Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
Cleveland Browns (10 Viewers)
- Thread starter wadegarrett
- Start date
MAC_32
Footballguy
Hope not but I would like your option #1 to become option #3. I'm indifferent on Claiborne vs. Blackmon but I do have a preference with future picks depending who we take at 4. If we go Claiborne then we have to get Wright or Floyd, without a doubt. If we go Blackmon I hope we don't reach for a CB at 22 unless Kirkpatrick falls. Don't like the others. Mercilus would be $ in that scenario.
nxmehta
Footballguy
Apparently Heckert offered up 3 1st rounders for the STL pick but didn't want to throw in the extra 2nd? That sounds like total 
to me. No way Heckert bets the farm (and I mean THE FARM) on RG3 and gets in a bidding war with Dan Snyder. And if he was willing to drop 3 1's then what's an extra 2 if RG3 is his guy? Doesn't sound like him at all.
I'm thinking we're looking to get out of the #4 spot. Let's see if we can get 3 first rounders this year (or another 1st for next year)...
to me. No way Heckert bets the farm (and I mean THE FARM) on RG3 and gets in a bidding war with Dan Snyder. And if he was willing to drop 3 1's then what's an extra 2 if RG3 is his guy? Doesn't sound like him at all.I'm thinking we're looking to get out of the #4 spot. Let's see if we can get 3 first rounders this year (or another 1st for next year)...
Last edited by a moderator:
Riversco
Footballguy
The Browns best move is probably trading down and getting another first rounder next year, so they have 2 first rounders in 2013 in case they find themselves needing to trade up for Matt Barkley. They need a QB and I don't think Flynn is the answer, and that's if Flynn even signs with Cleveland and not Miami or someone else.'Fallerjw said:
NJDawgPound
Footballguy
It's no secret they loved Barkley and it screwed them over when he went back to school. But Heckert has said this week that Brandon Weeden is very smart and ready to play now. He either is seriously considering him or it's a smokescreen.
Floyd The Barber
Footballguy
The problem is the Rams-Skins trade has set a new bar for quarterback draft trades. At least until RG3 flames out.Otherwise, tell the commodity brokers Mr. Valentine has set the price.
Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
Maybe they can sucker St Louis into giving up a 2nd rounder to move back up to 4 for Blackmon. Then take Richardson/Coples whoever at 6, WR at 22, Weeden and a DB in the 2nd.
Riversco
Footballguy
Oh I'm not saying that they would only have to give up both picks. I'm just saying they need to acquire ammo to trade for Barkley in 2013. A trade for Barkley might be both #1s, a #2, and a 2014 #1. So they gotta get a second #1 in 2013. They can do that maybe by trading down from #4.
Riversco
Footballguy
Flynn would probably struggle in Cleveland with a lack of targets to throw to. Plus he's already 27 and not a franchise QB. Plus, it would give them incentive to not draft Barkley in 2013, who very well could be a franchise QB. I think Browns best hope is if Flynn signs somewhere else.
wadegarrett
FFA Legend™
You know this because???
nxmehta
Footballguy
Obviously he can't know that, but how many 7th rounders who sat on the bench for a couple years magically turn into franchise QBs? It's possible, just not very likely.I don't know anymore what the Browns should do about the QB situation this year. I guess we're just gonna have to trust the scouting department...
Balco
Footballguy
There are a ton of late round abs who sat for a little while and became very solid playoff abs:Tom Brady, Matt Hasselback, Kurt Warner, Tony Romo, Matt Cassel, Marc Bulger, Trent Green, Brad Johnson, Mark Brunell, to name a few.Obviously he can't know that, but how many 7th rounders who sat on the bench for a couple years magically turn into franchise QBs? It's possible, just not very likely.I don't know anymore what the Browns should do about the QB situation this year. I guess we're just gonna have to trust the scouting department...
I
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype.
Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
NJDawgPound
Footballguy
Thanks. We have some franchise players (Haden, Thomas, Mack, and I think Little and Sheard will be ones) but have major holes. We need those picks to fill these. With our two 1s this year and our second, hopefully next year we can start adding luxury picks (making strengths stronger instead of addressing weaknesses).Work out an incentive laden deal for Hillis, and then give me Clayborne at 4, Michael Floyd at 22, and Weeden at 37. OR, give me Blackmon at 4, Janoris Jenkins at 22, and Weeden at 37.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype. Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
Balco
Footballguy
What about Phil Taylor? Guys on the NFL on sirius were talking about how good he was. Do you agree? The issue in the games I watched were that they do not have a competent receiver on that roster. I have a feeling they will have to trade up if they want Floyd (probably 3 or 4 spots). You add Flynn, a free agent receiver who knows how to run routes and catch the ball, Floyd, and have Cribbs move to slot receiver, and now you have got something. That defense has some very valuable pieces.Thanks. We have some franchise players (Haden, Thomas, Mack, and I think Little and Sheard will be ones) but have major holes. We need those picks to fill these. With our two 1s this year and our second, hopefully next year we can start adding luxury picks (making strengths stronger instead of addressing weaknesses).Work out an incentive laden deal for Hillis, and then give me Clayborne at 4, Michael Floyd at 22, and Weeden at 37. OR, give me Blackmon at 4, Janoris Jenkins at 22, and Weeden at 37.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype. Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
NJDawgPound
Footballguy
Taylor was good in stretches. He needs to play hard all the time though. But now that you mention Taylor, I'll count Ahtyba Rubin in the franchise player category. Taylor needs to emulate him. I envision Little's max potential as a great #2 in the mold of the Arizona Anquan Boldin. We need our Larry Fitzgerald though.What about Phil Taylor? Guys on the NFL on sirius were talking about how good he was. Do you agree? The issue in the games I watched were that they do not have a competent receiver on that roster. I have a feeling they will have to trade up if they want Floyd (probably 3 or 4 spots). You add Flynn, a free agent receiver who knows how to run routes and catch the ball, Floyd, and have Cribbs move to slot receiver, and now you have got something. That defense has some very valuable pieces.Thanks. We have some franchise players (Haden, Thomas, Mack, and I think Little and Sheard will be ones) but have major holes. We need those picks to fill these. With our two 1s this year and our second, hopefully next year we can start adding luxury picks (making strengths stronger instead of addressing weaknesses).Work out an incentive laden deal for Hillis, and then give me Clayborne at 4, Michael Floyd at 22, and Weeden at 37. OR, give me Blackmon at 4, Janoris Jenkins at 22, and Weeden at 37.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype. Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
Balco
Footballguy
Little needs to hold onto the ball. He still has time ti develop, receivers often don't reach their potential until year 3. That defense has talent. Use number 5 on another defender, and add a role player or 2, and they are good to go.Taylor was good in stretches. He needs to play hard all the time though. But now that you mention Taylor, I'll count Ahtyba Rubin in the franchise player category. Taylor needs to emulate him. I envision Little's max potential as a great #2 in the mold of the Arizona Anquan Boldin. We need our Larry Fitzgerald though.What about Phil Taylor? Guys on the NFL on sirius were talking about how good he was. Do you agree? The issue in the games I watched were that they do not have a competent receiver on that roster. I have a feeling they will have to trade up if they want Floyd (probably 3 or 4 spots). You add Flynn, a free agent receiver who knows how to run routes and catch the ball, Floyd, and have Cribbs move to slot receiver, and now you have got something. That defense has some very valuable pieces.Thanks. We have some franchise players (Haden, Thomas, Mack, and I think Little and Sheard will be ones) but have major holes. We need those picks to fill these. With our two 1s this year and our second, hopefully next year we can start adding luxury picks (making strengths stronger instead of addressing weaknesses).Work out an incentive laden deal for Hillis, and then give me Clayborne at 4, Michael Floyd at 22, and Weeden at 37. OR, give me Blackmon at 4, Janoris Jenkins at 22, and Weeden at 37.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype. Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
wadegarrett
FFA Legend™
Couldn't agree more Gunz.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype. Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
GreatLakesMike
Footballguy
No kidding. His rookie stats were actually pretty impressive even if you disregard everything said above.
GreatLakesMike
Footballguy
'MAC_32 said:
RevDawg
Footballguy
+1Couldn't agree more Gunz.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype. Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
Riversco
Footballguy
I disagree. When you don't have a franchise QB, you have to go for it. Even if he is a bust, so what? Just keep trying. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. The fact is, a lot of scouts think RG3 is a franchise QB. Oftentimes, you don't even get a chance to trade up for one of those. Typically, they get drafted by whoever has the pick. This guy is rated very highly and could've been traded for. You do it.Busting on a QB isn't a death knell for a franchise anyway. People overvalue first round picks. The Chargers traded up to get Ryan Leaf. It blew up in their face. People said it would set their franchise back years. 2 years after that trade, they had improved from 1-15 to 8-8. 4 years after the Leaf trade, they were 12-4.+1Couldn't agree more Gunz.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype.
Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
Last edited by a moderator:
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
WTF are you talking about? It took 7 years to get to 12-4 after the Leaf trade. Please get rid of your Rivers avatar if you can't even keep up with W-L records. And that turnaround only happened in year 7 b/c the Bolts hit the lottery in the '01 draft (LT and Brees) and then made the greatest undrafted FA signing in NFL history in '03 (Gates). Otherwise, the Leaf trade would have set the Bolts back by probably ~ a decade.I disagree. When you don't have a franchise QB, you have to go for it. Even if he is a bust, so what? Just keep trying. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. The fact is, a lot of scouts think RG3 is a franchise QB. Oftentimes, you don't even get a chance to trade up for one of those. Typically, they get drafted by whoever has the pick. This guy is rated very highly and could've been traded for. You do it.Busting on a QB isn't a death knell for a franchise anyway. People overvalue first round picks. The Chargers traded up to get Ryan Leaf. It blew up in their face. People said it would set their franchise back years. 2 years after that trade, they had improved from 1-15 to 8-8. 4 years after the Leaf trade, they were 12-4.+1Couldn't agree more Gunz.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype.
Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
Riversco
Footballguy
So you're saying if they drafted poorly after the Leaf trade, they would have been set back a decade? I think the truth is if they had drafted poorly, they would have been set back a decade, Leaf trade or not.WTF are you talking about? It took 7 years to get to 12-4 after the Leaf trade. Please get rid of your Rivers avatar if you can't even keep up with W-L records. And that turnaround only happened in year 7 b/c the Bolts hit the lottery in the '01 draft (LT and Brees) and then made the greatest undrafted FA signing in NFL history in '03 (Gates). Otherwise, the Leaf trade would have set the Bolts back by probably ~ a decade.I disagree. When you don't have a franchise QB, you have to go for it. Even if he is a bust, so what? Just keep trying. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. The fact is, a lot of scouts think RG3 is a franchise QB. Oftentimes, you don't even get a chance to trade up for one of those. Typically, they get drafted by whoever has the pick. This guy is rated very highly and could've been traded for. You do it.Busting on a QB isn't a death knell for a franchise anyway. People overvalue first round picks. The Chargers traded up to get Ryan Leaf. It blew up in their face. People said it would set their franchise back years. 2 years after that trade, they had improved from 1-15 to 8-8. 4 years after the Leaf trade, they were 12-4.+1Couldn't agree more Gunz.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype.
Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
I'm saying that it took 7 years to get to 12-4 (unlike the 4 yrs you claimed) and that it took the luck of acquiring 3 first ballot HOF'ers just to get back that quickly.So you're saying if they drafted poorly after the Leaf trade, they would have been set back a decade? I think the truth is if they had drafted poorly, they would have been set back a decade, Leaf trade or not.WTF are you talking about? It took 7 years to get to 12-4 after the Leaf trade. Please get rid of your Rivers avatar if you can't even keep up with W-L records. And that turnaround only happened in year 7 b/c the Bolts hit the lottery in the '01 draft (LT and Brees) and then made the greatest undrafted FA signing in NFL history in '03 (Gates). Otherwise, the Leaf trade would have set the Bolts back by probably ~ a decade.I disagree. When you don't have a franchise QB, you have to go for it. Even if he is a bust, so what? Just keep trying. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. The fact is, a lot of scouts think RG3 is a franchise QB. Oftentimes, you don't even get a chance to trade up for one of those. Typically, they get drafted by whoever has the pick. This guy is rated very highly and could've been traded for. You do it.Busting on a QB isn't a death knell for a franchise anyway. People overvalue first round picks. The Chargers traded up to get Ryan Leaf. It blew up in their face. People said it would set their franchise back years. 2 years after that trade, they had improved from 1-15 to 8-8. 4 years after the Leaf trade, they were 12-4.+1Couldn't agree more Gunz.From an unbiased outsider, I think you guys avoided a major disaster in dealing 3 1's and a 2 for RG3. It's easy to fall in love with his numbers and skill set, but this ain't the Big 12, and at least 50% of "franchise QB's" never live up to the hype.
Use those 1's to build a rock solid foundation.
NJDawgPound
Footballguy
Tgunz and Riversco:
Please take the fighting elsewhere; we're a happy (disfunctional) family in here.
Please take the fighting elsewhere; we're a happy (disfunctional) family in here.
NJDawgPound
Footballguy
Sorry if this is a :honda: but if we were to sign Mike Wallace, do we HAVE to give the Steelers our #4, or can it be the #22?
Riversco
Footballguy
The Browns schedule arguably got a little bit harder. Going into 2012, the home game against the Redskins was arguably one of the very few games they could pencil in as a victory. But now that they got RG3, that might be the game-changing weapon to push the Redskins over the Browns in that game.
wadegarrett
FFA Legend™
Has to be our original pick, #4.
Balco
Footballguy
Oof. Way to steep, considering you lose the # 4 and have to pay Wallace a huge contract. I think it's dumb the NFL won't let an NFL offer their choice of #1 if they have multiple first rounders.
MAC_32
Footballguy
Get that Kolb crap out of here too. At least Tannehill and Weeden have one thing Kolb doesn't have - a prayer. Still, don't want either and want us to build around what we already have. Flynn's the only available QB I'd be happy if we bright in.
