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Jene Bramel

IDP 2007 NFL Draft Thread

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4.132 -- RYAN MCBEAN -- Pittsburgh Steelers

Positional versatility!!!!

Tomlin is taking every player that fits both the 3-4 and 4-3 Tampa-2 he can find. McBean can be a very good 3-4 end and 4-3 undertackle. Another Steeler to keep an eye on toward the end of 2007 in case a position change occurs. Could be a stud in DT specific leagues in 2008.

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Who am I to question anything Shanahan and Denver do, but still I gotta say I'm a little disappointed in their draft. What was the trade up about ? Somewhere someone got a good laugh, I do like the Crowder pick though and was hoping for DL upgrades all along.

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Who am I to question anything Shanahan and Denver do, but still I gotta say I'm a little disappointed in their draft. What was the trade up about ? Somewhere someone got a good laugh, I do like the Crowder pick though and was hoping for DL upgrades all along.

Agree. :excited: I've not caught the explanation yet but suspect that there was some team lurking, some insidious influence, waiting to snatch their man at the 21st spot.Dallas?....who ended up trading down and taking Spencer at the 1.26 is the most likely.I'm not sure of the Tyler pick-up....time will tell. If he rooms with a mentor, he just might overcome his problems. A risky pic but the kid has the tools to be the best DT in this draft if he can stay clean.

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from the Buffalo News today:

While Jauron would not commit to a position for Posluszny, he is expected to play the middle in Buffalo, because incumbent Angelo Crowell is better suited to the strong side in the Bills defense.

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4.134 -- ANTWAN BARNES -- Baltimore Ravens

Just a placeholder comment. Undersized at 235 pounds, but has great measurables (4.5, 31 reps) with a history of solid defensive end play. Worth paying attention to any LB with pass rush skill that the Ravens draft now with Adalius Thomas gone and Ray Lewis on the decline. Needs work in pass coverage but could project into a Bart Scott role if you stretch the depth chart well into the future and hallucinate Scott taking Lewis' role.

5.150 -- JOSH GATTIS -- Jacksonville Jaguars

Stuck behind Donovin Darius and Reggie Nelson for now. Questionable scouting report in places, but could project down the line as a SS with some decent run stopping skills. May be still worth watching in deep dynasty leagues.

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5.158 -- JOHNNY BALDWIN -- Detroit Lions

Very little available on this guy but the Lions have a couple of suspect guys at MLB so I'm searching.

Huntsville Times

Alabama A&M inside linebacker Johnny Baldwin may have secured his draft status Tuesday when he wowed about a dozen scouts from the National Football League at the school's annual pro day.

Baldwin was one of 10 Bulldogs to work out for NFL scouts. A 6-foot-1, 232-pounder, Baldwin put up impressive numbers in front of representatives from the Carolina Panthers, Indianapolis Colts, Jacksonville Jaguars, Kansas City Chiefs, Miami Dolphins, Minnesota Vikings, New Orleans Saints, New York Giants, Oakland Raiders, Seattle Seahawks and Tennessee Titans.

Baldwin ran the 40-yard dash in 4.59 seconds, had a 38-inch vertical, 10-4 broad jump and bench-pressed 225 pounds 28 times.

"He was very impressive," A&M coach Anthony Jones said. "His stock should have gone up. Johnny has been working extremely hard and it showed (Tuesday). He's been blessed where he stayed healthy, and he's going to get an opportunity to fulfill his dream."

One liner on another scouting service reads "aggressive run-and-chase backer with the ability to backup in the NFL." And there's a message board thread that suggests the Colts' scouts were comparing him to Robert Mathis after his workout.

We'll see.

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5.164 -- TIM SHAW -- Carolina Panthers

Decent value and a guy who could fill Adam Seward's role as a swing backup at all three spots. Enough depth that Na'il Diggs could be let go if enough of the youngsters step up and plenty of hedge against Dan Morgan. Davis, Morgan, Beason, Diggs, Anderson, Shaw, Seward, Melton right now. Couple gotta go.

