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HBO - Song of Ice&Fire Series -Varsity Thread - no TV only whiners

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They did a darn good job of it, imo. Can't wait til next week!!!

I agree with this. The sets look right. The characters seem right.

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Can I get a breakdown of who is who kingdom-wise and relationship-wise fron those of you who read the book(s)? I liked this episode but just want to make sure I'm followIng properly.

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There's gonna be a lot of incest on this show isn't there?

I get that its fictional and all, but it still kinda ruins the experience of seeing Lena Headey get boffed.

Other than that, good first episode. I know nothing about the books, so this is all new to me. The production values are insane, even for HBO. I gotta think they're gonna need huge viewership numbers and some new subscribers to justify the expense.

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I see this series being talked about all over the interwebs. Is it worth watching if I haven't read any of the books or is reading the books pretty well a requirement to enjoy the HBO series?

I would skip watching the show and just read the books. I think it would be a better experience for you.

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Can I get a breakdown of who is who kingdom-wise and relationship-wise fron those of you who read the book(s)? I liked this episode but just want to make sure I'm followIng properly.

That's a pretty big undertaking, but for the here and now, you have:House StarkEddard (Ned)CatelynRob - Heir to House Stark - around 16Sansa - 13Arya - like 9 or 10Bran - 7 or 8Ricken - 3Jon Snow- bastard son of Ned - around 16BaratheonRobert - KingCersei - QueenJoffrey - son & heirthere's some other siblings in here, but these are the primariesLannisterTywinCercei - QueenJaime - Heir to House LannisterTyrion - "the Imp"TargaryenViserys - Current seat of House Targaryen, exiled heir to the Iron ThroneDaenarys - SisterStick with that for now.. there's a lot more, and if you want to dig deeper, check it out on Wikipedia, but beware of spoilers. There are probably some doozies if you aren't careful.I suggest reading the books, at least so you can know the full backstory and so you can join in much of the inevitable spoiler-filled conversation without unpleasant surprises.

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Very much enjoyed it and looking forward to seeing the rest of it play out.

There's gonna be a lot of incest on this show isn't there?

Ok was starting to like the show but what is with all the incest?

From the books the Targaryen family practiced it to keep their royal blood pure. In the rest of Westeros it is taboo which is one reason Brann gets tossed. Being it was the queen might have something to do with it too! Edited by Mjolnirs

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Can I get a breakdown of who is who kingdom-wise and relationship-wise fron those of you who read the book(s)? I liked this episode but just want to make sure I'm followIng properly.

That's a pretty big undertaking, but for the here and now, you have:House StarkEddard (Ned)CatelynRob - Heir to House Stark - around 16Sansa - 13Arya - like 9 or 10Bran - 7 or 8Ricken - 3Jon Snow- bastard son of Ned - around 16BaratheonRobert - KingCersei - QueenJoffrey - son & heirthere's some other siblings in here, but these are the primariesLannisterTywinCercei - QueenJaime - Heir to House LannisterTyrion - "the Imp"TargaryenViserys - Current seat of House Targaryen, exiled heir to the Iron ThroneDaenarys - SisterStick with that for now.. there's a lot more, and if you want to dig deeper, check it out on Wikipedia, but beware of spoilers. There are probably some doozies if you aren't careful.I suggest reading the books, at least so you can know the full backstory and so you can join in much of the inevitable spoiler-filled conversation without unpleasant surprises.
This is a pretty good job. You will want to eventually read the books, but if you don't want the spoilers while the series is running I have another suggestion. The back of the first book had a breakdown of the different houses involved and their primary players. You could get the book and just read that part.

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I got no real complaints from it, though it wasn't as mind blowing awesome as I had hoped. Kind of like the first X-Men movie, they had to establish a lot of relationships in a short amount of time without the benefit of narrative subtext and revelatory scenes from later in the books. I think they did a pretty good job of it. I really liked the title intro. Hopefully as other cities like Riverrun, Dragonstone, Casterly Rock etc appear, the sequence will change a bit and show the new spots. Dinklage was great. Hopefully it gets even better as it goes.

