Any advice for adding IDP to existing league? (1 Viewer)

Hey all,

I'm in a 10-team league that plays .5 PPR and currently uses traditional team defenses. That last piece has been driving me nuts in recent years, and I'm looking to build a little momentum toward IDP. This league is a bunch of old friends, some heavily-engaged and some others just along for the ride. It is often difficult to get a consensus on making big changes (PPR met a lot of resistance initially). I know I have at least two allies in this IDP thing, and we are wanting to be very careful about providing a successful pitch to the league as a whole. Basically, the first pitch will likely be the only pitch. So I'm trying to anticipate some of the potential questions, objections, logistical issues, etc. I want it to be fairly straightforward. Here are some of my thoughts:

1) How many starters? How many roster spots? Are offensive/defensive roster spots interchangeable, or are some spots dedicated to defense?

2) How to draft? Just integrate it into the regular draft, or hold a separate IDP draft? Or start separate in year 1 and then integrate it after people get used to it?

3) How to handle special teams scoring? Add PR/KR positions, or just ignore that? Or only give it to starting RB/WR?

4) What about odd situations like JJ Watt scoring offensive TDs?

I appreciate any advice here. Please know that the last thing I want is to alienate anybody from the league. I want to find a comprehensive package of rules that considers both the final product and the process of developing it, so that I can make a relatively simple pitch that won't get rejected immediately as "too complicated." Is there a way to do this with one year of "training wheels" as a stepping stone to full adoption?

Please offer any relevant experiences!

Thanks!

Is it redraft or dynasty?

Are you the commissioner or just one of the owners?

Wooters said:

Doesn't matter if it is dynasty or redraft and it doesn't matter if you're the commish or an owner. What we would actually need to know In order to recommend things like this is you current setup. How many current starters? How large are rosters? What is your current scoring system?

Click to expand...

Lol. Well I'd say it certainly matters if it's redraft or dynasty, considering that he's asking:

2) How to draft? Just integrate it into the regular draft, or hold a separate IDP draft? Or start separate in year 1 and then integrate it after people get used to it?

It sounds like it's redraft, but I'm not sure.

gliz said:

Hey all,

I'm in a 10-team league that plays .5 PPR and currently uses traditional team defenses. That last piece has been driving me nuts in recent years, and I'm looking to build a little momentum toward IDP. This league is a bunch of old friends, some heavily-engaged and some others just along for the ride. It is often difficult to get a consensus on making big changes (PPR met a lot of resistance initially). I know I have at least two allies in this IDP thing, and we are wanting to be very careful about providing a successful pitch to the league as a whole. Basically, the first pitch will likely be the only pitch. So I'm trying to anticipate some of the potential questions, objections, logistical issues, etc. I want it to be fairly straightforward. Here are some of my thoughts:

1) How many starters? How many roster spots? Are offensive/defensive roster spots interchangeable, or are some spots dedicated to defense?

2) How to draft? Just integrate it into the regular draft, or hold a separate IDP draft? Or start separate in year 1 and then integrate it after people get used to it?

3) How to handle special teams scoring? Add PR/KR positions, or just ignore that? Or only give it to starting RB/WR?

4) What about odd situations like JJ Watt scoring offensive TDs?

I appreciate any advice here. Please know that the last thing I want is to alienate anybody from the league. I want to find a comprehensive package of rules that considers both the final product and the process of developing it, so that I can make a relatively simple pitch that won't get rejected immediately as "too complicated." Is there a way to do this with one year of "training wheels" as a stepping stone to full adoption?

Please offer any relevant experiences!

Thanks!

Click to expand...

The bolded part is what I was getting at. A commissioner generally knows how to approach everyone in the league behind-the-scenes and guage support. The "along for the ride" owners are generally the toughest to sell IDP to. I have a few suggestions, but like the others have said, we would like a little more info regarding your current league set-up.

I appreciate the inquiries.

It's a redraft league. I'm just an owner, but I suppose a bit of an activist owner.