5.167 -- KEVIN PAYNE -- Chicago Bears

Most of the in-the-box safeties aren't landing in great roles. Scouts differ on Payne but most see him as needing improvement in coverage (somewhat like Adam Archuleta) and as a inconsistent tackler. Long term SS possibility here but not much more right now.

5.173 -- MICHAEL COE -- Indianapolis Colts

Another very solid, if raw, Cover-2 corner prospect to Indianapolis. It'll be interesting to see how this crew plays out.

5.176 -- RUFUS ALEXANDER -- Minnesota Vikings

Slippery slide for Alexander but the thump at the bottom was him landing on Chad Greenway's heels on the depth chart at WLB. Alexander has issues, but Greenway wasn't setting camp afire last year. Worth watching.

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5.179 -- HB BLADES -- Washington Redskins

Doesn't project well to the weak side according to most scouting services. Limited in coverage. Probably not an IDP option anytime soon in Washington.

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hate to bring up something from yesterday right now, but you guys really didn't say much about Harris to NYJ.

where do you see this guy fitting in? Hobson and Vilma are inside right now. We all know they don't like Barton that much and Thomas of course will stay at outside.

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hate to bring up something from yesterday right now, but you guys really didn't say much about Harris to NYJ.where do you see this guy fitting in? Hobson and Vilma are inside right now. We all know they don't like Barton that much and Thomas of course will stay at outside.

didn't Hobson play OLB?I think the starting lineup now is: Thomas/Barton/Vilma/Hobson but Harris will replace Barton at some point.

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hate to bring up something from yesterday right now, but you guys really didn't say much about Harris to NYJ.

where do you see this guy fitting in? Hobson and Vilma are inside right now. We all know they don't like Barton that much and Thomas of course will stay at outside.

From yesterday's posts...

2.47 -- DAVID HARRIS -- New York Jets

Jets were vocal about looking to improve Eric Barton's spot. Harris is an excellent fit at the LILB spot as a decent sized player with better speed than was originally thought. It pretty much seals Jonathan Vilma's fate as the RILB and so-so IDP value until he changes teams and scheme. And it'll be a great test of the LILB/RILB dichotomy. When Harris shows up in the top fifteen linebackers next season, you can put to rest the argument that 3-4 ILB are questionable IDP options. And he will if he can prove himself enough in coverage to hold an every down role.

Jets trade up for ILB David Harris.

assuming they don't trade Vilma, should be a very studly ILB pair in the 3-4. seems like they are overloaded with inside linebackers now though.

Harris reminds me a bit of Victor Hobson. PFW compares him to Kirk Morrison and suggests he can play MLB or SLB.

Not the most durable or athletic guy, but one thing he does very well is shed blockers.

John Murphy's take: A solid if not spectacular all-around prospect who steadily improved his grade throughout his senior campaign, Harris is the type of player who grows on you the more that you watch his game films. He has a few limitations in pass coverage -- better in zone than man-to-man -- but has terrific natural instincts and is especially adept at diagnosing the play quickly, making the proper pre-snap read and then keeping the defenders around him in the right place. Harris does not get out of position on misdirection plays, but sometimes lacks the foot speed to make the tackle on plays run to the wide side of the field. He brings intangibles to the position and will be a good character player for the locker room.

There are several teams in need of a pure inside linebacker, which is where Harris fits best for the next level. He can be productive playing the middle in a base 4-3 system or even inside linebacker in a 3-4 scheme; his only weakness would come if asked to stick most running backs or tight ends in man coverage on third downs. He could be removed in certain third-down situations early in his career, but he has the type of work ethic and dedication to improve as a pass defender over time. Depending on how the inside linebacker market plays out in free agency, I expect Harris will make a hard charge up into the early portion of the second round.

I'd be very surprised if he was behind Victor Hobson inside on opening weekend. I think Hobson goes back outside to compete with David Bowens. Barton will be released; it doesn't look like the Jets can get much for him in trade. I'm interested to see if Harris can hold an every down role, though, before I get any more heavily behind his IDP value.

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another interesting thing about Harris is that the Jets linebackers coach was his defensive coordinator at Michigan. So, considering they know him well and traded up to get him, it makes sense that they have big plans for him.

