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Moe Green

Philip Rivers Is Terrible

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i have to post something like this every year in this thread since Phillip does this several times a year

Rivers is so bad.  He beat up on an awful AFC west for years and compiled tons of stats.  But whenever a prime time game or playoff game comes up you see his true form.  Some of the throws last night he just threw it up without even scanning the field. Every year he has multiple meltdown games like last night where he has multiple turnovers.  if not for penalties he would have had like what 6 turnovers last night?  Doesn't help that hes basically a statue in the pocket and takes sacks like crazy.  I know most are aware of all this but it just irks me when I hear his name get mentioned with the other really great qbs.  Hes garbage

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5 minutes ago, need2know said:

i have to post something like this every year in this thread since Phillip does this several times a year

Rivers is so bad.  He beat up on an awful AFC west for years and compiled tons of stats.  But whenever a prime time game or playoff game comes up you see his true form.  Some of the throws last night he just threw it up without even scanning the field. Every year he has multiple meltdown games like last night where he has multiple turnovers.  if not for penalties he would have had like what 6 turnovers last night?  Doesn't help that hes basically a statue in the pocket and takes sacks like crazy.  I know most are aware of all this but it just irks me when I hear his name get mentioned with the other really great qbs.  Hes garbage

I haven't checked the schedule but he's a good producer in FF, for his draft position, and could be a buy low. Those long passes at the end were perplexing, as they only needed a FG.

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13 minutes ago, need2know said:

i have to post something like this every year in this thread since Phillip does this several times a year

Rivers is so bad.  He beat up on an awful AFC west for years and compiled tons of stats.  But whenever a prime time game or playoff game comes up you see his true form.  Some of the throws last night he just threw it up without even scanning the field. Every year he has multiple meltdown games like last night where he has multiple turnovers.  if not for penalties he would have had like what 6 turnovers last night?  Doesn't help that hes basically a statue in the pocket and takes sacks like crazy.  I know most are aware of all this but it just irks me when I hear his name get mentioned with the other really great qbs.  Hes garbage

I won’t try to defend a nearly 38-year-old rivers. That said, for the last decade plus he was one of the best quarterbacks in the game.

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7 minutes ago, Cjw_55106 said:

I won’t try to defend a nearly 38-year-old rivers. That said, for the last decade plus he was one of the best quarterbacks in the game.

Not really.  He was an above average QB, a great stat compiler, an average-at-best winner.

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19 minutes ago, need2know said:

i have to post something like this every year in this thread since Phillip does this several times a year

Rivers is so bad.  He beat up on an awful AFC west for years and compiled tons of stats.  But whenever a prime time game or playoff game comes up you see his true form.  Some of the throws last night he just threw it up without even scanning the field. Every year he has multiple meltdown games like last night where he has multiple turnovers.  if not for penalties he would have had like what 6 turnovers last night?  Doesn't help that hes basically a statue in the pocket and takes sacks like crazy.  I know most are aware of all this but it just irks me when I hear his name get mentioned with the other really great qbs.  Hes garbage

This is one of the worst takes in this 46 page thread, and that is saying something. Pretty much every sentence in this post is wrong. Kudos.

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7 minutes ago, Alex P Keaton said:

Not really.  He was an above average QB, a great stat compiler, an average-at-best winner.

A guy is not a compiler if his rate statistics are great in addition to his accumulated statistics. They are.

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Rivers had a bad game, no doubt about that. He was under heavy pressure all game, and it definitely affected him.

Despite that, he led the Chargers on a TD drive to give the Chargers a 4 point lead with 4:02 remaining in the game. Then the Chargers defense proceeded to allow the Raiders to drive 75 yards for the game winning TD over the next 3 minutes. It's not all on Rivers.

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31 minutes ago, Just Win Baby said:

Rivers had a bad game, no doubt about that. He was under heavy pressure all game, and it definitely affected him.

Despite that, he led the Chargers on a TD drive to give the Chargers a 4 point lead with 4:02 remaining in the game. Then the Chargers defense proceeded to allow the Raiders to drive 75 yards for the game winning TD over the next 3 minutes. It's not all on Rivers.

his decision   making is pure garbage right now.....all you need to win is a fg and hes chucking it 40 yards down field...you have your time outs ...its ok to throw 7 yard passes and get a drive going....im baffled at how poorly he played

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Rivers will squeak into the HOF, based on his numbers.  He is currently #6 all time in yardage.  Of the 4 in the top 10 already eligible (Favre, Marino, Elway, Moon), all made it.  Peyton will be a shoe-in, and the other 4 active will make it too (Brees, Brady, Eli, Ben).  He is currently #6 all time in TD's, trailing only Manning, Brady, Brees, Favre, and Marino, all of which are in, or will be in.  The next 4 below him (Ben, Eli, Rodgers, Tarkenton) are in or will be in.  He is 9th in wins, trailing only QB's in the hall, or QB's that will be.

