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He's done. He'll be competitive but he lost the fear factor. Looks like The Gold Bear might be out of the woods. This post has been edited by Finless: 14 August 2009 - 12:53 PMhttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=467745&view=findpost&p=10305526Looks to me like this thread is supposed to be about him being done....
He is far from that.
No one could seriously argue that he is done. But the prediction that he's lost the fear factor and that Jack's record is safe looks to be holding true. The context of your quote is that he is done being dominant. Thanks for the bumpHe's done. He'll be competitive but he lost the fear factor. Looks like The Gold Bear might be out of the woods. This post has been edited by Finless: 14 August 2009 - 12:53 PMhttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=467745&view=findpost&p=10305526Looks to me like this thread is supposed to be about him being done....
YEAH BUT NOBODY'S SCARED OF HIM!!!! FINITO!!!!
Yeah, it's a real stretch to predict that an athlete will cease to be dominant the older he gets.No one could seriously argue that he is done. But the prediction that he's lost the fear factor and that Jack's record is safe looks to be holding true. The context of your quote is that he is done being dominant. Thanks for the bumpHe's done. He'll be competitive but he lost the fear factor. Looks like The Gold Bear might be out of the woods. This post has been edited by Finless: 14 August 2009 - 12:53 PMhttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=467745&view=findpost&p=10305526Looks to me like this thread is supposed to be about him being done....
You guys can keep playing semantics about "the whole purpose of this thread," but there's no definition of "done" or "finished" that can apply to a guy who is in the conversation for best golfer in the world.
The fear factor is a product of winning, and occasionally doing it in dramatic fashion. He didn't win for a while so that waned. Now he's started winning again, complete with timely hole-outs. He's building that back up. Will he get all the way there? Who knows, but he's definitely trending in that direction relative to where he was before Australia last year. Most golfers will tell you he's already "back." It's the casual observers - the golf equivalent of my mother watching football - who have this MAJOR WINS ONLY measurement.No one could seriously argue that he is done. But the prediction that he's lost the fear factor and that Jack's record is safe looks to be holding true. The context of your quote is that he is done being dominant. Thanks for the bumpHe's done. He'll be competitive but he lost the fear factor. Looks like The Gold Bear might be out of the woods. This post has been edited by Finless: 14 August 2009 - 12:53 PMhttp://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=467745&view=findpost&p=10305526Looks to me like this thread is supposed to be about him being done....
But he's only won the ham n egger opens, Otis
I never said that and agree it is a ridiculous statement. But to suggest that Tiger will be measured by anything other than major titles from here on out is just wrong. There is nothing left for him to do. He is already the best ever if he quit today. And AJ's suggestion that other players would tell you is back is pure conjecture. If you watch the golf channel the prevailing consensus is that he isn't back to where he was. I agree he is trending that way, but he hasn't won a major in over 4 years. All the Bay Hills and Memorials doesn't change that.It cannot be argued that he is dominant. And i think the argument that he will never be again is a valid one based on the evidence. Old Tiger would be making a charge today. The course is there for the taking. He just can't put four rounds together in the majors anymore.But he's only won the ham n egger opens, Otis
Fair comment. For me, if he doesn't beat Jack's record it will be a major disappointment. He was on a trajectory to win 20+ easily.I think the root of this thread was that Ambien-gate derailed the historic run. And so far that looks to be right.
It's not that simple. I think it's more about the injuries and the swing change. Mostly the swing change, and even more specifically, the monkeying with his putting stroke. The debacle certainly didn't help, but I think it's role is overblown.
It's all of the above. Haney's book shed some good insight into Tiger's internal motivation.. He fired Butch Harmon for a number of reasons but for more than anything, Butch wanted to work on maintenance and Tiger wanted to work on improvement. AJ, you know as well as anyone that championship golf is much more mental than physical. How can you say that the debacle is overblown? All of that combined led to the point where he is today.
I don't get it. Nicklaus never had to face this level of competition week in and week out. THe field is WAAAAAAAYYY deeper in talent than it was 30 years ago. Heck...it's deeper than it was even TEN years ago, partly due to Tiger himself.Does he really have to dominate this field or break Jack's record to be the best ever? I don't think so.
Comparing players of different eras does not work in any sport (including golf). The term "best ever" is a matter of opinion and nothing more.
