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Philip Rivers Thread

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3 minutes ago, TheWinz said:

Would we have won a SB with Brees if we kept him?  We'll never know.

With Norv Turner, Mike McCoy, and Anthony Lynn as his HC instead of Sean Payton? :no: 

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Philip Rivers completed 36-of-45 passes for 363 yards, one touchdown, and two interceptions in Indianapolis' 27-20 upset loss to the Jaguars.

It was high drama in Rivers' Colts debut (a la his entire career with the Chargers) as he drove the field with less than one minute remaining only to eventually deliver a dropped back shoulder fade to T.Y. Hilton and turn the ball over on downs. The veteran hit nine different receivers throughout the day but will inevitably have his entire performance boiled down to two bone-headed interceptions that allowed the Jaguars to stay competitive throughout. Rivers' presence is still terrific news for Jonathan Taylor (9/22) and Nyheim Hines (7/28/1) as Indy's running backs recorded a 44% target share in Week 1; Rivers notably targeted Los Angeles' backfield at the league's highest rate last year. He'll arguably rank as a QB1 in Week 2 against a Minnesota secondary that was scorched for four touchdowns in the season opener against Aaron Rodgers.

- Rotoworld

 

Edited by The Frankman

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i love Rivers, but at this point in his career, it's obvious he's no Gardner Minshew II.

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After finally watching this game it's shocking(yet par for the course) that Rivers is getting all the blame for this loss.

- The IND offensive line couldn't make 3rd-and-1 and 4th-and-1 conversions(some in the redzone) at all in the running game. This is against a DL that lost its best two players from last year when they weren't all that dominant in the first place. I was pretty shocked that they couldn't get ONE yard on the ground so many times.

- The IND coaching staff left points on the field in the first quarter. I'm all for playing the analytics most of the time but if you can get the lead by simply kicking the FG I just don't understand opting not to take the lead at any point in the game. Unless you have no faith in your defense, but we'll get to that later.

- Both Cambell and Doyle had huge 15 yard penalties. Add that to multiple "illegal formation" penalties on a single drive that led to a FG doinking off the upright that probably would have gone in if the attempt would have been even 5 yards shorter.

- It's hard to understate just how big a drop TY Hilton had on the final drive in the game. I think that was actually one of two huge drops in the game. In another situation as the first half was winding down Hines has a chance to run out of bounds after getting a first down but instead cuts back to the middle of the field to gain an extra 2 yards after he had already gotten a first down. Just awful.

- I thought the addition of Buckner was going to make a big improvement on this defense and yet they seemed worse than last season to me. They gave up 27pt to an offense that scored less than 19ppg last season. On the go-ahead TD the receiver was open by 10-15 yards and walked into the endzone. We are talking about a juggernaut offense led by Minshew/Robinson in the passing/running game. If the IND defense can't hold JAX team to less than 27ppg they wouldn't be a playoff contender with Joe Montana in his prime at QB.

Yeah, Rivers threw two INT's and that's not good. But if anyone thinks that IND was going to win this game with Brissett and his 250yards/0td/0int all they need to do is go back and watch Brisset on his one snap at QB in this game. The Colts were a mess. I think they are more talented than they played in this game and hope they can bounce back but this was absolutely a TEAM loss from start to finish. I am biased as a Rivers fan for sure. But anyone describing this loss as "Rivers being Rivers" just didn't watch the game or is much more biased against Rivers than I am for him. 

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4 hours ago, BoltBacker said:

Yeah, Rivers threw two INT's and that's not good. But if anyone thinks that IND was going to win this game with Brissett and his 250yards/0td/0int all they need to do is go back and watch Brisset on his one snap at QB in this game. The Colts were a mess. I think they are more talented than they played in this game and hope they can bounce back but this was absolutely a TEAM loss from start to finish. I am biased as a Rivers fan for sure. But anyone describing this loss as "Rivers being Rivers" just didn't watch the game or is much more biased against Rivers than I am for him. 

Your post is basically correct, but that one pick was undeniably exactly what he looked like last year.  

