When pigs fly...Is Jessie Jackson going to apologize?
Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
Yeah, right after Al Sharpton apologizes for Tawana Brawley and after he issues a sincere apology for his "hymietown" remarks.Is Jessie Jackson going to apologize?
I've been saying these kids were innocent since the beginning. Do we really think "their lives were completely and utterly destroyed"??I don't. I feel horrible for them, and knew as a layman from the basic facts early on that it was a bull#### show.Whoa, whoa, whoa. Don't you think they're moving a little to fast here. Maybe they should wait a few more years until these kids lives are completely and utterly destroyed. I'm not sure that some of them won't recover and actually make something of themselves. No need to go so fast.
I am not so sure. With the ethics issues I have a feeling there is a case here but you may be right.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
I think they have absolutely been damaged.I've been saying these kids were innocent since the beginning. Do we really think "their lives were completely and utterly destroyed"??I don't. I feel horrible for them, and knew as a layman from the basic facts early on that it was a bull#### show.Whoa, whoa, whoa. Don't you think they're moving a little to fast here. Maybe they should wait a few more years until these kids lives are completely and utterly destroyed. I'm not sure that some of them won't recover and actually make something of themselves. No need to go so fast.
You can if there is misconduct and malicious prosecution. And I definitely think that there is a strong argument that there was in this case by Nifong.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
YepYou can if there is misconduct and malicious prosecution. And I definitely think that there is a strong argument that there was in this case by Nifong.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
I'm not saying you couldn't bring a civil case, but proving that he was malicious is going to be next to impossible, unless someone has something on tape.I am not so sure. With the ethics issues I have a feeling there is a case here but you may be right.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
I definitely think it "looks like it" but I am nearly 100% certain you couldn't prove it. I hope I'm wrong, and the ####er burns, but I'd bet against it. These kids have already spent a reported $3M defending themselves; maybe they'll find some pro bono...You can if there is misconduct and malicious prosecution. And I definitely think that there is a strong argument that there was in this case by Nifong.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
I think that Nifong covering up DNA evidence that didn't agree with his case is pretty solid evidence. If I were a juror, that alone would be enough to prove malicious prosecution. It would be a civil suit so the burden is just a preponderance of the evidence. As long as you are more sure that he did it than didn't do it that's all you need.I'm not saying you couldn't bring a civil case, but proving that he was malicious is going to be next to impossible, unless someone has something on tape.I am not so sure. With the ethics issues I have a feeling there is a case here but you may be right.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
As we have seen once you get something in front of a civil jury the rules are different. There has been enough done here to get a win I think.I definitely think it "looks like it" but I am nearly 100% certain you couldn't prove it. I hope I'm wrong, and the ####er burns, but I'd bet against it. These kids have already spent a reported $3M defending themselves; maybe they'll find some pro bono...You can if there is misconduct and malicious prosecution. And I definitely think that there is a strong argument that there was in this case by Nifong.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
Let's keep in mind for a moment that you are (as are most, if not all FFA-ers) well above average in intelligence as compared to most of our fellow man. You may have known all along that this was a "bull#### show", but there are plenty of people that didn't. There are people that either truly believed, or chose to believe, that the Duke lacrosse team was guilty as charged.Remember, there are still many people that believe (or choose to believe) that OJ didn't kill two people in cold blood.I've been saying these kids were innocent since the beginning. Do we really think "their lives were completely and utterly destroyed"??I don't. I feel horrible for them, and knew as a layman from the basic facts early on that it was a bull#### show.Whoa, whoa, whoa. Don't you think they're moving a little to fast here. Maybe they should wait a few more years until these kids lives are completely and utterly destroyed. I'm not sure that some of them won't recover and actually make something of themselves.
No need to go so fast.
Sure he is, sure.Is Jessie Jackson going to apologize?
But, if I agree that most people are indeed "Stupid" -- and I do agree, that means 99% of the population don't even remember these kid's names.Let's keep in mind for a moment that you are (as are most, if not all FFA-ers) well above average in intelligence as compared to most of our fellow man. You may have known all along that this was a "bull#### show", but there are plenty of people that didn't. There are people that either truly believed, or chose to believe, that the Duke lacrosse team was guilty as charged.Remember, there are still many people that believe (or choose to believe) that OJ didn't kill two people in cold blood.I've been saying these kids were innocent since the beginning. Do we really think "their lives were completely and utterly destroyed"??I don't. I feel horrible for them, and knew as a layman from the basic facts early on that it was a bull#### show.Whoa, whoa, whoa. Don't you think they're moving a little to fast here. Maybe they should wait a few more years until these kids lives are completely and utterly destroyed. I'm not sure that some of them won't recover and actually make something of themselves.
No need to go so fast.
