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The Derek Jeter farewell tour (1 Viewer)

Doctor Detroit

Please remove your headgear
Possibly the worst thing in baseball history.

This is basically Pete Rose without the edge, an average player who just stuck around a long ####### time.

FWIW I've never been a Jeter hater and am definitely not a Yankee hater, he's just not that special. :shrug:

 
Possibly the worst thing in baseball history.

This is basically Pete Rose without the edge, an average player who just stuck around a long ####### time.

FWIW I've never been a Jeter hater and am definitely not a Yankee hater, he's just not that special. :shrug:
It is what it is. Chipper got it. Did he deserve his farewell pop?

 
Possibly the worst thing in baseball history.

This is basically Pete Rose without the edge, an average player who just stuck around a long ####### time.

FWIW I've never been a Jeter hater and am definitely not a Yankee hater, he's just not that special. :shrug:
He's not special? Come on, DD.

 
Well, the flip side is, he DOES sell tickets on the road because of this, so do the fans want some sort of moment before the game?. I know the Yankees are always a pretty popular road draw but people DO want to come out and see him. So they spend 2 minutes before a game with a little something something? Who cares? I never objected to it for Ripken. Can't recall if Yount or Brett had a similar thing, I think one of them did. I also didn't object to Chipper.

 
Can't wait for the All-Star game celebration and 3+ hours of talking about him. He was player of the month in August 1998, hopefully they go back over that month in excruciating detail for everyone. :thumbup:

 
For the better part of the past two decades, you’d be hard pressed to find a more universally beloved player across the world of baseball than New York Yankees shortstop Derek Jeter. From his very first season in the Bronx, which culminated with a Rookie of the Year award and World Series Championship, it was clear that Jeter had the profile of a Yankee lifer—the type of gritty yet innately talented player that could one day find himself on a plaque in Monument Park. Nearly twenty years and five World Series rings later, The Captain is lacing up the cleats for one final rodeo around baseball. When all is said and done, that monument will very much become a reality.Over the course of the season, various teams around baseball are planning to honor Jeter before his final game at their respective home stadiums. The ceremonies will be similar to those of Mariano Rivera’s farewell tour last season. Undoubtedly, all the winning Jeter has done has created some bitterness amongst fans of the teams he has defeated. But also like Rivera, the way Jeter has played the game and carried himself over the years has made fans amongst even the most rival fan bases. It’s perhaps impossible to be a true fan of baseball and not appreciate the career of Derek Jeter.

As a result of this appreciation, fans around baseball are indeed paying top dollar to see Jeter one last time at their respective ballparks. Jeter will be making stops at 18 different stadiums this year, and current secondary market ticket prices for each one of those stops are well above the respective team’s season average. In fact, ten of these 18 games check in as top five highest priced games of the year for the opposing team, and not one ranks below being the 18th most expensive game. Overall, Jeter farewell games rank as the 6.56th most expensive games of the year for each team.
Well, maybe not impossible.

 
Jeter was great, but I agree that he is slightly overrated, especially by the media and Yankees fans, most of whom act like you are insulting their mother if you even imply that Jeter cannot walk on water.

 
Jeter was great, but I agree that he is slightly overrated, especially by the media and Yankees fans, most of whom act like you are insulting their mother if you even imply that Jeter cannot walk on water.
Nobody is claiming he's the best player ever.

 
Derek Jeter once bunted a ball so hard, it was recorded on the Richter scale as "amazing." :august1998playerofthemonth:

 
Jeter was great, but I agree that he is slightly overrated, especially by the media and Yankees fans, most of whom act like you are insulting their mother if you even imply that Jeter cannot walk on water.
Nobody is claiming he's the best player ever.
Maybe not, but there are people who think he is the best player of his generation, and that kind of talk is just crazy.
No, there aren't.

 
http://nextimpulsesports.com/2014/02/18/derek-jeter-overrated-baseball-player-time/
Derek Jeter announced his retirement last week from Major League Baseball, in which he will call it quits at the conclusion of the 2014 season. Everyone knows that Jeter is one of the more decorated MLB shortstops of all time. He is a 13-time All-Star. He has five Silver Slugger Awards. He has five Gold Glove Awards. He played for the Yankees during their recent resurgence, in which he has earned five World Series rings. He was widely known for his philanthropic work. When he was called upon to act in movies and television, he was able to poke fun of himself. He even played older brother to Minotaur-loving Alex Rodriguez. But what he is mostly known for are his continuous clutch hits and great fielding during the playoffs, so much so that it garnered him the nickname of Mr. November.

Yet, not everyone is sold on Jeter’s prowess on the field. Time and again Jeter found himself playing Johnnie Cochran for his defensive skills, most notably his fielding range. Although he shrugged off the negative criticism as a part of playing in New York, Jeter could never escape it. But, beyond that, what truly made Jeter famous and unforgettable? What put him in the discussion for best shortstop of all time? What made him possibly the most overrated baseball player of all time? In the quickest answer possible – not playing for the Houston Astros.

Coming out of high school, Jeter was a widely known, poised-beyond-his-years shortstop from Michigan. He was the Gatorade High School Player of the Year. He was heavily recruited by Michigan University, and pretty soon he had the caught the eye of most teams drafting in the first round of the MLB Amateur draft. Hal Newhouser, who was a scout with the Houston Astros at the time, was so sure of his future success that he quit his job with the Astros after they selected Phil Nevin instead of Jeter.

Jeter spent four seasons in the minors, which is somewhat typical for baseball. However, it took him awhile to get his bat going. Also working against him was his defense. In just 126 games, he committed 56 errors and owned an embarrassingly low .889 fielding percentage – which is the equivalent of typing with gloves on. However, even with his awful mitten defensive skills, Jeter still took home the league’s award for best defensive shortstop. The receipt of that award became a disturbingly annoying trend to many in the sabremetric field.

Upon reaching the majors, Jeter did have to play in front of raucous New York crowds. And not only that, when on the road – and even though there are displaced Yankee fans across the country – they still were the Evil Empire when walking into a stadium. But, nonetheless, he played on the Yankees. He had protection everywhere he turned. In the lineup, he got to hit in front of guys like Bernie Williams, Paul O’Neill, Tino Martinez, Jorge Posada, Jason Giambi, Gary Sheffield, Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, Robinson Cano, Hideki Matsui and a plethora of veterans giving it their last shot as part timers (including Tim Raines, Todd Zeile, David Justice, Glenallen Hill, and so on). Obviously, the pockets were lined deep in New York. And Jeter reaped the benefits. In the end, who would you rather pitch to? Derek Jeter or a roided up Jason Giambi with Jeter possibly on? It’s an easy answer, statistically or not.

