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Racist rancher,feds at a standoff.Drone strike looming! (1 Viewer)

tom22406

Footballguy
Showdown on the range: Nevada rancher, feds face off over cattle grazing rights

By Michael Martinez, CNN
updated 8:17 AM EDT, Fri April 11, 2014
140411073221-dnt-lv-blm-vs-ranchers-00010018-story-top.jpg


STORY HIGHLIGHTS
  • Feds: Cliven Bundy's livestock has been illegally grazing on U.S. lands for 20 years
  • Bundy says his family's cattle has grazed on the land since the 1800s
  • After winning in court, U.S. officials begin a roundup of his 500 cattle
  • A YouTube video shows family and supporters in a heated face-off with rangers

(CNN) -- A 20-year dispute between a Nevada rancher and federal rangers over illegal cattle grazing erupted into an Old West-style showdown on the open range this week, even prompting self-proclaimed members of militia groups from across the country to join the rancher in fighting what they say is U.S. "tyranny."

What began as a legal fight between longtime rancher Cliven Bundy and the U.S. Bureau of Land Management has escalated as Bundy kept his cattle on the federal land, and the government has responded by beginning roundups of the livestock.

A confrontation teetered on violence Wednesday when Bundy family members and dozens of supporters angrily confronted a group of rangers holding Tasers and barking dogs on leashes near Bunkerville, about 80 miles northeast of Las Vegas.

Federal officials say a police dog was kicked and officers were assaulted.


Bundy family members say they were thrown to the ground or jolted with a Taser.

In the end, the rangers got into their white SUVs and drove away, a YouTube video of the incident showed.

"Get out of our state!" the cheering protesters yelled at the rangers as they departed in several vehicles. "BLM go away! BLM go away!" they added, referring to the Bureau of Land Management.

The entire incident is now under investigation, Amy Lueders, the bureau's director in Nevada, said Thursday.

To some, the 67-year-old Bundy is a hero who hails from a long family of ranchers stretching back to the Wild West.

To environmentalists and the feds, however, he's an outlaw of sorts who owes U.S. taxpayers more than $1 million in unpaid grazing fees.

The U.S. government is rounding up Bundy's cattle that it says have been grazing illegally on public lands in Clark County for more than 20 years, according to the land-management bureau and the National Park Service.

Between Saturday and Wednesday, contracted wranglers impounded a total of 352 cattle, federal officials said. Bundy says he owns 500 of the more than 900 cattle that federal officials are planning to confiscate for illegal grazing, the Las Vegas Review-Journal reported. Bundy told the newspaper that each head of his livestock is worth about $1,000.

Since the roundups began, protesters have been confined to two areas to publicly declare their grievances, but the peaceful protests in recent days "have crossed into illegal activity, including blocking vehicles associated with the (roundup), impeding cattle movement, and making direct and overt threats to government employees," the two federal agencies said in a statement.

On Wednesday, a bureau truck driven by a civilian employee assisting in the roundup "was struck by a protester on an ATV and the truck's exit from the area was blocked by a group of individuals who gathered around the vehicle," the agencies' statement said.

In the scuffle with protesters, a police dog was kicked, and officers protecting the civilian driver were threatened and assaulted, the two agencies' statement said. "After multiple requests and ample verbal warnings, law enforcement officers deployed Tasers on a protestor," the statement said.

The profanity-laced tussle was captured on a video posted onYouTube. A group that said it posted the video didn't respond to requests for comment.

In the video, protesters demanded to know why a backhoe and a dump truck were being used in the roundup -- and whether any livestock were killed. On Thursday, Lueders said the heavy equipment was used for field restoration.

"No BLM! No BLM!" the protesters chanted to rangers in the middle of a two-lane rural highway.

What sounds likes zapping Tasers can be heard in the video.

In the wake of the publicized protests, members of various militia groups have been traveling from Virginia, Texas, Montana, Idaho and Wisconsin and arriving at the protest site and Bundy's ranch to support the family, said Stephen L. Dean, 45, of Utah, a member of one such group called the Peoples United Mobile Armed Services.

"It's tyranny in government," Dean said when asked what brought him to Nevada.

And, he added, "stealing people's cattle."

One banner at the protest side stated: "Has the West been won? Or has the fight just begun!"

In removing Bundy's livestock from public lands, the park service and land bureau are carrying out two U.S. District Court orders from two different judges.

"Cattle have been grazing in trespass on public lands in Southern Nevada for more than two decades," the National Park Service said. "The BLM and NPS have made repeated attempts to resolve this matter administratively and judicially. Impoundment of cattle illegally grazing on public lands is an option of last resort."

