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"Maurile's Auction Method" VBD baseline (1 Viewer)

fridayfrenzy

fridayfrenzy

Footballguy
This is an issue with myFBG's "Customized Draft Sheet", as well as the Draft Dominator, since both use "Maurile's Auction Method" VBD Baseline. The problem lies with start 2 QB leagues. The draft sheets are basically useless, I am talking about the first 14 of 15 players are all QBs.

I realize the problem lies in the multiplier used for QBs, so how is one supposed to fix this or is this VBD just not equipped for 2 QB leagues.

Can anyone give me a hand on how to use "Maurile's Auction Method" VBD baseline with a 2 QB league.

 
I think the multiplier might be too high, but I'm not sure. I've tested a lot of 2QB leagues, and ever seen one where 14 of the first 15 players are QBs. How many teams in the league, and how many RB and WR starters?

For example, I just tested out a 12-team league with 6-point passing TDs, 1 per 20 passing yards, -1 point per INT, start 2QB/2RB/2WR. I got 10 out of the first 15 as QBs and I'm not sure there's anything wrong with that, given those parameters, although admittedly I'm not sure as that's a pretty weird league and my intuition might be failing me. A league that is exactly the same as the "standard FBG league" but with two QB starters instead of one yields 8 of the top 15 picks as QBs.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Doug Drinen said:
I think the multiplier might be too high, but I'm not sure. I've tested a lot of 2QB leagues, and ever seen one where 14 of the first 15 players are QBs. How many teams in the league, and how many RB and WR starters?For example, I just tested out a 12-team league with 6-point passing TDs, 1 per 20 passing yards, -1 point per INT, start 2QB/2RB/2WR. I got 10 out of the first 15 as QBs and I'm not sure there's anything wrong with that, given those parameters, although admittedly I'm not sure as that's a pretty weird league and my intuition might be failing me. A league that is exactly the same as the "standard FBG league" but with two QB starters instead of one yields 8 of the top 15 picks as QBs.
Click to expand...
10 teams, 2 QB - 2 RB - 3 WR/TE - PK - DEF, 6 pt. TD, 1 per 30 yards, -2 int. My list looked very QB heavy in the 1st couple of rounds as well and I can't agree with that result. Sure maybe 3 in the first couple of rounds but not as many as being presented.
 
MrJimiT said:
Doug Drinen said:
I think the multiplier might be too high, but I'm not sure. I've tested a lot of 2QB leagues, and ever seen one where 14 of the first 15 players are QBs. How many teams in the league, and how many RB and WR starters?For example, I just tested out a 12-team league with 6-point passing TDs, 1 per 20 passing yards, -1 point per INT, start 2QB/2RB/2WR. I got 10 out of the first 15 as QBs and I'm not sure there's anything wrong with that, given those parameters, although admittedly I'm not sure as that's a pretty weird league and my intuition might be failing me. A league that is exactly the same as the "standard FBG league" but with two QB starters instead of one yields 8 of the top 15 picks as QBs.
Click to expand...
10 teams, 2 QB - 2 RB - 3 WR/TE - PK - DEF, 6 pt. TD, 1 per 30 yards, -2 int. My list looked very QB heavy in the 1st couple of rounds as well and I can't agree with that result. Sure maybe 3 in the first couple of rounds but not as many as being presented.
Click to expand...
To be more specific, 10 QB's & 10 RB's for first 20 picks. Hasselbeck, Cutler & Kitna all above Alexander, Rudi Johnson & Laurence Maroney.
 
If I go into the Draft Dominator and start a new league and basically only change the VBD Baseline to Maurile's Auction and change it from 1 QB starter to 2 QB starters....it spits out the following.

