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Laurence Maroney vs. DeAngelo Williams (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Rev
- Start date
Couch Potato
Footballguy
I go with Maroney. Boney Williams just isn't as much fun to say.
Boston
Footballguy
I think you need to look at Foster's contract in detail. Does anyone know the actual numbers Carolina is on the hook for? The reason for this is Foster is still young and I know the funny money part of his deal is good money. Therefore that's a potential issue for William's playing time. On the flipside Dillon is probably nearing the end and Maroney is set up to be the Patriot workhorse. One thing to remember about the Pats...while they spread the ball around in the air they ride a RB hard on the ground.
Couch Potato
Footballguy
That's really the key here for me. Carolina seems to like to divide the workload more, even if all backs are healthy.
The Man Who Met Andy Griffith
Footballguy
Hmm... When the Pats had A Smith, they spread it around. When they had Dillon, they rode him.
When the Panthers had S Davis, they rode him. When they had D Foster & N Goings, they spread it around.
I sense a pattern.
cstu
Footballguy
DeAngelo appears to be in a worse situation with Maroney likely getting the starting job by next year, but DeAngelo reminds me a lot of Emmitt as well as Cadillac.
I don't want to talk him up too much since the first post I ever made about him was last year's bowl game where he broke his leg, but I think has everything he needs to be a great NFL back.
I don't want to talk him up too much since the first post I ever made about him was last year's bowl game where he broke his leg, but I think has everything he needs to be a great NFL back.
Boston
Footballguy
Disagree about Antowain. In 01 when he played very well he had 287 carries to Faulk at 41. Also, Antowain pretty much did that in only 14 games since he didn't have the job early. In 02 when he didn't play that well he still outcarried Faulk 252-52. In 03 the Pats RB situation was a mess and there was no primary RB although they leaned on Antowain late when his game picked up. When Dillon was healthy and productive in 04 he had 345 carries to Faulk's 54. Last year injuries made the RB position messy although Dillon still had 209 carries in a limited capacity.The bottomline is if the Pats have a legit #1 RB they use him as a workhorse in the running game.
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FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
I like Williams and I don't have it all that close. First of all just watching the two I think DeAngelo is a much better RB. Maroney screamed overrated to me in college as that Minnesota system opened up giant holes. I never really saw the guy breaking tackles or making guys miss on a consistent basis, the first guy he met in the open field often brought him down.
That said, he showed good vision, acceleration, speed, and power and I think that bodes well for what the Patriots want from their RBs (Dillon is a similar type runner....not flashy but rather just gets the job done. I do think Dillon does a much better job of breaking tackles, but Maroney is faster).
Situation wise I like both. Foster is young sure, but word around here is that his contract is structured to make it cap friendly to cut him after a year. Dillon is old so Maroney should step in next year or the year after that, but with the frequency of Foster injuries we could see Williams in there a lot faster. Personally I think that with DeAngelo's talent and Carolina's system once he gets the chance Foster is never getting it back.
That said, he showed good vision, acceleration, speed, and power and I think that bodes well for what the Patriots want from their RBs (Dillon is a similar type runner....not flashy but rather just gets the job done. I do think Dillon does a much better job of breaking tackles, but Maroney is faster).
Situation wise I like both. Foster is young sure, but word around here is that his contract is structured to make it cap friendly to cut him after a year. Dillon is old so Maroney should step in next year or the year after that, but with the frequency of Foster injuries we could see Williams in there a lot faster. Personally I think that with DeAngelo's talent and Carolina's system once he gets the chance Foster is never getting it back.
Ozymandias
Footballguy
I don't know. Maroney's name opens him up to Phoney Maroney taunts. Deangelo Williams is harder to diss.
But the Pats know their stuff. I think I'll go with Maroney.
But the Pats know their stuff. I think I'll go with Maroney.
Couch Potato
Footballguy
Good point Ozy. I just drafted Phoney Maroney and now you have me worried.
Tommy Collins
Footballguy
Foster, DeShaunView Stats at Players Inc Site
Player Info
Draft Info
RB (#)
Year: 2002
Carolina Panthers
Round: 2
Tustin, CA
Position: 2
Salary History
2006 1000000.00
2007 4250000.00
2008 4750000.00
Aussie Cowboy
Footballguy
On the other hand, "Lo-Mo" is a pretty sweet nickname.
I think they're even. Both are in situations that are great for each. I wanted maroney, because of the size/speed combo, but with the Pats on the clock, I would have been happy with either, or even Chad Jackson, so a good day for me.
