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I was curious about Darren McFadden and Jonathan Stewart, these guys were the top-2 picks in most rookie drafts this year, but haven't done a whole lot and don't seem to be making any progress toward getting starting jobs. I'm not writing them off by any means, but I'm wondering, should there should be a significant change in expectations?

I wouldn't change long-term expectations, but definitely short-term (2008-2009) expectations have to be lowered. I've always liked Stewart better, but I think DeAngelo Williams is a lot harder to nudge to the side than Justin Fargas is. My feeling on guys like Stewart and McFadden is that I generally don't mind carrying unstartable prospects for 1+ years as long as I'm 100% confident they will be difference makers down the road. Guys like Shaun Alexander behind Ricky Watters and Deuce McAllister behind Ricky Williams were good examples of that phenomenon. You could also say Larry Johnson and Ahman Green were like that, but I think there was more doubt about them become superstars. And then, of course, there are countless examples of wasting roster spots on prospects who never pan out. Kevan Barlow, Chris Brown, Tatum Bell, Chris Perry . . . heck even a guy like Jerious Norwood. And that group is relatively successful compared to some of the major flameouts. God, did I ever fall hard for Kevan Barlow. . . .

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Mid-season buy-lows:

QB - Peyton Manning

QB - Ben Roethlisberger

QB - Tom Brady

QB - Vince Young

RB - Adrian Peterson

RB - Maurice Jones-Drew

RB - Jonathan Stewart

RB - Darren McFadden

RB - LaDainian Tomlinson (contenders)

RB - Ronnie Brown

WR - Randy Moss

WR - Marques Colston

WR - Santonio Holmes

WR - Torry Holt (against all logic, I'm feeling it . . . and he's dirt cheap right now)

WR - Sidney Rice

WR - Josh Morgan

TE - Kellen Winslow

TE - Tony Scheffler

TE - Dustin Keller

Mid-season sell-highs:

QB - Matt Schaub

QB - Kyle Orton

QB - Jason Campbell

QB - Chad Pennington

RB - Steve Slaton

RB - LenDale White

RB - Clinton Portis (builders)

RB - Thomas Jones (take what you can get from a contender)

RB - Michael Pittman (ditto)

RB - Deuce McAllister (ditto)

WR - Laveranues Coles

WR - Donnie Avery

WR - Ted Ginn

WR - Antonio Bryant

WR - Kevin Walter

TE - Tony Gonzalez

TE - Bo Scaife

TE - Kevin Boss

Just my :rolleyes:

Edited by Fear & Loathing

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Hey F&L, what do you think about contenders having CJ this year? Should we be worrying about a week 16 rest?

Worry is much too strong of a word. I think being aware of the possibility is smart, but it's way too early to be taking action because you think the Titans might consider benching Johnson. Week 16 is a long way off in the timeline of an NFL season.

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Mid-season buy-lows:

WR - Torry Holt (against all logic, I'm feeling it . . . and he's dirt cheap right now

Feeling more logical today. Despite the decent fantasy showing yesterday, I just don't think Holt has it any more. 6/58/1 is a big game for him now.

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F&L, I haven't watched the Jaguars at all this year but after not much of anything out of MJD the past two weeks against bad defenses I am going to leave him on the bench unless I see more out of this offense. Is his lack of production based on poor O-Line play or ill advised over-reliance on an average passing game. From where I sit it looks like DelRio is set on further proving that his decision to go with Garrard over Leftwitch is the one that will take them to the promised land. Why have they gone away from the running game so much? They ran the ball a total of 21 times with MJD getting 10 carries and they threw to him twice. This against a team that has not tackled well all year. If it wasn't for Garrard being stopped on the goal line before giving it to MJD for the TD on the next play he would have put up terrible numbers.

What is up with coaches like DelRio, Childress and Shanahan that makes them get away from sound football to prove a point?

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Mid-season sell-highs:

QB - Matt Schaub

QB - Kyle Orton

QB - Jason Campbell

QB - Chad Pennington

RB - Steve Slaton

RB - LenDale White

RB - Clinton Portis (builders)

RB - Thomas Jones (take what you can get from a contender)

RB - Michael Pittman (ditto)

RB - Deuce McAllister (ditto)

WR - Laveranues Coles

WR - Donnie Avery

WR - Ted Ginn

WR - Antonio Bryant

WR - Kevin Walter

TE - Tony Gonzalez

TE - Bo Scaife

TE - Kevin Boss

Just my :2cents:

A couple of things about this list:

1. I'm not sure how ADP makes a buy-low list. I think he's the highest valued player in dynasty, so it'd be tough to get him cheap.

2. Guys on your sell-high list that I'm not sure have enough value to merit moving on the chance this isn't real:

QB - Jason Campbell

WR - Donnie Avery

WR - Ted Ginn

WR - Antonio Bryant

TE - Bo Scaife

These 5 guys all should be young enough to duplicate this effort, and there are reasons to be bullish on all of them. I know there are also some reasons to be bearish - but I really think Scaife, Campbell, & Avery are set up well for the future:

Scaife: Titans LOVE to throw to the TE. Job competiton is old (Crumpler), but Scaife is not, and he's got a rapport with the QB of the future there to boot. His value isn't tied up in TD's, and while he is a mid-range TE1 this season, I don't think there are alot of people clamoring for him. Maybe you can find somebody who desperately needs a solid TE for the stretch run, I guess.

Campbell: Younger QB in a WCO in his first year in the system. Good talent around him, and the scheme should remain the same. It generally takes QB's more than a season to get the system, and next year will be Campbell's first time keeping the same offensive system in the last half-decade or something (goes back to College, at least)

Avery: Rookie WR who is producing now that the Rams seem to have a semblance of an offense. He's behind DeSean Jackson & Eddie Royal, but he's producing like a WR3. I am guessing you think his talent level isn't up to snuff, and that he will fall back to earth, but if your bearish on Holt & Avery, what Ram WR do you think is trending up, if any?

