QB Justin Fields, PIT (5 Viewers)

[osubuckeyeman]

So, has anyone dropped him or traded him?

 

[dipandglide]

Why has the Bears gotten away from what Fields does best and that is to improvise, instead of trying to make him a pocket passer?

Because the defenses playing against him can improvise as well. Improvision can't be the only thing he brings to the table, it's a spice not the main meal. If Fields is having trouble making pre-snap reads, adjusting accordingly, and being able to go through progressions at game speed then "improvising" isn't going to improve things. It would be like me saying "well I don't know anything about how to be a chef or to cook food, but I'll just improvise my dinner."

Exactly. A QBs job is to read defenses and distribute the ball. It isn't to scramble around and play backyard ball. The Bears have no choice but to try and develop him into a better pocket passer.

 

[dipandglide]

Why has the Bears gotten away from what Fields does best and that is to improvise, instead of trying to make him a pocket passer?

Because the defenses playing against him can improvise as well. Improvision can't be the only thing he brings to the table, it's a spice not the main meal. If Fields is having trouble making pre-snap reads, adjusting accordingly, and being able to go through progressions at game speed then "improvising" isn't going to improve things. It would be like me saying "well I don't know anything about how to be a chef or to cook food, but I'll just improvise my dinner."

Making him a pocket passer is like making Lamar Jackson a pocket passer. Bad move.

Stop. Lamar can pass and distribute the ball. He's no Peyton Manning, but he's multiple classes above Fields.

 

[jumper]

Why has the Bears gotten away from what Fields does best and that is to improvise, instead of trying to make him a pocket passer?

Because the defenses playing against him can improvise as well. Improvision can't be the only thing he brings to the table, it's a spice not the main meal. If Fields is having trouble making pre-snap reads, adjusting accordingly, and being able to go through progressions at game speed then "improvising" isn't going to improve things. It would be like me saying "well I don't know anything about how to be a chef or to cook food, but I'll just improvise my dinner."

Making him a pocket passer is like making Lamar Jackson a pocket passer. Bad move.

What makes you think if they allow him to "improvise" that will be a good move? This is like the folks who said "you can't force Tim Tebow to be a pocket passer" or the whole "let Russ cook" argument - at a certain point you have to consider maybe it's the player who is the problem rather than just being coaches who have no idea what they're doing.

It's entirely possible the offense would do even worse if the coaches simply allowed him to "improvise" like you want - like Zach Wilson or Nathan Peterman worse.

Or you hire a coach like Steichen who knows how to get the most out of his QB by playing to his strengths while also developing him as a passer.

Like a good coach would do.

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

 

[bostonfred]

So, has anyone dropped him or traded him?

Traded him straight up for deshaun Watson in one league. Have him in a dynasty where I'm rebuilding and I currently have a clear path to the 1.1 and have no option to sell him or bench him. Last year he helped me lose a lot of games early - then cost me Bijan when he went off.

I think the coaches will start putting in designed runs soon. Maybe even this week. They want to improve him as a passer but are under pressure and don't want to lose their jobs, and he's good enough to win games if they let him run. The problem is that defenses can stack the box and mush rush him. If he takes a 3 step drop they pummel him and the running backs can't do anything about it. If he rolls out they don't need to cover everyone because he's a two read guy at best right now. They can just watch him stare down his first target and cover the half of the field he rolls to.

What they need to do is design runs, and design pass plays that start with him rolling out. Give him the McVay to Goff treatment, telling him what the defense is showing before the helmet mic cuts off, and play fast so the d can't wait and change the coverage.

Get him some confidence playing the way he wants to play and adding stuff that complements it. It's admirable to want to get him real reps as a pocket passer, but all that's happening is that he's getting sacked at a ridiculous rate and losing his confidence as a passer. This almost never works but they keep on doing it because that's how they know how to teach. They're going to ruin him if they haven't already

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

 

[Banger]

He gets the Broncos this week. If he can not show improvement against a team that just had 70 dropped on them there's really nothing more that can be said to defend him and the fire sales will be on or flat dropping of Justin Fields. Buy low now or trade now depending on how you feel because next week will be huge for Field's value.

It’s ride or die at this point. Can’t see anyone giving anything much over waiver wire value for him at this point.

 

[coyote5]

So, has anyone dropped him or traded him?

