Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
Training camp notes blog (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Jene Bramel
- Start date
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
Hard to trust anything on the Packer side with six potential starters sitting in that game. I agree that Raji and Jenkins are the likely nickel linemen. No idea how Capers might approach the rest of the nickel package. I didn't hear much about a four man nickel line vs a 3-3-5 vs a two down lineman, four linebacker alignment from practice. Might be stuck waiting until the third preseason game to glean much from this group.Keep the notes coming everybody.
Drop
Footballguy
Here are some things that I've observed in some preseason games:
Kevin Vickerson DL Titans - has a quick punch at the snap that he uses to get under pads, extends arms and drives offensive linemen backwards after securing leverage, decent overall motor in pursuit
Demetrius Bell OL Bills - seems hesitant and lost in space
Stanley Daniels OL Jets - quick step on pulling plays and will launch into defenders, although he didn't seem overpowering with his momentum he was basically effective pulling
Alex Barron LT Rams - overextends, sloppy long arms. i don't know that his technique really instills confidence in the QB as his form breakdowns he'll probably have to grab and hold guys a little too much
Chilo Rachal OG 49ers - powerful run blocker that will move people, decent pass protection, solid overall
Ahmad Brooks LB 49ers - solid quickness on running plays adds some pop to his tackles, inconclusive pass coverage skill
Kamerion Wimbley OLB Browns - struggles to shed blocks which is a huge problem, only lined up as LE vs GB. he really can't get off blocks and isn't arm tackling anyone that runs by him while engaged. as a rookie he showed some pass rush agility, he nows seems to be too stiff and plays too high which exposes him and magnifies his weaknesses, he does have decent speed though
T.J. Lang OL Packers - locks onto defenders and steers them to open holes, has good mobility and will get to the second level properly. he played OG vs CLE, but could probably play OT as well because of his footwork
David Veikune LB Browns - he seemed to be an instinctive player who can do some things, i have to see more of him stacking and shedding, but it didn't appear to be a major issue from the few plays i saw. he had an INT and what i took from it mostly was that it was tipped ball that he reacted too pretty well. usually when a player is leaning one way and something unexpected happens i like to see how quickly they can see it and adjust
John St. Clair RT Browns - slow footed and sloppy, looks very average on every play
Desmond Bishop LB Packers - good speed and power, solid instincts on delayed stunt middle blitz, will blow up a RB trying to block
Coye Francies CB Browns - reacts well, will drive on the ball and hit, seems to play with fluidity
David Thornton LB Titans - sheds and tackles fundamentally sound
Stylez G. White DE Bucs - good quick hands, awareness is solid and can lead him to some explosive tackles when he can get an angle, closing speed is decent
Troy Kropog OT Titans - solid ability to kickstep and mirror pass rushers, will get his hands on the defender with a solid initial pop. in the first game he seemed to breakdown somewhat after that initial pop and had some trouble rebalancing himself quickly, but in the second game i saw he was doing a much better job rebalancing and was very effective
Jeremy Zuttah OG Bucs - seems to understand pass protection exchanges very well, he's always looking to help if he has nobody in front of him and he can come off the help if there is a delayed blitz. i think that he sees the plays well and understands the x and o game, however i don't think he was a very punishing blocker at the point of attack. i need to see more of him and how he reacts when he gets exposed, i am not sure if it's quickness or his power that is the problem, but together i don't think they equate to the type of physical blocker that he could be
Jermaine Phillips LB Bucs - has decent linebacker instincts and can get through some trash. the question is can he drop ballcarriers in their tracks often enough, he has the awareness and tenacity to make plays, durability concerns are natural considering his position change. i didn't get a great look at how he sheds tackles, ideally they don't want schemes coming down to him having to do that, but he's going to have to use his abilities and beat blockers with quickness and judging by how he pursues the play through trash i think he can avoid getting engaged with some regularity. he just can't be getting pancaked by offensive linemen who are quick to the second level.
Ryan Mouton CB Titans - returned kicks and i think punts for the majority, i could be wrong about that, but it seemed like his job. he played a decent amount of snaps with the 1s and even played much later in the games. i need to see much more of him, but he seems to be comfortable with the speed of the game. he drove on a josh freeman throw and picked it to the house, sort of a fundamental play where he just reacted and didn't waste any movement
Gerald McRath LB Titans - i need to see much more of him, but he seemed to be in on a lot of plays on special teams and was just active overall with good speed and athleticism, decent instincts, wraps and tackles soundly
Cary Williams CB Titans - nice frame, but the speed of the game seems to give him problems. the times when he is in decent position he doesn't react well enough to make a perfect play and other times he's so out of position that he needs lots of help. he seemed to be targeted often as a weak link and for good reason. he's a developmental player, but i am not seeing any instinctive play from him, he seems raw obviously, but i don't see what the coaching staff sees in him in actual games.
Beau Bell LB Browns - doesn't win collisions vs blockers very often, slow to read and get downhill, he's willing to hit blockers, but he's not blowing guys up and he's not really attempting to slip their blocks in any way. i don't know if he got by in college playing like this, but it's not going to work in the nfl
is it ok that i posted o line notes in this forum? is it ok if i post a few of my offensive player notes too?