Williams is definitely shiftier. But, Maroney is stronger. Maroney is Dillon at a younger age, with a bit more speed.
I'd tip the scales to Maroney, but I think any difference will be minute.
Williams is definitely shiftier. But, Maroney is stronger. Maroney is Dillon at a younger age, with a bit more speed.
I'd tip the scales to Maroney, but I think any difference will be minute.
Ted the Caver
Footballguy
The Patriots have proven to be one of the best run organizations in the league. Sure, NFL personnel people have make mistakes time and again, but I've got to go with BB over what my fellow football fans think.
rabidfireweasel
Footballguy
What is equally important, or more important, is his signing bonus- which is 4.5 million. 1.5 goes against the cap this year. Next year they can keep him or cut him for a 1 million dollar cap savings (however this does create 3 million in dead money.) In 2008, the Panthers are in a great situation. If Williams is a bust, they can keep foster. If he is a success, they will likely cut him and save 3.25 million against the cap.
mightyeskimo
Footballguy
IMHO. The Pats never "rode" Antowain. Smith never amassed over 300 carries once. That's the definition of "riding a back". Anything less is spreading it around. Dillon in 2004 was "rode". Antowain, while doing his job well, was just part of a spread it around attack. If Maroney can produce than Bill will give him the rock 300 plus and he'll be great fantasy wise. As to the main question of this topic, I like DeAngelo. He's a lot tougher than people give him credit for and if given the job he'll not only get the rock 300 times in a season but he'll be in a run heavy offense that, if he's really "rode", might take him to 350 plus carries. Which, would make him an easy for top 5 fantasy back.
Rev
Footballguy
1. I don't think we can expect NE to start Moroney in 2007. As long as Dillon is healthy and not retired, Moroney will at best share touches with him, Faulk, and Pass.
2. I don't think Foster will outlast Dillon, even being 26 years old to Dillon's 31. As, a proven stud, Dillon could bounce back with a 1500 yard season and hang around for 2 or 3 more years... meanwhile, Foster could trip on his shoelace and miss 14 games this season.
3. I think Foster could be far easier to beat out than Dillon, even though he's way younger. Shelton didn't work out, so the Panthers see their new feature back in Williams. No way do they draft a stud like DW to share carries with Foster. When they drafted DW, Foster became insurance at best.
4. How could someone with the 1.2 rookie pick pass on a talented and successful player like Williams in a situation where they simply need Foster to do what he's always done for Williams to shine: get hurt!?
2. I don't think Foster will outlast Dillon, even being 26 years old to Dillon's 31. As, a proven stud, Dillon could bounce back with a 1500 yard season and hang around for 2 or 3 more years... meanwhile, Foster could trip on his shoelace and miss 14 games this season.
3. I think Foster could be far easier to beat out than Dillon, even though he's way younger. Shelton didn't work out, so the Panthers see their new feature back in Williams. No way do they draft a stud like DW to share carries with Foster. When they drafted DW, Foster became insurance at best.
4. How could someone with the 1.2 rookie pick pass on a talented and successful player like Williams in a situation where they simply need Foster to do what he's always done for Williams to shine: get hurt!?
Boston
Footballguy
My definition of spreading it around is having backs who are in the same neighborhood of carries. That has not been the case when the Pats have had productive RB under BB. In 2001 Antowin was a workhorse. He was a backup the first two games and still had 287 carries for the year. I challenge you to find a Pats fan who watches them to say Antowain was not their horse that year.You are confusing the Pats passing attack with their rushing attack. They completely spread it around through the air regardless of how much talent they have. Yet, the same can not be said for the rushing attack since BB took over. When a RB has proved he can handle the load they have rode him. That being said I would not be surprised if that changed in 2006 since both Dillon and Maroney will get plenty of oppportunities if they play well. Having two RBs like this is something they have not had in the past. While Faulk is very productive he is best suited and used best as a third down/change of pace RB. Yet, if all goes according to plan look for Maroney to be the main man in 2007 and beyond.
Our difference in opinion maybe the definition of "riding" a back. If you think that means getting 350 carries than I understand where you are coming from. Yet, there is no doubt that the Pats will use a "primary" ball carrier if BB trusts him. They just don't spread the ball around in that type of situation.
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The Man Who Met Andy Griffith
Footballguy
I was wrong.
Ron_Mexico
I Love Doggies
No Minnesota offensive lineman wasan All-American nor were any drafted
by NFL teams.
