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LB Tiers 2013 / Version 3.0 Updated May 9 (1 Viewer)

'Jene Bramel said:
'Young 8 said:
Does Ellerbe replace Dansby in the Elite LB1 Upside tier now ?
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Too early to say. I'm not certain I know how the Ellerbe/Wheeler/Burnett/Misi group plays out. Could see some 3-4. Could see some subpackage rotations.For now, put Ellerbe in the risk-reward LB2 group, Wheeler in a LB3 tier and watch the press conferences to glean some more information.
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Burnett was released though too right? At least I thought I read he was???
 
'blend said:
'Jene Bramel said:
'Young 8 said:
Does Ellerbe replace Dansby in the Elite LB1 Upside tier now ?
Click to expand...
Too early to say. I'm not certain I know how the Ellerbe/Wheeler/Burnett/Misi group plays out. Could see some 3-4. Could see some subpackage rotations.For now, put Ellerbe in the risk-reward LB2 group, Wheeler in a LB3 tier and watch the press conferences to glean some more information.
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Burnett was released though too right? At least I thought I read he was???
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This was posted before Burnett was released.
 
What is Kaluka Maiava's upside in Oakland? Does he replace Wheeler's snaps? will he play 3 downs?

 
I noticed Erin Henderson not even listed, he was re-signed by Minny and Jasper was let go... were would u class EH now?

 
No mention of C. Upshaw? Seems he had a decent rookie year and could be in line for more PT this upcoming season. Thoughts?

 
'BC3 said:
What is Kaluka Maiava's upside in Oakland? Does he replace Wheeler's snaps? will he play 3 downs?
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No idea what's happening in Oakland. Don't think much of Maiava, but if he's given an every down role he could have LB3+ value.
'KellysHeroes said:
I noticed Erin Henderson not even listed, he was re-signed by Minny and Jasper was let go... were would u class EH now?
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Depends on if he plays well enough to win a reliable every down role. I've pushed him as a LB2 in that role in the past.
'jurb26 said:
No mention of C. Upshaw? Seems he had a decent rookie year and could be in line for more PT this upcoming season. Thoughts?
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I'm generally biased against one-dimensional 3-4 OLBs in balanced scoring system. Still some upside with Upshaw, but until he projects to 8+ sacks, he won't crack my top 50.
 
Brad Jones in GB, is he the real deal playing next to Desmond? He looked solid at the end of last season.

 
'Langly said:
Brad Jones in GB, is he the real deal playing next to Desmond? He looked solid at the end of last season.
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They restructured AJ Hawks deal, so most likely he remains the 2 down LB?DJ Smith is still in the mix also, think it will take til camp to see what happens for sure.
 
Still wouldn't be surprised if Hawk is traded/cut before the season. Although Hawk isn't as bad as his reputation suggests, he just doesn't live up to where he was drafted or what he's paid...DJ looked real solid, and would be the best fit next to Bishop IMO. But a lot of that depends, if he's healthy enough in time, if he is my guess is he'd get more snaps. I like Brad Jones, but his play was not quite as good as his FF points would suggest.

 
Dumervile to LB?

Elvis Dumervil has agreed to a multiyear contract with the Baltimore Ravens, a league source confirmed to ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter.

 
'Packerz said:
Still wouldn't be surprised if Hawk is traded/cut before the season. Although Hawk isn't as bad as his reputation suggests, he just doesn't live up to where he was drafted or what he's paid...DJ looked real solid, and would be the best fit next to Bishop IMO. But a lot of that depends, if he's healthy enough in time, if he is my guess is he'd get more snaps. I like Brad Jones, but his play was not quite as good as his FF points would suggest.
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Do nfl teams ever trade lbs, I can't recall the last time one was
 
'KellysHeroes said:
'Packerz said:
Still wouldn't be surprised if Hawk is traded/cut before the season. Although Hawk isn't as bad as his reputation suggests, he just doesn't live up to where he was drafted or what he's paid...DJ looked real solid, and would be the best fit next to Bishop IMO. But a lot of that depends, if he's healthy enough in time, if he is my guess is he'd get more snaps. I like Brad Jones, but his play was not quite as good as his FF points would suggest.
Click to expand...
Do nfl teams ever trade lbs, I can't recall the last time one was
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DeMeco Ryans and Aaron Curry are two recent ones I can think of.
 
