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Ryan Grant (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter LBH
- Start date
Burning Sensation
Footballguy
i have him ranked right around Lendale White, somewhere in the mid/late teens. I would not give up a top 4 rookie pick for him, and would unlikely give up a pick from 5-8 either.
LBH
Footballguy
wow really. I thought he looked a lot better than White this year. Would you equate his value to a wr in the 10-15 range? Maybe Im higher than him than most, but I wouldnt trade him for a lot of other proven backs(Mcgahee,Portis come to mind) just because he has shown he is capable of monster games and is really young.
Jeff Tefertiller
Footballguy
Ryan Grant is a player that many dynasty owners appreciate but are hesitant to invest much in. We all agree he looked great and this should continue. But, most Grant owners are having trouble finding willing buyers who are willing to pay much.
I would trade a pick in the 1.05-1.07 range. In startup dynasty drafts this offseason, I expect Grant to be a top twenty pick. I know that is surprising, but there will be at least one in every league that values Grant as a top fantasy back.
I would trade a pick in the 1.05-1.07 range. In startup dynasty drafts this offseason, I expect Grant to be a top twenty pick. I know that is surprising, but there will be at least one in every league that values Grant as a top fantasy back.
LBH
Footballguy
that sounds reasonable. I guess Im the one in my leagues that values him as a top fantasy back. Not many RBs can rush for 200yds and 3tds against a solid defense. Im loving Grants prospects
PranksterJD
Footballguy
Wish I could get that guy to raise his flippin' hand.Right now Grant is a guy who's value on the trade market isn't anywhere close to his upside for someone who already owns him, so he's generally a "hold" by default. Seems like the best time to move him was 6 weeks ago.
Jeff Tefertiller
Footballguy
I think the best time to move him is this summer. He should get more respect the longer the offseason rolls on.
MAC_32
Footballguy
08 Ryan Grant = 06 Willie Parker. Many will be hesitant with him this season and they'll be disappointed they passed on him. Beyond 08, we'll see how next season goes. I haven't compiled my dyno rankings just yet, but I'd likely rank him in the 7-10 range too. I see the Packers utilizing Brandon Jackson a little more to keep Grant fresh, but it'll be his show next year. With the emergence of DeShawn Wynn last year Morency is gone and in the event of a Grant injury a Jackson/Wynn committee would emerge.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
I don't really know what the organization will do this off-season. I fully expect Grant to be the opening day starter but there are no guarantees. I was somewhat surprised last off-season when the club decided to trade a very popular player in Samkon Gado for Morency. Also, given depth at RB in this years draft, I won’t be shocked if they add another back.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
The Grant owner has offered me Grant + rookie pick 2.08 (20 overall) for Portis in one league.
I am not even close to taking that.
Grant isn't a sure thing and I also think Jackson could be in the mix there.
It is interesting enough for me to consider it as a initial low ball offer and look at what else I would need to mitigate the risk I would be taking on however. Still thinking about that.
I am not even close to taking that.
Grant isn't a sure thing and I also think Jackson could be in the mix there.
It is interesting enough for me to consider it as a initial low ball offer and look at what else I would need to mitigate the risk I would be taking on however. Still thinking about that.
Iwannabeacowboybaby!
Footballguy
You are either really high on this guy or you're not. I don't see a reason why he shouldn't be a top 7 back next year, I really don't.
So, I guess I'm in the high category. If I'm drafting 7 or higher next year, I'm targeting Grant. Green Bay should be tough again next year and what I saw out of Grant the last 1/2 of the season was what I think Green Bay will try and do again next season.
I really don't know why people are trying to shop him around because you're not going to get anyone worth his value and if you trade him for some numbered rookie pick it puts you in a position to have to draft someone in my opinion that's going to be in the top 10 RB's.
Any rookie RB would be hard pressed to do that.
So, I guess I'm in the high category. If I'm drafting 7 or higher next year, I'm targeting Grant. Green Bay should be tough again next year and what I saw out of Grant the last 1/2 of the season was what I think Green Bay will try and do again next season.
I really don't know why people are trying to shop him around because you're not going to get anyone worth his value and if you trade him for some numbered rookie pick it puts you in a position to have to draft someone in my opinion that's going to be in the top 10 RB's.