Added the BLM: "Mr. Bundy has also failed to comply with multiple court orders to remove his cattle from the federal lands and to end the illegal trespass."

The bureau does allow grazing on federal lands -- it administers 18,000 grazing permits and leases on 157 million acres across the country, the agency said.

Bundy's dispute with the government began about 1993 when the bureau changed grazing rules for the 600,000-acre Gold Butte area to protect an endangered desert tortoise, KLAS reported.

Bundy refused to abide by the changes and stopped paying his grazing fees to the federal bureau, which he contends is infringing on state rights. His family has been ranching since the 1800s, before the U.S. Department of Interior was created and endangered species became a federal issue, he said in an interview with KLAS.

"My forefathers have been up and down the Virgin Valley ever since 1877. All these rights I claim have been created through pre-emptive rights and beneficial use of the forage and the water. I have been here longer. My rights are before the BLM even existed," Bundy told the station.

"With all these rangers and all this force that is out here, they are only after one man right now. They are after Cliven Bundy. Whether they want to incarcerate me or whether they want to shoot me in the back, they are after me. But that is not all that is at stake here. Your liberty and freedom is at stake," he continued.

And Bundy sees it as a state issue.

"The federal government has seized Nevada's sovereignty ... they have seized Nevada's laws and our public land. We have no access to our public land and that is only a little bit of it," he said.

This week, Nevada Gov. Brian Sandoval told the bureau of residents' criticism of the roundup.

What Sandoval said he found "most disturbing" was the BLM's use of a "First Amendment area" that confined protesters to a designated area.

Such an area "tramples upon Nevadans' fundamental rights under the U.S. Constitution," Sandoval said. "No cow justifies the atmosphere of intimidation which currently exists nor the limitation of constitutional rights that are sacred to all Nevadans."

In response, federal officials are allowing the protesters to gather on public lands as long as they don't impede the roundup, said Lueders, the BLM's director in Nevada.

Bundy is digging in for a long fight.

"I've been fighting this for a number of years. It's not about my cows, I'll tell you that much," he said at a town meeting on Wednesday night. "It's about freedom and liberty and our Constitution ... and above all it's about our policing power. Who has policing power today?"

With the growing controversy, it was uncertain Thursday how long the cattle roundup will now last. At Wednesday night's meeting, residents gave Bundy a standing ovation when he publicly spoke.

"I love you people. And I love this land, and I love freedom and liberty," Bundy told the crowd. "I know without doubt that our Constitution didn't provide for anything like the federal government owning this land, and so when I pay my grazing fees -- if I owe any grazing fees -- I will sure pay it to the right landlord, and that will be to Clark County, Nevada."

http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/10/us/nevada-rancher-rangers-cattle-showdown/
 
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(•_•)

I guess you could say that this rancher....

( •_•)>⌐■-■

(⌐■_■)

Has a real beef with the government

YEEEEEAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!

 
There's a wide range of opinions on the matter, but I think if both sides just chewed the cud a bit, everything will bovine.

 
Maybe he should have done what he was supposed to instead of thinking he owns everything his cattle touch. Just another entitled ####### who thinks he's a hero.

 
Maybe he should have done what he was supposed to instead of thinking he owns everything his cattle touch. Just another entitled ####### who thinks he's a hero.
Yeah, and all the wingnuts are flocking to him like flies on ####. Good thing they have their guns to fight the government. Looks like all the gun nuts were right in the gun threads.

 
Collins manages to insult Utahns with comments on Bundy roundup


Commissioner Tom Collins fears the dispute at Cliven Bundy’s ranch that has drawn protesters from across state lines might turn violent.So when Collins talked this week with a county commissioner in Utah who said others are coming so Southern Nevada to support the Bundys, he did what he usually does: He spoke his opinion without mincing words or worrying if he offended someone.

Those comments are now making the rounds on social media and have attracted criticism from people ranging from Utah ranchers to his colleagues on the County Commission.

It started when Darin Bushman, a Piute County, Utah, commissioner, called Collins about the Bureau of Land Management roundup of Bundy’s cattle in the Gold Butte area, about 80 miles northeast of Las Vegas. The cattle are being seized after Bundy failed to pay grazing fees over 20 years. When the conversation ended, Bushman posted on Facebook that Collins said Utahns are “inbred bastards” and if they come to Clark County to support Bundy they “better have funeral plans.” Collins also told Bushman that they should mind their “own (expletive) business.”

“Now that’s some classy leadership for you,” Bushman wrote in his post.