3. I htink Gonzalez is interesting as a buy if your timeframe isn't more than 2 seasons out. I don't think he's a Chief next season, and that should mean an upgrade, because the QB/OL situation can't get much worse.

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F&L, I haven't watched the Jaguars at all this year but after not much of anything out of MJD the past two weeks against bad defenses I am going to leave him on the bench unless I see more out of this offense. Is his lack of production based on poor O-Line play or ill advised over-reliance on an average passing game. From where I sit it looks like DelRio is set on further proving that his decision to go with Garrard over Leftwitch is the one that will take them to the promised land. Why have they gone away from the running game so much? They ran the ball a total of 21 times with MJD getting 10 carries and they threw to him twice. This against a team that has not tackled well all year. If it wasn't for Garrard being stopped on the goal line before giving it to MJD for the TD on the next play he would have put up terrible numbers.What is up with coaches like DelRio, Childress and Shanahan that makes them get away from sound football to prove a point?

I don't know how you overcome losing both of your starting guards for the year, plus the center for most of it. And these are very good linemen we are talking about. There simply aren't the holes that there was in the past. They really don't have much choice but to throw a lot more.

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F&L, I haven't watched the Jaguars at all this year but after not much of anything out of MJD the past two weeks against bad defenses I am going to leave him on the bench unless I see more out of this offense. Is his lack of production based on poor O-Line play or ill advised over-reliance on an average passing game. From where I sit it looks like DelRio is set on further proving that his decision to go with Garrard over Leftwitch is the one that will take them to the promised land. Why have they gone away from the running game so much? They ran the ball a total of 21 times with MJD getting 10 carries and they threw to him twice. This against a team that has not tackled well all year. If it wasn't for Garrard being stopped on the goal line before giving it to MJD for the TD on the next play he would have put up terrible numbers.What is up with coaches like DelRio, Childress and Shanahan that makes them get away from sound football to prove a point?

I don't know how you overcome losing both of your starting guards for the year, plus the center for most of it. And these are very good linemen we are talking about. There simply aren't the holes that there was in the past. They really don't have much choice but to throw a lot more.
Isn't it easier to run block than pass block? I have always heard that lineman prefer to run block. Pass blocking requires more communication between linemen specifically in regards to picking up stunts and blitzes. Further, the prognosticators at this site and others have been aware of the injuries on the line yet they continue to rate MJD high based on match-ups, which makes some sense. If a team has not played the run well all year and is tackling poorly why would you not try to stress those weak points in the defense? The Jags record seems to show that an over reliance on the pass game is not working.

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A couple of things about this list:1. I'm not sure how ADP makes a buy-low list. I think he's the highest valued player in dynasty, so it'd be tough to get him cheap.2. Guys on your sell-high list that I'm not sure have enough value to merit moving on the chance this isn't real:QB - Jason CampbellWR - Donnie AveryWR - Ted GinnWR - Antonio Bryant TE - Bo ScaifeThese 5 guys all should be young enough to duplicate this effort, and there are reasons to be bullish on all of them. I know there are also some reasons to be bearish - but I really think Scaife, Campbell, & Avery are set up well for the future:Scaife: Titans LOVE to throw to the TE. Job competiton is old (Crumpler), but Scaife is not, and he's got a rapport with the QB of the future there to boot. His value isn't tied up in TD's, and while he is a mid-range TE1 this season, I don't think there are alot of people clamoring for him. Maybe you can find somebody who desperately needs a solid TE for the stretch run, I guess.Campbell: Younger QB in a WCO in his first year in the system. Good talent around him, and the scheme should remain the same. It generally takes QB's more than a season to get the system, and next year will be Campbell's first time keeping the same offensive system in the last half-decade or something (goes back to College, at least)Avery: Rookie WR who is producing now that the Rams seem to have a semblance of an offense. He's behind DeSean Jackson & Eddie Royal, but he's producing like a WR3. I am guessing you think his talent level isn't up to snuff, and that he will fall back to earth, but if your bearish on Holt & Avery, what Ram WR do you think is trending up, if any?3. I htink Gonzalez is interesting as a buy if your timeframe isn't more than 2 seasons out. I don't think he's a Chief next season, and that should mean an upgrade, because the QB/OL situation can't get much worse.

1. You may be right. I've seen a lot of re-drafters wringing their hands about ADP before this past weekend, but I don't know about Dynasty leaguers. You're probably right. I was thinking more along the lines of: he hasn't had that one huge blow-up game yet, so maybe if you've been trying to sell the farm for him and the owner won't bite, perhaps you can get in before the blow-up game.2. I agree there are reasons to be bullish on all of them, but there are also reasons to pull the trigger if somebody else is enamored of them. In all of those cases, I think they're playing better now than they will in future years. Obviously, Ginn & Avery had down games since I posted this, so they're probably holds now.3. I agree that Gonzo may have a 2-year window of high performance, but I expect this spread offense to have a shelf life of about one more week before it's figured out and Tyler Thigpen goes back in the can. I wouldn't give Gonzo away, but if you can find a contender who is bullish on Gonzo for the rest of the year in that spread offense and willing to pay a steep price to get the missing piece of the puzzle, then selling is a good idea.

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F&L, I haven't watched the Jaguars at all this year but after not much of anything out of MJD the past two weeks against bad defenses I am going to leave him on the bench unless I see more out of this offense. Is his lack of production based on poor O-Line play or ill advised over-reliance on an average passing game. From where I sit it looks like DelRio is set on further proving that his decision to go with Garrard over Leftwitch is the one that will take them to the promised land. Why have they gone away from the running game so much? They ran the ball a total of 21 times with MJD getting 10 carries and they threw to him twice. This against a team that has not tackled well all year. If it wasn't for Garrard being stopped on the goal line before giving it to MJD for the TD on the next play he would have put up terrible numbers.What is up with coaches like DelRio, Childress and Shanahan that makes them get away from sound football to prove a point?