Kevin Vickerson DL Titans - has a quick punch at the snap that he uses to get under pads, extends arms and drives offensive linemen backwards after securing leverage, decent overall motor in pursuit
Demetrius Bell OL Bills - seems hesitant and lost in space
Stanley Daniels OL Jets - quick step on pulling plays and will launch into defenders, although he didn't seem overpowering with his momentum he was basically effective pulling
Alex Barron LT Rams - overextends, sloppy long arms. i don't know that his technique really instills confidence in the QB as his form breakdowns he'll probably have to grab and hold guys a little too much
Chilo Rachal OG 49ers - powerful run blocker that will move people, decent pass protection, solid overall
Ahmad Brooks LB 49ers - solid quickness on running plays adds some pop to his tackles, inconclusive pass coverage skill
Kamerion Wimbley OLB Browns - struggles to shed blocks which is a huge problem, only lined up as LE vs GB. he really can't get off blocks and isn't arm tackling anyone that runs by him while engaged. as a rookie he showed some pass rush agility, he nows seems to be too stiff and plays too high which exposes him and magnifies his weaknesses, he does have decent speed though
T.J. Lang OL Packers - locks onto defenders and steers them to open holes, has good mobility and will get to the second level properly. he played OG vs CLE, but could probably play OT as well because of his footwork
David Veikune LB Browns - he seemed to be an instinctive player who can do some things, i have to see more of him stacking and shedding, but it didn't appear to be a major issue from the few plays i saw. he had an INT and what i took from it mostly was that it was tipped ball that he reacted too pretty well. usually when a player is leaning one way and something unexpected happens i like to see how quickly they can see it and adjust
John St. Clair RT Browns - slow footed and sloppy, looks very average on every play
Desmond Bishop LB Packers - good speed and power, solid instincts on delayed stunt middle blitz, will blow up a RB trying to block
Coye Francies CB Browns - reacts well, will drive on the ball and hit, seems to play with fluidity
David Thornton LB Titans - sheds and tackles fundamentally sound
Stylez G. White DE Bucs - good quick hands, awareness is solid and can lead him to some explosive tackles when he can get an angle, closing speed is decent
Troy Kropog OT Titans - solid ability to kickstep and mirror pass rushers, will get his hands on the defender with a solid initial pop. in the first game he seemed to breakdown somewhat after that initial pop and had some trouble rebalancing himself quickly, but in the second game i saw he was doing a much better job rebalancing and was very effective
Jeremy Zuttah OG Bucs - seems to understand pass protection exchanges very well, he's always looking to help if he has nobody in front of him and he can come off the help if there is a delayed blitz. i think that he sees the plays well and understands the x and o game, however i don't think he was a very punishing blocker at the point of attack. i need to see more of him and how he reacts when he gets exposed, i am not sure if it's quickness or his power that is the problem, but together i don't think they equate to the type of physical blocker that he could be
Jermaine Phillips LB Bucs - has decent linebacker instincts and can get through some trash. the question is can he drop ballcarriers in their tracks often enough, he has the awareness and tenacity to make plays, durability concerns are natural considering his position change. i didn't get a great look at how he sheds tackles, ideally they don't want schemes coming down to him having to do that, but he's going to have to use his abilities and beat blockers with quickness and judging by how he pursues the play through trash i think he can avoid getting engaged with some regularity. he just can't be getting pancaked by offensive linemen who are quick to the second level.
Ryan Mouton CB Titans - returned kicks and i think punts for the majority, i could be wrong about that, but it seemed like his job. he played a decent amount of snaps with the 1s and even played much later in the games. i need to see much more of him, but he seems to be comfortable with the speed of the game. he drove on a josh freeman throw and picked it to the house, sort of a fundamental play where he just reacted and didn't waste any movement
Gerald McRath LB Titans - i need to see much more of him, but he seemed to be in on a lot of plays on special teams and was just active overall with good speed and athleticism, decent instincts, wraps and tackles soundly
Cary Williams CB Titans - nice frame, but the speed of the game seems to give him problems. the times when he is in decent position he doesn't react well enough to make a perfect play and other times he's so out of position that he needs lots of help. he seemed to be targeted often as a weak link and for good reason. he's a developmental player, but i am not seeing any instinctive play from him, he seems raw obviously, but i don't see what the coaching staff sees in him in actual games.
Beau Bell LB Browns - doesn't win collisions vs blockers very often, slow to read and get downhill, he's willing to hit blockers, but he's not blowing guys up and he's not really attempting to slip their blocks in any way. i don't know if he got by in college playing like this, but it's not going to work in the nfl
is it ok that i posted o line notes in this forum? is it ok if i post a few of my offensive player notes too?
Last edited by a moderator:
corpcow
Footballguy
Keep an eye on Bryan Kehl.
Boley has been a popular offseason sleeper, but obviously he is out with injury (still on PUP) and also has a 1 game suspension. It is Kehl, not Wilkinson, who is running as the starter with Boley out. He looked pretty good in the game and was brought on blitzes a few times. On a local Giants training camp show, Coughlin went out of his way to praise him in relation to a question on second year players - said something to the effect that "he's had the talent, but the light really went on for him this year".
If he runs as the starter and plays well, I don't think it's inconceivable that he keeps Boley out of the lineup...