I'm (mostly) confident that his teammates will shape up to where he has a good fantasy year, but I would not trust him in the post-season.  I think his under pressure decision-making is cooked.

 

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4 hours ago, BoltBacker said:

After finally watching this game it's shocking(yet par for the course) that Rivers is getting all the blame for this loss.

- The IND offensive line couldn't make 3rd-and-1 and 4th-and-1 conversions(some in the redzone) at all in the running game. This is against a DL that lost its best two players from last year when they weren't all that dominant in the first place. I was pretty shocked that they couldn't get ONE yard on the ground so many times.

- The IND coaching staff left points on the field in the first quarter. I'm all for playing the analytics most of the time but if you can get the lead by simply kicking the FG I just don't understand opting not to take the lead at any point in the game. Unless you have no faith in your defense, but we'll get to that later.

- Both Cambell and Doyle had huge 15 yard penalties. Add that to multiple "illegal formation" penalties on a single drive that led to a FG doinking off the upright that probably would have gone in if the attempt would have been even 5 yards shorter.

- It's hard to understate just how big a drop TY Hilton had on the final drive in the game. I think that was actually one of two huge drops in the game. In another situation as the first half was winding down Hines has a chance to run out of bounds after getting a first down but instead cuts back to the middle of the field to gain an extra 2 yards after he had already gotten a first down. Just awful.

- I thought the addition of Buckner was going to make a big improvement on this defense and yet they seemed worse than last season to me. They gave up 27pt to an offense that scored less than 19ppg last season. On the go-ahead TD the receiver was open by 10-15 yards and walked into the endzone. We are talking about a juggernaut offense led by Minshew/Robinson in the passing/running game. If the IND defense can't hold JAX team to less than 27ppg they wouldn't be a playoff contender with Joe Montana in his prime at QB.

Yeah, Rivers threw two INT's and that's not good. But if anyone thinks that IND was going to win this game with Brissett and his 250yards/0td/0int all they need to do is go back and watch Brisset on his one snap at QB in this game. The Colts were a mess. I think they are more talented than they played in this game and hope they can bounce back but this was absolutely a TEAM loss from start to finish. I am biased as a Rivers fan for sure. But anyone describing this loss as "Rivers being Rivers" just didn't watch the game or is much more biased against Rivers than I am for him. 

:goodposting: 

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Since Paris Campbell is an emergency start for me, I sure hope Rivers doesn’t suck for one game. 

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8 hours ago, SeniorVBDStudent said:

Your post is basically correct, but that one pick was undeniably exactly what he looked like last year.  

I'm (mostly) confident that his teammates will shape up to where he has a good fantasy year, but I would not trust him in the post-season.  I think his under pressure decision-making is cooked.

That's fair. But it's also fair to point out that for most of his career in SD he was put in situations where he HAD TO make the play for the chargers to win. Last Sunday he was in a similar situation despite the fact he was playing with a much more talented cast around him. IND would have been up by AT LEAST two TD's at the time Rivers tried to thread the needle with that last pass that absolutely was a mistake.

I will quibble with your second point, however. IMO the problem with the Colts last year is most people didn't think they could win if they got down by a TD or more. I think that's precisely why they needed either a Rivers or a Winston or anyone really that can potentially come back and get a win if you fall behind. Brissett might have been able to game manage the '85 Bears to a deep playoff run but that's what it would take to drag him there.

But playoff talk is all pretty moot if James Robinson defeats three tacklers with a single hurdle. Or if Gardner Minshew is making a pregame warmup throw to a WR that has no defender within 15 yards of him at the GL on the go-ahead score. I couldn't say it any better than.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7fjDS0jKiE&ab_channel=topdoggjb

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Nothing against Rivers but I'm holding Brisset in a few dynasty leagues. Just got a horrible feeling this season doesn't end well for him.

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Philip Rivers completed 17-of-21 passes for 217 yards and one score in Indianapolis' Week 3 win over the Jets.

Even Jacoby Brissett was afforded four pass attempts on Sunday as the Colts cruised to an easy win over New York behind three interceptions, two pick-sixes, two sacks and a safety. Rivers and Indianapolis' starters were benched in the fourth quarter for the second consecutive game, ceding snaps (and production) to the team's backups while leading by three scores. Week 4 against the Bears should offer a full game's worth of stat-padding for all. Consider Rivers a fringe QB2 in a competitive matchup for that one.

