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wadegarrett

**** CLEVELAND BROWNS THREAD ****

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there’s a lot of truth to that, but this is also the same city that saw LeBron run the Cavs into the ground.  

not sure capitulating to Mayfield’s every whim is the right way to go about this?

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7 hours ago, beer 30 said:

long story short, Dorsey is the first person who had the balls to stand up to Haslam.  

as many of us suspected.  

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17 hours ago, amnesiac said:

long story short, Dorsey is the first person who had the balls to stand up to Haslam.  

as many of us suspected.  

Haslam's ineptitude is just as obvious.  He can't get out of his own way, which many Browns fans noted each season.  Every time he played a trump card over the GM and Coaches, it turned out bad.  JM is a prime example.  Then he turns around and decides he's meddling too much, and leaves an inept HC in place because he wants to rid himself of the "kneejerk reaction" tag he's created for himself.  He needs to lose the ego and selfishness, and just sit back and let the team he's built run this thing.  Dorsey is starting to show what he can do when given the reigns.  Haslam and Dee need to step back into the shadows and not be there for every decision.  The article reads like it's heading in that direction, but Haslam has a long way to go to show he can really step back and not interfere.

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The best thing that has happened with the organization is that the HC reports directly to the GM now and not to the owner.

That changes everything.

Jimmy's screw ups were rooted in his organizational chart where their was no buffer and it pitted the GM against the HC and that created chaos.

Dorsey saw the problem and fixed it.  Done.  No more Haslam meddling.  Lets roll.

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On 1/24/2019 at 8:41 AM, beer 30 said:

Other tidbit I found interesting, and a little telling, is that the HC Search Committee voted 4-1 against hiring Hue.  The one "Yes" vote came from Haslam himself, and as the owner, he got his way in the end.  I think how that scenario has played out since Hue was hired, and then fired, may have humbled Haslam a little bit.  This may be why we are seeing the change in reporting structure and letting Dorsey take the lead role for the team instead of Haslam.  Not only did he go against the people he sought out to help him make the HC hire, it also backfired in a very public manner that he will now have to live through until the team turns things around.  I know if I were in his shoes, I'd probably be a little more gun shy to make another leadership decision on my own anytime soon.

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On 1/26/2019 at 4:40 PM, The Man With No Name said:

ESPN Radio this morning - What team will be the next to win multiple Super Bowls, excluding Rams and Patriots?

Mel Kiper -

3. Seahawks

2. Browns

1. Chiefs

Seahawks?  meh. 

Chiefs?  maybe?  Reid’s record hasn’t been great lately.  

Browns?  can they make the playoffs first?

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February 04, 2019 | Tony Pauline

Quote

 

17 Cleveland Browns

  • Jeffery Simmons DT Mississippi State

Analysis: I may demand a mulligan on this pick, but a terrific source tells me the belief is that Brown general manager John Dorsey will select Simmons. I’ll have more on the Mississippi State defensive tackle Wednesday.

 

Nystrom: Mock Draft 1.0 Monday, February 4, 2019

Quote

 