The whole thing is moot now, as one of the owners I thought would be easiest to bring over to my side shot it down unequivocally. No big deal; that saves me a lot of trouble trying to pitch it to the others. I am now intending to start my own IDP league. Maybe I'll go all-in and make it a dynasty league!

What are some of the best resources you know of for starting/running an IDP league? Is there a generally-accepted "best" hosting site for IDP leagues?

Thanks again to everybody who posted.

a lot of people will suggest mfl but yahoo's really fine, too

i'd suggest at least 6 idp rostered -- gets kind of pointless if it's less than that

Sounds good. I've been playing Yahoo for years, so it's good to know it is a decent choice for IDP as well.

yeah, I play idp on yahoo and we haven't had any troubles

if you can get those guys to do more than 6 that might be good, but sometimes it's hard to get people to buy in.

maybe 2 lb, 2 db, 1 dl and a flex, but you can do anything -- split out s/cb, add more guys, or whatever.

I think if I was you I'd figure out a scoring system and put that in somewhere like fftoday, maybe, to generate a list of guys at each position so you can see how deep you'll be going in the pool.

http://www.fftoday.com/stats/index.htm

think you'd have to create the league on yahoo to get that list.

we've never split out pr/kr --- just give those points to whoever returns it, which also holds for jj's td catches.

personally, although we use a full 6 pts for a defensive score, I'd rather it be 3 or 4 due to their random and unpredictable nature.

we just draft them with everybody else, but they tend to score less than offensive guys, and the scarcity isn't the same, so they get drafted after the offensive guys, typically.

we've done anywhere from a half point to full point per tackle, and maybe 2 points for sack, but also half point for tackle for a loss --- you can do anything, though.

our system is probably considered tackle friendly.

I think the biggest issue that a lot of people don't consider is scarcity --- that's really the driving force behind value.

so, like I said, go to some site and put your full scoring system in there, multiply out roster spots by total league members, then see how deep you'll be going in each position, and also how sack vs tackle scoring impacts what you do.

I pretty much learned idp just off this board, but I've also been listening to podcasts jeff ratcliffe and ross miles do --- those guys are pretty sharp.

That was really helpful, Kool-Aid Larry. I am going to start the league and be the commissioner, so I can set the starting positions however I want and I'm sure people will be fine with it. They'll just be happy to get to try it out. I will take your advice and pursue that link when I get a bit more free time. Thanks a bunch!

I have linked our league rules. Scroll about half way down for the written rules.

I have been running an IDP league for 23 years. Our rules are very non-standard, but may help you with some ideas. Some of the unique things we do:

1- We play a best ball format. This really helps with new players who fear the work of IDP. We went to this about 7 years ago and everyone loves it.

2- Scoring is also very non-standard. I think one of the keys to a successful IDP league is that your top defensive players are just as valuable as the top offensive players. It really makes the draft much more unpredictable and fun. It also helps with trading.

3- We have an auction part to our draft- just the first few rounds so if you have the 9th pick, you still have a shot at the very best players on the board.

4- We also have a unique keeper system that has been in place for 4 years. It allows for multiple keepers, but ensures most of the best players get thrown back- keeping the draft fun and allowing a team to rebuild itself much quicker than full dynasty.

We use Myfantasyleague as the host. There is a cost to it, but for ten teams, it would be about $8 each. The site is customizable six ways to Sunday and can handle just about any thing you want.

Like I said, I hope it gives you some ideas. Good luck with your new league.

A 10 team league with so few starters won't be very interesting for IDP. When it's that watered down, you can just grab guys on waivers and it has almost no effect. Make the league 12 teams and at least 2 DL starting and 3 LBs, with a flex. It gets more interesting with more spots. I know people think they want to start small but it's just not very interesting with small rosters in my experience.

I should have checked back in a while ago to let you all know that I have been considering what you have posted and what you have linked. Thanks a bunch for all the ideas! It all is very helpful. I am taking my time with making any decisions, but I am generating ideas and kicking them around, and your input helps with that.