Probably dropping him for Stroud. He's already far ahead of him in vision and decision making.

 

[jumper]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

 

[bostonfred]

Why has the Bears gotten away from what Fields does best and that is to improvise, instead of trying to make him a pocket passer?

Because the defenses playing against him can improvise as well. Improvision can't be the only thing he brings to the table, it's a spice not the main meal. If Fields is having trouble making pre-snap reads, adjusting accordingly, and being able to go through progressions at game speed then "improvising" isn't going to improve things. It would be like me saying "well I don't know anything about how to be a chef or to cook food, but I'll just improvise my dinner."

Exactly. A QBs job is to read defenses and distribute the ball. It isn't to scramble around and play backyard ball. The Bears have no choice but to try and develop him into a better pocket passer.

Start with something like what Mike Shanahan did with Jake plummer. Have fields roll right. Running back runs right and chips the unblocked defender then goes to a route. Kmet runs a drag 5-7 yards upfield. Moore runs a post route. Fields has the option to tuck and run, dump it off, throw short or deep and he only needs to read the defenders on his side of the field. Offensive line doesn't need to play great just get in the way and slow guys down. Next play, hand it off to the rb who runs left. Then run the same play but have kmet motion left and do a designed qb run to the right.

That's way too basic for today's defenses but you can't just stand in one place where your terrible o line can't sustain blocks long enough for you to make your read and you keep getting hit instead of learning. That's so much worse than basic.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

 

[Max Power]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

He was better last year. I realize that’s not saying a ton, but he was playing instinctively and showed flashes of competence while going big with his legs.

In doing so he extended drives, and kept defenses on their toes.

If defenses don’t have to account for his rushing, they’re better able to defend his passing.

Ain’t rocket science. His OC is a turd.

 

[FairWarning]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

He was better last year. I realize that’s not saying a ton, but he was playing instinctively and showed flashes of competence while going big with his legs.

In doing so he extended drives, and kept defenses on their toes.

If defenses don’t have to account for his rushing, they’re better able to defend his passing.

Ain’t rocket science. His OC is a turd.

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

 

[Mr Anonymous]

They weren't trying to make him into a pocket passer, they were correctly challenging him to be more than a one read and take off passer. They knew the team was going nowhere with a gimmick bubble screen based offense. They had to learn if Fields could speed up his processor and he very quickly essentially gave up on that goal and told the world that the coaching staff was filling his head with too much. Teams routinely bring QBs along slowly by simplifying the offense and giving the QB less to diagnose, but in year 3 it was TIME to find out if he could do more. Btw, the line isn't nearly as bad as Fields apologists make it out to be. Fields has the 2nd slowest release time in the league behind Maholmes. If you're QB is consistently holding the ball for 4 seconds or more, it's gonna look like the line is breaking down. The difference between Maholmes and Fields is that Pat is improvising in search of the big play while Justin is still trying to figure out where his 2nd and 3rd reads are.

 

[osubuckeyeman]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

The mystery I have is he can throw in the pocket and he has gone through progressions at Ohio State. I understand the game is different including the speed of the game and schemes used on both sides of the ball however he showed arm talent at the collegiate level. Why has he not translated to the NFL level yet? He used his legs at Ohio State as well but he was balanced. I still think he can be unlocked just trying to figure it out before he loses confidence is the key. The Bears need to go back to his Ohio State tape. What did the tape show them then? I know it was a different front office but someone did the work. They need to do it again.

 

[BobbyLayne]

They weren't trying to make him into a pocket passer, they were correctly challenging him to be more than a one read and take off passer. They knew the team was going nowhere with a gimmick bubble screen based offense. They had to learn if Fields could speed up his processor and he very quickly essentially gave up on that goal and told the world that the coaching staff was filling his head with too much. Teams routinely bring QBs along slowly by simplifying the offense and giving the QB less to diagnose, but in year 3 it was TIME to find out if he could do more. Btw, the line isn't nearly as bad as Fields apologists make it out to be. Fields has the 2nd slowest release time in the league behind Maholmes. If you're QB is consistently holding the ball for 4 seconds or more, it's gonna look like the line is breaking down. The difference between Maholmes and Fields is that Pat is improvising in search of the big play while Justin is still trying to figure out where his 2nd and 3rd reads are.

