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Not to nitpick but can the DEA just get a warrant on a lawyer? Seems far fetched.

No warrant needed. They were just following him around in public.
How could they get into the vault? Even the bank would have standards right?

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Great episode, tension the entire time as has been noted. The only thing I take a small issue with is I don't see how Walt survives that talk in the desert. I know it is a nitpick of the show and it doesn't bother me that much but I think in the real world it would be a mistake to announce you are "the cook" and expect to be able to just talk your way out of that confrontation, normally he'd be shot/dead after revealing that. By saying he was the one that killed Fring, that should not be enough to scare these guys.

no, they knew he was the only guy in the world that could signicantly increase their profit margins. They are not going to flush millions of dollars away over a display of machismo. Edited by Sam Quentin

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Not to nitpick but can the DEA just get a warrant on a lawyer? Seems far fetched.

No warrant needed. They were just following him around in public.
How could they get into the vault? Even the bank would have standards right?
Bank can consent without a warrant. They tell the lady that if she doesn't let them in, they'll arrest her as an accomplice. Probably why she was kind of edge when the lawyer came in.

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I know when I am loading up tens of thousands of dollars in my safe deposit boxes, I always do it with the bank vault wide open so anyone can walk by and see how much money I'm toting around. That's just me.

The door was closed when he started. They must have opened it while he was in progress.

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Walt wears his watch on his right hand bit is right handed. Odd.

I think he took it off his left hand to burn the plastic handcuff last week. Now, with the bandage there, he can't put it back on that wrist.

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I'm also going to have to disagree with Mike. Fring never considerd Walt a professional. It was only a matter of time until Gale mastered his method. Gus would not have put up with Walt and Jesse as his only cooks over the long term. Who knows, though, because Jesse did eventually earn some of his respect.

If Walt would have just cooked with Gale everything is fine. Gus was willing to defend Walt against the cartel because Gus wanted to be out from under them. Gus was a big fan if Walt until Walt chose Jesse and took out those dealers. Then Walt continuously over played his hand and it got to the point that Gus preferred Jesse to Walt. But it was Walts ego that put he and his family in jeopardy, not Gus and not killing Tuco. Walt keeps Gake as his assistant and he has a cushy multimillion dollar job in a premiere lab.
but he'd have probably had to let Gus take out Jesse and Hank, as well as accept that Gus and by extension he was OK with the murder of a child. At that point, he had enough humanity left to reject that outcome.

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Great episode. The scene with the cops arriving at the playground was some terrific acting. You could see the conflict all over Mike, trying to go after his granddaughter or just get out of there.

I didn't have a problem with Mike having Walt do his errand. He clearly didn't want Jesse to take the risk of getting caught helping him and while he knew he and Walt weren't friends he had no reason to believe Walt was going to off him. If he hadn't wounded Walt's pride he probably wouldn't have.

My only issue was the desert scene. Just wasn't believable to me. It seemed like Declan stood to make a bit more money with Walt's deal but I have a hard time believing it was enough that a guy who was the boss and had set up his whole operation would be willing to trade that in for a minority share in someone else's operation (especially when he could likely make up a big part of that difference by just offing Walt right there and taking his biggest competition off the market). And it definitely didn't seem like a big enough raise for him to just stand there and allow himself to be verbally castrated in front of his men without retribution.

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I know when I am loading up tens of thousands of dollars in my safe deposit boxes, I always do it with the bank vault wide open so anyone can walk by and see how much money I'm toting around. That's just me.

The door was closed when he started. They must have opened it while he was in progress.
I don't see how in the world that would be legal without a warrant of some manner.

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I know when I am loading up tens of thousands of dollars in my safe deposit boxes, I always do it with the bank vault wide open so anyone can walk by and see how much money I'm toting around. That's just me.

The door was closed when he started. They must have opened it while he was in progress.
I don't see how in the world that would be legal without a warrant of some manner.
:confused: The bank let the DEA do it.

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I know when I am loading up tens of thousands of dollars in my safe deposit boxes, I always do it with the bank vault wide open so anyone can walk by and see how much money I'm toting around. That's just me.

The door was closed when he started. They must have opened it while he was in progress.
I don't see how in the world that would be legal without a warrant of some manner.
What would be the implications if the chubbster just happened to open it for them after they give her a box of donuts?

