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:MERGED: *** JaMarcus Russell Thread *** (1 Viewer)

I see, but I think his talent and skill set pretty much handle themselves.

His arm is the best I have ever seen in college football.

 
Based on their college career it has to be VY. VY beat a stacked USC team in the Rose Bowl(home game for USC) for the national championship. JR beat a soft ND team in the Sugar Bowl(home game for LSU). Both performances were stellar but clearly the real pressure was on VY as the game went down to the last possession. JR was playing with a lead the entire game and did not really have any pressure of winning with the big lead. We cannot use VY's NFL performance to compare to JR because JR has not played a down yet. If JR plays next year then we can compare the two as NFL QBs.

 
ILoveMyLions said:
redman said:
In short:

Young:

More mobile

More athletic

Superior leader
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I think you have to add to that Young's intangibles besides leadership to that list. His poise under pressure and rising to the occassion are perhaps his greatest strengths as a football player. I haven't seen that nearly as much with Russell. The Florida game, and perhaps the Tennessee and Auburn game are good examples of that. Young refused to lose and lead many comebacks against what some would consider superior opponents and/or defenses his last year in college.
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:own3d:
 
the question should be how smart and hard working is russell?

is he just daunte culpepper or can he be ben roethlisberger.

 
redman said:
ILoveMyLions said:
redman said:
In short:

Young:

More mobile

More athletic

Superior leader
Click to expand...
I think you have to add to that Young's intangibles besides leadership to that list. His poise under pressure and rising to the occassion are perhaps his greatest strengths as a football player. I haven't seen that nearly as much with Russell. The Florida game, and perhaps the Tennessee and Auburn game are good examples of that. Young refused to lose and lead many comebacks against what some would consider superior opponents and/or defenses his last year in college.
Click to expand...
:own3d:
Click to expand...
I don't know if you understood what I was saying, but I see leadership as one quality, and playing well under pressure as another.
 
redman said:
cowboyz said:
the question should be how smart and hard working is russell?

is he just daunte culpepper or can he be ben roethlisberger.
Click to expand...
:own3d:
Click to expand...
well relatively :whoosh: . i couldn't think of another large guy that had ok movement that was accurate and good. i was thinking byron leftwich, but ben looks to be better. and byron isn't mobile.ben wonderlic 25

daunte 15

 
cowboyz said:
redman said:
cowboyz said:
the question should be how smart and hard working is russell?

is he just daunte culpepper or can he be ben roethlisberger.
Click to expand...
:whoosh:
Click to expand...
well relatively :lol: . i couldn't think of another large guy that had ok movement that was accurate and good. i was thinking byron leftwich, but ben looks to be better. and byron isn't mobile.ben wonderlic 25

daunte 15
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I believe that any wonderlic should be adjusted downwards by at least 15 points for any QB who refuses to wear a helmet while riding a motorcycle. :own3d:
 
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redman said:
Ignoring for the moment that Young has actually played in the NFL and successfully led his team to victory, I don't think these two guys can be compared fully. Young runs like a significantly smaller guy and and is able to use that ability to avoid sacks and scramble for yards. He's learning how to pass in the NFL and will undoubtedly use that mobility to successfully buy time to make passing plays. I think, coming out of college, Russell will have better raw passing skills than Young, and perhaps the strongest throwing arm in the league right away. He is clearly less mobile than Young (Russell's aspirations to be compared to Randal Cunningham aside :whoosh: ), so there's already a ceiling on his abilities. In short:Young:More mobileMore athleticSuperior leaderRussell: Better passer (coming out of college)Stronger armI would roughly equate them (again, as we see them coming out of college) in terms of their draft value, but obviously its for different reasons.
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:own3d: I agree with the conclusion. I'll add that they are both special "game breaking" QBs that can defeat a defense even when they have the perfect game plan and execute it well.
 