On Tuesday, Clark County commissioners will discuss decorum of commissioners, which was sparked in part by concerns about Collins’ recent statements, said commission Chairman Steve Sisolak. Sisolak said Collins won’t be the sole focus of that discussion, which will examine the broader issue of decorum.

He said he’s uncertain of what the outcome might be or whether it would require anything formal such as a policy change.

In an interview, Collins downplayed Bushman’s elected office, noting his county has only about 1,500 people. Census data shows the tiny rural county has just 1,556 people.

“I’m trying to do everything I can to discourage anybody who tells me they’re coming here with loaded guns,” Collins said. “I’m going to tell them not to come.”

The issues at hand are complex, and a protester who doesn’t understand rural Nevada fails to grasp the whole picture of the situation, Collins said.

Collins said he’s been in touch with BLM officials about the issue and is closely following the situation.

“The Bundys want peace,” Collins said. “They don’t want any violence going on, so all these gun-packing folks just need to go home.”

Bushman said he contacted Collins to discuss his views on jurisdictions of lands. He said the conversation for the most part was “civil and professional.”

Bushman said he told Collins he was heading to the protest and expected some people from his county to be there, as the issue has attracted the concerns of Utah ranchers.

“This guy was just off-the-hook weird,” Bushman said. “I’ve never ran into a fellow commissioner who treated me like that.”

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/water-environment/collins-manages-insult-utahns-comments-bundy-roundup
:o

 
Collins manages to insult Utahns with comments on Bundy roundup

Commissioner Tom Collins fears the dispute at Cliven Bundys ranch that has drawn protesters from across state lines might turn violent.

So when Collins talked this week with a county commissioner in Utah who said others are coming so Southern Nevada to support the Bundys, he did what he usually does: He spoke his opinion without mincing words or worrying if he offended someone.

Those comments are now making the rounds on social media and have attracted criticism from people ranging from Utah ranchers to his colleagues on the County Commission.

It started when Darin Bushman, a Piute County, Utah, commissioner, called Collins about the Bureau of Land Management roundup of Bundys cattle in the Gold Butte area, about 80 miles northeast of Las Vegas. The cattle are being seized after Bundy failed to pay grazing fees over 20 years. When the conversation ended, Bushman posted on Facebook that Collins said Utahns are inbred bastards and if they come to Clark County to support Bundy they better have funeral plans. Collins also told Bushman that they should mind their own (expletive) business.

Now thats some classy leadership for you, Bushman wrote in his post.

On Tuesday, Clark County commissioners will discuss decorum of commissioners, which was sparked in part by concerns about Collins recent statements, said commission Chairman Steve Sisolak. Sisolak said Collins wont be the sole focus of that discussion, which will examine the broader issue of decorum.

He said hes uncertain of what the outcome might be or whether it would require anything formal such as a policy change.

In an interview, Collins downplayed Bushmans elected office, noting his county has only about 1,500 people. Census data shows the tiny rural county has just 1,556 people.

Im trying to do everything I can to discourage anybody who tells me theyre coming here with loaded guns, Collins said. Im going to tell them not to come.

The issues at hand are complex, and a protester who doesnt understand rural Nevada fails to grasp the whole picture of the situation, Collins said.

Collins said hes been in touch with BLM officials about the issue and is closely following the situation.

The Bundys want peace, Collins said. They dont want any violence going on, so all these gun-packing folks just need to go home.

Bushman said he contacted Collins to discuss his views on jurisdictions of lands. He said the conversation for the most part was civil and professional.

Bushman said he told Collins he was heading to the protest and expected some people from his county to be there, as the issue has attracted the concerns of Utah ranchers.

This guy was just off-the-hook weird, Bushman said. Ive never ran into a fellow commissioner who treated me like that.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/water-environment/collins-manages-insult-utahns-comments-bundy-roundup
:o
What's a Utahn?

 
Collins manages to insult Utahns with comments on Bundy roundup

Commissioner Tom Collins fears the dispute at Cliven Bundys ranch that has drawn protesters from across state lines might turn violent.

So when Collins talked this week with a county commissioner in Utah who said others are coming so Southern Nevada to support the Bundys, he did what he usually does: He spoke his opinion without mincing words or worrying if he offended someone.

Those comments are now making the rounds on social media and have attracted criticism from people ranging from Utah ranchers to his colleagues on the County Commission.

It started when Darin Bushman, a Piute County, Utah, commissioner, called Collins about the Bureau of Land Management roundup of Bundys cattle in the Gold Butte area, about 80 miles northeast of Las Vegas. The cattle are being seized after Bundy failed to pay grazing fees over 20 years. When the conversation ended, Bushman posted on Facebook that Collins said Utahns are inbred bastards and if they come to Clark County to support Bundy they better have funeral plans. Collins also told Bushman that they should mind their own (expletive) business.