Sep 28, 2020, 1:59 PM ET

 

 

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A list of the only NFL quarterbacks to throw 400 TD passes in their career....

Brees

Brady

Peyton Manning

Favre

Marino

RIVERS

Yeah, he really is "Terrible", just like so many other guys on that list. Maybe the single worst take in the history of FBG. About half a rung different than the infamous "Leinart > Rivers" by LHUCKS.

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Philip Rivers completed 16-of-29 passes for 190 yards and one touchdown in the Colts' 19-11, Week 4 win over the Bears.

Rivers came into this one completing a league-high 78.3% of his passes, but this was more of a struggle for the veteran against a strong pass defense. Still, Rivers did enough with the offense to set Rodrigo Blankenship up for four field goals. Rivers' touchdown was a red-zone hookup with Mo Alie-Cox. It was more than plenty against a Bears team that was stuck on three points before their final drive. Rivers hasn't been good for fantasy on very low volume, but the Colts are 3-1. The get a road date with the Browns in Week 5.

- Rotoworld

I usually rotate kickers, but I think I'm going to have to make Rodrigo Blankenship an every-week play.

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He is terrible. Playing like a rookie today. 

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Is there any chance they give Jacob Eason a shot this season?  Interested to see what he has to offer. 

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Hilton has grounds filing an impersonating a QB charges.

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Philip Rivers completed 21-of-33 passes for 243 yards and two interceptions in Indianapolis' Week 5 loss to Cleveland.

Trailing 27-20 in the final quarter, Rivers dropped back into his own end zone, cratered under pressure from Myles Garrett (who bullied backup LT Le'Raven Clark all afternoon) and launched the ball out of bounds for an intentional grounding penalty and safety that comfortably put the Browns up by two scores. Whether he saw a receiver in that area is a moot point; Rivers was signed in Indianapolis for his veteran presence and his boneheaded decisions in the team's two losses are that of a rookie's. His arm strength (or lack thereof) was also on display during an attempt outside the numbers that resulted in a walk-in pick-six — Rivers' first of two interceptions — for backup S Ronnie Harrison. Rivers found Marcus Johnson downfield for a 36-yard gain and, later on, Ashton Dulin for a 34-yard strike but still ultimately lost the game for Indianapolis. He'll rank as a low-end QB2 in Week 6 against the Bengals.

Oct 11, 2020, 7:19 PM ET

 

 

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On 2/19/2020 at 9:33 AM, Stinkin Ref said:

If people are going to blame River's performance on the offensive line, lack of separation by WR's, etc.there is really nothing you can say to argue with them.  Anybody that watched him lean back and chuck it saw that it looked like he was trying to throw a medicine ball downfield.  There is a reason Ekeler had 108 targets and 92 receptions and it wasn't all because of the offensive line or lack of separation by the WR's. 148 of his 390 completions (38%) went to the RB. I don't know where that compares, but I really don't care.  My eye balls tells me even HE lost confidence in his ability to complete passes downfield.  Rivers had a 66% completion percentage.  81% completion percentage to his RB's. 59% to everybody else. 

He was and is a liability throwing the ball downfield.  He has lost the zip to fit the ball in tight windows.  While his throwing motion has always been the topic of conversation and medicine ball like, it seems to have gotten worse.  He has lost the zip and that motion allows defensive backs even that much of a better read. His game was always predicated on good decisions, anticipation, and accuracy.... but even those have seen a drastic decline.  I watched a lot of his games, and even his down field completions seemed like you squinted your eyes, hunched your shoulders for a second, and hoped it reached it's intended destination.  Long way of saying....it seemed like it was up for grabs.  You don't want that in your QB. Now I realize the comeback for the Rivers backers will be that the oline sucked and he didn't have times, so yeah he just had to chuck it up, or whatever.  But if you are being honest, that was not the case all the time....many times, he made bad decisions, lacked good anticipation and accuracy, and had very little zip on the medicine ball.  I would cringe if I was a fan of a team that brings him in.  :2cents:

bump.....:lmao:.....:whistle:

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at some point (soon?) they have to admit their mistake and go back to jacoby right? 