I don't know how you overcome losing both of your starting guards for the year, plus the center for most of it. And these are very good linemen we are talking about. There simply aren't the holes that there was in the past. They really don't have much choice but to throw a lot more.
Isn't it easier to run block than pass block? I have always heard that lineman prefer to run block. Pass blocking requires more communication between linemen specifically in regards to picking up stunts and blitzes. Further, the prognosticators at this site and others have been aware of the injuries on the line yet they continue to rate MJD high based on match-ups, which makes some sense. If a team has not played the run well all year and is tackling poorly why would you not try to stress those weak points in the defense? The Jags record seems to show that an over reliance on the pass game is not working.
I think it's the combination of 2 factors:1. Anthony is right. You can't lose both starting guards and your starting center and expect to run the ball consistently well. This is a significant factor.2. Jack Del Rio absolutely would rather run the ball. Every team in the league knows this and has decided to take this away from the Jags offense and make David Garrard beat them. What defenses are doing against the Jags right now is the exact same thing that defenses are attempting to do against the Titans. They are selling out against the run and making the quarterback prove that he can beat them. The Titans have one of the best offensive lines in the league while the Jags O-Line is in tatters. Therein lies much of the difference. You saw what MJD/Taylor could do with a healthy line last season.They can keep trying to pound their heads against a cinder-block wall, or they can try to beat the defense through the air. The Titans right now are walking a fine line with this under Kerry Collins, and I think they're going to get burnt. Luckily, they have Chris Johnson bailing them out, but I wouldn't be surprised if teams begin to sell out even harder against their run game knowing that the combination of Kerry Collins and receivers who can't gain separation won't beat them. Personally, I wouldn't bench MJD going forward, but that's just me. I don't own him in any leagues, so I don't have to make that decision. But what's great about him is even if his yardage totals are down, he usually manages to find his way into the end zone. Combined with his homerun hitting ability, I think that makes him an awfully tough "sit." Edited by Fear & Loathing

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Mid-season buy-lows:

QB - Peyton Manning

QB - Ben Roethlisberger

QB - Tom Brady

QB - Vince Young

RB - Adrian Peterson

RB - Maurice Jones-Drew

RB - Jonathan Stewart

RB - Darren McFadden

RB - LaDainian Tomlinson (contenders)

RB - Ronnie Brown

WR - Randy Moss

WR - Marques Colston

WR - Santonio Holmes

WR - Torry Holt (against all logic, I'm feeling it . . . and he's dirt cheap right now)

WR - Sidney Rice

WR - Josh Morgan

TE - Kellen Winslow

TE - Tony Scheffler

TE - Dustin Keller

I like the calls in bold. I particularly like Stewart since I think he'll eventually be the best RB from this draft class. Very nice RB2 if you can get him cheap from a contender.

McFadden has the potential to be an epic bust IMO. Then again, I don't think anyone is surprised by that.

Mid-season sell-highs:

QB - Matt Schaub

QB - Kyle Orton

QB - Jason Campbell

QB - Chad Pennington

RB - Steve Slaton

RB - LenDale White

RB - Clinton Portis (builders)

RB - Thomas Jones (take what you can get from a contender)

RB - Michael Pittman (ditto)

RB - Deuce McAllister (ditto)

WR - Laveranues Coles

WR - Donnie Avery

WR - Ted Ginn

WR - Antonio Bryant

WR - Kevin Walter

TE - Tony Gonzalez

TE - Bo Scaife

TE - Kevin Boss

Just my :unsure:

I like all of these except for the Antonio Bryant call. He's getting a ton of targets and producing startable numbers. I say ride him out and then consider selling before the NFL draft.

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I was curious about Darren McFadden and Jonathan Stewart, these guys were the top-2 picks in most rookie drafts this year, but haven't done a whole lot and don't seem to be making any progress toward getting starting jobs. I'm not writing them off by any means, but I'm wondering, should there should be a significant change in expectations?

I wouldn't change long-term expectations, but definitely short-term (2008-2009) expectations have to be lowered. I've always liked Stewart better, but I think DeAngelo Williams is a lot harder to nudge to the side than Justin Fargas is. My feeling on guys like Stewart and McFadden is that I generally don't mind carrying unstartable prospects for 1+ years as long as I'm 100% confident they will be difference makers down the road. Guys like Shaun Alexander behind Ricky Watters and Deuce McAllister behind Ricky Williams were good examples of that phenomenon. You could also say Larry Johnson and Ahman Green were like that, but I think there was more doubt about them become superstars. And then, of course, there are countless examples of wasting roster spots on prospects who never pan out. Kevan Barlow, Chris Brown, Tatum Bell, Chris Perry . . . heck even a guy like Jerious Norwood. And that group is relatively successful compared to some of the major flameouts. God, did I ever fall hard for Kevan Barlow. . . .
Good analysis. But regarding the prospects who were wasted--I don't think any of them were first round picks except for Perry, and he got hurt. If he hadn't of gotten hurt he might well have been very good.

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Mid-season buy-lows:

QB - Peyton Manning

QB - Ben Roethlisberger

QB - Tom Brady

QB - Vince Young

RB - Adrian Peterson

RB - Maurice Jones-Drew

RB - Jonathan Stewart

RB - Darren McFadden

RB - LaDainian Tomlinson (contenders)

RB - Ronnie Brown

WR - Randy Moss

WR - Marques Colston

WR - Santonio Holmes

WR - Torry Holt (against all logic, I'm feeling it . . . and he's dirt cheap right now)

WR - Sidney Rice

WR - Josh Morgan

TE - Kellen Winslow

TE - Tony Scheffler

TE - Dustin Keller

I like the calls in bold. I particularly like Stewart since I think he'll eventually be the best RB from this draft class. Very nice RB2 if you can get him cheap from a contender.