17. Cleveland – Mississippi State DL Jeffery Simmons

I’m going to defer to a Monday report from my friend Tony Pauline, which stated that Browns GM John Dorsey is likely to select Simmons were he to fall to 1.17. That makes so much sense. In a deep iDL class, Simmons’ infamous assault video is the sort of thing that could cause him to lose close-calls during the on-the-clock decision-making process such as I referred to above with the Falcons pick. But Simmons was lauded at Mississippi State for the work he put in on and off the field, and by all accounts, he learned from his mistake and has turned out well. I’m a second-chance guy, myself. Simmons is one of the few human beings roaming this earth that knows what it’s like to be disdained for a two-minute slice of his 22 years on earth. At rock bottom, you choose to stay the course (recidivism) or tear down your egoic structures and rebuild yourself from the ground up (rebirth). Simmons has thus far chosen the latter path and if he keeps walking it he could become a fortified value-giver for the rest of his life. This isn’t the same situation, but note the differences in Ryan Leaf’s personality between after he got drafted by the Chargers and today. That’s hard-earned wisdom from a jail cell and the pit of the human experience, son. Today, Leaf is a person who changes lives as part of his outreach mission. This transformation is perceived as sort of unthinkable – but Leaf’s incredible interpersonal resurgence is not necessarily a unique phenomena. In fact, there are many Ryan Leafs roaming the earth right now. Nobody would ever choose to hit rock bottom, and yet there are riches down there for those courageous enough to kill off who they were for who they will become. I’m not saying that Simmons will become an inspirational human being and a dogged worker who reaches his athletic ceiling – but I am saying early returns are promising enough that I’d absolutely co-sign John Dorsey’s decision if he went this direction.

 

What happens with Jeffrey Simmons? The Mississippi State product is a legit top-10 prospect

Quote

What happens with Jeffrey Simmons? The Mississippi State product is a legit top-10 prospect. But as a high school senior he was caught on video punching a woman—and as a result wasn’t invited to Indy for the combine. In the time since, he became a star in the SEC and won over teammates and coaches, who’ve vouched for him to NFL teams. His case is not a simple one.

Simmons is an interesting case this year because he wasn't invited to the combine

Quote

 

9. Buffalo Bills - Jeffery Simmons, DT, Mississippi State

Simmons is an interesting case this year because he wasn't invited to the combine due to past violence allegations. The defensive tackle was caught on camera hitting a woman while in high school, but was subsequently allowed to enroll at Mississippi State and has worked to repair his image since. On tape, Simmons is a top-ten player in this class and has had no further issues with violence. Only one team has to give him a shot. - Alessandrini

 

Defensive tackle is the biggest need for the Browns

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On 1/28/2019 at 9:29 AM, amnesiac said:

Seahawks?  meh. 

Chiefs?  maybe?  Reid’s record hasn’t been great lately.  

Browns?  can they make the playoffs first?

By what standard has Reid not been good recently. Win their division three years in a row with double digit wins and he just lost in the AFCC. What is good recently?

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7 hours ago, Wise Old Owl said:

By what standard has Reid not been good recently. Win their division three years in a row with double digit wins and he just lost in the AFCC. What is good recently?

check his playoff record the last several years?

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9 hours ago, Wise Old Owl said:

By what standard has Reid not been good recently. Win their division three years in a row with double digit wins and he just lost in the AFCC. What is good recently?

also the post was about multiple Super Bowls. 

the only team on that list that has any in recent history is the Seahawks, who have one.  

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Pretty interesting article on the part Brian Hoyer played in the Pat's SB victory. Also, he was the only Patriot not to play in the game.

"Hoyer began his career in New England, but he got his first shot as a starter in Cleveland. In 2014, his second year there, he started 11 games for coordinator Kyle Shanahan, then played for Shanahan again in San Francisco in ’17. Rams coach Sean McVay coached tight ends for Mike and Kyle Shanahan in Washington from 2010-13, which led Hoyer to believe he’d have some institutional knowledge of McVay’s offense.

Before the Super Bowl, he watched an episode of Peyton Manning’s Detail series on ESPN-Plus on Goff, and it hit him right away—the offense is the same. Looking at the Rams tape confirmed it. Then, he saw an NFL Network interview where Goff and McVay discussed the coach being in the quarterback’s ear up until the 15-second play-clock cutoff, which was something Shanahan did with Hoyer. Then, Hoyer went back to Amazon’s All or Nothing series on the Rams; it was about the 2016 season but had footage of OTAs from McVay’s first spring there. Hoyer recognized the language.

“I guess that’s the risk in putting yourself out there like that,” Hoyer joked over the phone on Sunday."

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/02/11/super-bowl-devin-jason-mccourty-brian-hoyer-patriots-rams

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6 minutes ago, ex-ghost said:

Hunt to Browns?!?!!?

