Horses Mouth
Footballguy
nope. try after week 2 after he gets stuffed by CHI. then his schedule frees up.
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Kevin Jones in the Mike Martz Offense (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Righetti
- Start date
One
Not Allowed In Mexico
This sounds eriely like last year. Everyone was saying that he'd be better and he only got worse. I'd stay away.
Gopher State
Footballguy
I watched the game and I was impressed with the fact that Jones was on the receiving end of 5 passes. I think after the Bear game, good things will happen, hey maybe before, A. Green rushed for about 100 yards against the Bears. This might be the time to buy Jones now.
Gandalf
Footballguy
It's because he was great in college and a first round pick. But the loyalty is kinda Ron Dayne-esque.
Zaphod
Two heads are better than one
Most people like to sound informed by voicing a very strong opinion, which unfortunately is based on very casual knowledge more often than not. They then get very piqued when said player doesn't perform (either positively or negatively) like they said he would.It's funny, but I've seen posters around here avoid more facts and concrete statistics than you could shake a stick at.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
Jones was a HUGE recruit out of HS - the #1 HS back in the country his senior year and surprised a lot of people by choosing Tech over Penn State. At Tech, he was exceptional even though he had to share carries with Lee Suggs. He has the prototype body and sub 4.4 speed. He got 1100 yrds as a rookie (4.7 ypc), and looked dominant in the final 5 games (led the NFL in rushing the 2nd half of the season). 2005 was an admitted disaster.So the facts show a RB who was considered All Everything in HS, the best RB of all time at Tech, ran for 1100 his rookie year with a high average, and then had one bad season. Which is the anomaly again?Most people like to sound informed by voicing a very strong opinion, which unfortunately is based on very casual knowledge more often than not. They then get very piqued when said player doesn't perform (either positively or negatively) like they said he would.It's funny, but I've seen posters around here avoid more facts and concrete statistics than you could shake a stick at.
Righetti
Footballguy
Q: Caller asks how good will Kevin Jones be Sunday against Chicago's defense?
KOWALSKI
A: Ahman Green had 110 yards rushing against the Bears. It's not like you can't run on the Bears. What didn't work last week for the Lions was the screen game. That may be because Mike Holmgren had seen so much of Martz's offense in the past. They were sticking with Kevin Jones really tight all game long.
Martz keeps saying they will keep giving Jones the ball. The only reason Jones got the ball 14 times against Seattle is because the Lions didn't have the ball on long drives.
You have to run the ball inside against the Bears because they have so much speed. But the Lions believe they can run on the perimeter, too. If they do beat the Bears on the perimeter, you could see some big plays. I'm not predicting that, but that's what they think they can do.
KOWALSKI
A: Ahman Green had 110 yards rushing against the Bears. It's not like you can't run on the Bears. What didn't work last week for the Lions was the screen game. That may be because Mike Holmgren had seen so much of Martz's offense in the past. They were sticking with Kevin Jones really tight all game long.
Martz keeps saying they will keep giving Jones the ball. The only reason Jones got the ball 14 times against Seattle is because the Lions didn't have the ball on long drives.
You have to run the ball inside against the Bears because they have so much speed. But the Lions believe they can run on the perimeter, too. If they do beat the Bears on the perimeter, you could see some big plays. I'm not predicting that, but that's what they think they can do.
cstu
Footballguy
Jones was a HUGE recruit out of HS - the #1 HS back in the country his senior year and surprised a lot of people by choosing Tech over Penn State. At Tech, he was exceptional even though he had to share carries with Lee Suggs. He has the prototype body and sub 4.4 speed. He got 1100 yrds as a rookie (4.7 ypc), and looked dominant in the final 5 games (led the NFL in rushing the 2nd half of the season). 2005 was an admitted disaster.So the facts show a RB who was considered All Everything in HS, the best RB of all time at Tech, ran for 1100 his rookie year with a high average, and then had one bad season. Which is the anomaly again?Most people like to sound informed by voicing a very strong opinion, which unfortunately is based on very casual knowledge more often than not. They then get very piqued when said player doesn't perform (either positively or negatively) like they said he would.It's funny, but I've seen posters around here avoid more facts and concrete statistics than you could shake a stick at.