McFadden has the potential to be an epic bust IMO. Then again, I don't think anyone is surprised by that.

Mid-season sell-highs:

QB - Matt Schaub

QB - Kyle Orton

QB - Jason Campbell

QB - Chad Pennington

RB - Steve Slaton

RB - LenDale White

RB - Clinton Portis (builders)

RB - Thomas Jones (take what you can get from a contender)

RB - Michael Pittman (ditto)

RB - Deuce McAllister (ditto)

WR - Laveranues Coles

WR - Donnie Avery

WR - Ted Ginn

WR - Antonio Bryant

WR - Kevin Walter

TE - Tony Gonzalez

TE - Bo Scaife

TE - Kevin Boss

Just my :banned:

I like all of these except for the Antonio Bryant call. He's getting a ton of targets and producing startable numbers. I say ride him out and then consider selling before the NFL draft.
I don't see Ginn as a sell high. First, he is only in the middle of his second year and we know WRs often don't fully develop until year Three or Four. Second, he is not playing with a QB who can fully take advantage of his speed--Pennington cannot throw deep ball. Plus, I doubt you will get much more for him than a second round pick and he has more upside IMO than any second round rookie pick.

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Mid-season buy-lows:

QB - Peyton Manning

QB - Ben Roethlisberger

QB - Tom Brady

QB - Vince Young

RB - Adrian Peterson

RB - Maurice Jones-Drew

RB - Jonathan Stewart

RB - Darren McFadden

RB - LaDainian Tomlinson (contenders)

RB - Ronnie Brown

WR - Randy Moss

WR - Marques Colston

WR - Santonio Holmes

WR - Torry Holt (against all logic, I'm feeling it . . . and he's dirt cheap right now)

WR - Sidney Rice

WR - Josh Morgan

TE - Kellen Winslow

TE - Tony Scheffler

TE - Dustin Keller

Mid-season sell-highs:

QB - Matt Schaub

QB - Kyle Orton

QB - Jason Campbell

QB - Chad Pennington

RB - Steve Slaton

RB - LenDale White

RB - Clinton Portis (builders)

RB - Thomas Jones (take what you can get from a contender)

RB - Michael Pittman (ditto)

RB - Deuce McAllister (ditto)

WR - Laveranues Coles

WR - Donnie Avery

WR - Ted Ginn

WR - Antonio Bryant

WR - Kevin Walter

TE - Tony Gonzalez

TE - Bo Scaife

TE - Kevin Boss

Just my :banned:

The buy Lows: agree with most except I am not seeing Sidney Rice. As a Vikings fan I want him to become a stud, but I just don't see it. Plus, they still have no QB in sight so even if he does develop he won't have a solid QB for several more years.

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I don't see Ginn as a sell high. First, he is only in the middle of his second year and we know WRs often don't fully develop until year Three or Four. Second, he is not playing with a QB who can fully take advantage of his speed--Pennington cannot throw deep ball. Plus, I doubt you will get much more for him than a second round pick and he has more upside IMO than any second round rookie pick.

To each his own. My hunch about Ginn is that he'll never develop into a complete WR.

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Mid-season buy-lows:

QB - Peyton Manning

QB - Ben Roethlisberger

QB - Tom Brady

QB - Vince Young

RB - Adrian Peterson

RB - Maurice Jones-Drew

RB - Jonathan Stewart

RB - Darren McFadden

RB - LaDainian Tomlinson (contenders)

RB - Ronnie Brown

WR - Randy Moss

WR - Marques Colston

WR - Santonio Holmes

WR - Torry Holt (against all logic, I'm feeling it . . . and he's dirt cheap right now)

WR - Sidney Rice

WR - Josh Morgan

TE - Kellen Winslow

TE - Tony Scheffler

TE - Dustin Keller

Very much agree on him, I wouldn't be shocked at all if he were a top-5 WR down the stretch.

3 others I'd add:

Matt Jones seems like a good buy-low due to his upcoming suspension, but he seems pretty entrenched as Garrard's favorite target.

Brady Quinn, I could see him being a top-10 QB by the start of next season.

Matt Ryan, I kinda see him as similar to Cutler at this point last season, where you see loads of talent and skill, but the big numbers aren't there yet. I think those are coming and this may be the last time Ryan is touchable for a reasonable price in dynasty leagues.

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After 8 games Slaton is on pace for 240 carries, 1076 yards, 4.5 ypc, 60 catches, 362 yards, and 12 total TD's. Not bad considering the defenses he has faced. I see he has a score of 37, and Addai at 74. Even if you dont like Slaton, i cant see Addai being twice as good as Slaton when it comes to fantasy value. Just wondering if you are budging on your views of Slaton, and if not, what do you think it will take for him to establish himself as a solid #2RB?

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After 8 games Slaton is on pace for 240 carries, 1076 yards, 4.5 ypc, 60 catches, 362 yards, and 12 total TD's. Not bad considering the defenses he has faced. I see he has a score of 37, and Addai at 74. Even if you dont like Slaton, i cant see Addai being twice as good as Slaton when it comes to fantasy value. Just wondering if you are budging on your views of Slaton, and if not, what do you think it will take for him to establish himself as a solid #2RB?

I did updates on QBs & RBs last night around 7:45. Slaton is the 21st ranked RB with a value score of 54. Addai is the 15th ranked RB with a value score of 73. It would be very easy for me to move Slaton higher than 21, first half stats being what they are. But I just don't believe he has the long-term stability to be a major asset in Dynasty leagues. Sometimes you have to hold your ground even when a stretch of games in the present belies a player's true value. Edited by Fear & Loathing

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F&L:

Can you give me your opinions on Lenart and Kolb for 2009? Due to roster limitations I have to cut one Saturday and am looking for thoughts. I see you have Leinart very slightly higher.