Yea just heard the news announced on 92.3 the Fan. $1 million for the deal.

Pretty sure I'm not in favor of it unless it was just to keep him off another roster.

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8 minutes ago, beer 30 said:

Pretty sure I'm not in favor of it unless it was just to keep him off another roster.

Obviously they won't come out and say that, so the statement doesn't prove anything....

https://twitter.com/Browns/status/1095034024014368768

....but I would say it's a major stretch to think we signed him to keep him off another team's roster.  

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This feels like a dumb move. This team is coming off a really positive season. All the experts like where they are headed, future is bright yadda yadda. Seems unnecessary for not only a RB but one that brings excessive baggage. Why risk the PR hit and all the noise the acquisition will bring with it :confused:

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7 minutes ago, Bobcat10 said:

Obviously they won't come out and say that, so the statement doesn't prove anything....

https://twitter.com/Browns/status/1095034024014368768

....but I would say it's a major stretch to think we signed him to keep him off another team's roster.  

An ancillary benefit then. More I think about it, if, BIG IF, he reverses course and pans out then I can see Johnson on the trading block. Duke is a fan favorite and a good player but he was a standout on teams (except last year) that were terrible. I'm not sure he would provide that same level of production or appear to on a top tier team. I don't think it's difficult to make a case that Hunt >>>> Johnson.

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4 minutes ago, beer 30 said:

An ancillary benefit then. More I think about it, if, BIG IF, he reverses course and pans out then I can see Johnson on the trading block. Duke is a fan favorite and a good player but he was a standout on teams (except last year) that were terrible. I'm not sure he would provide that same level of production or appear to on a top tier team. I don't think it's difficult to make a case that Hunt >>>> Johnson.

Assuming Hunt's suspended at least well into October I don't see how it impacts Duke at all.  The team isn't going to have any more info on Hunt when they have to make a decision on Duke at the trade deadline.  If Duke's playing well then you aren't going to move him.  If he's playing poorly then he won't have a market.  And if Hunt over takes Duke later in 2019 then he's probably going somewhere else in 2020.  If there's a 2019 trade deadline deal then if anything it's gotta be the team trading Hunt, no?

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I think 2019 will basically be status quo and ironing out the trio will happen next offseason.  Probably has more effect on the draft this year than anything else because I was thinking a mid draft RB was in play.

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I think that this is a PR nightmare but purely from a football and money standpoint, it is a pretty smart move.

You have to assume that they are risking nothing financially (in terms of salary to Hunt). If he never gets off the CE list, he prolly makes nothing. If he gets off the list, he will be on presumably a very short leash and the browns could easily get out from under any obligations if he slipped up.

Counter point to that;

The browns have Chubb on a rookie deal. They have some extra draft capital, 2 3rds and 3 5ths, and they have by far the most money to spend if they want to. They don't really "need" to try and bring issues like this in the locker room to save a few bucks.

I remember reading that under Kitchens the run game was featured a lot more, so maybe its primarily about getting an actually good football player at a possible discount at a position that gets hurt a lot. I don't know...

*edit

Well looking through the trade thread, Sigmund beat me to most of this, but still

Edited by Pwingles

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Aren't compensatory picks based on how big of a contract the guy you're losing signs for?

This could be Dorsey helping a guy out and also ending up with maybe a 3rd round pick to boot.

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6 minutes ago, Andy Dufresne said:

Aren't compensatory picks based on how big of a contract the guy you're losing signs for?

This could be Dorsey helping a guy out and also ending up with maybe a 3rd round pick to boot.

This may end up mattering, but I suspect Dorsey's spending will offset any losses via the comp pick.  Mainly because we aren't going to lose many guys to free agency in 2020.

The RFA tender angle is more likely, but given the quality of the 2020 class I'll be surprised if he gets any major bites.

Edited by MAC_32
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1 hour ago, Andy Dufresne said:

Aren't compensatory picks based on how big of a contract the guy you're losing signs for?