Does Lorenzo Alexander fit in here somewhere? I have seen reports that the Cardinals may use him as a three-down OLB.

 
What about DJ Williams now that he is being talked about as the MLB for Chicago? I understand the dynasty value isn't there, but it would seem to be a pretty good landing spot for 2013.

 
Does anyone know much about Najee Goode, LB in Tampa Bay? He's available in pretty much all of my dynasty leagues and I'm starting to get a warm fuzzy about him. Same kind of warm fuzzy I got about Wesley Woodyard before he blew up.

With Mason Foster's injury/concussion issues, his time to shine could be on the horizon.

He was described as London Fletcher-esque.

I'd like to pick him up on the cheap but was wondering if anyone in here might have some more insight.

Shhhhhhhh! :ph34r:

 
Free agency muddled the middle tiers significantly. Many of the tough to read situations should play out within a few weeks of the draft, but I’m not ready to make a convincing argument for alignment and snap count for lots of teams yet. I’ve got a list of ~ 20 veteran players I’m not certain where to slot. But I think all of them deserve to be considered as Top 40-50 options right now, so they comprise a long list of Tier Jumpers -- long enough that I loosely grouped them into mini-tiers. I also think this year’s draft class could prove to be as deep as last year’s, which could put another 4-8 names into tier jumper limbo by May. A number of these players are going to move into the LB2 (or higher) tiers in time, while a couple of the risk-reward LB2 names will drop into a lower ceiling tier.

I also added context to the dynasty stash tier.

As always, questions, suggestions and challenges are encouraged. Hopefully, there aren’t any major errors in my cut-and-paste process.

Key:

FA=Free Agent

TJ=Tier Jumper (plus signs indicate ceiling tier)

Red=Significant Move from last update (coming in Version 3.0 and beyond)

**All classifications per Rotoworld (proxy for MFL) on date of this post

**Assume a league with 60+ LB rostered, 25+ starting LB, and a balanced scoring system.

----------

Elite LB1Luke Kuechly

Derrick Johnson

James Laurinaitis

Daryl Washington

Elite LB1 Upside

Sean Lee

D’Qwell Jackson

Paul Posluszny

Bobby Wagner

NaVorro Bowman

Patrick Willis

Lawrence Timmons

Colin McCarthy

Chad Greenway

Lavonte David

Desmond Bishop

Wesley Woodyard

Mason Foster

Jerod Mayo

Brian Cushing

Risk-Reward LB2

Nick Roach

DJ Williams

Bruce Carter

Dannell Ellerbe

Curtis Lofton

Sean Weatherspoon

Donald Butler

Zach Brown

Vontaze Burfict

Jerrell Freeman

Demario Davis

High Floor LB2

London Fletcher

Stephen Tulloch

Rush / Big Play LB2

Von Miller

Aldon Smith

Elvis Dumervil

Clay Matthews

Terrell Suggs

High Floor / Low Ceiling LB3

Perry Riley

Lance Briggs

Phillip Wheeler

Russell Allen

KJ Wright

Jo-Lonn Dunbar

Jon Beason

DeMeco Ryans

Thomas Davis

Stephen Nicholas

David Harris

AJ Hawk

Karlos Dansby (FA / TJ +++)

Daryl Smith (FA)

Brian Urlacher (FA)

Tier Jumpers

Kelvin Sheppard (TJ 3-Star)

Mychal Kendricks (TJ 3-Star)

Donta Hightower (TJ 3-Star)

Pat Angerer (TJ 3-Star)

Nigel Bradham (TJ 3-Star)

Erin Henderson (TJ 2-Star)

Akeem Dent (TJ 2-Star)

Nate Irving (TJ 2-Star)

James-Michael Johnson (TJ 2-Star)

Jacquian Williams (TJ 2-Star)

Jameel McClain (TJ 2-Star)

Brandon Spikes (TJ 1-Star)

Courtney Upshaw (TJ 1-Star)

Miles Burris (TJ 1-Star)

Melvin Ingram (TJ 1-Star)

Mark Herzlich (TJ 1-Star)

James Anderson (TJ 1-Star)

Kevin Burnett (TJ 1-Star)

