Florida boy killed by Neighborhood Watch (4 Viewers)

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

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How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

'Clinton said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

Go away. I have no interest in your race discussion.

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I'm not going anywhere. You can go if you want. Race is about the only pertinent issue in this thread. I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Good. Stand your ground. You get a lot of ####, undeservedly so, but your opinion is as valuable as anyone else's.

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Good posting.....except Tim deserves a lot of it.

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It really doesn't matter whether I deserve it or not. Nobody's harming me here no matter what they write. It's a discussion board on the internet. If people want to insult me, go right ahead. It doesn't bother me in the least.And I also disagree with Clinton: not all opinions are of equal value. Christo's opinion on legal issues is going to be more valuable than mine. If discussion of this case were limited to legal issues, then I would defer to Christo every time and I would hope anyone who is not also an attorney would do the same.

But this issue is not just about the law, however much Christo (and some others) want to believe. It is also very much about race and our society. And while I don't consider myself an expert on either, I certainly feel knowledgeable enough to comment on those, and I will continue to do so as the mood strikes me.

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'timschochet said:

I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

'Carolina Hustler said:

'Chaos Commish said:

'cstu said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

It should be mandatory that people who kill someone while claiming self-defense should be tested for drugs and alcohol.

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No it shouldn't. You never know when you may have to defend yourself. It's much different than driving. I step out of a bar a little drunk and get mugged by some thugs with hammers, who cares how much I had to drink when I start shooting to save my life?

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Around here, you can't have a gun in a place that serves alcohol.. I think you're going to have to take the hammer beating.. Sorry..

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'Chaos Commish said:

Isn't there a separate thread for the race issues?

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'Chaos Commish said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'Chaos Commish said:

'cstu said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

It should be mandatory that people who kill someone while claiming self-defense should be tested for drugs and alcohol.

Click to expand...

No it shouldn't. You never know when you may have to defend yourself. It's much different than driving. I step out of a bar a little drunk and get mugged by some thugs with hammers, who cares how much I had to drink when I start shooting to save my life?

Click to expand...

Around here, you can't have a gun in a place that serves alcohol.. I think you're going to have to take the hammer beating.. Sorry..

Click to expand...

Okay. I have a few drinks in my backyard and go for a walk and the thugs jump me. I shoot them. Who cares if I had a few drinks?

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'timschochet said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

I'll ask you the same question I asked Strike. Do you know any black people? If you do, ask them if they have ever been harrassed by the police. And then when the answer is yes (as it will be at least 99% of the time), ask them what excuses the police used for "probable cause." And then once you do this, maybe you'll understand that what I wrote is NOT schtick, but reality for black people living in this country.

Click to expand...

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

'Clinton said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

Go away. I have no interest in your race discussion.

Click to expand...

I'm not going anywhere. You can go if you want. Race is about the only pertinent issue in this thread. I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Good. Stand your ground. You get a lot of ####, undeservedly so, but your opinion is as valuable as anyone else's.

Click to expand...

Good posting.....except Tim deserves a lot of it.

Click to expand...

It really doesn't matter whether I deserve it or not. Nobody's harming me here no matter what they write. It's a discussion board on the internet. If people want to insult me, go right ahead. It doesn't bother me in the least.And I also disagree with Clinton: not all opinions are of equal value. Christo's opinion on legal issues is going to be more valuable than mine. If discussion of this case were limited to legal issues, then I would defer to Christo every time and I would hope anyone who is not also an attorney would do the same. But this issue is not just about the law, however much Christo (and some others) want to believe. It is also very much about race and our society. And while I don't consider myself an expert on either, I certainly feel knowledgeable enough to comment on those, and I will continue to do so as the mood strikes me.

Click to expand...

'Chaos Commish said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'Chaos Commish said:

'cstu said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

It should be mandatory that people who kill someone while claiming self-defense should be tested for drugs and alcohol.

Click to expand...

No it shouldn't. You never know when you may have to defend yourself. It's much different than driving. I step out of a bar a little drunk and get mugged by some thugs with hammers, who cares how much I had to drink when I start shooting to save my life?

Click to expand...

Around here, you can't have a gun in a place that serves alcohol.. I think you're going to have to take the hammer beating.. Sorry..

Click to expand...

Okay. I have a few drinks in my backyard and go for a walk and the thugs jump me. I shoot them. Who cares if I had a few drinks?

Click to expand...

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Then why do you keep asking legal questions?

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As we know,

There are known knowns.

There are things we know we know.

We also know

There are known unknowns.