Whether you want to believe Jeter was the benefactor of a ridiculous lineup for nearly two decades is up to you. Some of those seasons he had 40+ home run guys hitting in the lower third of the Yankees’ lineups. And yet with all of that help behind him, and netting 700+ plate appearances in 10 different seasons – five of which he led the league – Jeter only led the league in runs one time. Once. He led the league in hits just two times. He never accumulated 100+ walks. He never led the league in any other major statistical category. Combine that with the fact that Jeter has had only one season in which his UZR rating, which measures the amount of runs you save your team, was above zero, it’s amazing to know that he still finished in the top ten of MVP voting eight different times. Bill James even famously once said Jeter was “the most ineffective defensive player in the major leagues, at any position.” To put it politely, Jeter as an anomaly in the sabermetric community.

But Jeter also was more than just the Paris Hilton of baseball. He didn’t inherit a wealth of statistics and awards because of the players that followed him in the lineup. He still had to perform. He still ranks 10th all time on the hits list. And more often than not, he performed better on the big stage than in the regular season. This is how he earned his other nickname – Captain Clutch. He is currently sitting at a postseason slash line of .308/.374/.465, which is nearly identical to his career statistics. He has numerous notable postseason plays that players could only wish for. Yet, some could argue that anyone with a season’s worth of postseason games under their belt will probably have one or two of these standout plays. Healthy consistency was another benefit afforded to Jeter. But is that not a sign of greatness?

According to Baseball Reference’s Similarity Score, Jeter compares most closely to Craig Biggio. If you remember, Biggio was up for the Hall of Fame this year and failed to make it. No one argues Biggio’s greatness, but he didn’t get in. Yet, Jeter will get in his first time around. And he’ll get in with ease. That’s the disparity between playing in Houston and playing in New York. In one city you win multiple championships, date Hollywood actresses, and garner top-10 MVP votes – in the other, you may get a barbecue named after you.

To combat the stat geeks, Jeter does own the 21st best offensive career WAR. He’s sandwiched on that list by Jimmie Foxx and Eddie Matthews. And the only people sitting above him on that list with fewer seasons played are Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams, and Mickey Mantle. But it’s hard to look past the help he received offensively in the lineup behind him. It’s hard to ignore the deep pockets of the Yankees, which afforded Jeter with relief in the form of 15+ game winners, veteran bench depth, the best closer of all time, and intelligent managers – all of which are necessary for long postseason runs. So even though Jeter’s career aligned with the aforementioned Yankee resurgence, he wasn’t necessarily the catalyst.

In short, is Derek Jeter overrated? Absolutely. Statistically compared to other Hall of Fame shortstops, he barely cracks the top 15 all time. Had he not played for nearly two decades for the winningest team of all-time (of any sport) he’d be lower on the list. But, is he better than Craig Biggio?

Absolutely. He performed in the postseason the same as he did in the regular season, if not better. And he did so with consistency over an extended period of time. However, he did so with help. And lots of help. So, how overrated is Derek Jeter? Very. But with a caveat. Due to how he is heralded in the baseball community, Jeter is definitely one of the most overrated baseball players of all time.
 
Doctor Detroit said:
http://nextimpulsesports.com/2014/02/18/derek-jeter-overrated-baseball-player-time/
Derek Jeter announced his retirement last week from Major League Baseball, in which he will call it quits at the conclusion of the 2014 season. Everyone knows that Jeter is one of the more decorated MLB shortstops of all time. He is a 13-time All-Star. He has five Silver Slugger Awards. He has five Gold Glove Awards. He played for the Yankees during their recent resurgence, in which he has earned five World Series rings. He was widely known for his philanthropic work. When he was called upon to act in movies and television, he was able to poke fun of himself. He even played older brother to Minotaur-loving Alex Rodriguez. But what he is mostly known for are his continuous clutch hits and great fielding during the playoffs, so much so that it garnered him the nickname of Mr. November.

Yet, not everyone is sold on Jeter’s prowess on the field. Time and again Jeter found himself playing Johnnie Cochran for his defensive skills, most notably his fielding range. Although he shrugged off the negative criticism as a part of playing in New York, Jeter could never escape it. But, beyond that, what truly made Jeter famous and unforgettable? What put him in the discussion for best shortstop of all time? What made him possibly the most overrated baseball player of all time? In the quickest answer possible – not playing for the Houston Astros.

Coming out of high school, Jeter was a widely known, poised-beyond-his-years shortstop from Michigan. He was the Gatorade High School Player of the Year. He was heavily recruited by Michigan University, and pretty soon he had the caught the eye of most teams drafting in the first round of the MLB Amateur draft. Hal Newhouser, who was a scout with the Houston Astros at the time, was so sure of his future success that he quit his job with the Astros after they selected Phil Nevin instead of Jeter.

Jeter spent four seasons in the minors, which is somewhat typical for baseball. However, it took him awhile to get his bat going. Also working against him was his defense. In just 126 games, he committed 56 errors and owned an embarrassingly low .889 fielding percentage – which is the equivalent of typing with gloves on. However, even with his awful mitten defensive skills, Jeter still took home the league’s award for best defensive shortstop. The receipt of that award became a disturbingly annoying trend to many in the sabremetric field.

Upon reaching the majors, Jeter did have to play in front of raucous New York crowds. And not only that, when on the road – and even though there are displaced Yankee fans across the country – they still were the Evil Empire when walking into a stadium. But, nonetheless, he played on the Yankees. He had protection everywhere he turned. In the lineup, he got to hit in front of guys like Bernie Williams, Paul O’Neill, Tino Martinez, Jorge Posada, Jason Giambi, Gary Sheffield, Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, Robinson Cano, Hideki Matsui and a plethora of veterans giving it their last shot as part timers (including Tim Raines, Todd Zeile, David Justice, Glenallen Hill, and so on). Obviously, the pockets were lined deep in New York. And Jeter reaped the benefits. In the end, who would you rather pitch to? Derek Jeter or a roided up Jason Giambi with Jeter possibly on? It’s an easy answer, statistically or not.

Whether you want to believe Jeter was the benefactor of a ridiculous lineup for nearly two decades is up to you. Some of those seasons he had 40+ home run guys hitting in the lower third of the Yankees’ lineups. And yet with all of that help behind him, and netting 700+ plate appearances in 10 different seasons – five of which he led the league – Jeter only led the league in runs one time. Once. He led the league in hits just two times. He never accumulated 100+ walks. He never led the league in any other major statistical category. Combine that with the fact that Jeter has had only one season in which his UZR rating, which measures the amount of runs you save your team, was above zero, it’s amazing to know that he still finished in the top ten of MVP voting eight different times. Bill James even famously once said Jeter was “the most ineffective defensive player in the major leagues, at any position.” To put it politely, Jeter as an anomaly in the sabermetric community.