I am interested in hearing ideas about the ideal number of IDP starters, and at which positions. I'd like to include one or more flex spots. I've seen 2 DL, 2 LB, 2 DB, and 1 Flex touted multiple times. That's 7 spots. Anybody prefer other numbers of starters?

gliz said:

I should have checked back in a while ago to let you all know that I have been considering what you have posted and what you have linked. Thanks a bunch for all the ideas! It all is very helpful. I am taking my time with making any decisions, but I am generating ideas and kicking them around, and your input helps with that.

I am interested in hearing ideas about the ideal number of IDP starters, and at which positions. I'd like to include one or more flex spots. I've seen 2 DL, 2 LB, 2 DB, and 1 Flex touted multiple times. That's 7 spots. Anybody prefer other numbers of starters?

Click to expand...

I prefer full IDP (11 starters) - 1 DT, 2 DE, 4 LB, 2 S, 2 CB, / 2 DT, 2 DE, 3 LB, 2 S, 2 CB (flex is your DT/LB). Or if you want to go with just DL, LB and DB I like 3 of each.

Seems like 6 or 7 is too few, especially in a 10 team league. But you could start low and make a rule that IDP starters will increase next year or each of the next 2 or 3.

I'd say that's ok -- pretty typical of a lot of leagues, and I wouldn't go below that, anyway.

if you go too shallow it just ends up being better to stream than roster guys

personally, I like adding idp but you have to draw a balance with the people you recruit to the league.

if you know a bunch of hardcore idp guys you could expand on that, but newer idp players might get scared off if you give them too much to do.

like I said earlier, put your scoring in some site like fftoday and see who you'll end up using at the bottom.

I don't know if I have fftoday exactly updated with my scoring, but (2 lb + 1 flex) x 12 teams = 36 guys deep --- that's down around rolando mcclain, kj wright, and telvin smith in ppg, depending on how you count the injuries.

you'd just want to decide if that's deeper than you want to go, or if the guys in your league could navigate around guys like lamur and mauga

Kool-Aid Larry said:

I'd say that's ok -- pretty typical of a lot of leagues, and I wouldn't go below that, anyway.

if you go too shallow it just ends up being better to stream than roster guys

personally, I like adding idp but you have to draw a balance with the people you recruit to the league.

if you know a bunch of hardcore idp guys you could expand on that, but newer idp players might get scared off if you give them too much to do.

like I said earlier, put your scoring in some site like fftoday and see who you'll end up using at the bottom.

I don't know if I have fftoday exactly updated with my scoring, but (2 lb + 1 flex) x 12 teams = 36 guys deep --- that's down around rolando mcclain, kj wright, and telvin smith in ppg, depending on how you count the injuries.

you'd just want to decide if that's deeper than you want to go, or if the guys in your league could navigate around guys like lamur and mauga

Click to expand...

I did that, and it showed me just how few of the defensive players I actually know. Just looking at the list, outside of a handful of players, they seem interchangeable in terms of how much effort would be required to navigate around them. That's okay with me, as I am wanting to learn about them anyway, but I am having doubts as to whether the guys I'd be playing with have sufficient interest to make it a good idea to go deep. But I do hear the comments that it's not interesting if there is no scarcity. I guess it really comes down to assessing the other owners interest/commitment to the concept.

For the record, LB #34-39 according to the scoring I entered (based upon 2014 stats) were:

J. Laurinaitis (I've heard of him)

G. Hodges

D. Hawthorne

R. McClain (and him)

T. Smith

J. McClain

The Man With No Name said:

gliz said:

I should have checked back in a while ago to let you all know that I have been considering what you have posted and what you have linked. Thanks a bunch for all the ideas! It all is very helpful. I am taking my time with making any decisions, but I am generating ideas and kicking them around, and your input helps with that.

I am interested in hearing ideas about the ideal number of IDP starters, and at which positions. I'd like to include one or more flex spots. I've seen 2 DL, 2 LB, 2 DB, and 1 Flex touted multiple times. That's 7 spots. Anybody prefer other numbers of starters?

