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Linebacker Tiers [early camp update 8/2] (1 Viewer)

Jene Bramel

Footballguy
Linebacker tiers (early camp update) ~ posted 8/2

Linebacker tiers (post-OTA update) ~ posted 7/5

Linebacker tiers (post-draft update) ~ updated 6/1

Linebacker tiers (pre-draft) ~ updated 4/21

No major modification to the tier process this year but I have made one major modification to the presentation process. The tier features will be presented in table format, which will allow me to include a one-liner for every player tiered.

I'll open a separate discussion thread for each position as I roll them out, but feel free to send me emails and tweets if you like. I'll answer in all formats as quickly as I can.

 
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I agree with your thought that you are likely undervaluing Kerrigan. He was off to a hot start and then injured his meniscus in week 3 which limited him the rest of the year. He had that fixed off season so if healthy I think he may challenge to be in your top tier for rush LBs.

 
Did I overlook Dont'a Hightower?
I struggle with Hightower but he probably should slot in the redraft watch list tier.

The depth chart suggests there's an opening at middle linebacker and in the nickel. But, though he's been improving against the run, his solo tackle numbers are a little light. And his coverage hasn't improved at all.

 
Can you elaborate more on Zach Brown?

What do you question about Kendricks ceiling? He gets abused for his lack of height by good TE's, but he was great towards the end of the season. I ask because guys with high-end athletic traits don't usually get their ceiling capped (by me at least).

Same question for Worrilow I guess. It seems like a really conservative play to put him in a 1B tier while noting he migh deserve to be higher. He missed 1/3rd of the season and still finished 12th is tackles! Considering the path he took the league it's scary to think he could get better all around.

Who would you consider the top targets on your watch list for dynasty players? I like Collins personally.

Great article!!

 
Can you elaborate more on Zach Brown?

What do you question about Kendricks ceiling? He gets abused for his lack of height by good TE's, but he was great towards the end of the season. I ask because guys with high-end athletic traits don't usually get their ceiling capped (by me at least).

Same question for Worrilow I guess. It seems like a really conservative play to put him in a 1B tier while noting he migh deserve to be higher. He missed 1/3rd of the season and still finished 12th is tackles! Considering the path he took the league it's scary to think he could get better all around.

Who would you consider the top targets on your watch list for dynasty players? I like Collins personally.

Great article!!
Brown's issues include the lack of clarity about how Horton feels about him, unknowns about role in defense, continued issues with contact at times, inconsistencies in coverage. All of those could disappear quickly with a better scheme fit (if there is one for him), improvement with coaching, team trusting him to take 1000 snaps and a renewed discipline in tackling.

Kendricks played over 1000 snaps last year, but saw a below average number of rush attempts. That could be a positive if the Eagles decline, but it feels unlikely. He had essentially no competition from anyone not named DeMeco Ryans -- who hadn't been running up tackles in previous seasons. Kendricks managed just 81 solos. There's still room for optimism obviously. The big play numbers last year are nice, but high variance value adds. I'm not sure I see the athleticism translating or the violent player I saw in his college tape. That worries me that he'll get to the 95 solo upside I thought he had.

I went back and watched Worrilow (and Cole) and will do so again after the draft settles out. My first impression is that neither of them were dominant run defenders, which puts them in the opportunity is more important for their value than talent category -- for now. If the Falcons change schemes, improve their offense enough to sustain drives more regularly or Weatherspoon is a more durable player this year, Worrilow's numbers are at risk.

Lots of room for debate this year. I'm less comfortable with this group of tiers than I've been at any point in the last 6-7 years. Kendricks, Brown, Worrilow, Cole and lots of others have a wide range of expectation for me right now. There may be a fair amount of movement in the next set, as we learn what teams think of their depth charts during and the draft and OTA process.

 
Can you elaborate more on Zach Brown?
Brown's issues include the lack of clarity about how Horton feels about him, unknowns about role in defense, continued issues with contact at times, inconsistencies in coverage. All of those could disappear quickly with a better scheme fit (if there is one for him), improvement with coaching, team trusting him to take 1000 snaps and a renewed discipline in tackling.
Who starts next to him? McCarthy, Fokou or someone else?

 
Any thoughts on Jason Worilds? Steelers seem to like him.
Hasn't progressed as well as expected. Sacks last year were either unblocked or against poor competition. I like the fact that he's playing for a contract this year, so he would be on a big play matchup watch list, but I wouldn't have him rostered unless you're in a deeper big play league.