Do you really think it's all about the offensive line ?
I think it's more about Maroney's high talent level.
mightyeskimo
Footballguy
That was exactly where I was coming from. The reason I like Williams is because I feel he is more likely to get more 300+ carry seasons, as well as 350+ carry seasons, than Maroney. When I refer to a "spread it around attack" I refer to the offense as a whole. Like we see with the Pats. I agree that, when available, NE (or any other team for that matter) will use a primary rusher if they can get the job done. I also agree that Antowain's performance in 2004 was great. I remember many of those runs and he really had a career high intensity. Imagine what he would have been like for fantasy owners if he had gotten the rock 350 times that year! That is what I see for DeAngelo. Good points!
Rev
Footballguy
C Greg Eslinger to the BroncosG Mark Setterstrom to the Rams
The Gophers had two excellent linemen drafted this year, the better of which was Greg Eslinger who was drafted by the Broncos in the 6th. He recieved the Outland Trophy as the nation's top interior lineman last year. His stature as a small (though lightening quick) lineman led him to be passed over for other linemen with far less achievements but larger frames. The Bronco's got a treat, however, as they like smaller and quicker linemen. Eslinger is a fantastic player and a smart leader who pulled from the center position and opened up holes that a truck could drive through.
Setterstrom was no dud, though, and performed very well for the Gophers. Moroney had a lot of help from these two.
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Phlash
Footballguy
When I watch Maroney run the ball, all I can think of is Edgerin James 2.0. He's pretty much the same back in my mind, but I don't think he'll put up Edgerin type production, although he may come close.
Anyways, I am realllly happy with the Maroney pick. He's going to be a great RB for the Patriots for a loonnnng time.
Anyways, I am realllly happy with the Maroney pick. He's going to be a great RB for the Patriots for a loonnnng time.
nerangers
Footballguy
Try Money Maroney...might make you sleep easier at night!I think Maroney is in a good situation...and we are talking long term here. I wasn't high on him with the reviews I read prior to draft, but if both Coach B and Shanahan like him, he has to be MONEY!
Dillon got just about 350 carries in 2004. I see no reason Maroney won't get that kind of load eventually.
Sopranos
Footballguy
I like Williams Here. Maroney is a great talent. But Car. RB's score alot of tds. Pats besides Brady are not consistant year to year. They dont pass to their workhoes RB often and LM isnt all that when it comes to recieving. I rank. Addai ahead of both of em FF wise. Great offense and he has all the tools and as ran the same 40 as Bush. He just cant cut and move like Bush. But he is top 10 FF Rb for years to come. Anyone can run in this offense...
Sopranos
Footballguy
If Shanny the Rat really liked him he would have got him. He had 2 first rounders before their trade. Im not buying it. IMO they gave too much to get a guy they didnt have to move up for AND didnt need. They made Jake what he was. Dont throw picks...He is a slinger and you cant hold a guy like that back. Their offense was to conservitive IMO.Try Money Maroney...might make you sleep easier at night!I think Maroney is in a good situation...and we are talking long term here. I wasn't high on him with the reviews I read prior to draft, but if both Coach B and Shanahan like him, he has to be MONEY!
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TitusIII
Footballguy
You may as well flip a coin. I like Williams because I believe a RB can put up #1 fantasy back stats in the Carolina system. Brady is a top notch QB, and will steal some TD's. Either way, I'm glad we throw rookies into our fall draft. Hopefully one of the two has siezed the starting job by the end of the exhibition season.
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Jackal
Footballguy
man i am stuck. soon as the draft was over, i thought addai was my man. i really like williams. i like the way he runs, and i like the articles i read about his character. maroney seems to be a little bit bigger of a back and went to a very well run new england team. i think i have since ruled out addai. was'nt ranked very high on a lot of charts. the whole thing about splitting carries with rhodes, however much coachspeak it may be scares me a little, and if you look down the road at the cap situations of all three teams, indy seems to be in the worst of shape. i know the pats have a ton of room under the cap, how about the panthers? how is there cap situation? if it is even somewhat in good shape, i can't see them just cutting foster. he seems cheap enough for me for them to keep around. ii think this is a two man race for me between williams and maroney. and after reading this whole thread, i am still not any closer to making a decision. good points were made for both players. i draft at the end of the month. i have no clue at this point
i have no clue at this pointcarlosnphilly
Footballguy
Would love to answer, but my fantasy team never sucks bad enough to be in contention for the high picks. 