WRT his release time / ability to see more than one read, he is about 0.8 seconds slower to setup on average (5-step drop) than Tua. That seems like a correctable error but here we are.

 

[Banger]

They weren't trying to make him into a pocket passer, they were correctly challenging him to be more than a one read and take off passer. They knew the team was going nowhere with a gimmick bubble screen based offense. They had to learn if Fields could speed up his processor and he very quickly essentially gave up on that goal and told the world that the coaching staff was filling his head with too much. Teams routinely bring QBs along slowly by simplifying the offense and giving the QB less to diagnose, but in year 3 it was TIME to find out if he could do more. Btw, the line isn't nearly as bad as Fields apologists make it out to be. Fields has the 2nd slowest release time in the league behind Maholmes. If you're QB is consistently holding the ball for 4 seconds or more, it's gonna look like the line is breaking down. The difference between Maholmes and Fields is that Pat is improvising in search of the big play while Justin is still trying to figure out where his 2nd and 3rd reads are.

WRT his release time / ability to see more than one read, he is about 0.8 seconds slower to setup on average (5-step drop) than Tua. That seems like a correctable error but here we are.

ya, you think that would be corrected last year, not still an issue this year.

 

[pinkstapler]

He is holding the ball too long and that isn't on the scheme or coaches.

I totally agree on holding the ball too long, but the fact he's been doing it since last season at this point, I'd put some of that fault on the coaches. Continued mistakes that are pretty much bad habits at this point reflect a bit on the coaching IMO, and that one is glaring. Train it out of him, and call plays that limit the situations where he'd be doing it. Me yelling "throw the damn ball away" at my TV doesn't seem to be helping

 

[pinkstapler]

I think Fields is also a prime example of expectations being way too high for rookie QBs, and that being rushed in can be extremely detrimental to their development. QBs who are able to make a seamless transition from college to NFL immediately are unicorns. And very very few of them are stylistically like Fields. Even Hurts and Lamar were on the sidelines through the majority of their first seasons, and Fields is obviously behind where they were developmentally. Look what we saw from Jordan Love his rookie year in the preseason, and even the next. Now he had some solid coaching and was learning behind one of the most talented QBs in the league. But I really don't think a trial by fire training is the way to go. Add in the details of what in his game needed drastic improvement, mixed with a poorly run organization, a bad coaching staff... I'm not trying to say Fields would have been Hurts/Lamar if he had sat his first season or two. But I do think it worked against his development a lot. Feels a lot of times coaches are making decisions to save their own jobs rather than put in the time and effort to actually develop a team, even if it means burning a season or two to get there. Product of the way the NFL runs I guess, but just kinda sucks tbh. Not saying all Packers fans have been living in glory the past 30 years, but they've also only had 4 QBs over that time and all of them were well above average. I don't think that's pure luck.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

They weren't trying to make him into a pocket passer, they were correctly challenging him to be more than a one read and take off passer. They knew the team was going nowhere with a gimmick bubble screen based offense. They had to learn if Fields could speed up his processor and he very quickly essentially gave up on that goal and told the world that the coaching staff was filling his head with too much. Teams routinely bring QBs along slowly by simplifying the offense and giving the QB less to diagnose, but in year 3 it was TIME to find out if he could do more. Btw, the line isn't nearly as bad as Fields apologists make it out to be. Fields has the 2nd slowest release time in the league behind Maholmes. If you're QB is consistently holding the ball for 4 seconds or more, it's gonna look like the line is breaking down. The difference between Maholmes and Fields is that Pat is improvising in search of the big play while Justin is still trying to figure out where his 2nd and 3rd reads are.

Tell me you haven't watched a Bears game without telling me you haven't watched a Bears game. THe All22 disagrees with every single point you're making here.

Fields is a 1 read and done QB -
The team can't work without a gimmick bubble screen offense -
Fields gave up on the goal of becoming a better pocket passer -
Fields told the world exactly that -
The Bears OL isn't that bad -
Fields is slow progressing in his reads -

Again, Fields isn't playing well. We can all agree on that. But dang, some of y'all want to look at a few screencaps from the game and proclaim it's all on Fields. SMH.

 

[JohnnyU]

Why has the Bears gotten away from what Fields does best and that is to improvise, instead of trying to make him a pocket passer?

