Dynasty Qb #2 Ranking (1 Viewer)

These are consensus dynasty rankings for year 2007

If you vote other, please specify.

Also, please comment on your vote, and list any player that should be nominated for the next round.

I like the chatter going on in the 1st thread lets keep that going as we vote.

Link to poll #1 http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=291729

1. Peyton Manning

2. Carson Palmer

Palmer won vote. Link to Qb poll #3 http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=291941

For me, it's a tossup between Palmer and Brees. But I picked Brees. I really like the weapons he has and the playcalling in NO. And I have a creeping bad feeling about the future of the Bengals running game. Not that Palmer is a slouch, but I give Brees a narrow edge. Donovan would be right there, but I just don't have confidence in his ability to stay healthy.

pantagrapher said:

For me, it's a tossup between Palmer and Brees. But I picked Brees. I really like the weapons he has and the playcalling in NO. And I have a creeping bad feeling about the future of the Bengals running game. Not that Palmer is a slouch, but I give Brees a narrow edge. Donovan would be right there, but I just don't have confidence in his ability to stay healthy.

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Brees for the reasons I said in the first thread: What pantagrapher said, and the Saints went from one of the worst o-lines in the league to allowing the least number of sacks in the entire league this season.

1.manning

2.palmer

3.brees

Palmer.

I'm a big Brees fan, but I want to see how the Saints do next year and see them prove this season is not just a fluke. Colston could be a one year wonder and Horn will be retired very soon. I have more confidence in CJ, Housh and the Cinci running game over time than I do in the Saints at this point (but that could easily change if the 'Aints keep it up.)

To speed up the process you should just add the next guy to the list if he is the clear #2 in voting. So since Palmer outvoted anyone by more than 25 votes, you should just add him at #2 instead of starting a new thread.

I've seen this done before and it's probably best to do it that way, and leave each thread up for voting for at least 24 hours to get the best idea of everyone's vote.

That said, for the people voting Brees #2, you have no concerns over his shoulder?

Alot of people seemed worried 6 months ago, granted now he's top 5 for sure, but things can change in an instant with one big hit I would think.

I'd feel safer with Brady, or even Hasselbeck, though I think there's a significant dropoff from 2-3.

I still have Eli ahead of Bress in Dynasty formats

Other: Vick

aposulli said:

That said, for the people voting Brees #2, you have no concerns over his shoulder?

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Not to the point that it would alter my ranking. He seems fine to me. And he's getting good protection, which bodes well for any QB.

aposulli said:

To speed up the process you should just add the next guy to the list if he is the clear #2 in voting. So since Palmer outvoted anyone by more than 25 votes, you should just add him at #2 instead of starting a new thread.I've seen this done before and it's probably best to do it that way, and leave each thread up for voting for at least 24 hours to get the best idea of everyone's vote.That said, for the people voting Brees #2, you have no concerns over his shoulder?Alot of people seemed worried 6 months ago, granted now he's top 5 for sure, but things can change in an instant with one big hit I would think.I'd feel safer with Brady, or even Hasselbeck, though I think there's a significant dropoff from 2-3.I still have Eli ahead of Bress in Dynasty formats

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What are you talking about? Isn't Brady on the injury report with a shoulder injury for, what, the 38th straight week! If this is what conserns you, then does Palmer concern you? Hasselbeck is just coming off an injury and he is not 100% healed. And saying Eli ahead of Brees is a joke IMO. I'll make that trade right now. Sometimes surgery makes the structure stronger after it fully heals. Brees has not show any signs of it bothering him. Another year in Payton's offense Brees could have a better year next year.

pantagrapher said:

aposulli said:

That said, for the people voting Brees #2, you have no concerns over his shoulder?

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Not to the point that it would alter my ranking. He seems fine to me. And he's getting good protection, which bodes well for any QB.

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He hasn't shown that it has slowed him down. Are you worried about Palmer's knee?

Palmer.

Can we change the heading to 1b?

I meant to vote Palmer, but hit "null vote" accidentally. Glad to see Carson is running away with the voting without my vote...

ATC1 said:

pantagrapher said:

For me, it's a tossup between Palmer and Brees. But I picked Brees. I really like the weapons he has and the playcalling in NO. And I have a creeping bad feeling about the future of the Bengals running game. Not that Palmer is a slouch, but I give Brees a narrow edge. Donovan would be right there, but I just don't have confidence in his ability to stay healthy.

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Brees for the reasons I said in the first thread: What pantagrapher said, and the Saints went from one of the worst o-lines in the league to allowing the least number of sacks in the entire league this season.

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I went Brees. All things being equal, I'll take the guy that's guarenteed to play indoors 9 weeks a year.

Palmer has better, established weapons and is more of a pro. Brees is short and may be smoke and mirrors.

aposulli said:

To speed up the process you should just add the next guy to the list if he is the clear #2 in voting. So since Palmer outvoted anyone by more than 25 votes, you should just add him at #2 instead of starting a new thread.I've seen this done before and it's probably best to do it that way, and leave each thread up for voting for at least 24 hours to get the best idea of everyone's vote.

Click to expand...