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FrostBite
Footballguy
Trade much?Would love to answer, but my fantasy team never sucks bad enough to be in contention for the high picks.
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Rev
Footballguy
Trade much?Would love to answer, but my fantasy team never sucks bad enough to be in contention for the high picks.
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No kidding. That's how I roll...carlosnphilly
Footballguy
When you win 6 championships in a row, no one wants to trade with you.Trade much?Would love to answer, but my fantasy team never sucks bad enough to be in contention for the high picks.
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gman8343
What would Lemmy do?
When you win 6 championships in a row, no one wants to trade with you.Trade much?Would love to answer, but my fantasy team never sucks bad enough to be in contention for the high picks.
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Ned
Footballguy
When you win 6 championships in a row, no one wants to trade with you.Trade much?Would love to answer, but my fantasy team never sucks bad enough to be in contention for the high picks.
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Jackal
Footballguy
When you win 6 championships in a row, no one wants to trade with you.Trade much?Would love to answer, but my fantasy team never sucks bad enough to be in contention for the high picks.
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BigJim®
Footballguy
Pre-draft I would have marginally preferred DeAngelo because I do think he has the tools and RB instincts to be a good NFL runningback. Post-draft, I'm leaning toward Maroney because I do like his landing spot as it looks like he'll get a better opportunity without needing to compete with other young RBs such as Foster/Shelton. My only complaint of Maroney at the UofM was that he missed a lot of time with a dinged ankle, even while sharing the load. That said, he's definitely got the instincts/speed to play at the next level.
I'll probably change my mind 100 times before the rookie draft, however. Looks like a win/win for teams taking these guys.
I'll probably change my mind 100 times before the rookie draft, however. Looks like a win/win for teams taking these guys.
Captain Spaulding
Footballguy
Lets see....a few months ago we were talking about figuring out if it were Lendale White or D. Williams as the #2 RB in the draft. Mahoney and Addai were determined to be in a tier lower. After bad bench press and a few big mac's White's stock seems to have fallen to 5th place now. Somehow Mahoney has propelled to the #2 competed spot with Williams because he's in NE behind Dillon?
Carolina's defense is much better than NE's (and NE didn't fill many voids via draft either) thus creating many more opportunities for Carolina RB carries on the offensive side. Aside from 1 good season be Dillon in 2004, NE has never been able to show much of a threat running the ball behind their O-line. A. Smith was a workhorse but at 2.0 ypc defenses didn't bother to focus on him.
The debate between Foster and Dillon (who drops dead 1st) is tough call. Dillon is a proven feature back but old and Foster is now entering mid-career but has not proven yet that he can be a feature back.
I say stick with Williams here as the choice, but don't be surprised if the owner who takes Lendale White several picks later gets the best RB of the 3 when its all said an done.
Carolina's defense is much better than NE's (and NE didn't fill many voids via draft either) thus creating many more opportunities for Carolina RB carries on the offensive side. Aside from 1 good season be Dillon in 2004, NE has never been able to show much of a threat running the ball behind their O-line. A. Smith was a workhorse but at 2.0 ypc defenses didn't bother to focus on him.
The debate between Foster and Dillon (who drops dead 1st) is tough call. Dillon is a proven feature back but old and Foster is now entering mid-career but has not proven yet that he can be a feature back.
I say stick with Williams here as the choice, but don't be surprised if the owner who takes Lendale White several picks later gets the best RB of the 3 when its all said an done.
Couch Potato
Footballguy
Funny thing is, I've now had an opportunity to be in a bunch of leagues with FBG posters, including a few who have said this kind of thing in the past. Almost without fail, the braggards are the ones that end up near the bottom. I'm just not impressed with anyone's self-proclaimed supremacy.I don't usually call out specific individuals, but here's one example. We have a guy here called mrharrier. Self-proclaimed expert, posts his dynasty rankings and acts like we all should be so privileged to have them. He joined a 1st-year 14-team MOX dynasty league with me last year, finished dead last at 3-10 (I was 11-2) and quit the league after that initial year (saying he didn't have time, but I know it was because he sucked; he has since joined another initial dynasty league I'm tracking, so he has time), and leaving someone else to clean up last year's dynasty mess. The crime wasn't in having a poor record. That happens. The crime was in being so damn pompous, then bailing when things didn't work out the way he'd expected.When you win 6 championships in a row, no one wants to trade with you.Trade much?Would love to answer, but my fantasy team never sucks bad enough to be in contention for the high picks.
