Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
wadegarrett

**** CLEVELAND BROWNS THREAD ****

Recommended Posts

22 minutes ago, DallasDMac said:

Because I find it hard to support a team that has been so horrible for so long, that has been the punchline for jokes for so long, that finally looks like maybe they are turning a corner, be right back in the news for all the wrong reasons. And this one is egregious. This wasn't some fight or minor infraction. This is basically an unseen-until-now level of total buffoonery. It's  all there is on every news station everywhere. I can't turn on any single news program without seeing it. When you can't wear a piece of team's gear without people snickering, then something is wrong. It's an institutional problem.

The two teams meet again in a couple of weeks, and there's a lot they can do to put this to rest.  I think both coaches don't want this to escalate and will be all over their guys between now and then.  In fact, here's video of Tomlin addressing his players: Be Nice (contains some bad words)

  • Laughing 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Peak said:

Do you think they let up just becuase they were down by 2 scores with less than 2mins to play?  Nope.

 

Ummm yes.  It happens all the time, as it should.   This was 8 seconds.  It wasnt even possible for the Steelers to win.  Literally not possible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Bobcat10 said:

I thought instigation is now a suspendible act? 

He did not instigate to the level where it would be suspension worthy.  At all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, ghostguy123 said:

Ummm yes.  It happens all the time, as it should.   This was 8 seconds.  It wasnt even possible for the Steelers to win.  Literally not possible.

Then why did Tomlin have his offense out there trying to throw deep?  Why didn't Rudolph just take the knee and give up?  These guys play the game from whistle to whistle.  It was literally not possible for the Steelers to win on their previous drive with 2mins left.  Why didn't they take a knee there?

You make no sense?  Why even play the game if they're just going to say "Damn...I give up.  You win." with time left on the clock.  They were playing the game.  Both sides.  Offense and Defense.  Had the QB took a knee and Tomlin threw in the towel (as you are suggesting), we wouldn't be talking about any of this right now.  SMH

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, ghostguy123 said:

He did not instigate to the level where it would be suspension worthy.  At all.

I could certainly get behind this if there were not 2-3 threatening behaviors prior to the helmet swing/contact. Unfortunately that’s not the case and I’d be ignoring important factors in the situation. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, ghostguy123 said:

He did not instigate to the level where it would be suspension worthy.  At all.

So you're saying Rudolph didn't:

- React like an over-emotionally (some have said Petulant) child to a legal hit/tackle after having a crappy 4 INT game?

- Grabbed Myles' helmet first - was the aggressor and instigator of the whole sha-bang?

- Kicked Myles in the groin during initial scuffle while grabbing and twisting Garrett's helmet?

- Continued to attack Myles once they were separated by the DeCastro and other players?

These fellows don't agree with that idea:

Deion SandersMason Rudolph should be significantly fined as well for trying to rip @MylesLGarrett helmet off his head which ignited the retaliation. He's not without fault in the unfortunate matter. This is a physical,emotional game played by men. Let's not forget that. @nflnetwork  #Truth

Nate Burleson: That @steelers & @Browns fight was a wild scene but it could of been avoided! and since everybody wants to play the blame game, here’s my list of individuals that are at fault. @MylesLGarrett @MaurkicePouncey @Rudolph2Mason What are y’all thoughts?

Max Kellerman: [Mason Rudolph was the one who started the fight." @maxkellerman thinks the reaction to Myles Garrett has been "hysterical."

By no way am I condoning what Myles did, and I think his suspension is warranted.  But let's not act like Rudolph was innocently crying on his knees praying for mercy when big, bad Myles came calling with a lead-filled helmet attempting to strike down upon him with great vengeance and furious anger.

:loco:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Peak said:

Then why did Tomlin have his offense out there trying to throw deep?  Why didn't Rudolph just take the knee and give up?  These guys play the game from whistle to whistle.  It was literally not possible for the Steelers to win on their previous drive with 2mins left.  Why didn't they take a knee there?

You make no sense?  Why even play the game if they're just going to say "Damn...I give up.  You win." with time left on the clock.  They were playing the game.  Both sides.  Offense and Defense.  Had the QB took a knee and Tomlin threw in the towel (as you are suggesting), we wouldn't be talking about any of this right now.  SMH

If you dont see the difference between 2 minutes left and 15 seconds left I dont know what to tell you, other than to look up the definition of "literally".

They actually did take a knee on the very next play in case you missed that.

Edited by ghostguy123

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, ghostguy123 said:

I never said Rudolph wasnt at fault.  I said he shouldnt be suspended.  

So attempting to remove a player's helmet isn't suspension worthy?  I'd refer you to the Courtland Finnegan fight from a few years ago.  Let me know how that turned out.