Now thats some classy leadership for you, Bushman wrote in his post.

On Tuesday, Clark County commissioners will discuss decorum of commissioners, which was sparked in part by concerns about Collins recent statements, said commission Chairman Steve Sisolak. Sisolak said Collins wont be the sole focus of that discussion, which will examine the broader issue of decorum.

He said hes uncertain of what the outcome might be or whether it would require anything formal such as a policy change.

In an interview, Collins downplayed Bushmans elected office, noting his county has only about 1,500 people. Census data shows the tiny rural county has just 1,556 people.

Im trying to do everything I can to discourage anybody who tells me theyre coming here with loaded guns, Collins said. Im going to tell them not to come.

The issues at hand are complex, and a protester who doesnt understand rural Nevada fails to grasp the whole picture of the situation, Collins said.

Collins said hes been in touch with BLM officials about the issue and is closely following the situation.

The Bundys want peace, Collins said. They dont want any violence going on, so all these gun-packing folks just need to go home.

Bushman said he contacted Collins to discuss his views on jurisdictions of lands. He said the conversation for the most part was civil and professional.

Bushman said he told Collins he was heading to the protest and expected some people from his county to be there, as the issue has attracted the concerns of Utah ranchers.

This guy was just off-the-hook weird, Bushman said. Ive never ran into a fellow commissioner who treated me like that.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/water-environment/collins-manages-insult-utahns-comments-bundy-roundup
:o
What's a Utahn?
I think it's the Mormons?

 
Bundy vs. BLM: Interest in cattle dispute widens

By HENRY BREANLAS VEGAS REVIEW-JOURNAL
The Bureau of Land Management quietly dismantled its so-called “First Amendment areas” in northeastern Clark County on Thursday, as the fight over Cliven Bundy’s cattle widened into a national debate about states’ rights and federal land-use policy.

State lawmakers from Arizona to Washington are headed for Nevada to rally alongside the Bundy family and its supporters. Most of them are tea party Republicans or Libertarians associated with a patriot group known as the Oath Keepers.

Several of the elected officials said they were drawn into the issue by video footage of Wednesday’s clash between angry protesters and BLM rangers that shows Bundy’s sister being tackled to the ground and one of Bundy’s seven sons being shot with a stun gun.

“Watching that video last night created a visceral reaction in me,” said Arizona Rep. Kelly Townsend, a tea party Republican who is driving up from Phoenix to take part in a rally with lawmakers and Oath Keepers near the Bundy ranch Monday. “It sounds dramatic, but it reminded me of Tiananmen Square. I don’t recognize my country at this point.”

Nevada Assemblywoman Michele Fiore, R-Las Vegas, called the footage “horrifying.” The pro-gun lawmaker has made two trips to the Bunkerville area in the past two days so she could meet with protesters, “protect our Nevadans and keep the peace.”

“I’m highly offended by the feds coming in as aggressively as they have,” Fiore said.

Federal officials have said the large law enforcement presence and high level of security come in response to direct and indirect threats of violence made by Bundy family members and others.

Before the federal roundup of Bundy’s livestock began, the BLM set up two orange plastic pens as rallying points for demonstrators wanting to protest the ongoing operation on federal land 80 miles northeast of Las Vegas. The move drew criticism from elected leaders and others. In a statement Tuesday, Gov. Brian Sandoval said the First Amendment areas were “offensive” and called on the agency to remove them.

During a conference call with reporters Thursday afternoon, Amy Lueders, state director for the BLM in Nevada, said the agency heard the governor’s concerns and “made some adjustments” to address them.

“We are allowing people to congregate on public land as long as they don’t inhibit the operation,” she said.

Bunkerville resident Jim Olson lives across the street from where one of the First Amendment areas was set up. He said it reminded him of East Berlin during the Cold War, and he was glad to see a crew of BLM firefighters take it down Thursday morning.

“It took five minutes. They hooked a truck onto it, and bing, bang, boom the fence was gone,” Olson said. “Of course the publicity has just been horrid, and they (BLM officials) are not handling it very well.”

The Bundy family and its supporters have established their own rally area on private property along state Route 170 near the Virgin River. The “First Amendment areas” went largely unused, except as a repository for protest signs bearing slogans such as “1st Amendment isn’t an area” and “1st Amendment: Corralled like an animal.”