Any rookie RB would be hard pressed to do that.
I think one reason behind hestitancy is that he was a ww pickup in leagues at mid-season and now guys want a top 4 rookie, top WR or nice RB back. Does not seem right
In one dynasty league, a guy payed the 32nd pick overall to move up in waivers and get him. I offered Torry Holt and Malcolm kelly for Ryan Grant and Matt Ryan in .5 reception and the counter was Grant for Boldin, Kelly and Fred Davis.
I looked at the Holt offer as TO for Rudi Johnson, 3 or 4 years ago. The guy would have asked for the same(he owns Rudi) and the TO part handily won that deal. The counter is just insanity as I dont trade Boldin for Grant and Ryan. But than I am a big believer that WR can help you win championships especially in PPR, and proved it this year.
In one dynasty league, a guy payed the 32nd pick overall to move up in waivers and get him. I offered Torry Holt and Malcolm kelly for Ryan Grant and Matt Ryan in .5 reception and the counter was Grant for Boldin, Kelly and Fred Davis.
I looked at the Holt offer as TO for Rudi Johnson, 3 or 4 years ago. The guy would have asked for the same(he owns Rudi) and the TO part handily won that deal. The counter is just insanity as I dont trade Boldin for Grant and Ryan. But than I am a big believer that WR can help you win championships especially in PPR, and proved it this year.
Banger
Footballguy
Agree totally.Basically to me it comes down to if you believe he's going to be the starter. If he is, he is going to be money. The Packers have no significant free agents so essentially the entire team will stay in tact so that consistency should bode well next well. One thing to keep in mind though, Grant's schedule when he stepped in as a starter was the easiest in the league. He certainly played well in those games and had a nice game vs. a tough Minn defense but I think anyone using his 1/2 year stats and doubling them may be disappointed.
MAC_32
Footballguy
I'd rank Portis and Grant in the same tier in a dyno. This is not a deal I'd accept, but certainly one I'd pursue. I'd counter with a 1st round rookie pick instead of the 2nd he initially asked for and see what he says. Portis is older, has more miles, is on a re-building offense, and was less productive than Grant in 07.
BigJim®
Footballguy
He's currently untradable for this exact reason.
Warhogs
Footballguy
I agree with others that it is more of a mental thing for people because he was a free agent pickup for most people. The same thing could probably be said for Priest Holmes or Rudi Johnson when they burst upon the scene. Grant will need to have another solid season next year before people will be willing to rank him appropriately so he very well could be a great buy for this next year.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Grant is 25 Portis is 27. So 2 years difference in age. I don't believe in the workload/carries argument of that being a negative for the RB getting the workload unless it is extreme in one season (over 400 rushing attempts before counting receptions). In fact a RB who has handled a larger workload and been successful compared to a RB who has not is actually a positive from my perspective. Grant hasn't proven he can handle a full workload over an entire season yet while Portis has proven this year after year.Grant has been stuffed by the KC 2.9 YPC, Rams 3.1 YPC, Giants 2.2 YPC At this point I see Grant as more of a matchup type RB while Portis is a must start regardless of the opponent.Grant may have compitition for carries while Portis clearly will not when healthy.Not saying Grant isn't a good prospect. Just think he is far from being in the same tier as Portis is.
LBH
Footballguy
I think Grants competition for carries is less than Portis. Betts is more of a factor than Wynn or Jackson imo
Banger
Footballguy
The selective YPC stats are great. Take a look at Portis's #'s...2.38 AZ, 2.45 NE, 3 Dal, 2 Buff, 2.11 Chi, 2.6 Sea. You have to take a look at the overall picture and for the year Portis had a 3.88 and Grant a 5.1. Do I think that Grant has more talent than Portis? No, Do I think that Grant (assuming he's the starter) has a better surrounding/opportunity? Definitely yes. What makes you think that Grant will have competition for carries? After he became the starting back (not including the last game where he played one qtr.) the Pack had 200 carries and Grant had 174 of them (87%) while Portis for the year had 325 of 446 carries (72%). Looks like Portis is more likely to share his carries, specifically with Betts and short yardage with Sellers, than Grant is.