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7.211 -- OSCAR LUA -- New England Patriots

Decent ILB prospect to develop behind Bruschi, Vrabel and Seau. Couldn't stay healthy with multiple major knee issues at USC and has limited range and cover skills but Belichick has done more with less.

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who are the top 5 idp's?

1 - willis

2 - adams

3 - landry

4 - merriweather

5 - beason

based on talent not the team and chances of starting????

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so safe to say this kills Hobson's value :D:unsure:

why? he played OLB for them last year too...which is how he got 6 sacks. there was some speculation that they would move him inside to replace Barton and add a new OLB...but his value should be about the same as it was last year. I guess one thing that may hurt him is that he'll likely be replaced by David Bowens in pass rushing situations.

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who are the top 5 idp's?1 - willis2 - adams3 - landry4 - merriweather5 - beasonbased on talent not the team and chances of starting????

WillisPosluznyBeasonLandryAdams

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who are the top 5 idp's?1 - willis2 - adams3 - landry4 - merriweather5 - beasonbased on talent not the team and chances of starting????

I'm confused.Are you asking who the best five defensive players in this draft were? Or are you asking who the best five IDPs would be if they all started in the best situation? I have a hard time separating the IDPs from situation/scheme when ranking them so those things sound the same to me.I think the five most talented defensive players are Landry, Willis, Beason, Posluszny, with Revis, Timmons, Hall, Carriker and Anderson fighting for the fifth spot. I'd probably draft Timmons in a dynasty league with Anderson a close second, although I think Carriker and Revis might be more talented.I don't know if that helps or not.

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7.226 -- CJ WILSON -- Carolina Panthers

Wilson is listed as a corner by most scouting services but many note his ability to convert to safety. Coyle thinks he's a hitter and a prospect with some significant upside. There's nobody at SS right now in Carolina. If the Panthers move Wilson there and don't sign a veteran later this off-season, there could be a lot of value here.

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so safe to say this kills Hobson's value

:lmao::homer:

why? he played OLB for them last year too...which is how he got 6 sacks. there was some speculation that they would move him inside to replace Barton and add a new OLB...but his value should be about the same as it was last year. I guess one thing that may hurt him is that he'll likely be replaced by David Bowens in pass rushing situations.
I'm pretty sure it was the other way around Barton and Thomas were outside, Hobson and Vilma inside.

my bad, Hobson was outside

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most talented period.

i'm part of a sim league and i need lb and a de.

landry, g adams, and reggie nelson have already been picked.

would you take willis over jamarcus russell??? Talent wise???

I only have jon kitna in my league.

thanks jene!!!

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most talented period.i'm part of a sim league and i need lb and a de.landry, g adams, and reggie nelson have already been picked.would you take willis over jamarcus russell??? Talent wise???I only have jon kitna in my league.thanks jene!!!

Depends on scoring system but I think it'd be real hard to pass on Russell's upside for an IDP.

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7.239 -- CJ AH YOU -- Buffalo Bills

High upside edge rusher. Rotational guy behind at least two established ends already but so was Mark Anderson. Longshot but could surprise.

7.240 -- BRANDON SILER -- San Diego Chargers

Fell due to concerns over overall play and weak coverage skills. Probably fifth on the depth chart at ILB but worth mentioning.

Not much left over -- Rory Johnson, Earl Everett, Melvin Bullitt and a few other back end OLB and CB prospects hanging around for the free agent flurry.

Think that'll about do it. This group is nowhere near as deep in recent seasons at first pass. FBG opens in the next 10 days and all staff rankings should be up by then. Plenty of mini-camp observations over that period to shape my personal rankings. I'll try to participate in the rookie ranking threads after some consideration tonight or tomorrow.

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scoring system in the sim league is the same as the nfl.

you don't get points for sacks.

your game is simulated and you just need to man the best team week to week.

it's like simulating madden but we run the league based on the each ind. players rankings by the computer. OLmen and every other position.

it really helps to have a good OL and DL.

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:loco:

I've gotta say - excellent thread Jene, Aaron, and everyone else involved.

The analysis here is far better than anything I'd expect coming from the other "experts" in the coming weeks/months. And to do this on the fly right as the picks are made is amazing.