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Colts coach Frank Reach said the team has not considered sitting Philip Rivers.

"No consideration for that," Reich strongly affirmed when asked if he's considered benching Rivers. "Philip is our quarterback." The 3-2 Colts would arguably be 5-0 were it not for Rivers' rookie mistakes in the only two games he's been asked to rear back and throw the ball 30-plus times. The 38-year-old veteran was admittedly under siege from Myles Garrett on Sunday but that doesn't explain his intentional grounding in the end zone or pick-six to backup S Ronnie Harrison. Rivers has a softer on-paper matchup this Sunday against the Bengals.

SOURCE: Jim Ayello on Twitter

Oct 12, 2020, 4:12 PM ET

 

 

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6 hours ago, Faust said:

Colts coach Frank Reach said the team has not considered sitting Philip Rivers.

"No consideration for that," Reich strongly affirmed when asked if he's considered benching Rivers. "Philip is our quarterback." The 3-2 Colts would arguably be 5-0 were it not for Rivers' rookie mistakes in the only two games he's been asked to rear back and throw the ball 30-plus times. The 38-year-old veteran was admittedly under siege from Myles Garrett on Sunday but that doesn't explain his intentional grounding in the end zone or pick-six to backup S Ronnie Harrison. Rivers has a softer on-paper matchup this Sunday against the Bengals.

SOURCE: Jim Ayello on Twitter

Oct 12, 2020, 4:12 PM ET

I'm the biggest Rivers fan in this forum and recognize my bias. But in his defense:

  • He played without his LT1, WR2, WR3, and RB1 yesterday... LT was particuarly problematic, and that is a more serious problem for Rivers than for some other QBs.
  • Cleveland might actually be good... certainly, they seem to have a good pass rush, and that clearly affected Rivers
  • As for the intentional grounding safety, he threw it out of bounds in the area where his receiver would have ended up on his corner route, but pressure accelerated his clock, and the receiver wasn't there yet.
    • It was evident after the play that Rivers was telling the refs that his receiver was running a corner route (though the ex-ref in the broadcast incorrectly said that Rivers was telling the ref that the receiver was supposed to run a corner but instead ran a post).
    • Regardless, the refs didn't care (not criticizing them, they penalize the result, not what it might/should have been).
    • Just saying, that was an unfortunate outcome, but understandable with context. IMO it doesn't reflect as badly on Rivers as the popular narrative.
    • I would put that particular issue more on the play call, with a long developing corner route on a play where the dropback was in the end zone against a pass rush that had been consistently generating pressure.
Edited by Just Win Baby

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12 hours ago, iamkoza said:

at some point (soon?) they have to admit their mistake and go back to jacoby right? 

Or start talking to Dak right away.

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11 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

I'm the biggest Rivers fan in this forum and recognize my bias. But in his defense:

  • He played without his LT1, WR2, WR3, and RB1 yesterday... LT was particuarly problematic, and that is a more serious problem for Rivers than for some other QBs.
  • Cleveland might actually be good... certainly, they seem to have a good pass rush, and that clearly affected Rivers
  • As for the intentional grounding safety, he threw it out of bounds in the area where his receiver would have ended up on his corner route, but pressure accelerated his clock, and the receiver wasn't there yet.
    • It was evident after the play that Rivers was telling the refs that his receiver was running a corner route (though the ex-ref in the broadcast incorrectly said that Rivers was telling the ref that the receiver was supposed to run a corner but instead ran a post).
    • Regardless, the refs didn't care (not criticizing them, they penalize the result, not what it might/should have been).
    • Just saying, that was an unfortunate outcome, but understandable with context. IMO it doesn't reflect as badly on Rivers as the popular narrative.
    • I would put that particular issue more on the play call, with a long developing corner route on a play where the dropback was in the end zone against a pass rush that had been consistently generating pressure.