MAC_32
Footballguy
You have to factor in the workload too, not just age. Grant's 2 years younger and 5 years less as a featured RB than Portis. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying Portis is due to break down, I was one of the Portis supporters before last season, but the average useful life of an NFL RB is 5 years and Portis is crossing that line right now. He has another year or two in him, but beyond that? I'm not expecting it.Grant showed no signs of wearing down through 12 full games, sure there's four more on a full season's slate I'm just saying he was fine through 12 and was showing no signs of wearing down anytime soon. Him holding up through four more games is a risk I'm willing to accept.Grant was held to less than 3.5 YPC in three of the 12 games he played, Portis was held to less than 3.5 YPC eight of the 17 games he played. I don't see how Grant's low YPC in those three games you mentioned is relevant when comparing the two.Neither Grant nor Portis are in a competition for carries. Based on what evidence can you say Grant's in a competition?
sho nuff
Footballguy
So you would have sat him against Minnesota?Yes...wow...he was "stuffed" by KC and the Rams (so 2 games...but he still had 55 and a TD against the Rams...and added about 37 yards receiving against KC. Also notice, the Packers passed the ball much more in those games (all RBs will have some bad games...even portis did)...please don't bring up the Giants game as any indication of what he will do though.
phthalatemagic
Footballguy
Wynn had some excellent games before his injury. I don't see why McCarthy would not want him to get the ball 5-10 times per game next year.
Banger
Footballguy
I don't know about excellent. For the year he avg'd 4.06 ypc. He had 2 decent games 10-50-2 vs. the Giants in the week 2 when they were horrible and 13-78-1 vs. Chi in week 5. Other than that there's not much there.
phthalatemagic
Footballguy
He only had 10 and 13 carries in those games. I'd say that was excellent.
Banger
Footballguy
I wouldn't. If that's excellent Tatum Bell and Norwood are stars. I'd say that's decent. Why didn't he get more carries then? In week 2 he carried the ball 10 of 27 carries, then went silent for 2 weeks, then in week 5 he got 13 carries and Morency got 9. Even in those "best games" he only had 46% of the carries. Wynn is a Ladell Betts smokescreen.
hoofnstang
Footballguy
Just this week I moved Grant (1 yr contract) and Favre (RFA) for Addai (4 yr contract) and Campbell (2 yr contract) in a dynasty. Some serious man love for GBP players on his part.
Warhogs
Footballguy
The part I don't like about your argument is we heard the same argument about Betts compared to Portis a year ago and Betts actually was pretty excellent.
Banger
Footballguy
wow. How wasted was he when he made the move?
Deals don't get much better than that.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Oh I am definitly looking at the big picture here. Small sample sizes vs. a large body of work.In my league Portis finished as RB 5. Grant RB 15.Grant got substantial duty following the Packers week 7 bye. 12 total games as a starter including playoffs out of 18 total games. I will take out the week 17 game vs. the Lions because he was rested in that game although it looks like to me he would have had a solid day that day.at Broncos 22 104 0 3 7 at Chiefs 19 55 0 4 37 vs Vikings 25 119 1 0 5 20 vs Panthers 20 88 0 1 2 at Lions 15 101 1 0 6 31 vs Cowboys 14 94 2 0 1 4 vs Raiders 29 156 1 0 2 6 at Rams 18 55 1 1 2 5 at Bears 14 100 1 0 1 9 vs Lions 6 57 1 0 So what you have is a RB who is fresh in the middle half of the season coming in and doing well. Yet he still got stymied in 3 out of the 12 games (25%) against defenses (except the Giants) that are not top D's. That does make me wonder a bit. The Vikings Seattle (iffy) and Cowboys were the only strong defenses he did well against. I am not saying Grant is not a good prospect. I think he is. Just that he doesen't have a large body of work that I can consider reliable over a full season like Portis does. I allready know that if Portis has a down game (or 2) that he will still be the man. I don't neccessarily know that about Grant. If Grant struggles there is a possibility that the Pack will use Jackson more. It is a risk.I do like the Packers supporting cast (Oline and passing game) better than I like the Redskins though. And that is a positive in Grants favor moving forward.However part of my questions about Grant vs. Portis is about pure talent also. I know Portis has talent and will be a starting RB regardless of the team and circumstances around him. I cannot say that about Grant right now. I happen to think the Packers Oline blocked outstanding for him in many of those games (based off of what I watched). Also oposing defenses had to focus on Favre and the WRs much more than they had to focus on the Redskins passing game. It is easy for me to see another RB (like Jackson) having similar success behind that line and under those circumstances.I am not saying the 2 players do not deserve comparison. But I do not have Grant in the same tier as Portis because I see Grant carrying much more risk than Portis who is a proven player. For me I like to mitigate risk (and my team situation warrants that right now as well) so I would need more insurance (value in trade) to consider taking that risk on than the Grant owner is offering me.