Because the defenses playing against him can improvise as well. Improvision can't be the only thing he brings to the table, it's a spice not the main meal. If Fields is having trouble making pre-snap reads, adjusting accordingly, and being able to go through progressions at game speed then "improvising" isn't going to improve things. It would be like me saying "well I don't know anything about how to be a chef or to cook food, but I'll just improvise my dinner."

Making him a pocket passer is like making Lamar Jackson a pocket passer. Bad move.

Stop. Lamar can pass and distribute the ball. He's no Peyton Manning, but he's multiple classes above Fields.

Well, Desmond Ridder has as many passing TDs as Jackson with 2.

 

[Kiddnets]

So I was wondering how I nabbed him off the wire last year......I believe it was just around this time and then he went off and carried me to the playoffs. I havent watched a lot of games since but is it possible hes a slow starter and can turn it around like last year? Concerning to read so many people saying he looks done.

 

[jumper]

They weren't trying to make him into a pocket passer, they were correctly challenging him to be more than a one read and take off passer. They knew the team was going nowhere with a gimmick bubble screen based offense. They had to learn if Fields could speed up his processor and he very quickly essentially gave up on that goal and told the world that the coaching staff was filling his head with too much. Teams routinely bring QBs along slowly by simplifying the offense and giving the QB less to diagnose, but in year 3 it was TIME to find out if he could do more. Btw, the line isn't nearly as bad as Fields apologists make it out to be. Fields has the 2nd slowest release time in the league behind Maholmes. If you're QB is consistently holding the ball for 4 seconds or more, it's gonna look like the line is breaking down. The difference between Maholmes and Fields is that Pat is improvising in search of the big play while Justin is still trying to figure out where his 2nd and 3rd reads are.

Tell me you haven't watched a Bears game without telling me you haven't watched a Bears game. THe All22 disagrees with every single point you're making here.

Fields is a 1 read and done QB -
The team can't work without a gimmick bubble screen offense -
Fields gave up on the goal of becoming a better pocket passer -
Fields told the world exactly that -
The Bears OL isn't that bad -
Fields is slow progressing in his reads -

Again, Fields isn't playing well. We can all agree on that. But dang, some of y'all want to look at a few screencaps from the game and proclaim it's all on Fields. SMH.

This isn't anything personal against Fields, it's all about his current and likely immediate future production as a fantasy football asset. The dude could literally be the next Steve Young and it doesn't really matter for my fantasy football team going into Week 4 of the 2023 season. Whether you "blame" Fields, or the coaches, or think it's just bad timing and in an alternate universe he's a Top 3 fantasy QB this year doesn't matter.

At a certain point (in redraft at least), you need to decide for a given player you drafted whether to hold or cut bait. And anyone being honest would say Fields hasn't given fantasy owners a lot of reasons to think a turnaround is imminent. Every argument to hold him is basically the same as those given during the last year of Russell Wilson in Seattle, basically a variation of "just let him play in the way that would be best for my fantasy football team." The problem is what would be best for the fantasy owners of Fields (lots of rushing yardage and/or vulture rush TDs, with passing yardage being a secondary consideration) isn't necessarily what will help the real-life Bears team win football games. Yeah in fantasy if Fields had a stat line of 11/22 for 99/1/1 but added 125 yards rushing you'd be happy as an owner, but the actual Bears football team would likely still lose games by about the same scores.

 

[DeaLerZ]

So I was wondering how I nabbed him off the wire last year......I believe it was just around this time and then he went off and carried me to the playoffs. I havent watched a lot of games since but is it possible hes a slow starter and can turn it around like last year? Concerning to read so many people saying he looks done.

He isn't done, but the Bears are a mess of an organization from top to bottom. The play calling is awful and too easy for defenses to read because it lacks creativity, and absolutely does not get the most of their skill players. The Bears actually have a lot of good talent with Roschon and DJ Moore in particular. Their defense is terrible and lets opponents offenses stay on the field for 55-60% of the time.

I think I could turn it around still, but I personally already sought out different options and made a deal for Justin Herbert. If I stay around any longer waiting for Fields to be serviceable starting option, my fantasy football season will be over. I should be 2-1, but mainly because of Fields not living anywhere close to expectations I am at 0-3

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

 

[DeaLerZ]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

The way I get excited about Fields immediately again is if they fire Getsy, and have a play caller who is going to let Fields run loose and play to his strengths. At this point Fields is just worth stashing on your bench and hoping the Bears get smart. I doubt it happens because they are a terrible organization, but if he does he immediately has league winning upside.