 
Can you elaborate more on Zach Brown?
Brown's issues include the lack of clarity about how Horton feels about him, unknowns about role in defense, continued issues with contact at times, inconsistencies in coverage. All of those could disappear quickly with a better scheme fit (if there is one for him), improvement with coaching, team trusting him to take 1000 snaps and a renewed discipline in tackling.
Who starts next to him? McCarthy, Fokou or someone else?
I'm expecting Woodyard to start at the other spot. And there's a good chance he's the every-down ILB if Horton uses only one. That's why I have Woodyard in a higher tier for now. Not sure what Horton feels about Brown, while we know he thought highly enough of Woodyard to bring him in early in free agency and (presumably) sign off on the team giving him a nice contract.

 
Can you elaborate more on Zach Brown?
Brown's issues include the lack of clarity about how Horton feels about him, unknowns about role in defense, continued issues with contact at times, inconsistencies in coverage. All of those could disappear quickly with a better scheme fit (if there is one for him), improvement with coaching, team trusting him to take 1000 snaps and a renewed discipline in tackling.
Who starts next to him? McCarthy, Fokou or someone else?
I'm expecting Woodyard to start at the other spot. And there's a good chance he's the every-down ILB if Horton uses only one. That's why I have Woodyard in a higher tier for now. Not sure what Horton feels about Brown, while we know he thought highly enough of Woodyard to bring him in early in free agency and (presumably) sign off on the team giving him a nice contract.
So Ayers-Woodyard-Brown-Morgan? Woody could be in for a lot of tackles.

 
Hey Jene,

With Karlos Dansby gone and Washington probably facing suspension do you feel 2nd year LB Kevin Minter rates a mention on one of thsoe lists?

I haven't followed him too closely but it stands to reason he may be gifted Dansby's starting gig and/or with Daryl Washington likely to miss some time he seems destined to get significant PT at some point this year.

It seems 2nd year LB for Arizona has a shot to get a lot more playing time and possibly a starting job which could mean IDP gold so I'd bet the IDP crowd would like your take on him.

Thanks. ;)

EDIT: Ahhh. Just saw that you did list Minter last on the tier 3 upside list.

Do you have any more info on him? I recall you weren't too keen on him during the season last year. Have you changed at all on him and could you give a bit more on him? He's the last guy you have in his tier and I don't know if that has any significance at all on how you rate him.

tier 3a | Upside LB3I'd like this group better were I convinced of an elite ceiling for Te'o and Minter or Zach Brown and Kendricks had shown more consistency to date. I think this tier will see the most turnover -- players moving up, players moving out, players moving in from the watch list -- than any other in the coming weeks.

Kevin Minter Unproven, but favorite to start, Washington's legal issues / possible suspension may play role
 
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Can you elaborate more on Zach Brown?
Brown's issues include the lack of clarity about how Horton feels about him, unknowns about role in defense, continued issues with contact at times, inconsistencies in coverage. All of those could disappear quickly with a better scheme fit (if there is one for him), improvement with coaching, team trusting him to take 1000 snaps and a renewed discipline in tackling.
Who starts next to him? McCarthy, Fokou or someone else?
I'm expecting Woodyard to start at the other spot. And there's a good chance he's the every-down ILB if Horton uses only one. That's why I have Woodyard in a higher tier for now. Not sure what Horton feels about Brown, while we know he thought highly enough of Woodyard to bring him in early in free agency and (presumably) sign off on the team giving him a nice contract.
So Ayers-Woodyard-Brown-Morgan? Woody could be in for a lot of tackles.
That's my current expectation. But I'm not confident enough to write anyone's name in ink. Not certain why I'm reluctant, but I think it's odd that Horton hasn't said anything specific about his front seven yet.

 
Hey Jene,

With Karlos Dansby gone and Washington probably facing suspension do you feel 2nd year LB Kevin Minter rates a mention on one of thsoe lists?

I haven't followed him too closely but it stands to reason he may be gifted Dansby's starting gig and/or with Daryl Washington likely to miss some time he seems destined to get significant PT at some point this year.

It seems 2nd year LB for Arizona has a shot to get a lot more playing time and possibly a starting job which could mean IDP gold so I'd bet the IDP crowd would like your take on him.

Thanks. ;)

EDIT: Ahhh. Just saw that you did list Minter last on the tier 3 upside list.