So if you don't think the charges will follow these kids around for a long, long time you are vastly overestimating the bulk of the population. When the Duke kids were dragged through the mud, that was front page news and a big chunk of Sportscenter. The eventual outcome ... :crickets:
Never forget, in the great pie chart of American intelligence, there's a great big slice labeled "Stupid."
Not in civil court.I think you two are using too much emotion here. OJ was found innocent. In any case, I hope you're right.
OJ is a public official?Not in civil court.I think you two are using too much emotion here. OJ was found innocent. In any case, I hope you're right.
I would like to see Durham District Attorney Mike Nifong disbarred, or at least removed from his position as DA. His whole goal in this case was to get himself re-elected as DA.I am not so sure. With the ethics issues I have a feeling there is a case here but you may be right.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
OJ was found not guilty. Big difference.And criminal court is different then civil court. He did lose his civil case.I think you two are using too much emotion here. OJ was found innocent. In any case, I hope you're right.
Yeah, whatever. The difference between innocent and not guilty is just the cost of the attorneys.And he lost his civil case because they didn't have to prove MALICIOUS intent. Please tell me you're not drawing an ACTUAL correlary between the two cases. I was merely pointing out how stupid people are when it comes to determining actual guilt or the lack thereof.OJ was found not guilty. Big difference.And criminal court is different then civil court. He did lose his civil case.I think you two are using too much emotion here. OJ was found innocent. In any case, I hope you're right.
I know somebody who knows somebody. Rest assured when they're finally taken off of the defensive and get a chance to collect themselves, they will retaliate. The DA's office is a given. Nifong personally is likely as well, claiming that he so egregiously broke the law and rules of professional conduct that he pierced the immunity afforded him by his office. The City of Durham PD is likely as well. The big question is whether or not Duke is included in the suits or not. This isn't over, not by a long shot. This is simply the end of the beginning. Fully expect a "Where do I go to get my life back?" presser eventually.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
By my understanding, you can if they act far enough outside the parameters of the law and their office.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
I'll be rooting for them.I know somebody who knows somebody. Rest assured when they're finally taken off of the defensive and get a chance to collect themselves, they will retaliate. The DA's office is a given. Nifong personally is likely as well, claiming that he so egregiously broke the law and rules of professional conduct that he pierced the immunity afforded him by his office. The City of Durham PD is likely as well. The big question is whether or not Duke is included in the suits or not. This isn't over, not by a long shot. This is simply the end of the beginning. Fully expect a "Where do I go to get my life back?" presser eventually.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
I also heard ESPN's legal analyst, Roger Cossack saying that his team felt not enough evidence existed at this time to support any case against Nifong.By my understanding, you can if they act far enough outside the parameters of the law and their office.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
That may very well be true. I didn't say they would win a case or even get it heard. I said I thought it likely that they would try to bring one against him personally based on the argument that he pierced his immunity.I also heard ESPN's legal analyst, Roger Cossack saying that his team felt not enough evidence existed at this time to support any case against Nifong.By my understanding, you can if they act far enough outside the parameters of the law and their office.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
I agree they'll file a case. Why wouldn't they? That alone isn't too expensive, plus it at least accuses him of being malicioius, and hopefully puts a further stain on his life and career.He's a dirtbag scumbag POS.That may very well be true. I didn't say they would win a case or even get it heard. I said I thought it likely that they would try to bring one against him personally based on the argument that he pierced his immunity.I also heard ESPN's legal analyst, Roger Cossack saying that his team felt not enough evidence existed at this time to support any case against Nifong.By my understanding, you can if they act far enough outside the parameters of the law and their office.Which is nothing. You can't sue public officials.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
What I really want to know is if he's still paying for the accuser's college as he promised to do when she made these accusations.Is Jessie Jackson going to apologize?
Nilfong purposely withheld exculpatory evidence from the defense and made inflammatory and as it turns out completely incorrect statements to the media. The first is illegal and the second is unethical and not allowed by the BAR. That it why the BAR has charges against him. I don't think he's in a good legal position at all. If the BAR levies any type of penalty against him whatsoever, even just a public reprimand, I think it will pretty much guarantee a victory in a civil case from the accused players.Interesting that the arguement seems to be that Nifong should suffer the same fate he inflicted on the young men. That though the likelihood of success is minimal, and against the letter of the law and the apparent weight of the evidence, that those matters should be ignored and the matter pursued. Further interesting, to me at least, that any attorney handling the matter will essentially be doing so for the same reasons as did Nifong, because it will initially be percieved as being good for one's career.Did Nifong have probable cause to file with a victim statement, some initially corroborating testimony, and some physical evidence-yes. Should he have, as a cautious and prudent prosecutor done a more thourough initial investigation before filing-ideally. Was he then reckless, I would say so. Was he malicious thereby abrogating his protections under governmental immunity, very unlikely. Is there some record that as the evidence developed futher that he amended charges, yes. Will that help him in avoiding a civil suit that already looks weak, yes.Ultimately, as a legal matter he is sitting in a pretty good position. That said if the judge allows the matter past summary judgment, and some just might, you never know what a jury will do.