Click to expand...

I prefer full IDP (11 starters) - 1 DT, 2 DE, 4 LB, 2 S, 2 CB, / 2 DT, 2 DE, 3 LB, 2 S, 2 CB (flex is your DT/LB). Or if you want to go with just DL, LB and DB I like 3 of each.

Seems like 6 or 7 is too few, especially in a 10 team league. But you could start low and make a rule that IDP starters will increase next year or each of the next 2 or 3.

Click to expand...

That is where my thinking was headed, too. Then I thought maybe 11 on each side of the ball, which opens up another can of worms with the offensive positions, but I can handle that later. I'm far more adept at those considerations than the IDP ones. Whether it's 11 or some other number, I want to have it equal on both sides of the ball.

I'd like to hear people's thoughts on how much IDP should score per game in comparison to offensive players. I have seen comments that having them score in similar ranges makes the draft more interesting and facilitates trades throughout the season. Any other considerations?

one of the things I would be careful about is the scarcity issue

sometimes people want to make fantasy closer to reality --- like the 11 on 11 thing, but in real football there's 5 offensive linemen you don't use in fantasy.

what you really want to do is balance the scarcity just right at each position if you want to keep it interesting.

gliz said:

Kool-Aid Larry said:

I'd say that's ok -- pretty typical of a lot of leagues, and I wouldn't go below that, anyway.

if you go too shallow it just ends up being better to stream than roster guys

personally, I like adding idp but you have to draw a balance with the people you recruit to the league.

if you know a bunch of hardcore idp guys you could expand on that, but newer idp players might get scared off if you give them too much to do.

like I said earlier, put your scoring in some site like fftoday and see who you'll end up using at the bottom.

I don't know if I have fftoday exactly updated with my scoring, but (2 lb + 1 flex) x 12 teams = 36 guys deep --- that's down around rolando mcclain, kj wright, and telvin smith in ppg, depending on how you count the injuries.

you'd just want to decide if that's deeper than you want to go, or if the guys in your league could navigate around guys like lamur and mauga

Click to expand...

I did that, and it showed me just how few of the defensive players I actually know. Just looking at the list, outside of a handful of players, they seem interchangeable in terms of how much effort would be required to navigate around them. That's okay with me, as I am wanting to learn about them

Click to expand...

yeah, just bear in mind we aren't so much comparing #34 to #36 as we are #10 to #36 when we talk about scarcity.

you could probably think of it like the wr position that people are more familiar with --- there will be a lot of scrubby guys rotating around as your wr3/4, but the top 10 type guys carry value simply because the alternative is to pick up a scrubby #36 guy if your top 10 guy isn't available due to byes, injury, etc.

also, I added that flex in as a default third lb, as that's how it tends to play out, although that can change depending on your scoring.

if you just rostered 1 wr or lb it would kill both the scarcity and value of these top guys.

Yep, that all makes sense. Lots to consider. I'll have to stew on it for a while. Thanks for the help!

In order to make defensive players somewhat comparable to offensive players in value, you have one of two choices:

1) Make the roster deep on the defensive side of the ball

2) Seriously inflate IDP scoring so that defensive players are scoring 2x what offensive players are scoring.

I prefer the former option. In my league, we run with 7 offensive starters (which is one more non-OL than is on the field at any time), and so we did the same with defense, starting 12 IDPs. I like this setup best, as it simulates what you're doing on the offensive side of the ball, featuring the players on the field at any time plus one "rotational" kind of player. It gives nice flexibility.

TheMathNinja said:

In order to make defensive players somewhat comparable to offensive players in value, you have one of two choices:

1) Make the roster deep on the defensive side of the ball

2) Seriously inflate IDP scoring so that defensive players are scoring 2x what offensive players are scoring.

I prefer the former option. In my league, we run with 7 offensive starters (which is one more non-OL than is on the field at any time), and so we did the same with defense, starting 12 IDPs. I like this setup best, as it simulates what you're doing on the offensive side of the ball, featuring the players on the field at any time plus one "rotational" kind of player. It gives nice flexibility.