That is to say

We know there are some things

We do not know.

But there are also unknown unknowns,

The ones we don't know

We don't know.

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'Carolina Hustler said:

Actually, I have a lot of black friends... I have seen some of them harassed, and I've heard some of this "because I'm black" stuff.. But I've seen that line used in situations that were obviously their fault on Waaaaay more occasions than when they were questioned for no reason.. See, for some, any time they have to interact with the police, or anytime something doesn't go their way, it's "Because I'm a Black man" or "He's just prejudice".. Often used as an excuse.. There are people in this world who are white that will judge a person based upon their skin color, just like there are people in this world that are black, that will do the same, just like there are people that are just #######s to everyone.. When a black man is harassed by the police, it's "because I'm black".. What is it when a white guy is harassed by the police?

I have a lot of brothers, cousins, uncles in my family, all white, and I'd say most of them have been harassed by the police at one point in their life... It's life.. People are #######s, and some police officers let the power go to their heads.. You search for answers when things don't add up.. "Must be because I'm black".. Maybe just the guy is an #######.. Or maybe the guy is just having a bad day.. Or maybe you deserved a ticket because you were speeding in a school zone you jack ###, just shut up and move on...

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'Carolina Hustler said:

'Chaos Commish said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'Chaos Commish said:

'cstu said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

It should be mandatory that people who kill someone while claiming self-defense should be tested for drugs and alcohol.

Click to expand...

No it shouldn't. You never know when you may have to defend yourself. It's much different than driving. I step out of a bar a little drunk and get mugged by some thugs with hammers, who cares how much I had to drink when I start shooting to save my life?

Click to expand...

Around here, you can't have a gun in a place that serves alcohol.. I think you're going to have to take the hammer beating.. Sorry..

Click to expand...

Okay. I have a few drinks in my backyard and go for a walk and the thugs jump me. I shoot them. Who cares if I had a few drinks?

Click to expand...

I think your blood alcohol level would be put to the test in court.. I think it would be much harder to defend yourself in court if you were drunk when you shot a guy..

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'timschochet said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

I'll ask you the same question I asked Strike. Do you know any black people? If you do, ask them if they have ever been harrassed by the police. And then when the answer is yes (as it will be at least 99% of the time), ask them what excuses the police used for "probable cause." And then once you do this, maybe you'll understand that what I wrote is NOT schtick, but reality for black people living in this country.

Click to expand...

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Then why do you keep asking legal questions?

Click to expand...

I don't keep asking legal questions. I ask a few pertinent legal questions from time to time, and I appreciate your answers. In this particular instance as to whether or not police would have treated Zimmerman the same way had he been black, your legal opinion has no bearing.

Click to expand...

'cstu said:

'timschochet said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

I'll ask you the same question I asked Strike. Do you know any black people? If you do, ask them if they have ever been harrassed by the police. And then when the answer is yes (as it will be at least 99% of the time), ask them what excuses the police used for "probable cause." And then once you do this, maybe you'll understand that what I wrote is NOT schtick, but reality for black people living in this country.

Click to expand...

I know a lot of black people, but guess what - they don't dress and act like thugs so they don't get harassed by the police.

Click to expand...

'cstu said:

'timschochet said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y

Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

I'll ask you the same question I asked Strike. Do you know any black people? If you do, ask them if they have ever been harrassed by the police. And then when the answer is yes (as it will be at least 99% of the time), ask them what excuses the police used for "probable cause." And then once you do this, maybe you'll understand that what I wrote is NOT schtick, but reality for black people living in this country.

Click to expand...

I know a lot of black people, but guess what - they don't dress and act like thugs so they don't get harassed by the police.

Click to expand...

'cstu said:

'timschochet said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

I'll ask you the same question I asked Strike. Do you know any black people? If you do, ask them if they have ever been harrassed by the police. And then when the answer is yes (as it will be at least 99% of the time), ask them what excuses the police used for "probable cause." And then once you do this, maybe you'll understand that what I wrote is NOT schtick, but reality for black people living in this country.

Click to expand...

I know a lot of black people, but guess what - they don't dress and act like thugs so they don't get harassed by the police.

Click to expand...

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Then why do you keep asking legal questions?

Click to expand...

I don't keep asking legal questions. I ask a few pertinent legal questions from time to time, and I appreciate your answers. In this particular instance as to whether or not police would have treated Zimmerman the same way had he been black, your legal opinion has no bearing.

Click to expand...