Unless your name is Gretsky
So who has Tiger faced that matched - Palmer, Player, Trevino, Watson, Floyd? And at the next tier - Weiskopf, Miller, early Seve career - maybe not the depth at 30 but at the top it was better quality that Jack faced IMO
No there are just more players that can make a run at any time. During Nicklaus time, he had to go against major winners Player (9), Watson (8), Palmer (7), Trevino (6), Ballesteros (5), Floyd (4). Tiger: Mickleson (4). That's it.
But the lack of depth just accentuates the top heaviness at the # of majors as well. When you only have a handful of guys that can even compete for a major, that's just a few guys to spread all those majors amongst so naturally, they'll all have a lot of majors.
You can look at it that way but this in undeniable. Tiger couldn't hit the driver that Jack used. 210cc.Some comparisons.The major advantage that Tiger has over Jack is; the lighter weight shaft by almost 50 grams and a little more than an inch longer; the high COR (spring-like effect); high MOI (forgiveness) head, even though Tiger is using a 380 cc driver the max allowed is 460 cc. Tiger also uses the new low spin multilayered ball and this along with other factors gives Tiger the ability, to achieve optimum launch conditions for his ball speed. These all important launch conditions, were not achievable by Jack or any other players using the equipment available in 1968. Taking everything into account knowing that both golfers hit the ball with similar head speeds it is estimated that if Jack had todays equipment he would have driven the ball approximately 30 yards farther than he did in 1968 and more accurately because of the more forgiving driver, low spin and very much better quality ball.
Pretty much the Tiger blowers who keep moving the goal posts. When this thread started, Tiger was in the midst of 17 straight top 10's with 10 wins. There were still guys throwing eTantrums saying he would still blow up the Major record.
That's nice. And?Tiger competes against players with the same advantages. Jack competed against players with the same equipment. There is more depth today but less greatness. Tiger with his conditioning and practice would athletically destroy the guys from the 60s.
You funny.
I agree and already said he is the best ever in my opinion if he hung it up right now. That doesn't change the fact that if he doesn't beat Jack's record his career will be, on some level, a disappointment given that only a couple of years it looked like he would smash it.
so what? everyone else would have too.
Well done, sir.
And lets see Jack and Arnie compete with that equipment on today's lengthened courses too.
There is no doubt that Tiger is in the conversation for greatest golfer ever. But he's the one who set the target of beating Jack Nicklaus's record for majors (as has been mentioned above). And if he doesn't beat that record, he will always be in the conversation, but he will never be the clear cut #1 ever. And unless he pulls out a great round tomorrow, another major will slip by.
Yeah, and hav'em riding on Mike Ditka while they're doing it.
I don't think anybody has ever made the claim that Lefty is the greatest that ever was.Lot's of posters who don't know #### about golf saying Tiger is done.
Well, he could have been #1 after Tiger hit the rails. He never took it. But that's GOLF. Heck, Scott is zero for Major's, and he is the leader today. There are a lot of golfers who are zero for Major's, and a lot who have less than 5 wins in their career.I don't think anybody has ever made the claim that Lefty is the greatest that ever was.Lot's of posters who don't know #### about golf saying Tiger is done.
Do we call this the Billy Baroo argument?
1. 32.56728%2. 2.93764%3. 8.39562%Or thereabouts.
Yes, that is a tough one. One would have to be able to * count to 4* add by groups of 4* and be able to divide by possible years of the 4 wins he needs by year he would play Seems like it would have to be triangulated or something. I'm no math major.
Not comparing eras...comparing DEPTH.
I think y'all are looking at this wrong. There are more players today CAPABLE of winning a major. Nicklaus had 5 or 6 other guys capable...Tiger's facing 20 or 30 guys capable. Depth at the top has resulted in more people winning majors instead of 4 or 5 guys winning almost all of them.
As usual, Timmy settles the argument.
So hard to tell yourself to do that when you think you can pull off a shot. Most golfers have too much bravada to take the unplayable. The second sand shot from his sitting down position was masterful. not enough to save him from a triple bogey though. OUCH. Officially out of it now.
I would guess that guy knows a little biut more about golf than you or me. Seems to be somewhat knowledgeable and not an Eldrick Woods bandwaggoneer. I could find more comparisons stating the same.