Click to expand...

I've been tinkering with this stuff off camera for the past few weeks. What I am currently considering is this:

QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, TE, K, SUPERFLEX

3 DL, 3 LB, 3 DB, 2 IDP FLEX

Using the Draft Dominator (using last year's projections), the above roster requirements produce a VBD ranking with a blend of offensive players projected to be selected in the first two rounds (8 QB, 4 RB, 6 WR, 2 TE). I like that mix. Of course, the IDP guys don't really get selected en masse until round 6 and beyond.

I think what bothers me most is that the IDP guys seem so interchangeable. The drop-off just isn't very steep. I'm not sure if there's much to be done about that, though.

gliz said:

TheMathNinja said:

In order to make defensive players somewhat comparable to offensive players in value, you have one of two choices:

1) Make the roster deep on the defensive side of the ball

2) Seriously inflate IDP scoring so that defensive players are scoring 2x what offensive players are scoring.

I prefer the former option. In my league, we run with 7 offensive starters (which is one more non-OL than is on the field at any time), and so we did the same with defense, starting 12 IDPs. I like this setup best, as it simulates what you're doing on the offensive side of the ball, featuring the players on the field at any time plus one "rotational" kind of player. It gives nice flexibility.

Click to expand...

I've been tinkering with this stuff off camera for the past few weeks. What I am currently considering is this:

QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, TE, K, SUPERFLEX

3 DL, 3 LB, 3 DB, 2 IDP FLEX

Using the Draft Dominator (using last year's projections), the above roster requirements produce a VBD ranking with a blend of offensive players projected to be selected in the first two rounds (8 QB, 4 RB, 6 WR, 2 TE). I like that mix. Of course, the IDP guys don't really get selected en masse until round 6 and beyond.

I think what bothers me most is that the IDP guys seem so interchangeable. The drop-off just isn't very steep. I'm not sure if there's much to be done about that, though.

Click to expand...

Yes, this is the problem you will run into when you have a deep offensive starting roster but relatively shallow IDP starting roster (as you have above). Your RB's and WR's will have relatively high VBD because the baseline starter is going to be rather low. Some of it will have to do with your scoring system also. There tends to be more IDP separation in scoring systems that lean "big play" as opposed to "tackle-heavy". I use an analytically-based IDP scoring that revolves around "expected points added" and it makes for pretty good defensive value, but still not quite at NFL levels (http://football13.myfantasyleague.com/2015/options?L=27312&O=09).%C2'>

gliz said:

TheMathNinja said:

In order to make defensive players somewhat comparable to offensive players in value, you have one of two choices:

1) Make the roster deep on the defensive side of the ball

2) Seriously inflate IDP scoring so that defensive players are scoring 2x what offensive players are scoring.

I prefer the former option. In my league, we run with 7 offensive starters (which is one more non-OL than is on the field at any time), and so we did the same with defense, starting 12 IDPs. I like this setup best, as it simulates what you're doing on the offensive side of the ball, featuring the players on the field at any time plus one "rotational" kind of player. It gives nice flexibility.

Click to expand...

I've been tinkering with this stuff off camera for the past few weeks. What I am currently considering is this:

QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, TE, K, SUPERFLEX

3 DL, 3 LB, 3 DB, 2 IDP FLEX

Using the Draft Dominator (using last year's projections), the above roster requirements produce a VBD ranking with a blend of offensive players projected to be selected in the first two rounds (8 QB, 4 RB, 6 WR, 2 TE). I like that mix. Of course, the IDP guys don't really get selected en masse until round 6 and beyond.

I think what bothers me most is that the IDP guys seem so interchangeable. The drop-off just isn't very steep. I'm not sure if there's much to be done about that, though.

Click to expand...

