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The Spiritual / Religious Makeup of the FFA (1 Viewer)

Which one do you most align with?

  • Extremely Devout Believer / Follower of a Religion - It's a major part of my life

    Votes: 27 9.9%
  • Devout Believer / Follower of a Religion - It's a significant part of my life

    Votes: 37 13.5%
  • Casual Believer / Follower of a Religion - It's part of my life

    Votes: 16 5.8%
  • Very casual Believer / Follower of a Religion - Pretty much just the Holiday events

    Votes: 14 5.1%
  • On the fence with Religion. Don't really have a feeling one way or the other

    Votes: 3 1.1%
  • Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion but DEFINITELY feel that there's a "higher power&qu

    Votes: 16 5.8%
  • Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion but SOMEWHAT feel that there's a "higher power&quot

    Votes: 17 6.2%
  • Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion but POSSIBLY feel that there's a "higher power&quot

    Votes: 44 16.1%
  • Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiri

    Votes: 86 31.4%
  • Agnostic / Atheist but still follow a religion

    Votes: 14 5.1%

  • Total voters
    274

Joe Bryant

Guide
Staff member
Two interesting threads lately in the FFA about religion. Otis asked religious folks to explain why they have faith in their religion. Tim asked non religious folks why they don't have faith.

Good discussion in both. Thanks. FFA Rocks.

Sometimes a poll is helpful though to get a snapshot for the big picture. And not just hear who has something to say. These categories won't come close to fitting everyone I know. Just thought I'd throw this out and make an effort to get a take on where folks are. Just pick one that most aligns with where you see yourself. And of course add more thoughts or comments.

Thanks.

J

 
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Can you add options for agnostics / atheists that still follow a religion? Many of us may have some attachment to a religion due to family / want children raised, the want for tradition, maybe the thought that we don't know what god may be but one religion better represents what we think it may be than others, etc

 
Can you add options for agnostics / atheists that still follow a religion? Many of us may have some attachment to a religion due to family / want children raised, the want for tradition, maybe the thought that we don't know what god may be but one religion better represents what we think it may be than others, etc
:hifive:

J

 
  1. bullet_star_rated.png
    Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion but SOMEWHAT feel that there's a "higher power" and "spiritual" realm (4 votes [8.89%])
  2. Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion but POSSIBLY feel that there's a "higher power" and "spiritual" realm (6 votes [13.33%])

tough call between these two
both work for agnostic theists - of which I consider myself

 
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  1. bullet_star_rated.png
    Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion but SOMEWHAT feel that there's a "higher power" and "spiritual" realm (4 votes [8.89%])
  2. Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion but POSSIBLY feel that there's a "higher power" and "spiritual" realm (6 votes [13.33%])

tough call between these two
This was probably bad writing on my part. Was trying to capture that "so you're telling me there's a chance" component.

J

 
Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiritual" realm (18 votes [33.33%])

I feel I have to reel myself in at times when posting in religious discussions mostly because there are some aspects of religion that legitimately piss me off.

 
Voted for the last one as well. I am an atheist but still enjoy practicing aspects the Jewish religion. As Tevye would say, "tradition!"

 
Can you add options for agnostics / atheists that still follow a religion? Many of us may have some attachment to a religion due to family / want children raised, the want for tradition, maybe the thought that we don't know what god may be but one religion better represents what we think it may be than others, etc
Yeah I'd change my vote to this. I still identify as catholic, go with family, plan on raising a kid in the catholic church, etc. even though I'm an atheist.

 
Can you add options for agnostics / atheists that still follow a religion? Many of us may have some attachment to a religion due to family / want children raised, the want for tradition, maybe the thought that we don't know what god may be but one religion better represents what we think it may be than others, etc
Yeah I'd change my vote to this. I still identify as catholic, go with family, plan on raising a kid in the catholic church, etc. even though I'm an atheist.
That was my gut which is why I asked (thanks Joe).I'm an agnostic because foolish of me to think I actually know or my predisposition to Judaism is not due to how I was raised.