But Jeter also was more than just the Paris Hilton of baseball. He didn’t inherit a wealth of statistics and awards because of the players that followed him in the lineup. He still had to perform. He still ranks 10th all time on the hits list. And more often than not, he performed better on the big stage than in the regular season. This is how he earned his other nickname – Captain Clutch. He is currently sitting at a postseason slash line of .308/.374/.465, which is nearly identical to his career statistics. He has numerous notable postseason plays that players could only wish for. Yet, some could argue that anyone with a season’s worth of postseason games under their belt will probably have one or two of these standout plays. Healthy consistency was another benefit afforded to Jeter. But is that not a sign of greatness?

According to Baseball Reference’s Similarity Score, Jeter compares most closely to Craig Biggio. If you remember, Biggio was up for the Hall of Fame this year and failed to make it. No one argues Biggio’s greatness, but he didn’t get in. Yet, Jeter will get in his first time around. And he’ll get in with ease. That’s the disparity between playing in Houston and playing in New York. In one city you win multiple championships, date Hollywood actresses, and garner top-10 MVP votes – in the other, you may get a barbecue named after you.

To combat the stat geeks, Jeter does own the 21st best offensive career WAR. He’s sandwiched on that list by Jimmie Foxx and Eddie Matthews. And the only people sitting above him on that list with fewer seasons played are Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams, and Mickey Mantle. But it’s hard to look past the help he received offensively in the lineup behind him. It’s hard to ignore the deep pockets of the Yankees, which afforded Jeter with relief in the form of 15+ game winners, veteran bench depth, the best closer of all time, and intelligent managers – all of which are necessary for long postseason runs. So even though Jeter’s career aligned with the aforementioned Yankee resurgence, he wasn’t necessarily the catalyst.

In short, is Derek Jeter overrated? Absolutely. Statistically compared to other Hall of Fame shortstops, he barely cracks the top 15 all time. Had he not played for nearly two decades for the winningest team of all-time (of any sport) he’d be lower on the list. But, is he better than Craig Biggio?

Absolutely. He performed in the postseason the same as he did in the regular season, if not better. And he did so with consistency over an extended period of time. However, he did so with help. And lots of help. So, how overrated is Derek Jeter? Very. But with a caveat. Due to how he is heralded in the baseball community, Jeter is definitely one of the most overrated baseball players of all time.
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?

 
Doctor Detroit said:
http://nextimpulsesports.com/2014/02/18/derek-jeter-overrated-baseball-player-time/
Derek Jeter announced his retirement last week from Major League Baseball, in which he will call it quits at the conclusion of the 2014 season. Everyone knows that Jeter is one of the more decorated MLB shortstops of all time. He is a 13-time All-Star. He has five Silver Slugger Awards. He has five Gold Glove Awards. He played for the Yankees during their recent resurgence, in which he has earned five World Series rings. He was widely known for his philanthropic work. When he was called upon to act in movies and television, he was able to poke fun of himself. He even played older brother to Minotaur-loving Alex Rodriguez. But what he is mostly known for are his continuous clutch hits and great fielding during the playoffs, so much so that it garnered him the nickname of Mr. November.

Yet, not everyone is sold on Jeter’s prowess on the field. Time and again Jeter found himself playing Johnnie Cochran for his defensive skills, most notably his fielding range. Although he shrugged off the negative criticism as a part of playing in New York, Jeter could never escape it. But, beyond that, what truly made Jeter famous and unforgettable? What put him in the discussion for best shortstop of all time? What made him possibly the most overrated baseball player of all time? In the quickest answer possible – not playing for the Houston Astros.

Coming out of high school, Jeter was a widely known, poised-beyond-his-years shortstop from Michigan. He was the Gatorade High School Player of the Year. He was heavily recruited by Michigan University, and pretty soon he had the caught the eye of most teams drafting in the first round of the MLB Amateur draft. Hal Newhouser, who was a scout with the Houston Astros at the time, was so sure of his future success that he quit his job with the Astros after they selected Phil Nevin instead of Jeter.

Jeter spent four seasons in the minors, which is somewhat typical for baseball. However, it took him awhile to get his bat going. Also working against him was his defense. In just 126 games, he committed 56 errors and owned an embarrassingly low .889 fielding percentage – which is the equivalent of typing with gloves on. However, even with his awful mitten defensive skills, Jeter still took home the league’s award for best defensive shortstop. The receipt of that award became a disturbingly annoying trend to many in the sabremetric field.

Upon reaching the majors, Jeter did have to play in front of raucous New York crowds. And not only that, when on the road – and even though there are displaced Yankee fans across the country – they still were the Evil Empire when walking into a stadium. But, nonetheless, he played on the Yankees. He had protection everywhere he turned. In the lineup, he got to hit in front of guys like Bernie Williams, Paul O’Neill, Tino Martinez, Jorge Posada, Jason Giambi, Gary Sheffield, Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, Robinson Cano, Hideki Matsui and a plethora of veterans giving it their last shot as part timers (including Tim Raines, Todd Zeile, David Justice, Glenallen Hill, and so on). Obviously, the pockets were lined deep in New York. And Jeter reaped the benefits. In the end, who would you rather pitch to? Derek Jeter or a roided up Jason Giambi with Jeter possibly on? It’s an easy answer, statistically or not.

Whether you want to believe Jeter was the benefactor of a ridiculous lineup for nearly two decades is up to you. Some of those seasons he had 40+ home run guys hitting in the lower third of the Yankees’ lineups. And yet with all of that help behind him, and netting 700+ plate appearances in 10 different seasons – five of which he led the league – Jeter only led the league in runs one time. Once. He led the league in hits just two times. He never accumulated 100+ walks. He never led the league in any other major statistical category. Combine that with the fact that Jeter has had only one season in which his UZR rating, which measures the amount of runs you save your team, was above zero, it’s amazing to know that he still finished in the top ten of MVP voting eight different times. Bill James even famously once said Jeter was “the most ineffective defensive player in the major leagues, at any position.” To put it politely, Jeter as an anomaly in the sabermetric community.

But Jeter also was more than just the Paris Hilton of baseball. He didn’t inherit a wealth of statistics and awards because of the players that followed him in the lineup. He still had to perform. He still ranks 10th all time on the hits list. And more often than not, he performed better on the big stage than in the regular season. This is how he earned his other nickname – Captain Clutch. He is currently sitting at a postseason slash line of .308/.374/.465, which is nearly identical to his career statistics. He has numerous notable postseason plays that players could only wish for. Yet, some could argue that anyone with a season’s worth of postseason games under their belt will probably have one or two of these standout plays. Healthy consistency was another benefit afforded to Jeter. But is that not a sign of greatness?