Also, I'm pretty sure cleating someone in the groin is a suspension worthy offense.  What's different from doing that and stomping on another player?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, ghostguy123 said:

If you dont see the difference between 2 minutes left and 15 seconds left I dont know what to tell you, other than to look up the definition of "literally".

Let me ask it a different way, if the offense lines up to make a play with 15 seconds left, is it your thought that the defense should just stand around with their hands on their hips saying, "Go for it.  We already won.  Go get that TD, Rudy!"

Seriously?!?

I'm trying to understand where you're coming from, but it just doesn't make any sense.  I have never seen Pittsburgh take a knee and concede a game.  I've also never seen a defense not line up, even if/when the offense lines up to take a knee.  They are playing a game.  It goes until the final whistle.  What exactly would you expect them to do differently?  Obviously the scuffle shouldn't have happened, but you were talking the actual game play specifically.  I really don't see where you're coming from, and I'm sure I'm not the only one reading this thread who feels/thinks the same way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This team has no discipline. They took a chance on Kitchens for some reason and it isn't working out. He's in over his head. Embarrassing organization. The only bright spot was Mayfield rightfully calling out Garrett last night. Finally some maturity from somebody on this team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Peak said:

So you're saying Rudolph didn't:

He did nothing suspension worthy, and it doesn't make sense to suspend him because of how Garrett responded.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, ghostguy123 said:

I never said Rudolph wasnt at fault.  I said he shouldnt be suspended.  

Steeler plant is what you are.

  • Laughing 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, Peak said:

Let me ask it a different way, if the offense lines up to make a play with 15 seconds left, is it your thought that the defense should just stand around with their hands on their hips saying, "Go for it.  We already won.  Go get that TD, Rudy!"

Seriously?!?

I'm trying to understand where you're coming from, but it just doesn't make any sense.  I have never seen Pittsburgh take a knee and concede a game.  I've also never seen a defense not line up, even if/when the offense lines up to take a knee.  They are playing a game.  It goes until the final whistle.  What exactly would you expect them to do differently?  Obviously the scuffle shouldn't have happened, but you were talking the actual game play specifically.  I really don't see where you're coming from, and I'm sure I'm not the only one reading this thread who feels/thinks the same way.

Ever watch the pro bowl?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, Bobcat10 said:

I could certainly get behind this if there were not 2-3 threatening behaviors prior to the helmet swing/contact. Unfortunately that’s not the case and I’d be ignoring important factors in the situation. 

 

6 minutes ago, beer 30 said:

Steeler plant is what you are.

 

2 minutes ago, Peak said:

I do not understand why this is the battle you all are picking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, ghostguy123 said:

Ever watch the pro bowl?

Cmon...now you're just moving goalposts.  You're going to compare a glorified game of 2-hand touch to a regular season game?  One doesn't matter to the players at all, while the other means everything to them and their goals.  SMH

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, MAC_32 said:

 

 

I do not understand why this is the battle you all are picking.

Me....I'm bored at work and have another hour to kill.   :lmao:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is this the new Zapruder film? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Peak said:

Cmon...now you're just moving goalposts.  You're going to compare a glorified game of 2-hand touch to a regular season game?  One doesn't matter to the players at all, while the other means everything to them and their goals.  SMH

I am saying garrett doesnt need to (as in shouldnt)go balls to the wall with 10 seconds left up 14 when there isnt even enough time left on the clock for the Steelers to win even if the Browns tried to let them win.  

Not sure why you arent comprehending this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Concept Coop said:

The still are misleading. Here's the video.  Rudolph is clearly just scrambling to get Garrett off of him while Garrett is reaching for and eventually ripping his helmet off. Rudolph didn't intentionally punch or kick Garrett.

Seen the video.  Multiple times.  Yep. His helmet wrenching on Garrett was all just him trying to move.  His kicking Garrett all while the olinemen was pulling him off was him trying to move away.  Rudolph was in such a hurry to get away from Garrett that he rushed back at him, not once but twice, after he was free of that monster's wrath.  Gotcha.  Ok.

  • Laughing 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, ghostguy123 said:

I am saying garrett doesnt need to (as in shouldnt)go balls to the wall with 10 seconds left up 14 when there isnt even enough time left on the clock for the Steelers to win even if the Browns tried to let them win.  

Not sure why you arent comprehending this.

Because I don't see why any NFL player wouldn't line up and do his job with 10 seconds left up 14.  Every Dlineman was rushing.  Garrett just got there first.  But it sounds like you would've rather seen them just stand up and play patty-cake with DeCastro and Pouncey instead of doing their job - which is to rush the QB.  :loco:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Peak said:

Seen the video.  Multiple times.  Yep. His helmet wrenching on Garrett was all just him trying to move.  His kicking Garrett all while the olinemen was pulling him off was him trying to move away.  Rudolph was in such a hurry to get away from Garrett that he rushed back at him, not once but twice, after he was free of that monster's wrath.  Gotcha.  Ok.