Do you have any more info on him? I recall you weren't too keen on him during the season last year. Have you changed at all on him and could you give a bit more on him? He's the last guy you have in his tier and I don't know if that has any significance at all on how you rate him.

tier 3a | Upside LB3I'd like this group better were I convinced of an elite ceiling for Te'o and Minter or Zach Brown and Kendricks had shown more consistency to date. I think this tier will see the most turnover -- players moving up, players moving out, players moving in from the watch list -- than any other in the coming weeks.

Kevin Minter Unproven, but favorite to start, Washington's legal issues / possible suspension may play role
The players are loosely grouped as to how I'd draft / rank them. Minter is in the Upside LB3 tier, which puts him above that large group of guys in the redraft watch list group.

I liked Minter before the draft and during the offseason -- he was a part of the second tier of my rookie linebackers as late as early August with Alonso and Ogletree. Unfortunately, he didn't establish himself in the preseason and didn't get a long look while Washington was suspended while Dansby cemented himself as an anchor inside.

I'd feel much better about Minter if a better player than Jasper Brinkley had held him out of the lineup last year. Unlike guys like NaVorro Bowman or Curtis Lofton in the past (or Worrilow or Cole this year) there aren't any snaps to review to determine whether he's making progress. The only reason he's tiered as a possible LB3 is that I liked his college tape and the opportunity would seem to be there for the taking (depth chart, Washington legal issues, loss of Mathieu, etc).

 
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Jene Bramel said:
FUBAR said:
Jene Bramel said:
Can you elaborate more on Zach Brown?
Brown's issues include the lack of clarity about how Horton feels about him, unknowns about role in defense, continued issues with contact at times, inconsistencies in coverage. All of those could disappear quickly with a better scheme fit (if there is one for him), improvement with coaching, team trusting him to take 1000 snaps and a renewed discipline in tackling.
Who starts next to him? McCarthy, Fokou or someone else?
I'm expecting Woodyard to start at the other spot. And there's a good chance he's the every-down ILB if Horton uses only one. That's why I have Woodyard in a higher tier for now. Not sure what Horton feels about Brown, while we know he thought highly enough of Woodyard to bring him in early in free agency and (presumably) sign off on the team giving him a nice contract.
So Ayers-Woodyard-Brown-Morgan? Woody could be in for a lot of tackles.
That's my current expectation. But I'm not confident enough to write anyone's name in ink. Not certain why I'm reluctant, but I think it's odd that Horton hasn't said anything specific about his front seven yet.
Thanks, thought maybe I've just missed it. :thumbup:

 
Z. Brown to the middle. Obviously still has to win the job but good sign. Hoping they trade McCarthy on draft day too.

 
Jene - where would you rank the mythical creature "healthy Desmond Bishop"?

Seems like a very cheap stash that may very easily be cut early in the season, but if he's healthy could be a good value.

Same question, different circumstances for Erin Henderson.

 
Jene, What is your gut feeling on the Koa Misi situation in Miami? I get the impression that he's being tried at MLB, but would it be safe to say that he's got nothing more than an outside shot at winning the job... at least in terms of winning it long-term (more than this season at most)? In other words, he seems like more of a temporary solution, than anything else, if indeed he starts the season as their MLB. Just curious if you agree with that sentiment.

I've heard/read rumors that he wanted to decline the position change (to MLB), due to the increased mental responsibilities of playing in the middle, but it sounds now like those rumors were refuted. Either way, it seems unlikely that he's the long-term answer, no?

Granted, this is Rotoworld (and even they are cautioning that their source is unreliable), so take it for what it's worth (which may be nothing)....

Misi

 
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Jene - where would you rank the mythical creature "healthy Desmond Bishop"?

Seems like a very cheap stash that may very easily be cut early in the season, but if he's healthy could be a good value.

Same question, different circumstances for Erin Henderson.
He's not healthy. Explosion is gone and with it his range and leverage unfortunately. I don't see him having any real shot an a starting job, much less an every-down gig. Henderson has the benefit of a new coaching staff, but no team was in a hurry to sign him last offseason. If Zimmer doesn't draft a linebacker through the first four rounds, then a longshot, easy-to-cut stash may make more sense.

 
Jene, What is your gut feeling on the Koa Misi situation in Miami? I get the impression that he's being tried at MLB, but would it be safe to say that he's got nothing more than an outside shot at winning the job... at least in terms of winning it long-term (more than this season at most)? In other words, he seems like more of a temporary solution, than anything else, if indeed he starts the season as their MLB. Just curious if you agree with that sentiment.

