Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Huh. That IS interesting.Not at all. It was early in the morning when he couldn't sleep. Later, he went to the capitol building. It was a very weird event.
Huh. That IS interesting.Not at all. It was early in the morning when he couldn't sleep. Later, he went to the capitol building. It was a very weird event.
Maybe. We'll see.The cop was arrested and justice is going to be served. In the later case there were no burning down of businesses, no looting, no violence. The most violent protests tend to be from the left.
The current level of anger seems as if he was already aquitted. I am confident justice will be served, and hopefully the other cops involved face some criminal charges too.Maybe. We'll see.
Assassins who were not BLM....despite some attempts to claim as much. Lets be clear there.Seems like a short memory. The BLM movement started during the Obama years. The left were rioting over the same things, but those cases were a lot less clear cut than this one. And cops were being targered by assassins.
I agree...it seems like that. IMO, because of years of it happening, because of delays in even arresting him...because of the lies and misinformation as the official account of the situation.The current level of anger seems as if he was already aquitted. I am confident justice will be served, and hopefully the other cops involved face some criminal charges too.
Right now I don't even want to think of the powder keg that will erupt at such a thing.I wonder if "justice will be served" allows for the possibility (even if it is really, really remote) that we arrive at "Not Guilty".
Heard it mentioned last night and did a bit of reading: https://www.washingtonian.com/2016/05/17/richard-nixon-kent-state-protests-white-house-lincoln-memorial/Huh. That IS interesting.
Is he still up for just murder in the 3rd degree? Because that's brutal in itselfRight now I don't even want to think of the powder keg that will erupt at such a thing.
I am confident they will be pardoned by Donald Trump in a giant "f-u" to his opponents after we evict him from office. Why should anyone believe that justice will be served under this current administration?The current level of anger seems as if he was already aquitted. I am confident justice will be served, and hopefully the other cops involved face some criminal charges too.
oooofff..i didn't even consider that angle.I am confident they will be pardoned by Donald Trump in a giant "f-u" to his opponents after we evict him from office. Why should anyone believe that justice will be served under this current administration?
Right? Even if the jury wants to say not guilty you publicly declare him guilty anyway then whisk him off to a new life in "witness" protection.Right now I don't even want to think of the powder keg that will erupt at such a thing.
Not at all. It was early in the morning when he couldn't sleep. Later, he went to the capitol building. It was a very weird event.
I decided to look it up, and it really is interesting.Huh. That IS interesting.
Nixon obviously had a lot of faults, but he was excellent at politics. I used to be a newspaper reporter and I would get emails from time to time from irate readers. I can't tell you how many times I simply responded with a "I appreciate your response and thank you for reading," and how I would then get a reply saying, "I never expected you to respond," followed by a civil exchange. Trump doesn't have to go stand among protestors, which is obviously dangerous. But he hasn't made *any* attempt to talk to them as people. He seems to have no interest in that. I'm mainly a lurker here, but I'm familiar with the stances of most of the people in this thread, and some of them grate on me to no end. It's easy for me to scroll past with no interest in what they have to say. But I'm positive that were I to meet some of these same people at a bar, we'd probably joke and have a good time. I can hate your politics without hating you. My issue with Trump is that those things are the same. He has no interest in getting to know his enemies, because then they might not be enemies anymore, and without enemies, he has nothing.Nixon had finished a press conference at 10 p.m. on May 8, in which he had been questioned about his decision to expand American operations in Cambodia as part of the Vietnam War. Nixon then made 20 telephone calls to various people including Billy Graham and Thomas E. Dewey and the NBC reporter Nancy Dickerson.[1] He then slept from 2:15 a.m. until around 4 a.m.[2]
Nixon awoke after 4 a.m. and put on a recording of Eugene Ormandy conducting Rachmaninoff at a loud volume in the Lincoln Sitting Room. This awoke his valet Manolo Sanchez. Looking at the gathering of people on the National Mall, Nixon asked Sanchez if he had ever visited the memorial at night and then told him to get dressed after Sanchez answered in the negative.[2]
Nixon, Sanchez, the senior White House doctor Walter Robert Tkach and Secret Service agents then drove to the memorial in a presidential limousine, with Nixon later recalling that he had "never seen the Secret Service quite so petrified with apprehension". Upon arrival Nixon and Sanchez walked up the steps to the statue of the seated Lincoln with Nixon pointing out the carved inscriptions of Lincoln's Second Inaugural Address and his Gettysburg Address.[2] White House Deputy for Domestic Affairs Egil Krogh was also present.[3]
Some students had recognised Nixon by now and, although surprised by his advent, walked up to him and shook his hand. Nixon said that the students "were not unfriendly" to him, but "seemed somewhat overawed". Nixon learnt that several of them attended Syracuse University, and spoke of the university's football team. Commenting later to journalists, the Syracuse University students felt that "most of what he was saying was absurd ... Here we had come from a university that's completely uptight, on strike, and when we told him where we were from, he talked about the football team."[2]
On the Vietnam War, Nixon told the students:
I hope that [your] hatred of the war, which I could well understand, would not turn into a bitter hatred of our whole system, our country and everything that it stood for. I said that I know probably most of you think I'm an SOB. But I want you to know that I understand just how you feel.