They'll go after not just Nilfong but the county and Duke as well. They'll get good money from the other two. And they can get a judgement against Nilfong even if he can't pay it and then pursue him forever just for fun, like the Goldman's have done against O.J.As a further practical matter I suspect Nifong is more or less judgment proof. Few prosecutors have that kind of bank. These families are already on the hook for massive legal fees, the last thing they need is more. It would take quite a commitment to proceed. Of course their sense of having been wronged may give them that commitment, and others, with their own agendas may be willing to help financially to pursue the matter.
DW, Didn't he file the charges without ever talking to the victim? I had read it was months and he didn't interview her and that he hid DNA evidence that didn't agree with his case. Wouldn't that be enough to prove misconduct, or to at least get it to a jury in a civil case? As an aside, I love you lawyers types to discuss these issues on here....very interesting.I realize there is probably a thread that discusses all this, but I do have to actually work occassionally.Interesting that the arguement seems to be that Nifong should suffer the same fate he inflicted on the young men. That though the likelihood of success is minimal, and against the letter of the law and the apparent weight of the evidence, that those matters should be ignored and the matter pursued. Further interesting, to me at least, that any attorney handling the matter will essentially be doing so for the same reasons as did Nifong, because it will initially be percieved as being good for one's career.Did Nifong have probable cause to file with a victim statement, some initially corroborating testimony, and some physical evidence-yes. Should he have, as a cautious and prudent prosecutor done a more thourough initial investigation before filing-ideally. Was he then reckless, I would say so. Was he malicious thereby abrogating his protections under governmental immunity, very unlikely. Is there some record that as the evidence developed futher that he amended charges, yes. Will that help him in avoiding a civil suit that already looks weak, yes.Ultimately, as a legal matter he is sitting in a pretty good position. That said if the judge allows the matter past summary judgment, and some just might, you never know what a jury will do.
The sanction for the withholding of exculpatory evidence is the exclusion of the same. Yes, he is answerable to the Bar. I believe he is a disgrace and should be disbarred. The question in a civil suit, at least legally will not be is he an unworthy jackass and a political opportunist. The question is does his immunity stand.StrikeS2k said:Nilfong purposely withheld exculpatory evidence from the defense and made inflammatory and as it turns out completely incorrect statements to the media. The first is illegal and the second is unethical and not allowed by the BAR. That it why the BAR has charges against him. I don't think he's in a good legal position at all. If the BAR levies any type of penalty against him whatsoever, even just a public reprimand, I think it will pretty much guarantee a victory in a civil case from the accused players.Ditkaless Wonders said:Interesting that the arguement seems to be that Nifong should suffer the same fate he inflicted on the young men. That though the likelihood of success is minimal, and against the letter of the law and the apparent weight of the evidence, that those matters should be ignored and the matter pursued. Further interesting, to me at least, that any attorney handling the matter will essentially be doing so for the same reasons as did Nifong, because it will initially be percieved as being good for one's career.Did Nifong have probable cause to file with a victim statement, some initially corroborating testimony, and some physical evidence-yes. Should he have, as a cautious and prudent prosecutor done a more thourough initial investigation before filing-ideally. Was he then reckless, I would say so. Was he malicious thereby abrogating his protections under governmental immunity, very unlikely. Is there some record that as the evidence developed futher that he amended charges, yes. Will that help him in avoiding a civil suit that already looks weak, yes.Ultimately, as a legal matter he is sitting in a pretty good position. That said if the judge allows the matter past summary judgment, and some just might, you never know what a jury will do.
Noone thinks a raped occurred anymore, except maybe Jesse Jackson. There is 0 proof that anything resembling rape occurred. There never was.I haven't followed this much. Does this mean a) the DA knows the woman wasn't raped; b) the DA in unsure of the rape but can't prove it either way; c) thinks the woman was raped but has absolutely no chance of figuring out who was the rapist; or d) something else?