I've heard/read rumors that he wanted to decline the position change (to MLB), due to the increased mental responsibilities of playing in the middle, but it sounds now like those rumors were refuted. Either way, it seems unlikely that he's the long-term answer, no?

Granted, this is Rotoworld (and even they are cautioning that their source is unreliable), so take it for what it's worth (which may be nothing)....

Misi
Misi is a base defensive player only. I don't think he's a great fit inside either. Base MLB would be a slightly better role for him statistically, but his ceiling is that of a matchup tier player in deep tackle heavy leagues.

 
Jene - where would you rank the mythical creature "healthy Desmond Bishop"?

Seems like a very cheap stash that may very easily be cut early in the season, but if he's healthy could be a good value.

Same question, different circumstances for Erin Henderson.
He's not healthy. Explosion is gone and with it his range and leverage unfortunately. I don't see him having any real shot an a starting job, much less an every-down gig. Henderson has the benefit of a new coaching staff, but no team was in a hurry to sign him last offseason. If Zimmer doesn't draft a linebacker through the first four rounds, then a longshot, easy-to-cut stash may make more sense.
No picks in the 1st 3 rounds. We'll see today if they take an ILB.

 
guess Cole is going to go down, wayyyyyy down
How so?
Maybe the guy that they reached for in the first round will put Cole to bench? Yeah, I;m not seeing it either. I'm not even sure if he's better than Brandon Graham
This is the IDP forums. Please educate yourself on difference between ILBs, OLBs, Sam, Mike, Will, etc...
Cole will be 2 downer, competing for tackles with the Greenway & Barr. Barr and Cole will cancel each other out; hows that

 
guess Cole is going to go down, wayyyyyy down
How so?
Maybe the guy that they reached for in the first round will put Cole to bench? Yeah, I;m not seeing it either. I'm not even sure if he's better than Brandon Graham
This is the IDP forums. Please educate yourself on difference between ILBs, OLBs, Sam, Mike, Will, etc...
Cole will be 2 downer, competing for tackles with the Greenway & Barr. Barr and Cole will cancel each other out; hows that
Coming from an outsider it seems pretty snotty. You may be right, time will tell. I'm interested whether they pick an ILB later.

 
guess Cole is going to go down, wayyyyyy down
How so?
Maybe the guy that they reached for in the first round will put Cole to bench? Yeah, I;m not seeing it either. I'm not even sure if he's better than Brandon Graham
This is the IDP forums. Please educate yourself on difference between ILBs, OLBs, Sam, Mike, Will, etc...
Let's not do this in this please.

It's just as easy to give your thoughts on where Barr is more likely to play and why you feel he's not a threat to Cole than belittle another post. Or, if you're not comfortable doing that, don't post.

Thanks.

 
guess Cole is going to go down, wayyyyyy down
How so?
Maybe the guy that they reached for in the first round will put Cole to bench? Yeah, I;m not seeing it either. I'm not even sure if he's better than Brandon Graham
This is the IDP forums. Please educate yourself on difference between ILBs, OLBs, Sam, Mike, Will, etc...
Let's not do this in this please.

It's just as easy to give your thoughts on where Barr is more likely to play and why you feel he's not a threat to Cole than belittle another post. Or, if you're not comfortable doing that, don't post.

Thanks.
That's OK...I though he was talking about Trent Cole, not Audie.

 
I saw your tweet last night Jene. No worries, it's worth the wait.

I also figured the big injuries of this week might slow things down a little....

 
I saw your tweet last night Jene. No worries, it's worth the wait.

I also figured the big injuries of this week might slow things down a little....
I didn't see the tweet. Was there new expected timing on the release? I"m really excited to see the update!

 
I saw your tweet last night Jene. No worries, it's worth the wait.

I also figured the big injuries of this week might slow things down a little....
I didn't see the tweet. Was there new expected timing on the release? I"m really excited to see the update!
It said sometime this weekend. With the new injuries and bans I am sure he has to rework his list a little. So I am hoping tonight. I am hoping for a rookie section with some good sleepers.

 
I read somewhere that K Misi was starting so far in all sub packages. If that holds up Jene, would you bump him up a bit?
I suppose it's possible he'd play every-down over Ellerbe. But I don't think he has the range or coverage ability to see a huge boost in numbers. Highest he'd go for me would be high floor LB3.