I get it....he was a good QB for a long time and its hard to let it go....but how many more bad games/plays does he get in your opinion before they pull the trigger....as the article mentions ....his play/decisions pretty much directly lead to their two losses....and that unfortunately for him has been happening a little too often in recent years.....he is often the reason for losses.....and not wins....this team is pretty good (defense/running the ball) and has playoff potential, but they may not be good enough to have Rivers cost them some wins here and there...

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34 minutes ago, Stinkin Ref said:

I get it....he was a good QB for a long time and its hard to let it go....but how many more bad games/plays does he get in your opinion before they pull the trigger....

There is no trigger to pull. The Colts know what they have with Brissett. Brissett won’t get them any farther than Rivers even as bad as Rivers is playing. 

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10 hours ago, Stinkin Ref said:

I get it....he was a good QB for a long time and its hard to let it go....but how many more bad games/plays does he get in your opinion before they pull the trigger....as the article mentions ....his play/decisions pretty much directly lead to their two losses....and that unfortunately for him has been happening a little too often in recent years.....he is often the reason for losses.....and not wins....this team is pretty good (defense/running the ball) and has playoff potential, but they may not be good enough to have Rivers cost them some wins here and there...

The Chargers let him walk and drafted their QBOTF, who has played well for a rookie. They used some of the cap savings to sign a few highly regarded free agents (Bulaga, Joseph, Harris). They are 1-4. Certainly doesn't look like Rivers was the reason they lost a lot of games last season, since they are still losing close games on a weekly basis.

As for the Colts being "pretty good" at running the ball, they lost RB1 Mack in game 1 and are currently #8 in rushing attempts, #20 in rushing yards, #19 in rushing TDs, and #31 in ypc. I wouldn't characterize that as pretty good. It is very clearly below average.

As for "pulling the trigger," Rivers had a bad game. He has still performed better to date this season than Brissett did last season. I can't see them pulling him unless his performance continues to be as bad or worse as it was against Cleveland for an extended period.

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18 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

The Chargers let him walk and drafted their QBOTF, who has played well for a rookie. They used some of the cap savings to sign a few highly regarded free agents (Bulaga, Joseph, Harris). They are 1-4. Certainly doesn't look like Rivers was the reason they lost a lot of games last season, since they are still losing close games on a weekly basis.

As for the Colts being "pretty good" at running the ball, they lost RB1 Mack in game 1 and are currently #8 in rushing attempts, #20 in rushing yards, #19 in rushing TDs, and #31 in ypc. I wouldn't characterize that as pretty good. It is very clearly below average.

As for "pulling the trigger," Rivers had a bad game. He has still performed better to date this season than Brissett did last season. I can't see them pulling him unless his performance continues to be as bad or worse as it was against Cleveland for an extended period.

Which QB would you rather have on your team?   Rivers or Herbert?  

Rivers was washed up last year.   

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7 hours ago, DocHolliday said:

Which QB would you rather have on your team?   Rivers or Herbert?  

Rivers was washed up last year.   

I'd rather have rookie Herbert on a rookie contract over 38 year old Rivers on a veteran contract. Doesn't change anything I posted.

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11 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

I'd rather have rookie Herbert on a rookie contract over 38 year old Rivers on a veteran contract. Doesn't change anything I posted.

the pick 6 he threw against CLE should.....that had absolutely nothing to do with anybody else, no excuses.....and that is the type of stuff he has been doing for awhile now....even the staff here at FBG is confirming pretty much exactly what we have been saying for awhile now about his arm strength, decision making, and costing teams wins instead of being one of the main reasons they get them....I give you props JWB for hanging in there and fighting the fight, but his skills as a QB (especially in the two most important areas, arm strength and decision making) have fallen off a cliff......and they weren't that great to begin with (yes even tho he has put up some good numbers over the years)....at some point it can't be the oline's fault or not having this RB or these WR's...to think that benching him is out of the question is crazy, I agree Brissett isn't a huge upgrade, but not sure it could be worse.....but thats IND problem if this turns out to be a bad signing.....they had chances to go in several different directions....