Thanks.

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F&L

Would love to hear your opinion about a dynasty ppr trade I am on the verge of making.

I receive Gore in exchange for Hightower and E Royal

I am loaded at WR and need a RB2 to pair with AD

Thanks in advance

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Mid-season buy-lows:

QB - Peyton Manning

QB - Ben Roethlisberger

QB - Tom Brady

QB - Vince Young

RB - Adrian Peterson

RB - Maurice Jones-Drew

RB - Jonathan Stewart

RB - Darren McFadden

RB - LaDainian Tomlinson (contenders)

RB - Ronnie Brown

WR - Randy Moss

WR - Marques Colston

WR - Santonio Holmes

WR - Torry Holt (against all logic, I'm feeling it . . . and he's dirt cheap right now)

WR - Sidney Rice

WR - Josh Morgan

TE - Kellen Winslow

TE - Tony Scheffler

TE - Dustin Keller

Mid-season sell-highs:

QB - Matt Schaub

QB - Kyle Orton

QB - Jason Campbell

QB - Chad Pennington

RB - Steve Slaton

RB - LenDale White

RB - Clinton Portis (builders)

RB - Thomas Jones (take what you can get from a contender)

RB - Michael Pittman (ditto)

RB - Deuce McAllister (ditto)

WR - Laveranues Coles

WR - Donnie Avery

WR - Ted Ginn

WR - Antonio Bryant

WR - Kevin Walter

TE - Tony Gonzalez

TE - Bo Scaife

TE - Kevin Boss

Just my :2cents:

Funny ..

I just traded Quinn,Orton,Addai (Couldve Chose Slaton, but i like him more than Addai),Kevin Smith

And i got Peyton Manning, LT, Randy Moss, sets me for Playoffs. :blackdot:

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F&L:Can you give me your opinions on Lenart and Kolb for 2009? Due to roster limitations I have to cut one Saturday and am looking for thoughts. I see you have Leinart very slightly higher.Thanks.

Hi rockalum,Here's what I think: I have Leinart slightly higher because of his offensive weapons and Warner's tenuous health. Warner is a free agent after the season, and my guess is the Cardinals will make a push to re-sign the MVP candidate to a 2-year deal. Warner has said that he would like to stay in Arizona if he keeps playing, and there's no reason for all sides not to make a deal. That would leave Leinart as a high-priced fantasy handcuff, but, again, he would be in position to put up nice numbers if Warner suffered a serious injury over the next couple of years.Because of Warner's presence, I think Kolb will get a starting job in the NFL before Leinart. I think Philly will stick with McNabb and a QB-desperate team may be willing to part with the picks necessary to grab Kolb (a la Matt Schaub). The question is whether Kolb will produce enough with a starting job to be a fantasy asset. So to answer your question, if you're looking for the one with the better chance of landing a starting a job, I'd go with Kolb. If you're looking for the one with the most fantasy upside in a best case scenario, I'd go with Leinart.

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Funny ..I just traded Quinn,Orton,Addai (Couldve Chose Slaton, but i like him more than Addai),Kevin SmithAnd i got Peyton Manning, LT, Randy Moss, sets me for Playoffs. :lol:

Yeah, that's a ridiculous trade . . . and a perfect example of why builders often stay builders instead of competitors. You don't give up superstars for bit parts.

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F&LWould love to hear your opinion about a dynasty ppr trade I am on the verge of making.I receive Gore in exchange for Hightower and E RoyalI am loaded at WR and need a RB2 to pair with ADThanks in advance

I'm not F&L, but I like this trade.

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F&LWould love to hear your opinion about a dynasty ppr trade I am on the verge of making.I receive Gore in exchange for Hightower and E RoyalI am loaded at WR and need a RB2 to pair with ADThanks in advance

As much as I :lol: Eddie Royal, I say go for it if you have the WR depth. Great chance to sell high on Officer Hightower for a difference maker.

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This maybe a bit early to ask this but are there any players potentially coming out for this years draft that you are very high on?

Sorry, Steelers22.I'm not much of a college football watcher, so I have no idea behind Tim Tebow and Matthew Stafford (both of whom should stay in school). Maybe EBF or some other prospect mavens can help you out here?

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F&L:Can you give me your opinions on Lenart and Kolb for 2009? Due to roster limitations I have to cut one Saturday and am looking for thoughts. I see you have Leinart very slightly higher.Thanks.

Hi rockalum,Here's what I think: I have Leinart slightly higher because of his offensive weapons and Warner's tenuous health. Warner is a free agent after the season, and my guess is the Cardinals will make a push to re-sign the MVP candidate to a 2-year deal. Warner has said that he would like to stay in Arizona if he keeps playing, and there's no reason for all sides not to make a deal. That would leave Leinart as a high-priced fantasy handcuff, but, again, he would be in position to put up nice numbers if Warner suffered a serious injury over the next couple of years.Because of Warner's presence, I think Kolb will get a starting job in the NFL before Leinart. I think Philly will stick with McNabb and a QB-desperate team may be willing to part with the picks necessary to grab Kolb (a la Matt Schaub). The question is whether Kolb will produce enough with a starting job to be a fantasy asset. So to answer your question, if you're looking for the one with the better chance of landing a starting a job, I'd go with Kolb. If you're looking for the one with the most fantasy upside in a best case scenario, I'd go with Leinart.
Interesting take. I think the Eagles braintrust loves Kolb, but they also took McNabb as Reid's first ever pick - over booing idiots at the draft. And that turned out very well. I think Kolb has near-zero value for 2009 - except if McNabb gets hurt, as the Eagles won't likely move him, unless they get overwhelmed - think a 1st rounder sicne they used a second, and they already have an extra next year. I do like the Eagles offense & situation a lot, though if Kolb steps in.With Quinn making Anderson available, that means there's one guy who will hit the trade market with possibly more suitors than Kolb.Leinart has just Warner's health and eventual age-related decline to get a gig with great WR's. Howver, he's had a shot and failed, so we've got some data - however, I think if he cuts out a lot of the dumb mistakes, he could develop well enough. For 2009 ONLY, I prefer Leinart, as I think Warner going down/declining horribly is more likely than that McNabb going down - I can't fathom Mcnabb suddenly becoming a replacement-level player due to age-related skill decline that fast.