Great job!

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On the Jets situation, both Barton and Hobson will have to fight to remain starters, and it's very likely Barton gets cut with a 3.5 mil cap number and is a guy who free lances a bit too much for Mangini's liking. I expect Harris will start for Barton in the more productive ILB spot (Barton as a cap cut to the Giants is a real possibility) and Hobson will have to hold off Bowen at the OLB spot opposite Bryan Thomas. At this point, I think Bowen has the advantage, but he's making the conversion from DE to OLB, and might not be ready by the start of the season.

I figure Harris to be a 200 point LB even in his rookie year (tackle heavy scoring systems) and expect Barton to be changing his green and white helmet for another color.... Giants blue is a possibility. Barton isn't a bad LB.... he is a guy who is average but can have some great games when he can be a force. Emotional player who can be good when he gets his motor running, but when he plays with that emotion, he can take some stupid penalties. If he goes to WLB in a 4-3, he can be a very good FF value, at a minimum, a good #3 lb.

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5.179 -- HB BLADES -- Washington Redskins

Doesn't project well to the weak side according to most scouting services. Limited in coverage. Probably not an IDP option anytime soon in Washington.

This is almost assuredly their MLB in waiting. He's going to play special teams and absorb as much as possible from Fletcher, another undersized MLB. They're hoping that he turns into another Zach Thomas or Lofa Tatupu.

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7.211 -- OSCAR LUA -- New England Patriots

Decent ILB prospect to develop behind Bruschi, Vrabel and Seau. Couldn't stay healthy with multiple major knee issues at USC and has limited range and cover skills but Belichick has done more with less.

As a USC watcher, Lua is your stereotypical, old-fashioned plugger. He works hard and will hit, but he's just not all that athletic or rangy. Maybe they can turn him into a Ted Johnson type of ILB up in NE, but his ceiling is clearly his athleticism.

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1.26 -- ANTHONY SPENCER -- Dallas Cowboys

And Chaos Commish throws his laptop...

Meh. I really liked Spencer as this season's Tamba Hali. Undersized guy with a decent first step who was much stronger in run support than he looked. Now he looks in nearly every way like his fellow alumnus Shaun Phillips. He'll play the LOLB role in this defense (where Merriman played) but Ware at ROLB will get the bulk of the best pass rushing opportunities. He goes from a potential nice RDE to a very suspect OLB prospect in IDP terms.

Ah well.

And it probably means Bobby Carpenter stays inside (nod to WD).

A buddy of mine called this a few weeks ago. Dallas has a team that can win now and, if you believe in Hamlin, then this was the last significant hole on defense. Spencer is going to...or should...play right away and take pressure off of D. Ware.

The Cowboys had a good draft. Folks in Texas seem to be torn but that first round pick next year will fall in the Top 10. I don't care what the Browns got done on draft day or who they signed in free agency. That is still a bad to below average football team. CC, your Pokes will get their offensive playmaker next year early in Round 1.

It is sick to think the Pokes added another lottery ball in the McFadden sweepstakes.

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1.26 -- ANTHONY SPENCER -- Dallas Cowboys

And Chaos Commish throws his laptop...

Meh. I really liked Spencer as this season's Tamba Hali. Undersized guy with a decent first step who was much stronger in run support than he looked. Now he looks in nearly every way like his fellow alumnus Shaun Phillips. He'll play the LOLB role in this defense (where Merriman played) but Ware at ROLB will get the bulk of the best pass rushing opportunities. He goes from a potential nice RDE to a very suspect OLB prospect in IDP terms.

Ah well.

And it probably means Bobby Carpenter stays inside (nod to WD).

A buddy of mine called this a few weeks ago. Dallas has a team that can win now and, if you believe in Hamlin, then this was the last significant hole on defense. Spencer is going to...or should...play right away and take pressure off of D. Ware.

The Cowboys had a good draft. Folks in Texas seem to be torn but that first round pick next year will fall in the Top 10. I don't care what the Browns got done on draft day or who they signed in free agency. That is still a bad to below average football team. CC, your Pokes will get their offensive playmaker next year early in Round 1.