1 QB Peyton Manning2 QB Carson Palmer3 QB Tom Brady4 QB Marc Bulger5 QB Drew Brees6 QB Vince Young7 QB Jon Kitna8 QB Tony Romo9 QB Donovan McNabb10 QB Ben Roethlisberger11 QB Jay Cutler12 QB Matt Leinart13 QB Matt Hasselbeck14 QB Philip Rivers15 RB LaDainian Tomlinson16 QB Eli Manning17 QB Michael Vick18 QB Brett Favre19 QB Alex Smith20 QB Steve McNair21 QB J.P. Losman22 QB Chad Pennington23 QB Jason Campbell24 RB Steven Jackson25 QB Jake Delhomme26 QB Matt Schaub27 QB Rex Grossman28 QB Tarvaris Jackson29 QB Byron Leftwich30 RB Larry JohnsonIn the first 30 players, the break down is 27 QBs and 3 RBs. There is something wrong with the baseline when it is producing results like this. This is saying that Byron Leftwich, the 27th QB, has a greater value than Larry Johnson, the 3rd RB and the #1 WR.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
fridayfrenzy said:
If I go into the Draft Dominator and start a new league and basically only change the VBD Baseline to Maurile's Auction and change it from 1 QB starter to 2 QB starters....it spits out the following.

Code: 
1   QB  Peyton Manning2   QB  Carson Palmer3   QB  Tom Brady4   QB  Marc Bulger5   QB  Drew Brees6   QB  Vince Young7   QB  Jon Kitna8   QB  Tony Romo9   QB  Donovan McNabb10  QB  Ben Roethlisberger11  QB  Jay Cutler12  QB  Matt Leinart13  QB  Matt Hasselbeck14  QB  Philip Rivers15  RB  LaDainian Tomlinson16  QB  Eli Manning17  QB  Michael Vick18  QB  Brett Favre19  QB  Alex Smith20  QB  Steve McNair21  QB  J.P. Losman22  QB  Chad Pennington23  QB  Jason Campbell24  RB  Steven Jackson25  QB  Jake Delhomme26  QB  Matt Schaub27  QB  Rex Grossman28  QB  Tarvaris Jackson29  QB  Byron Leftwich30  RB  Larry Johnson
In the first 30 players, the break down is 27 QBs and 3 RBs. There is something wrong with the baseline when it is producing results like this. This is saying that Byron Leftwich, the 27th QB, has a greater value than Larry Johnson, the 3rd RB and the #1 WR.
Click to expand...
Well, actually all QBs have more value due to the starting requirements, but the DD is just a tool. It's showing the importance of the position. If you draft your first QB, then the values would likely change and other positions would move up the list.If you hadn't drafted a QB by the time other QBs were off the board clearly any QB would have much more value than any RB because you are losing so many points.
 
Doug Drinen said:
A league that is exactly the same as the "standard FBG league" but with two QB starters instead of one yields 8 of the top 15 picks as QBs.
Click to expand...
Not for me. I opened DD and started a "New" league and changed it to 2 QBs and got 27 of the first 30 picks as QBs. What am I doing wrong?
 
fridayfrenzy said:
If I go into the Draft Dominator and start a new league and basically only change the VBD Baseline to Maurile's Auction and change it from 1 QB starter to 2 QB starters....it spits out the following.

Code: 
1   QB  Peyton Manning2   QB  Carson Palmer3   QB  Tom Brady4   QB  Marc Bulger5   QB  Drew Brees6   QB  Vince Young7   QB  Jon Kitna8   QB  Tony Romo9   QB  Donovan McNabb10  QB  Ben Roethlisberger11  QB  Jay Cutler12  QB  Matt Leinart13  QB  Matt Hasselbeck14  QB  Philip Rivers15  RB  LaDainian Tomlinson16  QB  Eli Manning17  QB  Michael Vick18  QB  Brett Favre19  QB  Alex Smith20  QB  Steve McNair21  QB  J.P. Losman22  QB  Chad Pennington23  QB  Jason Campbell24  RB  Steven Jackson25  QB  Jake Delhomme26  QB  Matt Schaub27  QB  Rex Grossman28  QB  Tarvaris Jackson29  QB  Byron Leftwich30  RB  Larry Johnson
In the first 30 players, the break down is 27 QBs and 3 RBs. There is something wrong with the baseline when it is producing results like this. This is saying that Byron Leftwich, the 27th QB, has a greater value than Larry Johnson, the 3rd RB and the #1 WR.
Click to expand...
I'm not certain, but I would assume it's showing the importance of the QB position in this league as there are so many points to be had.If I were to guess, afteryou draft your first QB, the list would look significantly different.
 
