77 replies to this topic

[Clifford]

I just had a thread deleted containing observations about the NE-ATL game, something I did not see anywhere on the first two pages of threads. I tried multiple searches for this game and was told that my search terms were too short (why on earth would that be a permissions requirement??) and searching for NE-ATL game returned no results.

If you're going to remove threads because they're Hondas, link to the existing thread since the search function on this site simply does not work. Or, improve the search function. I know for a fact I am not the first poster to complain about this. Also a little tired of being a paying customer here and getting treated like I am an unwanted guest.

end

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Search function actually works great, IMO.

Don't take things like this personally. It's better for everyone if discussions are kept together in the same thread.

[Clifford]

Really, I just tried to search for Bills vs Colts and couldn't. How is that great?

I'm not complaining just to complain. Having a non-functioning search function on your site, especially when you expect people to use it and rely on it, is really unacceptable. Google provides a site-search for free. It would take all of 2 hours to implement.

Again, if you expect people to use and the search "Bills vs Colts" returns an error, it doesn't work.

[Detroitgodfather]

both of the games from yesterday have had a thread going strong on page 1 since game time. you gotta look!!!!

[AhrnCityPahnder]

It works fine. You're just not good at it.


Search Shark Pool forum, thread titles only, last 7 days, "Bills"

http://forums.footba.....ghlite=+Bills

Edited by AhrnCityPahnder, 20 August 2010 - 08:21 AM.

[tooski]

Agree with Clifford. Aaron, exactly what should be typed into the search function for results on the New england vs Atlanta game?

[Nagle2998]

If it says that it is to long and you would have just put in Bills it would have came up on your first page. I really have no idea what your complaining about it I mean it even told you it was to long if you didn't know to just put in one team after that I think your more to blame then the site.

[V1LL]

I'm with this dude.....tried searching for Norton's "eyes of the guru" articles.....nothing. This place puts an emphasis on "We have over 500 million pages of content!" What good are they if you can't find the articles you need quickly and efficiently?
seems a simple fix with all the money this place is raking in.....FIX IT!!

Vill

I just had a thread deleted containing observations about the NE-ATL game, something I did not see anywhere on the first two pages of threads. I tried multiple searches for this game and was told that my search terms were too short (why on earth would that be a permissions requirement??) and searching for NE-ATL game returned no results.

If you're going to remove threads because they're Hondas, link to the existing thread since the search function on this site simply does not work. Or, improve the search function. I know for a fact I am not the first poster to complain about this. Also a little tired of being a paying customer here and getting treated like I am an unwanted guest.

end

[Lord Fantasy]

Solution:

1. Searchers try a little harder.
2. Forum police be a little more forgiving.

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Agree with Clifford. Aaron, exactly what should be typed into the search function for results on the New england vs Atlanta game?

Search Shark Pool forum, thread titles only, last 7 days, "Bills"

http://forums.footba.....ghlite=+Bills

[Clifford]

Agree with Clifford. Aaron, exactly what should be typed into the search function for results on the New england vs Atlanta game?

Guys, it is 2010, not 2001. IF you have to ask anything at all about how it works, it doesn't work! People have a slightly higher standard for intuitive functions these days.

If you can make an iPhone app, you can add a decent search function to this forum.

[TheBradyBunch]

I don't really understand the 3 character limit the search function has. For instance, if I search "Ray Rice", the search will end in an error automatically because of his 3 letter first name. So, I end up searching "Rice" and having to sift through tons of threads related to Sidney. I'm not complaining, but since the OP raised the question, it was just something I noticed recently.

[Aaron Rudnicki]

I'm with this dude.....tried searching for Norton's "eyes of the guru" articles.....nothing. This place puts an emphasis on "We have over 500 million pages of content!" What good are they if you can't find the articles you need quickly and efficiently?
seems a simple fix with all the money this place is raking in.....FIX IT!!

Vill

All free articles for the website are logged at www.todayinfantasy.com

All pay articles will soon be logged and searchable at footballguys as well. You'll be able to search by author, topic, keywords, players, etc. We are currently in the process of populating the database right now.

[Bob Magaw]

using a word like vs yielded the error message... try it with just bills colts next time...

"One or all of your search keywords were below 4 characters or you searched for words which are not allowed, such as 'html', 'img', etc, please go back and increase the length of these search keywords or choose different keywords."