It is sick to think the Pokes added another lottery ball in the McFadden sweepstakes.

Last year I suffered through Parcells forcing Bobby Carpenter in the first when clearly Manny Lawson was the way to go. It irks me and we have a repeat this year. Wade is comparing Spencer to fellow ex Boilermaker Shaun Phillips. I find this kind of talent observation laughable, unfortunate, and I'm a little tired fo Jerry promising BaP then going with the head coach.

The thing that makes me furious about this one is the move up with Philly. They made an awesome deal with Cleveland that was laced with good karma and common sense for both teams, and they tarnished it by getting raped by the Eagles.

Dallas basically said Spencer is greater than:

a combination of one of these:

Eric Weddle, Justin Blalock, Sidney Rice, Dwayne Jarrett, or Chris Houston...

AND this is what really kils me...

one of these...

Quentin Moses, Alama-Francis, or Ryan Kalil...

I would submit to you that every single one of those players are better football players than Spencer. So there's this disconcerting double whammy with them taking a player (Spencer) who I think was overhyped in the Big 10 and no better than Rob Ninkovich or Ray Edwards, AND passing on two better players. Even if Spencer is who Wade thinks he is, I doubt he is worth any combination of those Dallas could be boasting today.

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1.26 -- ANTHONY SPENCER -- Dallas Cowboys

And Chaos Commish throws his laptop...

Meh. I really liked Spencer as this season's Tamba Hali. Undersized guy with a decent first step who was much stronger in run support than he looked. Now he looks in nearly every way like his fellow alumnus Shaun Phillips. He'll play the LOLB role in this defense (where Merriman played) but Ware at ROLB will get the bulk of the best pass rushing opportunities. He goes from a potential nice RDE to a very suspect OLB prospect in IDP terms.

Ah well.

And it probably means Bobby Carpenter stays inside (nod to WD).

A buddy of mine called this a few weeks ago. Dallas has a team that can win now and, if you believe in Hamlin, then this was the last significant hole on defense. Spencer is going to...or should...play right away and take pressure off of D. Ware.

The Cowboys had a good draft. Folks in Texas seem to be torn but that first round pick next year will fall in the Top 10. I don't care what the Browns got done on draft day or who they signed in free agency. That is still a bad to below average football team. CC, your Pokes will get their offensive playmaker next year early in Round 1.

It is sick to think the Pokes added another lottery ball in the McFadden sweepstakes.

Last year I suffered through Parcells forcing Bobby Carpenter in the first when clearly Manny Lawson was the way to go. It irks me and we have a repeat this year. Wade is comparing Spencer to fellow ex Boilermaker Shaun Phillips. I find this kind of talent observation laughable, unfortunate, and I'm a little tired fo Jerry promising BaP then going with the head coach.

The thing that makes me furious about this one is the move up with Philly. They made an awesome deal with Cleveland that was laced with good karma and common sense for both teams, and they tarnished it by getting raped by the Eagles.

Dallas basically said Spencer is greater than:

a combination of one of these:

Eric Weddle, Justin Blalock, Sidney Rice, Dwayne Jarrett, or Chris Houston...

AND this is what really kils me...

one of these...

Quentin Moses, Alama-Francis, or Ryan Kalil...

I would submit to you that every single one of those players are better football players than Spencer. So there's this disconcerting double whammy with them taking a player (Spencer) who I think was overhyped in the Big 10 and no better than Rob Ninkovich or Ray Edwards, AND passing on two better players. Even if Spencer is who Wade thinks he is, I doubt he is worth any combination of those Dallas could be boasting today.

Agreed on points concerning the Eagles trade and Spencer's value vs. what Dallas could have had.

I still think that the Cowboys are easily resting in the Top 10 next year and...most likely...Top 5. I watched the draft with nothing but Cowboy fans and just about everyone was happy until the Eagles trade. Also, like yourself, once hindsight kicked in a few people were really upset. Jones' dunce cap fell off for a short period of time Saturday. Somebody quickly put it back on his head.

Most are taking solace in the fact that the Cowboys will most likely make the playoffs and end up picking at the top part of the draft next year. Considering the players likely to come out that is not all bad.