'GDogg said:

'cstu said:

'timschochet said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

I'll ask you the same question I asked Strike. Do you know any black people? If you do, ask them if they have ever been harrassed by the police. And then when the answer is yes (as it will be at least 99% of the time), ask them what excuses the police used for "probable cause." And then once you do this, maybe you'll understand that what I wrote is NOT schtick, but reality for black people living in this country.

Click to expand...

I know a lot of black people, but guess what - they don't dress and act like thugs so they don't get harassed by the police.

Click to expand...

How do thugs dress and act? Only thugs or people that "dress and act like thugs" get harassed by the police?

Click to expand...

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

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'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Then why do you keep asking legal questions?

Click to expand...

I don't keep asking legal questions. I ask a few pertinent legal questions from time to time, and I appreciate your answers. In this particular instance as to whether or not police would have treated Zimmerman the same way had he been black, your legal opinion has no bearing.

Click to expand...

You mean the particular instance where you asked about probable cause and then after I responded you made an unsolicited statement about race?

Click to expand...

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

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Wiggers should be stopped every time a cop sees one on general principle.

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'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Then why do you keep asking legal questions?

Click to expand...

I don't keep asking legal questions. I ask a few pertinent legal questions from time to time, and I appreciate your answers. In this particular instance as to whether or not police would have treated Zimmerman the same way had he been black, your legal opinion has no bearing.

Click to expand...

You mean the particular instance where you asked about probable cause and then after I responded you made an unsolicited statement about race?

Click to expand...

Any statement I make about race is unsolicited. I poised a rhetorical question about probable cause. It was not a legal question. Somebody else may have asked that.

Click to expand...

'Carolina Hustler said:

'GDogg said:

'cstu said:

'timschochet said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

Click to expand...

Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y Does Tim really think this way?

Click to expand...

I'll ask you the same question I asked Strike. Do you know any black people? If you do, ask them if they have ever been harrassed by the police. And then when the answer is yes (as it will be at least 99% of the time), ask them what excuses the police used for "probable cause." And then once you do this, maybe you'll understand that what I wrote is NOT schtick, but reality for black people living in this country.

Click to expand...

I know a lot of black people, but guess what - they don't dress and act like thugs so they don't get harassed by the police.

Click to expand...

How do thugs dress and act? Only thugs or people that "dress and act like thugs" get harassed by the police?

Click to expand...

I don't dress or act like a thug, and I've been harassed by the police.. But I'm white so that doesn't count right?

Click to expand...

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Then why do you keep asking legal questions?

Click to expand...

I don't keep asking legal questions. I ask a few pertinent legal questions from time to time, and I appreciate your answers. In this particular instance as to whether or not police would have treated Zimmerman the same way had he been black, your legal opinion has no bearing.

Click to expand...

You mean the particular instance where you asked about probable cause and then after I responded you made an unsolicited statement about race?

Click to expand...

Any statement I make about race is unsolicited. I poised a rhetorical question about probable cause. It was not a legal question. Somebody else may have asked that.

Click to expand...

So in your mind a question about probable cause has nothing to do with the law. Gotcha.

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'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

I'm not interested in your legalese discussion which has no bearing whatsoever to what really happened in this case.

Click to expand...

Then why do you keep asking legal questions?

Click to expand...

I don't keep asking legal questions. I ask a few pertinent legal questions from time to time, and I appreciate your answers. In this particular instance as to whether or not police would have treated Zimmerman the same way had he been black, your legal opinion has no bearing.

Click to expand...

You mean the particular instance where you asked about probable cause and then after I responded you made an unsolicited statement about race?

Click to expand...

Any statement I make about race is unsolicited. I poised a rhetorical question about probable cause. It was not a legal question. Somebody else may have asked that.

Click to expand...

So in your mind a question about probable cause has nothing to do with the law. Gotcha.

Click to expand...

The question that I asked is whether or not police appy the same definition of "probable cause" when it comes to black suspects vs. white suspects. My question has nothing to do with the law.

Click to expand...

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

Click to expand...

How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

Click to expand...

In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Click to expand...

'timschochet said:

'parasaurolophus said:

'timschochet said:

The article is ultimately wrong. Yes, there is certainly exploitation going on. But this story IS at heart a racial one, and attempts to deny it are absurd IMO. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that Trayvon Martin would be alive today if he was white. There is not a shred of doubt in my mind that if Zimmerman was black, he'd be behind bars right now. Maybe he'd be able to use the Stand Your Ground defense at at trial, but right now he'd be in jail waiting for that trial. Blacks are rightfully outraged about this case because in general, the police in our nation do not treat black people well, and there is a double standard. Until everyone, including conservatives, realize this and try to do something to change it, stories like this one will always spark a fire, as they should.

