.
GregR
Footballguy
I think Tom Moore is likely to be a good influence on him. Even if most of what Peyton Manning has become is due to Peyton himself and not Moore... I think Moore has to have learned a lot about what a QB needs to do to be successful from the long association they had in Indy. I could his decision making improve as he better understands how to take advantage of what a defense gives him.
TLEF316
Footballguy
I like Sanchez's game, but I'm a realist. This is obviously an important year for him.
I think he has good poise and a good enough arm to make all the throws. I think he's a good leader, but has room to grow in that area. He obviously did a much better job at protecting the ball in year 2. He obviously needs to improve his completion percentage.
IMO, Schottenheimer is holding him back at this point. I think he's a bad OC who is good for 2 or 3 absolute game planning brainfarts each season (Last year it was Baltimore, Green Bay and the Miami Loss).
Honestly, at this point, I think its going to be tough to break into the top 10 QB's. The top 10 is pretty damn good. But right now, i think the level of QB play in the league is pretty strong. Of course, the bottom handful of starters are mostly bums or guys with no experience, but the 11-24 range is pretty tight in terms of skill level and accomplishment. The fact that Sanchez has played in big playoff games on the road and won (Yes, i know he didn't "win" those games by himself, but he didn't lose them either) puts him closer to 10 than 24.
Just my opinion, of course.
I think he has good poise and a good enough arm to make all the throws. I think he's a good leader, but has room to grow in that area. He obviously did a much better job at protecting the ball in year 2. He obviously needs to improve his completion percentage.
IMO, Schottenheimer is holding him back at this point. I think he's a bad OC who is good for 2 or 3 absolute game planning brainfarts each season (Last year it was Baltimore, Green Bay and the Miami Loss).
Honestly, at this point, I think its going to be tough to break into the top 10 QB's. The top 10 is pretty damn good. But right now, i think the level of QB play in the league is pretty strong. Of course, the bottom handful of starters are mostly bums or guys with no experience, but the 11-24 range is pretty tight in terms of skill level and accomplishment. The fact that Sanchez has played in big playoff games on the road and won (Yes, i know he didn't "win" those games by himself, but he didn't lose them either) puts him closer to 10 than 24.
Just my opinion, of course.
njherdfan
Footballguy
As a huge Jets fan, I think Sanchez is absolutely the weakest link on the team. I think and hope he can improve, but for the first two years, he's been a liability. While it's true he lowered his interceptions from year 1 until year 2, he also led the NFL with 15 dropped INTs, which is absurd. I also think he gets a little too much credit for winning four playoff games, because with the exception of the win against NE, I don't think he played particularly well in any of them, and he was downright awful in last year's win against Indy. But, Sanchez has also only been a starting QB for 3 years (1 in college, 2 in the pros) and he has the physical tools necessary to succeed; he doesn't lack the ability to make any specific throws. I have to believe and hope that Sanchez will improve, but this year will show a lot. IMO, the Jets have the most cumulative talent in the NFL at the other 21 positions other than QB, so they only need someone who won't hurt them at QB to succeed. I'm hopeful Sanchez turns into that this season.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Please understand the context of the thread, gentlemen. This has nothing to do with Sanchez being "a top-10 QB."Levi's stance was that Sanchez did not deserve to be DRAFTED with a top-10 pick. Clearly, he was wrong.Shocking, I know.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
LHUCKS
Footballguy
Looks like I hit the nail on the head...again.
PizzaDeliveryGuy
extra sausage
I see a ton of hammer marks in the wood surrounding the nail.Looks like I hit the nail on the head...again.
LHUCKS
Footballguy
thoughts?
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
RenegadeGM
Footballguy
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