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I know when I am loading up tens of thousands of dollars in my safe deposit boxes, I always do it with the bank vault wide open so anyone can walk by and see how much money I'm toting around. That's just me.

The door was closed when he started. They must have opened it while he was in progress.
I don't see how in the world that would be legal without a warrant of some manner.
What would be the implications if the chubbster just happened to open it for them after they give her a box of donuts?
You think for all the precautions Mike too, they would have done this a different way. 9 boxes at one bank? You think he would have spread those out over multiple locations. :shrug:

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Missed the beginning, but how didn't Mike know they were tailing his lawyer if he was monitoring Hank with the bug and computer gadget?Also why was it removed?

I'm sure Mike wasn't listening 24 x 7. He heard them say they were coming to his house with a search warrant. It wasn't until the very last minute that they started trailing the lawyer.

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Saw it coming a few minutes into the episode. Good tension.I had the same thought re: Fring & Walt, that there was no way Walt could just be the quiet cook for very long because Fring would have had him killed sooner or later.

Remember, Tuco was killed before Gus was really in the picture and well before Walt was his cook. Even though Walt didn't actually kill Tuco (Jesse shot him and then obviously Hank killed him), this thread happened whether or not Walt was the quiet cook. In fact, with the cousins coming it was creating war for them. The idea that Mike had about just keeping his head down and cooking couldn't happen and Mike knows that... the guy who was protecting Walt from the cousins etc.

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Missed the beginning, but how didn't Mike know they were tailing his lawyer if he was monitoring Hank with the bug and computer gadget?Also why was it removed?

I'm sure Mike wasn't listening 24 x 7. He heard them say they were coming to his house with a search warrant. It wasn't until the very last minute that they started trailing the lawyer.
I'm sure he was listening to all of it. Not live necessarily, but eventually.Not every discussion/tactic/decision @ the local DEA is in Hank's office or documented somehow on his computer.

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Missed the beginning, but how didn't Mike know they were tailing his lawyer if he was monitoring Hank with the bug and computer gadget?Also why was it removed?

He dumped his laptop down a well, and he was "out" at that point.I think Walt and friends knew that it would not be possible to keep the bug there forever without detection. In fact, Mike specifically told to get the bug.

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Not every discussion/tactic/decision @ the local DEA is in Hank's office or documented somehow on his computer.

Right, they specifically showed that Hank was in the conference room, not his office, when he told them to trail the lawyer.

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I like how Mike had a bag of guns that he emptied individually into the well, rather than just throwing the whole thing down there. No need to waste a good bag, you know.

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While no warrant was needed to follow the lawyer and watch him in the room, since there wasnt anything to siggest he was engaged in criminal activity (going into s safe deposit box room with money isnt illegal) one would have been needed to search him or look into the boxes. As a defense atty he would have known this and probably could have kept his mouth shut. Additionally, much of what he would then say would be covered by atty-client privilege (although not as clearly since he was engaged in crime with them and, for mike, hue wasn't his lawyer) but a half-smart atty could have claimed it there and at least made the dea get a court order.

My take is that the lawyer just got scared and, presumably, demanded immunity and started spilling his guts. Frankly, this pissed me off more than if the show would have just ignored legal particulars bc it furthered the stereotype that defense attys are greedy, spineless chicken####s bc the lawyer could have gotten out of that easily Thanks, gilligan.

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While no warrant was needed to follow the lawyer and watch him in the room, since there wasnt anything to siggest he was engaged in criminal activity (going into s safe deposit box room with money isnt illegal) one would have been needed to search him or look into the boxes. As a defense atty he would have known this and probably could have kept his mouth shut. Additionally, much of what he would then say would be covered by atty-client privilege (although not as clearly since he was engaged in crime with them and, for mike, hue wasn't his lawyer) but a half-smart atty could have claimed it there and at least made the dea get a court order. My take is that the lawyer just got scared and, presumably, demanded immunity and started spilling his guts. Frankly, this pissed me off more than if the show would have just ignored legal particulars bc it furthered the stereotype that defense attys are greedy, spineless chicken####s bc the lawyer could have gotten out of that easily Thanks, gilligan.