According to Baseball Reference’s Similarity Score, Jeter compares most closely to Craig Biggio. If you remember, Biggio was up for the Hall of Fame this year and failed to make it. No one argues Biggio’s greatness, but he didn’t get in. Yet, Jeter will get in his first time around. And he’ll get in with ease. That’s the disparity between playing in Houston and playing in New York. In one city you win multiple championships, date Hollywood actresses, and garner top-10 MVP votes – in the other, you may get a barbecue named after you.

To combat the stat geeks, Jeter does own the 21st best offensive career WAR. He’s sandwiched on that list by Jimmie Foxx and Eddie Matthews. And the only people sitting above him on that list with fewer seasons played are Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams, and Mickey Mantle. But it’s hard to look past the help he received offensively in the lineup behind him. It’s hard to ignore the deep pockets of the Yankees, which afforded Jeter with relief in the form of 15+ game winners, veteran bench depth, the best closer of all time, and intelligent managers – all of which are necessary for long postseason runs. So even though Jeter’s career aligned with the aforementioned Yankee resurgence, he wasn’t necessarily the catalyst.

In short, is Derek Jeter overrated? Absolutely. Statistically compared to other Hall of Fame shortstops, he barely cracks the top 15 all time. Had he not played for nearly two decades for the winningest team of all-time (of any sport) he’d be lower on the list. But, is he better than Craig Biggio?

Absolutely. He performed in the postseason the same as he did in the regular season, if not better. And he did so with consistency over an extended period of time. However, he did so with help. And lots of help. So, how overrated is Derek Jeter? Very. But with a caveat. Due to how he is heralded in the baseball community, Jeter is definitely one of the most overrated baseball players of all time.
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.

 
Doctor Detroit said:
http://nextimpulsesports.com/2014/02/18/derek-jeter-overrated-baseball-player-time/
Derek Jeter announced his retirement last week from Major League Baseball, in which he will call it quits at the conclusion of the 2014 season. Everyone knows that Jeter is one of the more decorated MLB shortstops of all time. He is a 13-time All-Star. He has five Silver Slugger Awards. He has five Gold Glove Awards. He played for the Yankees during their recent resurgence, in which he has earned five World Series rings. He was widely known for his philanthropic work. When he was called upon to act in movies and television, he was able to poke fun of himself. He even played older brother to Minotaur-loving Alex Rodriguez. But what he is mostly known for are his continuous clutch hits and great fielding during the playoffs, so much so that it garnered him the nickname of Mr. November.

Yet, not everyone is sold on Jeter’s prowess on the field. Time and again Jeter found himself playing Johnnie Cochran for his defensive skills, most notably his fielding range. Although he shrugged off the negative criticism as a part of playing in New York, Jeter could never escape it. But, beyond that, what truly made Jeter famous and unforgettable? What put him in the discussion for best shortstop of all time? What made him possibly the most overrated baseball player of all time? In the quickest answer possible – not playing for the Houston Astros.

Coming out of high school, Jeter was a widely known, poised-beyond-his-years shortstop from Michigan. He was the Gatorade High School Player of the Year. He was heavily recruited by Michigan University, and pretty soon he had the caught the eye of most teams drafting in the first round of the MLB Amateur draft. Hal Newhouser, who was a scout with the Houston Astros at the time, was so sure of his future success that he quit his job with the Astros after they selected Phil Nevin instead of Jeter.

Jeter spent four seasons in the minors, which is somewhat typical for baseball. However, it took him awhile to get his bat going. Also working against him was his defense. In just 126 games, he committed 56 errors and owned an embarrassingly low .889 fielding percentage – which is the equivalent of typing with gloves on. However, even with his awful mitten defensive skills, Jeter still took home the league’s award for best defensive shortstop. The receipt of that award became a disturbingly annoying trend to many in the sabremetric field.

Upon reaching the majors, Jeter did have to play in front of raucous New York crowds. And not only that, when on the road – and even though there are displaced Yankee fans across the country – they still were the Evil Empire when walking into a stadium. But, nonetheless, he played on the Yankees. He had protection everywhere he turned. In the lineup, he got to hit in front of guys like Bernie Williams, Paul O’Neill, Tino Martinez, Jorge Posada, Jason Giambi, Gary Sheffield, Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, Robinson Cano, Hideki Matsui and a plethora of veterans giving it their last shot as part timers (including Tim Raines, Todd Zeile, David Justice, Glenallen Hill, and so on). Obviously, the pockets were lined deep in New York. And Jeter reaped the benefits. In the end, who would you rather pitch to? Derek Jeter or a roided up Jason Giambi with Jeter possibly on? It’s an easy answer, statistically or not.

Whether you want to believe Jeter was the benefactor of a ridiculous lineup for nearly two decades is up to you. Some of those seasons he had 40+ home run guys hitting in the lower third of the Yankees’ lineups. And yet with all of that help behind him, and netting 700+ plate appearances in 10 different seasons – five of which he led the league – Jeter only led the league in runs one time. Once. He led the league in hits just two times. He never accumulated 100+ walks. He never led the league in any other major statistical category. Combine that with the fact that Jeter has had only one season in which his UZR rating, which measures the amount of runs you save your team, was above zero, it’s amazing to know that he still finished in the top ten of MVP voting eight different times. Bill James even famously once said Jeter was “the most ineffective defensive player in the major leagues, at any position.” To put it politely, Jeter as an anomaly in the sabermetric community.

But Jeter also was more than just the Paris Hilton of baseball. He didn’t inherit a wealth of statistics and awards because of the players that followed him in the lineup. He still had to perform. He still ranks 10th all time on the hits list. And more often than not, he performed better on the big stage than in the regular season. This is how he earned his other nickname – Captain Clutch. He is currently sitting at a postseason slash line of .308/.374/.465, which is nearly identical to his career statistics. He has numerous notable postseason plays that players could only wish for. Yet, some could argue that anyone with a season’s worth of postseason games under their belt will probably have one or two of these standout plays. Healthy consistency was another benefit afforded to Jeter. But is that not a sign of greatness?

According to Baseball Reference’s Similarity Score, Jeter compares most closely to Craig Biggio. If you remember, Biggio was up for the Hall of Fame this year and failed to make it. No one argues Biggio’s greatness, but he didn’t get in. Yet, Jeter will get in his first time around. And he’ll get in with ease. That’s the disparity between playing in Houston and playing in New York. In one city you win multiple championships, date Hollywood actresses, and garner top-10 MVP votes – in the other, you may get a barbecue named after you.