Josh Bynes (TJ 1-Star)

Darryl Sharpton (TJ 1-Star)

Audie Cole (TJ 1-Star)

David Hawthorne (TJ 1-Star)

Matchup Rush LB

Justin Houston

Paul Kruger

Tamba Hali

Brandon Graham

Akeem Ayers

Whitney Mercilus

Jabaal Sheard

Brian Orakpo

LaMarr Woodley

Trent Cole

Jason Worilds

Junior Galette

Dynasty Stash (Current / Ceiling)

Keenan Robinson (LB7 w/ LB3 Upside)

Danny Trevathan (LB7 w/ LB3 Upside)

Vinny Curry (LB7 w/ LB3 Upside)

Emmanuel Lamur (LB7 w/ LB3 Upside)

Jonas Mouton (LB7 w/ LB3 Upside)

Sean Spence (LB7 w/ LB3 Upside)

Cory Greenwood (LB7 w/ LB3 Upside)

Draft Watch

Alec Ogletree

Arthur Brown

Kevin Minter

Manti Te’o

Kevin Reddick

Sio Moore

Jamie Collins

Zaviar Gooden

Khaseem Greene

Brandon Jenkins

Jelani Jenkins

Sean Porter

Jon Bostic

Ty Powell

Kiko Alonso

Nico Johnson

DeVonte Holloman

Jarvis Jones

Dion Jordan (DE)

Barkevious Mingo (DE)

Corey Lemonier (DE)

Chase Thomas

 
saintfool said:
thoughts on bulter to NO? comes over with Ryan now....
Click to expand...
Not very high on any of the Saints' OLB options. Tentatively have Galette just on this side of the value curve, but any of the Smith, Wilson and Butler could all slot there based on personal preference. That tier is primarily based on single game matchup pass rush upside, which is why Galette gets the narrow edge for me for now.

 
Jene, out of this years draft who do you see(in regards to Lbs) as has having a strong impact ala Keuchly? Obviously its hard to place judgments without knowing what teams they will go to, but in regards to overall talent and athletiscm...just wondering who your prime LB candidate would be to target if your draft was before the NFL draft.

 
Langly said:
Jene, out of this years draft who do you see(in regards to Lbs) as has having a strong impact ala Keuchly? Obviously its hard to place judgments without knowing what teams they will go to, but in regards to overall talent and athletiscm...just wondering who your prime LB candidate would be to target if your draft was before the NFL draft.
Click to expand...
Brown and Ogletree are the only ones I trust to be playing an every-down role by the end of their rookie season. There will be others, but they carry no guarantees until we see scheme fit, etc.

jacobo_moses said:
Jene what made you move Demario Davis up so high?
Click to expand...
Rex said he'll start, I don't see any pre-draft impediments to him playing in subpackages and I don't think ILB will be a high enough priority in their draft that a player who can challenge him will be drafted.

Bear in mind, as always, that there's a continuum in that group of LB2 tiers. Davis doesn't crack the top 30 yet and the players listed in the risk-reward tier are there because their season and weekly floor isn't assured to be LB3 quality.

 
Jene Bramel said:
Langly said:
Jene, out of this years draft who do you see(in regards to Lbs) as has having a strong impact ala Keuchly? Obviously its hard to place judgments without knowing what teams they will go to, but in regards to overall talent and athletiscm...just wondering who your prime LB candidate would be to target if your draft was before the NFL draft.
Click to expand...
Brown and Ogletree are the only ones I trust to be playing an every-down role by the end of their rookie season. There will be others, but they carry no guarantees until we see scheme fit, etc.

jacobo_moses said:
>Jene what made you move Demario Davis up so high?
Click to expand...
Rex said he'll start, I don't see any pre-draft impediments to him playing in subpackages and I don't think ILB will be a high enough priority in their draft that a player who can challenge him will be drafted.