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It's cute that 50% of the people posting here didn't even know who Russel was two days ago. Most of them had this post during the Sugar Bowl.

"I never saw Russel play before tonight, but OMFGZOZROERS?!?!!? OGMGMG?SSF ^^^^ !@#@!# he's a freakin GOD! He's got the body of Cpepp, the instincts of Marino, the arm of Elway, the speed of Vick, and the heard of Favre. Although I've never heard of him before tonight, I'm pretty sure he's the best QB prospect ever. OMFGORZ I just wet myself"

 
billyjoe said:
It's cute that 50% of the people posting here didn't even know who Russel was two days ago. Most of them had this post during the Sugar Bowl."I never saw Russel play before tonight, but OMFGZOZROERS?!?!!? OGMGMG?SSF ^^^^ !@#@!# he's a freakin GOD! He's got the body of Cpepp, the instincts of Marino, the arm of Elway, the speed of Vick, and the heard of Favre. Although I've never heard of him before tonight, I'm pretty sure he's the best QB prospect ever. OMFGORZ I just wet myself"
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We only wish we were as smart and well-informed as you. And married to as beautiful of a sister. :(
 
pantherclub said:
His arm is the best I have ever seen in college football.
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Easily, imo. No one comes close. Top 3 prospect on physical tools alone, and an easy #1 overall if the class wasn't so strong (Peterson, Thomas and Johnson all being elite prospects).
 
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redman said:
Ignoring for the moment that Young has actually played in the NFL and successfully led his team to victory, I don't think these two guys can be compared fully. Young runs like a significantly smaller guy and and is able to use that ability to avoid sacks and scramble for yards. He's learning how to pass in the NFL and will undoubtedly use that mobility to successfully buy time to make passing plays. I think, coming out of college, Russell will have better raw passing skills than Young, and perhaps the strongest throwing arm in the league right away. He is clearly less mobile than Young (Russell's aspirations to be compared to Randal Cunningham aside :banned: ), so there's already a ceiling on his abilities. In short:Young:More mobileMore athleticSuperior leaderRussell: Better passer (coming out of college)Stronger armI would roughly equate them (again, as we see them coming out of college) in terms of their draft value, but obviously its for different reasons.
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Hmmm .... their passing numbers look pretty similar to me:Russell 211/308, 68.51%, 2797 yds, 9.08 yds/att, 26/7 TD/INT, 168.1 QB ratingYoung 212/325, 65.23%, 3036 yds, 9.34 yds/att, 26/10 TD/INT, 163.9 QB rating
 
fulham9 said:
redman said:
Ignoring for the moment that Young has actually played in the NFL and successfully led his team to victory, I don't think these two guys can be compared fully. Young runs like a significantly smaller guy and and is able to use that ability to avoid sacks and scramble for yards. He's learning how to pass in the NFL and will undoubtedly use that mobility to successfully buy time to make passing plays. I think, coming out of college, Russell will have better raw passing skills than Young, and perhaps the strongest throwing arm in the league right away. He is clearly less mobile than Young (Russell's aspirations to be compared to Randal Cunningham aside :banned: ), so there's already a ceiling on his abilities. In short:Young:More mobileMore athleticSuperior leaderRussell: Better passer (coming out of college)Stronger armI would roughly equate them (again, as we see them coming out of college) in terms of their draft value, but obviously its for different reasons.
Click to expand...
Hmmm .... their passing numbers look pretty similar to me:Russell 211/308, 68.51%, 2797 yds, 9.08 yds/att, 26/7 TD/INT, 168.1 QB ratingYoung 212/325, 65.23%, 3036 yds, 9.34 yds/att, 26/10 TD/INT, 163.9 QB rating
Click to expand...
Given the potential for significant talent disparity in college, I really don't put much stock in college stats beyond getting a general feel for how a player did. Nobody's saying that Young sucked. I would point out though that the defenses that Russell typically faced in the SEC were a lot better than those Young typically faced in the Big 12.
 