To combat the stat geeks, Jeter does own the 21st best offensive career WAR. He’s sandwiched on that list by Jimmie Foxx and Eddie Matthews. And the only people sitting above him on that list with fewer seasons played are Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams, and Mickey Mantle. But it’s hard to look past the help he received offensively in the lineup behind him. It’s hard to ignore the deep pockets of the Yankees, which afforded Jeter with relief in the form of 15+ game winners, veteran bench depth, the best closer of all time, and intelligent managers – all of which are necessary for long postseason runs. So even though Jeter’s career aligned with the aforementioned Yankee resurgence, he wasn’t necessarily the catalyst.

In short, is Derek Jeter overrated? Absolutely. Statistically compared to other Hall of Fame shortstops, he barely cracks the top 15 all time. Had he not played for nearly two decades for the winningest team of all-time (of any sport) he’d be lower on the list. But, is he better than Craig Biggio?

Absolutely. He performed in the postseason the same as he did in the regular season, if not better. And he did so with consistency over an extended period of time. However, he did so with help. And lots of help. So, how overrated is Derek Jeter? Very. But with a caveat. Due to how he is heralded in the baseball community, Jeter is definitely one of the most overrated baseball players of all time.
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.

 
Jeter is definitely overrated by the casual fans who just know how famous he is and assume he's OMG HE'S JETER HE MUST BE THE BEST PLAYER EVAH!

But I think people who really and truly know and understand the game realize that he's probably a top-5 all time SS, arguably the best of his generation (tough to rank him even within his era due to ARod/Nomar/Tejada all being roid guys) and one of the best overall players of his generation. But clearly not THE best player, and never was in the conversation for such a title.

 
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.
I think it is bad enough. He's 57th in total WAR. http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_bat_career.shtml

Behind Bagwell, Whitaker, and Walker, who are still waiting for the HOF. I think they should all be in the HOF (and Jeter too), but he'll probably sail in pretty easily on the 1st ballot, so I'd say he is a bit overrated.

 
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.
I think it is bad enough. He's 57th in total WAR. http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_bat_career.shtml

Behind Bagwell, Whitaker, and Walker, who are still waiting for the HOF. I think they should all be in the HOF (and Jeter too), but he'll probably sail in pretty easily on the 1st ballot, so I'd say he is a bit overrated.
At any rate...how can one be (if you're a WAR guy) the 57th best position player in MLB history and be overrated? Shouldn't your argument be that Walker, Bagwell(with spectulation being that he was a steroid user) and Whitaker are underrated.....

 
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.
I think it is bad enough. He's 57th in total WAR. http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_bat_career.shtml

Behind Bagwell, Whitaker, and Walker, who are still waiting for the HOF. I think they should all be in the HOF (and Jeter too), but he'll probably sail in pretty easily on the 1st ballot, so I'd say he is a bit overrated.
At any rate...how can one be (if you're a WAR guy) the 57th best position player in MLB history and be overrated? Shouldn't your argument be that Walker, Bagwell(with spectulation being that he was a steroid user) and Whitaker are underrated.....
By the definition of the word, if someone is ranked higher than jeter in WAR but people say jeter is better than them, then that makes jeter overrated and the other guy underrated.

In fact, if WAR is the basis for evaluation, then anyone who places jeter in the top 56 players of all time, is overrating hin

 
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.
I think it is bad enough. He's 57th in total WAR. http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_bat_career.shtml

Behind Bagwell, Whitaker, and Walker, who are still waiting for the HOF. I think they should all be in the HOF (and Jeter too), but he'll probably sail in pretty easily on the 1st ballot, so I'd say he is a bit overrated.
At any rate...how can one be (if you're a WAR guy) the 57th best position player in MLB history and be overrated? Shouldn't your argument be that Walker, Bagwell(with spectulation being that he was a steroid user) and Whitaker are underrated.....
By the definition of the word, if someone is ranked higher than jeter in WAR but people say jeter is better than them, then that makes jeter overrated and the other guy underrated.

In fact, if WAR is the basis for evaluation, then anyone who places jeter in the top 56 players of all time, is overrating hin
Has anyone said Jeter was better than the 56 guys in front of him?...and if they did...were they basing it solely on WAR?

Like I said before....I don't see how anyone can nail him as overrated...or "what if he had played in Houston" or his lineup protected him too much. He's pretty much nails in whatever way you want to evaluate his career; WAR, counting stats, rings.....

 
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.
I think it is bad enough. He's 57th in total WAR. http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_bat_career.shtml

Behind Bagwell, Whitaker, and Walker, who are still waiting for the HOF. I think they should all be in the HOF (and Jeter too), but he'll probably sail in pretty easily on the 1st ballot, so I'd say he is a bit overrated.
At any rate...how can one be (if you're a WAR guy) the 57th best position player in MLB history and be overrated? Shouldn't your argument be that Walker, Bagwell(with spectulation being that he was a steroid user) and Whitaker are underrated.....
It doesn't matter where you are, you can still be overrated. I could state that Ted Williams is overrated, if he was commonly rated as a Top 2-3 player, and I thought he was more like 8-10.

Here's an ESPN article asking if Derek Jeter is the best SS of all time. 68% say yes. http://espn.go.com/newyork/hot/?id=8315065 So, 68% think he is better than Wagner, Ripken, Yount, Ozzie, etc. That's overrated to me.

 
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Don Quixote said:
Thunderlips said:
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.
I think it is bad enough. He's 57th in total WAR. http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_bat_career.shtml

Behind Bagwell, Whitaker, and Walker, who are still waiting for the HOF. I think they should all be in the HOF (and Jeter too), but he'll probably sail in pretty easily on the 1st ballot, so I'd say he is a bit overrated.
At any rate...how can one be (if you're a WAR guy) the 57th best position player in MLB history and be overrated? Shouldn't your argument be that Walker, Bagwell(with spectulation being that he was a steroid user) and Whitaker are underrated.....
It doesn't matter where you are, you can still be overrated. I could state that Ted Williams is overrated, if he was commonly rated as a Top 2-3 player, and I thought he was more like 8-10.

Here's an ESPN article asking if Derek Jeter is the best SS of all time. 68% say yes. http://espn.go.com/newyork/hot/?id=8315065 So, 68% think he is better than Wagner, Ripken, Yount, Ozzie, etc. That's overrated to me.
Now while I'll agree that more casual fans would/will overrate him.... Somehow I think, that despite the numbers, more (so called) "serious" fans of the game will tag Jeter with the "overrated" monniker simply because of what team he played for. To each his own though....