I thought the performance was better than the stats showed - the passing game was terrible, and he did have his longest run called back due to Roy Williams being an idiot on the other side away from the play and getting an illegal motion call against him. Roy should have just stood there like he does when he isn't the primary receiving option, but alas...
That being said, he took a shot that didn't look too terrible and it sent him to the sidelines for a time. Considering his previous issues with injuries it just seems that the guy isn't tough...
That being said, he took a shot that didn't look too terrible and it sent him to the sidelines for a time. Considering his previous issues with injuries it just seems that the guy isn't tough...
If you want to consider just his pro career, the dominant 5 games appear to be the anomaly at this point. He sucked over the first half of his rookie year and was hurt, he sucked all of last season and was hurt.... I think it's questionable to consider his HS and college resume as more relevant than 3/4's of his pro career, since we do get fantasy points based on what he does as a pro.Jones was a HUGE recruit out of HS - the #1 HS back in the country his senior year and surprised a lot of people by choosing Tech over Penn State. At Tech, he was exceptional even though he had to share carries with Lee Suggs. He has the prototype body and sub 4.4 speed. He got 1100 yrds as a rookie (4.7 ypc), and looked dominant in the final 5 games (led the NFL in rushing the 2nd half of the season). 2005 was an admitted disaster.So the facts show a RB who was considered All Everything in HS, the best RB of all time at Tech, ran for 1100 his rookie year with a high average, and then had one bad season. Which is the anomaly again?Most people like to sound informed by voicing a very strong opinion, which unfortunately is based on very casual knowledge more often than not. They then get very piqued when said player doesn't perform (either positively or negatively) like they said he would.It's funny, but I've seen posters around here avoid more facts and concrete statistics than you could shake a stick at.
my man otis
Footballguy
in a "shark" league guys know this and won't move him. if you're league mates are on top of things you should get him this week when they check teh schedule and see the bears on tap.
John Facenda
Footballguy
duaneok66
Footballguy
He had 1 1/2 bad seasons . . . despite what people post in this thread, he is not a strong inside runner; he prefers to go outside . . . he will not move the pile . . . he is an average (at best) receiver and back . . . please don't bring up what someone did in high school and college . . . there is a laundry list of first round picks that spent a very short time in the NFL . . . he had 1100 yards in his frist year, but has done little since . . . on Sunday, he did NOT look good at all . . . admittedly, he did look better than his numbers indicated; he was actually able to get some yards after contact, but still , the way guys rave about him, you'd think he was a threat to string together 100 yard runs . . . as to his speed, Trung Canidate was faster . . . where is he?? Jones does not have great vision or cutback ability . . . Is he a great back?? absolutely not . . . the word great is overused . . .Jones was a HUGE recruit out of HS - the #1 HS back in the country his senior year and surprised a lot of people by choosing Tech over Penn State. At Tech, he was exceptional even though he had to share carries with Lee Suggs. He has the prototype body and sub 4.4 speed. He got 1100 yrds as a rookie (4.7 ypc), and looked dominant in the final 5 games (led the NFL in rushing the 2nd half of the season). 2005 was an admitted disaster.So the facts show a RB who was considered All Everything in HS, the best RB of all time at Tech, ran for 1100 his rookie year with a high average, and then had one bad season. Which is the anomaly again?Most people like to sound informed by voicing a very strong opinion, which unfortunately is based on very casual knowledge more often than not. They then get very piqued when said player doesn't perform (either positively or negatively) like they said he would.It's funny, but I've seen posters around here avoid more facts and concrete statistics than you could shake a stick at.
duaneok66
Footballguy
. . . and to the guy that said he was "punishing tacklers" , I don't know what game you were watching . . . he is NOT a bulldozer by any stretch of the imagination . . . he got a few yards afte contact . . . If you want to talk about "punishing guys", Ernie Sims was the one punishing on Sunday, he was destroying Alexander . . .