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12 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

I'd rather have rookie Herbert on a rookie contract over 38 year old Rivers on a veteran contract. Doesn't change anything I posted.

Rivers is a waste of time in Indy.   The team would be better served developing a young QB than accomplishing nothing this season.   Rivers isn’t going to remain the starter for the entire season.  The Colts will eventually see what most of us already know.  

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So let me get this straight....

2020 Colts with Rivers - win 67% - 26.2ppg offense

2019 Colts with Brissett - win 47% - 22.6ppg offense

"Just like I said all along, Rivers would be a disaster in IND.... he's FINISHED!"

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36 minutes ago, BoltBacker said:

So let me get this straight....

2020 Colts with Rivers - win 67% - 26.2ppg offense

2019 Colts with Brissett - win 47% - 22.6ppg offense

"Just like I said all along, Rivers would be a disaster in IND.... he's FINISHED!"

No, you don't have that straight. Indy has scored a decent amount on defense and special teams this year, and scoring is up in general over last year- Indy is 16th in avg ppg this year and they were 16th last year. Also, their schedule has been very easy so far:

2020 Colts with Rivers - opponents win 34% - opponents allow 28.23ppg defense

2019 Colts with Brissett - opponents win 50% - opponents allow 20.60ppg defense

So, while Brissett may suck, at least he led them to exceed the average scoring against his opponents, unlike Rivers.

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2 hours ago, humpback said:

No, you don't have that straight. Indy has scored a decent amount on defense and special teams this year, and scoring is up in general over last year- Indy is 16th in avg ppg this year and they were 16th last year. Also, their schedule has been very easy so far:

2020 Colts with Rivers - opponents win 34% - opponents allow 28.23ppg defense

2019 Colts with Brissett - opponents win 50% - opponents allow 20.60ppg defense

So, while Brissett may suck, at least he led them to exceed the average scoring against his opponents, unlike Rivers.

Please be clear. Are you saying you think the Colts should play Brissett over Rivers? If not, what is your point?

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On 10/15/2020 at 12:50 PM, DocHolliday said:

Rivers is a waste of time in Indy.   The team would be better served developing a young QB than accomplishing nothing this season.   Rivers isn’t going to remain the starter for the entire season.  The Colts will eventually see what most of us already know.  

Was he a waste of time in week 6? :no: 

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9 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

Please be clear. Are you saying you think the Colts should play Brissett over Rivers? If not, what is your point?

I was clear. The numbers the Colts are putting up aren't nearly as "impressive" when you look at them in context, in fact I would argue that they are disappointing.

What part of what I wrote leads you to the conclusion that I think they Colts should play Brissett over Rivers? Was it "while Brissett may suck"?

The point is, while Rivers used to be a good QB, he no longer is. It would be easier if you truthers simply admitted that instead of contorting yourselves trying to pretend that he is.

9 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

Was he a waste of time in week 6? :no: 

You mean where they squeaked out a win at home vs. the 1-win Bengals? Quite the accomplishment. Rivers tried to give that game away too with a INT in the 4th qtr. but fortunately the Bengals missed the FG and the defense stepped up in the end to hold onto the win.

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He's terrible!

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On 10/22/2020 at 4:47 AM, humpback said:

No, you don't have that straight. Indy has scored a decent amount on defense and special teams this year, and scoring is up in general over last year- Indy is 16th in avg ppg this year and they were 16th last year. Also, their schedule has been very easy so far:

2020 Colts with Rivers - opponents win 34% - opponents allow 28.23ppg defense

2019 Colts with Brissett - opponents win 50% - opponents allow 20.60ppg defense

So, while Brissett may suck, at least he led them to exceed the average scoring against his opponents, unlike Rivers.

I think that those are all fair points.

But I'm curious, if you are making the case that Brissett was playing a much more difficult schedule than Rivers has played thus far are you accounting for the fact that last season(during the super tough schedule) the Colts rushed for 4.5 yards/attempt. This season(during the super easy schedule) the Colts are rushing for 3.6 yards/attempt. Do you think that this suggests that the OL isn't playing as well and the running backs aren't playing as well as they did last season?