Anytime, little buddy.

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My take is that the lawyer just got scared and, presumably, demanded immunity and started spilling his guts. Frankly, this pissed me off more than if the show would have just ignored legal particulars bc it furthered the stereotype that defense attys are greedy, spineless chicken####s bc the lawyer could have gotten out of that easily Thanks, gilligan.

you have issues.

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Missed the beginning, but how didn't Mike know they were tailing his lawyer if he was monitoring Hank with the bug and computer gadget?Also why was it removed?

He dumped his laptop down a well, and he was "out" at that point.I think Walt and friends knew that it would not be possible to keep the bug there forever without detection. In fact, Mike specifically told to get the bug.
What if they had just detected the bug, left it in place for misinformation, and now Walt has implicated himself because he's the only one who could have removed it?

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Missed the beginning, but how didn't Mike know they were tailing his lawyer if he was monitoring Hank with the bug and computer gadget?Also why was it removed?

He dumped his laptop down a well, and he was "out" at that point.I think Walt and friends knew that it would not be possible to keep the bug there forever without detection. In fact, Mike specifically told to get the bug.
What if they had just detected the bug, left it in place for misinformation, and now Walt has implicated himself because he's the only one who could have removed it?
That was the risk.

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Missed the beginning, but how didn't Mike know they were tailing his lawyer if he was monitoring Hank with the bug and computer gadget?Also why was it removed?

He dumped his laptop down a well, and he was "out" at that point.I think Walt and friends knew that it would not be possible to keep the bug there forever without detection. In fact, Mike specifically told to get the bug.
What if they had just detected the bug, left it in place for misinformation, and now Walt has implicated himself because he's the only one who could have removed it?
This was my thought immediately after the scene with Walt in Hank's office. Hank seemed skeptical of Walt, then Gomez conveniently brings up the lawyer flipping right in earshot of Walt. It all just seemed to be too much of a coincidence.

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DEA knows Jessie was involved with blue meth. If the DEA is tailing everyone they can, it would make sense for Mike to avoid contact with Jessie. The only one off the DEA radar at the moment was Walt. Huell didn't seem available.

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My take is that the lawyer just got scared and, presumably, demanded immunity and started spilling his guts. Frankly, this pissed me off more than if the show would have just ignored legal particulars bc it furthered the stereotype that defense attys are greedy, spineless chicken####s bc the lawyer could have gotten out of that easily Thanks, gilligan.

you have issues.
He's just a genuine idiot, who thinks he's being a clever fisherman.

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DEA knows Jessie was involved with blue meth. If the DEA is tailing everyone they can, it would make sense for Mike to avoid contact with Jessie. The only one off the DEA radar at the moment was Walt. Huell didn't seem available.

As far as Hank know, Jesse is at the end of the chain- street dealer. Hanks working the top of the chain.

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Missed the beginning, but how didn't Mike know they were tailing his lawyer if he was monitoring Hank with the bug and computer gadget?Also why was it removed?

He dumped his laptop down a well, and he was "out" at that point.I think Walt and friends knew that it would not be possible to keep the bug there forever without detection. In fact, Mike specifically told to get the bug.
What if they had just detected the bug, left it in place for misinformation, and now Walt has implicated himself because he's the only one who could have removed it?
Plus they purposely went to a camera shot from the top corner of Hank's office as to imply there was a security camera there.

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Missed the beginning, but how didn't Mike know they were tailing his lawyer if he was monitoring Hank with the bug and computer gadget?

He dumped the laptop when he heard about the search warrant, before Hank had to stop tailing Mike, before he even thought to see that the lawyer repped all 9 guys. Plus, the decision to start tailing Mike's lawyer happened in the conference room, where there was no bug.

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DEA knows Jessie was involved with blue meth. If the DEA is tailing everyone they can, it would make sense for Mike to avoid contact with Jessie. The only one off the DEA radar at the moment was Walt. Huell didn't seem available.

As far as Hank know, Jesse is at the end of the chain- street dealer. Hanks working the top of the chain.
Untrue. A street dealer wouldn't have been holed up in the main manufacturing facility.

