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***Official 2016 Baseball Hall of Fame Thread (1 Viewer)

Eephus

Eephus

Footballguy
Veteran's Committee ballot announced:

Pre-Integration Era Committee: Doc Adams, Sam Breadon, Bill Dahlen, Wes Ferrell, Garry Herrmann, Marty Marion, Frank McCormick, Harry Stovey, Chris von der Ahe and Bucky Walters

Candidate bios here

Dahlen is the only player who comes close to measuring up by modern standards (75 WAR) although several other players would pass the "better than the worst HoFer" criteria. Marty Marion is just a ridiculous candidate--his top three B-R comps are Rafael Ramirez, Scott Fletcher and Mike Bordick.

Von der Ahe was an important figure in the growth of the game in the 19th century but I'm not really big on inducting owners over players.

 
Eephus said:
Von der Ahe was an important figure in the growth of the game in the 19th century but I'm not really big on inducting owners over players.
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The Summer of Beer and Whiskey was a really fun read. Von der Ahe was quite the character.

 
2016 Ballot Announced

Garret Anderson

Brad Ausmus

Jeff Bagwell

Barry Bonds

Luis Castillo

Roger Clemens

David Eckstein

Jim Edmonds

Nomar Garciaparra

Troy Glaus

Ken Griffey Jr.

Mark Gruzielanek

Mike Hampton

Trevor Hoffman

Jason Kendall

Jeff Kent

Mike Lowell

Edgar Martinez

Fred McGriff

Mark McGwire

Mike Mussina

Mike Piazza

Tim Raines

Curt Schilling

Gary Sheffield

Lee Smith

Sammy Sosa

Mike Sweeney

Alan Trammell

Billy Wagner

Larry Walker

Randy Winn

 
I would listen to arguments for at least half the ballot. Scratch the closers and the players currently under BBWAA PED protest and that list in under 10, but I'd listen to arguments for at least half the ballot.

And if you don't think Jim Edmonds isn't a first-ballot HOFer, you hate America almost as much as you hate frosted tips. So #### you. Seriously. ####. You.

 
Bruce Dickinson said:
Ramblin Wreck said:
Garrett Anderson and David Eckstein? Am I missing something?
Click to expand...
10 years of MLB service time gets you on the HOF ballot once. At least 5% of votes cast keeps you on the ballot. 75% gets you in the Hall.

Doubtful Anderson or Eckstein are on the ballot next year.
Click to expand...
Guys with sufficient service time who didn't make the ballot

Jose Guillen

Cristian Guzman

Bob Howry

Gary Matthews Jr.

Bengie Molina

Russ Ortiz

Chan Ho Park

Russ Springer

Fernando Tatis

Jeff Weaver

 
Eephus said:
Bruce Dickinson said:
Ramblin Wreck said:
Garrett Anderson and David Eckstein? Am I missing something?
Click to expand...
10 years of MLB service time gets you on the HOF ballot once. At least 5% of votes cast keeps you on the ballot. 75% gets you in the Hall.

Doubtful Anderson or Eckstein are on the ballot next year.
Click to expand...
Guys with sufficient service time who didn't make the ballotJose Guillen

Cristian Guzman

Bob Howry

Gary Matthews Jr.

Bengie Molina

Russ Ortiz

Chan Ho Park

Russ Springer

Fernando Tatis

Jeff Weaver
Click to expand...
Is there a stated criteria for initial inclusion in the ballot other than service time, retirement time, on the eligible list (or whatever phrasing they used to exclude Pete Rose)?ETA: found it. Turns out there is a Screening Committee. Six people who review the list of newly eligibles. If at least two of the six think the player is worthy of the ballot, the player is on it. One or fewer, player is dropped from consideration.

Bummer that five of the six Screening Committee members never saw Fernando Tatis play.

Looks like I also misstated BBWAA's definition of 10 years. It's not 10 years of service time the way the league calculates service time for arbitration, free agency, and pension eligibility. It's "played in 10 different seasons".