Boley has been a popular offseason sleeper, but obviously he is out with injury (still on PUP) and also has a 1 game suspension. It is Kehl, not Wilkinson, who is running as the starter with Boley out. He looked pretty good in the game and was brought on blitzes a few times. On a local Giants training camp show, Coughlin went out of his way to praise him in relation to a question on second year players - said something to the effect that "he's had the talent, but the light really went on for him this year".
If he runs as the starter and plays well, I don't think it's inconceivable that he keeps Boley out of the lineup...
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
Jermaine Phillips practiced at safety today. The beat writers had essentially blown it off as his getting familiar with the new scheme at safety as a contingency against injury. Now Tanard Jackson has been suspended for the first four games. Have to watch for coaches comments and further practices before knowing for sure, but things look to be getting interesting again just when Phillips looked locked in at WLB.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
Greg Bedard (Milwaukee Journal Sentinel) tweeting that Brandon Chillar was replacing AJ Hawk in the nickel packages in practice tonight.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
I had originally dismissed the CHI/BUF game after a DVR malfunction as not worthy of a second look. Another look through the gamebooks and a PM discussion about the Bear safety position changed my mind.
It's certainly worth noting that Al Afalava came up to play with the first team last week after Danieal Manning's hamstring issue, but he's been installed at SS and bumped Kevin Payne to FS. The Bears shuffled deck chairs at FS throughout OTAs and camp, going through Craig Steltz, Josh Bullocks, Corey Graham and Manning. The team wants to start Tillman and Bowman at CB apparently, which would leave little room for Manning at nickel with Vasher and Graham in the picture, but this is still worth noting and watching very closely when Manning is deemed healthy.
It's certainly worth noting that Al Afalava came up to play with the first team last week after Danieal Manning's hamstring issue, but he's been installed at SS and bumped Kevin Payne to FS. The Bears shuffled deck chairs at FS throughout OTAs and camp, going through Craig Steltz, Josh Bullocks, Corey Graham and Manning. The team wants to start Tillman and Bowman at CB apparently, which would leave little room for Manning at nickel with Vasher and Graham in the picture, but this is still worth noting and watching very closely when Manning is deemed healthy.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
We pimped Bowman on the podcast a little late last year as a deep sleeper type. Both players will definitely have value if they start at those positions.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
More DVR observations:
**The Jets started in a 3-4, but morphed into a 4-3 at times. Looks like more 3-4 than 4-3 for Ryan with this group.
**It's only the preseason and the ones took only a few snaps, but I think the Jet ILB value will be a wash. There seemed to be little consistency as to who played SILB and WILB in the 3-4. Harris was the MLB in the 4-3, with Scott playing WLB. I thought Harris was a little more sudden in run support. Both Scott and Harris played in the nickel. Both players were blitzing frequently in the nickel. If all that holds, I think Harris might be underrated right now.
**Vernon Gholston played end in the 3-3-5 nickel, but did standup on a couple of plays. He did not play in the base defense (Pace did).
**Kerry Rhodes got some blitz calls but was mostly in deep coverage.
**Chris Draft got a couple of early nickel snaps, but it was all Laurinaitis in the nickel after that.
**The Jags look to be playing the LOLB/ROLB game in the 4-3, with Daryl Smith playing LOLB. And they spent the entire second series in the 3-4, with Harvey at ROLB exclusively and Durant moving with the formation at WILB.
**Yeremiah Bell was in the box a reasonable amount of time at SS. Gibril Wilson was hardly ever in the picture.
**Akin Ayodele stayed in some nickel packages in favor of a DE. The Dolphin beat writers also suggested that Yeremiah Bell sat out a couple of nickel snaps, but I had trouble confirming that. George Wilson flashed on the screen on one nickel snap, so it might be legit. Probably not worth worrying over for now.
**The Jets started in a 3-4, but morphed into a 4-3 at times. Looks like more 3-4 than 4-3 for Ryan with this group.
**It's only the preseason and the ones took only a few snaps, but I think the Jet ILB value will be a wash. There seemed to be little consistency as to who played SILB and WILB in the 3-4. Harris was the MLB in the 4-3, with Scott playing WLB. I thought Harris was a little more sudden in run support. Both Scott and Harris played in the nickel. Both players were blitzing frequently in the nickel. If all that holds, I think Harris might be underrated right now.
**Vernon Gholston played end in the 3-3-5 nickel, but did standup on a couple of plays. He did not play in the base defense (Pace did).
**Kerry Rhodes got some blitz calls but was mostly in deep coverage.
**Chris Draft got a couple of early nickel snaps, but it was all Laurinaitis in the nickel after that.
**The Jags look to be playing the LOLB/ROLB game in the 4-3, with Daryl Smith playing LOLB. And they spent the entire second series in the 3-4, with Harvey at ROLB exclusively and Durant moving with the formation at WILB.
**Yeremiah Bell was in the box a reasonable amount of time at SS. Gibril Wilson was hardly ever in the picture.
**Akin Ayodele stayed in some nickel packages in favor of a DE. The Dolphin beat writers also suggested that Yeremiah Bell sat out a couple of nickel snaps, but I had trouble confirming that. George Wilson flashed on the screen on one nickel snap, so it might be legit. Probably not worth worrying over for now.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
Afalava could potentially have better value, but I wouldn't trust either player to be clearly outside the monster replacement level DB tier yet.