Bear in mind, as always, that there's a continuum in that group of LB2 tiers. Davis doesn't crack the top 30 yet and the players listed in the risk-reward tier are there because their season and weekly floor isn't assured to be LB3 quality.
Click to expand...
Jets D will be on the field for about 70% of thier games as well, giving their LBs plenty of tackle opps

 
Jene Bramel said:
saintfool said:
thoughts on bulter to NO? comes over with Ryan now....
Click to expand...
Not very high on any of the Saints' OLB options. Tentatively have Galette just on this side of the value curve, but any of the Smith, Wilson and Butler could all slot there based on personal preference. That tier is primarily based on single game matchup pass rush upside, which is why Galette gets the narrow edge for me for now.
Click to expand...
i don't think Galette or Smith will be terribly effective. They only have experience as DE really and, even then, were not especially good at this time. Maybe they will just absorb blockers while Lofton and Hawthorne fly around for tackles?

 
Jene, don't mean to beat a dead horse on Lorenzo Alexander, but it seems as though he may be headed for a three-down role. That has to make the list somewhere, no? I don't know much about the guy but am trying to stay ahead of the curve. In deeper IDP leagues, finding a three-down LB out of nowhere is a big deal.

 
10tihwj said:
Jene, don't mean to beat a dead horse on Lorenzo Alexander, but it seems as though he may be headed for a three-down role. That has to make the list somewhere, no? I don't know much about the guy but am trying to stay ahead of the curve. In deeper IDP leagues, finding a three-down LB out of nowhere is a big deal.
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Yeah, he probably fits as a 1-2 Star in the Tier Jumper tier. Not convinced that he'll beat Brinkley out as the base defensive SILB, but he has every-down potential if that happens.
 
Jene, I'm surprised to see Mason Foster in the "Elite LB 1 with Upside" tier based on last year's numbers. His production dropped with the addition of Lavonte David and I've read in the past that the TB coaches don't have much faith in Mason.

 
bbasham said:
Jene, I'm surprised to see Mason Foster in the "Elite LB 1 with Upside" tier based on last year's numbers. His production dropped with the addition of Lavonte David and I've read in the past that the TB coaches don't have much faith in Mason.
Click to expand...
im kind of interested in this as well, and may try and buy low on him due to his low points last season.

 
Langly said:
bbasham said:
Jene, I'm surprised to see Mason Foster in the "Elite LB 1 with Upside" tier based on last year's numbers. His production dropped with the addition of Lavonte David and I've read in the past that the TB coaches don't have much faith in Mason.
Click to expand...
im kind of interested in this as well, and may try and buy low on him due to his low points last season.
Click to expand...
Thirded.

With David on board there, I feel like I'm missing something here.

 
Packerz said:
Still wouldn't be surprised if Hawk is traded/cut before the season. Although Hawk isn't as bad as his reputation suggests, he just doesn't live up to where he was drafted or what he's paid...DJ looked real solid, and would be the best fit next to Bishop IMO. But a lot of that depends, if he's healthy enough in time, if he is my guess is he'd get more snaps. I like Brad Jones, but his play was not quite as good as his FF points would suggest.
Click to expand...
In the Green Bay Press Gazette 2-3 weeks ago, they raised the question of why they spent money resigning Brad Jones, when they had 3 competent LBs already under contracts (and they seem to like a couple of others- Lattimore/Manning). The answer from the source was that Bishop is coming off a major injury that may slow him down and that they worry he is no sure thing for the upcoming season, hawk is nothing special, just a solid LB that is really a 2 down LB, and DJ Smith won't be ready for week one due to his injury and because it happened mid-season. Enter Jones- Bishop may be gimpy, Hawk was never a cover guy anyway, and Smith is unavailable. The most logical outcome in my mind, was that Bishop starts and plays every down, comes off in dime. Hawk plays running downs, but comes off in favor of Jones on passing downs. Jones was very very good in coverage, and Jones would be the only ILB in dime. They did not love DJ Smith when he played last season, but did love Jones, so there is the possibility that they will be working Jones in as a 3 down ILB next to Bishop. There is also the contracts- Jones signed for $3.75 million x 3 years, Hawk took a pay cut to just under $3 million x 3 years. Seems like a loose commitment to Jones. My take on this- I'd have a sliver of worry on Bishop, am excited about Jones, and would be selling Hawk. In my league, Jones was LB#20 over the last 8 weeks of the regular season when he was playing every down, so he already has the fantasy production, and probably can be had pretty cheap.