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DEA knows Jessie was involved with blue meth. If the DEA is tailing everyone they can, it would make sense for Mike to avoid contact with Jessie. The only one off the DEA radar at the moment was Walt. Huell didn't seem available.

As far as Hank know, Jesse is at the end of the chain- street dealer. Hanks working the top of the chain.
Untrue. A street dealer wouldn't have been holed up in the main manufacturing facility.
when the blue sky was a small mom and pop operation, why not?

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This thread has become nothing but semantics....you :nerd: constantly complain about non issues like a search warrant or feds going to a bank vault. Focus on the big picture here and discuss the story, not what would happen in real life. This isn't f'in real life. It's a tv show. Endless posts about 96% purity, whether or not to call some supporting actor Landry, or what a spoiler is are pointless.

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Great episode, tension the entire time as has been noted. The only thing I take a small issue with is I don't see how Walt survives that talk in the desert. I know it is a nitpick of the show and it doesn't bother me that much but I think in the real world it would be a mistake to announce you are "the cook" and expect to be able to just talk your way out of that confrontation, normally he'd be shot/dead after revealing that. By saying he was the one that killed Fring, that should not be enough to scare these guys.

no, they knew he was the only guy in the world that could signicantly increase their profit margins. They are not going to flush millions of dollars away over a display of machismo.
1000 gallons @70% yield = 70% total product x 100% take = profits on 70% product vs. 1000 gallons @99% yield = 99% total product x 35% take = profits on 34.65% product (so just from those 1000 gallons they make half as much money):shrug:I'll guess I'll just have to assume they agreed to the deal so they could try to learn his recipe (to enjoy the higher efficiency all to themselves) before killing Walt.

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I know when I am loading up tens of thousands of dollars in my safe deposit boxes, I always do it with the bank vault wide open so anyone can walk by and see how much money I'm toting around. That's just me.

Killing Mike was also a pretty convenient short cut, but I'm pretty good with the way it went down.

And Todd taking notes at the cook and Walt doesn't think that's a bad idea?????? come on.

good episode though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGo5bxWy21g

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Hank's boss is owned by the cartel.

If that was the case, they'd have Walt by now.
The cartel or the cops? Could it be an elaborate scheme to drive Walt to the cartel?

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Walt wears his watch on his right hand bit is right handed. Odd.

I do this too.

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I rarely disagree with Sepinwall but the offing of Mike didn't seem like a contrived shortcut at all to me. I liked it a lot.

Best episode of the seasons so far.

Mike being killed isn't what he took issue with. It was that he agreed to let Walt run the errand.

And he's taking heat on his board for that stance.

Laura

I look at it this way; Mike let Walt go retrieve the bag because he didn't give an eff about Walt and he actually cared for Jesse. So if something went wrong at the airport, Mike was more comfortable letting Walt hang out to dry than Jesse.

Chris

This is what I thought, too. Mike has the relationship that Walt used to have with Jesse.

JT

I agree 100%. Mike already knew he was on a slippery slope, so protect Jesse and expose Walt if anything goes wrong. The tough part is explaining Saul not doing it, but that may have been Saul's reluctance to get involved.

Carter That is exactly how I saw it – if something was going to happen to someone helping Mike, it was going to be Walt.

Now, I have my doubts about Mike trusting that lawyer...

sepinwall

No, I understand Mike's concern for Jesse. But in this circumstance, HIS LIFE is on the line, and he knows Walt to be a completely untrustworthy rat bastard. If he doesn't want to have Jesse do it, surely ONE of his "guys" is still able-bodied and free in the ABQ area, no?

Both Saul and Jesse are likely being monitored by the DEA. Walt was the only one completely free of legal attention and therefore least likely by far to have the fuzz follow the go bag to Mike.

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1000 gallons @70% yield = 70% total product x 100% take = profits on 70% product vs. 1000 gallons @99% yield = 99% total product x 35% take = profits on 34.65% product (so just from those 1000 gallons they make half as much money)

I don't understand why greater purity = greater yield. It should be the opposite. The less pure it is, the more filler there is. It's an inferior product, but they should end up with more of it.That's not to say they can't make more money selling the pure stuff. They can definitely charge a higher price for it.In any case, your comparison above isn't apples-to-apples. Without Heisenberg, they have to pay their own cooks and acquire their own raw materials. With Heisenberg, they're getting a 35% cut on the yield from 1,000 gallons of methylamine that they don't have to acquire elsewhere. (They do have to pay Mike $5 million for his 333 gallons, but they're getting a cut of the other 667 gallons, apparently worth $10 million as methylamine but worth hundreds of millions when converted to Heisenberg's meth, without having to pay for it.)