Drop
Footballguy
Jarron Gilbert DL Bears - quick at the snap, continuously powerful while engaged and will usually end up throwing a guy off of him, can keep his feet well even while engaged and fighting which allows him to clog things up pretty well inside. just going on what i saw from the CHI @ BUF preseason game, i haven't seen a variety of moves to compliment his physical attributes. he seems to have the quickness and power to control the line of scrimmage provided that he develops his moves and focuses on hand fighting savvy. i'm curious as to what kind of work ethic he has really, because if it's elite he's a breakout star waiting to happen. just my opinion...
for anyone else who has seen the Bears play this preseason, i forgot to look but was Kellen Davis ever in on defense? i saw him on special teams, but i'm wondering if they use him at DE or just TE.
for anyone else who has seen the Bears play this preseason, i forgot to look but was Kellen Davis ever in on defense? i saw him on special teams, but i'm wondering if they use him at DE or just TE.
bcr8f
Footballguy
Miami Dolphins: Dolphins cut Eric Green
> Posted by Mike Berardino on August 19, 2009 05:01 PM
Rookie promise has trumped veteran knowledge.
That was the message in the Miami Dolphins’ decision on Wednesday to terminate the contract of cornerback Eric Green.
Green, the former Arizona Cardinal and Clewiston High product, had worked with the first unit throughout offseason practices, but rookie second-rounder Sean Smith moved into the top spot one week into training camp.
While rookie first-rounder Vontae Davis also struggled in Monday’s 12-9 preseason victory over Jacksonville, Green had an even tougher night. At one point in the second quarter, Green, working opposite of Davis, allowed three straight completions for a total of 42 yards against the Jaguars’ second-team offense.
Even Hall of Fame quarterback Bob Griese, providing color commentary on the local TV broadcast, noted Green’s struggles.
“There’s a lot of passes being thrown Eric Green’s way,” Griese said on the air.
xxx
I'm a little surprised at the timing of the move, as there are no guarantees Sean Smith and Vontae Davis will continue to improve at their current rate. But if Green had no shot in the Trifecta's eyes to make this team, then it's probably best to get him out of the way now.
The larger question is what do you make of this regime's spotty record in free agency the past two years? Green, Ernest Wilford, Reggie Torbor, Charlie Anderson, etc?
They definitely have done a better job through the draft, trades and the waiver wire so far than with the big-ticket additions.
> Posted by Mike Berardino on August 19, 2009 05:01 PM
Rookie promise has trumped veteran knowledge.
That was the message in the Miami Dolphins’ decision on Wednesday to terminate the contract of cornerback Eric Green.
Green, the former Arizona Cardinal and Clewiston High product, had worked with the first unit throughout offseason practices, but rookie second-rounder Sean Smith moved into the top spot one week into training camp.
While rookie first-rounder Vontae Davis also struggled in Monday’s 12-9 preseason victory over Jacksonville, Green had an even tougher night. At one point in the second quarter, Green, working opposite of Davis, allowed three straight completions for a total of 42 yards against the Jaguars’ second-team offense.
Even Hall of Fame quarterback Bob Griese, providing color commentary on the local TV broadcast, noted Green’s struggles.
“There’s a lot of passes being thrown Eric Green’s way,” Griese said on the air.
xxx
I'm a little surprised at the timing of the move, as there are no guarantees Sean Smith and Vontae Davis will continue to improve at their current rate. But if Green had no shot in the Trifecta's eyes to make this team, then it's probably best to get him out of the way now.
The larger question is what do you make of this regime's spotty record in free agency the past two years? Green, Ernest Wilford, Reggie Torbor, Charlie Anderson, etc?
They definitely have done a better job through the draft, trades and the waiver wire so far than with the big-ticket additions.
bcr8f
Footballguy
Chillar was signed for his coverage skills after Poppinga let several TE's get deep on him. One game was lost(Bears) 2 years ago when this happened.
massraider
Footballguy
Lions cut Bullocks.
This is kind of big, I love strong safeties from bad teams, it'll be worth watching to see who takes that job. Kalvin Pearson started first preseason game, but I have no idea how he did, aside from one bad missed tackle.
This is kind of big, I love strong safeties from bad teams, it'll be worth watching to see who takes that job. Kalvin Pearson started first preseason game, but I have no idea how he did, aside from one bad missed tackle.
bcr8f
Footballguy
I thought Chris Owens Atl CB looked good in game 1.
Falcons rookies-
Another change is that he said “the majority of the rookies” will get playing time in the first half to see how they fare against first- and second-string players. Smith named three rookies in particular, cornerback Christopher Owens, defensive end Lawrence Sidbury and defensive tackle Vance Walker, the seventh-round pick from Georgia Tech.
Another is that defensive end Chauncey Davis and defensive tackle Trey Lewis will start, though Smith cautioned not to read anything into it, as all linemen will be rotated. Davis and Lewis will start in place of end Jamaal Anderson and tackle Thomas Johnson, who started alongside end John Abraham and tackle Jonathan Babineaux on Saturday in Detroit.