 
Don Quixote said:
Thunderlips said:
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.
I think it is bad enough. He's 57th in total WAR. http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_bat_career.shtml

Behind Bagwell, Whitaker, and Walker, who are still waiting for the HOF. I think they should all be in the HOF (and Jeter too), but he'll probably sail in pretty easily on the 1st ballot, so I'd say he is a bit overrated.
At any rate...how can one be (if you're a WAR guy) the 57th best position player in MLB history and be overrated? Shouldn't your argument be that Walker, Bagwell(with spectulation being that he was a steroid user) and Whitaker are underrated.....
It doesn't matter where you are, you can still be overrated. I could state that Ted Williams is overrated, if he was commonly rated as a Top 2-3 player, and I thought he was more like 8-10.

Here's an ESPN article asking if Derek Jeter is the best SS of all time. 68% say yes. http://espn.go.com/newyork/hot/?id=8315065 So, 68% think he is better than Wagner, Ripken, Yount, Ozzie, etc. That's overrated to me.
Now while I'll agree that more casual fans would/will overrate him.... Somehow I think, that despite the numbers, more (so called) "serious" fans of the game will tag Jeter with the "overrated" monniker simply because of what team he played for. To each his own though....
But that's kind of the point, being a Yankee tends to overrate players. They're the global face of MLB and people always hear of all the great Yankee legends, so when Jeter gets put up there with those guys, it's bound to happen through no fault of his own. I even heard a lot of people putting Jeter on the Yankees Mt. Rushmore. On a team that had Ruth, Gehrig, DiMaggio, and Mantle, that's pure lunacy.

 
Don Quixote said:
Thunderlips said:
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Bad enough to take away the 21st of all time greatest O War? I get it....people don't like Jeter and want to make EVERY excuse in the book (great team, payroll, New York, IF HE WAS ONLY AN ASTRO!!!!,blah-blah-blah).....but he has the stat geek cred (21st WAR), he has the counting number geeks cred(3000+ hits) and he has the "hardware" geeks cred (5 WS rings).....he was a great player.
I think it is bad enough. He's 57th in total WAR. http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_bat_career.shtml

Behind Bagwell, Whitaker, and Walker, who are still waiting for the HOF. I think they should all be in the HOF (and Jeter too), but he'll probably sail in pretty easily on the 1st ballot, so I'd say he is a bit overrated.
At any rate...how can one be (if you're a WAR guy) the 57th best position player in MLB history and be overrated? Shouldn't your argument be that Walker, Bagwell(with spectulation being that he was a steroid user) and Whitaker are underrated.....
It doesn't matter where you are, you can still be overrated. I could state that Ted Williams is overrated, if he was commonly rated as a Top 2-3 player, and I thought he was more like 8-10.

Here's an ESPN article asking if Derek Jeter is the best SS of all time. 68% say yes. http://espn.go.com/newyork/hot/?id=8315065 So, 68% think he is better than Wagner, Ripken, Yount, Ozzie, etc. That's overrated to me.
Now while I'll agree that more casual fans would/will overrate him.... Somehow I think, that despite the numbers, more (so called) "serious" fans of the game will tag Jeter with the "overrated" monniker simply because of what team he played for. To each his own though....
But that's kind of the point, being a Yankee tends to overrate players. They're the global face of MLB and people always hear of all the great Yankee legends, so when Jeter gets put up there with those guys, it's bound to happen through no fault of his own. I even heard a lot of people putting Jeter on the Yankees Mt. Rushmore. On a team that had Ruth, Gehrig, DiMaggio, and Mantle, that's pure lunacy.
But it's not like we're talking Phil Rizzuto here....and plus, there's going to be pop for him....as there was for Chipper. Jeter's offensive numbers compare. Hell.....someone above brought up Robin Yount. Jeter's numbers are better than Yount's numbers.......He destroys Trammels, Ozzie Smith,..his OPS and OPS+ are above Ripken. Better than Larkin.....

He rightly takes a hit defensively....although two of those guys moved out of SS at an older age.(Not saying that that's not his fault). But defensive analytics arent exactly an exact science....

I think the thing that got me most about the OP (DD's link) was the guy's holding it against him that he played for a good team. The article goes in with an axe to grind.....he talks Biggio yet doesn't hold him under the same microscope of playing with in prime Bagwell and Berkman. I doubt most fans chasitizing Jeter for his lineup will say '"well Manny was overrated because he had Ortiz and Thome behind him and Damon and Alomar in front him for most of his career".

 
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Possibly the worst thing in baseball history.

This is basically Pete Rose without the edge, an average player who just stuck around a long ####### time.

FWIW I've never been a Jeter hater and am definitely not a Yankee hater, he's just not that special. :shrug:
Well he's no Tony Gwynn.

 
http://nextimpulsesports.com/2014/02/18/derek-jeter-overrated-baseball-player-time/
Derek Jeter announced his retirement last week from Major League Baseball, in which he will call it quits at the conclusion of the 2014 season. Everyone knows that Jeter is one of the more decorated MLB shortstops of all time. He is a 13-time All-Star. He has five Silver Slugger Awards. He has five Gold Glove Awards. He played for the Yankees during their recent resurgence, in which he has earned five World Series rings. He was widely known for his philanthropic work. When he was called upon to act in movies and television, he was able to poke fun of himself. He even played older brother to Minotaur-loving Alex Rodriguez. But what he is mostly known for are his continuous clutch hits and great fielding during the playoffs, so much so that it garnered him the nickname of Mr. November.

Yet, not everyone is sold on Jeter’s prowess on the field. Time and again Jeter found himself playing Johnnie Cochran for his defensive skills, most notably his fielding range. Although he shrugged off the negative criticism as a part of playing in New York, Jeter could never escape it. But, beyond that, what truly made Jeter famous and unforgettable? What put him in the discussion for best shortstop of all time? What made him possibly the most overrated baseball player of all time? In the quickest answer possible – not playing for the Houston Astros.

Coming out of high school, Jeter was a widely known, poised-beyond-his-years shortstop from Michigan. He was the Gatorade High School Player of the Year. He was heavily recruited by Michigan University, and pretty soon he had the caught the eye of most teams drafting in the first round of the MLB Amateur draft. Hal Newhouser, who was a scout with the Houston Astros at the time, was so sure of his future success that he quit his job with the Astros after they selected Phil Nevin instead of Jeter.

Jeter spent four seasons in the minors, which is somewhat typical for baseball. However, it took him awhile to get his bat going. Also working against him was his defense. In just 126 games, he committed 56 errors and owned an embarrassingly low .889 fielding percentage – which is the equivalent of typing with gloves on. However, even with his awful mitten defensive skills, Jeter still took home the league’s award for best defensive shortstop. The receipt of that award became a disturbingly annoying trend to many in the sabremetric field.