 

[jumper]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

The way I get excited about Fields immediately again is if they fire Getsy, and have a play caller who is going to let Fields run loose and play to his strengths. At this point Fields is just worth stashing on your bench and hoping the Bears get smart. I doubt it happens because they are a terrible organization, but if he does he immediately has league winning upside.

He also has league losing downside. Playing him is akin to sticking Taysom Hill in my lineup, or Kyle Pitts. You know they have talent, you know they could go off any given week, yet are probably a net loser for season-long redraft.

 

[DeaLerZ]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

The way I get excited about Fields immediately again is if they fire Getsy, and have a play caller who is going to let Fields run loose and play to his strengths. At this point Fields is just worth stashing on your bench and hoping the Bears get smart. I doubt it happens because they are a terrible organization, but if he does he immediately has league winning upside.

He also has league losing downside. Playing him is akin to sticking Taysom Hill in my lineup, or Kyle Pitts. You know they have talent, you know they could go off any given week, yet are probably a net loser for season-long redraft.

Stash on your bench.

 

[jurrassic]

And yet they play Denver this week. A team that completely gave up last week.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

The way I get excited about Fields immediately again is if they fire Getsy, and have a play caller who is going to let Fields run loose and play to his strengths. At this point Fields is just worth stashing on your bench and hoping the Bears get smart. I doubt it happens because they are a terrible organization, but if he does he immediately has league winning upside.

He also has league losing downside. Playing him is akin to sticking Taysom Hill in my lineup, or Kyle Pitts. You know they have talent, you know they could go off any given week, yet are probably a net loser for season-long redraft.

Yes that part seems obvious.

 

[LakeCowboy]

Traded him and DJ Moore in a deal before the season as pieces to help get Ja'marr Chase in a big multi piece trade. Glad I exited.

 

[Battersbox]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

Opposing teams have absolutely caught on. If you don't see a difference in the way opposing defenses are strategizing against the Bears versus what they were doing through week 10 or so last year I doubt you're watching all the games.

So much of his success came from his improvisation between weeks 6-10 last year it was astounding. The Bears would be down by a TD or even multiple scores, teams would start rushing Fields while the Bears tried to get back into the game, and Justin would put together amazing runs because they couldn't sack him.

Teams have learned they have to keep him in front of them. They aren't blitzing when they get a lead on the Bears...they're simply rushing 3-4 guys and hanging back. Justin isn't racking up rushing yards because defenses are taking that option away and making him beat them with his arm.

Everyone is acting like this is a brand new phenomenon, but it isn't. The Bears offense slowed noticeably the final 5-6 weeks LAST year--the Bears averaged ~15 points a game through Fields' final 5 starts in 2022. This is a continuation of that.

The Bears could absolutely be doing more with their own offensive schemes to help him out, but ultimately I think it's simply going to take Fields being more willing to make anticipatory throws to allow his receivers to make some plays.

 

[Mr Anonymous]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

Opposing teams have absolutely caught on. If you don't see a difference in the way opposing defenses are strategizing against the Bears versus what they were doing through week 10 or so last year I doubt you're watching all the games.

So much of his success came from his improvisation between weeks 6-10 last year it was astounding. The Bears would be down by a TD or even multiple scores, teams would start rushing Fields while the Bears tried to get back into the game, and Justin would put together amazing runs because they couldn't sack him.

Teams have learned they have to keep him in front of them. They aren't blitzing when they get a lead on the Bears...they're simply rushing 3-4 guys and hanging back. Justin isn't racking up rushing yards because defenses are taking that option away and making him beat them with his arm.

Everyone is acting like this is a brand new phenomenon, but it isn't. The Bears offense slowed noticeably the final 5-6 weeks LAST year--the Bears averaged ~15 points a game through Fields' final 5 starts in 2022. This is a continuation of that.

The Bears could absolutely be doing more with their own offensive schemes to help him out, but ultimately I think it's simply going to take Fields being more willing to make anticipatory throws to allow his receivers to make some plays.