I ask because just watching the games it's absolutely clear that Colts are not the same team when time after time they can't get run for a first down or TD in short yardage situations. If the OL/RB would have played at the level they are currently playing at with Brissett last season then Brissett wouldn't have just fallen below the .500 mark that he couldn't even reach last season, right?

There is a REASON people are comparing Rivers production to Brissett. You do realize that right? The reason is because IND needed to go into this season with a starting QB. They had Brissett on the roster. Rivers was a FA. If you are arguing IND should be playing Mahomes at QB instead of Rivers..... I completely agree. Well done. To the best of my knowledge that wasn't an option. There were a finite number of options they had. Among them was Andy Dalton. And Marcus Mariota. That context also matters. So if some people are saying, "Rivers is terrible, he's costing his team wins with his turnover... they should have signed Jamies Winston because he takes care of the ball so much better!"..... then it just sounds like shallow and dumb criticism. I don't think Dalton, Mariota, or Winston are as bad as most seem to right now but I'm not convinced any of them would have IND(with a much worse OL/RB situation THIS season than LAST as you've pointed out) at a 4-2 record.

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On 10/22/2020 at 6:54 PM, dickey moe said:

He's terrible!

Same think you've been saying since before he had thrown his 40th TD. And his 140th TD. And his 400th TD.

If a person plays the same lotto number day after day they will eventually get the numbers right provided they make enough attempts. They only look foolish each and every day until then. Thirteen years is a long time. I don't blame you for feeling embarrassed.

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2 hours ago, BoltBacker said:

I think that those are all fair points.

But I'm curious, if you are making the case that Brissett was playing a much more difficult schedule than Rivers has played thus far are you accounting for the fact that last season(during the super tough schedule) the Colts rushed for 4.5 yards/attempt. This season(during the super easy schedule) the Colts are rushing for 3.6 yards/attempt. Do you think that this suggests that the OL isn't playing as well and the running backs aren't playing as well as they did last season?

I ask because just watching the games it's absolutely clear that Colts are not the same team when time after time they can't get run for a first down or TD in short yardage situations. If the OL/RB would have played at the level they are currently playing at with Brissett last season then Brissett wouldn't have just fallen below the .500 mark that he couldn't even reach last season, right?

There is a REASON people are comparing Rivers production to Brissett. You do realize that right? The reason is because IND needed to go into this season with a starting QB. They had Brissett on the roster. Rivers was a FA. If you are arguing IND should be playing Mahomes at QB instead of Rivers..... I completely agree. Well done. To the best of my knowledge that wasn't an option. There were a finite number of options they had. Among them was Andy Dalton. And Marcus Mariota. That context also matters. So if some people are saying, "Rivers is terrible, he's costing his team wins with his turnover... they should have signed Jamies Winston because he takes care of the ball so much better!"..... then it just sounds like shallow and dumb criticism. I don't think Dalton, Mariota, or Winston are as bad as most seem to right now but I'm not convinced any of them would have IND(with a much worse OL/RB situation THIS season than LAST as you've pointed out) at a 4-2 record.

To be clear, I'm simply adding context to refute your argument that Rivers is performing much better than Brissett did last year. To answer your question, I think it's obvious that the O-line isn't run blocking nearly as well as last year, however they are currently ranked 5th in pass protection according to Football Outsider, which is 2 spots higher than last year. Only 1 QB has been pressured less often this year than Rivers (Brees). The running backs obviously haven't been having a ton of success, but is that more due to them, the run blocking of the O-line, or teams not respecting Rivers' arm leading to lots of stacked boxes? As far as 3rd down specifically, Rivers has been dreadful there himself with 4 INTs on 3rd down alone, 3 of those coming with 6 or fewer yards to go.

This is the Philip Rivers thread. I think the reason some are comparing him to Brissett is to cover for how bad Rivers is. There were other options (Cam Newton for example), but again, I'm only commenting on the play of Rivers since this is a thread about him- that other talk is better served in the Colts thread IMO. I only mentioned Brissett to provide context to your post comparing them.

Like I said, he used to be good. He no longer is. Really should be the end of the story IMO.