Misrepresenting arguments is easy but unproductive and makes you look bad.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Peak said:

Because I don't see why any NFL player wouldn't line up and do his job with 10 seconds left up 14.  Every Dlineman was rushing.  Garrett just got there first.  But it sounds like you would've rather seen them just stand up and play patty-cake with DeCastro and Pouncey instead of doing their job - which is to rush the QB.  :loco:

Yes I would have.  Rather not see an injury or a fight on the last play of two of a heated rivalry game.  

Well guess what happened......

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Concept Coop said:

Misrepresenting arguments is easy but unproductive and makes you look bad.

Then why do you continue to do it?  Not just in this thread, but in the Garrett thread?  I'm not the only one who's called you out on it.  But a Steelers fan is going to stick up for their only QB, I guess.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, Concept Coop said:

The still are misleading. Here's the video.  Rudolph is clearly just scrambling to get Garrett off of him while Garrett is reaching for and eventually ripping his helmet off. Rudolph didn't intentionally punch or kick Garrett.

Wrong angle to even make that claim...  you are looking at it with blinders on... 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, Peak said:

Then why do you continue to do it?  Not just in this thread, but in the Garrett thread?  I'm not the only one who's called you out on it.  But a Steelers fan is going to stick up for their only QB, I guess.

Now you're just lying. And I'm not a Steelers fan.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Concept Coop said:

The still are misleading. Here's the video.  Rudolph is clearly just scrambling to get Garrett off of him while Garrett is reaching for and eventually ripping his helmet off. Rudolph didn't intentionally punch or kick Garrett.

why can’t they both be wrong?

 

with Garrett being wrong-er?

 

simple enough, no?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, amnesiac said:

why can’t they both be wrong?

 

with Garrett being wrong-er?

 

simple enough, no?

Sure; I believe I said as much.

Edit: Sorry, I'm having this conversation in two threads. In the other I said that both guys overreacted, but only one did anything worthy of a suspension.

Edited by Concept Coop

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Concept Coop said:

Sure; I believe I said as much.

Edit: Sorry, I'm having this conversation in two threads. In the other I said that both guys overreacted, but only one did anything worthy of a suspension.

all good, just wanted to clarify. 
 

the Browns fans in here are having the same discussion; does what Rudolph did rise to the level of suspension?  it’s certainly debatable.  
 

i think most fans believe both were at fault, and Garrett definitely went too far.  

as far as the suspensions, that’s up to the NFL, so at the end of the day, it doesn’t really matter what we all think.  
 

have a good one. 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Peak said:

Then why do you continue to do it?  Not just in this thread, but in the Garrett thread?  I'm not the only one who's called you out on it.  But a Steelers fan is going to stick up for their only QB, I guess.

He's a Cowboys fan.  Just stop.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, MAC_32 said:

I do not understand why this is the battle you all are picking.

I’m confused at why it seems so difficult  for people to wrap their heads around *why* people might think Mason should have been suspended. His actions during the melee and post game words are pretty clear. I understand what you and ghost have said, which is nothing more than an opinion on the matter (like mine), and I don’t agree. Now we’re picking battles? 

You do understand I think Myles got what he deserved? There’s not really much left to flush out there, I’m already tired of it. 

Edited by Bobcat10

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Bobcat10 said:

I’m confused at why it seems so difficult  for people to wrap their heads around *why* people might think Mason should have been suspended. His actions during the melee and post game words are pretty clear. I understand what you and ghost have said, which is nothing more than an opinion on the matter (like mine), and I don’t agree. Now we’re picking battles? 

You do understand I think Myles got what he deserved? There’s not really much left to flush out there, I’m already tired of it. 

I just don't understand why that is the prioritized discussion point. Hate making assumptions, but it strikes me as making arguments out of convenience. Our actions are indefensible, so let's pick apart what the other side did. Whether intentional or not it's meant to distract. I get that I'm just reading too much into it, but that's what's been going through my head when Browns people bring up Rudolph's punishment. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had picked up Cleveland d for next week v Miami.  Stay the course or stream elsewhere?  Will be starting Mayfield and just need an average week. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, BassNBrew said:

I had picked up Cleveland d for next week v Miami.  Stay the course or stream elsewhere?  Will be starting Mayfield and just need an average week. 

I'm guessing Vernon is back, but if he isn't we are starting Thomas and Smith at DE. Blegh.

Ogunjobi is out at DT, so I'm guessing that means Lawrence and...?