BLOX said:
I'm not certain, but I would assume it's showing the importance of the QB position in this league as there are so many points to be had.If I were to guess, afteryou draft your first QB, the list would look significantly different.
Click to expand...
Nope, it doesn't change after you have drafted a QB.
 
I think this is a bug (I'll ping Bruce to check) but if you click the "Auction Settings (on/off)" button on the first setup screen, in conjunction with clicking MT's method as your VBD baseline of choice, then it gives a list similar to what my app gives. LJ is 8th and Leftwich is 54th.

 
Doug Drinen said:
I think this is a bug (I'll ping Bruce to check) but if you click the "Auction Settings (on/off)" button on the first setup screen, in conjunction with clicking MT's method as your VBD baseline of choice, then it gives a list similar to what my app gives. LJ is 8th and Leftwich is 54th.
Click to expand...
If I have the Auction setting button clicked "ON", it still gives the exact same draft list.
 
It seems that the multiplier is just to high for 2 QBs using the projections in the DD because the multiplier makes the QB's baseline the 44th QB, which only gets 25 points, therefore all the QBs will have massive value when compared to a measely 25 point baseline.

Using a baseline of the 44th RB is not nearly the amount of dropoff because multiple RBs get into games, but teams generally only have one QB.

Just seems like somewhat of a flaw in the VBD Auction Method, and hence why it sucks that the myFBG only has Maurile's Auction method for the "Customized Draft Sheet". All 2 QB leagues basically don't get to use that feature of myFBG.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
fridayfrenzy said:
It seems that the multiplier is just to high for 2 QBs using the projections in the DD because the multiplier makes the QB's baseline the 44th QB, which only gets 25 points, therefore all the QBs will have massive value when compared to a measely 25 point baseline.Using a baseline of the 44th RB is not nearly the amount of dropoff because multiple RBs get into games, but teams generally only have one QB.
Click to expand...
It's a sorting issue.If you look at the auction values, you'll find that the auction values don't align with the VBD values. I'm showing Tomlinson's auction value at 54.84 and Carson Palmer's at 52.24. Is that what you see? That's the order they should be displaying.
 
fridayfrenzy said:
myFBG.
Click to expand...
MyFBG does not list 27 QBs in the top 30 for a 2QB league.
Player Fant Points Value

1 QB Peyton Manning 349.9 67.6

2 RB LaDainian Tomlinson 333.2 59.5

3 QB Carson Palmer 303.9 55.4

4 QB Tom Brady 302.4 52.2

5 RB Steven Jackson 289.3 49.4

6 QB Marc Bulger 290.1 47.2

7 QB Drew Brees 283.2 43.5

8 RB Larry Johnson 263.8 43.3

9 RB Frank Gore 252.8 40.4

10 QB Jon Kitna 271.9 39.2

11 RB Joseph Addai 241.6 37.6

12 QB Vince Young 270.7 36.7

13 RB Brian Westbrook 236.9 36.1

14 QB Tony Romo 269.1 35.8

15 RB Willie Parker 235.0 35.1

16 QB Jay Cutler 261.6 34.2

17 QB Matt Hasselbeck 260.8 33.6

18 RB Shaun Alexander 217.5 31.2

19 RB Rudi Johnson 215.5 30.3

20 QB Ben Roethlisberger 260.6 29.8

21 RB Laurence Maroney 212.8 29.3

22 QB Donovan McNabb 259.8 29.2

23 QB Matt Leinart 259.8 28.7

24 RB Travis Henry 208.8 28.1

25 WR Steve Smith 204.9 27.9

26 QB Philip Rivers 256.6 27.8

27 RB Reggie Bush 208.7 27.6

28 QB Eli Manning 253.1 27.0

29 RB Maurice Jones-Drew 207.2 26.9

30 QB Michael Vick 251.4 26.3
Click to expand...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
In the Draft Dominator, you can adjust the multipliers for Maurile's VBD Baseline. I agree the 1.8 looks to be too high for 2 QB Starters. I plugged in 1.2 and it looked much better. 1.1 looks good too. (You can modify this on the File - Setup - VBD Baseline tab).