 
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Just to comment on the gb lbs. I traded malcom jenkins and recevied brad jones, a 5tg round pick and swapped 4th round picks for an earlierpock in that round. Malcom played well last season, but i felt that was basically his ceiling wherin Jones has a higher ceiling potential. Plus its a little easier to find serviceable safties than a 3 down serviceable LB

 
bbasham said:
Jene, I'm surprised to see Mason Foster in the "Elite LB 1 with Upside" tier based on last year's numbers. His production dropped with the addition of Lavonte David and I've read in the past that the TB coaches don't have much faith in Mason.
Click to expand...
May be premature to put him in that tier. I think he's got a better shot at playing every down this year and he was very productive when he played the majority of downs last year. It was snap count as much (or more) than David's presence that kept his numbers down after the first couple of weeks of the season. I'm fine with demoting him to a 3-Star Tier Jumper; he's already barely above the risk-reward LB2 line.

CokeZero said:
Jene,

thoughts on Rey Maualuga? intentionally left off your list? Is he that bad in your opinion?
Click to expand...
Inconsistent tackler against the run, no guarantee he plays inside, may not play every down, must contend with a stat crew that gives many more assists than solos. Matchup IDP at best with much more downside than upside.

 
With the 4 game suspension looming, as well as possibly the more troubling 1 year suspension on his next failed test - how far down do you knock D Washington? Is he still "top 10"?

 
Young 8 said:
What's the Dqwell Jackson outlook in the "new" Browns 3-4 ?
Click to expand...
Not sure he's as dynamic as Daryl Washington and I don't necessarily think he'll get the same pass rush opportunity. But scheme isn't a concern here and neither is his likely opportunity or surrounding cast (so-so tacklers, solid defensive line despite scheme change). Very comfortably inside the elite tiers barring a preseason injury.

matttyl said:
With the 4 game suspension looming, as well as possibly the more troubling 1 year suspension on his next failed test - how far down do you knock D Washington? Is he still "top 10"?
Click to expand...
He'll stay in the same tier with an asterisk for me. This isn't akin to the DJ Williams situation where Washington isn't likely to have a role when he returns. In redraft leagues, I'd treat it as a four week injury that he shouldn't have any difficulty returning from. If you'd normally bump a player down a tier (or more), do so.

I'm more interested in a player's per game numbers than year end numbers. So, Washington likely drops to the bottom of the same tier -- I'll take a player with similar talent and more projected games over him, but probably wouldn't take a lesser talent to get the benefit of the four game buffer. Instead, I'd trust that I can find a "depth" player who greatly outplays his draft slot / consensus expectation / etc.

That's a general answer. Specifically, Washington was already on the edge of the elite tier. I kept him there in this update, mostly because I foresee jumping 2-5 players up into that tier this summer rather than dropping him and leaving the "elite" tier thin. He's within a free-flowing tier that includes guys like Lee, Wagner, Jackson, etal.

I'd like to see how the Cardinals approach OTAs. Washington had elite tackle numbers last year, but was buoyed by the huge pass rush opportunity and success he had under Horton. The tackles aren't guaranteed and I think the pass rush numbers could drop 50%.

 
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Jene Bramel said:
Young 8 said:
What's the Dqwell Jackson outlook in the "new" Browns 3-4 ?
Click to expand...
Not sure he's as dynamic as Daryl Washington and I don't necessarily think he'll get the same pass rush opportunity. But scheme isn't a concern here and neither is his likely opportunity or surrounding cast (so-so tacklers, solid defensive line despite scheme change). Very comfortably inside the elite tiers barring a preseason injury.

matttyl said:
>With the 4 game suspension looming, as well as possibly the more troubling 1 year suspension on his next failed test - how far down do you knock D Washington? Is he still "top 10"?
Click to expand...
I'm more interested in a player's per game numbers than year end numbers. So, Washington likely drops to the bottom of the same tier -- I'll take a player with similar talent and more projected games over him, but probably wouldn't take a lesser talent to get the benefit of the four game buffer. Instead, I'd trust that I can find a "depth" player who greatly outplays his draft slot / consensus expectation / etc.

This is where Jene separates himself from the rest of the pack. And honestly, where most IDP owner's must make their living. Anyone can pluck the low hanging fruit and make a pie, but the guy that can make dessert from the rotten stuff on the ground, will survive the longest.
Click to expand...
 