FWIW, I disagree with this. Some people will vote for Brees ahead of Palmer, but it's entirely possible that Brady or McNabb (or perhaps someone else) would win the majority vote when we do #3. (or this type of thing could happen at some other vote.) 24 hours is fine if it isn't a runaway. Biabreakable will run this as he sees fit, but that's how I did it last year. Thanks again to him for doing it.

ATC1 said:

aposulli said:

That said, for the people voting Brees #2, you have no concerns over his shoulder?Alot of people seemed worried 6 months ago, granted now he's top 5 for sure, but things can change in an instant with one big hit I would think.I'd feel safer with Brady, or even Hasselbeck, though I think there's a significant dropoff from 2-3.I still have Eli ahead of Bress in Dynasty formats

Click to expand...

What are you talking about? Isn't Brady on the injury report with a shoulder injury for, what, the 38th straight week! If this is what conserns you, then does Palmer concern you? Hasselbeck is just coming off an injury and he is not 100% healed. And saying Eli ahead of Brees is a joke IMO. I'll make that trade right now. Sometimes surgery makes the structure stronger after it fully heals. Brees has not show any signs of it bothering him. Another year in Payton's offense Brees could have a better year next year.

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Why would I be worried with Brady when he's never missed significant time.Palmer's case, the knee shouldn't come back to haunt him unless someone decides falls into his leg again which is the risk every QB takes (what are the odds of a reoccuring knee injury for a pocket passer?)Hasselbeck is also coming off injuries that shouldn't be long term.Brees is obviously no slouch, but I simply posed a question. I think it's fair considering the issues Pennington has (7 yds per attempt).

-OZ- said:

aposulli said:

To speed up the process you should just add the next guy to the list if he is the clear #2 in voting. So since Palmer outvoted anyone by more than 25 votes, you should just add him at #2 instead of starting a new thread.I've seen this done before and it's probably best to do it that way, and leave each thread up for voting for at least 24 hours to get the best idea of everyone's vote.

Click to expand...

FWIW, I disagree with this. Some people will vote for Brees ahead of Palmer, but it's entirely possible that Brady or McNabb (or perhaps someone else) would win the majority vote when we do #3. (or this type of thing could happen at some other vote.) 24 hours is fine if it isn't a runaway. Biabreakable will run this as he sees fit, but that's how I did it last year. Thanks again to him for doing it.

Click to expand...

My thinking was just that Palmer was the obvious 2... even if some people feel strongly that Brees or anyone else is better, lets be real... the vast majority will go to Palmer, and the 1st vote (for #1) suggested it would go as such.I don't forsee many consensous top 2 vote-getters in future QB threads.

aposulli said:

-OZ- said:

aposulli said:

To speed up the process you should just add the next guy to the list if he is the clear #2 in voting. So since Palmer outvoted anyone by more than 25 votes, you should just add him at #2 instead of starting a new thread.I've seen this done before and it's probably best to do it that way, and leave each thread up for voting for at least 24 hours to get the best idea of everyone's vote.

Click to expand...

FWIW, I disagree with this. Some people will vote for Brees ahead of Palmer, but it's entirely possible that Brady or McNabb (or perhaps someone else) would win the majority vote when we do #3. (or this type of thing could happen at some other vote.) 24 hours is fine if it isn't a runaway. Biabreakable will run this as he sees fit, but that's how I did it last year. Thanks again to him for doing it.

Click to expand...

My thinking was just that Palmer was the obvious 2... even if some people feel strongly that Brees or anyone else is better, lets be real... the vast majority will go to Palmer, and the 1st vote (for #1) suggested it would go as such.I don't forsee many consensous top 2 vote-getters in future QB threads.

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my mistake for thinking you were saying to make Brees #3 automatically. I could agree on Palmer, but discussion for each is a good thing IMO.

Highway Robbery said:

Brees is short and may be smoke and mirrors.

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Yeah, I guess it's been that way for the past 3 years huh?

-OZ- said:

aposulli said:

To speed up the process you should just add the next guy to the list if he is the clear #2 in voting. So since Palmer outvoted anyone by more than 25 votes, you should just add him at #2 instead of starting a new thread.I've seen this done before and it's probably best to do it that way, and leave each thread up for voting for at least 24 hours to get the best idea of everyone's vote.

Click to expand...

FWIW, I disagree with this. Some people will vote for Brees ahead of Palmer, but it's entirely possible that Brady or McNabb (or perhaps someone else) would win the majority vote when we do #3. (or this type of thing could happen at some other vote.) 24 hours is fine if it isn't a runaway. Biabreakable will run this as he sees fit, but that's how I did it last year. Thanks again to him for doing it.

Click to expand...