There have been many strong armed quarterbacks come to the NFL only to fail miserably. What they all appeared to be lacking is football instincts and the ability to read a defense in a hurry.

Vince Young is a different player than JaMarcus Russell and shouldn't be compared to him. Where Young thrives is his unbelieavable athleticism which helps him to break down a defense thanks to his scrambling ability. Young is just a big of a threat to run the ball for a 40-yard touchdown as throwing the ball for a 40-yard touchdown...

Russell has a great pocket presence. One of the best that I have seen. His arm is legendary strong and when you watch him play it is apparent that it is every bit as strong as the rumors have been. What I like about him however is not the arm strength but his apparent ability to read what the defense is doing and to put the ball into the correct spot.

Russell has a real opportunity if he lands in the right situation to not only be a good NFL quarterback but a great one. Often the quarterbacks blessed with a strong arm struggle to read defenses while the ones blessed with football smarts don't have the arm strength to take advantage of what they see on the field. Russell appears to have the best of both worlds and I believe he is far and away the best quarterback prospect coming out this year (and I don't have anybody even close to him).

He's the real deal. Teams in need of a quarterback should be trading up to try and land this kid.

 
diesel7982 said:
snorlax said:
He didn't sound like he was even considering coming back in his comments after the game.
Click to expand...
Im usually not a big fan of guys coming out early, but in Russell's case, Id advise him to leave and not touch a football until April 29th.
Click to expand...
Yeah teams will be lining up to give him 40M without seeing him do a private workout. Great advice.A private workout will be where he excels. Strength. Arm Strength. Size. He's probably far more impressive up close. We want to avoid looking at his games against Auburn and Florida. Florida he was 24/41 228 and 3 picks. Woops? He needs to focus on his raw talents, which is workout will show. Trust me, he won't be working out against the Florida D, so nothing in his workout will hurt him. You can't tell people "check the tape", when he sucked against the two best D he faced. You DONT want them checking the tape, you want them looking at his mammoth arm strength in workouts.
 
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billyjoe said:
diesel7982 said:
snorlax said:
He didn't sound like he was even considering coming back in his comments after the game.
Click to expand...
Im usually not a big fan of guys coming out early, but in Russell's case, Id advise him to leave and not touch a football until April 29th.
Click to expand...
Yeah teams will be lining up to give him 40M without seeing him do a private workout. Great advice.A private workout will be where he excels. Strength. Arm Strength. Size. He's probably far more impressive up close. We want to avoid looking at his games against Auburn and Florida. Florida he was 24/41 228 and 3 picks. Woops? He needs to focus on his raw talents, which is workout will show. Trust me, he won't be working out against the Florida D, so nothing in his workout will hurt him. You can't tell people "check the tape", when he sucked against the two best D he faced. You DONT want them checking the tape, you want them looking at his mammoth arm strength in workouts.
Click to expand...
Not familiar with hyperbole are we?
 
mrhankey said:
Colin Dowling said:
How is the top 10 not QB friendly? No fewer then 5 of the top 10 teams need to address the QB spot.
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Meant to say top 5, not top 10. Of the first 5 teams, only Oakland and Detroit need QB's. Picks 7-9 look really good for Jamarcus.
Click to expand...
Im not sure how I can rationalize the Lions needing a QB, but the Browns not.
 
massraider said:
Here's the problem, what's that other direction? Let's assume they don't trade down. Which is unlikely. Al Davis rarely trades down, and the #1 pick isn't an easy thing to move.

So what's the other direction? Joe Thomas? Is he the next Orlando Pace? Because, to use your argument, teams are grabbing Levi Jones and Tarik Glenn's and Walter Jones later than the #1 pick. I haven't seen anyone call him the best prospect since Orlando, and that's what you want to hear if you take an OT #1. Knee surgeries in his past as well.