Does he deserve to be in the HOF?  As a 40+ year fan of the Chargers, the answer is no.  He is a good QB, but not great.  He lets his emotions get the best of him in the face of adversity.  Great QB's find ways to win, but Rivers finds ways to lose.  FWIW, I think Eli will make it too, but shouldn't.

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33 minutes ago, Just Win Baby said:

Rivers had a bad game, no doubt about that. He was under heavy pressure all game, and it definitely affected him.

Despite that, he led the Chargers on a TD drive to give the Chargers a 4 point lead with 4:02 remaining in the game. Then the Chargers defense proceeded to allow the Raiders to drive 75 yards for the game winning TD over the next 3 minutes. It's not all on Rivers.

Rivers was a very good QB.   He doesn't want to be hit any more and throws the ball up for grabs at the first sign of pressure.  That o line must be awful since the Raiders have little talent as edge rushers.   

Rivers had plenty of time on the clock and the talented receivers to methodically carve up a weak Raiders secondary by throwing intermediate range passes.   He could have hit Henry, Allen and Ekeler for 7-15 yard gains at will on the last drive.   Instead, he panicked and was throwing up garbage.   Repeatedly.  

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2 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

his decision   making is pure garbage right now.....all you need to win is a fg and hes chucking it 40 yards down field...you have your time outs ...its ok to throw 7 yard passes and get a drive going....im baffled at how poorly he played

I started wondering if there's any reason they might be trying to lose. Throws were off, decisions were off, playcalling made no sense.

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56 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

his decision   making is pure garbage right now.....all you need to win is a fg and hes chucking it 40 yards down field...you have your time outs ...its ok to throw 7 yard passes and get a drive going....im baffled at how poorly he played

That was very weird that he didn't make a single completion on that drive in 8 attempts. Just hit Allen on a quick slant and then a crosser. Raiders just showed you how to do it. 

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29 minutes ago, saintfool said:

thoughts on Easton?

"U Got the Look" holds up well, but we all know what 'Sugar Walls' was about, am I right?

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12 minutes ago, Truebluey said:

That was very weird that he didn't make a single completion on that drive in 8 attempts. Just hit Allen on a quick slant and then a crosser. Raiders just showed you how to do it. 

unclutch

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7 minutes ago, Statorama said:

"U Got the Look" holds up well, but we all know what 'Sugar Walls' was about, am I right?

Well played.

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i started mike williams last night for two reasons... 1 - oak's secondary had been very generous to fantasy WR;s... and 2 - oak pass rush had been abysmal so i thought rivers would have time to hit williams on deeper targets.... not so much. any kind of pressure up the middle against rivers right now and the play is over and you just have to hope he isnt throwing a pick

Edited by iamkoza

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1 hour ago, Statorama said:

"U Got the Look" holds up well, but we all know what 'Sugar Walls' was about, am I right?

Sugar Walls became popular around the time I hit puberty...a round of applause for you sir.

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2 hours ago, TheWinz said:

Rivers will squeak into the HOF, based on his numbers.  He is currently #6 all time in yardage.  Of the 4 in the top 10 already eligible (Favre, Marino, Elway, Moon), all made it.  Peyton will be a shoe-in, and the other 4 active will make it too (Brees, Brady, Eli, Ben).  He is currently #6 all time in TD's, trailing only Manning, Brady, Brees, Favre, and Marino, all of which are in, or will be in.  The next 4 below him (Ben, Eli, Rodgers, Tarkenton) are in or will be in.  He is 9th in wins, trailing only QB's in the hall, or QB's that will be.

Does he deserve to be in the HOF?  As a 40+ year fan of the Chargers, the answer is no.  He is a good QB, but not great.  He lets his emotions get the best of him in the face of adversity.  Great QB's find ways to win, but Rivers finds ways to lose.  FWIW, I think Eli will make it too, but shouldn't.

I agree he should not be HOF and the majority of his high rankings are due to his 16 year career... not his overall quality as a QB.  If you do something longer than anybody esle (save a few), you will have more yards, TD's & wins...  that does not make you HOF caliber. 

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3 minutes ago, Birdie048 said:

I agree he should not be HOF and the majority of his high rankings are due to his 16 year career... not his overall quality as a QB.  If you do something longer than anybody esle (save a few), you will have more yards, TD's & wins...  that does not make you HOF caliber. 