I would go 2 DL's and 3 IDP Flex. The thing with DL's is after the first 5-10, they score extremely randomly. One game they'll get you 5 tackles, and then they'll go 3-4 games of just one tackle. You'll drive yourself crazy trying to find one that scores even remotely consistently. Just my

Also, I did a pretty in-depth scoring analysis a couple of years ago for our league. What I found was that the value of LB's was almost identical to WR's all the way down to WR/LB 65. DB's have lesser value at the top, but more value than any position starting at DB 25-30. DL's have a value similair to TE's, the first 5-10 hold good value, but after that it's a crapshoot.

TheMathNinja said:

gliz said:

TheMathNinja said:

In order to make defensive players somewhat comparable to offensive players in value, you have one of two choices:

1) Make the roster deep on the defensive side of the ball

2) Seriously inflate IDP scoring so that defensive players are scoring 2x what offensive players are scoring.

I prefer the former option. In my league, we run with 7 offensive starters (which is one more non-OL than is on the field at any time), and so we did the same with defense, starting 12 IDPs. I like this setup best, as it simulates what you're doing on the offensive side of the ball, featuring the players on the field at any time plus one "rotational" kind of player. It gives nice flexibility.

Click to expand...

I've been tinkering with this stuff off camera for the past few weeks. What I am currently considering is this:

QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, TE, K, SUPERFLEX

3 DL, 3 LB, 3 DB, 2 IDP FLEX

Using the Draft Dominator (using last year's projections), the above roster requirements produce a VBD ranking with a blend of offensive players projected to be selected in the first two rounds (8 QB, 4 RB, 6 WR, 2 TE). I like that mix. Of course, the IDP guys don't really get selected en masse until round 6 and beyond.

I think what bothers me most is that the IDP guys seem so interchangeable. The drop-off just isn't very steep. I'm not sure if there's much to be done about that, though.

Click to expand...

Yes, this is the problem you will run into when you have a deep offensive starting roster but relatively shallow IDP starting roster (as you have above). Your RB's and WR's will have relatively high VBD because the baseline starter is going to be rather low. Some of it will have to do with your scoring system also. There tends to be more IDP separation in scoring systems that lean "big play" as opposed to "tackle-heavy". I use an analytically-based IDP scoring that revolves around "expected points added" and it makes for pretty good defensive value, but still not quite at NFL levels (

Click to expand...

But does that separation not also come with rather difficult-to-project variance, so that more randomness is introduced into the league's scoring, diluting the skill factor associated with projecting scoring both pre-draft and throughout the season?

Jedi Knight said:

gliz said:

TheMathNinja said:

In order to make defensive players somewhat comparable to offensive players in value, you have one of two choices:

1) Make the roster deep on the defensive side of the ball

2) Seriously inflate IDP scoring so that defensive players are scoring 2x what offensive players are scoring.

I prefer the former option. In my league, we run with 7 offensive starters (which is one more non-OL than is on the field at any time), and so we did the same with defense, starting 12 IDPs. I like this setup best, as it simulates what you're doing on the offensive side of the ball, featuring the players on the field at any time plus one "rotational" kind of player. It gives nice flexibility.

Click to expand...

I've been tinkering with this stuff off camera for the past few weeks. What I am currently considering is this:

QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, TE, K, SUPERFLEX

3 DL, 3 LB, 3 DB, 2 IDP FLEX

Using the Draft Dominator (using last year's projections), the above roster requirements produce a VBD ranking with a blend of offensive players projected to be selected in the first two rounds (8 QB, 4 RB, 6 WR, 2 TE). I like that mix. Of course, the IDP guys don't really get selected en masse until round 6 and beyond.

I think what bothers me most is that the IDP guys seem so interchangeable. The drop-off just isn't very steep. I'm not sure if there's much to be done about that, though.

Click to expand...