[Kool-Aid Larry]

in a case like this, you know that the relevant game threads are recent, and you can see the date of last posts, so I suggest searching the old fashioned way -- with your eyeballs.

skimming the first page I can find this thread on pats/falcons

http://forums.footba...howtopic=548718

[bonesman]

It works fine. You're just not good at it.

Yup

Your query has to be at least 4 characters long.


What bugs me about the search is the flood control!

[joffer]

It works fine. You're just not good at it.

[Aaron Rudnicki]

you can use the + sign to combine search terms and only pull up threads that include all words.

for example, searching the following: +bills +colts

gives you this: http://forums.footba.....Bbills +colts

3rd non-pinned thread is Colts/Bills preseason week 2 discussion thread

[Northbound Train]

Agree with Clifford. Aaron, exactly what should be typed into the search function for results on the New england vs Atlanta game?

Guys, it is 2010, not 2001. IF you have to ask anything at all about how it works, it doesn't work! People have a slightly higher standard for intuitive functions these days.

If you can make an iPhone app, you can add a decent search function to this forum.

Not a fan of the search feature either...

[ookook]

I agree that the search engine is archaic and dysfunctional.

[Clifford]

You know the only thing I've found that really works?

http://www.google.co...lient=firefox-a

That could be on your site in about 2 hours. Probably way less if you have someone that has done it before.

[Cheeky Monkey]

It works fine. You're just not good at it.


Search Shark Pool forum, thread titles only, last 7 days, "Bills"

http://forums.footba.....ghlite=+Bills

Clifford>

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Agree with Clifford. Aaron, exactly what should be typed into the search function for results on the New england vs Atlanta game?

Guys, it is 2010, not 2001. IF you have to ask anything at all about how it works, it doesn't work! People have a slightly higher standard for intuitive functions these days.

If you can make an iPhone app, you can add a decent search function to this forum.

if the search function already works very well for most users (which it does, IMO) wouldn't it be much easier to just help the people having problems with it learn how to use it better?

there are limitations involved here given how active this message board is. I believe adding in the capability for 2 and 3-letter word searches and removing flood control could slow the board down considerably.

[Exit 1]

The 3 letter rule on searches is megatarded.

[bonesman]

I don't really understand the 3 character limit the search function has. For instance, if I search "Ray Rice", the search will end in an error automatically because of his 3 letter first name. So, I end up searching "Rice" and having to sift through tons of threads related to Sidney. I'm not complaining, but since the OP raised the question, it was just something I noticed recently.

Just search Rice Ravens then

I don't get the limit either but I haven't found it very limiting.

[fridayfrenzy]

Why can't the search function work with 3 letter words?

I don't understand this.

[Gopher State]

I aways found the search function to work really well. No problems with it, I don't know what the issue is here.

[Cheeky Monkey]

Why can't the search function work with 3 letter words?

I don't understand this.

It probably taxes the database significantly more using a 3 character query. It has to parse through much more information.

[PosterNutBag]

i agree the search function on this website doesn't work very well

try searching on this: +rice -sidney

can someone explain to me why there is a Sidney Rice thread on the first page of results when I specifically asked it to exclude posts with Sidney?

[Clifford]

Agree with Clifford. Aaron, exactly what should be typed into the search function for results on the New england vs Atlanta game?

Guys, it is 2010, not 2001. IF you have to ask anything at all about how it works, it doesn't work! People have a slightly higher standard for intuitive functions these days.

If you can make an iPhone app, you can add a decent search function to this forum.

if the search function already works very well for most users (which it does, IMO) wouldn't it be much easier to just help the people having problems with it learn how to use it better?

First off, I am obviously not the only person who thinks it sucks. This thread has gotten a lot of negatives from people other than me concerning search. So saying it works well is not really examining the situation.

Second, you have a paying customer raising a problem. This is not the way to react to it. When a customer points out a flaw and other customers chime in, you should look into it, instead of immediately dismissing it.

Third, if you have to learn to use it it's broken. The web is supposed to be about easy, intuitive interfaces that require no explanation. Site searches should be the easiest thing to use about your site. As this thread has proven it's obviously not close to that.

Fourth, Google has this figured out. They provide site-searches for free and even give you instructions for installing it. And it's worth pointing out they delivered the right thread, top result, even when I used a search term three characters or under.