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Maybe EBF or some other prospect mavens can help you out here?

There are some good threads on the topic already. This one is a good place to start:

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=367315

I'm still in the process of deciding exactly who I like out of this crop, but I have some early opinions on who might be overrated and who's shaping up to be a nice value. If you have any specific questions, you can PM me.

Right now I'd estimate that we're looking at 6-8 RBs who will figure into the first round of rookie drafts and 4 WRs who will be picked in the first round of the NFL draft. Now that we're in the YouTube age, highlights of these guys are readily available:

LeSean McCoy, Pittsburgh - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Fgo_MMbZIM

Chris Wells, Ohio State - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0BM_4ti2YA

Knowshon Moreno, Georgia - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xAdHm65v_M

CJ Spiller, Clemson - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqnqJn_UQx8

Shonn Greene, Iowa - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyZWTM3ctWM

Javon Ringer, Michigan State - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XBZLTEEi8Y

Charles Scott, LSU -

Stafon Johnson, USC - n/a

Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MI5ZezxKBVM...feature=related

Darrius Heyward-Bey, Maryland - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXBP3yC9fcQ...feature=related

Jeremy Maclin, Missouri - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaEnK8_1P7g

Percy Harvin, Florida - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A34up1pGP84

Familiarizing yourself with these 12 prospects will give you a good head start on evaluating the 2009 crop.

Michael Crabtree is probably the top player available, but lots of these players at RB and WR have star potential.

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Because of Warner's presence, I think Kolb will get a starting job in the NFL before Leinart. I think Philly will stick with McNabb and a QB-desperate team may be willing to part with the picks necessary to grab Kolb (a la Matt Schaub). The question is whether Kolb will produce enough with a starting job to be a fantasy asset.

I agree it's McNabb or burst in Philly, even more so than it was last year this time. However, what has Kolb done to earn the Schaub-lust other than get drafted too high? Is it his impressive 5 YPA during preseason? I think it will take a marquee relief performance, like Schaub's start for ATL against NE, for any team to pay enough that the Eagles will move him. He hasn't done anything like that yet. Otherwise, he's signed for 2 more years at a mil per, and the Eagles will be happy to Aaron Rodgers him through his rookie deal as long as McNabb stays healthy. I think his greatest value is as a handcuff, because it would take a lot for him to supplant McNabb barring a Theismannization.

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McCoy really won me over in the Notre Dame game. Pitt was playing with a high school QB and he absolutely carried them. I think my top 4 for next year w/o having the luxury of knowing where they're headed would be:

Wells

McCoy

Crabtree

Moreno

As we speak, that seems to be tier one in terms of dynasty prospects..but I'm no expert

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McCoy really won me over in the Notre Dame game. Pitt was playing with a high school QB and he absolutely carried them. I think my top 4 for next year w/o having the luxury of knowing where they're headed would be:WellsMcCoyCrabtreeMorenoAs we speak, that seems to be tier one in terms of dynasty prospects..but I'm no expert

I expect CJ Spiller to be in the mix when all is said and done. He has the best burst of any RB in this class and has been consistently productive when given opportunities in college. The NFL is a copycat league. Spiller stands to benefit from Chris Johnson's success because teams will try to use him like the Titans use CJ3. Shonn Greene is a Rudi Johnson/Michael Turner clone. His performance will exceed his NFL draft position.Harvin and Heyward-Bey have the upside to be just as good as Crabtree. That may even be true of Maclin. Edited by EBF

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Here's what DHB brings to the table:

He's a different animal than Crabtree. Crabtree is a run-after-the-catch receiver like Boldin or TO. DHB is a true vertical threat with dangerous speed. He has the upside to be a Pro Bowl player. The reason he's ranked below Crabtree is because he doesn't have the track record of production or consistency. Basically, he's more of a boom-or-bust prospect. But if he booms, he could be special.

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Guest awesomeness

Are we sure Crabtree CAN come out? I heard he wasn't eligible for the draft.

We are sure that Crabtree CAN and WILL come out.

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Because of Warner's presence, I think Kolb will get a starting job in the NFL before Leinart. I think Philly will stick with McNabb and a QB-desperate team may be willing to part with the picks necessary to grab Kolb (a la Matt Schaub). The question is whether Kolb will produce enough with a starting job to be a fantasy asset.

I agree it's McNabb or burst in Philly, even more so than it was last year this time. However, what has Kolb done to earn the Schaub-lust other than get drafted too high? Is it his impressive 5 YPA during preseason? I think it will take a marquee relief performance, like Schaub's start for ATL against NE, for any team to pay enough that the Eagles will move him. He hasn't done anything like that yet. Otherwise, he's signed for 2 more years at a mil per, and the Eagles will be happy to Aaron Rodgers him through his rookie deal as long as McNabb stays healthy. I think his greatest value is as a handcuff, because it would take a lot for him to supplant McNabb barring a Theismannization.
If someone wanted AJ Feeley to start, it's not out of the realm of possibility - but he might need a showcase game or two - possible if mcNabb gets dinged or plays stellar in pre-season..