Falcons rookies-
Another change is that he said “the majority of the rookies” will get playing time in the first half to see how they fare against first- and second-string players. Smith named three rookies in particular, cornerback Christopher Owens, defensive end Lawrence Sidbury and defensive tackle Vance Walker, the seventh-round pick from Georgia Tech.
Another is that defensive end Chauncey Davis and defensive tackle Trey Lewis will start, though Smith cautioned not to read anything into it, as all linemen will be rotated. Davis and Lewis will start in place of end Jamaal Anderson and tackle Thomas Johnson, who started alongside end John Abraham and tackle Jonathan Babineaux on Saturday in Detroit.
Last edited by a moderator:
Birdie048
Footballguy
I agree. He looked solid in the limited time I caught him. I was underwhelmed by Joe Mays. Mays has good speed and was all over the place, but he was easily fooled by mis-direction or play action. He got caught flat footed a few time early in the 1Q... once leading to big plays by Dallas Clark.
massraider
Footballguy
It'll be interesting to see what happens with Mays. Philly has a new DC, so it's tough to project, but he's one of those guys that if you can acquire him cheap, it could be a decent payoff. Still doubt he is anything more than an LB4 for owners.
Larry Thomas
Footballguy
USA Today
An apparent injury to ILB Zach Thomas(notes) has opened the door for first-team reps for UFA signee Corey Mays(notes). Mays, a former member of the Patriots and Bengals, has taken advantage of that. “He works hard and he’s very physical,” head coach Todd Haley said. “He’s smart. When he’s out there he runs the defense. He runs a tight huddle, a tight ship. He’s not afraid to get on the guys and get them organized and get them lined up and be where they have to be. Then, he runs and hits and I like guys who run and hit.”
I thought Mays played very well last week vs Houston, Thomas doesn't have much left, if Mays continues to play the way he has so far this summer, he may keep Thomas on the bench.
The 2-5-4 Formation, Corey Mays, and Other Preseason Week One Ramblings
Corey Mays
Mays is no longer just competing for a roster spot on this team, he might be in a dead heat competition with Zach Thomas the starting spot next to Derrick Johnson. Since mini-camp he has impressed the coaches, and this past Saturday he was all over the place making plays.
In the short amount of time he was in, he accumulated five tackles, and one pass deflection. It seemed as though the announcer was calling his name every play.
Mays originally signed a contract with the Chiefs expecting to compete for a roster spot as a special teams ace and a backup linebacker. He has far exceeded those expectations thus far, and continues to impress everyone involved.
In the two seasons he's been in the NFL with Cincinnati and New England, he accumulated 38 special teams tackles, and that’s exactly what he was planning on doing here.
Evidently though, there was something inside of him that neither of those coaching staffs saw, something that has come out of him since he has been here in Kansas City.
Zach Thomas can be a valuable asset for the Chiefs whether he starts or not. If Corey Mays keeps playing
An apparent injury to ILB Zach Thomas(notes) has opened the door for first-team reps for UFA signee Corey Mays(notes). Mays, a former member of the Patriots and Bengals, has taken advantage of that. “He works hard and he’s very physical,” head coach Todd Haley said. “He’s smart. When he’s out there he runs the defense. He runs a tight huddle, a tight ship. He’s not afraid to get on the guys and get them organized and get them lined up and be where they have to be. Then, he runs and hits and I like guys who run and hit.”
I thought Mays played very well last week vs Houston, Thomas doesn't have much left, if Mays continues to play the way he has so far this summer, he may keep Thomas on the bench.
The 2-5-4 Formation, Corey Mays, and Other Preseason Week One Ramblings
Corey Mays
Mays is no longer just competing for a roster spot on this team, he might be in a dead heat competition with Zach Thomas the starting spot next to Derrick Johnson. Since mini-camp he has impressed the coaches, and this past Saturday he was all over the place making plays.
In the short amount of time he was in, he accumulated five tackles, and one pass deflection. It seemed as though the announcer was calling his name every play.
Mays originally signed a contract with the Chiefs expecting to compete for a roster spot as a special teams ace and a backup linebacker. He has far exceeded those expectations thus far, and continues to impress everyone involved.
In the two seasons he's been in the NFL with Cincinnati and New England, he accumulated 38 special teams tackles, and that’s exactly what he was planning on doing here.
Evidently though, there was something inside of him that neither of those coaching staffs saw, something that has come out of him since he has been here in Kansas City.
Zach Thomas can be a valuable asset for the Chiefs whether he starts or not. If Corey Mays keeps playing
Zoomanji
Footballguy
Uggg maybe I'm still sour from how badly the whole team played but mays was less than impressive. His coverage skills were poor at best. Not sure how this will play out since Gocong was one of the nickel backers last year and I think he and Jordan will be the 2 this year.Mays at best looks like a S. Tulloch like player. Not sure that is even a LB4 at this point.And A. Samuel looked terrible as well. maybe he just doesn't try hard in pre-season? But I still think he's over-rated (still can't get over the terrible PI against Moss last week and dude walks away thumping his chest till the flag comes in, idiot) Oh and you may want to cover Larry Fitzgerald too buddy./rant Either way I'm not on the Mays bandwagon and I'm not sure it will ever really get started
Last edited by a moderator:
Larry Thomas
Footballguy
Yeah... I was unimpressed by Joe Mays also. The May's bandwagon thats picking up steam is Corey's. He was a guy who stood out watching their game last week. GM Scott Pioli seen something in New England to bring him in, I can see why Mays has made an impression on the coaching staff.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
Quick hitters from a few games this weekend:
**As noted elsewhere, Gary Guyton got first team snaps ahead of Tedy Bruschi against Cincinnati. It's a safe bet that will stick moving forward. Still may not be much more than bye week replacement value for Guyton, but remains worth watching.