I would go after the university as well without hesitation. I would also personally name the professors personally from the university that jumped on the cause and carried the pitchforks. Basically, I'm carpet bombing.Genedoc said:I know somebody who knows somebody. Rest assured when they're finally taken off of the defensive and get a chance to collect themselves, they will retaliate. The DA's office is a given. Nifong personally is likely as well, claiming that he so egregiously broke the law and rules of professional conduct that he pierced the immunity afforded him by his office. The City of Durham PD is likely as well. The big question is whether or not Duke is included in the suits or not. This isn't over, not by a long shot. This is simply the end of the beginning. Fully expect a "Where do I go to get my life back?" presser eventually.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
Clearly that's the question. And I'll admit I have no idea what the level of egregiousness in his actions is before the immunity is nullified. I'm just saying that IMO if the BAR sanctions him, and especially if they disbar him as they should, it will do a lot to overturning the immunity. I could be wrong.The sanction for the withholding of exculpatory evidence is the exclusion of the same. Yes, he is answerable to the Bar. I believe he is a disgrace and should be disbarred. The question in a civil suit, at least legally will not be is he an unworthy jackass and a political opportunist. The question is does his immunity stand.
Just seeing the public part of this I think he was malicious. In the end, the chances of them getting him on a verdict is slim, no doubt, but I would bet that they survive sumjudge on all these, shall we say, questionable complaints.Ditkaless Wonders said:Interesting that the arguement seems to be that Nifong should suffer the same fate he inflicted on the young men. That though the likelihood of success is minimal, and against the letter of the law and the apparent weight of the evidence, that those matters should be ignored and the matter pursued. Further interesting, to me at least, that any attorney handling the matter will essentially be doing so for the same reasons as did Nifong, because it will initially be percieved as being good for one's career.Did Nifong have probable cause to file with a victim statement, some initially corroborating testimony, and some physical evidence-yes. Should he have, as a cautious and prudent prosecutor done a more thourough initial investigation before filing-ideally. Was he then reckless, I would say so. Was he malicious thereby abrogating his protections under governmental immunity, very unlikely. Is there some record that as the evidence developed futher that he amended charges, yes. Will that help him in avoiding a civil suit that already looks weak, yes.Ultimately, as a legal matter he is sitting in a pretty good position. That said if the judge allows the matter past summary judgment, and some just might, you never know what a jury will do.
See, that's just plain wrong. The medical examination concluded that there was evidence supporting a claim of physical assault.Whether it was the lacrosse team or some random guy she slept with earlier that night, THAT is where there is no proof.Noone thinks a raped occurred anymore, except maybe Jesse Jackson. There is 0 proof that anything resembling rape occurred. There never was.I haven't followed this much. Does this mean a) the DA knows the woman wasn't raped; b) the DA in unsure of the rape but can't prove it either way; c) thinks the woman was raped but has absolutely no chance of figuring out who was the rapist; or d) something else?
Is that what the woman said?Noone thinks a raped occurred anymore, except maybe Jesse Jackson. There is 0 proof that anything resembling rape occurred. There never was.I haven't followed this much. Does this mean a) the DA knows the woman wasn't raped; b) the DA in unsure of the rape but can't prove it either way; c) thinks the woman was raped but has absolutely no chance of figuring out who was the rapist; or d) something else?
Do you believe a Duke Lacrosse player raped her, based upon the DNA evidence, the testimony of the other stripper, and all the other evidence that has come to light? yes or no?See, that's just plain wrong. The medical examination concluded that there was evidence supporting a claim of physical assault.Whether it was the lacrosse team or some random guy she slept with earlier that night, THAT is where there is no proof.
Exactly. Go after everbody. I would want my 3 mil back and a little satisfaction.I would go after the university as well without hesitation. I would also personally name the professors personally from the university that jumped on the cause and carried the pitchforks. Basically, I'm carpet bombing.Genedoc said:I know somebody who knows somebody. Rest assured when they're finally taken off of the defensive and get a chance to collect themselves, they will retaliate. The DA's office is a given. Nifong personally is likely as well, claiming that he so egregiously broke the law and rules of professional conduct that he pierced the immunity afforded him by his office. The City of Durham PD is likely as well. The big question is whether or not Duke is included in the suits or not. This isn't over, not by a long shot. This is simply the end of the beginning. Fully expect a "Where do I go to get my life back?" presser eventually.I am not much for suing but in this case if I were them I would sue the DA's office for everything I could.
Which time? She changed her story more times than the number of Imus threads here.Is that what the woman said?Noone thinks a raped occurred anymore, except maybe Jesse Jackson. There is 0 proof that anything resembling rape occurred. There never was.I haven't followed this much. Does this mean a) the DA knows the woman wasn't raped; b) the DA in unsure of the rape but can't prove it either way; c) thinks the woman was raped but has absolutely no chance of figuring out who was the rapist; or d) something else?
The DA= Tool of the highest proportions.I haven't followed this much. Does this mean a) the DA knows the woman wasn't raped; b) the DA in unsure of the rape but can't prove it either way; c) thinks the woman was raped but has absolutely no chance of figuring out who was the rapist; or d) something else?