wadegarrett
FFA Legend™
Does it really matter who they draft? They'll find a way to #### it up one way or another. 
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Cleveland Browns (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter wadegarrett
- Start date
MAC_32
Footballguy
I still haven't seen a Pat Shurmur offense go anywhere but horizontal. Until I do there's no reason for me to believe it will change. That and even if his game planning does improve with talent he showed me he has absolutely no clue how to manage a game. A well coached team wins 6-9 games this year. Shurmur was lucky to get the 4 he did. This is the worst single season coaching job I've seen of the new Browns. By a lot. Chris Palmer says thank you, Pat.
NJDawgPound
Footballguy
I agree. And I wanted to buy in on Shurmur. I understand that we had no offseason to install a new offense and a new defense. However, neither did John Fox in Denver; and neither did Jay Gruden in Cincy with a rookie QB and a rookie #1 WR. They still got results. I'm of the ilk of the value of continuity and avoiding the revolving door, but some of the mistakes were inexcusable. What happened at the end of the Rams game was terrible. That playcall on the 3rd and 1 on that initial drive vs. the Ravens was a headscratcher. As was the mismanagement of the clock at the end of the half last week. He's got to have some accountability there. I know this guy is not the answer, let's cut ties right now.Like I said, we could have randomly thrown a dart at all the coordinators last year and hit a better choice for head coach. Someone supposedly in the know over on the OBR football board mentioned that Shurmur's locker room is in shambles and every week there is no game plan. I don't know how true that is, but from watching on TV, it's not far off.
Fensalk
Footballguy
I'm hearing now that the Browns may look into trading down in the draft again. You would think at #4, any of these top 4 picks (QB Andrew Luck, QB Robert Griffin, RB Trent Richardson, WR Justin Blackmon) might help them. What may happen is this:
1. Colts take Luck
2. Someone trades up to the Rams spot and grabs Griffin.
3. The Vikings select Richardson due to Peterson's injury.
4. WR Justin Blackmon is the best player on the board.
The problem is, the Browns front office does not believe in selecting WRs high. So Blackmon being left on the board is a problem for them. They know other teams will gladly trade up to get Blackmon.
From what I've gleaned over the course of the season, the Browns currently do not believe in selecting WRs or LBs high. They love Tony Pashos at RT, so its doubtful they select that. There are no QBs they like that they can grab with a high pick. There are no RBs to get with a high pick. They feel set at TE.
By process of elimination, the two first round picks may be used on DE, OG, or CB.
Their probably targeting DE Quinton Coples, G David DeCastro, DE Melvin Ingram or CB Dre Kirkpatrick.
1. Colts take Luck
2. Someone trades up to the Rams spot and grabs Griffin.
3. The Vikings select Richardson due to Peterson's injury.
4. WR Justin Blackmon is the best player on the board.
The problem is, the Browns front office does not believe in selecting WRs high. So Blackmon being left on the board is a problem for them. They know other teams will gladly trade up to get Blackmon.
From what I've gleaned over the course of the season, the Browns currently do not believe in selecting WRs or LBs high. They love Tony Pashos at RT, so its doubtful they select that. There are no QBs they like that they can grab with a high pick. There are no RBs to get with a high pick. They feel set at TE.
By process of elimination, the two first round picks may be used on DE, OG, or CB.
Their probably targeting DE Quinton Coples, G David DeCastro, DE Melvin Ingram or CB Dre Kirkpatrick.
NJDawgPound
Footballguy
So you're saying Matt Kalil AND Claiborne will last till 5?
saintfool
Dead sexy
this is interesting to me. do they move on from the concussed and limited watson? moore and cameron are future but does the FO make the switch next season?
daveR
Footballguy
The perils of Fantasy Football -- everyone forgets the trenches, the DBs, etc..On the other hand, they could do like last year, only with Richardson the target for someone who is looking for an exceptional talent to fill a hole. Who needs a RB to put them over the top?
Fensalk
Footballguy
The Vikings would probably have selected one of them, but now its a bit up in the air because the ADP injury may make them decide to take Richardson. If that happens, the Browns may trade down.