I would go 2 DL's and 3 IDP Flex. The thing with DL's is after the first 5-10, they score extremely randomly. One game they'll get you 5 tackles, and then they'll go 3-4 games of just one tackle. You'll drive yourself crazy trying to find one that scores even remotely consistently. Just my

Also, I did a pretty in-depth scoring analysis a couple of years ago for our league. What I found was that the value of LB's was almost identical to WR's all the way down to WR/LB 65. DB's have lesser value at the top, but more value than any position starting at DB 25-30. DL's have a value similair to TE's, the first 5-10 hold good value, but after that it's a crapshoot.

Click to expand...

I'll play around with that. Seems to make sense on the surface.

Another, not directly related, question for the forum: any thoughts on differentiating the scoring of defensive stats for DL vs. LB vs. DB? So that a DL scores more for a solo tackle than does a LB, for example? I'm not crazy about it, but I do give TE 1.5 PPR and .15 per yard, so it's not unheard of for me to sign off on something like that.

i did a search and this thread kind of fits my needs, so i wanted to build off it:

i'm a commish of a 12 team, redraft w/2 keepers. 4pt passing TD, 0.5 ppr, std scoring otherwise. We do an auction draft w./$200 budget

starting position: QB, 2RB, 2WR, flex, TE, Def, K, 6 bench

people have grown tired of the team defense so they want to try IDP. But even the people backing IDP have never done IDP, so the suggestion was to just have one IDP flex position in lieu of the defense. In researching the possibility i checked this forum and found this thread.... and I gather from this thread that you need to have at least 3-5 IDP starters to make it worthwhile?

I don't think we'll get the support to have 3-5 IDP starters on top of the offensive starters.... my league is just tired of team defense and it looks like the single IDP flex will be kind of a stupid idea? Or do I run with it and if the league likes IDP we can slowly look to expand IDP starting spots? any thoughts would be appreciated

iamkoza said:

i did a search and this thread kind of fits my needs, so i wanted to build off it:

i'm a commish of a 12 team, redraft w/2 keepers. 4pt passing TD, 0.5 ppr, std scoring otherwise. We do an auction draft w./$200 budget

starting position: QB, 2RB, 2WR, flex, TE, Def, K, 6 bench

people have grown tired of the team defense so they want to try IDP. But even the people backing IDP have never done IDP, so the suggestion was to just have one IDP flex position in lieu of the defense. In researching the possibility i checked this forum and found this thread.... and I gather from this thread that you need to have at least 3-5 IDP starters to make it worthwhile?

I don't think we'll get the support to have 3-5 IDP starters on top of the offensive starters.... my league is just tired of team defense and it looks like the single IDP flex will be kind of a stupid idea? Or do I run with it and if the league likes IDP we can slowly look to expand IDP starting spots? any thoughts would be appreciated

Click to expand...

As was stated in a couple previous posts the key to make IDP's worthwhile is to have a considerable starting lineup for numbers (equal offense and IDP works well) and to make the scoring system equal across the board.

By that I mean an elite QB = RB = DL = LB = TE = etc.

If each position at each tier scores roughly the same points that makes each position equal in value and really gives flexibitiy in drafting a team. This really makes the draft a lot more fun.

We have tinkered with scoring over the years to try and meet this format and it is very difficult especially with the NFL changing to a more air attack and RBBC.

I would strongly suggest you not just add "IDP" as a position, but differentiate DL, LB and DB. Maybe 2 starters at each, for example. Otherwise, with a small number of IDP starters, it's too easy to just stream LBs all season long, and the IDP get treated like extra kicker positions once the handful of true elites are drafted.

I had a league that went from team D to IDP, initially with just "start 3 defensive players." Stretching it out to "start 5" made a big difference in terms of people paying attention to their IDPs.

Also, your defensive scoring will matter a lot. The balance between rewarding tackle accumulators, vs. less frequent big play makers is key.

My long standing league made the transition over to IDP the past 3 years. I had advocated for IDP over a decade ago but was shot down by everyone wanting to keep it "simple" and "traditional". So I gave up on it. Then 4 years ago out of the blue someone brought it up at the draft and it had traction as people seemed now ready to take the next step. But some weren't so sure, mainly those that hadn't done IDP before (about half our league is in another league that is IDP).