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What kind of value does think Westbrook have at this point? Im all but eliminated from the playoffs this season and will likely need to switch to rebuilding mode. If I were to make some offers to contenders looking for RB help, what do you think I could reasonably expect in return?

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Maybe EBF or some other prospect mavens can help you out here?

There are some good threads on the topic already. This one is a good place to start:

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=367315

I'm still in the process of deciding exactly who I like out of this crop, but I have some early opinions on who might be overrated and who's shaping up to be a nice value. If you have any specific questions, you can PM me.

Right now I'd estimate that we're looking at 6-8 RBs who will figure into the first round of rookie drafts and 4 WRs who will be picked in the first round of the NFL draft. Now that we're in the YouTube age, highlights of these guys are readily available:

LeSean McCoy, Pittsburgh - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Fgo_MMbZIM

Chris Wells, Ohio State - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0BM_4ti2YA

Knowshon Moreno, Georgia - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xAdHm65v_M

CJ Spiller, Clemson - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqnqJn_UQx8

Shonn Greene, Iowa - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyZWTM3ctWM

Javon Ringer, Michigan State - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XBZLTEEi8Y

Charles Scott, LSU -

Stafon Johnson, USC - n/a

Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MI5ZezxKBVM...feature=related

Darrius Heyward-Bey, Maryland - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXBP3yC9fcQ...feature=related

Jeremy Maclin, Missouri - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaEnK8_1P7g

Percy Harvin, Florida - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A34up1pGP84

Familiarizing yourself with these 12 prospects will give you a good head start on evaluating the 2009 crop.

Michael Crabtree is probably the top player available, but lots of these players at RB and WR have star potential.

Is this list before or after the BMI filter?

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Because of Warner's presence, I think Kolb will get a starting job in the NFL before Leinart. I think Philly will stick with McNabb and a QB-desperate team may be willing to part with the picks necessary to grab Kolb (a la Matt Schaub). The question is whether Kolb will produce enough with a starting job to be a fantasy asset.

I agree it's McNabb or burst in Philly, even more so than it was last year this time. However, what has Kolb done to earn the Schaub-lust other than get drafted too high? Is it his impressive 5 YPA during preseason? I think it will take a marquee relief performance, like Schaub's start for ATL against NE, for any team to pay enough that the Eagles will move him. He hasn't done anything like that yet. Otherwise, he's signed for 2 more years at a mil per, and the Eagles will be happy to Aaron Rodgers him through his rookie deal as long as McNabb stays healthy. I think his greatest value is as a handcuff, because it would take a lot for him to supplant McNabb barring a Theismannization.
If someone wanted AJ Feeley to start, it's not out of the realm of possibility - but he might need a showcase game or two - possible if mcNabb gets dinged or plays stellar in pre-season..
:goodposting: I'm confused by your wording. Are you insinuating that an NFL team may want A.J. Feeley as its starting QB going into next season?

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What kind of value does think Westbrook have at this point? Im all but eliminated from the playoffs this season and will likely need to switch to rebuilding mode. If I were to make some offers to contenders looking for RB help, what do you think I could reasonably expect in return?

I had to rebuild one time, after not making the playoffs back in 2003. At that point, I created this role for myself: Once you realize that injuries have taken your team out of contention, the next step is to go out and actively target the young stars that you want. Do not, I repeat: DO NOT, let other owners come to you with offers for your Brian Westbrooks and LaDainian Tomlinsons. It's on you to do your due diligence on trade targets and come to a decisive conclusion. It should also go without saying that you should never let a competitor slough off his depth in bit parts for your "aging" superstars. One other significant point: Don't feel like you have to deal Westbrook just because you are out of the race. This is a mistake that I see builders make over and over again. With Westbrook in your lineup, there's no reason you can't be a contender again next season, so don't have your mind set on dealing him for the best possible package. With those disclaimers out in the open, players to target are obviously young, talented difference-makers. A trade like this is tricky because you have to go after younger studs who haven't broken out statistically enough to become the darlings of the experts and pseud-experts. You have use anticipation to grab a Calvin Johnson before the 2008 season or a Steve Jackson before his 2006 season. Guys I'd be targeting in return for Westbrook:Chris JohnsonSteven JacksonMaurice Jones-DrewCalvin JohnsonDwayne BoweJonathan StewartLarry FitzgeraldEddie RoyalObviously, other players may have to be involved, but those are guys that would be on my list as targets. Edited by Fear & Loathing

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Because of Warner's presence, I think Kolb will get a starting job in the NFL before Leinart. I think Philly will stick with McNabb and a QB-desperate team may be willing to part with the picks necessary to grab Kolb (a la Matt Schaub). The question is whether Kolb will produce enough with a starting job to be a fantasy asset.

I agree it's McNabb or burst in Philly, even more so than it was last year this time. However, what has Kolb done to earn the Schaub-lust other than get drafted too high? Is it his impressive 5 YPA during preseason? I think it will take a marquee relief performance, like Schaub's start for ATL against NE, for any team to pay enough that the Eagles will move him. He hasn't done anything like that yet. Otherwise, he's signed for 2 more years at a mil per, and the Eagles will be happy to Aaron Rodgers him through his rookie deal as long as McNabb stays healthy. I think his greatest value is as a handcuff, because it would take a lot for him to supplant McNabb barring a Theismannization.
If someone wanted AJ Feeley to start, it's not out of the realm of possibility - but he might need a showcase game or two - possible if mcNabb gets dinged or plays stellar in pre-season..
:pickle: I'm confused by your wording. Are you insinuating that an NFL team may want A.J. Feeley as its starting QB going into next season?
Sorry about being hard to understand. I was comparing the possibility of another team seeing something Kolb & likening that to when the Eagles dealt A.J. Feeley to the (admittedly stupid) Miami Dolphins. Kolb was a second round pick, and was pretty well thought of, which is more than Feeley was. If somebody wanted Feeley at one time, it's easily a possibility that someone might want Kolb if he got a showcase game or two.It's not just Schaub-lust that happened, there was Feeley-lust at one point, and that was much less deserved. My gut tells me Stanton gets out of Detroit before Kolb leaves Philly, though. Detroit doesn't want Stanton, and there's an OC on a team needing a QB that likes him - 49ers with Martz. Edited by stevegamer

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LOL, nice Desean Jackson impression. Doesn't even have possession of the ball when he crossed the goal line.