I can't call myself an atheist because I waver between how absurd the idea of a God is and how absurd the idea of no God is, as well.

If it were up to me is likely not follow religion at all and be a Jew by heritage, which does mean a lot to me for a number of non religious reasons, but between the wife who chose to convert and my other family this is a good compromise.

 
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Can you add options for agnostics / atheists that still follow a religion? Many of us may have some attachment to a religion due to family / want children raised, the want for tradition, maybe the thought that we don't know what god may be but one religion better represents what we think it may be than others, etc
Yeah I'd change my vote to this. I still identify as catholic, go with family, plan on raising a kid in the catholic church, etc. even though I'm an atheist.
That was my gut which is why I asked (thanks Joe).I'm an agnostic because foolish of me to think I actually know or my predisposition to Judaism is not due to how I was raised.

I can't call myself an atheist because I waver between how absurd the idea of a God is and how absurd the idea of no God is, as well.

If it were up to me is likely not follow religion at all and be a Jew by heritage, which does mean a lot to me for a number of non religious reasons, but between the wife who chose to convert and my other family this is a good compromise.
That's a good reason why these threads are helpful (at least to me). I don't think that I ever considered that option. I can totally see it now. But didn't think about it before. Thanks.

J

 
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Can you add options for agnostics / atheists that still follow a religion? Many of us may have some attachment to a religion due to family / want children raised, the want for tradition, maybe the thought that we don't know what god may be but one religion better represents what we think it may be than others, etc
Yeah I'd change my vote to this. I still identify as catholic, go with family, plan on raising a kid in the catholic church, etc. even though I'm an atheist.
Do you still take communion each week? I grew up Catholic through high school and then stopped but when I go back now (rarely) for a wedding/funeral, etc I no longer accept communion.

 
I'm agnostic but open to the idea that consciousness could exist in dimensions other than our observable Universe. I highly doubt that any religion on earth has captured the specifics of what would look like.

 
Let's say I am introduced to an impressive power of some sort. What attributes must it have in order to qualify as being "higher"? How am I to distinguish between higher powers and other sorts of powers? If I can't answer that question -- and I confess that I can't -- I don't see how I can vote in the poll.

 
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Can you add options for agnostics / atheists that still follow a religion? Many of us may have some attachment to a religion due to family / want children raised, the want for tradition, maybe the thought that we don't know what god may be but one religion better represents what we think it may be than others, etc
Yeah I'd change my vote to this. I still identify as catholic, go with family, plan on raising a kid in the catholic church, etc. even though I'm an atheist.
Do you still take communion each week? I grew up Catholic through high school and then stopped but when I go back now (rarely) for a wedding/funeral, etc I no longer accept communion.
No, and I only go a few time per year. Will go weekly with kids (I anticipate).

 
Let's say I am introduced to an impressive power of some sort. What attributes must it have in order to qualify as being "higher"? How am I to distinguish between higher powers and other sorts of powers? If I can't answer that question -- and I confess that I can't -- I don't see how I can vote in the poll.
I think what I'm trying to get at with that Maurile is the thought that there is something more than just our human existence. So "other" powers would apply too I guess. Or forget the powers part and just use the "spiritual realm" part maybe. I'm not very good at putting words to this.

J

 
That was my gut which is why I asked (thanks Joe).

I'm an agnostic because foolish of me to think I actually know or my predisposition to Judaism is not due to how I was raised.

I can't call myself an atheist because I waver between how absurd the idea of a God is and how absurd the idea of no God is, as well.

If it were up to me is likely not follow religion at all and be a Jew by heritage, which does mean a lot to me for a number of non religious reasons, but between the wife who chose to convert and my other family this is a good compromise.
That's a good reason why these threads are helpful (at least to me). I don't think that I ever considered that option. I can totally see it now. But didn't think about it before. Thanks.

J
It's incredibly common amongst Jews (I voted for that choice too). Sometimes when I'm at temple, I feel like everybody there is an atheist just going through the motions. Even the rabbi.