 
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Eephus said:
2016 Ballot Announced

Garret Anderson

Brad Ausmus

Jeff Bagwell

Barry Bonds

Luis Castillo

Roger Clemens

David Eckstein

Jim Edmonds

Nomar Garciaparra

Troy Glaus

Ken Griffey Jr.

Mark Gruzielanek

Mike Hampton

Trevor Hoffman

Jason Kendall

Jeff Kent

Mike Lowell

Edgar Martinez

Fred McGriff

Mark McGwire

Mike Mussina

Mike Piazza

Tim Raines

Curt Schilling

Gary Sheffield

Lee Smith

Sammy Sosa

Mike Sweeney

Alan Trammell

Billy Wagner

Larry Walker

Randy Winn
Click to expand...
I would need to trade for some innings, but that is one hell of a WIS team. Bonds, Griffey, Walker in the all left handed OF. Piazza, Bagwell (over Big Mac), Kent, Nomar, Glaus in the all right handed infield. Roger, Mussina, Schilling, Hampton a solid 4 man rotation. Give me 6 innings min every start. Smith, Hoffman, Wagner to close out the game.

McGwire and Sosa first two sticks off the bench. Trammell, Lowell, Eckstein, defensive replacements. Jason Kendall for the awkward runs to first.

 
Jeff Bagwell
Barry Bonds
Roger Clemens
Jim Edmonds
Ken Griffey Jr.
Mike Mussina
Mike Piazza
Tim Raines
Alan Trammell
Billy Wagner

limited to 10

 
Eephus said:
2016 Ballot Announced

Garret Anderson

Brad Ausmus

Jeff Bagwell

Barry Bonds

Luis Castillo

Roger Clemens

David Eckstein

Jim Edmonds

Nomar Garciaparra

Troy Glaus

Ken Griffey Jr.

Mark Gruzielanek

Mike Hampton

Trevor Hoffman

Jason Kendall

Jeff Kent

Mike Lowell

Edgar Martinez

Fred McGriff

Mark McGwire

Mike Mussina

Mike Piazza

Tim Raines

Curt Schilling

Gary Sheffield

Lee Smith

Sammy Sosa

Mike Sweeney

Alan Trammell

Billy Wagner

Larry Walker

Randy Winn
Click to expand...
If I had a ballot...

 
Bagwell

Griffey, Jr.

Raines

Trammell

...are the four no-brainers for me. After that, I'd certainly consider:

Hoffman

Kent

Martinez

McGriff

Mussina

Piazza

Schilling

Walker

Obviously, couldn't vote for all eight of those, with the limit being 10. Would have to review them more closely.

 
Bagwell

Bonds

Clemens

Edmonds

Griffey Jr

Martinez

McGwire

Mussina

Piazza

Raines

Limited to 10. IMO more than 10 are deserving, and that's even with my admitted bias against closers.

 
Some of this voting (as always) is completely mind boggling.

There are folks who are voting in PED guys. Good for them. I agree. But there are three dudes, David Borges, Chris DeLuca, and Steve Wine, who voted for Sammy Sosa, but not Jeff Bagwell.

Or maybe they just think that home runs are the only stat that matters?

 
the moops said:
Some of this voting (as always) is completely mind boggling.

There are folks who are voting in PED guys. Good for them. I agree. But there are three dudes, David Borges, Chris DeLuca, and Steve Wine, who voted for Sammy Sosa, but not Jeff Bagwell.

Or maybe they just think that home runs are the only stat that matters?
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I don't know the specific circumstances of those ballots, but I have seen some voters state that they think Player X is more deserving than Player Y, but voted for Player Y over X as part of a strategy to keep Player Y on the ballot.

It could be something like that. Or they could just dig the long ball.

 
How good was Tim Raines? Didn't he just steal a bunch of bases? I only remember him from the tail end of his career.

 
Annyong said:
How good was Tim Raines? Didn't he just steal a bunch of bases? I only remember him from the tail end of his career.
Click to expand...
Really good hitter. Never hit 20 HRs in a season, but very few NLers in the 1980s did - too many multipurpose stadiums 380 or so to the gaps. Bunch of years over .300 and won a batting title. Not just a slap hitter, either. He could drive the ball into the gaps for a bunch of doubles, and leg out some triples.