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My friend, the people who post here have varying degrees of knowledge and interest in football, but in general they are sensible and respectful toward one another, and very smart. Many of us are here to find a group with more understanding and sophistication than the crowd you are up against "when you win 6 championships in a row" because those folks ceased being a challenge to us a long time ago. I see that you're fairly new here and I've seen some of your posts in other threads. You'd do well to not be so full of yourself because it just isn't going to impress this crowd.
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TLEF316
Footballguy
every time i watched maroney(like 5 times last year) he was getting brought down in the backfield on a consistent basis, often by DB's. Hell, i dont think i saw a game where the backup(i think his name was russell) didnt out-perform him.
im taking deangelo. He's the better player and the situation is just as good
im taking deangelo. He's the better player and the situation is just as good
jurb26
Footballguy
Double
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I see this group of RBs in this order:1. Bush
2a. Williams
2b. White
4. Maroney
5. Addai
6. Drew
7. Norwood
8. Harrison
9. Calhoun
10. Not really sure who I would put here.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
I'm sorry, but this post just reeks of ignorance...I'm not trying to be mean, I just don't know how else to say it here as it's ignoring something that is obviously accepted.Minnesota runs a similar zone blocking system with smaller linemen, hence the reason they aren't top NFL prospects. They don't fit the NFL mold well, but make no mistake they are superb college linemen in a superb college rushing system. Every expert has acknowledged this.
But really you don't need experts, you need only actually watch a Minnesota game. People love to talk about how Bush had huge holes and didn't have to face up a defender until he got 6 yards downfield. Having watched a good deal of both, the holes in Minnesota were quite a bit larger and Maroney had a lot more room to run that even Bush did. But then again, perhaps you just believe that Gary Russell is legiitmately an 8ypc running back.
I don't deny Maroney has talent, nor do I deny that he seems a good fit for an NFL running back (he's not flashy, not gonna plow guys over, not gonna make highlight moves, but he has great vision and one-cut speed a la Alexander or Edge), but you show me something that doesn't think the running system he played in is one of the best in college football (if not THE best), I'll show you someone who's just flat-out not paying attention.
You can't just say Maroney is overrated because he comes from a top rushing attack. Great running backs can come from great running college teams, it doesn't preclude them being good pros. Marion Barber has certainly shown indications in his first year that it wasn't just the Minnesota line that made him look good. Maroney arguably looked better than Barber when they were both together, so what outcome should you draw from that?A comparison:
Greg Eslinger, Minnesota (6th round) 6'3" 292 lbs
Nick Mangold, Ohio State (1st round) 6'4" 300 lbs
Mark Setterstrom, Minnesota (7th round) 6'4" 314 lbs
Davin Joseph, Oklahoma (1st round) 6'3" 311 lbs.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
I didn't intend to say Maroney was overrated because he comes from a top rushing attack. I intended to say he was slightly overrated based on what I saw of him, and still put up numbers because he came from a top rushing attack.He often went down the first time a defensive player got a shot at him. I very rarely saw him make a guy miss or break a wrap-up tackle. He often got into the open field 1 on 1, a scenario he should win everytime as a top RB, and more often than not he was taken down.
Now keep in mind I'm not saying he's going to bust or anything as I think he's a very good RB, just not the #2 RB out there and is slightly overrated as such. I compared him to Alexander so that's hard to say "bust", but like Alexander he will require a top system/line to be able to use his good vision and while NE is a decent situation, I don't see it as one that is going to open up big holes for him to find.
Just my opinion, based on what I saw of him compared to the other runners (which was quite a bit).
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Boston
Footballguy
As a Pats fan I have no problem saying their O line will be very effective this year. I think it has a chance to be a top of the line unit. Both Light and Koppen will be back from injuries, Neal resigned, both Kazcur and Mankins will be a year older and they have quality backups in Gorin and Hochstein as well as two new drafts picks and some other prospects. Everyone except Koppen and Hochstein is signed for multiple years so this is a group that will stay pretty much intact for a long time and continuity is usually a big plus in this area.
I can easily see why someone may like Williams over Maroney yet I would not use the Pats O line as a reason. Look for the Pats run game to be among the most improved this year and a lot of it will start upfront.
I can easily see why someone may like Williams over Maroney yet I would not use the Pats O line as a reason. Look for the Pats run game to be among the most improved this year and a lot of it will start upfront.
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carlosnphilly
Footballguy
Logic down?You don't find it a bit creepy that you're stalking complete strangers on the Internet? 
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