LBH
Footballguy
for me, the risk of Grants small sample size vs Portis consistancy is offset by Grants upside
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mozzy84
Footballguy
as a vikes fan is pains me to say the pack have found there running back imo. After watching him play alot last year I just don't see any weaknesses that are going to put him to the bench. The guys behind him have weaknesses also and are just not as good as him, which bodes well fantasy wise in this day of rbbc.
Keys Myaths
Pokerguy
1. RBs break down at 29-31. Age is MUCH more of a factor than number of carries.2. Grant has only done his thing through 12 games. There have been many other running backs that have impressed in that timespan and have dropped off. Julius Jones, Kevin Jones and Kevan Barlow just to name a few. Portis is running very well, behind a good OL in a running system in the prime of his career. Taking Grant before him is a huge risk that I wouldn't take.
Banger
Footballguy
I agree with a lot of what you said. Pure talent, Portis - no doubt in my mind. I also agree that he has less replacement risk and this is the key to the entire situation IMO. There's no denying that Portis is more accomplished and has a longer track record. Picking and choosing ypc or performances is meaningless to me. Grant did better against Minn than any back in the league I believe so having a couple below average games against some teams comes with the territory. Some of those same good defenses that Grant did well against, Portis got snuffed (Dal/Sea). It happens.Portis has also had knee issues that concern me. I know it was overblown last offseason but it could be an issue going forward. Also, the Skins don't have a coach or offensive philosophy at this point and although I'm sure that Portis will be a centerpiece, there is uncertainty there. Grant's situation will be identical to last year and there's value in that.To me it boils down to Portis's talent vs. Grant's opportunity. Grant will be on a balanced offense with a strong defense which will enable him to get a large # of carries each game. He averaged 19.4 carries in games he started last year which was about the same as Portis but he will have many more goal line opportunities due to the offense he plays on. Given the choice in a redraft, given the information we have in front of us now, they are essentially a coin toss IMO. I might go with Portis due to my conservative drafting nature but Grant has more upside.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
While there is uncertainty with the direction the Redskins will go right now I don't think it matters for Portis because Portis is going to be a bell cow even if unexpectedly Portis gets traded to another team. We have seen Portis be a square peg in a round hole before and he still performed (although not up to his potential).
In my eyes Portis still has the upside to be the #1 RB in the league if everything worked out in his favor. I don't see Grant having that same upside.
So really no matter how I slice it Portis is in another tier than Grant. If I were taking a long term view in Dynasty then the 2 years might matter to me and I might be willing to take on the risk of Grant (especially since I am building for the future anyways and poor performance of my team will help my draft picks next year). But even in that scenario I would need more value in return for Portis than the Grant owner has offered me. I am pretty confident that if I were selling Portis with moves towards the future in mind I could find a better deal than Grant + pick 20 in 2008 for him.
In my eyes Portis still has the upside to be the #1 RB in the league if everything worked out in his favor. I don't see Grant having that same upside.
So really no matter how I slice it Portis is in another tier than Grant. If I were taking a long term view in Dynasty then the 2 years might matter to me and I might be willing to take on the risk of Grant (especially since I am building for the future anyways and poor performance of my team will help my draft picks next year). But even in that scenario I would need more value in return for Portis than the Grant owner has offered me. I am pretty confident that if I were selling Portis with moves towards the future in mind I could find a better deal than Grant + pick 20 in 2008 for him.
cstu
Footballguy
They are only 15 months apart in age.
One 16 team league, dealt Hackett/3.04 for Grant/Keith(addai handcuff)/3.01. I was deep at WR, and figured it was a steal.