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There are two questions that you would have to answer conclusively before your point becomes valid.Can you prove that Trayvon was not wandering about in between houses and looking at things?Can you prove that white people in the gated community have done the same things and Zimmerman ignored them?Seems to me the guy called about potholes before and I don't think it was because the asphalt was black.

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I don't think either of your questions would make my point any more or less valid.

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'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

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'Chaos Commish said:

Here's a pretty long summary including some of the timing of events that interest me. It suggests Zimmerman's call began at 7:11 not 7:09 as omally cited. That's a pretty big deal in what could have happened. The article reminds me of this quote by Rumsfeld:

As we know,

There are known knowns.

There are things we know we know.

We also know

There are known unknowns.

That is to say

We know there are some things

We do not know.

But there are also unknown unknowns,

The ones we don't know

We don't know.

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'BustedKnuckles said:

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

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Even Tyler Perry`s mom had this advice for her son as he was growing up ,"My mother would always say to me, 'if you get stopped by the police, especially if they are white policemen, you say 'yes sir' and 'no sir', and if they want to take you in, you go with them. Don't resist, you hear me? Don't make any quick moves, don't run, you just go.'"

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'Chaos Commish said:

'cstu said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

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How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

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In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

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It should be mandatory that people who kill someone while claiming self-defense should be tested for drugs and alcohol.

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No it shouldn't. You never know when you may have to defend yourself. It's much different than driving. I step out of a bar a little drunk and get mugged by some thugs with hammers, who cares how much I had to drink when I start shooting to save my life?

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'BustedKnuckles said:

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

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Even Tyler Perry`s mom had this advice for her son as he was growing up ,"My mother would always say to me, 'if you get stopped by the police, especially if they are white policemen, you say 'yes sir' and 'no sir', and if they want to take you in, you go with them. Don't resist, you hear me? Don't make any quick moves, don't run, you just go.'"

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'GDogg said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'GDogg said:

'cstu said:

'timschochet said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'timschochet said:

'Christo said:

'timschochet said:

'jon_mx said:

Need probable cause to test Zimmerman. What else you got?

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How about the fact that he just shot an unarmed man to death? Is that enough? Can't believe some of these comments.

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In order to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman the police needed probable cause to believe Zimmerman was on drugs or drunk. So no, the fact that Zimmerman had just shot an unarmed man to death is not, in and of itself, probable cause to perform a drug/alcohol test on Zimmerman.

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Then why did they perform a test on Martin?"Probable cause" is whatever the police says it is, when it comes to blacks. If Zimmerman had been black, of course he would have been tested. Whom are we kidding here?

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Someone please tell me that this is schtick..y Does Tim really think this way?

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I'll ask you the same question I asked Strike. Do you know any black people? If you do, ask them if they have ever been harrassed by the police. And then when the answer is yes (as it will be at least 99% of the time), ask them what excuses the police used for "probable cause." And then once you do this, maybe you'll understand that what I wrote is NOT schtick, but reality for black people living in this country.

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I know a lot of black people, but guess what - they don't dress and act like thugs so they don't get harassed by the police.

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How do thugs dress and act? Only thugs or people that "dress and act like thugs" get harassed by the police?

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I don't dress or act like a thug, and I've been harassed by the police.. But I'm white so that doesn't count right?

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Cool. So, then you and I agree that it's not only "thugs" or people that "dress and act like thugs" that get harassed by the police.It "counts" for purposes of saying that some cops are jerks, but no, it doesn't count in terms of the discussion regarding racial profiling. Are you of the opinion that white people get harassed by the police because of the color of their skin as often as people of color?

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'BustedKnuckles said:

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

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Even Tyler Perry`s mom had this advice for her son as he was growing up ,"My mother would always say to me, 'if you get stopped by the police, especially if they are white policemen, you say 'yes sir' and 'no sir', and if they want to take you in, you go with them. Don't resist, you hear me? Don't make any quick moves, don't run, you just go.'"

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'Christo said:

'BustedKnuckles said:

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

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Even Tyler Perry`s mom had this advice for her son as he was growing up ,"My mother would always say to me, 'if you get stopped by the police, especially if they are white policemen, you say 'yes sir' and 'no sir', and if they want to take you in, you go with them. Don't resist, you hear me? Don't make any quick moves, don't run, you just go.'"

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That's good advice whatever your race.

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'BustedKnuckles said:

'Christo said:

'BustedKnuckles said:

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

Click to expand...