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Can I get a breakdown of who is who kingdom-wise and relationship-wise fron those of you who read the book(s)? I liked this episode but just want to make sure I'm followIng properly.

That's a pretty big undertaking, but for the here and now, you have:House StarkEddard (Ned)CatelynRob - Heir to House Stark - around 16Sansa - 13Arya - like 9 or 10Bran - 7 or 8Ricken - 3Jon Snow- bastard son of Ned - around 16BaratheonRobert - KingCersei - QueenJoffrey - son & heirthere's some other siblings in here, but these are the primariesLannisterTywinCercei - QueenJaime - Heir to House LannisterTyrion - "the Imp"TargaryenViserys - Current seat of House Targaryen, exiled heir to the Iron ThroneDaenarys - SisterStick with that for now.. there's a lot more, and if you want to dig deeper, check it out on Wikipedia, but beware of spoilers. There are probably some doozies if you aren't careful.I suggest reading the books, at least so you can know the full backstory and so you can join in much of the inevitable spoiler-filled conversation without unpleasant surprises.
They aged everyone up a bit (eg:Rickon is older than 3 here) and set Robert's Rebellion/War of the Ursurper 17 years ago instead of 14. In this war Robert (Mark Addy)won the Throne by defeating the last Targaryen King(they ruled for 285 years or so and united the Seven Kingdoms into one realm) This king was Viserys and Daenaryes father (whom Jaime Lannister assassinated). Ned, Jon Arryn and Hoster Tully led armies with Robert.Jaime is not the heir because he took an oath for the King's Guard.

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Can I get a breakdown of who is who kingdom-wise and relationship-wise fron those of you who read the book(s)? I liked this episode but just want to make sure I'm followIng properly.

To be honest, I'd just use the wiki page. The cast is gigantic.

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Can I get a breakdown of who is who kingdom-wise and relationship-wise fron those of you who read the book(s)? I liked this episode but just want to make sure I'm followIng properly.

That's a pretty big undertaking, but for the here and now, you have:

House Stark

Eddard (Ned)

Catelyn

Rob - Heir to House Stark - around 16

Sansa - 13

Arya - like 9 or 10

Bran - 7 or 8

Ricken - 3

Jon Snow- bastard son of Ned - around 16

Baratheon

Robert - King

Cersei - Queen

Joffrey - son & heir

there's some other siblings in here, but these are the primaries

Lannister

Tywin

Cercei - Queen

Jaime - Heir to House Lannister

Tyrion - "the Imp"

Targaryen

Viserys - Current seat of House Targaryen, exiled heir to the Iron Throne

Daenarys - Sister

Stick with that for now.. there's a lot more, and if you want to dig deeper, check it out on Wikipedia, but beware of spoilers. There are probably some doozies if you aren't careful.

I suggest reading the books, at least so you can know the full backstory and so you can join in much of the inevitable spoiler-filled conversation without unpleasant surprises.

This is a pretty good job. You will want to eventually read the books, but if you don't want the spoilers while the series is running I have another suggestion. The back of the first book had a breakdown of the different houses involved and their primary players. You could get the book and just read that part.
Here's another list taken from this site:

Below is a list of characters-- great and small-- that have appeared thus far in the first season of HBO's Game of Thrones.

Character Note

Will A ranger of the Night's Watch.

Waymar Royce A ranger of the Night's Watch.

Gared A ranger of the Night's Watch.

Lord Eddard Stark Lord of Winterfell, Lord Paramount of the North, and Warden of the North.

Jon Snow Bastard son of Eddard Stark by an unknown mother.

Robb Stark Eldest son of Lord Eddard Stark and Catelyn Tully.

Bran Stark Second son of Eddard Stark and Catelyn Tully.