Bingo. Teams have adjusted to his running and have dared him to read coverage. Something the Bears were trying to assess as well. He took all of one week to decide that staying in the pocket and progressing through reads was "too much being put in his head" before deciding he needed to play free again. The problem is "playing free" (which is taking off and running) is something defenses are gameplanning for.

 

[zoonation]

out of the league in two years.

 

[TripleThreat]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

I think both are correct.

.. going back to @osubuckeyeman question I picked up a second QB if he doesn’t produce agaisnt Den it’s definitely time to pivot.

 

[zoonation]

And yet they play Denver this week. A team that completely gave up last week.

I think Denver is a better team than Chicago and has a much better QB. I think the D rebounds this week. Wake up call and all that. Also, not that you can ever have excuses in the NFL, but they played in ridiculous heat in Miami last weekend and their bench was in the sun the whole time. I think that contributed to them laying down. Still embarrassing for them though. I think they win this one fairly easily.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

And yet they play Denver this week. A team that completely gave up last week.

I think Denver is a better team than Chicago and has a much better QB. I think the D rebounds this week. Wake up call and all that. Also, not that you can ever have excuses in the NFL, but they played in ridiculous heat in Miami last weekend and their bench was in the sun the whole time. I think that contributed to them laying down. Still embarrassing for them though. I think they win this one fairly easily.

Imma award a tie. Ii think they're both bad teams that have tons of talent at skill positions but are horribly imbalanced with bad OL.

 

[Max Power]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

The mystery I have is he can throw in the pocket and he has gone through progressions at Ohio State. I understand the game is different including the speed of the game and schemes used on both sides of the ball however he showed arm talent at the collegiate level. Why has he not translated to the NFL level yet? He used his legs at Ohio State as well but he was balanced. I still think he can be unlocked just trying to figure it out before he loses confidence is the key. The Bears need to go back to his Ohio State tape. What did the tape show them then? I know it was a different front office but someone did the work. They need to do it again.

You mean that Ohio State team that had 4 first round WRs on it?

There are only about 5 teams at the NCAA level who were even on the same talent level as Ohio State. I think JF looked better because his team was hands down more talented in 95% of his games.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

The Bears offense slowed noticeably the final 5-6 weeks LAST year

1. Fields hurt his hip at the end of last year.
2. Last 5-6 weeks? Wut. You mean like DET on 11/13 where he threw 67/2/1 while rushing for 147/2? Or maybe you mean the next week against ATL where he passed for 1/1 and ran for 85/1? No? Surely you meant the following week vs GB on 12/4 when he passed for 254/0/2 and ran for 71/1 with a long of 55? I guess you're talking about PHI the next week when he passed 152/2/0 and ran for 95 yards? Is that when defenses contained him?

Then IIRC he hurt his hip in BUF 12/24, but was having a good game, having thrown 119/1. The next week 1/1 he played pretty well throwing for just 75 yards 1/1, but was completely contained on the ground where he only ran for 132 yards on 10 carries.

Those are his last 6 games so I actually have no idea what you're talking about here.

 

[Max Power]

Pretty rough stat. In Fields' 28 career starts he is 5-23 and has thrown for over 225 yards in 3 games with zero 300 yard games.

Cj stroud in 3 career starts has thrown for over 225 3 times and has one 300 yard game.

 

[FairWarning]

Teams have caught on, now he has to change.

No, they haven’t. The bears OC just runs such a vanilla offense and has Fields overthinking everything, ruining his natural ability to play football. And that’s dumb.

The way I get excited about Fields immediately again is if they fire Getsy, and have a play caller who is going to let Fields run loose and play to his strengths. At this point Fields is just worth stashing on your bench and hoping the Bears get smart. I doubt it happens because they are a terrible organization, but if he does he immediately has league winning upside.

One thing that isn’t happening is Getsy getting fired during the season. They are a coach short now.

 

[FairWarning]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

The mystery I have is he can throw in the pocket and he has gone through progressions at Ohio State. I understand the game is different including the speed of the game and schemes used on both sides of the ball however he showed arm talent at the collegiate level. Why has he not translated to the NFL level yet? He used his legs at Ohio State as well but he was balanced. I still think he can be unlocked just trying to figure it out before he loses confidence is the key. The Bears need to go back to his Ohio State tape. What did the tape show them then? I know it was a different front office but someone did the work. They need to do it again.

You mean that Ohio State team that had 4 first round WRs on it?