Upon reaching the majors, Jeter did have to play in front of raucous New York crowds. And not only that, when on the road – and even though there are displaced Yankee fans across the country – they still were the Evil Empire when walking into a stadium. But, nonetheless, he played on the Yankees. He had protection everywhere he turned. In the lineup, he got to hit in front of guys like Bernie Williams, Paul O’Neill, Tino Martinez, Jorge Posada, Jason Giambi, Gary Sheffield, Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, Robinson Cano, Hideki Matsui and a plethora of veterans giving it their last shot as part timers (including Tim Raines, Todd Zeile, David Justice, Glenallen Hill, and so on). Obviously, the pockets were lined deep in New York. And Jeter reaped the benefits. In the end, who would you rather pitch to? Derek Jeter or a roided up Jason Giambi with Jeter possibly on? It’s an easy answer, statistically or not.

Whether you want to believe Jeter was the benefactor of a ridiculous lineup for nearly two decades is up to you. Some of those seasons he had 40+ home run guys hitting in the lower third of the Yankees’ lineups. And yet with all of that help behind him, and netting 700+ plate appearances in 10 different seasons – five of which he led the league – Jeter only led the league in runs one time. Once. He led the league in hits just two times. He never accumulated 100+ walks. He never led the league in any other major statistical category. Combine that with the fact that Jeter has had only one season in which his UZR rating, which measures the amount of runs you save your team, was above zero, it’s amazing to know that he still finished in the top ten of MVP voting eight different times. Bill James even famously once said Jeter was “the most ineffective defensive player in the major leagues, at any position.” To put it politely, Jeter as an anomaly in the sabermetric community.

But Jeter also was more than just the Paris Hilton of baseball. He didn’t inherit a wealth of statistics and awards because of the players that followed him in the lineup. He still had to perform. He still ranks 10th all time on the hits list. And more often than not, he performed better on the big stage than in the regular season. This is how he earned his other nickname – Captain Clutch. He is currently sitting at a postseason slash line of .308/.374/.465, which is nearly identical to his career statistics. He has numerous notable postseason plays that players could only wish for. Yet, some could argue that anyone with a season’s worth of postseason games under their belt will probably have one or two of these standout plays. Healthy consistency was another benefit afforded to Jeter. But is that not a sign of greatness?

According to Baseball Reference’s Similarity Score, Jeter compares most closely to Craig Biggio. If you remember, Biggio was up for the Hall of Fame this year and failed to make it. No one argues Biggio’s greatness, but he didn’t get in. Yet, Jeter will get in his first time around. And he’ll get in with ease. That’s the disparity between playing in Houston and playing in New York. In one city you win multiple championships, date Hollywood actresses, and garner top-10 MVP votes – in the other, you may get a barbecue named after you.

To combat the stat geeks, Jeter does own the 21st best offensive career WAR. He’s sandwiched on that list by Jimmie Foxx and Eddie Matthews. And the only people sitting above him on that list with fewer seasons played are Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams, and Mickey Mantle. But it’s hard to look past the help he received offensively in the lineup behind him. It’s hard to ignore the deep pockets of the Yankees, which afforded Jeter with relief in the form of 15+ game winners, veteran bench depth, the best closer of all time, and intelligent managers – all of which are necessary for long postseason runs. So even though Jeter’s career aligned with the aforementioned Yankee resurgence, he wasn’t necessarily the catalyst.

In short, is Derek Jeter overrated? Absolutely. Statistically compared to other Hall of Fame shortstops, he barely cracks the top 15 all time. Had he not played for nearly two decades for the winningest team of all-time (of any sport) he’d be lower on the list. But, is he better than Craig Biggio?

Absolutely. He performed in the postseason the same as he did in the regular season, if not better. And he did so with consistency over an extended period of time. However, he did so with help. And lots of help. So, how overrated is Derek Jeter? Very. But with a caveat. Due to how he is heralded in the baseball community, Jeter is definitely one of the most overrated baseball players of all time.
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Goes to show you how important defense is to the overall game

 
I love Jeter. Love his game, love his approach, love his grit, love his leadership and clutch play in the post season.

But if he played in Kansas City or Pittsburgh he would not get all this attention. It's a product of being "The Captain" for the New York freaking Yankees.

So of course he is going to be percieved by some as "overrated".

But Jeter is one of the best SS in the history of game. It's not a glamour hitting position. But he sure was a heck of a hitter in the clutch moments throughout his career. Defensively in his prime...almost second to none. They don't make them like this that often. 20 years, one club. That's old school baseball.

Great player. But yeah...more hype due to where he plays.

 
http://nextimpulsesports.com/2014/02/18/derek-jeter-overrated-baseball-player-time/
Derek Jeter announced his retirement last week from Major League Baseball, in which he will call it quits at the conclusion of the 2014 season. Everyone knows that Jeter is one of the more decorated MLB shortstops of all time. He is a 13-time All-Star. He has five Silver Slugger Awards. He has five Gold Glove Awards. He played for the Yankees during their recent resurgence, in which he has earned five World Series rings. He was widely known for his philanthropic work. When he was called upon to act in movies and television, he was able to poke fun of himself. He even played older brother to Minotaur-loving Alex Rodriguez. But what he is mostly known for are his continuous clutch hits and great fielding during the playoffs, so much so that it garnered him the nickname of Mr. November.

Yet, not everyone is sold on Jeter’s prowess on the field. Time and again Jeter found himself playing Johnnie Cochran for his defensive skills, most notably his fielding range. Although he shrugged off the negative criticism as a part of playing in New York, Jeter could never escape it. But, beyond that, what truly made Jeter famous and unforgettable? What put him in the discussion for best shortstop of all time? What made him possibly the most overrated baseball player of all time? In the quickest answer possible – not playing for the Houston Astros.

Coming out of high school, Jeter was a widely known, poised-beyond-his-years shortstop from Michigan. He was the Gatorade High School Player of the Year. He was heavily recruited by Michigan University, and pretty soon he had the caught the eye of most teams drafting in the first round of the MLB Amateur draft. Hal Newhouser, who was a scout with the Houston Astros at the time, was so sure of his future success that he quit his job with the Astros after they selected Phil Nevin instead of Jeter.

Jeter spent four seasons in the minors, which is somewhat typical for baseball. However, it took him awhile to get his bat going. Also working against him was his defense. In just 126 games, he committed 56 errors and owned an embarrassingly low .889 fielding percentage – which is the equivalent of typing with gloves on. However, even with his awful mitten defensive skills, Jeter still took home the league’s award for best defensive shortstop. The receipt of that award became a disturbingly annoying trend to many in the sabremetric field.