This could be Dorsey helping a guy out and also ending up with maybe a 3rd round pick to boot.

Somewhat. 

First Hunt will be a RFA and the Browns can tender him at a level that any team signing him would need to give them picks at the level of the RFA contract. This could be as high as the 2nd round level.

Then if Hunt is still with the team after the RFA year (2020) if Hunt signs as a free agent then this could lead to the Browns getting comp picks in return. This depends on if the Browns sign more free agents than they lose however.

They could also just trade him at some point if Chubb is playing so well that Hunt is expendable.

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This is too bizarre.

A day before we signed a RB facing domestic abuse charges a former Browns executive was 'allegedly' murdered by his wife who was trolling dating sites before his murder.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Wife of ex-Browns executive charged with his murder

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i’ve been trying to digest the Kareem Hunt signing. 

seems unnessary, and almost feels like a “i’m smarter than everyone else” move. 

hope he’s a model citizen and helps the team, but i have a feeling this will end poorly.  

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Seems brilliant to me.  Talented player at a cheap cost, and they don't have to rely on him because of the other talent already on the roster.  I mean, morally, kind of an awful statement to make, but it's always been that way.  If you can play you'll have a home. 

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On ‎2‎/‎11‎/‎2019 at 7:31 PM, Bracie Smathers said:

This is too bizarre.

A day before we signed a RB facing domestic abuse charges a former Browns executive was 'allegedly' murdered by his wife who was trolling dating sites before his murder.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Wife of ex-Browns executive charged with his murder

Lesson learned: If you feel a heart attack coming, drop that knife ASAP.

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On 2/12/2019 at 4:47 PM, amnesiac said:

hope he’s a model citizen and helps the team, but i have a feeling this will end poorly.  

I get that optics of the move look bad but lets be big boys here, somebody was going to sign him. I'm with you and hope the kid "gets it" but also like you I don't think he will.

With that said I think, from a Browns business decision, it's a great move. Signed arguably one of the top 5 RB's in the league for minimum money keeping him off of someone else's roster, you get him as a RFA and if things do go sideways, you bail on him having confidence he won't be back in the NFL again.

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17 minutes ago, beer 30 said:

With that said I think, from a Browns business decision, it's a great move. Signed arguably one of the top 5 RB's in the league for minimum money keeping him off of someone else's roster, you get him as a RFA and if things do go sideways, you bail on him having confidence he won't be back in the NFL again.

This is where I'm at right now.  It's a good business signing.  If he works out, that will be a dangerous backfield with Hunt and Chubb with Baker.  If it doesn't, nothing lost by the team with the minimal investment.  And if he doesn't want to return after the season, then there's a chance for a comp pick in the next draft.  It was a win/win situation in that regard.  Now the negative publicity that was bound to come with this is the main drawback.  However, this team has had its name drug through the mud so often, it wouldn't be an NFL off season if CLE wasn't in the news for something stupid.  Dorsey did it right by doing this now and then letting the fervor of FA and the Draft wash the news away over the next two months.

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Greg Robinson didn't allow a single sack last year and the Browns ran well in his direction. Is it possible that things "clicked" with him while everyone was comparing him to Tony Mandarich and other busts?

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1 hour ago, Bri said:

Greg Robinson didn't allow a single sack last year and the Browns ran well in his direction. Is it possible that things "clicked" with him while everyone was comparing him to Tony Mandarich and other busts?

Baker likes him.  To me, that means he and Baker have some chemistry -- Baker knows where he's going to be, who he's blocking how.  It's nice synergy!

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I love the Hunt signing.  I see no downside.  The PR potential downside is very minimal because if ANYTHING goes wrong with Hunt we just cut him.  

Obviously Dorsey knows Hunt well personally, and feels fairly confident he can keep it together for a while.

