What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

Obama to propose two free years of community college (1 Viewer)

Gary Coal Man

Footballguy
Politico

Obama to propose two free years of community college for students

President Barack Obama will need the approval of Congress to realize his proposal for making two years of community college free for students.

So far, that plan doesn’t have an official price tag — other than “significant,” according to White House officials. If all 50 states participate, the proposal could benefit 9 million students each year and save students an average of $3,800 in tuition, the White House said.

But administration officials insisted on a call with reporters Thursday evening that “this is a proposal with bipartisan appeal.”

Case in point: Republican Gov. Bill Haslam, whose brainchild Tennessee Promise program strongly influenced Obama’s proposal. Beginning this year, any high school graduate in that state is eligible for two years of free community college tuition under the Tennessee Promise.

Obama, alongside Vice President Joe Biden and second lady Jill Biden, will tout his proposal dubbed “America’s College Promise” during a visit Pellissippi Community College in Knoxville, Tenn., on Friday.

“What I’d like to do is to see the first two years of community college free for everybody who’s willing to work for it,” Obama said in a White House video posted Thursday evening. “It’s something we can accomplish, and it’s something that will train our workforce so that we can compete with anybody in the world.”

The president’s proposal would make two years of community college free for students of any age with a C+ average who attend school at least half-time and who are making “steady progress” toward their degree.

To be eligible, community colleges would have to offer academic programs that fully transfer credits to local public four-year colleges and universities or training programs with high graduation rates that lead to in-demand degrees and certificates. Community colleges must also adopt “promising and evidence-based institutional reforms” to improve student outcomes.

Federal funding would cover three-quarters of the average cost of community college, and Obama is asking states to pick up the rest of the tab — assuming Congress agrees to the plan in the first place.

“I hope we’ve got the chance to make sure that Congress gets behind these kinds of efforts to make sure that even as we rebound and grow in 2015, that it benefits everybody and not just some,” the president said in the video.

Obama said his online announcement was “a little preview” of his plans for the Jan. 20 State of the Union address.

The cost details will be in the president’s 2016 budget proposal, White House director Cecilia Muñoz said.

Muñoz said Obama aims to make college “the norm in the same way high school is the norm now.”

The Tennessee Promise idea has, needless to say, caught on. And Education Undersecretary Ted Mitchell said on Thursday’s call that he hopes Obama’s plan will encourage more states to start similar programs.

But the idea is not without critics.

The Institute for College Access and Success, which is typically in step with the Obama administration, called the proposal “a wolf in sheep’s clothing.” Among the problems, TICAS says, is that the more substantial costs of college — living expenses, textbooks and transportation — are typically left out of the deal.

And Bryce McKibben, a former Association of Community College Trustees policy analyst who recently became a policy adviser to Democrats on the Senate education committee, has noted potential flaws. For instance, the program could end up doing more for less needy students than those who need it the most, because low-income applicants may already be covered by Pell grants and other federal aid.

Since state appropriations plummeted during the economic recession, students and families have been forced to pay more for college. From 2008-12, public college funding in 26 states fell by 5 percent or more, according to a recent Center for American Progress report.

Advocacy groups including CAP, which has counseled the Obama administration on higher education issues, have promoted ideas to spur both federal and state funding to boost college enrollment.

“The first order of business is to make college more affordable — and by affordable, we mean basically make it free for low- and moderate-income families through federal investments and stimulating state investments,” David Bergeron, vice president of postsecondary education at CAP, told POLITICO earlier this week.

At the same time, Bergeron had some reservations about Friday’s announcement.

“I don’t want to just have our low-income and least prepared students going to community colleges,” he said, “because those community colleges are the least resourced.”

But Thomas J. Snyder, president of the massive Ivy Tech Community College in Indiana, says he fully supports the idea, which he called “a game-changer.”

“We have ground to make up against other countries, and this is a big first step in doing just that,” Snyder said in an email. “It will make the goal of achieving a college degree more attainable for more Americans — whether it be a two-year degree that leads to a good-paying job or the first step toward a more affordable four-year option.”

Haslam and Sen. Lamar Alexander will both be on hand at Friday’s event. Alexander plugged the Tennessee Promise on the Senate floor Wednesday. But the newly elected Senate education committee chair also said that simplifying the federal financial aid process is “the one thing the federal government can do to give more opportunity to Americans, particularly in community colleges.”

Also Friday, Obama plans to announce the new American Technical Training Fund to “expand innovating, high-quality technical training programs across the country,” according to a White House release. The program will award programs that partner with employers and include “work-based learning opportunities,” provide accelerated training and accommodate part-time work.

The president has some limited authority to steer Department of Labor funds toward skills training that focuses on partnerships with employers and accelerated training. But a larger investment would need to be authorized by Congress, and in recent years both chambers have more or less ignored Obama’s proposals for investments in jobs-driven training, such as a 2015 budget proposal for a $1.5 billion “Community College Job-Driven Training Fund” that went nowhere.
Thoughts?

 
Government involvement in the financial aspects of college is one of the main reasons it's as expensive as it is already. We really don't need more.