Fensalk
Footballguy
I think they take Richardson if he's there. The only reason they trade down is if the top three picks are Luck, Griffin, and Richardson. I don't think they want Blackmon. The current organizational philosophy is that no WR is worth that high a pick. They feel they can find quality WRs in later rounds. So a WR being at that spot forces a trade down for them.
On the other hand, they could do like last year, only with Richardson the target for someone who is looking for an exceptional talent to fill a hole. Who needs a RB to put them over the top?
nxmehta
Footballguy
1. The Rams will take Kalil.2. Are you nuts? I guarantee that they will either draft a RT (I would guess with their late round pick) or bring in a top free agent.
But, I do agree that the Browns will trade down, specifically if they don't want RG3. He WILL be there at 4, and that's the perfect spot for someone to trade up to get him. If they don't want him they will get a boatload of picks for him. And I'm 100% okay with that.
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Fensalk
Footballguy
1. I think specifically the Rams would trade down to #6 and let the Redskins have Griffin. They could move down 4 spots and pick up a boatload of picks. 2. I heard it straight from Grossi himself. Grossi specifically said the Browns LOVE Tony Pashos. Grossi couldn't understand why, but that's what he said.
The Hank
Footballguy
Vikings sunk a high draft pick to Toby Gerhart recently. No chance of them taking another RB there, especially with expectation that ADP will be back at some point early next season. I think its more likely that MIN will use FA to help supplant their RB situation; thus opening up the possibility of trading down to Griffin/Blackmon suitors or taking an OL/DB.
The Man With No Name
Footballguy
No use in trying to figure this out yet. You got free agency before the draft and there are always a lot of players changing teams. That will change teams outlook on the draft.
I like the idea of drafting the highest player on your boaed regardless of position. Get talent. Trading down and getting more picks is fine by me.
I like the idea of drafting the highest player on your boaed regardless of position. Get talent. Trading down and getting more picks is fine by me.
Fensalk
Footballguy
Personally I don't think the Vikings will take him either, but its a new possibility that I didn't mention that opened up.'The Hank said:'Fensalk said:
Fensalk
Footballguy
Another thing I forgot to mention. The Browns are going to need more DE depth. Sheard played a ton of downs this year, and while the team was pleasantly surprised he didn't hit a rookie wall, they need to find players to give him a breather. Browns' defensive coordinator **** Jauron said in an interview a while back that he wants 8 guys that can rotate in and out on the 4-man DL to keep them fresh.
I expect them to add talent to the DL in the draft, and free agency perhaps as well.
I expect them to add talent to the DL in the draft, and free agency perhaps as well.
nxmehta
Footballguy
Yes, a DE is a bigtime need. I really think we need about 4-5 STUD players in order to be competitive (in no particular order):1. QB2. WR3. DE4. LB5. Some kind of OL (OT, OG)If we can just get 2 in the draft and 2 in free agency, with a complete offseason and a health Steinbach, this team could be really good next year.Now's the part where I remind myself to quote this post exactly a year from now to point out how ####### stupid I am
wadegarrett
FFA Legend™
At the beginning of the season they had $23+ million in cap room...not sure where it's at now but I know they haven't spent much of it.They were 7th on this list in August.
wadegarrett
FFA Legend™
Pretty sure the Browns said they'd love to RELEASE Tony Pashos.
GreatLakesMike
Footballguy
Luck will be gone. Griffin looks too jittery in the pocket for my tastes. I think #4 is too early to take Blackmon. I like Blackmon, but not that well. I don't want Richardson at #4 either because I'm not a big fan of investing that kind of money in the RB position. Kalil would be a RT for the Browns, so no way they take him at #4.
I know it's not popular, but my guess is that Heckert takes Claiborne with the 4th pick or trades down. Honestly, I'd love to see the Browns grab Claiborne. Premium CB's are a must in today's NFL, and a secondary with Haden, Claiborne, and Ward would be pretty damn good.
I think Heckert is the best thing going for the Browns right now, so I'll trust whatever decision he makes.
I know it's not popular, but my guess is that Heckert takes Claiborne with the 4th pick or trades down. Honestly, I'd love to see the Browns grab Claiborne. Premium CB's are a must in today's NFL, and a secondary with Haden, Claiborne, and Ward would be pretty damn good.
I think Heckert is the best thing going for the Browns right now, so I'll trust whatever decision he makes.