Theon Greyjoy Youngest son of Lord Balon Greyjoy and Alannys Harlaw.

Jory Cassel Captain of Eddard Stark's household guard.

Daenerys Targaryen Only daughter of Aerys II Targaryen and Rhaella Targaryen.

Viserys Targaryen Younger son of King Aerys II Targaryen and Rhaella Targaryen.

Magister Illyrio Mopatis A Magister of the Free City of Pentos.

Ser Jorah Mormont Son of Lord Jeor Mormont.

Khal Drogo A Dothraki khal.

Lord Jon Arryn Lord of the Eyrie, Lord Paramount of the Vale, Warden of the East, and Hand of the King to Robert Baratheon.

Queen Cersei Lannister Daughter of Lord Tywin Lannister and Joanna Lannister, wife of King Robert Baratheon, and Queen of the Seven Kingdoms.

Tyrion Lannister Younger son of Lord Tywin Lannister and Joanna Lannister.

Ser Jaime Lannister Elder son of Lord Tywin Lannister and Joanna Lannister.

Maester Luwin Maester of Winterfell.

Lady Catelyn Stark Elder daughter of Lord Hoster Tully and Minisa Whent and wife of Lord Eddard Stark.

Sansa Stark Elder daughter of Lord Eddard Stark and Lady Catelyn Tully.

Arya Stark Younger daughter of Eddard Stark and Catelyn Tully.

Rickon Stark Youngest son of Eddard Stark and Catelyn Tully.

Prince Joffrey Baratheon Elder son of King Robert Baratheon and Queen Cersei Lannister.

Sandor Clegane Sworn shield to Prince Joffrey Baratheon.

King Robert Baratheon King of the Andals and the Rhoynar and the First Men, Lord of the Seven Kingdoms, and Protector of the Realm.

Benjen Stark Younger brother of Eddard Stark and First Ranger of the Night's Watch.

Septa Mordane A septa and tutor to Arya and Sansa Stark.

Rodrik Cassel Master-at-arms of Winterfell.

Be careful wandering around that site, though, as you're liable to run across mucho spoileros.

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Ok was starting to like the show but what is with all the incest?

Pretty common throughout history, actually. I wouldn't worry too much about it, it is more a theme moving forward than something that will be thrown in your face all the time. Obviously the final scene was driven by an incestuous affair that was discovered and that scene is a big part of what sets the plot for the series.

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Very good all in all, but I do have a couple of book snob quibbles.

I thought they left out two of the better lines from early in the book; after the beheading Bran asks Ned something like "Can a man still be brave even when he is afraid?" and Ned replies "That's the only time a man can be brave." and when Tyrion and Jon are talking and Tyrion tells Jon "All dwarves are bastards, but not all bastards need be dwarves" or something to that effect.

I was also surprised they didn't hit on Ned's promise to Lyanna when Ned and Robert were in the crypt. Maybe they figured there was enough going on without throwing a big mystery in there on top of everything.

Edited by parrot

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I turned it on about 20 minutes in to it and had no idea what was going on. I did see the dwarf from Elf get naked with a bunch of chicks before changing the channel, so that was good. Hope you guys liked it.

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My wife is reading and filled me in but otherwise I wouldn't have known dude was boning his sister, just would have thought she was the queen.

I guess I should pay more attentions.

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So the mentor of Neds and the (former) Hand of the King (Aryn maybe?)....who died but we find out later was murdered....was married to Ned's sister-in-law...who sent the note at the end?

Is Tyrion an old rival of Neds...but fought with him to overthrow the Targaryens?

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1. So the mentor of Neds and the (former) Hand of the King (Aryn maybe?)....who died but we find out later was murdered....was married to Ned's sister-in-law...who sent the note at the end?2. Is Tyrion an old rival of Neds...but fought with him to overthrow the Targaryens?