Even Tyler Perry`s mom had this advice for her son as he was growing up ,"My mother would always say to me, 'if you get stopped by the police, especially if they are white policemen, you say 'yes sir' and 'no sir', and if they want to take you in, you go with them. Don't resist, you hear me? Don't make any quick moves, don't run, you just go.'"

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That's good advice whatever your race.

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I agree, white po po scare the #### outa me.

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'Carolina Hustler said:

'BustedKnuckles said:

'Christo said:

'BustedKnuckles said:

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

Click to expand...

Even Tyler Perry`s mom had this advice for her son as he was growing up ,"My mother would always say to me, 'if you get stopped by the police, especially if they are white policemen, you say 'yes sir' and 'no sir', and if they want to take you in, you go with them. Don't resist, you hear me? Don't make any quick moves, don't run, you just go.'"

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That's good advice whatever your race.

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I agree, white po po scare the #### outa me.

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So, white police men are now racist, based on Perry's commentary over the Trayvon Martin case.. Gotcha..Tim was saying it was the whole police force.. Now we're narrowing it down.. The end is in sight..

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'timschochet said:

'StrikeS2k said:

'timschochet said:

I begin with a premise which is the opposite of yours. I hold that the playing field is unfair, that the police act unfairly towards African-Americans as a matter of course, and that it is up to YOU to provide evidence that they haven't done so in this particular case. Again, any reasonable study of police behavior tells you that in this situation, if Zimmerman were black he would be in jail right now.

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Yeah, we know, and it's why you're so often wrong in matters of race.

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Just on matters of race? Has your opinion of me improved? I used to be wrong about EVERYTHING.

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'BustedKnuckles said:

'Carolina Hustler said:

'BustedKnuckles said:

'Christo said:

'BustedKnuckles said:

'timschochet said:

of course any African-American who wears dresses like a "gangsta" is going to be treated with more suspicion by police than one who wears a business suit. That's just common sense. But the business suit is not going to protect a black man- he's STILL going to be stopped by police much more often than a white man. And a black dressed in "gangsta" clothes is going to be stopped by police much more than a white man in "gangsta" clothes.

Click to expand...

Even Tyler Perry`s mom had this advice for her son as he was growing up ,"My mother would always say to me, 'if you get stopped by the police, especially if they are white policemen, you say 'yes sir' and 'no sir', and if they want to take you in, you go with them. Don't resist, you hear me? Don't make any quick moves, don't run, you just go.'"

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That's good advice whatever your race.

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I agree, white po po scare the #### outa me.

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So, white police men are now racist, based on Perry's commentary over the Trayvon Martin case.. Gotcha..Tim was saying it was the whole police force.. Now we're narrowing it down.. The end is in sight..

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actually he was claiming racial profiling after being pulled over by 2 white cops.

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'timschochet said:

'StrikeS2k said:

And it's all based upon a single story, too.

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Do you know any black people, Strike? If you do, I dare you to ask them about being harrassed by police.

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'Giantseasonticketholder said:

If not, could you please point me to the posts where it's talked about how the media twisted this story just in time to take the attention off of the Supreme Courts decision on the Reduction of American Freedoms Act(Obamacare), in case that did not go according to plan (which it hasn't).

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'StrikeS2k said:

'timschochet said:

'StrikeS2k said:

And it's all based upon a single story, too.

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Do you know any black people, Strike? If you do, I dare you to ask them about being harrassed by police.

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No, Tim, I live in a cave. Seriously, who DOESN'T know any black people? If any of you don't know any black people could you please note it in this thread so we can judge you accordingly.

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'SacramentoBob said:

'StrikeS2k said:

'timschochet said:

'StrikeS2k said:

And it's all based upon a single story, too.

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Do you know any black people, Strike? If you do, I dare you to ask them about being harrassed by police.

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No, Tim, I live in a cave. Seriously, who DOESN'T know any black people? If any of you don't know any black people could you please note it in this thread so we can judge you accordingly.

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When is the last time you ate dinner at a black guy's house or invited him over your house for dinner?

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'Christo said:

'SacramentoBob said:

'StrikeS2k said:

'timschochet said:

'StrikeS2k said:

And it's all based upon a single story, too.

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Do you know any black people, Strike? If you do, I dare you to ask them about being harrassed by police.

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No, Tim, I live in a cave. Seriously, who DOESN'T know any black people? If any of you don't know any black people could you please note it in this thread so we can judge you accordingly.

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When is the last time you ate dinner at a black guy's house or invited him over your house for dinner?

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He didn't say he dated black men.

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