Upon reaching the majors, Jeter did have to play in front of raucous New York crowds. And not only that, when on the road – and even though there are displaced Yankee fans across the country – they still were the Evil Empire when walking into a stadium. But, nonetheless, he played on the Yankees. He had protection everywhere he turned. In the lineup, he got to hit in front of guys like Bernie Williams, Paul O’Neill, Tino Martinez, Jorge Posada, Jason Giambi, Gary Sheffield, Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, Robinson Cano, Hideki Matsui and a plethora of veterans giving it their last shot as part timers (including Tim Raines, Todd Zeile, David Justice, Glenallen Hill, and so on). Obviously, the pockets were lined deep in New York. And Jeter reaped the benefits. In the end, who would you rather pitch to? Derek Jeter or a roided up Jason Giambi with Jeter possibly on? It’s an easy answer, statistically or not.

Whether you want to believe Jeter was the benefactor of a ridiculous lineup for nearly two decades is up to you. Some of those seasons he had 40+ home run guys hitting in the lower third of the Yankees’ lineups. And yet with all of that help behind him, and netting 700+ plate appearances in 10 different seasons – five of which he led the league – Jeter only led the league in runs one time. Once. He led the league in hits just two times. He never accumulated 100+ walks. He never led the league in any other major statistical category. Combine that with the fact that Jeter has had only one season in which his UZR rating, which measures the amount of runs you save your team, was above zero, it’s amazing to know that he still finished in the top ten of MVP voting eight different times. Bill James even famously once said Jeter was “the most ineffective defensive player in the major leagues, at any position.” To put it politely, Jeter as an anomaly in the sabermetric community.

But Jeter also was more than just the Paris Hilton of baseball. He didn’t inherit a wealth of statistics and awards because of the players that followed him in the lineup. He still had to perform. He still ranks 10th all time on the hits list. And more often than not, he performed better on the big stage than in the regular season. This is how he earned his other nickname – Captain Clutch. He is currently sitting at a postseason slash line of .308/.374/.465, which is nearly identical to his career statistics. He has numerous notable postseason plays that players could only wish for. Yet, some could argue that anyone with a season’s worth of postseason games under their belt will probably have one or two of these standout plays. Healthy consistency was another benefit afforded to Jeter. But is that not a sign of greatness?

According to Baseball Reference’s Similarity Score, Jeter compares most closely to Craig Biggio. If you remember, Biggio was up for the Hall of Fame this year and failed to make it. No one argues Biggio’s greatness, but he didn’t get in. Yet, Jeter will get in his first time around. And he’ll get in with ease. That’s the disparity between playing in Houston and playing in New York. In one city you win multiple championships, date Hollywood actresses, and garner top-10 MVP votes – in the other, you may get a barbecue named after you.

To combat the stat geeks, Jeter does own the 21st best offensive career WAR. He’s sandwiched on that list by Jimmie Foxx and Eddie Matthews. And the only people sitting above him on that list with fewer seasons played are Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams, and Mickey Mantle. But it’s hard to look past the help he received offensively in the lineup behind him. It’s hard to ignore the deep pockets of the Yankees, which afforded Jeter with relief in the form of 15+ game winners, veteran bench depth, the best closer of all time, and intelligent managers – all of which are necessary for long postseason runs. So even though Jeter’s career aligned with the aforementioned Yankee resurgence, he wasn’t necessarily the catalyst.

In short, is Derek Jeter overrated? Absolutely. Statistically compared to other Hall of Fame shortstops, he barely cracks the top 15 all time. Had he not played for nearly two decades for the winningest team of all-time (of any sport) he’d be lower on the list. But, is he better than Craig Biggio?

Absolutely. He performed in the postseason the same as he did in the regular season, if not better. And he did so with consistency over an extended period of time. However, he did so with help. And lots of help. So, how overrated is Derek Jeter? Very. But with a caveat. Due to how he is heralded in the baseball community, Jeter is definitely one of the most overrated baseball players of all time.
I thought WAR was the end all be all of the stat geek? Now, this guys telling me he's the 21st best of all time but still overrated?

Jeter was a great player for a great team during a period when a franchise that had gotten a rep of mucking things up did thing right. How can he be the overrated?
If you want to talk WAR, his -9.2 career dWAR is the lowest of any shortstop ever.
Goes to show you how important defense is to the overall game
When it comes to SS...you want supreme defense and if they can hit .270 and steal you some bases your thrilled.

Jeter is a legend. Great defense, terrific hitter. One of the best ever. Does anyone really doubt this?

 
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Northern Voice said:
Todem said:
When it comes to SS...you want supreme defense and if they can hit .270 and steal you some bases your thrilled.

Jeter is a legend. Great defense, terrific hitter. One of the best ever. Does anyone really doubt this?
Umm... Yes.
Right now and very recently...yeah average. In his prime? Heck of a defensive SS. But his bat is what separates him from a lot of SS's. I am not saying better than Yount, or Cal, but he is right up there with some of the best all time SS's. Plus his consistently great post season play is huge.

 
Northern Voice said:
Todem said:
When it comes to SS...you want supreme defense and if they can hit .270 and steal you some bases your thrilled.

Jeter is a legend. Great defense, terrific hitter. One of the best ever. Does anyone really doubt this?
Umm... Yes.
Right now and very recently...yeah average. In his prime? Heck of a defensive SS. But his bat is what separates him from a lot of SS's. I am not saying better than Yount, or Cal, but he is right up there with some of the best all time SS's. Plus his consistently great post season play is huge.
No. He has always been a below average defensive player, who people think is more than that because of a couple plays in the playoffs, and jump-throws.

 
Todem said:
I love Jeter. Love his game, love his approach, love his grit, love his leadership and clutch play in the post season.

But if he played in Kansas City or Pittsburgh he would not get all this attention. It's a product of being "The Captain" for the New York freaking Yankees.

So of course he is going to be percieved by some as "overrated".

But Jeter is one of the best SS in the history of game. It's not a glamour hitting position. But he sure was a heck of a hitter in the clutch moments throughout his career. Defensively in his prime...almost second to none. They don't make them like this that often. 20 years, one club. That's old school baseball.

Great player. But yeah...more hype due to where he plays.
Totally agree, but at the same time the fact he was able to perform and be the anchor in NY counts for something as well, many a great player recently (ie. Randy Johnson, Knoblauch, Burnett, Kenny Rogers, Javier Vazquez) have wilted under the pressure of playing as a Yankee. You may not agree, it may not even make sense, but there is more expected rightly or wrongly. Some like Reggie Jackson and Ricky Henderson thrived on it, others like Munson, Mattingly and Jeter were able to lead others. I don't know how anyone could argue he isn't a top 20 overall player and top 5 SS of his generation. Add the titles and leadership in NY to that and you have what makes him who he is.

 

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