billymays
Footballguy
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n143/sc...jones9pi1hd.gif
this kind of run isnt unusual from him (other than seeing the endzone)
do you watch kj?
i have watched every game of his-and the he runs as hard as any back in the league. he runs hard between the tackles, he runs hard outside the tackles, he runs over people all the time(granted its to make a -2 yard run into a 2 yard run) if he was denvers starting back he would be getting 100+ on a consistent basis. if the lions get their passing game together he will be right around a #10 back in fantasy.
he ran harder than shaun alexander last week and he will run harder than thomas jones this week.
his lack of production isnt because of his lack of talent or effort.
this kind of run isnt unusual from him (other than seeing the endzone)
do you watch kj?
i have watched every game of his-and the he runs as hard as any back in the league. he runs hard between the tackles, he runs hard outside the tackles, he runs over people all the time(granted its to make a -2 yard run into a 2 yard run) if he was denvers starting back he would be getting 100+ on a consistent basis. if the lions get their passing game together he will be right around a #10 back in fantasy.
he ran harder than shaun alexander last week and he will run harder than thomas jones this week.
his lack of production isnt because of his lack of talent or effort.
avoiding injuries
Footballguy
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n143/sc...jones9pi1hd.gif
this kind of run isnt unusual from him (other than seeing the endzone)
do you watch kj?
i have watched every game of his-and the he runs as hard as any back in the league. he runs hard between the tackles, he runs hard outside the tackles, he runs over people all the time(granted its to make a -2 yard run into a 2 yard run) if he was denvers starting back he would be getting 100+ on a consistent basis. if the lions get their passing game together he will be right around a #10 back in fantasy.
he ran harder than shaun alexander last week and he will run harder than thomas jones this week.
his lack of production isnt because of his lack of talent or effort.
He had 1100 yds his first year as was pointed out. Last year's situation couldn't have been worse for him. The coach was horrible and the offense was as bad as I've seen. New QB, new HC and new OC all should help KJ become a SOLID #2 back. I'm not calling him great, but I think his value compared to where he was drafted could be.
Righetti
Footballguy
MLIVE.COM
After last year's loss, the team was left in shambles. Running back Kevin Jones and wide receiver Roy Williams bickered openly on the sideline while other players questioned the offensive game plan. There was also concern about Detroit's lack of on-field leadership and a sense of impending gloom settled over the team.
"It felt different on the sideline," left tackle Jeff Backus said. "In the past, we had guys get after each other and turn on each other. Today, we stuck together. That's the one thing (head coach Rod) Marinelli has definitely done, he's brought this team together."
After last year's loss, the team was left in shambles. Running back Kevin Jones and wide receiver Roy Williams bickered openly on the sideline while other players questioned the offensive game plan. There was also concern about Detroit's lack of on-field leadership and a sense of impending gloom settled over the team.
"It felt different on the sideline," left tackle Jeff Backus said. "In the past, we had guys get after each other and turn on each other. Today, we stuck together. That's the one thing (head coach Rod) Marinelli has definitely done, he's brought this team together."
duaneok66
Footballguy
Come on Detroit homers? Where are you?
No mention of his two fumbles??
What's even worse?? Detroit has the ball 1st and GOAL from inside the 5, and Jones takes the handoff (NOT a designed sweep) and promptly goes outside instead of sticking his nose inside . . .
No mention of his two fumbles??
What's even worse?? Detroit has the ball 1st and GOAL from inside the 5, and Jones takes the handoff (NOT a designed sweep) and promptly goes outside instead of sticking his nose inside . . .
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Its kinda hard to win when your team has a horrible offensive line. Look around the league. All the ####ty teams have the same thing in common: Houston, Raiders, Lions, Packers. This franchise is pathetic. 3/4 years top 10 picks are busts and the one thats not is more worried about making guarantees and doing dances after first downs than winning. Don't forget about the franchise tag on Jeff "On his" Backus. He's a real keeper. Can we please have an expansion team in Toronto so I don't have to deal with this #### anymore. 
This_Is_Not_VRR
Footballguy
Seattle and Chicago both have amazing run defenses. It's too early to give up on Jones at this point.