My impression is that it's less common in other religions, but I don't know for sure.

 
Let's say I am introduced to an impressive power of some sort. What attributes must it have in order to qualify as being "higher"? How am I to distinguish between higher powers and other sorts of powers? If I can't answer that question -- and I confess that I can't -- I don't see how I can vote in the poll.
I think what I'm trying to get at with that Maurile is the thought that there is something more than just our human existence. So "other" powers would apply too I guess. Or forget the powers part and just use the "spiritual realm" part maybe. I'm not very good at putting words to this.
There's much more to our universe than just human existence, for sure. Should we designate any of it "higher" or "spiritual"? That seems like more a matter of taste than a matter of fact.

I have no problem calling certain experiences -- the kind that can be achieved through deep meditation or prayer, for example -- "spiritual." But I would mean it only as a description of a person's subjective experience, not as a description anything occurring outside that person's head. No matter how hard Sylvia Browne meditates, for example, I do not believe that she can successfully communicate with the dead.

It might be accurate to say that I believe in spirituality, but not in spirits.

 
There's much more to our universe than just human existence, for sure.

***

I have no problem calling certain experiences -- the kind that can be achieved through deep meditation or prayer, for example -- "spiritual." But I would mean it only as a description of a person's subjective experience, not as a description anything occurring outside that person's head.
How is something happening in somebody's head more than just human existence? Or were these two sentences unrelated?

 
There's much more to our universe than just human existence, for sure. Should we designate any of it "higher" or "spiritual"? That seems like more a matter of taste than a matter of fact.
Thanks Maurile. Does it surprise you that people are voting the way they are and choosing the "Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiritual" realm" option? (Currently at 37 votes [30.58%])

Or is it more a poorly written poll thing... :bag:

J

 
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fatguyinalittlecoat said:
Maurile Tremblay said:
There's much more to our universe than just human existence, for sure.

***

I have no problem calling certain experiences -- the kind that can be achieved through deep meditation or prayer, for example -- "spiritual." But I would mean it only as a description of a person's subjective experience, not as a description anything occurring outside that person's head.
How is something happening in somebody's head more than just human existence? Or were these two sentences unrelated?
Yeah, I didn't mean for those two categories (stuff that's beyond human experience, and stuff that I'd describe as spiritual) to be synonymous.

 
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Joe Bryant said:
Does it surprise you that people are voting the way they are and choosing the "Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiritual" realm" option? (Currently at 37 votes [30.58%])
I don't think it's all that surprising. People on the internet are usually much less religious than people in real life.

 
I think another poll would be really interesting, with the following options:

1. I am religious and follow the same or very similar religion as the one I grew up with in my household

2. I am religious but follow a completely different religion from the one I grew up with in my household

3. I am not religious

I'd be very curious to see the results of this one. Even though it would be a tiny sample size.

 
Atheist but I'll admit I do fear that I'm wrong and have to spend eternity in my own personal hell: lying in a bath of olives while timschochet rattles off his top 5 everything.

 
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I think another poll would be really interesting, with the following options:

1. I am religious and follow the same or very similar religion as the one I grew up with in my household

2. I am religious but follow a completely different religion from the one I grew up with in my household

3. I am not religious
Might as well break the last category down into "I am not religious and I did not grow up in a religious household" and "I am not religious but I did grow up in a religious household."

 
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I think another poll would be really interesting, with the following options:

1. I am religious and follow the same or very similar religion as the one I grew up with in my household

2. I am religious but follow a completely different religion from the one I grew up with in my household

3. I am not religious
Might as well break the last category down into "I am not religious and I did not grow up in a religious household" and "I am not religious but I did grow up in a religious household."
Yes.

J

 
Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion but POSSIBLY feel that there's a "higher power" and "spiritual" realm

Emphasis on POSSIBLY. As science advances, the possibility decreases. The only thing I get hung up on is what created the first particle of matter. But that is negated by the question, "who created the creator". Both are puzzling questions but just because we can't answer it yet doesn't mean a creator is the only answer.