Awesome base-stealer, which mattered more in his era. Incredibly efficient base-stealer, too. Guys like Vince Coleman stole more bases but got thrown out on the basepaths a lot more than Raines did.

Outstanding range in the field, especially in left. Again, with all the Astroturf caverns of the time, speed in the outfield made a difference. Because he was so fast, he could get away with playing shallow, challenging flares and baserunners. If a ball was hit over his head, he could just run it down.

Career WAR is 69.1. Not eye-popping for a corner outfielder, but the next three outfielders behind him in career WAR are Tony Gwynn, Al Simmons, and Carlos Beltran.

 
Annyong said:
Fair to say he was a poor man's Rickey Henderson?
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Fair. Henderson had more power, had a better batting eye, and was an elite player for a lot longer. Raines and Henderson broke out at about the same time and were compared to each other a lot.

 
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I bought into the Trammell hype. Looks like he's getting a push from the last time on the ballot, but won't make it. Hope the veteran's committee puts him in at some point.

 
Gawain said:
I bought into the Trammell hype. Looks like he's getting a push from the last time on the ballot, but won't make it. Hope the veteran's committee puts him in at some point.
Click to expand...
The 84 Tigers were the very goodest team of all-time.

 
Update? i know Piazza is looking good and Bags finally getting some respect with 83% of votes so far. The cull seems to be working.

 
Is there any reason why Clemens and Bonds shouldn't have the exact same # of votes? They are both steroid users, both complete #####, and both first ballot hall of famers based on their skill.

Why would someone vote for one, and not the other?

 
the moops said:
Is there any reason why Clemens and Bonds shouldn't have the exact same # of votes? They are both steroid users, both complete #####, and both first ballot hall of famers based on their skill.

Why would someone vote for one, and not the other?
Click to expand...
The way I've seen some explain: Bonds was a HOFer before he allegedly started taking steroids. Steroids just took him into the stratosphere. Clemens would not have been a HOFer but for his second life after starting to take steroids.

 
Bruce Dickinson said:
I would listen to arguments for at least half the ballot. Scratch the closers and the players currently under BBWAA PED protest and that list in under 10, but I'd listen to arguments for at least half the ballot.

And if you don't think Jim Edmonds isn't a first-ballot HOFer, you hate America almost as much as you hate frosted tips. So #### you. Seriously. ####. You.
Click to expand...
Frosted tips and jorts

 
Wrigley said:
Bruce Dickinson said:
I would listen to arguments for at least half the ballot. Scratch the closers and the players currently under BBWAA PED protest and that list in under 10, but I'd listen to arguments for at least half the ballot.

And if you don't think Jim Edmonds isn't a first-ballot HOFer, you hate America almost as much as you hate frosted tips. So #### you. Seriously. ####. You.
Click to expand...
Frosted tips and jorts
Click to expand...
And half-shirts. Don't forget the half-shirts.

 
Annyong said:
Edmonds was just an OBP guy right? He was really good at making some catches look extraordinary.
Click to expand...
He had some power and threw out a lot of baserunners, too.

His career WAR (60.3) is far from HOF lock territory, but it's higher than several other guys on the ballot or near-future consideration: Pizza, Vlad, Sosa, Ichiro, Rivera, Kent, McGriff.

 
My guess Griffey and Piazza get in

But I think Bonds & Clemens and even Bagwell all deserve to be in

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Bruce Dickinson said:
Annyong said:
Edmonds was just an OBP guy right? He was really good at making some catches look extraordinary.
Click to expand...
He had some power and threw out a lot of baserunners, too.

His career WAR (60.3) is far from HOF lock territory, but it's higher than several other guys on the ballot or near-future consideration: Pizza, Vlad, Sosa, Ichiro, Rivera, Kent, McGriff.
Click to expand...
Not fair to include a catcher on that list... especially the greatest hitting catcher of all time (whos also criminally underrated defensively where, even with his weak arm, he was a plus defensive player overall)

 
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