1. Yep2. Do you really mean Tyrion (the dwarf?) or someone else? Almost sounds like you mean Jaime (the knight who was banging his sister at the end, then pushed the kid). If so, the answer is "sorta". They weren't rivals, but they didn't like each other (I think this'll be explained more in future episodes). They ended up allied against the Targaryens (also probably to be explained in more depth later on). Edited by Uruk-Hai

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1. So the mentor of Neds and the (former) Hand of the King (Aryn maybe?)....who died but we find out later was murdered....was married to Ned's sister-in-law...who sent the note at the end?2. Is Tyrion an old rival of Neds...but fought with him to overthrow the Targaryens?

1. Yep2. Do you really mean Tyrion (the dwarf?) or someone else? Almost sounds like you mean Jaime (the knight who was banging his sister at the end, then pushed the kid). If so, the answer is "sorta". They weren't rivals, but they didn't like each other (I think this'll be explained more in future episodes). They ended up allied against the Targaryens (also probably to be explained in more depth later on).
Yep...meant Jaime. I'm guessing reading the Wiki background that leads up to the novels is a good idea...doubt they backtrack to that history?

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1. So the mentor of Neds and the (former) Hand of the King (Aryn maybe?)....who died but we find out later was murdered....was married to Ned's sister-in-law...who sent the note at the end?2. Is Tyrion an old rival of Neds...but fought with him to overthrow the Targaryens?

1. Yep2. Do you really mean Tyrion (the dwarf?) or someone else? Almost sounds like you mean Jaime (the knight who was banging his sister at the end, then pushed the kid). If so, the answer is "sorta". They weren't rivals, but they didn't like each other (I think this'll be explained more in future episodes). They ended up allied against the Targaryens (also probably to be explained in more depth later on).
Yep...meant Jaime. I'm guessing reading the Wiki background that leads up to the novels is a good idea...doubt they backtrack to that history?
Oh, there's plenty of history out there but the problem is that you also run across a lot of apoliers. Plus, one of the cool things about the books is how Martin gives you bits and pieces of info (including his characters' pasts) a little at a time. Perceptions change as he does that. There's an obvious example that they sort of skimmed over last night; I'm wondering how they're going to introduce this since it's so central to a lot of plot threads.

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That really helped guys. Thanks!

I don't want to read the books while the series is on. I'd rather go along with it. Just needed some clarification/background, which I am sure I will need again. I probably will watch this again onDemand tonight.

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Very nice first episode. Can't go wrong with multiple beheadings in the first 15 mins.

Daenerys = Superhot

The visuals were incredible with both the Belfast and Malta locations. :thumbup:

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Here is a tongue-in-cheek but still-informative recap of last night's episode that may clear up some confusion for those who haven't read the books. Obviously, there are spoilers for last night's show itself, but none for upcoming episodes.

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Any place to watch this online without getting HBO? Or am I going to have to splurge?

I know with Comcast you can get three free months of HBO and I don't think there is a commitment past that. I suggest calling them to see what offers they have.

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Here is a tongue-in-cheek but still-informative recap of last night's episode that may clear up some confusion for those who haven't read the books. Obviously, there are spoilers for last night's show itself, but none for upcoming episodes.

Very helpful actually.

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Here is a tongue-in-cheek but still-informative recap of last night's episode that may clear up some confusion for those who haven't read the books. Obviously, there are spoilers for last night's show itself, but none for upcoming episodes.

Very helpful actually.
Here's HBO's viewer guide. Link goes to an interactive map. Upper right corner has a link for its guide to houses. Once in the guide to houses arewa, there's also an appendix that has some basic background info (how Robert became king, why he rebelled, etc..).

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I am watching this now, and have read all the books...twice.

I find myself watching and listening to the characters, all the while thinking, he's gonna die, she's gonna get taken like a dog.

Otherwise so far so good.

and Daenerys is very super hot.

Looking forward to the next book.

ETA: I can't wait to see the dragons.

Edited by Darrinll40

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I find myself watching and listening to the characters, all the while thinking, he's gonna die, she's gonna get taken like a dog.