ShaHBucks said:
Dan Connor have any upside as a Giant?
Click to expand...
He is competing against Herlich for now, right? Then no but he's good for tackles only. I would wait to see what they do with the draft.

 
Wanted to get some input on some LBers I have on my roster.

Scoring is a little different and probably help in how you would rank them so I will post. Dynasty League

2pt tackle, 1pt assist, 10pt per sack, 5pt half sack, 2pt tackle for loss, 3pt fumble cause(has to be recover by defense), 3pt fumble recovery 3pt int, 2pt pass defended

Start 2 Outside Linebackers and 2 Inside/Middle Linebackers

How would you rank them. Any have upside Haven't heard much on any of them.

OLBer

Woodley Steelers

Anderson Bears

Henderson Vikings

MLB

Sheppard Bills

Riley Redskins

Barnett UFA (Bills)

Thanks in advance.

 
Woodley is really the only name that stands out as having any real big play (sacks) upside and he's got plenty of miles on him at 28. Has missed nine regular season games in the last two years,so injuries may be a concern moving forward. Was also alleged to have come into last season in less than optimum shape.

Anderson was a tackle producing machine for Carolina in 2010/11 with 101 solos and 98 solos respectively but not a big play guy by any means. He did put up four sacks in 2010 but has only 8 1/2 in his seven year career and only three INT and four FF over that time. His tackle numbers in Chicago at SLB will most likely dip as Briggs and Williams will get the majority. He's also going to be 30 in Sept so not a real dynasty value.

Henderson had a career high three sacks last season but is another tackle heavy performer as opposed to the big plays that your scoring favors. He has zero INT and only three FF in his five seasons. He was coming off the field in passing situations last season and that danger remains there for 2013 as well.

Barnett produced nice numbers in his two years in Buffalo with over 280 total tackles(150 solo), three INT and four FF. He's going to be 32 years old though and as of now has no team. He will get signed but again at 32 and more of a big tackle number producer rather than big play threat isn't exactly a good dynasty option for your league format.

Sheppard and Riley are your best bets IMHO in a dynasty league. Sheppard had 80 total tackles with two sacks last season while playing only 521 snaps which will increase expenentially next season and he's only 25. Riley is your best option as he racked up 128 total tackles last season(78 solo) with 3 1/2 sacks and a forced fumble. He's entering his fourth season and played 1170 snaps last year.

Long story short (too late, I know I ramble) is that in your scoring format I'd rank them as follows:

1, Riley

2, Sheppard

3, Woodley(only becuase he has most potential for sacks of all these LBs)

4, Henderson

5, Barnett

6, Anderson

 
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  • BAL: Terrell Suggs from DE to LB
  • BAL: Chris Canty from DT to DE
  • BAL: Deangelo Tyson from DE to DT
  • BAL: Elvis Dumervil from DE to LB
  • BAL: Corey Graham from S to CB
  • BUF: Alex Carrington from DT to DE
  • BUF: Arthur Moats from LB to DE
  • CAR: Mario Addison from LB to DE
  • CLE: Paul Kruger from DE to LB
  • DAL: Demarcus Ware from LB to DE
  • DAL: Anthony Spencer from LB to DE
  • DAL: Cameron Sheffield from LB to DE
  • DAL: Jason Hatcher from DE to DT
  • DAL: Sean Lissemore from DE to DT
  • DAL: Ben Bass from DE to DT
  • IND: Lawrence Sidbury from DE to LB
  • IND: Ricky Jean-Francois from DT to DE
  • NE : Rob Ninkovich from LB to DE
  • NE : Brandon Deaderick from DT to DE
  • NE : Devin McCourty from CB to S
  • NO : Greg Romeus from DE to LB
  • NYG: Mathias Kiwanuka from LB to DE
  • NYJ: Garrett McIntyre from DE to LB
  • NYJ: Ricky Sapp from DE to LB
  • PHI: James Casey from RB to TE
  • PHI: Fletcher Cox from DT to DE
  • PHI: Cedric Thornton from DT to DE
  • PHI: Trent Cole from DE to LB
  • PHI: Brandon Graham from DE to LB
  • PHI: Phillip Hunt from DE to LB
  • WAS: Darryl Tapp from DE to LB
  • WAS: Jerome Murphy from CB to S
 
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