Almost 600,000 acres of public land has been temporarily closed to the public as more than 900 cattle are rounded up from a vast swath of mountains and desert where Bundy has left his livestock to roam even though he hasn’t paid federal grazing fees since 1993.

The BLM’s Lueders said the seizure of cattle on federal land was being done as a “last resort,” and there is only one person to blame for the situation.

“Mr. Bundy is breaking the law, and he has been breaking the law for 20 years,” she said. “He owes the taxpayers of the United States over $1 million.”

Townsend, the lawmaker from Arizona, said Bundy “may be in the wrong as far as the law is concerned,” but the way the roundup is being conducted is “un-American.”

She is part of a delegation of sympathetic state lawmakers, former law enforcement officers and military veterans who have been invited to stand with the Bundys and camp at their 160-acre ranch, with certain conditions.

On the Oath Keepers’ Facebook page, those planning to make the trip are instructed to bring cameras and “film everything” but not to wear military camouflage or openly carry rifles.

“Any rifles people may have with them need to stay in the vehicles,” the post says.

Gov. Sandoval is urging “all individuals who are near the situation to act with restraint.”

“Although tensions remain high, escalation of current events could have negative, long lasting consequences that can be avoided,” he said in a statement Thursday.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/nevada/bundy-vs-blm-interest-cattle-dispute-widens
 
He probably has a legitimate claim to the land due to adverse possession, but since he is against the government, probably would lose or maybe already has.

 
So half showed up to protest and half to film it with their phone?

 
“Watching that video last night created a visceral reaction in me,” said Arizona Rep. Kelly Townsend, a tea party Republican who is driving up from Phoenix to take part in a rally with lawmakers and Oath Keepers near the Bundy ranch Monday. “It sounds dramatic, but it reminded me of Tiananmen Square. I don’t recognize my country at this point.”
JFC

 
Gawain said:
Really sounds like he wants something for nothing.
says he was paying the grazing fee up until the govt said no more grazing because of an endangered tortoise

 
“Watching that video last night created a visceral reaction in me,” said Arizona Rep. Kelly Townsend, a tea party Republican who is driving up from Phoenix to take part in a rally with lawmakers and Oath Keepers near the Bundy ranch Monday. “It sounds dramatic, but it reminded me of Tiananmen Square. I don’t recognize my country at this point.”
JFC
And on the flip side in same article

Before the federal roundup of Bundy’s livestock began, the BLM set up two orange plastic pens as rallying points for demonstrators wanting to protest the ongoing operation on federal land 80 miles northeast of Las Vegas. The move drew criticism from elected leaders and others. In a statement Tuesday, Gov. Brian Sandoval said the First Amendment areas were “offensive” and called on the agency to remove them.
So the feds gave them plastic pens to voice their opinions in,how generous :lol:

 
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Gawain said:
Really sounds like he wants something for nothing.
says he was paying the grazing fee up until the govt said no more grazing because of an endangered tortoise
Did he continue to have his cattle graze on same said land?
yes

but this is an interesting power that the feds have...to seize a land and curtail grazing....probably hurts a lot of ranchers....

if he was less unhinged, after losing in court, he probably should have made other plans, but the underlying issue is an interesting debate.

 
Gawain said:
Really sounds like he wants something for nothing.
says he was paying the grazing fee up until the govt said no more grazing because of an endangered tortoise
Did he continue to have his cattle graze on same said land?
yes

but this is an interesting power that the feds have...to seize a land and curtail grazing....probably hurts a lot of ranchers....

if he was less unhinged, after losing in court, he probably should have made other plans, but the underlying issue is an interesting debate.
What land did the gov't seize. Did I miss that part?

 
Gawain said:
Really sounds like he wants something for nothing.
says he was paying the grazing fee up until the govt said no more grazing because of an endangered tortoise
Found this little blurb

The protracted conflict began in 1993, five years before the land was ruled to be off limits for grazing, when Cliven refused to pay grazing fees to the BLM. “We own this land,” he said, not the feds. Bundy says he is willing to pay grazing fees to Clark County but not to the BLM.
So he's willing to pay the county but not the BLM.

 
Gawain said:
Really sounds like he wants something for nothing.
says he was paying the grazing fee up until the govt said no more grazing because of an endangered tortoise
Did he continue to have his cattle graze on same said land?
yes

but this is an interesting power that the feds have...to seize a land and curtail grazing....probably hurts a lot of ranchers....

if he was less unhinged, after losing in court, he probably should have made other plans, but the underlying issue is an interesting debate.
It was federal land. Federal court told him (twice) to pay the fees or stop grazing on government land.

 

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