I found myself doing the same thing.

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For those that have not, you really really need to read the book first. You won't regret it.

Just do it. You can have it done in a week, if you stay on it. If not, then TIVO next week's episode.

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Here is a tongue-in-cheek but still-informative recap of last night's episode that may clear up some confusion for those who haven't read the books. Obviously, there are spoilers for last night's show itself, but none for upcoming episodes.

Very helpful actually.
It's pretty awesome actually, especially the picture at the end of Luke and Leia about to kiss with the caption "It's never ok!".

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For those that have not, you really really need to read the book first. You won't regret it.Just do it. You can have it done in a week, if you stay on it. If not, then TIVO next week's episode.

I don't get this at all. Listen, if the show requires people to have read the books in order to make sense of it, it will have failed as television. FWIW, I'm on the fence on the first show. I think some of the material comes off a bit clunky and the exposition is a bit leaden, but I thought that about the book too. I enjoyed the first two books (am currently reading the third), but I do think there are some narrative problems that will spill over into the show (I think it's a mistake to begin the entire series with the White Walkers, for instance, in the book and in the show). I also found the "problematic" sexual themes protrayed in the most prurient and adolescent manner possible in the show. I actually give Martin credit for making those themes more complex in the books.Right now, the series is looking like a more narratively complex The Tudors/Rome (2nd Season). Which puts it squarely in the guilty pleasure category for me.

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For those that have not, you really really need to read the book first. You won't regret it.Just do it. You can have it done in a week, if you stay on it. If not, then TIVO next week's episode.

I don't get this at all. Listen, if the show requires people to have read the books in order to make sense of it, it will have failed as television. FWIW, I'm on the fence on the first show. I think some of the material comes off a bit clunky and the exposition is a bit leaden, but I thought that about the book too. I enjoyed the first two books (am currently reading the third), but I do think there are some narrative problems that will spill over into the show (I think it's a mistake to begin the entire series with the White Walkers, for instance, in the book and in the show). I also found the "problematic" sexual themes protrayed in the most prurient and adolescent manner possible in the show. I actually give Martin credit for making those themes more complex in the books.Right now, the series is looking like a more narratively complex The Tudors/Rome (2nd Season). Which puts it squarely in the guilty pleasure category for me.
It's not that you have to read the book in order to enjoy the show. That's not it at all. I'm sure the show will be enjoyable without ever having read the books, but the entertainment value of the show is much much greater having read the books, imo. You may disagree, but I find knowing the characters in my head, and seeing them accurately portrayed (so far, so good) on screen is immensely entertaining. But to each his own.. if someone doesn't read, or if they don't want to invest the energy, so be it. I'm sure the HBO series will kick ### just the same.

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Any place to watch this online without getting HBO? Or am I going to have to splurge?

I know with Comcast you can get three free months of HBO and I don't think there is a commitment past that. I suggest calling them to see what offers they have.
It may depend on the particular offers available at your location. I tried to get free HBO for a couple of months and the best they would offer was $10 per month for 6 months.

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Crap. Damn HBO did a free weekend just so I could catch this on my Dish Network. I'm a fan of the books and now I might need to look into subscribing to HBO just to see this damn show. It was very good. Crap. :angry:

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Any place to watch this online without getting HBO? Or am I going to have to splurge?

I know with Comcast you can get three free months of HBO and I don't think there is a commitment past that. I suggest calling them to see what offers they have.
It may depend on the particular offers available at your location. I tried to get free HBO for a couple of months and the best they would offer was $10 per month for 6 months.
When I called about the cost of HBO they informed me about 3 free months. At the same I was having some service issues and they made it 6 free months! How could I say no?

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For those that have not, you really really need to read the book first. You won't regret it.Just do it. You can have it done in a week, if you stay on it. If not, then TIVO next week's episode.