Because he's not. Less size as well

Adrian Peterson? Well, yes, taking Tomlinson for the Chargers did work, but RB's fall out of the trees in the NFL. Every round in the draft has 1,000 yard rushers. Look at the Broncos and Chiefs. Their RB's aren't coming from the top 5.

Last off-season I think Alexander & Edge were up for grabs.

Calvin Johnson? I can't believe I would have to explain what is wrong with this pick. WR must have the highest bust rate in the draft, and a WR is dependent on a strong QB, and an O-line to protect him. We have neither. Taking Calvin Johnson is like buying rims for a non-existant car.

Great analogy, we can't even get the rock to Moss downfield

Here's the thing: It's a gamble either way, and they have multiple holes to fix either way. So if the #1 pick is a lottery ticket, I'd rather have the Powerball payoff than the Pick 4 payoff.

BTW, I am speaking in generalities here. I have no strong feeling about Russell and Quinn's pro prospects, or how they rank vs. Cutler, Leinart, etc. I am only making a statement about the notion that taking a QB in this position is a mistake. If Quinn or Russell don't impress you, fair enough. Can't really make a case one way or the other.

Any team picking 1st has multiple holes. But the franchise ones are hard to come by, and if they have a shot at one, they should take it.
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:goodposting: massraider knows things.
 
diesel7982 said:
mrhankey said:
Colin Dowling said:
How is the top 10 not QB friendly? No fewer then 5 of the top 10 teams need to address the QB spot.
Click to expand...
Meant to say top 5, not top 10. Of the first 5 teams, only Oakland and Detroit need QB's. Picks 7-9 look really good for Jamarcus.
Click to expand...
Im not sure how I can rationalize the Lions needing a QB, but the Browns not.
Click to expand...
I'm on the fence about Charlie Frye...but Cleveland has so many needs on offense that QB might not be the first need. I do admit that Cleveland has no depth at QB. The lions have a QB in Kitna (who put up pretty good fantasy numbers this year) and Orlovsky might.....might...be a starter in the years to come. To me, the only team in the top 9 draft spots that has a franchise QB is Arizona. (Left out Atlanta at #10 because I don't want to debate Vick) Oakland, Detroit, Cleveland, Tampa, Washington, Minnesota, Houston, Miami all could improve their QB play with Russell; however, most have servicable QB's or recent QB draft projects underway, and deeper needs that can be met in the draft. As an LSU homer, I would love to see Jamarcus go #1, but it's hard to tell what Al Davis will do.
 
Chaos Commish said:
I looked elsewhere. Nothing yet, but since this is basically concerning an agent, that seems like the kind of story PFT scoops. They got Metz by name. I'm buying.
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I hate PFT more every time they pull this crap.
Contrary to published and broadcast reports Sunday, the LSU quarterback and former Williamson High School standout has not yet signed with an agent and could still return to the Tigers for a run at the national championship and the Heisman Trophy in the fall, Russell's uncle Ray-Ray Russell told the Press-Register Sunday afternoon.

ESPN's report Sunday that Russell, who could not be reached for comment Sunday night, was turning pro came on the heels of a report on ProFootballTalk.com Friday afternoon that Russell had signed with agent Eric Metz.

Ray-Ray Russell, a radio talk show host in Mobile, said Sunday that Russell has not and will not sign with Metz, who recently signed LSU wide receiver Dwayne Bowe as a client.

"We haven't signed with an agent, I can tell you that," Ray-Ray Russell said, adding that Russell's mother, Zina Anderson, has a list of possible agents at her disposal though she and the family have yet to formally interview any prospective representatives.

Ray-Ray Russell would not indicate whether his nephew is leaning toward leaving school for the NFL draft in April or toward returning to LSU for one final campaign.

"At this point, I can't tell you," Ray-Ray Russell said. "It's a lot of guys jumping the gun. He's weighing all of his options."
Click to expand...
Presser Wednesday.
 
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