 
Joe Bryant said:
Does it surprise you that people are voting the way they are and choosing the "Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiritual" realm" option? (Currently at 37 votes [30.58%])
I don't think it's all that surprising. People on the internet are usually much less religious than people in real life.
I agree with you. My thought on that is that it's because people on the internet are more honest in this case as there are no "consequences" for expressing their opinion. In other words, the Atheist mid level guy in the office probably isn't talking a lot about his thoughts on religion if his boss is a Christian. That kind of thing?

J

 
Not a follower of religion. Still not sure if there is a higher power. Not sure why though. Maybe it's eternal optimism.

But, I also want to go back to the day I believed in Santa. Life was much simpler then.

 
The only thing I get hung up on is what created the first particle of matter.
The origin of matter might not be all that much more mysterious than the origin of life. In each case, we don't have the answer, but we have some possible candidates that are consistent with the laws of physics as we know them. (On the possible origin of matter, here's Lawrence Krauss.)

It still just pushes the question back a step, though. Even if we know how matter might have originated given the laws of physics, where did the laws of physics come from?

 
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I think another poll would be really interesting, with the following options:

1. I am religious and follow the same or very similar religion as the one I grew up with in my household

2. I am religious but follow a completely different religion from the one I grew up with in my household

3. I am not religious

I'd be very curious to see the results of this one. Even though it would be a tiny sample size.
On that note Otis, what did you think of the article about how a study is projecting China to be the most Christian nation in the world in 15 years?

Would that make any difference in what you were thinking?

Personally, the parent thing isn't as important to me. But I know it is to you.

J

 
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Joe Bryant said:
Does it surprise you that people are voting the way they are and choosing the "Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiritual" realm" option? (Currently at 37 votes [30.58%])
I don't think it's all that surprising. People on the internet are usually much less religious than people in real life.
I agree with you. My thought on that is that it's because people on the internet are more honest in this case as there are no "consequences" for expressing their opinion. In other words, the Atheist mid level guy in the office probably isn't talking a lot about his thoughts on religion if his boss is a Christian. That kind of thing?

J
This is probably right. If you asked my extended family they would all tell you I'm Catholic. I may have been raised that way, but clearly don't self identify as that these days. I just don't bother to have that conversation. You know, religion and politics...

 
I think another poll would be really interesting, with the following options:

1. I am religious and follow the same or very similar religion as the one I grew up with in my household

2. I am religious but follow a completely different religion from the one I grew up with in my household

3. I am not religious

I'd be very curious to see the results of this one. Even though it would be a tiny sample size.
On that note Otis, what did you think of the article about how a study is projecting China to be the most Christian nation in the world in 15 years?

Would that make any difference in what you were thinking?

J
Definitely interesting. It cuts against common sense for me and seems contrary to some other things I've seen, so who knows if there is some social condition there skewing the data. But it's interesting. At some point I'll find the time to so some research and see what I can find on all that. It's the most important assumption in my question.

 
Joe Bryant said:
Does it surprise you that people are voting the way they are and choosing the "Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiritual" realm" option? (Currently at 37 votes [30.58%])
I don't think it's all that surprising. People on the internet are usually much less religious than people in real life.
I agree with you. My thought on that is that it's because people on the internet are more honest in this case as there are no "consequences" for expressing their opinion. In other words, the Atheist mid level guy in the office probably isn't talking a lot about his thoughts on religion if his boss is a Christian. That kind of thing?

J
I think that's part of it (people acting differently online and offline). But another part of it is that the demographics of who is online are not representative of the country as a whole. These are broad generalizations, but my impression is that people online tend to be somewhat younger, whiter, maler, more educated, and richer than people in general. And religious people tend to be somewhat older, less white, more female, less educated, and poorer than people in general.

