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**** CLEVELAND BROWNS THREAD ****

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I just learned “Lighten up, Francis” is from Stripes.  

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10 hours ago, amnesiac said:

I just learned “Lighten up, Francis” is from Stripes.  

Sgt Hulka! Our big toe.

Edited by DallasDMac
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4 hours ago, DallasDMac said:

Sgt Hulka! Our big toe.

Great movie for the first 3/4. John Candy kills.   Hate the last 15 or 20 minutes.  

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26 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

Great movie for the first 3/4. John Candy kills.   Hate the last 15 or 20 minutes.  

how convenient, I fell asleep with about 20 minutes left!

 

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16 hours ago, amnesiac said:

I just learned “Lighten up, Francis” is from Stripes.  

First day on Earth?

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4 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

First day on Earth?

lol, no just never made it past the first 15 minutes. 

 

“You can’t leave!  All the plants are gonna die!!”

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On 9/12/2019 at 10:58 AM, Bracie Smathers said:

Armando Salguero‏Verified account @ArmandoSalguero

Adam Gase just announced to NY media QB Sam Darnold will miss Monday's game with mono and will be out several weeks.

7:33 AM - 12 Sep 2019

------------------------------------

Manish Mehta‏Verified account @MMehtaNYDN

Le’Veon Bell will get a MRI today for his sore shoulder today. Gase seems optimistic

7:36 AM - 12 Sep 2019

C.J. Mosley, Quinnen Williams out for the Jets on Monday night  

Quote

 

The Jets will play on Monday night without a pair of high-profile offseason acquisitions.

Linebacker C.J. Mosley (groin) and defensive tackle Quinnen Williams (ankle) are out for the primetime game against the Browns. Mosley arrived via free-agency with a big-money contract. Williams was the third overall pick in the draft.

They join quarterback Sam Darnold, who is out with mono.

Mosley was having a great debut for the Jets before exiting with his injury. Perhaps not coincidentally, the Jets eventually imploded without him.

Seven Jets are questionable, including running back Le'Veon Bell (shoulder). Bell was limited in practice all week. 

 

 

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19 hours ago, DocHolliday said:

Great movie for the first 3/4. John Candy kills.   Hate the last 15 or 20 minutes.  

It goes completely downhill once they get to Europe. It’s like they wrote and filmed a movie, then realized it was too short and made up a last act on the spot.

Edited by Pip's Invitation
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page 5??

we’re on MNF tonight guys!

oh also I’m making wings on the charcoal grill for the first time tonight.  wish me luck.  

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1 hour ago, texasheat said:

With Higgins OUT tonight, who takes his place?  Ratley, Taylor, Thomas??

I’d have said Ratley pregame as he got 30+ snaps last week.

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missed the first quarter, but the wings turned out pretty damn good.  

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need to get their act together, and fast. 

it's all there. penalty calls dropped big time yesterday, aside from myles taking 2 uglies... now pound the rock 20-25 a game and the pass game will open wide.

end of.

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The day after a 20 point win and I am...frustrated? What the hell.

 

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13 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

The day after a 20 point win and I am...frustrated? What the hell.

 

both teams looked bad.  

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We beat the Jets second team.  Felt like we were one play away from losing most of the game.  Baker missed a lot of open throws and did not look comfortable.  Should have had more screen passes/check downs.  Still had stupid penalties.  I dont have very high hopes for this team this year.

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26 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

The day after a 20 point win and I am...frustrated? What the hell.

Jets homer here, but I have Mayfield and Landry in one league that I like. I didn't come to talk smack, just earnestness. It wasn't pretty. It was an ugly win, if a win can be ugly. As Random points out, Baker did not look comfortable. Then again, the Jets are a professional team with pretty good coaching, however you feel about their DC and his mouth and the HC's attitude and "genius" moniker.

They're not poorly coached, is all I'm saying. Not that they're long for NY with a GM who didn't hire them, but that's for another day...

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I think both Gase and Gregggg are quite terrible. The former thinks horizontal passing wins and the latter does not cover the middle of the field. There's more, but those are their biggest problems. 

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3 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

I think both Gase and Gregggg are quite terrible. The former thinks horizontal passing wins and the latter does not cover the middle of the field. There's more, but those are their biggest problems. 

I didn't say I particularly agreed with their philosophy, but I think it's less stark than you think.

Freddie Kitchens is nothing to write home about, but that'll suss itself in the six-week wash. You'll see. 

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9 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I didn't say I particularly agreed with their philosophy, but I think it's less stark than you think.

Freddie Kitchens is nothing to write home about, but that'll suss itself in the six-week wash. You'll see. 