I have said it before, I root for a team who plays a game.  I dont know any of these people personally.  I would rather take 53 guys right out of prison and win a title than have 53 perfect saints and go 6-10. 

Now go trade for OBJ and let's have some fun.

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9 hours ago, ghostguy123 said:

I love the Hunt signing.  I see no downside.  The PR potential downside is very minimal because if ANYTHING goes wrong with Hunt we just cut him.  

Obviously Dorsey knows Hunt well personally, and feels fairly confident he can keep it together for a while.

I have said it before, I root for a team who plays a game.  I dont know any of these people personally.  I would rather take 53 guys right out of prison and win a title than have 53 perfect saints and go 6-10. 

Now go trade for OBJ and let's have some fun.

There is some downside, but IMO, it’s very minimal.  It seems like there is much more upside.  If Chubb doesn’t pan out & Himt does, win.  If Chubb plays great, you have a great backup, can trade Hunt, or can try to recoup some draft picks when you tender Hunt as a RFA.

Only real downside is if he is some kind of locker room issue, and I would hope Cle would be proactive if that’s the case.

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BREAKING NEWS

----------------------------

Scott Petrak ct‏ @ScottPetrak 2h2 hours ago

Can confirm VP of player personnel Andrew Berry has left #Browns for front office job with #Eagles. Was part of old Cleveland regime.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mary Kay Cabot‏Verified account @MaryKayCabot

#Browns Chief Strategy Office Paul DePodesta, also part of the Sashi Brown regime, is expected to stay in Cleveland even though Andrew Berry is leaving for a promotion with the #Eagles

6:36 AM - 25 Feb 2019

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3 hours ago, Bracie Smathers said:

BREAKING NEWS

----------------------------

Scott Petrak ct‏ @ScottPetrak 2h2 hours ago

Can confirm VP of player personnel Andrew Berry has left #Browns for front office job with #Eagles. Was part of old Cleveland regime.

Not too concerned with the Berry loss, as I think the kitchen was already a little too crowded with Hightower, Wolf, Dorsey.  Berry was the odd man out and it was a matter of time.

The loss that has me a little concerned is the loss of the Browns Cap guy, Brandon Sosna.  He went back to UC as a Director of Finance, or something like that....Who's the new guy now managing the cap and all this FA $$ the team needs to spend in March?

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Robinson will be protecting Baker's blindside for at least one more season.  Browns and Robinson agree on a 1 year deal for 2019.  Would've like to seen him sign longer term, but perhaps it's a "show us 2018 wasn't a fluke" kind of deal?  I keep hearing Harrison has talent, but would like for him to take more time learning - besides, Robinson seems to have resurrected his career in 2018.  Let's see if he's really got that 1st rnd talent, and if so, sign him long term.

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8 minutes ago, Peak said:

Robinson will be protecting Baker's blindside for at least one more season.  Browns and Robinson agree on a 1 year deal for 2019.  Would've like to seen him sign longer term, but perhaps it's a "show us 2018 wasn't a fluke" kind of deal?  I keep hearing Harrison has talent, but would like for him to take more time learning - besides, Robinson seems to have resurrected his career in 2018.  Let's see if he's really got that 1st rnd talent, and if so, sign him long term.

If Robinson thinks he can get that big contract then it makes sense for both sides to agree to a show-me one year deal.  He isn't going to get that deal based on what he did in a partial 2018.  It also gives Harrison a year to show how much he's developed.  Then the team can make a more informed decision on the position a year from now.

EDIT: and if it was a fluke then the team can wash their hands of him without penalty.

Edited by MAC_32
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Robinson is only 26. A #2 overall pick. If he works at it, he can command a huge new contract. Exactly what was his problem on the Rams? Forget the Lions stint, no one can protect Stafford adequately.

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All signs are pointing as this is Robinson betting on himself with the 1 year deal.  Read CLE offered him both a 1yr deal and 3yr deal.  GRob took the 1yr deal betting that he'll have another good year and try to cash in on that next year.  That's good to see, but CLE should also be looking at his replacement should he make good on that bet and jettison for the highest bidder next season.