 
Joe Bryant said:
Does it surprise you that people are voting the way they are and choosing the "Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiritual" realm" option? (Currently at 37 votes [30.58%])
I don't think it's all that surprising. People on the internet are usually much less religious than people in real life.
I agree with you. My thought on that is that it's because people on the internet are more honest in this case as there are no "consequences" for expressing their opinion. In other words, the Atheist mid level guy in the office probably isn't talking a lot about his thoughts on religion if his boss is a Christian. That kind of thing?

J
That's probably part of it. But I also think that people on the internet are just demographically different in some ways from the general population. They're more likely to be sci-fi fans, more likely to be white, less likely to be old, less likely to live in rural areas, less likely to be religious, etc.

 
Koya said:
Zow said:
Koya said:
Can you add options for agnostics / atheists that still follow a religion? Many of us may have some attachment to a religion due to family / want children raised, the want for tradition, maybe the thought that we don't know what god may be but one religion better represents what we think it may be than others, etc
Yeah I'd change my vote to this. I still identify as catholic, go with family, plan on raising a kid in the catholic church, etc. even though I'm an atheist.
That was my gut which is why I asked (thanks Joe).I'm an agnostic because foolish of me to think I actually know or my predisposition to Judaism is not due to how I was raised.

I can't call myself an atheist because I waver between how absurd the idea of a God is and how absurd the idea of no God is, as well.

If it were up to me is likely not follow religion at all and be a Jew by heritage, which does mean a lot to me for a number of non religious reasons, but between the wife who chose to convert and my other family this is a good compromise.
Ditto across the board.

 
I was raised devout protestant, parochial schools and everything. I can't say there isn't a God, but I firmly believe that it is impossible that any religion, or sub-sect of a religion, has the right answer. For one, Christians don't read the Old Testament the same way Jews read it. Yet the various Christian sects will practically fight to death (or the after-life) over so-called critical nuances in the same text.

Voted not believer, but possibly.

 
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I think another poll would be really interesting, with the following options:

1. I am religious and follow the same or very similar religion as the one I grew up with in my household

2. I am religious but follow a completely different religion from the one I grew up with in my household

3. I am not religious

I'd be very curious to see the results of this one. Even though it would be a tiny sample size.
On that note Otis, what did you think of the article about how a study is projecting China to be the most Christian nation in the world in 15 years?

Would that make any difference in what you were thinking?

J
Definitely interesting. It cuts against common sense for me and seems contrary to some other things I've seen, so who knows if there is some social condition there skewing the data. But it's interesting. At some point I'll find the time to so some research and see what I can find on all that. It's the most important assumption in my question.
You do realize that most religions who grow must do so through adult conversions at some point, right? All of Europe's Christian heritage at some point was due to conversion. South Korea has a higher % of Evangelical Protestants than the US (which is the flavor that America basically invented so it was imported into Korea). I don't get why you would be surprised that there's a lot of conversions inside growing religious movements.
 
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Maybe my hope for a God and a heaven is related to being a jaded Catholic. It would be a fitting end for quite a few priests and parishioners.

 
Joe Bryant said:
Does it surprise you that people are voting the way they are and choosing the "Not a Believer / Follower of a Religion and feel there is no "higher power" or "spiritual" realm" option? (Currently at 37 votes [30.58%])
I don't think it's all that surprising. People on the internet are usually much less religious than people in real life.
I agree with you. My thought on that is that it's because people on the internet are more honest in this case as there are no "consequences" for expressing their opinion. In other words, the Atheist mid level guy in the office probably isn't talking a lot about his thoughts on religion if his boss is a Christian. That kind of thing?

J
That's probably part of it. But I also think that people on the internet are just demographically different in some ways from the general population. They're more likely to be sci-fi fans, more likely to be white, less likely to be old, less likely to live in rural areas, less likely to be religious, etc.
You and fatguy are right for sure on the demographics.

What I mean more is that VikingAvenger007 is more likely to be honest on the internet than he is in real life. Especially when it comes to opinions like God. And especially when VikingAvenger007 in real life is John Smith who is an Atheist working as a mid level accountant in Atlanta trying to advance in the firm with a Christian boss that's trying to land the Chick Fil-A account.