**Keith Rivers continued to play every nickel snap in Brandon Johnson's absence. I think he looks solid enough to hold that role in the long term, but this is the team that's willing to let Chris Crocker miss tackles and Roy Williams trail TEs in coverage. Wait until Rivers plays in the nickel with Johnson healthy before giving him consistent LB3 value.
**Rey Maualuga stood out against the Pats twos and threes. Good sign, but isn't likely to be enough to earn him a bunch of snaps with the ones. Michael Johnson also looked good against the backups, but he saw time as a three-technique pass rusher with the first team on nickel downs. Very few snaps for him in a two point stance in either game thus far.
**James Laurinaitis took every nickel snap with the first team against the Falcons. On base downs, he's not done anything to suggest he'll have the sideline-to-sideline range necessary to become an elite tier tackler. Still time to grow into his role, though, and it's now clear that he'll be the every-down MLB most expected before camp started.
**Chad Greenway took every nickel snap against KC over three series of play ahead of Ben Leber. EJ Henderson continues to look impressive.
**The Chiefs were again a predominantly 3-4 base. I appear to be in the minority, but I'm not impressed by Corey Mays. That's not to say he can't have LB3/4 value as a potential every-down LILB in a target rich environment, but I think that's a pretty limited ceiling at best. Interestingly, I thought Tamba Hali looked decent at OLB this week (and last actually). Might be another Calvin Pace in the making.
**Larry Foote played every down again against the Browns and looked very active. Julian Peterson was nowhere to be found on nickel downs. Ernie Sims was around the ball, but still looks like less than an impact player. Kalvin Pearson was impressive, but the Lions had him up in the box frequently and he rarely was blocked.
**Eric Barton played every down again for Cleveland and Abram Elam saw a fair number of productive in-the-box snaps.
More to come later this week hopefully.
**As noted elsewhere, Gary Guyton got first team snaps ahead of Tedy Bruschi against Cincinnati. It's a safe bet that will stick moving forward. Still may not be much more than bye week replacement value for Guyton, but remains worth watching.
**Keith Rivers continued to play every nickel snap in Brandon Johnson's absence. I think he looks solid enough to hold that role in the long term, but this is the team that's willing to let Chris Crocker miss tackles and Roy Williams trail TEs in coverage. Wait until Rivers plays in the nickel with Johnson healthy before giving him consistent LB3 value.
**Rey Maualuga stood out against the Pats twos and threes. Good sign, but isn't likely to be enough to earn him a bunch of snaps with the ones. Michael Johnson also looked good against the backups, but he saw time as a three-technique pass rusher with the first team on nickel downs. Very few snaps for him in a two point stance in either game thus far.
**James Laurinaitis took every nickel snap with the first team against the Falcons. On base downs, he's not done anything to suggest he'll have the sideline-to-sideline range necessary to become an elite tier tackler. Still time to grow into his role, though, and it's now clear that he'll be the every-down MLB most expected before camp started.
**Chad Greenway took every nickel snap against KC over three series of play ahead of Ben Leber. EJ Henderson continues to look impressive.
**The Chiefs were again a predominantly 3-4 base. I appear to be in the minority, but I'm not impressed by Corey Mays. That's not to say he can't have LB3/4 value as a potential every-down LILB in a target rich environment, but I think that's a pretty limited ceiling at best. Interestingly, I thought Tamba Hali looked decent at OLB this week (and last actually). Might be another Calvin Pace in the making.
**Larry Foote played every down again against the Browns and looked very active. Julian Peterson was nowhere to be found on nickel downs. Ernie Sims was around the ball, but still looks like less than an impact player. Kalvin Pearson was impressive, but the Lions had him up in the box frequently and he rarely was blocked.
**Eric Barton played every down again for Cleveland and Abram Elam saw a fair number of productive in-the-box snaps.
More to come later this week hopefully.
massraider
Footballguy
Agent tweets Cody Brown out for season
The team still hasn't announced anything -- I would guess coach Ken Whisenhunt will talk about it after practice -- but the agent of rookie linebacker Cody Brown is saying on his Twitter account (over two parts, here and here) that Brown's wrist injury will end his season. Obviously, not great news and it matches up with Brown's mood in the locker room after the game Saturday night. In some ways it might have a silver lining because Brown still had a lot of learning to do and this takes the pressure off. But at the same time it's depth the Cards could have used, especially with older players at the position in front of Brown.
The team still hasn't announced anything -- I would guess coach Ken Whisenhunt will talk about it after practice -- but the agent of rookie linebacker Cody Brown is saying on his Twitter account (over two parts, here and here) that Brown's wrist injury will end his season. Obviously, not great news and it matches up with Brown's mood in the locker room after the game Saturday night. In some ways it might have a silver lining because Brown still had a lot of learning to do and this takes the pressure off. But at the same time it's depth the Cards could have used, especially with older players at the position in front of Brown.
darthraider
Footballguy
I looked around but really do not see much on Dominique Barber SS from Houston, if he ends up starting, which looks like the case, he could have some nice sleeper value as i am sure not many have heard of him outside of serious IDP'ers and Houston fans.