The OBJ TD was textbook Gregggg. Forget to cover the best player on the field, have no one in the middle of the field, and have the Free 20+ yards off the line. He's awful.

There were aspects of Freddie of being coach that concerned me, but what's happened the first two weeks has caught me completely by surprise. It's like he completely forgot what worked with Baker last year. Is that why Baker is clearly not comfortable back there? or is there more to it? I dunno, but they have a short week to figure it out and I have no reason to believe they will.

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4 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

The OBJ TD was textbook Gregggg. Forget to cover the best player on the field, have no one in the middle of the field, and have the Free 20+ yards off the line. He's awful.

Agreed. Terrible not to rotate help to prove a point and play cover zero.

That's how you lose quickly, and they did. (And so I lost my fantasy contest still going.)

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8 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

The OBJ TD was textbook Gregggg. Forget to cover the best player on the field, have no one in the middle of the field, and have the Free 20+ yards off the line. He's awful.

PIC - FS Marcus Maye was lined up 20-yards(!) off the line of scrimmage:

Graham Barfield‏Verified account @GrahamBarfield

The Jets really left OBJ uncovered out of the slot on that 89-yard score. FS Marcus Maye was lined up 20-yards(!) off the line of scrimmage:

8:27 PM - 16 Sep 2019

-----------------------------------

It had to be a blown coverage but the deep safety takes himself out of any ability to cover the mistake when  Greg lines him this far back off the LOS.

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That's what we were for, what, almost 20 years in a row?  Gimme the road win all day long and let's move on.  I think we'll progress in general, not regress.  

Avery - now it's a pattern

Freddie - calling passes inside the 2-min warning up 20?  Feels like he's trying to get them to work out the kinks (for much of the 4th quarter actually) rather than being an idiot coach like most probably think.  Still, I don't agree with it.

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1 minute ago, Bobcat10 said:

Freddie - calling passes inside the 2-min warning up 20?  Feels like he's trying to get them to work out the kinks (for much of the 4th quarter actually) rather than being an idiot coach like most probably think.

Sorry about last night.

I actually thought it was indeed this. Not being macho like some said, but working out offensive kinks. Still unwise, IMHO. 

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1 hour ago, Random said:

Felt like we were one play away from losing most of the game. 

Never felt that way at all.  Interesting.  

1 hour ago, Random said:

Still had stupid penalties.

Much cleaner game from my perspective.  

1 hour ago, Random said:

I dont have very high hopes for this team this year.

Did you have lofty semi-unrealistic expectations to begin with?  Many people did.  And that's ok.

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17 minutes ago, rockaction said:

Sorry about last night.

I actually thought it was indeed this. Not being macho like some said, but working out offensive kinks. Still unwise, IMHO. 

:thumbup:

Honestly I'm pretty sure you misinterpreted my post.  I was only referring to the play itself (all the Myles should be suspended and similar posts), not the injury.  I don't root for or mock serious injuries.  

 

The macho stuff is headliner stuff.  Talking/Argument points.  I don't think Freddie does things to be macho.  I'll need to see more of this to start questioning him.

Edited by Bobcat10
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Siebert and the Hammer looked great.  Gotta give props there.  

Vernon has kind of been invisible to me.  Kirksey too....I wonder if he's losing snaps.  Need to look at the logs.  

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The team looked.....good.  But something was still off.  Not sure I can put my finger on it.  The moxy of last year isn't there?  The reckless abandon?  There were some good plays.  There were some bonehead mistakes.  They won, but it didn't feel the same.  I can't put my thumb on it better than that, I guess.  The missing moxy...the "always feel like you're playing from behind" mentality this team had last year.  I haven't seen it yet in 2019.  I don't know.  Thats the best I can verbalize it right now.  

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5 minutes ago, Peak said:

The team looked.....good.  But something was still off.  Not sure I can put my finger on it.  The moxy of last year isn't there?  The reckless abandon?  There were some good plays.  There were some bonehead mistakes.  They won, but it didn't feel the same.  I can't put my thumb on it better than that, I guess.  The missing moxy...the "always feel like you're playing from behind" mentality this team had last year.  I haven't seen it yet in 2019.  I don't know.  Thats the best I can verbalize it right now.  

There's a disconnect between Freddie, Monken, and Baker. The opening script has been fine, but they didn't have penalties to fall back on this week once out of the script.

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2 minutes ago, Peak said:

The team looked.....good.  But something was still off.  Not sure I can put my finger on it.

DCs are really trying, and succeeding, in fooling Baker by making him do multiple reads before the snap and then changing coverage once the play beings where he's got to make reads on the fly and he's been facing pressure so he can't set his feet and move-up in the pocket like he did last year.  They are pressuring him up the middle, forcing him to move laterally and also changing from man to zone or zone to man.