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Wasn't Walt's real leverage that he was the only one that knew where the methylamine was? If anyone had killed him or refused to go along with his plan, they would have ended up with nothing.

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Great episode, tension the entire time as has been noted. The only thing I take a small issue with is I don't see how Walt survives that talk in the desert. I know it is a nitpick of the show and it doesn't bother me that much but I think in the real world it would be a mistake to announce you are "the cook" and expect to be able to just talk your way out of that confrontation, normally he'd be shot/dead after revealing that. By saying he was the one that killed Fring, that should not be enough to scare these guys.

no, they knew he was the only guy in the world that could signicantly increase their profit margins. They are not going to flush millions of dollars away over a display of machismo.
1000 gallons @70% yield = 70% total product x 100% take = profits on 70% product

vs.

1000 gallons @99% yield = 99% total product x 35% take = profits on 34.65% product (so just from those 1000 gallons they make half as much money)

:shrug:

I'll guess I'll just have to assume they agreed to the deal so they could try to learn his recipe (to enjoy the higher efficiency all to themselves) before killing Walt.

My link

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Looks like the Return of the Fly in 5.8.

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Wasn't Walt's real leverage that he was the only one that knew where the methylamine was? If anyone had killed him or refused to go along with his plan, they would have ended up with nothing.

The guys in the desert had their own source of methylamine. They wanted the 1,000 gallons for $15 million, but they were willing to walk away from the deal if it didn't include Heisenberg's covenant not to compete. That was a big part of what they were originally paying for, and they would have gotten it for free by killing Heisenberg.

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Wasn't Walt's real leverage that he was the only one that knew where the methylamine was? If anyone had killed him or refused to go along with his plan, they would have ended up with nothing.

As stated by DeClan, he didn't really care, he even said what's to stop me from wasting you right here? And that is when Walt sold him on Classic Coke and made him say his name like a monkey.It's spilled milk, no use really discussing this tangent any further.

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Wasn't Walt's real leverage that he was the only one that knew where the methylamine was? If anyone had killed him or refused to go along with his plan, they would have ended up with nothing.

The guys in the desert had their own source of methylamine. They wanted the 1,000 gallons for $15 million, but they were willing to walk away from the deal if it didn't include Heisenberg's covenant not to compete. That was a big part of what they were originally paying for, and they would have gotten it for free by killing Heisenberg.
I think they were using a different agent other than methylamine because they had to dye theirs blue.

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Wasn't Walt's real leverage that he was the only one that knew where the methylamine was? If anyone had killed him or refused to go along with his plan, they would have ended up with nothing.

The guys in the desert had their own source of methylamine. They wanted the 1,000 gallons for $15 million, but they were willing to walk away from the deal if it didn't include Heisenberg's covenant not to compete. That was a big part of what they were originally paying for, and they would have gotten it for free by killing Heisenberg.
I think they were using a different agent other than methylamine because they had to dye theirs blue.
Does using methylamine always make meth blue? (I don't think that's true in real life, but maybe it is on the show.) In any case, they had their own source of whatever raw materials they'd been using.

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Wasn't Walt's real leverage that he was the only one that knew where the methylamine was? If anyone had killed him or refused to go along with his plan, they would have ended up with nothing.

The guys in the desert had their own source of methylamine. They wanted the 1,000 gallons for $15 million, but they were willing to walk away from the deal if it didn't include Heisenberg's covenant not to compete. That was a big part of what they were originally paying for, and they would have gotten it for free by killing Heisenberg.
I think they were using a different agent other than methylamine because they had to dye theirs blue.
Does using methylamine always make meth blue? (I don't think that's true in real life, but maybe it is on the show.) In any case, they had their own source of whatever raw materials they'd been using.
Here's what the show wiki has to say about it. Seems like the blue color is mostly just a device by the show.

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