Edited by humpback

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On 10/24/2020 at 2:45 AM, humpback said:

This is the Philip Rivers thread. I think the reason some are comparing him to Brissett is to cover for how bad Rivers is. There were other options (Cam Newton for example), but again, I'm only commenting on the play of Rivers since this is a thread about him- that other talk is better served in the Colts thread IMO. I only mentioned Brissett to provide context to your post comparing them.

Well, Cam Newton was still on the Panthers when Rivers was signed by the Colts so I guess they could have invented a time travel machine otherwise I don't really know what you are talking about there. But for grins and giggles I guess it's also worth pointing out that Cam Newton has thrown for more than 170 yards once this season. I have no idea when Cam last led a team back from a 21-0 deficit but I don't think that he's likely done it recently.

I guess they could have stuck with Brissett and hoped other options became available, but that would mean bringing up the "B name" and I know we aren't supposed to talk about that in THIS thread. Maybe you are completely confused why we are discussing the Colts team the past 12 months in a thread about Rivers.... Rivers actually plays for the Colts btw... but you might want to buckle your seatbelt if that bothers you because there just might be some Colt discussion in a thread about Rivers. At least for as long as he plays for the Colts. If you can't understand why that is then it really is the end of this story as far as I am concerned. 

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12 hours ago, BoltBacker said:

Well, Cam Newton was still on the Panthers when Rivers was signed by the Colts so I guess they could have invented a time travel machine otherwise I don't really know what you are talking about there. But for grins and giggles I guess it's also worth pointing out that Cam Newton has thrown for more than 170 yards once this season. I have no idea when Cam last led a team back from a 21-0 deficit but I don't think that he's likely done it recently.

I guess they could have stuck with Brissett and hoped other options became available, but that would mean bringing up the "B name" and I know we aren't supposed to talk about that in THIS thread. Maybe you are completely confused why we are discussing the Colts team the past 12 months in a thread about Rivers.... Rivers actually plays for the Colts btw... but you might want to buckle your seatbelt if that bothers you because there just might be some Colt discussion in a thread about Rivers. At least for as long as he plays for the Colts. If you can't understand why that is then it really is the end of this story as far as I am concerned. 

:lmao:

It was publicly announced that Newton was available, so if they had any interest they could have either ponied up a 7th round pick or waited a few days until they released him, which the whole world knew was coming. Do you think teams wait until the first day of free agency to start considering their options? And yes, multiple "B" names were options, Bridgewater and Brady. Instead they went with the washed up Rivers.

As for Cam, he's averaging 56 yards per game rushing with 20 first downs and 5 TDs in 4 games, but including that doesn't fit your narrative. I'm not a big Cam fan myself, but I'm guessing the consensus is that he is a better option than Rivers at this point, particularly when you factor in their contracts and age.

Again, this is all just a giant straw man wrapped up in a red herring from you as the topic is Rivers' play. Rivers simply lost the game against the Jags, which remains their only win on the season. He also lost the game against the Browns. You seriously want to hang your hat on a comeback win vs. a 1-win Bengals team (where he still tried to give that game away with a 4th qtr. INT as well)? At best he's "won" them 1 game against a bad team and lost them 2, one against a terrible team. Not very compelling if you ask me.

Anyway, it's pretty clear that you aren't willing/able to have an intellectually honest conversation about Rivers, so enjoy arguing with yourself. :thumbup:

Edited by humpback

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6 hours ago, humpback said:

Again, this is all just a giant straw man wrapped up in a red herring from you as the topic is Rivers' play. Rivers simply lost the game against the Jags, which remains their only win on the season.

Did you even watch the game against the Jags?

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Quote

Philip Rivers completed 23-of-33 passes for 262 yards and three touchdowns in the Colts' Week 8 win over the Lions.

Rivers had his way with the Lions secondary, averaging 7.9 YPA in a turnover-free game. It's his second straight three touchdown performance. All of the TDs came on checkdowns, with two going to Nyheim Hines. Rivers has been trending up after a concerning start to the season. He gets a matchup with Ravens in Week 9.

- Rotoworld

All Hail Captain Checkdown.

Edited by The Frankman

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