OK, well its a duel-edged sword because with the defense shifting and moving and moving on the snap it not only causing confusion to the offense it opens up more potential for blown coverage like we saw on the OBJ busted coverage where, oops no-one was covering him and the S was lined up in G-Will town twenty yards off the LOS.  

That is the price DCs will pay for all of that movement and once things slow down for Baker and 'if' we get better protection and once the chemistry alchemates with the WRs the offense can start humming.

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38 minutes ago, Soulfly3 said:

20-25 carries a game. Or this will be a long ### season

Quantity of carries isn't the answer. Timing and choice of formation, those would be. As would not robot yanking him off the field on 3rd down.

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Just now, Bracie Smathers said:

DCs are really trying, and succeeding, in fooling Baker by making him do multiple reads before the snap and then changing coverage once the play beings where he's got to make reads on the fly and he's been facing pressure so he can't set his feet and move-up in the pocket like he did last year.  They are pressuring him up the middle, forcing him to move laterally and also changing from man to zone or zone to man.

OK, well its a duel-edged sword because with the defense shifting and moving and moving on the snap it not only causing confusion to the offense it opens up more potential for blown coverage like we saw on the OBJ busted coverage where, oops no-one was covering him and the S was lined up in G-Will town twenty yards off the LOS.  

That is the price DCs will pay for all of that movement and once things slow down for Baker and 'if' we get better protection and once the chemistry alchemates with the WRs the offense can start humming.

I'm curious if a second watch will yield something different, but I don't think this was the case at all last night and I think he was more at fault week 1 than the OL. I think more TE's and less 5th string WR's would help though.

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Last thing.  Can't believe I forgot to mention it as I noticed it happening all game long and it was my most important take away from the game.

We're taking WAY too long between plays getting back up to the LOS.  Pre-snap reads are being rushed or nonexistent on too many plays.  I don't know what the bottleneck is at the moment, but that must be fixed ASAP, probably more than anything else if you want to see some offensive fluidity like we saw last year.

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1 minute ago, Bobcat10 said:

Last thing.  Can't believe I forgot to mention it as I noticed it happening all game long and it was my most important take away from the game.

We're taking WAY too long between plays getting back up to the LOS.  Pre-snap reads are being rushed or nonexistent on too many plays.  I don't know what the bottleneck is at the moment, but that must be fixed ASAP, probably more than anything else if you want to see some offensive fluidity like we saw last year.

That's contributing to my disconnect perception.

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3 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

I'm curious if a second watch will yield something different, but I don't think this was the case at all last night and I think he was more at fault week 1 than the OL. I think more TE's and less 5th string WR's would help though.

12 personnel usage is way down from last year I believe and Baker was deadly in that last season.

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Just now, MAC_32 said:

I'm curious if a second watch will yield something different, but I don't think this was the case at all last night and I think he was more at fault week 1 than the OL. I think more TE's and less 5th string WR's would help though.

Unfortunately we cut our only legit in-line TE, the guys we are 'not-good' at blocking.  Njoku is our best receiving TE and he's in concussion protocol.  The guy Dorsey got from KC has struggled according to reports and the other guys seem like JAGs at this point even if they 'flashed' in preseason.

Chubb gets yanked in obvious passing situations, well because he's not great catching the ball and he's not good in pass-pro.  People don't like to hear it because he's such a great runner and 'occasionally' makes a play in the passing game but their is a reason why he gets yanked.

The timing is Baker making multiple reads.  Go back and look.  He gets up to the LOS and he's looking, and looking, and looking, while the clock burns.  I'm screaming for him to snap the ball but DCs are doing a good job of confusing him.  He needs time in the pocket to make reads on the fly but I think things will slow down for him even if he's constantly on the run this year.

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2 hours ago, Bobcat10 said:

Never felt that way at all.  Interesting.  

Much cleaner game from my perspective.  

Did you have lofty semi-unrealistic expectations to begin with?  Many people did.  And that's ok.

Not sure it could have been worse, so in that regards, I agree.  But they still looked worse than the second half of last year.

Yes.  Maybe.  I was hopeful for 9 wins.  Now thinking maybe 5?

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On 9/17/2019 at 11:54 AM, Random said:

I was hopeful for 9 wins.  Now thinking maybe 5?

Still think 9 is a fair number for this team. Think they are still gelling from the abbreviated pre-season snaps they took together so every game I'm looking for improvements. There were certainly some this week, never as much as you would like but a 20 point MNF road win is a 20 point MNF road win! Yes we played their second string, yes I never got the dominate feeling a 20 point victory should fill you with but regardless it's a win and no major injuries.