We will check into adjusting the MyFBG baseline for 2 QB Starters along these same lines.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Doug Drinen said:
fridayfrenzy said:
It seems that the multiplier is just to high for 2 QBs using the projections in the DD because the multiplier makes the QB's baseline the 44th QB, which only gets 25 points, therefore all the QBs will have massive value when compared to a measely 25 point baseline.Using a baseline of the 44th RB is not nearly the amount of dropoff because multiple RBs get into games, but teams generally only have one QB.
Click to expand...
It's a sorting issue.If you look at the auction values, you'll find that the auction values don't align with the VBD values. I'm showing Tomlinson's auction value at 54.84 and Carson Palmer's at 52.24. Is that what you see? That's the order they should be displaying.
Click to expand...
That's the auction value, but not what it is sorting as.
 
Doug Drinen said:
fridayfrenzy said:
myFBG.
Click to expand...
MyFBG does not list 27 QBs in the top 30 for a 2QB league.
Player Fant Points Value

1 QB Peyton Manning 349.9 67.6

2 RB LaDainian Tomlinson 333.2 59.5

3 QB Carson Palmer 303.9 55.4

4 QB Tom Brady 302.4 52.2

5 RB Steven Jackson 289.3 49.4

6 QB Marc Bulger 290.1 47.2

7 QB Drew Brees 283.2 43.5

8 RB Larry Johnson 263.8 43.3

9 RB Frank Gore 252.8 40.4

10 QB Jon Kitna 271.9 39.2

11 RB Joseph Addai 241.6 37.6

12 QB Vince Young 270.7 36.7

13 RB Brian Westbrook 236.9 36.1

14 QB Tony Romo 269.1 35.8

15 RB Willie Parker 235.0 35.1

16 QB Jay Cutler 261.6 34.2

17 QB Matt Hasselbeck 260.8 33.6

18 RB Shaun Alexander 217.5 31.2

19 RB Rudi Johnson 215.5 30.3

20 QB Ben Roethlisberger 260.6 29.8

21 RB Laurence Maroney 212.8 29.3

22 QB Donovan McNabb 259.8 29.2

23 QB Matt Leinart 259.8 28.7

24 RB Travis Henry 208.8 28.1

25 WR Steve Smith 204.9 27.9

26 QB Philip Rivers 256.6 27.8

27 RB Reggie Bush 208.7 27.6

28 QB Eli Manning 253.1 27.0

29 RB Maurice Jones-Drew 207.2 26.9

30 QB Michael Vick 251.4 26.3
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Yes, myFBG sorts by the auction value which is a lot better, but still very heavily weighted in QBs and maybe like Bruce said, the multiplier can be looked at.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
fridayfrenzy said:
This is an issue with myFBG's "Customized Draft Sheet", as well as the Draft Dominator, since both use "Maurile's Auction Method" VBD Baseline. The problem lies with start 2 QB leagues. The draft sheets are basically useless, I am talking about the first 14 of 15 players are all QBs. I realize the problem lies in the multiplier used for QBs, so how is one supposed to fix this or is this VBD just not equipped for 2 QB leagues. Can anyone give me a hand on how to use "Maurile's Auction Method" VBD baseline with a 2 QB league.
Click to expand...
Unless they have changed the equations in the last couple years the "engineered constants" being used don't work for 2 QB systems at all.It has been broken for years. I wrote a paper a few years back to show how to correctly derive these values mathematically rather than using engineering constants, but there was no interest from FBG in the slightest.
 
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