Tell that to Vinny Testaverde.  He is in the top 10 of most games played, but the only other categories he reached top 10 were losses (1st) and INT's (4th).

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4 hours ago, Birdie048 said:

I agree he should not be HOF and the majority of his high rankings are due to his 16 year career... not his overall quality as a QB.  If you do something longer than anybody esle (save a few), you will have more yards, TD's & wins...  that does not make you HOF caliber. 

He is top 10 all-time in passer rating, completion percentage, and YPA. Those things speak to quality.

He has also achieved his accomplishments despite:

  • Playing the past 13 seasons with Norv Turner, Mike McCoy, and Anthony Lynn as his head coach. If he makes the HOF, that would be the weakest list of head coaches of any HOF QB.
  • Playing his entire career for the Chargers, a team with notoriously weak ownership that permeates all aspects of the franchise.
  • Playing the majority of his career behind a terrible OL.

IMO these facts make what he has done more impressive. YMMV.

Edited by Just Win Baby
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He shouldn't be a HOFer IMO.  Better fantasy QB than NFL QB.  In this age of airing it out, the stats are padded already. His longevity shouldn't be what gets him in. 

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His throwing motion has never been a thing of beauty, but it was a little painful to watch last night. It's like he had to shot put the ball to get it downfield, which meant he had no accuracy or velocity, resulting in those floaters that were picked or went sailing over everyone. I know nobody looks good when under constant pressure from a 4-man rush (even Brady in a couple Super Bowls vs the Giants) but he really looked like a guy who was quickly gaining speed on the downslope of his career 

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Philip Rivers sucks. He just does.

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5 hours ago, Cjw_55106 said:

I won’t try to defend a nearly 38-year-old rivers. That said, for the last decade plus he was one of the best quarterbacks in the game.

So completely wrong in every facet of your obsequious devotion to this notion.

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4 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

He is top 10 all-time in passer rating, completion percentage, and YPA. Those things speak to quality.

He has also achieved his accomplishments despite:

  • Playing the past 13 seasons with Norv Turner, Mike McCoy, and Anthony Lynn as his head coach. If he makes the HOF, that would be the weakest list of head coaches of any HOF QB.
  • Playing his entire career for the Chargers, a team with notoriously weak ownership that permeates all aspects of the franchise.
  • Playing the majority of his career behind a terrible OL.

IMO these facts make what he has done more impressive. YMMV.

You need to look at it relative to peer performance, given that passer rating and completion percentage, across the league, have increased each decade.

538 did an article on this maybe 1-2 years ago.  I’ll try to find it.

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55 minutes ago, Alex P Keaton said:

You need to look at it relative to peer performance, given that passer rating and completion percentage, across the league, have increased each decade.

538 did an article on this maybe 1-2 years ago.  I’ll try to find it.

To that point, Jameis Winston and Marcus Mariota each have a higher career passer rating than Dan Marino

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Rivers sucked last night, nobody is denying that. He's been ok this, and is probably more of a B- starter at this point, after peaking as an A- starter at one point. 

Slightly off topic, but career stats are about the worst metric(short of maybe Super Bowl Rings) that people use to judge HOF'ers. They are entirely subjective to eras, teams, and longevity. Individual players should be era adjusted and ranked among their peers. 

Rivers is nowhere near a HOF'er to me, but I'm also pretty tough on HOF spots, and think QB's are already grossly over represented in the HOF. 

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15 hours ago, need2know said:

i have to post something like this every year in this thread since Phillip does this several times a year

Rivers is so bad.  He beat up on an awful AFC west for years and compiled tons of stats.  But whenever a prime time game or playoff game comes up you see his true form.  Some of the throws last night he just threw it up without even scanning the field. Every year he has multiple meltdown games like last night where he has multiple turnovers.  if not for penalties he would have had like what 6 turnovers last night?  Doesn't help that hes basically a statue in the pocket and takes sacks like crazy.  I know most are aware of all this but it just irks me when I hear his name get mentioned with the other really great qbs.  Hes garbage

He's definitely not garbage, although he is one of my least favorite QBs to watch. Nothing against him personally, but he throws the strangest looking ball in the game with that side arm release and odd mechanics. Every single pass he throws looks like it should be intercepted. But somehow it's been extremely effective for him, and he's usually highly accurate with one of the quickest releases in the game. They say he got it from throwing regulation size footballs at too young an age. 

But I do think he's much closer to Andy Dalton than an elite QB in that he almost always ends up on the wrong side in big games. Like I said in another thread, he's the Marty Schottenheimer of QBs. 