Hey, the Lions could have really used some defensive talent in Round 2 but they took a QB. There was a fair amount of sound prospects left but they went with the kid from MSU. I know how you feel.

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Great thread, Jene, fantastic read all the way through. Just wanted to clarify one thing:

3.65 -- QUENTIN MOSES -- Oakland Raiders

High upside/high bust potential. Will challenge Tyler Brayton early. Could potentially mean a shift to the strong side for Derrick Burgess, who would be better in run support. Could also be little more than a situational rusher.

Derrick Burgess is already on the strong side. Tyler Brayton (and his zero sacks last year), were on the weakside RE spot. If Moses can secure a spot on this D, it'll be at the coveted RE spot.

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Great thread, Jene, fantastic read all the way through. Just wanted to clarify one thing:

3.65 -- QUENTIN MOSES -- Oakland Raiders

High upside/high bust potential. Will challenge Tyler Brayton early. Could potentially mean a shift to the strong side for Derrick Burgess, who would be better in run support. Could also be little more than a situational rusher.

Derrick Burgess is already on the strong side. Tyler Brayton (and his zero sacks last year), were on the weakside RE spot. If Moses can secure a spot on this D, it'll be at the coveted RE spot.
My early dark horse for DROY.

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Great thread, Jene, fantastic read all the way through. Just wanted to clarify one thing:

3.65 -- QUENTIN MOSES -- Oakland Raiders

High upside/high bust potential. Will challenge Tyler Brayton early. Could potentially mean a shift to the strong side for Derrick Burgess, who would be better in run support. Could also be little more than a situational rusher.

Derrick Burgess is already on the strong side. Tyler Brayton (and his zero sacks last year), were on the weakside RE spot. If Moses can secure a spot on this D, it'll be at the coveted RE spot.
Has Burgess been in the LDE spot since he arrived in OAK?

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Great thread, Jene, fantastic read all the way through. Just wanted to clarify one thing:

3.65 -- QUENTIN MOSES -- Oakland Raiders

High upside/high bust potential. Will challenge Tyler Brayton early. Could potentially mean a shift to the strong side for Derrick Burgess, who would be better in run support. Could also be little more than a situational rusher.

Derrick Burgess is already on the strong side. Tyler Brayton (and his zero sacks last year), were on the weakside RE spot. If Moses can secure a spot on this D, it'll be at the coveted RE spot.
Has Burgess been in the LDE spot since he arrived in OAK?
I thought he moved to the RDE last year after playing LDE in 2005. massraider watched more games than I did, though, and I can't remember where Burgess lined up when I saw him against Cincinnati last year. Gamebooks make it look like he played on the right last year but we all know how inaccurate they were at times.

Regardless I agree that Moses will end up on the right side.

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Great thread, Jene, fantastic read all the way through. Just wanted to clarify one thing:

3.65 -- QUENTIN MOSES -- Oakland Raiders

High upside/high bust potential. Will challenge Tyler Brayton early. Could potentially mean a shift to the strong side for Derrick Burgess, who would be better in run support. Could also be little more than a situational rusher.

Derrick Burgess is already on the strong side. Tyler Brayton (and his zero sacks last year), were on the weakside RE spot. If Moses can secure a spot on this D, it'll be at the coveted RE spot.
Has Burgess been in the LDE spot since he arrived in OAK?
I thought he moved to the RDE last year after playing LDE in 2005. massraider watched more games than I did, though, and I can't remember where Burgess lined up when I saw him against Cincinnati last year. Gamebooks make it look like he played on the right last year but we all know how inaccurate they were at times.

Regardless I agree that Moses will end up on the right side.

There may have been moments when he switched, but I will say that he played on the left side all year. Word is that he is more comfortable rushing from that side, and as he has held up against the run surprisingly well, they seem in no rush to move him. I know that every sack I can remember, came from the left.

Brayton was on the right, and was spelled by Johnstone on passing downs. Kevin Huntley took that designated pass rushing role over in the latter part of the season, and grabbed a couple sacks. He looked great in the preseason, so maybe a deep sleeper for folks to keep an eye on.

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