Righetti
Footballguy
September 21, 2006, 10:13
Lions :: RB
RB K.Jones Frustrated With Fumbles
Mike O'Hara, Detroit News - [Full Article]
Kevin Jones is unhappy with himself and his recent bout with fumbleitis. The third-year back has couged up the ball three times in two games this season. He had only fumbled four times in his first 475 carries the previous two years. He is also concerned with his 3.0 yards per carry and that he hasn't run for over 100 yards since week 15 of the 2004 season. Jones also has yet to reach the end zone this season.
Lions :: RB
RB K.Jones Frustrated With Fumbles
Mike O'Hara, Detroit News - [Full Article]
Kevin Jones is unhappy with himself and his recent bout with fumbleitis. The third-year back has couged up the ball three times in two games this season. He had only fumbled four times in his first 475 carries the previous two years. He is also concerned with his 3.0 yards per carry and that he hasn't run for over 100 yards since week 15 of the 2004 season. Jones also has yet to reach the end zone this season.
Ahman Green ran for 100+ on the Bears week 1, and then shat the bed in week 2 against New Orleans. I think the Bears run D could be a bit overrated this year, though its still early. the next two weeks will tell the story on Jones. my strategy is Hold right now....
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TwinTurbo
Footballguy
It often does get overlooked because of all the attention given to the bust WR picks, but Detroit does have one of the worst O-lines in the league especially for run blocking. Jeff Backus sucks. And he's the top rated lineman on the team. Oh how I hate the Seahaws for drafting Hutchinson in 2000 one pick ahead of the Lions, leaving us with the only Michigan OT that was not any good. And for those keeping score at home, the three straight 1999-2001 1st round OL picks by the Lions were just as bad as the 2003-2005 #1 WR picks. Aaron Gibson, Stockar McDougle and Jeff Backus :XIts kinda hard to win when your team has a horrible offensive line. Look around the league. All the ####ty teams have the same thing in common: Houston, Raiders, Lions, Packers. This franchise is pathetic. 3/4 years top 10 picks are busts and the one thats not is more worried about making guarantees and doing dances after first downs than winning. Don't forget about the franchise tag on Jeff "On his" Backus. He's a real keeper. Can we please have an expansion team in Toronto so I don't have to deal with this #### anymore.
Righetti
Footballguy
although KJ has had 2 bad games before this first game where he was at least a servicable fantasy back..
17/81/1 plus 5/44/0
the thing that has caught my attention is that he has been involved in the passing game in each of the Lions games...
This is where KJ's value has gotten the biggest boost. Now you can count on an additional 30-40 yards (plus PPR if you score that way) which you did not get last year.
game 1 5/45
game 2 6/38
game 3 5/44
an extra four to possibly even 9 points a game out of KJ
pretty good for a guy who had an anemic total of 20 receptions for 109 yards in all of 2005
17/81/1 plus 5/44/0
the thing that has caught my attention is that he has been involved in the passing game in each of the Lions games...
This is where KJ's value has gotten the biggest boost. Now you can count on an additional 30-40 yards (plus PPR if you score that way) which you did not get last year.
game 1 5/45
game 2 6/38
game 3 5/44
an extra four to possibly even 9 points a game out of KJ
pretty good for a guy who had an anemic total of 20 receptions for 109 yards in all of 2005
Steelers4Life
Footballguy
He's RB13 in my PPR league.
Not bad for a guy who's faced the Bears and Seahawks already.
Not bad for a guy who's faced the Bears and Seahawks already.
MSULions
Footballguy
in addition to his ascendance in the passing game, he's simply looked STRONG. pounds the ball and is punishing defenders. He's only going to get better as the season where's on and they get more and more comfortable in the Martz offense.
Detroit: The best 0-3 team in history!!
Detroit: The best 0-3 team in history!!
Righetti
Footballguy
Martz helped Jones improve during week, and it pays off
Kevin Jones said Mike Martz told him he'd get the ball early and often in the game against the Packers, and he did. Jones is no longer frustrated with his role on the team, as he was last year, and after 125 yards of total offense he appears to be improving. He credits a talk with Martz on Saturday.
September 25, Free Press: Jones said he had a positive discussion with Martz on Saturday about what he could be doing better.
"I just wanted to know what he thought," Jones said. "He could be walking around thinking I'm not doing the right thing and not saying it. I just wanted to know for sure what he thought I could do better, so he told me."
Jones said Martz told him he was doing a good job, but to trust his blockers a little more.
Jones said he was trying to "run elusive" and instead of trying to be a "power back," something he has attempted to do in the past.
Kevin Jones said Mike Martz told him he'd get the ball early and often in the game against the Packers, and he did. Jones is no longer frustrated with his role on the team, as he was last year, and after 125 yards of total offense he appears to be improving. He credits a talk with Martz on Saturday.
September 25, Free Press: Jones said he had a positive discussion with Martz on Saturday about what he could be doing better.
"I just wanted to know what he thought," Jones said. "He could be walking around thinking I'm not doing the right thing and not saying it. I just wanted to know for sure what he thought I could do better, so he told me."
Jones said Martz told him he was doing a good job, but to trust his blockers a little more.
Jones said he was trying to "run elusive" and instead of trying to be a "power back," something he has attempted to do in the past.
Righetti
Footballguy
LT2: Tom, KJ looked good. Even though they were behind, they should've kept feeding him. He only had 6 carries in the 2nd half.
TomKowalski: YOU KNOW, I ASKED SOME PLAYERS ABOUT THE LACK OF RUNNING -- EVEN SOME OFFENSIVE LINEMEN WHO LOVE TO RUN BLOCK -- AND THEY SAID THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANY PROBLEMS WITH THE PLAYCALLING -- THEY SAID THE BIG PLAYS WERE THERE ...
TomKowalski: YOU KNOW, I ASKED SOME PLAYERS ABOUT THE LACK OF RUNNING -- EVEN SOME OFFENSIVE LINEMEN WHO LOVE TO RUN BLOCK -- AND THEY SAID THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANY PROBLEMS WITH THE PLAYCALLING -- THEY SAID THE BIG PLAYS WERE THERE ...
Righetti
Footballguy
Q: Was that the real Kevin Jones? Or the bad Packer defense that allowed Kevin Jones to get 5-yards per carry?
A: Jones said last week he was going to change the way he ran. He felt he was running like a robot. You have to give him freedom to find the hole. Yesterday he cut back deep against the grain and ran a long way where the play wasn't supposed to go. It won't always be right, but that's how guys get good. You got a glimpse of him doing well.
A: Jones said last week he was going to change the way he ran. He felt he was running like a robot. You have to give him freedom to find the hole. Yesterday he cut back deep against the grain and ran a long way where the play wasn't supposed to go. It won't always be right, but that's how guys get good. You got a glimpse of him doing well.
Ahmad Rashad
Footballguy
I don't understand what this last sentence is saying. Does this mean he's now going to try to "run elusive" or that he's now trying to be a "power back"? If he's trying to "run elusive" now and getting better results, that's great, as it probably means less wear and tear than trying to be a "power back."
aardball44
Footballguy
It will be interesting to see how far up the Top 200 Forward list Kevin Jones can move this week, and who he might pass along the way...
Righetti
Footballguy
SportsLine Reports:
Lions to give Jones more carries
Kevin Jones, RB DET
News: RB Kevin Jones, who is averaging approximately 95 yards per game in rushing and receiving yardage, could get an increased work load Sunday in St. Louis as the Lions attempt to get their running game on track. After gaining 35 and 44 yards respectively in the first two games, Jones got 81 yards on 17 carries, despite getting only six second-half carries.
Analysis: Jones continues to inch his way toward a 100-yard performance and it could be likely he reaches that plateau in Week 4 vs. St. Louis, as the Rams are giving up 129.7 rushing yards per game. He is a solid No. 2 running back for Week 4.
Lions to give Jones more carries
Kevin Jones, RB DET
News: RB Kevin Jones, who is averaging approximately 95 yards per game in rushing and receiving yardage, could get an increased work load Sunday in St. Louis as the Lions attempt to get their running game on track. After gaining 35 and 44 yards respectively in the first two games, Jones got 81 yards on 17 carries, despite getting only six second-half carries.
Analysis: Jones continues to inch his way toward a 100-yard performance and it could be likely he reaches that plateau in Week 4 vs. St. Louis, as the Rams are giving up 129.7 rushing yards per game. He is a solid No. 2 running back for Week 4.
Organized Chaos
Footballguy
Being a lions fan
, I love watching the guy, he is not afraid to lay a hit on someone, his second touchdown was made running over a saftey. 
billymays
Footballguy
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n143/sc...jones9pi1hd.gifhis second td looked like this only difference is the safety hung on for a ride this timeBeing a lions fan
duaneok66
Footballguy
its only been 21 games since the "star" has gone over 100 yards; you're too impatient . . .
billymays
Footballguy
and its been just about as long since he got 20+ carries.....
duaneok66
Footballguy
he's part of the problem, can't keep giving the guy the ball if he keeps getting shut down on first down . . .admittedly, I did watch the game today and he looked a lot better than usual . . .
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Righetti
Footballguy
Kowalski's take
Q: Kevin Jones ran the ball well yesterday. I'd like to see him get 100 yards.
A: I don't know if he'll ever get 100 yards because they throw an awful lot. With six minutes left they threw two passes to Kevin Jones. Before that they threw to him … and got nothing. The defense fears two players, Kevin Jones and Roy Williams. Those guys are keying on them real tight. They are not going to let him catch a screen in space. They did put Shawn Bryson in with Jones, and then threw to Bryson -- which was clever. They need to do more of that. When the game is on the line, the defense is not going to allow those guys to break free.
Q: Kevin Jones ran the ball well yesterday. I'd like to see him get 100 yards.
A: I don't know if he'll ever get 100 yards because they throw an awful lot. With six minutes left they threw two passes to Kevin Jones. Before that they threw to him … and got nothing. The defense fears two players, Kevin Jones and Roy Williams. Those guys are keying on them real tight. They are not going to let him catch a screen in space. They did put Shawn Bryson in with Jones, and then threw to Bryson -- which was clever. They need to do more of that. When the game is on the line, the defense is not going to allow those guys to break free.
Righetti
Footballguy
1/4 through the season.. KJ's game log shows that
1) he is more involved than last year with increased touches
2) his YPC has improved week to week (only four games I know)
3) his 3TD's in the last 2 weeks can give some hope for his biggest TD total of his career (which up to now is 5 TD's so that shouldn't be too hard to do)
4) his receptions and his involvement in the passing game has really helped his value.. he has at least 5 catches in each of the four games
5) it seems that he is not being pulled on third downs like he was last year
6) from the game-threads it sounds like he is running with more power and assertiveness
the issues are of course
1) Lions are playing from behind a whole lot, so they aren't running the ball 25-30 times a game (Which would give KJ 22-25 carries)
2) Martz' system is so pass friendly, it sounds like even in closer games they will stop running the ball fairly early if the game is not going that way
3) the Bears... twice
1) he is more involved than last year with increased touches
2) his YPC has improved week to week (only four games I know)
3) his 3TD's in the last 2 weeks can give some hope for his biggest TD total of his career (which up to now is 5 TD's so that shouldn't be too hard to do)
4) his receptions and his involvement in the passing game has really helped his value.. he has at least 5 catches in each of the four games
5) it seems that he is not being pulled on third downs like he was last year
6) from the game-threads it sounds like he is running with more power and assertiveness
the issues are of course
1) Lions are playing from behind a whole lot, so they aren't running the ball 25-30 times a game (Which would give KJ 22-25 carries)
2) Martz' system is so pass friendly, it sounds like even in closer games they will stop running the ball fairly early if the game is not going that way
3) the Bears... twice
Horses Mouth
Footballguy
well i have to admit i'm trying to run along side the bus and wait for it to stop at the next station. I had him behind Dunn and Brown this week. I've always like KJ and and totally missed out on this week's points prize. I may have to start adding back into my lineup.
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