I don't get this at all. Listen, if the show requires people to have read the books in order to make sense of it, it will have failed as television.
I don't think that's what's being said. I personally think people should read these books first because I think they would enjoy them a lot more. I couldn't imagine reading these books after watching the series.

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For those that have not, you really really need to read the book first. You won't regret it.Just do it. You can have it done in a week, if you stay on it. If not, then TIVO next week's episode.

I don't get this at all. Listen, if the show requires people to have read the books in order to make sense of it, it will have failed as television.
I don't think that's what's being said. I personally think people should read these books first because I think they would enjoy them a lot more. I couldn't imagine reading these books after watching the series.
:goodposting:I enjoyed the first show, but these books are some of the best Fantasy books on the market. It would be a shame to have to read them after being prejudiced by the series, no matter how good it is.

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For those that have not, you really really need to read the book first. You won't regret it.Just do it. You can have it done in a week, if you stay on it. If not, then TIVO next week's episode.

I don't get this at all. Listen, if the show requires people to have read the books in order to make sense of it, it will have failed as television.
I don't think that's what's being said. I personally think people should read these books first because I think they would enjoy them a lot more. I couldn't imagine reading these books after watching the series.
:goodposting:I enjoyed the first show, but these books are some of the best Fantasy books on the market. It would be a shame to have to read them after being prejudiced by the series, no matter how good it is.
Prejudiced and hit with massive spoilers. Definitely recommend the books first just for the excitement of discovery before the good but nowhere near as awesome as the source TV show ruins the surprises.That said, since I am still re-reading book 3, I'm having mind warp issues as the characters as I've pictured them are warring with the visuals from the show in my head. Like Tyrion and Sansa for instance. I always pictured Sansa looking like the weird princess from Neverending Story but now she's a super cute and most likely soon to be super hot redhead, and Tyrion I always pictured like the dwarf in Don't Look Now. Both of these characters' images keep morphing in my head like the suits from A Scanner Darkly. Kind of weird. I hope one image takes final control before the 5th book comes out (if it actually does now that season 2 is greenlit).

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Plus the dialogue in the books is fantastic. So is the first person POV. You get a lot more into the feelings of the characters. Such as Snow's rocky relationship with Cat. I really can't beleive they sliced Tyrion's line about "all dwarves are bastards, but not all bastards need be dwarves." That line really solidified Tyrion as a friend and comrade of Jon's.

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For those that have not, you really really need to read the book first. You won't regret it.Just do it. You can have it done in a week, if you stay on it. If not, then TIVO next week's episode.

I don't get this at all. Listen, if the show requires people to have read the books in order to make sense of it, it will have failed as television. FWIW, I'm on the fence on the first show. I think some of the material comes off a bit clunky and the exposition is a bit leaden, but I thought that about the book too. I enjoyed the first two books (am currently reading the third), but I do think there are some narrative problems that will spill over into the show (I think it's a mistake to begin the entire series with the White Walkers, for instance, in the book and in the show). I also found the "problematic" sexual themes protrayed in the most prurient and adolescent manner possible in the show. I actually give Martin credit for making those themes more complex in the books.Right now, the series is looking like a more narratively complex The Tudors/Rome (2nd Season). Which puts it squarely in the guilty pleasure category for me.
You have a lot of fancy words in there.

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Plus the dialogue in the books is fantastic. So is the first person POV. You get a lot more into the feelings of the characters. Such as Snow's rocky relationship with Cat. I really can't beleive they sliced Tyrion's line about "all dwarves are bastards, but not all bastards need be dwarves." That line really solidified Tyrion as a friend and comrade of Jon's.

:thumbup:

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while books usually provide more depth than you will ever get in a TV series, there is one thing that reading the book won't give me that the TV series will: a nice long shot of Emilia Clarke's big a##. :pickle:

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So i'm a fan of the Arya Stark character, does she play a significant role in the story, or is she more of a fringe character?

ETA: I guess my question is also is this a character worth caring about, or will she be gone soon?

Edited by modogg

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