He only has to beat out old and not so good Nick Ferguson, anyone with more info or that has heard he will start?
He only has to beat out old and not so good Nick Ferguson, anyone with more info or that has heard he will start?
Only thing I heard was that he passed Nick Ferguson on the depth chart, so as far as I know, he is in line to start at SS.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
I agree. Here are a couple of posts from earlier in this thread.
I haven't yet had a chance to review last week's preseason game.
darthraider
Footballguy
Thank you, I apologize... I did read these already was curious if we had newer news or anything more concrete as far as him being the starter.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
No worries. I don't know if it's better to do one big thread of thoughts with everybody's help or separate most of this stuff into its own thread. Barber is listed as the starter in the NFL.com Gamebook for Week 2, so it's sounding pretty concrete. He didn't stand out to me in Week 1, though, so I'm interested in another look, especially since I've pushed guys like Brandon Harrison and Glenn Earl fairly hard in the past from this position without much payoff.
bcr8f
Footballguy
I did like his blitzes on Favre. They went after him.Tyrell Sutton Green Bay has looked good. Wynn always hurt and Brandon jackson isn't much. He could move up.
Jermichael Finley keeps looking good. His blocking has even improved. I see 2 TE sets with Lee blocking and Finley going out as a large WR.
Markus P Dub
Footballguy
Can some one break down David Harris? I noticed he had another sack last night so curious if he's going to be the main playmaker in Rex's D or is B. Scott? Thank.s
RavensUNFL
Footballguy
Think of Ray Lewis number 5 to 8 years ago, maybe a few less tackles but a few more sacks. If Kris Jenkins is healthy all year I think Harris will be a top 5 scoring LB this year. Scott is not talented enough to be the main guy, he is a great #2 but Harris is the beast on this team. This is jmho and Jene and the others may completely disagree.
jsharlan
Footballguy
Barber moved into the starting SS spot during training camp as most fans expected. He played well when healthy last year. The latest buzz among Texans fans is if Busing will now push Harrison or Ferguson off the roster as he has been stellar in the preseason. They currently have 5 safeties in camp.Another thing to keep in mind from the Texans defense is holdout CB Dunta Robinson is expected to report right before the season kicks off. He will be playing for a contract with another team and has been flying under the fantasy radar a bit since he hasnt been in camp. His last full season of play was in 2006 and he had 83 tackles, so might want to keep him on a list of potential sleepers if he can come back in previous form.In the linebacker core, it is most likely Adibi will be the starting WLB in week 1. He was in a battle with Zac Diles for the spot, but when Cushing went down, Diles was moved to the strong side. Cushing will be back in the last week of the preseason, and with Adibi getting all the WLB reps, Diles looks to be the odd man out.
Last edited by a moderator:
darthraider
Footballguy
Thanks for the update jsharlan, I figured Barber would get ever chance to start, good he has taken advantage of it.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
I never fully bought into the "Bart Scott will be the Ray Lewis of this defense" expectation, but it became difficult to ignore the statements of the coaches and players. The first preseason game suggests that Harris will play a thumper role, but get plenty of pass rush opportunities too.Right now, I think a good comp for David Harris is James Farrior, with Bart Scott resembling a guy like, well, Bart Scott. I'm still not convinced either will top 90 solos and I think there's only a small percentage change Harris hits the elite LB1 ceiling, but I think Harris has more upside than Scott at this point.RavensUNFL said:Think of Ray Lewis number 5 to 8 years ago, maybe a few less tackles but a few more sacks. If Kris Jenkins is healthy all year I think Harris will be a top 5 scoring LB this year. Scott is not talented enough to be the main guy, he is a great #2 but Harris is the beast on this team. This is jmho and Jene and the others may completely disagree.Markus P Dub said:
darthraider
Footballguy
My thinking with Harris is based on the talent around him, which is why I don't like the Farrior comparison personally. Farrior was not the best lb'er on the team nor was he the first one to the ball carrier most times. That is why I think Harris has a shot at much better number than Jene's prediction imho (no disrespect intended), because Harris just doesn't have the competition for tackles and Jenkins is a monster in the middle when healthy which will give him even more oppurtunities to make plays.
I don't claim to be an expert, but I have been pretty good with my IDP guesses in the past. I almost will always defer to Jene in regards to IDP issues, so he is probably correct in this situation as well.