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NJDawgPound
Footballguy
As per the Canton Rep, Steinbach is fully recovered from his back surgery and ready to go. He's due $6M next year and I don't know if the Browns will force him to restructure, but we can eliminate two needs simply by bringing Steinbach back and resigning Hillis.
I'm kind of warming up to Claiborne and dreaming of sugarplums with a secondary of Haden, Caliborne, and Ward.
Then with the second pick in the first round go Floyd or Jeffery; Jeffery's stock is falling due to work ethic/weight issues so he may even last into the second round.
Throw a couple of bucks at Matt Flynn and look at us go.
I'm kind of warming up to Claiborne and dreaming of sugarplums with a secondary of Haden, Caliborne, and Ward.
Then with the second pick in the first round go Floyd or Jeffery; Jeffery's stock is falling due to work ethic/weight issues so he may even last into the second round.
Throw a couple of bucks at Matt Flynn and look at us go.
Fensalk
Footballguy
Posted this in another thread. Working with the assumption that the Browns go BPA with the 1.05 and take CB Claiborne. How to draft the rest of the way.
How about:
1.05: CB Claiborne
1.23: WR Kendall Wright (Using the pick we got for passing on Julio Jones on a WR, I think Wright is a good fit here)
2.05: DE Fletcher Cox
3.05: RB LaMichael James (Browns want an RB with the speed to get to the outside, not to mention the irony of his name being so close to LeBron James)
4.05: OG
How about:
1.05: CB Claiborne
1.23: WR Kendall Wright (Using the pick we got for passing on Julio Jones on a WR, I think Wright is a good fit here)
2.05: DE Fletcher Cox
3.05: RB LaMichael James (Browns want an RB with the speed to get to the outside, not to mention the irony of his name being so close to LeBron James)
4.05: OG
NJDawgPound
Footballguy
I think that Wright is projecting maybe a round/round 1/2 higher than his actual value. I look at him as a late second round talent. I know he's smallish, but how are his hands, and is the breakaway speed there?I want to know this kid's measurables; Little is an awesome talent but there were only two receivers at the combine that had smaller hands than Little. It definitely contributed to some of the drops I would imagine..
Fensalk
Footballguy
You're not going to get a sure thing this year because its a weak draft for WRs. Personally, I'd try to fill the WR spot in FA, take a top OG maybe like Cordy Glen at 1.23. Of course they will get heavily criticized if they do it. They probably take even more criticism down the road though if they reach for WR and RB this year.This isn't a WR-heavy or RB-heavy draft. They can't get the franchise QB. I'd beef up the lines with more top picks, find a WR in free agency, and go from there. if they try to force what's not there, they just set themselves back, and may ultimately get fired for it.
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NJDawgPound
Footballguy
You know the working class fans we have; I think only the short sighted ones will complain if we draft trenches high. We've ignored the trenches for too long before they wised up and took Thomas (and then last year with the Taylor and Sheard). I'm completely okay with grabbing James where you project and resigning Hillis. If we go OG at 23, it probably means Steinbach won't be back as I believe they like Louvau. We'd still need a RT as Pashos can't stay healthy, and we'd still need to fill a WR need. Vincent Jackson perhaps? I like Little's potential if he has a true number one on the other side taking coverage away.
rizzler
Footballguy
Anyone who is suggesting Blackmon over the likes of Griffin, is completely mad.
The Browns will 110% take Griffin at 4 IF he is still available, and all signs point to it.
To beat the broken drum:
1. Luck
2. Call me crazy, but the Rams may very well draft Blackmon here, to give their franchise QB a weapon, or conversely draft richardson, as their franchise RB is on his last legs. Also likely to trade pick away
3.Vikings are NOT drafting Richardson with AP returning at some point (and likely earlier than expected) and having taken a competent gerhart early as well. Not happening. They also wont be drafting Griffin, as ponder looks like he will be decent in the NFL
4. Griffin. Get your popcorn smothered in butter ladies and gents. it's gonna get greeeeeeeeeeeeeezy in here!!!
Not only does our QB position increase 30-fold in quality, but we will also see the likes of Greg Little shine like he should have, with a QB who can quick release, run and throw an ACCURATE and deep pass like it ain't no thing.
griffin will bring us to a whole new level. He will be the start of our revolution.