Riversco
Footballguy
The only way Flynn goes to Cleveland is if they overpay him. Otherwise, there are many more attractive destinations like Arizona, Miami, Denver, etc. And if the Browns overpay him, that precludes them from drafting Barkley in 2013. So it screws the Browns over to sign Flynn because he's not worth it.'MAC_32 said:
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
y Since Barkley projects as the likely #1 in the 2013 draft, the Browns aren't likely to get him anyway. If Peyton goes to AZ or Denver as expected, the market for Flynn is essentially limited to 3 teams (MIA, CLEV, and either DEN or AZ). Perhaps the bidding won't be completely out of hand due to the limited market and the obvious risk involved with Flynn.
Riversco
Footballguy
The Browns schedule is horrendous. They will probably have the first pick.4. Cleveland Browns Home: Baltimore Ravens, Cincinnati Bengals, Pittsburgh Steelers, Kansas City Chiefs, San Diego Chargers, Buffalo Bills, Philadelphia Eagles, Washington RedskinsAway: Baltimore Ravens, Cincinnati Bengals, Pittsburgh Steelers, Denver Broncos, Oakland Raiders, Indianapolis Colts, Dallas Cowboys, New York GiantsHow many games do you see them winning? I think 2 is about right. They've got 3 winnable games: chiefs, bills, and Colts, and they probably will fail to sweep all 3.
Last edited by a moderator:
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
???They play the AFC West, the Colts and the Bills. Sure the NFC East is tough, but Cleveland's non-division schedule really isn't especially difficult by NFL standards.
Riversco
Footballguy
The Browns are a 4 win team with 3 playoff teams in their division, also playing the tough NFC east and other games 2000 miles from home. I don't know where the wins will come from.
cstu
Footballguy
No doubt it's a tough schedule but all of their home games are winnable (Broncos, Chiefs, Bills, Eagles and Redskins). Their road schedule (Raiders, Chargers, Colts, Cowboys and Giants) is far more difficult and they could only beat the Colts.
nxmehta
Footballguy
We're bad but we're not THAT bad dude. The Colts also have a very tough schedule and they just about dropped every good player on their team. Andrew Luck isn't magically going to turn them into a 10 win team. Also, the Rams SOS is very close to the Browns next year as well.It's been a long time since we've had the #1 overall. I seriously doubt it will happen next year. Every year there are a couple of surprise wins, the most obvious being NE/NO from two years ago. Like the previous poster said many of our home games are winnable.I see us picking around 4 again next year. If we want Barkley we'll have to trade up to get him. And to do that we'll need some ammo. That means we'll have to trade down this year and hope to net another #1 next year.
Last edited by a moderator:
cstu
Footballguy
I wish I had some catchy phrase for how the Browns should try to lose as many games as possible to get Barkley in the draft, but the best I got "Play like Biz Markie for Barkley".
nxmehta
Footballguy
Barf spree for Barkley?
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
Alternately they could try not to suck in every single game and draft Aaron Murray.
MAC_32
Footballguy
We won't overpay, so I fully expect us to leave free agency without a new QB on the roster. Our solution just better not be Tannehill or Weeden. I'm going to be irrate because then we'll be in the same spot next season Minnesota is in this season. Btw, I don't agree with you about the schedule, but I do agree about the win total...that has more to do with our inept coaching though.
Riversco
Footballguy
Oh, I definitely factor in the inept coaching in Cleveland as for why they won't overcome that schedule.
Fallerjw
Footballguy
What about bringing in Kyle Orton or Jason Campbell as a veteran, or are they going to keep Seneca Wallace around?
I'm fine giving Colt McCoy a shot, but only if we get some decent pieces around him.
Any chance we look at Nicks or Grubbs at guard or maybe Gaither or another tackle?
I'd love to pick up a couple of pieces during free agency so we don't have to try to fill so many positions in the draft.
I'm fine giving Colt McCoy a shot, but only if we get some decent pieces around him.
Any chance we look at Nicks or Grubbs at guard or maybe Gaither or another tackle?
I'd love to pick up a couple of pieces during free agency so we don't have to try to fill so many positions in the draft.
nxmehta
Footballguy
If we bring in a vet to replace Wallace, it would be most helpful if he knew the West Coast, which I don't think Orton and Campbell do. I anticipate we'll keep Wallace but bring in some younger competition.For guard, I think Nicks will cost way to much. I'd love to see Grubbs. Anthony Herrera is also an option, as is Steve Hutchinson because of his obvious connections to the Walrus. Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if we cut Steinbach for one of these guys. We're only $17 million under the cap which really surprised me- there are other, much better teams out there with WAY more space. For example the 49ers have around $20 million, and the freaking Bengals have almost $50 million. So Heckert might try to trim 1 or 2 really expensive players.
Last edited by a moderator:
