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Financial Asteroid looming (1 Viewer)

oddball

Smart
Glenn Beck:

Let's say a giant asteroid was headed toward Earth right now and experts say it has a good chance of ending civilization as we know it. Let's also say that we've known about this asteroid for years but even as it gets closer and closer our leaders do nothing.

"Don't worry," they tell us, "The next administration will figure something out."

With the future of our country at stake, would Americans really sit back and tolerate that kind of inaction? Of course not -- we'd be sharpening our pitchforks and demanding answers.

Well there may not be a space asteroid heading toward us, but there is an economic one -- and the threat to our future is just as severe.

You might think that I'm talking about the recession (sorry: potential recession) or credit crisis, but I'm thinking bigger. Much, much bigger.

Let me give you three numbers that will put this economic asteroid into perspective: $200 billion, $14.1 trillion, and $53 trillion.

# $200 billion is the approximate total amount of write-downs announced so far as a result of the current credit crisis.

# $14.1 trillion is the size of the entire U.S. economy

# And $53 trillion is (drum roll please) the approximate size of this country's bill for the Social Security and Medicare promises we've made.

While no one will ever mistake me for Alan Greenspan, it seems to me that the third number is quite a bit larger than the other two. It also seems very few people care.

According to the latest Social Security and Medicare Trustees report (and I use that term loosely since it has the word "trust" in it) released earlier this week, the economic asteroid will first make impact in the year 2019 when the Medicaid trust fund becomes insolvent.

Only an immediate 122 percent increase in Medicaid taxes and a 26 percent increase in Social Security taxes can prevent (or more likely, delay) its impact.

Realizing that Americans have become pretty much numb to these kinds of ridiculous sounding proposals, U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson tried to up the ante this week. "Without change," he said, "Rising costs will drive government spending to unprecedented levels, consume nearly all projected federal revenues, and threaten America's future prosperity."

Now, I know we're all worried about important sounding things that none of us understand, like CDO's, SIV's, and Credit Default Swaps, but did you hear what our Treasury Secretary just said?

"Rising costs will ... consume nearly all projected federal revenues ..."

Translation: Every single tax dollar that is sent to Washington will be used to pay for just these two programs.

That means no money is left for anything else. Nothing. No Department of Defense or Homeland Security, no Department of Energy, no Department of Justice, no Environmental Protection Agency, no Internal Revenue Service. Actually, knowing our government, they'd probably keep the IRS going somehow.

Of course, none of this is exactly breaking news. Our leaders have known about this rapidly approaching asteroid for years now and they've done nothing but debate it. At the same time, I'm a realist. I understand that this stuff is "the third rail of politics," but our leaders' negligence on this issue is damn near criminal. No, correction, it is criminal.

Americans aren't afraid of the truth. In fact, we crave the truth only slightly more than we crave a leader who will actually give it to us. But part of the problem with this issue is that numbers followed by 12 zeroes aren't very relatable to the average American. Instead, try this on for size.

A million seconds is 12 days. A billion seconds is 32 years. A trillion seconds is 32,000 years. And 53 trillion seconds? 1.7 million years.

In an article that will appear in an upcoming issue of my magazine, Fusion, former Comptroller General of the United States David Walker tries a different tactic. He writes that our unfunded promises translate into "an IOU of around $455,000 per American household."

Wow. Does the size of our debt hit home now?

The America that I know doesn't sit around waiting for someone to rescue it from disaster. Besides, who do we expect to swoop in and save the day? Congress? The president? Please -- they're not only the ones who put the asteroid into space, they've also been making it bigger with irresponsible spending on everything from prescription drugs to billions in rebate checks and bailouts.

Bruce Willis and Tommy Lee Jones? They're more likely to be on Social Security than to save it.

And that leaves only us: We the People. Like every other crisis we face, it's up to us to save ourselves.

But how?

Be honest, no matter what side of the political aisle you're on, it's obvious that our financial deficit is dwarfed only by the deficit of trust we have in our leaders.

I'm willing to do the right thing for our future, I'm willing to sacrifice, but not when I believe that our leaders will do nothing but make the asteroid even larger.

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This drives me nuts. Most americans care about who got voted off an island or who's the next 'american idol'. Most people's attitude is "They'll solve it. I'm not worried". How the hell are they going to solve it when a couple trillion dollars spent on a war puts us in debt. Now imagine 53 trillion debt.

 
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"First of all, I do not believe there is an asteroid, the obvious signs of an asteroid are merely an illusion put there to deceive us. The asteroid is really just a reflection of the sun off of the moon surface and can not harm us. if you are a true good person and love humanity you have to belong to the no-asteroid society."

 
all little protectionism would resolve this.. increasing the cost of Licensing of technology and developments to other countries, call in other countries debts to the US, starting to charge fair market prices for Agriculture Technology, and grains...

humanitarianism got us into this mess.. holding the rest of the world hostage will get us out..

not to mention the military spending when foreign nations decide to liberate us from the oppression of the United States government

 
Moe Green said:
JerseyToughGuys said:
blow up the astroid.problem solved.
:thumbdown: Unless this country gets entitlement spending under control we're ####ed.
That and funding that 'war' thingy.
That will end before promising to pay for people from cradle to grave ever will.
True but it's still $200 mil a day or something like that. I'd rather have healthy Americans than voting Iraqis.
Not to mention that Beck is playign fast and loose again. He compares yearly income with multiyear bills to create a bigger problem than neccesary.We need to collect about 2 percent more SS tax per person to get past the boomers. We need to raise the retirement age one year every 10 years to keep pace with rising life expectancy. Do those two things and SS will be just fine.
 
We need to collect about 2 percent more SS tax per person to get past the boomers. We need to raise the retirement age one year every 10 years to keep pace with rising life expectancy. Do those two things and SS will be just fine.
Social Security is a lousy program that never should have been enacted to begin with. If we were starting over from scratch, we could do a lot better. Nobody is ever going to confuse me as a supporter of the status quo on this one. That said, NCC is right. Beck is wildly overstating things. Social Security can be "fixed" (ie made less horrible than it might be otherwise) by raising taxes a bit, lowering payments a bit, or tinkering with the retirement age. All of these options necessarily reduce the return on social security payments, which are already negative for broad classes of taxpayers, but it's not exactly the same thing as an asteroid wiping out human life as we know it.
 
We need to collect about 2 percent more SS tax per person to get past the boomers. We need to raise the retirement age one year every 10 years to keep pace with rising life expectancy. Do those two things and SS will be just fine.
Social Security is a lousy program that never should have been enacted to begin with. If we were starting over from scratch, we could do a lot better. Nobody is ever going to confuse me as a supporter of the status quo on this one. That said, NCC is right. Beck is wildly overstating things. Social Security can be "fixed" (ie made less horrible than it might be otherwise) by raising taxes a bit, lowering payments a bit, or tinkering with the retirement age. All of these options necessarily reduce the return on social security payments, which are already negative for broad classes of taxpayers, but it's not exactly the same thing as an asteroid wiping out human life as we know it.
I'd agree with that BTW.
 
With the current financial crisis we are in, do we still only have to raise the SS tax just a tad and lower the payments? Has this been affected at all?

 
Am I the only one that thinks that nothing can be done to stop this, and the only sane scenario will be to start hiding money and try to ride this thing out until it runs its course?

 
Am I the only one that thinks that nothing can be done to stop this, and the only sane scenario will be to start hiding money and try to ride this thing out until it runs its course?
If we had let it runs it course in the past we wouldn't be here. We didn't. We aren't. The asteroid grows in size.
 
Is this the guy who played guitar with Clapton, or the guy who did that "Loser" song. Either way, :thumbup:

 
My proposal.

1) Extend SS retirement age to 70-75...lower SS checks to those that didn't pay their fair share.

2) Cut back Medicare signficantly, stuff like 30K pacemakers to 80 year olds already standing on their last leg...I wont ask for one, so others shouldn't be able to. All of Bush's Medicare part D crap too. Basically if you're poor you get basic care but not top of the line care...we just can't afford this handout any longer.

3) Cut defense and war costs

Problem solved, LHUCKS for President in 2016.

 
My proposal.1) Extend SS retirement age to 70-75...lower SS checks to those that didn't pay their fair share.2) Cut back Medicare signficantly, stuff like 30K pacemakers to 80 year olds already standing on their last leg...I wont ask for one, so others shouldn't be able to. All of Bush's Medicare part D crap too. Basically if you're poor you get basic care but not top of the line care...we just can't afford this handout any longer. 3) Cut defense and war costsProblem solved, LHUCKS for President in 2016.
What a bag o crap that plan is.
 
My proposal.1) Extend SS retirement age to 70-75...lower SS checks to those that didn't pay their fair share.2) Cut back Medicare signficantly, stuff like 30K pacemakers to 80 year olds already standing on their last leg...I wont ask for one, so others shouldn't be able to. All of Bush's Medicare part D crap too. Basically if you're poor you get basic care but not top of the line care...we just can't afford this handout any longer. 3) Cut defense and war costsProblem solved, LHUCKS for President in 2016.
What a bag o crap that plan is.
Let's see your plan buddy...
 
My proposal.1) Extend SS retirement age to 70-75...lower SS checks to those that didn't pay their fair share.2) Cut back Medicare signficantly, stuff like 30K pacemakers to 80 year olds already standing on their last leg...I wont ask for one, so others shouldn't be able to. All of Bush's Medicare part D crap too. Basically if you're poor you get basic care but not top of the line care...we just can't afford this handout any longer. 3) Cut defense and war costsProblem solved, LHUCKS for President in 2016.
What a bag o crap that plan is.
Let's see your plan buddy...
Expand Medicare into a one payer national healthcare system and have people pay as to their ability to do so. Require all Americans to carry healthcare insurance, their own or the national plan, spread the risk over the largest possible base. Lower cost and provide 100's of billions in savings a year to the federal government according to the GAO. Switch to the Fair Tax and watch the economy grow, personal savings grow and employment take off.Simple. direct and to the point.
 
Am I the only one that thinks that nothing can be done to stop this, and the only sane scenario will be to start hiding money and try to ride this thing out until it runs its course?
If we had let it runs it course in the past we wouldn't be here. We didn't. We aren't. The asteroid grows in size.
Then it's time to head underground, I guess.
If I were a kid I'd start hiding my allowance. They are the ones that it's going to hit we are going to use up all the stop gap measures.
 
My proposal.1) Extend SS retirement age to 70-75...lower SS checks to those that didn't pay their fair share.2) Cut back Medicare signficantly, stuff like 30K pacemakers to 80 year olds already standing on their last leg...I wont ask for one, so others shouldn't be able to. All of Bush's Medicare part D crap too. Basically if you're poor you get basic care but not top of the line care...we just can't afford this handout any longer. 3) Cut defense and war costsProblem solved, LHUCKS for President in 2016.
What a bag o crap that plan is.
Let's see your plan buddy...
Expand Medicare into a one payer national healthcare system and have people pay as to their ability to do so. Require all Americans to carry healthcare insurance, their own or the national plan, spread the risk over the largest possible base. Lower cost and provide 100's of billions in savings a year to the federal government according to the GAO. Switch to the Fair Tax and watch the economy grow, personal savings grow and employment take off.Simple. direct and to the point.
That still won't truly lower costs unless coinsurance rates change drastically. Consumers aren't paying nearly enough and overconsume as a result.
 
My proposal.1) Extend SS retirement age to 70-75...lower SS checks to those that didn't pay their fair share.2) Cut back Medicare signficantly, stuff like 30K pacemakers to 80 year olds already standing on their last leg...I wont ask for one, so others shouldn't be able to. All of Bush's Medicare part D crap too. Basically if you're poor you get basic care but not top of the line care...we just can't afford this handout any longer. 3) Cut defense and war costsProblem solved, LHUCKS for President in 2016.
What a bag o crap that plan is.
Let's see your plan buddy...
Expand Medicare into a one payer national healthcare system and have people pay as to their ability to do so. Require all Americans to carry healthcare insurance, their own or the national plan, spread the risk over the largest possible base. Lower cost and provide 100's of billions in savings a year to the federal government according to the GAO. Switch to the Fair Tax and watch the economy grow, personal savings grow and employment take off.Simple. direct and to the point.
That still won't truly lower costs unless coinsurance rates change drastically. Consumers aren't paying nearly enough and overconsume as a result.
Actually with the requirement to have healthcare insurance it will allow there to be some more control. Further with an emphasis on well care over sick care it will result in long term cost reduction. Lastly the government will save billions because everyone will have a policy meaning it cuts the need for paying for the uninsured.
 
My proposal.

1) Extend SS retirement age to 70-75...lower SS checks to those that didn't pay their fair share.

2) Cut back Medicare signficantly, stuff like 30K pacemakers to 80 year olds already standing on their last leg...I wont ask for one, so others shouldn't be able to. All of Bush's Medicare part D crap too. Basically if you're poor you get basic care but not top of the line care...we just can't afford this handout any longer.

3) Cut defense and war costs

Problem solved, LHUCKS for President in 2016.
What a bag o crap that plan is.
Let's see your plan buddy...
Expand Medicare into a one payer national healthcare system and have people pay as to their ability to do so. Require all Americans to carry healthcare insurance, their own or the national plan, spread the risk over the largest possible base. Lower cost and provide 100's of billions in savings a year to the federal government according to the GAO. Switch to the Fair Tax and watch the economy grow, personal savings grow and employment take off.

Simple. direct and to the point.
That still won't truly lower costs unless coinsurance rates change drastically. Consumers aren't paying nearly enough and overconsume as a result.
Actually with the requirement to have healthcare insurance it will allow there to be some more control. Further with an emphasis on well care over sick care it will result in long term cost reduction. Lastly the government will save billions because everyone will have a policy meaning it cuts the need for paying for the uninsured.
Does an individual in your system get to choose between their private insurance and government insurance?If so, you're going to see the private sector cherry pick the healthiest patients by pricing the sickest into government coverage. Considering that these people now have government insurance instead of no insurance, their utilization will increase because it costs them less out of pocket. That's going to cost taxpayers more than the current uninsured, not less. The government can provide well care and it will decrease costs by a some margin, but if those patients move to private insurance, it's the private sector that is reaping the benefits of the government plan's expenditures. The private sector will continue to offer very little well care because consumers change insurance so often that they won't reap the benefits of their expenditures.

 
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My proposal.1) Extend SS retirement age to 70-75...lower SS checks to those that didn't pay their fair share.2) Cut back Medicare signficantly, stuff like 30K pacemakers to 80 year olds already standing on their last leg...I wont ask for one, so others shouldn't be able to. All of Bush's Medicare part D crap too. Basically if you're poor you get basic care but not top of the line care...we just can't afford this handout any longer. 3) Cut defense and war costsProblem solved, LHUCKS for President in 2016.
What a bag o crap that plan is.
Let's see your plan buddy...
Expand Medicare into a one payer national healthcare system and have people pay as to their ability to do so. Require all Americans to carry healthcare insurance, their own or the national plan, spread the risk over the largest possible base. Lower cost and provide 100's of billions in savings a year to the federal government according to the GAO. Switch to the Fair Tax and watch the economy grow, personal savings grow and employment take off.Simple. direct and to the point.
That still won't truly lower costs unless coinsurance rates change drastically. Consumers aren't paying nearly enough and overconsume as a result.
Actually with the requirement to have healthcare insurance it will allow there to be some more control. Further with an emphasis on well care over sick care it will result in long term cost reduction. Lastly the government will save billions because everyone will have a policy meaning it cuts the need for paying for the uninsured.
Does an individual in your system get to choose between their private insurance and government insurance?
Yes. You have to have it, where you get it is completely up to you.
 
I'd imagine if we took the cap off of social security, that problem would be pretty much taken care of immediately no?

 
NCCommish said:
Yes. You have to have it, where you get it is completely up to you.
See edit above.
Well that's why you make all insurance companies take on people with pre-existing conditions and all healthcare becomes portable. When the government has 40 million people on it's rolls it would be one of the biggest kids on the block. It will have low prices. It's insurance will be accepted everywhere. And it will be able to bargain with suppliers for lower costs. Why would people pay more for the same thing? That's not how any other market works.
 
NCCommish said:
Yes. You have to have it, where you get it is completely up to you.
See edit above.
Well that's why you make all insurance companies take on people with pre-existing conditions and all healthcare becomes portable. When the government has 40 million people on it's rolls it would be one of the biggest kids on the block. It will have low prices. It's insurance will be accepted everywhere. And it will be able to bargain with suppliers for lower costs. Why would people pay more for the same thing? That's not how any other market works.
If the government isn't providing a residual market, what is it doing in the market at all? Either way, the uninsured is not a profitable group to provide health insurance for, even with the market power a government plan would wield. Plus, public insurance doesn't exactly have a great reimbursement record to begin with.
 
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Here's a simple fix:

1) Get rid of the 102K cap on SS taxes so everyone has to pay 6.2% of their income into SS taxes. Problem solved.

 
I've read many articles on the subject. None of the politicians seem to be listening to David Walker, ex-US Comptroller (accountant). While not the biggest Glen Beck fan, he's dead on here. There are two solutions: 1.) Raise taxes. 2.) Decrease benefits. A combination of both will end up being the solution.

So knowing that income taxes will have to increase significantly to pay for the coming asteroids known as Social Security and Medicare, dumping money into 401k's and Traditional IRA's that give you a 25%-30% tax break today to get jammed at much higher levels later is insanity (after any company match of course). Just bringing a little real world applications to this discussion...

 

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