Fifth: Even if you don't want to replace it, I think it's fairly obvious that getting rid of the nonsensical and confusing three-char limit would make a lot of sense, especially given that searching for three character terms is going to be fairly natural for most people (ALT, NE, vs, Ray, etc)

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I don't really understand the 3 character limit the search function has. For instance, if I search "Ray Rice", the search will end in an error automatically because of his 3 letter first name. So, I end up searching "Rice" and having to sift through tons of threads related to Sidney. I'm not complaining, but since the OP raised the question, it was just something I noticed recently.

well, I just assumed you would be able to put in 'ray rice', or "ray rice", or something like that, so I checked it out ----
I clicked on 'search'
then 'more search options'
then right under the search field I spotted a link they had put there for easy spotting for those who needed help 'ADVANCED USAGE HELP', so I clicked it and learned the following:
"Some Words" Find posts with the phrase 'some words of wisdom', 'some words' but not 'some noise words'

which means you need to enter "ray rice"!!

I think the bottom line is that you're just the kind of person who wastes a ton of time because you have a Frequently Asked Question, but refuses to read the FAQ, or any type of help file.

dude, you gotta take a little responsibility for yourself at some point in your life.

[Cheeky Monkey]

I don't really understand the 3 character limit the search function has. For instance, if I search "Ray Rice", the search will end in an error automatically because of his 3 letter first name. So, I end up searching "Rice" and having to sift through tons of threads related to Sidney. I'm not complaining, but since the OP raised the question, it was just something I noticed recently.

I think the bottom line is that you're just the kind of person who wastes a ton of time because you have a Frequently Asked Question, but refuses to read the FAQ, or any type of help file.

dude, you gotta take a little responsibility for yourself at some point in your life.

/thread

[Mark Wimer]

Search function actually works great, IMO.

Don't take things like this personally. It's better for everyone if discussions are kept together in the same thread.

If we allow everyone who doesn't bother to look for an active thread to start a new thread on the same topic, the Shark Pool would rapidly become totally useless and unreadable.

Nothing personal, we just have to ask everyone to utilize existing threads that cover whatever questions people may have. There is 0% reason to start a new topic about "What did you see on the NE/ATL or BUF/IND games?" when there are already two 40+ reply threads on that EXACT topic.

MW

[Clifford]

I don't really understand the 3 character limit the search function has. For instance, if I search "Ray Rice", the search will end in an error automatically because of his 3 letter first name. So, I end up searching "Rice" and having to sift through tons of threads related to Sidney. I'm not complaining, but since the OP raised the question, it was just something I noticed recently.

well, I just assumed you would be able to put in 'ray rice', or "ray rice", or something like that, so I checked it out ----
I clicked on 'search'
then 'more search options'
then right under the search field I spotted a link they had put there for easy spotting for those who needed help 'ADVANCED USAGE HELP', so I clicked it and learned the following:
"Some Words" Find posts with the phrase 'some words of wisdom', 'some words' but not 'some noise words'

which means you need to enter "ray rice"!!

I think the bottom line is that you're just the kind of person who wastes a ton of time because you have a Frequently Asked Question, but refuses to read the FAQ, or any type of help file.

dude, you gotta take a little responsibility for yourself at some point in your life.

I just did exactly what you said and got an error. Fact is if you have to explain it's broken! Ever wonder why Microsoft is sucking wind and Apple is taking over the world? Because Apple got this one simple concept and Microsoft never could.

[Kool-Aid Larry]

i agree the search function on this website doesn't work very well

try searching on this: +rice -sidney

can someone explain to me why there is a Sidney Rice thread on the first page of results when I specifically asked it to exclude posts with Sidney?

yes, because you didn't specifically ask it to exclude posts with sydney --- it can't read your mind.

you people are killin' me.

[Clifford]

Search function actually works great, IMO.

Don't take things like this personally. It's better for everyone if discussions are kept together in the same thread.

If we allow everyone who doesn't bother to look for an active thread to start a new thread on the same topic, the Shark Pool would rapidly become totally useless and unreadable.

Nothing personal, we just have to ask everyone to utilize existing threads that cover whatever questions people may have. There is 0% reason to start a new topic about "What did you see on the NE/ATL or BUF/IND games?" when there are already two 40+ reply threads on that EXACT topic.

MW

No offense taken. The bigger issue here is teaching a man to fish, and fixing a search function that requires a users manual would be a great first step.

Well, we've been moved to FFA, so obviously nothing is ever going to be done about this. I'm going to go see if I can't get my subscription refunded. This is ridiculous.

Edited by Clifford, 20 August 2010 - 08:47 AM.

[Jene Bramel]

You can search for three letter words.

There is a google site specific search at the bottom of the advanced search window. You'll still need to use the + term to search for multiple phrases, but three letter searches are supported.

[nysportsfan]

Search function works, but not that well. Flood control, three letters, plus too many quotes in a reply are annoying.

I've managed because I know how to use it after time, but it's frustrating to new users at the minimum.

[Steve Tasker]

You know the only thing I've found that really works?

http://www.google.co...lient=firefox-a

That could be on your site in about 2 hours. Probably way less if you have someone that has done it before.

Shark Tip:

1. Scroll up to top of page
2. Click on "Search" in the top right corner - a small dialog box will open
3. Click on "More Search Options" in the bottom right corner of the small dialog box
4. Scroll down to bottom of the expanded search page - find a line titled "Search The Footballguys Forums With Google - Allows Searches For Words With <3 Letters - Opens In New Window"
5. Type query in the Google box
6. ???
7. Profit

hth

[ClownCausedChaos]

Searching "+blah +blah +blah +whaaaaa" bring this thread right to the top.

Seems like its working fine to me.

[Aaron Rudnicki]

First off, I am obviously not the only person who thinks it sucks. This thread has gotten a lot of negatives from people other than me concerning search. So saying it works well is not really examining the situation.

Second, you have a paying customer raising a problem. This is not the way to react to it. When a customer points out a flaw and other customers chime in, you should look into it, instead of immediately dismissing it.

Third, if you have to learn to use it it's broken. The web is supposed to be about easy, intuitive interfaces that require no explanation. Site searches should be the easiest thing to use about your site. As this thread has proven it's obviously not close to that.

Fourth, Google has this figured out. They provide site-searches for free and even give you instructions for installing it. And it's worth pointing out they delivered the right thread, top result, even when I used a search term three characters or under.

Fifth: Even if you don't want to replace it, I think it's fairly obvious that getting rid of the nonsensical and confusing three-char limit would make a lot of sense, especially given that searching for three character terms is going to be fairly natural for most people (ALT, NE, vs, Ray, etc)

#1 Didn't say you were the only one. It's a common complaint, but if you take a little extra time with your search and know how to use the search function, you can almost always find what you are looking for very quickly.

#2 Of course we take these complaints under consideration. If there's a way to improve the search function, why wouldn't we do it? I'm sure our tech guy Keith Overton is aware of all the issues involved and could explain them much much better than I could. You could probably start a thread in the website support forum as I'm guessing this thread won't last on page 1 very long.

#3 I guess we disagree on this point.

#4 A google search box is provided on the search page to help with 3-letter terms.

#5 Sure, it makes sense to allow them and I'm sure everyone would agree with that. But, this ignores how much larger the database would have to be if we wanted it to store every 3-letter word typed on these message boards. It's a matter of priorities. Most people want a board that works well, pages that load quickly, etc. Having a perfect search function would be awesome too, but not if adding it means that the entire board is going to slow down and ruin the message board experience for 99% of the users. As I said, there are limitations here and Keith is really the best person to discuss them with.


EDIT: this thread got moved while I was responding. The FFA isn't a good fit. I'll move it to the Support forum.

[Leroy Hoard]

I'd say "same as day one" but on day one a search would have been much easier.

[Shtaym Syek]

Search function actually works great, IMO.

Don't take things like this personally. It's better for everyone if discussions are kept together in the same thread.

If we allow everyone who doesn't bother to look for an active thread to start a new thread on the same topic, the Shark Pool would rapidly become totally useless and unreadable.

Nothing personal, we just have to ask everyone to utilize existing threads that cover whatever questions people may have. There is 0% reason to start a new topic about "What did you see on the NE/ATL or BUF/IND games?" when there are already two 40+ reply threads on that EXACT topic.

MW

Become?

[PosterNutBag]

i agree the search function on this website doesn't work very well

try searching on this: +rice -sidney

can someone explain to me why there is a Sidney Rice thread on the first page of results when I specifically asked it to exclude posts with Sidney?

yes, because you didn't specifically ask it to exclude posts with sydney --- it can't read your mind.

you people are killin' me.

please elaborate since it is apparently extra obvious based on your strong language

my search according to this page should have worked to include posts with "Rice" but without "Sidney"

but somehow, this thread appeared in my search results

[Holy Schneikes]

The three letter limitation has been discussed a lot. It's probably there just to minimize the massive returns that could result from very small search terms (thus speeding up the board in general for everyone). Also, while it is probably fairly configurable, this board is a 3rd party application that FBG did not write. They have somewhat limited ability to modify the way it works.

All that said, I have bombed out the board search tool COUNTLESS times myself (despite knowing about it from previous issues and working with this kind of software for a living) with short search terms (like PPR, or RB, or WR, or QB, or SD or Ben or...). Short search terms just seem to be VERY common in this environment and it DEFINITELY makes the basic board search nearly useless sometimes. Educating the users is AN answer, but not the best one by far. I've seen many a development firm go under using that as the primary method of solving problems with poorly implemented application functionality. Yeah, you can get it to work, but as others have mentioned, if you have to struggle to find appropriate search terms to find what you are looking for, it ain't making the grade as a first rate tool.

Now let me make an about face one more time. The little unadvertised google-based search form BELOW the standard board form is actually MUCH more useful in many cases. There is no 3 or 4 letter search term requirement, there is no flood control, it returns in a format we are all familiar with, and it is very very responsive . It does have some limitations, but it is better than the basic search IMO. I would actually suggest somehow incorporating THAT search engine vs the board engine as the default option wherever possible.

[billyjohnson]

Search function actually works great, IMO.

Don't take things like this personally. It's better for everyone if discussions are kept together in the same thread.

Yeah, and my grandmother's dial-up internet moves at the speed of light. (insert guzzling kool-aid emoticon)

Bill

[Holy Schneikes]

Moving this thread just compounds the problem. Yes, it is the appropriate forum, but realistically, no one is going to see it. Or maybe that's what you had in mind.

[Aaron Rudnicki]

please elaborate since it is apparently extra obvious based on your strong language

my search according to this page should have worked to include posts with "Rice" but without "Sidney"

but somehow, this thread appeared in my search results

if you are searching the entire thread, I believe it just looks for single posts that include the word Rice and don't include the word Sidney.

So post #4 in that thread would qualify:

One of the best young receivers in the league. I saw him make some catches against Dallas that I had to blink because I thought I was watching Larry Fitzgerald. Not knowing if Farve is back for sure is good for Rice owners because right now you can get him a little cheaper than what you can get him for when Farve is officially back, which he will be.

82 receptions for 1100 yards and 9 tds

Unless you go into the advanced search options page and tell it to "show results as posts", the default is to just show the entire thread.

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I don't really understand the 3 character limit the search function has. For instance, if I search "Ray Rice", the search will end in an error automatically because of his 3 letter first name. So, I end up searching "Rice" and having to sift through tons of threads related to Sidney. I'm not complaining, but since the OP raised the question, it was just something I noticed recently.

well, I just assumed you would be able to put in 'ray rice', or "ray rice", or something like that, so I checked it out ----
I clicked on 'search'
then 'more search options'
then right under the search field I spotted a link they had put there for easy spotting for those who needed help 'ADVANCED USAGE HELP', so I clicked it and learned the following:
"Some Words" Find posts with the phrase 'some words of wisdom', 'some words' but not 'some noise words'

which means you need to enter "ray rice"!!

I think the bottom line is that you're just the kind of person who wastes a ton of time because you have a Frequently Asked Question, but refuses to read the FAQ, or any type of help file.

dude, you gotta take a little responsibility for yourself at some point in your life.

I just did exactly what you said and got an error. Fact is if you have to explain it's broken! Ever wonder why Microsoft is sucking wind and Apple is taking over the world? Because Apple got this one simple concept and Microsoft never could.

well, I get a result --- sounds like a user problem.
I wouldn't be beating anyone up for not getting a simple concept if I were you, just sayin'.

maybe your computer is broken --- try turning it off.

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Moving this thread just compounds the problem. Yes, it is the appropriate forum, but realistically, no one is going to see it. Or maybe that's what you had in mind.

I did not move it out of the Shark Pool, but I did move it here from the FFA. I don't see how this is a bad fit for it.

who do you want to see it exactly?