There are only about 5 teams at the NCAA level who were even on the same talent level as Ohio State. I think JF looked better because his team was hands down more talented in 95% of his games.

Pretty easy to look great when you are up 3 TDs vs Purdue, have an OL 30 lbs bigger, and throwing to 5-star recruits all game.

Teams have a book on these qbs now. Doesn’t matter if it’s Vick, Kaep, Cam, Lamar, or Fields. these qbs take a lot of shots, and they don’t pass well enough in the long run.

 

[osubuckeyeman]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

The mystery I have is he can throw in the pocket and he has gone through progressions at Ohio State. I understand the game is different including the speed of the game and schemes used on both sides of the ball however he showed arm talent at the collegiate level. Why has he not translated to the NFL level yet? He used his legs at Ohio State as well but he was balanced. I still think he can be unlocked just trying to figure it out before he loses confidence is the key. The Bears need to go back to his Ohio State tape. What did the tape show them then? I know it was a different front office but someone did the work. They need to do it again.

You mean that Ohio State team that had 4 first round WRs on it?

There are only about 5 teams at the NCAA level who were even on the same talent level as Ohio State. I think JF looked better because his team was hands down more talented in 95% of his games.

Pretty easy to look great when you are up 3 TDs vs Purdue, have an OL 30 lbs bigger, and throwing to 5-star recruits all game.

He played an applicable schedule for his career. Slamming Purdue is a bit off base as well.

 

[WaltonGoggins]

Pretty rough stat. In Fields' 28 career starts he is 5-23 and has thrown for over 225 yards in 3 games with zero 300 yard games.

Cj stroud in 3 career starts has thrown for over 225 3 times and has one 300 yard game.

one is a legit starting QB the other is not. Texans for once lucked out thanks to winning final game of the season which allowed Bears to mess up trading away #1 pick to the Panthers who were in love with Young. Texans will take all the luck they can get. A lot of heads should roll in the Bears organization for that boneheaded move. Their QB is a RB trying to force him to be a traditional QB. Who still thinks that works?

 

[FairWarning]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

The mystery I have is he can throw in the pocket and he has gone through progressions at Ohio State. I understand the game is different including the speed of the game and schemes used on both sides of the ball however he showed arm talent at the collegiate level. Why has he not translated to the NFL level yet? He used his legs at Ohio State as well but he was balanced. I still think he can be unlocked just trying to figure it out before he loses confidence is the key. The Bears need to go back to his Ohio State tape. What did the tape show them then? I know it was a different front office but someone did the work. They need to do it again.

You mean that Ohio State team that had 4 first round WRs on it?

There are only about 5 teams at the NCAA level who were even on the same talent level as Ohio State. I think JF looked better because his team was hands down more talented in 95% of his games.

Pretty easy to look great when you are up 3 TDs vs Purdue, have an OL 30 lbs bigger, and throwing to 5-star recruits all game.

He played an applicable schedule for his career. Slamming Purdue is a bit off base as well.

It’s not slamming Purdue. How many games each season does Ohio St play vs comparative talent, 2-3 (mich, the bowl game, maybe Penn st)?

 

[osubuckeyeman]

Sure, like how Belicheck has done with Mac Jones? Or how Sean Payton did with Jameis Winston? Or how Shanahan did with Trey Lance?

No, specifically like how Shane Steichen has done with Herbert & Hurts, respectively. You know, exactly like I said in my post.

I don’t see what Fields has to do with any of those QBs.

Super weird reply.

Is Shane Steichen on the Bears staff?

You do realize this is like me saying "just get a hot supermodel girlfriend like Tom Brady did." It's easy to say "you should do this," and quite another to actually make it happen. Do you think the Bears haven't tried to make Fields better, they're simply too lazy to do so? Too busy playing Farmville instead of just saying "let him improvise" perhaps?

No.

It’s me saying they should get someone specifically to help Fields by letting him play to hos strengths.

It was a stand-alone point that you seem to have completely missed. It was about the player rather than the specific coach

the discussion context was that they’re trying to force him to be a pocket passer.

That has absolutely nothing to do with whatever BB is doing with Mac Jones.

Being facetious here, but JF's only strength as a QB is that he is a good RB.

The guy admittedly needs it kept simple, he can't anticipate throws, and won't stay in the pocket. How can anyone make that a good QB?