 
Any thoughts on Carl Bradford Green Bay moving to ILB opposite Hawk or replacing him?

 
cr8f said:
Any thoughts on Carl Bradford Green Bay moving to ILB opposite Hawk or replacing him?
He'll be given an opportunity to earn the role eventually.

Both Hawk and Jones are UFA's after 2015, Jamari Lattimore after this year.

Both Bradford and Barrington are cheaper and under contract longer than all of them. If they earn a starting nod it'll be easier for the Packers to justify using them and spending their $ elsewhere.

 
cr8f said:
Any thoughts on Carl Bradford Green Bay moving to ILB opposite Hawk or replacing him?
Whole lot of speculation about that among beat guys on Twitter during the draft. I didn't see Bradford as a fit there and the team said then that he would be looked at as an OLB. Anything changed in OTAs? I haven't seen any reports that he's taking snaps inside.

I don't think the Packers care that much about the depth at ILB right now. They know what they have in Hawk and Jones. They didn't see an obvious fit this offseason and ended up bringing back Lattimore -- another known commodity -- late. I think they'd be comfortable using a 6-7 DB package on non-base downs this year. That assumes the corners are (and stay) healthy, of course, but I think that may be part of the reason they didn't make an ILB upgrade a higher priority.

Long term, I suppose it's possible that Bradford transitions inside, but I wouldn't count on it being a statistically successful move.

 
I just noticed on the projected depth chart, FBG has Chaney listed as the starting MLB for Denver and a couple 70+ tackle prediction season for him. What the deal there? I didn't even notice him on yours, although I scrolled through quickly. Anything to see here or is this a mistake on the depth chart predictions? (Bob!)

 
I just noticed on the projected depth chart, FBG has Chaney listed as the starting MLB for Denver and a couple 70+ tackle prediction season for him. What the deal there? I didn't even notice him on yours, although I scrolled through quickly. Anything to see here or is this a mistake on the depth chart predictions? (Bob!)
Chaney opened OTAs with the first team at MLB. I've no idea who will win that job and I'm not excited about anyone currently rostered. I think we know what Chaney and Irving can do, Barrow is an unknown. I don't foresee any of these guys as having a chance at anything more than very low end Upside LB3 status anytime soon.

 
Any thoughts on Buffalo Bills rookie 3rd round draft pick LB Preston Brown as a potential dynasty stash?

Wondering since recent reports that projected starting MLB Brandon Spikes is being used on special teams for the first time in is career possibly hinting he wont be a full time starter leaving open some PT for Brown who has been getting 'decent' mention from the coaching staff.

Solidly built at 6'1 251 lbs, looks the part of a strong run defender but other than that I don't know much about him.

Just wondering your thoughts on Bills 3rd round rookie LB Preston Brown since he's not listed even as a dynsasty stash.

--------------------

SIDE NOTE: I originally thought the buzz given to Browns rookie LB Christian Kirksey was premature because I felt it was based on Pettine's work last year with Kiko Alonzo moreso than any talent Kirksey brough to the table but in a suprise Christian has been getting solid reports from recent OTAs and first day of mandatory mini camp.

Add reports came out that his college coach has had trouble finding a replacement for his leadership on the recruiting trail at Iowa.

I won't compare Kiko with Kirksey but it is possible that Christian 'might possibly' wind up starting or earning decent playing time in his rookie season.

 
Any thoughts on Buffalo Bills rookie 3rd round draft pick LB Preston Brown as a potential dynasty stash?

Wondering since recent reports that projected starting MLB Brandon Spikes is being used on special teams for the first time in is career possibly hinting he wont be a full time starter leaving open some PT for Brown who has been getting 'decent' mention from the coaching staff.

Solidly built at 6'1 251 lbs, looks the part of a strong run defender but other than that I don't know much about him.

Just wondering your thoughts on Bills 3rd round rookie LB Preston Brown since he's not listed even as a dynsasty stash.

--------------------

SIDE NOTE: I originally thought the buzz given to Browns rookie LB Christian Kirksey was premature because I felt it was based on Pettine's work last year with Kiko Alonzo moreso than any talent Kirksey brough to the table but in a suprise Christian has been getting solid reports from recent OTAs and first day of mandatory mini camp.

Add reports came out that his college coach has had trouble finding a replacement for his leadership on the recruiting trail at Iowa.

I won't compare Kiko with Kirksey but it is possible that Christian 'might possibly' wind up starting or earning decent playing time in his rookie season.
Look again.

 

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