 
Government involvement in the financial aspects of college is one of the main reasons it's as expensive as it is already. We really don't need more.
That really doesn't make sense to me. In fact, common sense says the opposite should be true. Care to unpack?

I get if you're saying tax dollars +, but that's not how I'm reading your comment.

 
Government involvement in the financial aspects of college is one of the main reasons it's as expensive as it is already. We really don't need more.
agree, generally, with the first part, but if you think this proposal will drive up prices as well, you will need to show your work....

 
Government involvement in the financial aspects of college is one of the main reasons it's as expensive as it is already. We really don't need more.
That really doesn't make sense to me. In fact, common sense says the opposite should be true. Care to unpack?

I get if you're saying tax dollars +, but that's not how I'm reading your comment.
Here's a good summary:

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/articles/2011/11/23/why-the-government-is-to-blame-for-high-college-costs

 
Government involvement in the financial aspects of college is one of the main reasons it's as expensive as it is already. We really don't need more.
agree, generally, with the first part, but if you think this proposal will drive up prices as well, you will need to show your work....
Can't. Unfortunately, once we grant an entitlement we can't take it back. They didn't expect they'd have that effect when they instituted the policies that have led to the "first part" so my concerns are that for unforeseeable reasons it would happen again. Seriously, we haven't even seen how much we're going to be screwed by Obamacare and now we want to implement another major entitlement when we're still trillions in debt?

 
Politico

Obama to propose two free years of community college for students

President Barack Obama will need the approval of Congress to realize his proposal for making two years of community college free for students.

So far, that plan doesn’t have an official price tag — other than “significant,” according to White House officials. If all 50 states participate, the proposal could benefit 9 million students each year and save students an average of $3,800 in tuition, the White House said.
Thoughts?
I didn't go to no community college or notin' but wouldn't the cost be

9 million x $3800 per year

 
Just left the thread about low reading levels of freshman these days. Sounds like this is just extended high school. If it makes less stupid people out there I'll pitch in a few bucks.

 
Government involvement in the financial aspects of college is one of the main reasons it's as expensive as it is already. We really don't need more.
That really doesn't make sense to me. In fact, common sense says the opposite should be true. Care to unpack?

I get if you're saying tax dollars +, but that's not how I'm reading your comment.
Here's a good summary:

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/articles/2011/11/23/why-the-government-is-to-blame-for-high-college-costs
Could be true.

You have to believe capitalism doesn't work as theorized. Since competing colleges would cut prices to fair market. But that's not a huge leap. I think most things don't work in the real world like they do in academia.

 
Politico

Obama to propose two free years of community college for students

President Barack Obama will need the approval of Congress to realize his proposal for making two years of community college free for students.

So far, that plan doesnt have an official price tag other than significant, according to White House officials. If all 50 states participate, the proposal could benefit 9 million students each year and save students an average of $3,800 in tuition, the White House said.
Thoughts?
I didn't go to no community college or notin' but wouldn't the cost be

9 million x $3800 per year
Hopefully less since the government is so big it should get a discount for volume compared to what us average schlubs get.
 
Politico

Obama to propose two free years of community college for students

President Barack Obama will need the approval of Congress to realize his proposal for making two years of community college free for students.

So far, that plan doesnt have an official price tag other than significant, according to White House officials. If all 50 states participate, the proposal could benefit 9 million students each year and save students an average of $3,800 in tuition, the White House said.
Thoughts?
I didn't go to no community college or notin' but wouldn't the cost be

9 million x $3800 per year
Hopefully less since the government is so big it should get a discount for volume compared to what us average schlubs get.
Yeah see, when you only have one customer who wants to buy your product and he's using someone else's money, discount isn't the word you use.

 
Too bad it doesn't include Vo Tech programs too.
I'd feel more strongly about giving two years of free vo tech than two years free community college. After two years of vo tech you have a marketable skill. After a community college degree you have the same relatively meaningless diploma as the other now nine million unemployed recent CC grads.


 
More pie in the sky, pandering to the base. I'm all for giving kids a chance who are pushing themselves, but I don't believe access to college is the major issue - attending & graduating HS would have a bigger impact on America. Unfortunately nobody wants to get down to grass roots and do the work.

I live in Rochester, NY. We're a bit smaller than Buffalo. In suburbs we live comfortable, middle class lives. Our city on the other hand is dangerous after dark with many drug related murders etc. I pulled the below to help paint the picture:

In numbers released by the State Department of Education, only 43.4 percent of high school seniors in Rochester public schools are graduating this year, and less than 10 percent of those graduates are ready for college.

Wouldn't it seem driving HS participation help more than offering free college? Or is that not a grand program the Prez can hang his hat on?

 
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.

 
maybe focus more on what they're already not learning in high school

 
Last edited by a moderator:
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two

years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.
Word.