Palmer seems to be clearly running away with this.I do want to allow enough time so that maximum participation can run its course and ensure that a large spectrum of FF players opinions are represented. I especialy like to hear voters reasoning for thier vote and debate from those who have a differing opinions. And I hope that carries forward in the following polls.I don't think that taking the 2nd highest vote from one poll would be properly representitive of which player deserves to be ranked next however. Because it does not allow for who the majority may have voted for as a second choice. It would only represent the opinion of those who were not in the majority for this poll.To illustrate:At the time of this posting there are 64 votes in favor of Carson Palmer 11 votes for Drew Brees 8 votes for Tom Brady. I have no way of knowing who those 64 voters would vote for as Qb #3 as they have allready voted for Palmer. What if 50 of them vote for McNabb? Then the poll would be flawed if I were to make Drew Brees #3I am sure there will be times that the player who is getting the 2nd most votes in a poll will end up winning the next poll. But that is not neccessarily a foregone conclusion.Another reason I do not see good logic in doing this is because if I remove the votes for Palmer I do not at this time have a clear majority for the next player in line. 11 to 8 is only a 58% to 42% majority and far too small a sample for me to consider that conclusive.In the IDP forum right now I have a vote for the #1 Linebacker that is not conclusive enough for me to close yet. I need more votes there before a decision can be made. The largest support is only 31% at this time. And there are many votes spread to a variety of players. 30% may end up deciding it but I need to see more votes before I can feel comfortable that a majority has been found.As far as my 2 cents on the Palmer vs. Brees debate I think it is important to look at some facts:Carson Palmer 27 years old this month:

+---------------------------------------+-----------------+ | Passing | Rushing |+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+| Year TM | G | Comp Att PCT YD Y/A TD INT | Att Yards TD |+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+| 2004 cin | 14 | 263 432 60.9 2897 6.7 18 18 | 18 47 1 || 2005 cin | 16 | 345 509 67.8 3836 7.5 32 12 | 34 41 1 || 2006 cin | 11 | 228 354 64.4 2869 8.1 21 8 | 18 24 0 |+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+| TOTAL | 41 | 836 1295 64.6 9602 7.4 71 38 | 70 112 2 |+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+

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Drew Brees 27 years old in January:

+---------------------------------------+-----------------+ | Passing | Rushing |+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+| Year TM | G | Comp Att PCT YD Y/A TD INT | Att Yards TD |+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+| 2001 sdg | 1 | 15 27 55.6 221 8.2 1 0 | 2 18 0 || 2002 sdg | 16 | 320 526 60.8 3284 6.2 17 16 | 38 130 1 || 2003 sdg | 11 | 205 356 57.6 2108 5.9 11 15 | 21 84 0 || 2004 sdg | 15 | 262 400 65.5 3159 7.9 27 7 | 53 85 2 || 2005 sdg | 16 | 323 500 64.6 3576 7.2 24 15 | 21 49 1 || 2006 nor | 11 | 276 414 66.7 3469 8.4 19 10 | 27 22 0 |+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+| TOTAL | 70 | 1401 2223 63.0 15817 7.1 99 63 | 162 388 4 |+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+

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Palmer has a higher TD/Interception ratio as well as higher career yards/attempt. Palmer is also playing a more difficult schedule than Brees is this year and the Bengals have been dealing with more adversity in thier offense than the Saints have this year in terms of injuries. The Bengals have been playing most of the year without LT Levi Jones and C Brahm. They have also had all 3 of thier main Wrs miss parts of the season and Chris Perry most of it.I dont mean to take anything away from Brees and he has been a solid Qb for 3 years straight and is still improving with lesser developed weapons of 2 rookies in Bush/Colston and 3rd year Wr Henderson breaking out now that Brees is there. New Orleans certainly has a lot of upside as these young players will likely improve with experience.I would still choose Palmer as he has performed better than Brees has and is more mistake free.There were some people this morning supporting Tony Romo and Rex Grossman as the #1 Qb but I still see no votes for them now that I added. Just checked and Palmer is at 72 votes for out of 96 total votes (75%) I think that is a clear enough majority to move on with Qb #3.

aposulli said:

ATC1 said:

aposulli said:

That said, for the people voting Brees #2, you have no concerns over his shoulder?Alot of people seemed worried 6 months ago, granted now he's top 5 for sure, but things can change in an instant with one big hit I would think.I'd feel safer with Brady, or even Hasselbeck, though I think there's a significant dropoff from 2-3.I still have Eli ahead of Bress in Dynasty formats

Click to expand...

What are you talking about? Isn't Brady on the injury report with a shoulder injury for, what, the 38th straight week! If this is what conserns you, then does Palmer concern you? Hasselbeck is just coming off an injury and he is not 100% healed. And saying Eli ahead of Brees is a joke IMO. I'll make that trade right now. Sometimes surgery makes the structure stronger after it fully heals. Brees has not show any signs of it bothering him. Another year in Payton's offense Brees could have a better year next year.

Click to expand...

Why would I be worried with Brady when he's never missed significant time.Palmer's case, the knee shouldn't come back to haunt him unless someone decides falls into his leg again which is the risk every QB takes (what are the odds of a reoccuring knee injury for a pocket passer?)Hasselbeck is also coming off injuries that shouldn't be long term.Brees is obviously no slouch, but I simply posed a question. I think it's fair considering the issues Pennington has (7 yds per attempt).

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RE:Brady. But when Pennington tried to come back he did not last very long. I think it's ok to say that throwing the ball is not a risk for Brees. Especially since he is throwing the ball more now with the Saints than he ever did with the Chargers.