I think (my opinion) is that the current level of anger represents "not again!" while there are 3 more cops that are free but should be arrested.The current level of anger seems as if he was already aquitted. I am confident justice will be served, and hopefully the other cops involved face some criminal charges too.
I'm trying to think - with what we saw in the video - what evidence could come to light to make me thing he is not guilty. Kind of at a loss.Right? Even if the jury wants to say not guilty you publicly declare him guilty anyway then whisk him off to a new life in "witness" protection.
I haven't seen anything that explains how it went from walking him across the street to him on the ground with a knee on his neck.I'm trying to think - with what we saw in the video - what evidence could come to light to make me thing he is not guilty. Kind of at a loss.
Yea - I think you could make a solid case for Murder 2. Especially since everyone in the crowd was yelling to him that he was killing him.Is he still up for just murder in the 3rd degree? Because that's brutal in itself
I don't think that's relevant, though. If Floyd had been killed during the apprehension, then maybe you could make that argument.I haven't seen anything that explains how it went from walking him across the street to him on the ground with a knee on his neck.
To make it even weirder, I've seen a security camera with an angle that appears to show that Floyd was in the back seat of the cruiser at some point before he was killed. When that video came out a couple days ago, some people (like Shaun King) were claiming it showed the officers punching him in the back seat, but to me it wasn't clear exactly what was happening. I'll see if I can dig that video up again.I haven't seen anything that explains how it went from walking him across the street to him on the ground with a knee on his neck.
Given the Rodney King riots didn't start until AFTER the officers were acquitted, it will be more like a nuclear bomb than a powder keg.Right now I don't even want to think of the powder keg that will erupt at such a thing.
Good stuff.I decided to look it up, and it really is interesting.
Nixon obviously had a lot of faults, but he was excellent at politics. I used to be a newspaper reporter and I would get emails from time to time from irate readers. I can't tell you how many times I simply responded with a "I appreciate your response and thank you for reading," and how I would then get a reply saying, "I never expected you to respond," followed by a civil exchange. Trump doesn't have to go stand among protestors, which is obviously dangerous. But he hasn't made *any* attempt to talk to them as people. He seems to have no interest in that. I'm mainly a lurker here, but I'm familiar with the stances of most of the people in this thread, and some of them grate on me to no end. It's easy for me to scroll past with no interest in what they have to say. But I'm positive that were I to meet some of these same people at a bar, we'd probably joke and have a good time. I can hate your politics without hating you. My issue with Trump is that those things are the same. He has no interest in getting to know his enemies, because then they might not be enemies anymore, and without enemies, he has nothing.
Nixon visits the hippiesAs a planned & controlled event, sure.
It's something Trump should do - but it wasn't going to happen the other night
he said a bunch of words and nothing positive came from the little he did NOT do - Obama wasn't a uniter. Trump isn't a uniterWhat did he do to escalate tension?
you mean with Reginald Denny ?You didn't answer his question. I know that's your shtick, but it's telling. What we are seeing today in the streets isn't significantly different than what we saw in 1992 with Rodney King. This has been going on for decades and decades. Clearly that's something you don't want to acknowledge for whatever reason as you double down on "but Obama" at every opportunity.
there were not Republican voters - that much it clearAssassins who were not BLM....despite some attempts to claim as much. Lets be clear there.
The only thing I heard, which is on the tape, was the office saying to him when he couldn't breath "Will you get in the car peacefully now?" Or something to that effect, so, it appears that George resisted getting in the car.I haven't seen anything that explains how it went from walking him across the street to him on the ground with a knee on his neck.
Floyd was a big man, a felon, committing forgery it appears, maybe resisting ... but the police officer committed a murder, his 3 non-white police buddies watched ... there should be and will be heavy penalties for thatThe only thing I heard, which is on the tape, was the office saying to him when he couldn't breath "Will you get in the car peacefully now?" Or something to that effect, so, it appears the George resisted getting in the car.
He said, “then go ahead and get in the car.”The only thing I heard, which is on the tape, was the office saying to him when he couldn't breath "Will you get in the car peacefully now?" Or something to that effect, so, it appears the George resisted getting in the car.
So by your logic if this year is the worst you’ve seen in 25 years that means it’s gotten worse in the last year, or year before or year before, all under Trump.what happened under his leadership, under his administration and presidency is his to own
he had 8 years to deescalate and yet here we are 3 1/2 years later, with maybe worse problems that I've seen in 25 years with the allowed violence/rioting/looting
again, in almost every year, after Obama tensions were worse than before those 8 years
the left has been far more violent yes but in the Obama years it grew, the spawning of BLM and ANTIFA and the hatred continued to get worse and worseSo by your logic if this year is the worst you’ve seen in 25 years that means it’s gotten worse in the last year, or year before or year before, all under Trump.