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Ok, I need some help here. I offered that trade, and he countered with Cotchery and Gonzalez for Fitzgerald. I am high on Fitz, so I think that's a steep price.

I believe that in the high majority of deals, the team getting the best player wins. I would never trade down from Fitz to get depth. The best thing to do is get a cheaper WR to add to Fitz. That offer is steep like you said. It's not even worth discussing. Keep Fitz and build around him.

Trading studs in a dynasty league for multiple players of lesser value is almost always a bad idea.

:goodposting::goodposting:

Dead on. I'm always looking to package multiple lesser talents for an elite talent. I've received a gaggle of offers for Fitz over the past 3 years, but never anything that tempted me to deal him.

I'm not a Plax fan, but I still wouldn't do that deal. What about packaging Slaton w/ Donald Lee or David Garrard for Gonzo?

Good advice. While I am realyl needing a TE, I am going to sit tight for a week or two. I bet the Gonzo owner comes back with a better offer soon.
Sure enough, the Gonzo owner traded him to me today for Slaton. I knew he'd come back to this offer.
:hifive:

Gonzo looking awfully good in that spread offense. I can't believe the difference in Thigpen just from putting him in the shotgun. Night and day.

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Ok, I need some help here. I offered that trade, and he countered with Cotchery and Gonzalez for Fitzgerald. I am high on Fitz, so I think that's a steep price.

I believe that in the high majority of deals, the team getting the best player wins. I would never trade down from Fitz to get depth. The best thing to do is get a cheaper WR to add to Fitz. That offer is steep like you said. It's not even worth discussing. Keep Fitz and build around him.

Trading studs in a dynasty league for multiple players of lesser value is almost always a bad idea.

:goodposting::goodposting:

Dead on. I'm always looking to package multiple lesser talents for an elite talent. I've received a gaggle of offers for Fitz over the past 3 years, but never anything that tempted me to deal him.

I'm not a Plax fan, but I still wouldn't do that deal. What about packaging Slaton w/ Donald Lee or David Garrard for Gonzo?

Good advice. While I am realyl needing a TE, I am going to sit tight for a week or two. I bet the Gonzo owner comes back with a better offer soon.
Sure enough, the Gonzo owner traded him to me today for Slaton. I knew he'd come back to this offer.
:hifive:

Gonzo looking awfully good in that spread offense. I can't believe the difference in Thigpen just from putting him in the shotgun. Night and day.

No doubt. I haven't looked it up, but Gonzalez has to be the highest-scoring TE since I traded for him. I am 8-2, I've wrapped up a playoff spot, and I have a red-hot TE on a team that throws the ball well for the playoffs.

Funny part is, people said I was getting the short end of the deal when I traded Slaton for Gonzalez. I had Peterson and Gore with horrible TEs. I think Slaton's a nice player, but he was the very definition of a sell-high candidate.

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No doubt. I haven't looked it up, but Gonzalez has to be the highest-scoring TE since I traded for him. I am 8-2, I've wrapped up a playoff spot, and I have a red-hot TE on a team that throws the ball well for the playoffs.Funny part is, people said I was getting the short end of the deal when I traded Slaton for Gonzalez. I had Peterson and Gore with horrible TEs. I think Slaton's a nice player, but he was the very definition of a sell-high candidate.

Absolutely. Fantasy football isn't about collecting the most talent, it's about giving yourself the best chance to win week-in and week-out.

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How does the KC Offense change with LJ back in the mix next week? Can they still run that spread offense with a big back like LJ? Who does it help and hurt?

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How does the KC Offense change with LJ back in the mix next week? Can they still run that spread offense with a big back like LJ? Who does it help and hurt?

I don't see how they can go away from the spread offense for the rest of the season. In a lost year, it's given them a chance to at least stay competitive. Just as importantly, it's given them competent quarterback play for the first time in a long time. I don't think it's a long-term strategy, but I do think it will stay for the rest of '08. Re: L.J.'s role. I'm not sure. Charles was coming in for him on third downs and during two-minute drills before the suspensions, so it kind of leaves him without a role in a shotgun attack. I wouldn't be counting on LJ for the fantasy playoffs.

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Interesting Jeff Fischer quote today in Peter King's MMQB:

Imagine if the Titans are 15-0 heading into Indianapolis. I don't care if the Colts are in it, out of it or have a playoff seed wrapped up, Dungy will play his guys. As will Jeff Fisher. He told me after the game Sunday, "We'll play our players'' for 16 games. No rest for the Titans.

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How does the KC Offense change with LJ back in the mix next week? Can they still run that spread offense with a big back like LJ? Who does it help and hurt?

I don't see how they can go away from the spread offense for the rest of the season. In a lost year, it's given them a chance to at least stay competitive. Just as importantly, it's given them competent quarterback play for the first time in a long time. I don't think it's a long-term strategy, but I do think it will stay for the rest of '08. Re: L.J.'s role. I'm not sure. Charles was coming in for him on third downs and during two-minute drills before the suspensions, so it kind of leaves him without a role in a shotgun attack. I wouldn't be counting on LJ for the fantasy playoffs.
K.C.'s passing game is on fire, and I don't see a reason to get conservative now. Thigpen is playing well. And in a year where they are way out of contention, it makes sense to allow Thigpen to continue to flourish.

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