So we tried a stepped approach and it actually worked really well as weird as it sounds.

Our offense is pretty typical starters, 1 QB, 1 RB, 1 WR, 1 TE, 3 Flex RB/WR/TE and 1 PK. Rostered 15 (was 17 with 2 Def teams). PPR with standard scoring otherwise (1 per 10 rush, etc.). Also it's a $150 buy in with $5 per transaction.

So what we did was the first year we rostered 9 IDP and started just 1 each (DL, LB, DB). This would mean that most everyone would have a stud to start at each position thus not giving the "IDP vets" a huge advantage. Rostering 9 would mean that the newbies would get used to names they had never heard of plus have their bye weeks and such covered so most teams wouldn't need to spend a lot on transactions.

We also did a separate IDP draft. This is the part I never thought would work but it did. After 15 rounds of offense we did 9 rounds separate IDP draft. Rosters were also kept at those levels all season.

2nd year...everyone had a blast but weren't quite ready to make the plunge with fully integrated draft so we kept the same parameters with a 9 round separate draft and starting 1 each but I insisted that at the 3rd year we either quit being babies and go all in or just dump the whole IDP idea.

3rd year (last year) we went all in. Expanded to 13 IDP roster spots, start 2 each plus 1 Flex (7 total to match the 7 offense + kicker) and fully integrated the draft so it's just 28 rounds, draft 13 offense, 13 IDP and 2 kickers. Everyone had a blast and we're not changing anything right now. I'm going to propose to have 1 more IDP starter but I don't really care either way. One thing we did do is open up rosters to full flex after the draft so people could reduce the number of IDPs they have or have more if they want. Thought about just having a full flex draft with no limits but we are a keeper league with contracts based on the round drafted. And what we don't want to happen is for teams to go bare minimum and just draft 8 IDP and load up on late round RBs and WRs and just suck the market dry for those players and then beef up IDP as needed during the bye weeks. So we'll probably just keep roster limits during the draft that are lifted after.

Scoring....real simple: Every player no matter their positions scores the same. JJ Watt catches a TD? Well then he gets the PPR, receiving yards and TD. QB tackles the guy that just intercepted his pass? Then he gets the points for the tackle. And so on.

IDPs do need to score something so that it matters. My league is a bit more balanced to tackle heavy. 2 pts per tackle, 1 pt per assist, 4 pts per big play (there is more but that's the basics most care about). About 40% of non QBs in the top 100 scorers are IDP so we feel that's pretty balanced without going crazy. We originally had big plays at 6 pts (it is the TD of the IDP after all) but several owners didn't like how variable it was so I toned it down a bit.

Been a while since I weighed in on this, and I've basically finished things up, if for no other reason than the season is almost here. Thought this might be the best place to post what I've decided to do in Year 1 of my new IDP league.

Lineups will be 3DB, 3DL, 3LB, 1 IDP flex. So we're probably going about 24 deep at DB and DL, and 32 deep at LB. I think this is a decent starting place for our first year.

Scoring leans slightly toward big plays as follows:

Solo tackle: 1.5*

Assist: .75*

Sack: 1.5*

Tackle for loss: 2*

Interception: 5

Fumble forced: 2.5

Fumble recovered: 2.5

TD: 6

Safety: 4

Blocked kick: 4

Pass defended: 3

Turnover return yards: 0.1/yard

* - These stack, so that a solo sack for a loss of yards (i.e. most sacks) score 1.5 + 1.5 + 2 = 5 points

As always, your thoughts are welcome.

As an aside, but very noteworthy for me, Yahoo has added PPFD (Points Per First Down) scoring. Bye-bye PPR! Hello PPFD! This made it easy to choose Yahoo for the new league.

gliz said:

As an aside, but very noteworthy for me, Yahoo has added PPFD (Points Per First Down) scoring. Bye-bye PPR! Hello PPFD! This made it easy to choose Yahoo for the new league.

Click to expand...

Just FYI for others, MFL has had that stat for a few years. Unsure on other web sites.