In another league, I was offered Chambers/Cotch/Shockey for Grant/J.King/M.Lawson. Need the WR depth, but still haven't finished talks.
So i was buying low in one league and trying to sell high in another, only reason i am selling is i already got LT/LJ/Westbrook, so no use for him and need another top WR or two.
In another league, I was offered Chambers/Cotch/Shockey for Grant/J.King/M.Lawson. Need the WR depth, but still haven't finished talks.
So i was buying low in one league and trying to sell high in another, only reason i am selling is i already got LT/LJ/Westbrook, so no use for him and need another top WR or two.
cstu
Footballguy
That's not even enough for me. I like Cotchery as well, but I'm not that high on Chambers because of the Chargers offense. Maybe with a different WR than Chambers and only then if I really needed a TE.
In a 1 Keeper league, I am strongly considering Ryan Grant over Frank Gore. Am I being hasty?
Grants breakout season resembles Gores rook season from the points aspect. Not necessarily the run n catch aspect Gore brings/brought to the table. But the overall weekly consistent fantasy points with solid yards and tds is undeniable. And more importantly he looked great with my own eyes. Grant looked great on the field and probably could have done more damage.
Gore is my #1, but Grant is getting a HARD look. Keeper turnover is fairly common in my league. 6 years I have gone through Ricky Williams(passed on Charlie Garner), Dom Davis(passed on Steven Davis), Lamont Jordan & Gore(passed on Marion Barber & Ronnie Brown). Not bad. Sticking my neck out for Grant, should he flop or lose his job, shouldn't be too difficult to recover from.
Grants breakout season resembles Gores rook season from the points aspect. Not necessarily the run n catch aspect Gore brings/brought to the table. But the overall weekly consistent fantasy points with solid yards and tds is undeniable. And more importantly he looked great with my own eyes. Grant looked great on the field and probably could have done more damage.
Gore is my #1, but Grant is getting a HARD look. Keeper turnover is fairly common in my league. 6 years I have gone through Ricky Williams(passed on Charlie Garner), Dom Davis(passed on Steven Davis), Lamont Jordan & Gore(passed on Marion Barber & Ronnie Brown). Not bad. Sticking my neck out for Grant, should he flop or lose his job, shouldn't be too difficult to recover from.
Arm Chair Express
Footballguy
Don't forget Samko Gado, who a lot of people on this board thought was the next big thing in GB.
Wow. My initial reaction is completely different. I take this deal in a second. Jeff King is a backup TE period. You get one of the top TE's in Shockey. Chambers or Cotch should outscore Grant especially in PPR. Chambers is only 30 and with one of the best O's in the league. How anyone is still down on this guy watching him since he went to SD is beyond me. Cotch is a good asset to get on top of this. And the only extra thing it costs you is a D player. I would be all over this deal if offered in the only league where I own Grant.
Banger
Footballguy
The situations are totally different.
That was my first thought. But I dont' need Shockey(got Witten) and would only be starting either Cotch or Chambers to go along with Braylon. So i am getting one WR that would crack my lineup, that is why i am hesitant to do this. I think I can get a better WR for either Grant or LJ. But for Grant, I believe it was a pretty solid offer.
Banger
Footballguy
I don't know your league, rules or rosters but I don't like that at all. You get no solid guys back for a RB that's potentially top 10. It fills spots but that's about it. Chambers is what a #20 at best, Cotchery #15 at best and Shock is about a 7-10 TE. I would rather go for one or two solid guys than a bag of rocks.
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duece2626
Footballguy
I've been offered Housh/Norwood/Dunn/'09 2nd for Grant/Crayton/'09 1st.
Thoughts?
My RB (can start 3) SJax, McGahee, Grant
My WR (can start 3-5) Colston, Roddy, Mason, Walker, Crayton, Clayton, J.Jones, M.Jones, Meachem.
Scoring: 1pt per catch, 1pt per 10yds, 6pts TD.
Thoughts?
My RB (can start 3) SJax, McGahee, Grant
My WR (can start 3-5) Colston, Roddy, Mason, Walker, Crayton, Clayton, J.Jones, M.Jones, Meachem.
Scoring: 1pt per catch, 1pt per 10yds, 6pts TD.
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Banger
Footballguy
Sweet deal.