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1 hour ago, Peak said:

All signs are pointing as this is Robinson betting on himself with the 1 year deal.  Read CLE offered him both a 1yr deal and 3yr deal.  GRob took the 1yr deal betting that he'll have another good year and try to cash in on that next year.  That's good to see, but CLE should also be looking at his replacement should he make good on that bet and jettison for the highest bidder next season.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe teams typically carry more than 8 OL.  Unless Hubbard gets whacked before March 15 we already have 7.  This strikes me as a case of sign someone(s) wave 2 for mostly non gtd $, take a shot on someone day 3 of the draft, knowing only one of them will see the roster Sep 1, then if none one of them are inspiring much confidence mine the scrap heap like last season and post Sep 1 cuts then see if you can uncover another Robinson.  If somebody falls that shouldn't then by all means draft a BPA, but given the state of offensive tackles throughout the league I feel comfortable saying that won't happen.  I think this position only becomes any sorta priority if Hubbard gets cut before his gtd kicks in.  

This offseason's priorities will probably be on the other side of the ball, especially in March.  I'm curious how much of our resources are devoted to WR and TE though.  I think those banging the table for a big move in March will be disappointed, but maybe there are potential trades I haven't considered.  I think one or two acquisitions in the first 120 picks or so in April are most likely.

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6 hours ago, Peak said:

All signs are pointing as this is Robinson betting on himself with the 1 year deal.  Read CLE offered him both a 1yr deal and 3yr deal.  GRob took the 1yr deal betting that he'll have another good year and try to cash in on that next year.  That's good to see, but CLE should also be looking at his replacement should he make good on that bet and jettison for the highest bidder next season.

Heard some numbers this afternoon, $7.4m guaranteed with a shot at $9m with incentives. What's a typical LT make in the league? Not a position I typically follow when it comes to $$$. And really, who the #### cares? Browns have $ to burn right now, hope it works out. Seems like he developed a nice rapport with Mayfield last year.

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Some impressive stuff coming out of the combine this weekend. 40 times are insane these days. You got a DL running a 40 faster than Odell Beckham did? C'mon man!

Just want to go on record and say I want nothing to do with DK Metcalf, think he's fools good. Reminds me a lot of Vernon Davis. Rather focus on defense.

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DK has a place - it's just not early round 1.  He could be a great role player, but barring quantitative changes if he's asked to be the guy then he'll probably fail.

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2 minutes ago, beer 30 said:

Just want to go on record and say I want nothing to do with DK Metcalf, think he's fools good. Reminds me a lot of Vernon Davis. Rather focus on defense.

He reminds me a lot of David Boston.  Plus his lateral moves/times were SSSSSLLLLOOOOOOWWWWWWW.  Really surprised by that coming from a WR.

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2 minutes ago, beer 30 said:

I want nothing to do with DK Metcalf,

Ole Miss WR D.K. Metcalf finished with a bottom-two percentile score in the 3-cone drill.

Metcalf (6'3/228) absolutely smashed the NFL Combine still after running a 4.33 40-yard dash at 228 pounds, but we can't ignore the terrible agility numbers here. Even at yesterday's press conference, Metcalf said that the Washington Redskins' staff said that he has to get better getting out of his breaks, which is something the 3-cone drill would measure. With elite straight-line speed and horrendous agility, Metcalf's athletic profile is wild, but there are routes where Metcalf will have corners shaking in fear. Let's hope that Metcalf lands on a team that will give him a chance to join the elites.

-------------------------------------------------------------

Matt Miller‏Verified account @nfldraftscout

As much as we talked about DK Metcalf's amazing 40, vert and weigh-in we also have to talk about his fail level short shuttle and 3-cone. A frame that big and that tight cannot bend or change direction--which is an important part of playing wide receiver.

5:47 AM - 3 Mar 2019

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