Thanks. Right, so the logical conclusion was that he wasn't willing to get in the car. That's what I took from it too.He said, “then go ahead and get in the car.”
While. He. Was. Kneeling. On. His. Neck.
https://www.businessinsider.com/extremist-killings-links-right-wing-extremism-report-2019-1?ampthe left has been far more violent yes but in the Obama years it grew, the spawning of BLM and ANTIFA and the hatred continued to get worse and worse
yes, under Trump has gotten worse too
No. The logical conclusion is he can't get in the car with a police officer kneeling on his neck.Thanks. Right, so the logical conclusion was that he wasn't willing to get in the car. That's what I took from it too.
99% of the rioters and looters and killing going on right now is being done by conservatives, GOP and Trump voters right ?https://www.businessinsider.com/extremist-killings-links-right-wing-extremism-report-2019-1?amp
https://www.adl.org/news/press-releases/adl-report-right-wing-extremists-killed-38-people-in-2019-far-surpassing-all
https://www.csis.org/ground-combatting-rise-right-wing-terror
https://www.congress.gov/116/bills/s894/BILLS-116s894is.xml
To just claim the left has been more violent ignores many many studies.
Sounds like this problem has had nothing to do with who was president, and will continue to grow regardless of who is president. Maybe the issue is bigger than who is president.the left has been far more violent yes but in the Obama years it grew, the spawning of BLM and ANTIFA and the hatred continued to get worse and worse
yes, under Trump has gotten worse too
I agree. Its not of value. I was merely countering the misinformation posted and backing it up again with multiple links.Oh good, now we can have another three-page slap-fight over whether left-wing violence is better or worse than right-wing violence. These add a lot of value to the forum.
That is a given, we all know that. What led up to him going to the ground?No. The logical conclusion is he can't get in the car with a police officer kneeling on his neck.
Right? Umm, no, we don't know. Which is part of the point . But i countered the claims you made. And it wasn’t just a discussion about this but about the years previous.99% of the rioters and looters and killing going on right now is being done by conservatives, GOP and Trump voters right ?
you don't believe that, and I don't believe it and everyone knows there aint a MAGA hate wearing guy in any of the looting photos
I'm having a difficult time understanding your point. Is it just that the cop should be charged only with Murder 3? That that's the appropriate charge?That is a given, we all know that. What led up to him going to the ground?
a) He was resisting getting in the car.
b) The cop was trying to kill him.
I know what the logical answer is, but hey if you think it was B then yeah, go for murder in the 1st.
I thought this was much better known.Huh. That IS interesting.
No....I mean Rodney King...that's what started the riots. Denny was a headline because of what happened to him in the riots. The riots weren't because of what happened to him (Denny).you mean with Reginald Denny ?You didn't answer his question. I know that's your shtick, but it's telling. What we are seeing today in the streets isn't significantly different than what we saw in 1992 with Rodney King. This has been going on for decades and decades. Clearly that's something you don't want to acknowledge for whatever reason as you double down on "but Obama" at every opportunity.
we've not had a POTUS unite in a very long time - Clinton might have been the best at it ... Bush's wasn't, Obama wasn't, Trump isn't
The prosecuters who looked at this did not just rush to judgement and say let's charge him with Murder 3. They looked at all the evidence and came up with the best charges you will get a conviction on. DW already weight in.Yea - I think you could make a solid case for Murder 2. Especially since everyone in the crowd was yelling to him that he was killing him.
And I think premeditation can be almost instantaneous, right? So if the crowd is yelling that he is killing him and he continues to put his knee into his neck - could you make a case for Murder 1?
Probably need Zow to address.
That is a given, we all know that. What led up to him going to the ground?
a) He was resisting getting in the car.
b) The cop was trying to kill him.
I know what the logical answer is, but hey if you think it was B then yeah, go for murder in the 1st.
Yea the prosecutors can be wrong. Or, as you hinted at, they may be charging for different reasons. DW said Murder 1 is not appropriate and he thinks he was "more or less" charged appropriately.The prosecuters who looked at this did not just rush to judgement and say let's charge him with Murder 3. They looked at all the evidence and came up with the best charges you will get a conviction on. DW already weight in.
You need to get up to speed on what happened. There is video of them putting him in the police car, then something happens in the car and officer Chauvin pulls him out of the car on the other side from where they put him in and kneels on his neck. The other officers run around and kneel on him as well. He wasnt resisting getting in the car, he was already in the car and then was removed from it and killed.That is a given, we all know that. What led up to him going to the ground?
a) He was resisting getting in the car.
b) The cop was trying to kill him.
I know what the logical answer is, but hey if you think it was B then yeah, go for murder in the 1st.
Why take him out of a car he was already in?You need to get up to speed on what happened. There is video of them putting him in the police car, then something happens in the car and officer Chauvin pulls him out of the car on the other side from where they put him in and kneels on his neck. The other officers run around and kneel on him as well. He wasnt resisting getting in the car, he was already in the car and then was removed from it and killed.