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Trainwrecks like that last drive the other night notwithstanding, I find Rivers to be one of the most fun pocket passers to watch ever.  His unusual throwing style and general personality made him look like a scrappy player who plays ugly, but often finds a way to get it done (drives, not Super Bowl wins :lol: ). 

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Has anyone played their way out of the HOF after being a lock to get in?

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On 11/10/2019 at 1:08 AM, BassNBrew said:

Has anyone played their way out of the HOF after being a lock to get in?

Eli gave it a try.

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If this guy gets into the HOF, it will be a travesty and show how much of a joke it has become.

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I'm not saying he's an all-time great, but some of the takes in here seem unusually harsh. He was a darn fine quarterback for a long time. HoF? I don't know, but he was darn good

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6 hours ago, Shawnky said:

If this guy gets into the HOF, it will be a travesty and show how much of a joke it has become.

If anyone doesn't think the HOF is already a travesty(and has been for a long time) then they haven't been paying attention.

If guys like Fred Dean, and Dave Casper, and Lynn Swann are HOF's then how high is the bar really? Unless the argument than NOBODY from a bad team should ever get into the HOF and bit players on good teams do belong. If that's the case let's just enshrine teams instead of players.

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On 11/10/2019 at 8:08 AM, BassNBrew said:

Has anyone played their way out of the HOF after being a lock to get in?

I dunno if "played" is the right word but if AB spends the next several years in court fighting the NFL and the teams that took a chance on him.... he may never get in if it really gets ugly. Some would say the rape accusations are already ugly enough.

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On 11/9/2019 at 6:27 AM, osubuckeyeman said:

Rivers fades at the end of every season fantasy wise.

It's almost as if he stands in the pocket all season long, year after year, behind a putrid OL, and takes a world of punishment.... year, after year, after year and by the end of the season he's a shell of the week #1 version. It's quite a coincidence every season.

Oh, and the reason telesco is an idiot is because he didn't give Gordon $15mil/season and AJ Smith didn't make Vincent Jackson the highest paid receiver in the NFL(more than Megatron was making at the time of the signing). They have never even had a "bad" OL in the past decade+, it's always been at or near the bottom of the league.

As a Rivers fan I am actually looking forward to his retirement because it's really going to expose just how poorly this franchise has been run. He's really the single biggest reason that franchise doesn't draft in the top 10 every single year.

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13 hours ago, Shawnky said:

If this guy gets into the HOF, it will be a travesty and show how much of a joke it has become.

Rivers is better than several HOF QB's. What is the difference between him and say Warren Moon? I'm not arguing in favor of either, but Rivers would hardly be the breaking point.

7 hours ago, BoltBacker said:

If anyone doesn't think the HOF is already a travesty(and has been for a long time) then they haven't been paying attention.

If guys like Fred Dean, and Dave Casper, and Lynn Swann are HOF's then how high is the bar really? Unless the argument than NOBODY from a bad team should ever get into the HOF and bit players on good teams do belong. If that's the case let's just enshrine teams instead of players.

I agree that a lot of HOF'ers are just silly, but Dave Casper is super legit. Best TE of the 70's, and a top-5 all time TE. 

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Crazy that this thread is 12 years old.

In a game where he has been throwing really poorly and indecisively, he follows up a 50 yard strike with a bizarre incomplete forward pass where he tried to pull a throw back and lost the handle. 

Then throws his 4th INT when his team is in position to tie the game.

That's Rivers these days -- wildly inconsistent, and not dependable.

One thing that seems to be getting worse over the year - he badly forces balls into double coverage, and hits lineman or gets his passes batted down more than I've ever seen him do before.

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As he gets older, I think he feels the pressure a lot more. Especially with that makeshift O line. He had pressure coming from BEHIND him all night as DE would blow past the tackles on the outside, and come up from behind as he stepped up in the pocket. His decisionmaking under pressure looks BAD. 😓

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Philip Rivers completed 28-of-52 passes for 353 yards, one touchdown, and four interceptions in the Chargers' 24-17, Week 11 loss to the Chiefs Monday night in Mexico City.

Rivers now has seven interceptions over his last two games, losses to the Raiders and Chiefs, to put the Chargers deep in the AFC West hole at 4-7. The Chargers absolutely clocked the Chiefs in total yards, 438-310, but Rivers couldn't get the offense into the end zone early and then tossed a bunch of mind-melting picks, including a final-minute one in the end zone to salt away the loss. It's become commonplace for Rivers at this point. His lone touchdown was a hookup with Keenan Allen. The Chargers have a Week 12 bye before going to Denver in Week 13. Rivers had 211 yards, zero TDs, and two INTs in a Week 5 home loss to the Broncos.

Nov 18, 2019, 11:47 PM ET

 

 

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