The mystery I have is he can throw in the pocket and he has gone through progressions at Ohio State. I understand the game is different including the speed of the game and schemes used on both sides of the ball however he showed arm talent at the collegiate level. Why has he not translated to the NFL level yet? He used his legs at Ohio State as well but he was balanced. I still think he can be unlocked just trying to figure it out before he loses confidence is the key. The Bears need to go back to his Ohio State tape. What did the tape show them then? I know it was a different front office but someone did the work. They need to do it again.

You mean that Ohio State team that had 4 first round WRs on it?

There are only about 5 teams at the NCAA level who were even on the same talent level as Ohio State. I think JF looked better because his team was hands down more talented in 95% of his games.

Pretty easy to look great when you are up 3 TDs vs Purdue, have an OL 30 lbs bigger, and throwing to 5-star recruits all game.

He played an applicable schedule for his career. Slamming Purdue is a bit off base as well.

It’s not slamming Purdue. How many games each season does Ohio St play vs comparative talent, 2-3 (mich, the bowl game, maybe Penn st)?

That can be said for a lot of teams in college football. I understand your point so I get what you are saying but he played well in the bowl games against elite college football teams.

 

[Silkk1211]

Just traded Fields and Warren for Lawrence so I'm sure he'll blow up this week

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Pretty rough stat. In Fields' 28 career starts he is 5-23 and has thrown for over 225 yards in 3 games with zero 300 yard games.

Cj stroud in 3 career starts has thrown for over 225 3 times and has one 300 yard game.

one is a legit starting QB the other is not. Texans for once lucked out thanks to winning final game of the season which allowed Bears to mess up trading away #1 pick to the Panthers who were in love with Young. Texans will take all the luck they can get. A lot of heads should roll in the Bears organization for that boneheaded move. Their QB is a RB trying to force him to be a traditional QB. Who still thinks that works?

Hindsight is a helluva drug. Stroud was absolutely not the consensus #2. Hou may have preferred him and targeted him, but they could have just as easily fallen into Bryce Young.

 

[Battersbox]

The Bears offense slowed noticeably the final 5-6 weeks LAST year

1. Fields hurt his hip at the end of last year.
2. Last 5-6 weeks? Wut. You mean like DET on 11/13 where he threw 67/2/1 while rushing for 147/2? Or maybe you mean the next week against ATL where he passed for 1/1 and ran for 85/1? No? Surely you meant the following week vs GB on 12/4 when he passed for 254/0/2 and ran for 71/1 with a long of 55? I guess you're talking about PHI the next week when he passed 152/2/0 and ran for 95 yards? Is that when defenses contained him?

Then IIRC he hurt his hip in BUF 12/24, but was having a good game, having thrown 119/1. The next week 1/1 he played pretty well throwing for just 75 yards 1/1, but was completely contained on the ground where he only ran for 132 yards on 10 carries.

Those are his last 6 games so I actually have no idea what you're talking about here.

I wasn't talking about Detroit, because week 10 isn't part of the last 5-6 weeks of the year (you know this).
The next week against Atlanta (week 11) ALSO isn't part of the last 5-6 weeks of the year (the NFL has 18 weeks these days).

And again, you can mention those stats if you wish, some are okay, some are not. The fact remains the BEARS AVERAGED ~15 points per game over the final 5-6 weeks of the year, which is what I said (not sure why you'd cite games I wasn't talking about) I don't think that's a good offense. If you want to argue about Fields as a Fantasy point producer, you sort of have an argument here, but I'm talking more from a Bears-fan perspective who hopes they start winning some games again.

Now you know what I'm talking about.

I watched virtually every snap of every Bears game since Fields has been on the team. I know what I've seen. He has never thrown for 300 yards in a game. But that's nothing: he has thrown for over 200 yards in a game only 7 times in 28 starts. He has thrown for UNDER 100 yeards 5 times. That seems almost impossible in today's NFL. And keep in mind, the Bears are trailing all the time, nearly every game. Defenses loosen up to prevent touchdowns, and he still doesn't rack up yardage. Yes, he ran for yardage, but for the past 9 weeks (last 6 of last year and first 3 of this year) it has resulted in few points and exactly zero wins.

I'm not sure why you decided to get snarky, but whatever. You've not refuted anything I've said. Be well.