The Browns will 110% take Griffin at 4 IF he is still available, and all signs point to it.
To beat the broken drum:
1. Luck
2. Call me crazy, but the Rams may very well draft Blackmon here, to give their franchise QB a weapon, or conversely draft richardson, as their franchise RB is on his last legs. Also likely to trade pick away
3.Vikings are NOT drafting Richardson with AP returning at some point (and likely earlier than expected) and having taken a competent gerhart early as well. Not happening. They also wont be drafting Griffin, as ponder looks like he will be decent in the NFL
4. Griffin. Get your popcorn smothered in butter ladies and gents. it's gonna get greeeeeeeeeeeeeezy in here!!!
Not only does our QB position increase 30-fold in quality, but we will also see the likes of Greg Little shine like he should have, with a QB who can quick release, run and throw an ACCURATE and deep pass like it ain't no thing.
griffin will bring us to a whole new level. He will be the start of our revolution.
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The Man With No Name
Footballguy
Can't trade for a player that doesn't have a contract.
Fensalk
Footballguy
The Packers could franchise Flynn and then trade him. I wouldn't pay a first round pick for Flynn though. I'd give them a second tops.
The Man With No Name
Footballguy
Of course they could franchise him. But they probably would take the best deal offered if they did that. They may want a 1st or multiple picks though. Have to wait and see if they franchise him first.
Abraham
Footballguy
As a guy with friends working for the football program, I would be ShOCKED of bray didn't play two more years, Especially if hunter doesn't come out next year.
rizzler
Footballguy
are you expecting RG3 to be gone at 4, or do you honestly think we would pass on his for a WR?
MAC_32
Footballguy
I think someone other than us trades up to 2 or 3 to take him. Probably 2. St Louis has a ton of holes.Honestly, I'd be ok with Blackmon AND Wright. Although I highly doubt we do that.
rizzler
Footballguy
who realistically will pony up to move to the #2 spot to grab RG3?
MAC_32
Footballguy
Or Miami. Maybe Seattle.The top 5 is a completely different animal now with salary slotting.
Krush Groove
Footballguy
The Browns
nxmehta
Footballguy
Can anyone comment on Ryan Tannehill? Never seen the kid play but scouting report and measurables look good. Plus, he was coached by Mike Sherman who is a Holmgren disciple and maybe a candidate for the offensive coordinator position.
Any chance we take a shot at him? It would free us up to take a playmaker like Blackmon with our early 1st...
Any chance we take a shot at him? It would free us up to take a playmaker like Blackmon with our early 1st...
Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
1. They are NOT re-signing Hillis. Period. End of story. Mark it down. Etch it in stone. Smack it up, flip it, rub it down. So you can take that out of any of your hypotheticals.
2. That said, it is going to be very hard for them to pass on Richardson at 4. Unless they think Hardesty/Jackson/Oggy/FA is enough while they address more pressing needs.
3. I think they will sign an FA WR and it will be Desean Jackson. They need a speed guy and he's a Heckert draftee
4. I agree with the trade down to WAS/MIA scenario if RG is on the board.
2. That said, it is going to be very hard for them to pass on Richardson at 4. Unless they think Hardesty/Jackson/Oggy/FA is enough while they address more pressing needs.
3. I think they will sign an FA WR and it will be Desean Jackson. They need a speed guy and he's a Heckert draftee
4. I agree with the trade down to WAS/MIA scenario if RG is on the board.
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MAC_32
Footballguy
Intangibles and physical tools are good, but he has made some head scratchingly dumb decisions in big spots this season. I'd be less critical if it didn't happen in just about every big/close game.
rizzler
Footballguy
If we took Richardson over RG3, Id be upset. Not crushed, but upsetRichardson has stud written all over him. But RG3 has elite QB and 500+ rushing written all over him. Id rather have a franchise shotcaller.And I for one never had the feeling Colt would be our saviour. But this is a different story.
Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
To clarify, I'm not sold on Griffin, but if they believe he is a franchise QB they MUST take him at 4 if he is there. If not it should be Richarson or the LSU DB. Then WR & DE with the ATL and 2nd round picks