 
I would rather spend the money on smaller class sizes in primary and secondary education, counselors, funding HS technology classes, etc.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.
The difference between CC and in-state tuition at most state schools isn't huge. Probably worth it for way, way more fun.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.
The difference between CC and in-state tuition at most state schools isn't huge.
It's between five and ten times cheaper in CA. That seems pretty huge.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.
The difference between CC and in-state tuition at most state schools isn't huge.
It's between five and ten times cheaper in CA. That seems pretty huge.
Woah, that is big- it's only like ~1.5 times higher in NY, for example. In any event, while it would help, it wouldn't make a huge dent in the student debt crisis.

 
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.
The difference between CC and in-state tuition at most state schools isn't huge.
It's between five and ten times cheaper in CA. That seems pretty huge.
Woah, that is big- it's only like ~1.5 times higher in NY, for example. In any event, while it would help, it wouldn't make a huge dent in the student debt crisis.
It's like $50/unit, which is quite affordable. Good luck signing up for classes though. A lot if schools are heavily impacted.

 
Politico

Obama to propose two free years of community college for students

President Barack Obama will need the approval of Congress to realize his proposal for making two years of community college free for students.

So far, that plan doesnt have an official price tag other than significant, according to White House officials. If all 50 states participate, the proposal could benefit 9 million students each year and save students an average of $3,800 in tuition, the White House said.
Thoughts?
I didn't go to no community college or notin' but wouldn't the cost be

9 million x $3800 per year
Hopefully less since the government is so big it should get a discount for volume compared to what us average schlubs get.
Lol

Standard operating procedure will have them paying 3 times the cost

 
Community college is like a disco with books. Heres my $10, im gonna get my learn on.

Its called community college because anyone in the community can go. Hookers, drug dealers, cmon in

 
Currently the US spends about 54 billion a year on higher education. You could send every kid to a state school for about 52 billion. If Germany can do it so can we.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
isn't this just an end-around on future student loan debt? instead of giving money to the Univ of Phoenix and the like? they can walk out with an Associate degree or have credits that get them into a full university. universities should love this because they're having to spend money on remediation and readiness programs for incoming students. this would also pour money into an underfunded CC system too.

 
Great idea.

The last thing we need is for spoiled, entitled little whiny #####es to have to contribute anything toward their attendance of community college classes. It might cut into their Starbucks fund or impede their ability to hit the next rave.

You know how much it costs to attend a junior college in California for two years, not counting books? About $2,800. That is it. Heaven forbid we might require adults to invest in themselves a little bit.

Never mind the fact that all poor kids will qualify for twice that amount in grants in this state. And most other students get some sort of financial aid.

This is the burden? This is the oppressive situation facing our youth? The same ####ers I see rolling around in new cars, dropping a ten spot on coffee and energy drinks, while surfing the web via their iphone throughout class?

Where do I sign? If I can save just one child from having to actually grow up and put on their big boy pants I will do it...no matter the cost.

 
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.
The difference between CC and in-state tuition at most state schools isn't huge.
It's between five and ten times cheaper in CA. That seems pretty huge.
Woah, that is big- it's only like ~1.5 times higher in NY, for example. In any event, while it would help, it wouldn't make a huge dent in the student debt crisis.
It's like $50/unit, which is quite affordable. Good luck signing up for classes though. A lot if schools are heavily impacted.
One of the reasons why it is impacted is because we don't actually treat institutions of higher learning as a place for higher learning. They are simply extensions of the k-12 babysitting factories for thousands of dumbasses who screwed around in high school, got crappy grades and now want to delay entering the real world.

If Obama is going to do something like this...how about you at least reward the students who actually put the work in and only allow students who graduated high school with a 3.0 GPA or better to attend for free.

 
Too bad it doesn't include Vo Tech programs too.
:goodposting:

This is basically just another handout to the middle class. Granted, it makes more policy sense than the home mortgage interest deduction, for example, but a ton of households who could have afforded college anyway will be getting a windfall with this.

 
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.
The difference between CC and in-state tuition at most state schools isn't huge.
It's between five and ten times cheaper in CA. That seems pretty huge.
Woah, that is big- it's only like ~1.5 times higher in NY, for example. In any event, while it would help, it wouldn't make a huge dent in the student debt crisis.
It's like $50/unit, which is quite affordable. Good luck signing up for classes though. A lot if schools are heavily impacted.
One of the reasons why it is impacted is because we don't actually treat institutions of higher learning as a place for higher learning. They are simply extensions of the k-12 babysitting factories for thousands of dumbasses who screwed around in high school, got crappy grades and now want to delay entering the real world.

If Obama is going to do something like this...how about you at least reward the students who actually put the work in and only allow students who graduated high school with a 3.0 GPA or better to attend for free.
You really have a pessimistic view of the function of community college.

And I'll echo Gunz, investing in education is bad?

 
As a quick google search of Germany's system noted, many countries view higher education as more of a public than a private benefit.

 
If you plan on going to your state university, you might as well just do your first two years at CC in all classes with credits that will transfer and then finish up at the big school for the last two years. Way, way less fun, but you save yourself from huge loan debt.
The difference between CC and in-state tuition at most state schools isn't huge. Probably worth it for way, way more fun.
University my daughter started at was ~$19000/yr since they required freshmen to live on campus which meant room and board. Our local CC costs me about $4k/yr.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top