I don't claim to be an expert, but I have been pretty good with my IDP guesses in the past. I almost will always defer to Jene in regards to IDP issues, so he is probably correct in this situation as well.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
No apologies necessary. This kind of discussion is what makes this Forum far and away the best IDP outlet on the web. I'm wrong plenty and readily admit I'm not comfortable projecting this situation. FWIW, I'm comparing Harris to the recent Steeler version of Farrior in the 3-4, not his old Jets days. I would agree that Marvin Jones and Mo Lewis were stronger NFL players and better statistical options at that point in Farrior's career. It's not perfect, but I think the talent level, surrounding cast (I'm not a huge Foote fan), NT (Hampton) and role (zone blitzing, thumping ILB) are comparable between Farrior v2006-2008 and Harris v2009.To flesh this out the big picture a little more, I'm struggling with the following:**There's no Ray Lewis talent here.**There's been no clear SILB/WILB split.**The player rumored to have the "Ray Lewis" role (Scott) isn't playing MLB in the 4-3 looks.**David Harris has been very effective in camp as a pass rusher and got more rush looks than Scott last week.**I think Scott is a talented player, but I'm not sure he's as dynamic as many have argued he is over the years.**I think Harris is a better all-around player than many have argued he is at times in his career.To me, none of that suggests that Bart Scott is the focal point of this scheme, which is what's been suggested by Scott himself and seemingly backed up by Ryan at times. After watching the first game, I'm leaning toward my gut on this, which is that the total picture suggests Harris is the better statistical option. If the next two week's preseason games look the same, I'll move Harris up even higher, though I doubt it'll be into the top 20.My thinking with Harris is based on the talent around him, which is why I don't like the Farrior comparison personally. Farrior was not the best lb'er on the team nor was he the first one to the ball carrier most times. That is why I think Harris has a shot at much better number than Jene's prediction imho (no disrespect intended), because Harris just doesn't have the competition for tackles and Jenkins is a monster in the middle when healthy which will give him even more oppurtunities to make plays. I don't claim to be an expert, but I have been pretty good with my IDP guesses in the past. I almost will always defer to Jene in regards to IDP issues, so he is probably correct in this situation as well.
Last edited by a moderator:
bcr8f
Footballguy
Nick Barnett (ACL surgery) practiced in full for the first time Monday night. Barnett immediately replaced Brandon Chillar in the starting lineup and was inserted into the nickel package over Desmond Bishop.
Now from Tom P-Chillar and Barnett at ilb with the ones in nickel again.
Now from Tom P-Chillar and Barnett at ilb with the ones in nickel again.
Last edited by a moderator:
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
**Robert Ayers saw time with the first team nickel package as a standup pass rusher flitting around the line like a drunken butterfly. That was as quick as he looked the entire game. Color me unimpressed with his first step or bull rush as a standup OLB. All of his base defensive snaps with the second team were at ROLB.
**Andra Davis played only sparingly in passing situations, leaving the field in favor of Wes Woodyard. Looks like Williams, Dumervil and potentially Ayers will be the every-down linebackers in Denver.
**Also not particularly impressed (albeit in very small sample size) with Darcel McBath's interest in tackling. Not sure he projects to anything more as a FS in the future. If he's solidly ahead of David Bruton at second team SS right now, it says very little for the long term prospects of either Bruton or Josh Barrett if his play against the Seahawks was any indication.
**Aaron Curry missed this game with a groin injury. Leroy Hill still aligned to the strong side (with DD Lewis at WLB) in the base defense.
**Andra Davis played only sparingly in passing situations, leaving the field in favor of Wes Woodyard. Looks like Williams, Dumervil and potentially Ayers will be the every-down linebackers in Denver.
**Also not particularly impressed (albeit in very small sample size) with Darcel McBath's interest in tackling. Not sure he projects to anything more as a FS in the future. If he's solidly ahead of David Bruton at second team SS right now, it says very little for the long term prospects of either Bruton or Josh Barrett if his play against the Seahawks was any indication.
**Aaron Curry missed this game with a groin injury. Leroy Hill still aligned to the strong side (with DD Lewis at WLB) in the base defense.
Last edited by a moderator:
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
He wasn't anywhere near the quarterback in a full half of play despite facing a questionable offensive line and Hasselbeck's 23 pass attempts. He was regularly drive blocked off the line on the few rush attempts. He still looks quick in space, but I think he's a 30 solo, 5-7 sack guy at best.That still leaves him in the messy DL3 tier.
massraider
Footballguy
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
I was impressed and had the feeling he was "practicing" power moves instead of his usual game. He did bullrush Locklear into Hasselbeck in what amounted to a sack, imo. He had a sure sack on another play but Patterson barely beat him to Hass. Anyway, he was near the QB a few times and he brought his B game on purpose. He might be very good in this role. Double digit sacks would not surprise me.
corpcow
Footballguy
I would think a lot of his value is whether or not he's classified as a DE. As a DE, I can see him getting enough tackle opportunities + sacks to be a viable starter. I would feel much less comfortable starting him as a LB. MFL already announced that he will be moved to LB on Aug 31st.
HockeyScotty
Footballguy
I'm curious about this look you discsussed. What was the rest of the alignment, do you remember. I'll watch for this game to replay on NFL network.I would assume Warren-Wilfork were the two DT? Who was the other end? Burgess?
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
If my memory is right, Pryor and Brace were rotating alongside Wilfork at tackle. LeKevin Smith (traded to Broncos) was the other end. Mike Wright and Ty Warren were both inactive. Warren and Wright could play inside or outside in this formation and Jarvis Green is still around at end.Patriots were predominantly in the 3-4 in the early series against Cincinnati last week. Warren was back and starting at end. Wright was still out.
HockeyScotty
Footballguy
Thanks Jene, it seems like their depth is in the form of big body DT types so was curious what their new looks would be with Burgess also.