J

 
I think another poll would be really interesting, with the following options:

1. I am religious and follow the same or very similar religion as the one I grew up with in my household

2. I am religious but follow a completely different religion from the one I grew up with in my household

3. I am not religious

I'd be very curious to see the results of this one. Even though it would be a tiny sample size.
On that note Otis, what did you think of the article about how a study is projecting China to be the most Christian nation in the world in 15 years?

Would that make any difference in what you were thinking?

J
Definitely interesting. It cuts against common sense for me and seems contrary to some other things I've seen, so who knows if there is some social condition there skewing the data. But it's interesting. At some point I'll find the time to so some research and see what I can find on all that. It's the most important assumption in my question.
You do realize that most religions who grow must do so through adult conversions at some point, right? All of Europe's Christian heritage at some point was due to conversion. South Korea has a higher % of Evangelical Protestants than the US (which is the flavor that America basically invented so it was imported into Korea). I don't get why you would be surprised that there's a lot of conversions inside growing religious movements.
I just find it super interesting this is so important to Otis. I understand the objections to God. I have them too and struggle with Existence of Evil / Bad Things Happening to Good People / Exclusion / and other stuff talked about here. I would put the legacy thing way down the list on things I've heard. But that's the beauty of conversation. "My" list doesn't matter. What matters to Otis is his list. That's just how it works. It's not good or bad. It just is. I'm just interested as I've never seen that be a big deal to someone.

J

 
I was raised devout protestant, parochial schools and everything. I can't say there isn't a God, but I firmly believe that it is impossible that any religion, or sub-sect of a religion, has the right answer. For one, Christians don't read the Old Testament the same way Jews read it. Yet the various Christian sects will practically fight to death (or the after-life) over so-called critical nuances in the same text.

Voted not believer, but possibly.
I think the bolded hits the mark for me too.

 
On that note Otis, what did you think of the article about how a study is projecting China to be the most Christian nation in the world in 15 years?

Would that make any difference in what you were thinking?

Personally, the parent thing isn't as important to me. But I know it is to you.

J
If you're interested in the growth of Christianity in China, you HAVE to read Safely Home, by Randy Alcorn. It's fiction, based in modern-day China, and gives a facinating look at the realities of both past and modern-day persecution and how the church continues to grow.

 
Did the results of this turn out about as you expected?

I think for me they did. The one thing I whiffed on though was I thought there would be more "I'm not religious but I am spiritual" component. Seems like I hear that a lot. But that's a good thing about a poll where you can actually count up all votes compared to things that are heard.

J

 
Did the results of this turn out about as you expected?

I think for me they did. The one thing I whiffed on though was I thought there would be more "I'm not religious but I am spiritual" component. Seems like I hear that a lot. But that's a good thing about a poll where you can actually count up all votes compared to things that are heard.

J
That surprised me too. If I were to suddenly wake up one morning having faith in a higher power, I would definitely put myself in that category. In some ways to me, organized religion is just as far away from a simple belief in a higher power as atheism is.

 
Did the results of this turn out about as you expected?

I think for me they did. The one thing I whiffed on though was I thought there would be more "I'm not religious but I am spiritual" component. Seems like I hear that a lot. But that's a good thing about a poll where you can actually count up all votes compared to things that are heard.

J
I am going to make a possibly unhelpful comment: I've rarely heard that uttered from a male's mouth. Very few females here. Ergo...

 
Did the results of this turn out about as you expected?

I think for me they did. The one thing I whiffed on though was I thought there would be more "I'm not religious but I am spiritual" component. Seems like I hear that a lot. But that's a good thing about a poll where you can actually count up all votes compared to things that are heard.

J
I am going to make a possibly unhelpful comment: I've rarely heard that uttered from a male's mouth. Very few females here. Ergo...
I could be wrong but I interpret it as "I believe in a higher power, but don't identify with any organized religious groups".

 

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