What's troubling are the penalties but I think they will work themselves out. I don't remember any drive killers this week so :thumbup: There's nothing that takes the air out of the balloon quicker than a stupid penalty on long drive. Baker's flying the ball...lot of contributing things that could be causing that but he needs to settle in the pocket or learn to throw on the move again because he's sailing a lot of balls. As was eluded to, Baker having to make multiple reads in the pocket. I think that will come but you could tell he was uncomfortable in the pocket Monday. They are going to have to establish the run this week, quit going away from it when it's working. And probably the #1 thing I noticed is for all the complaining we've done over the years about check down QB's, I'm hoping Baker remembers he has an underneath option on about every play and doesn't need to go downfield all the time.

Good win, needed win, still plenty to work on and improve but heading in the right direction. Would love to see a close, hard fought game this Sunday with it coming down to Seibert nailing a 53 yarder as the clock expires for the win.

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Now that I've had a day to clear my head...I think we need to come out Sunday in no-huddle.

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2 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

Now that I've had a day to clear my head...I think we need to come out Sunday in no-huddle.

As someone who rosters Mayfield, I urge you guys to do so.

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1 hour ago, MAC_32 said:

Now that I've had a day to clear my head...I think we need to come out Sunday in no-huddle.

I like love this idea.  No huddle.  Go back to the 12 set they used last year.  The more comfortable and familiar, the better.  Quick strikes and runs.  Put the Rams on their heels.  You know they'll be looking at the last few weeks and preparing for that version of this team.  Come out and hit them in the jaw with last year's version.

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they're going to get the ball out of baker's hands MUCH quicker going forward.

whether that is no huddle, or just more slants... the ball will come out much quicker, which should open things up for chubb

i know i sound like a broken record, but this offense needs to center around him running the ball. he is THAT good

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Hubbard is in a walking boot. Can we pull the trigger on TWilliams now? Pretty please??

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Couple of points:

Jim Miller on Sirius said that Baker's footwork is way off from last year. He's overstriding, and pointing his lead foot towards the sideline, which is making him throw way off target. Why? Well... Pat Kirwan ran the numbers: during Baker's epic 7-game stretch to end the season last year, he was sack 3 times on 224 dropbacks. 1 sack for every 75 drop backs. That's insane. So far this year- 1 sack every 10 dropbacks. He got murdered week 1 against the Titans, and now he's pressing to get rid of the ball.

2nd: I don't know much about Monken, but apparently this love affair with the deep ball has his fingerprints all over it. Freddie is still calling the plays, but apparently what we're seeing shows a ton of Monken philosophy.

I actually think we'll look a lot better once Hilliard comes back. Baker seemed to really trust him last year, and with the focus on OBJ/Landry, Hilliard should get plenty of opportunities if Baker actually has time to look around.

Last: Chubb has something like 42-43 touches in the first two games. That's the right amount. The problem is the sequence. There's just no flow to the offense right now.

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17 minutes ago, Tecumseh said:

2nd: I don't know much about Monken, but apparently this love affair with the deep ball has his fingerprints all over it. Freddie is still calling the plays, but apparently what we're seeing shows a ton of Monken philosophy.

I was wondering why it looked like Air Coryell out there. Lots of long-developing routes, which ties into the pass protection and mechanics you talked about in your other points.

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i still believe in Mayfield long term. 

i think the offense has been a combination of a lot of things and it worries me a bit that Kitchens has let it happen, but there is still time for them to fix it.  

they will need a great effort by the defense to keep it a low scoring game to have a chance. 

the line should be much higher than three, but i hope i’m wrong about that.  

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3 hours ago, Tecumseh said:

Hubbard is in a walking boot. Can we pull the trigger on TWilliams now? Pretty please??

Adding OL in season wont fix anything. The most important aspect of an OL is cohesiveness and chemistry. It takes time to develop. Let this group develop. It's been fine the first two weeks. Not good, but fine. Hopefully it gets better. 

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10 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

Adding OL in season wont fix anything. The most important aspect of an OL is cohesiveness and chemistry. It takes time to develop. Let this group develop. It's been fine the first two weeks. Not good, but fine. Hopefully it gets better. 

disagree.  they plugged in Robinson last year and instantly got better.  

and the line has not been fine.  

the line is not the only problem, but it’s one of them. 

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Just now, amnesiac said:

disagree.  they plugged in Robinson last year and instantly got better.  

and the line has not been fine.  

the line is not the only problem, but it’s one of them. 

Then go find a Robinson. Dont use a 1 plus on a Williams. In season bandaids can work, but they're not optimal. Building with what you have is the play. And what we currently have is fine. 

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