Burnett blew out his Achilles, but I like how Burris has played. Curious if they transition to more 3 lb with Takitaki instead of 5 db with Carrie. Maybe Redwine instead? 

Which leaves Richardson, Scho, Ward, and Randall with rookies and journeymen. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, BassNBrew said:

I had picked up Cleveland d for next week v Miami.  Stay the course or stream elsewhere?  Will be starting Mayfield and just need an average week. 

Just my opinion, but I think this is the sort of situation where teams rally together & crush their opponents.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, MAC_32 said:

I'm guessing Vernon is back, but if he isn't we are starting Thomas and Smith at DE. Blegh.

Ogunjobi is out at DT, so I'm guessing that means Lawrence and...?

Burnett blew out his Achilles, but I like how Burris has played. Curious if they transition to more 3 lb with Takitaki instead of 5 db with Carrie. Maybe Redwine instead? 

Which leaves Richardson, Scho, Ward, and Randall with rookies and journeymen. 

Have the think a call will be made to Eric Berry and a DL bright up for m the practice squad.  :Shrug:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, Shawnky said:

He's a Cowboys fan.  Just stop.

My apologies. I'll update my notebook.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, Concept Coop said:

Now you're just lying. And I'm not a Steelers fan.

I was referring to the two conversations, as Birdie and I replied to similar posts of yours in two places. 

Getting caught up on the thread and reading the exchange with Amnesiac, I can see where you're coming from. I had multiple conversations about this yesterday and I took your comments that Rudolph was not at fault. I think both were boneheads and should be reprimanded accordingly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Peak said:

Have the think a call will be made to Eric Berry and a DL bright up for m the practice squad.  :Shrug:

 

Hope not on the former, this is your opportunity to find out about the young guys. 

There isn't an answer on the DL. More pressure on the DB's to hold up in coverage. Need to be more creative with blitz calls. Aren't going to win the battle on the line of scrimmage, so the goal is now just not to lose it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, MAC_32 said:

I just don't understand why that is the prioritized discussion point. Hate making assumptions, but it strikes me as making arguments out of convenience. Our actions are indefensible, so let's pick apart what the other side did. Whether intentional or not it's meant to distract. I get that I'm just reading too much into it, but that's what's been going through my head when Browns people bring up Rudolph's punishment. 

Ok I’m not going down this path. I’ve seen tons of negative reaction about Mason’s lack of suspension from non Browns fans. That includes many current and former NFL players, local and national media, fans with no connection to either team, etc etc etc. The media continues to ask Mason questions and he keeps looking worse. It is what it is I guess. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, MAC_32 said:

Hope not on the former, this is your opportunity to find out about the young guys. 

I don't disagree, but look at Redwine. He was not ready. He's not a strong safety. They only have CBs. There is no one in the roster that can play SS adaquately. If he's good to play, I don't see why not? He's the only vet I can think of right now. I'm open to others, but I feel we need a vet presence in the backfield.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Peak said:

I don't disagree, but look at Redwine. He was not ready. He's not a strong safety. They only have CBs. There is no one in the roster that can play SS adaquately. If he's good to play, I don't see why not? He's the only vet I can think of right now. I'm open to others, but I feel we need a vet presence in the backfield.

What did you see out of Redwine that made you think he can't play strong? I dont know if he can or can't. I just didn't see anything to indicate one way or the other. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

What did you see out of Redwine that made you think he can't play strong? I dont know if he can or can't. I just didn't see anything to indicate one way or the other. 

I thought he looked too tentative. He didn't play near the line. He gave up too much room on coverage. He just didn't look confident. Maybe it was first game jitters. Maybe it was the scheme. I don't know. But everything I've heard is that the SS is a leader in Wilks scheme, and I don't feel confident Redwine could do that right now.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Peak said:

I thought he looked too tentative. He didn't play near the line. He gave up too much room on coverage. He just didn't look confident. Maybe it was first game jitters. Maybe it was the scheme. I don't know. But everything I've heard is that the SS is a leader in Wilks scheme, and I don't feel confident Redwine could do that right now.  

To be fair, he hasn't gotten any reps. I don't think expecting him to hit the field mid game and be the alpha of the secondary is a fair expectation. In fact, i would argue most of those criticisms were by design. Given the circumstances, dont put him in a position to give up a big play would be what I expect out of Wilks. 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Adam Schefter‏Verified account @AdamSchefter 5h5 hours ago

The draft pick that the Browns received from Houston in the Duke Johnson trade officially will become a 3rd-round pick today:

-----------------------------------

:thumbup:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

soooo...

Miami.  at home.  seriously should be a win. right?  5-6

at Steelers.  they will want revenge.  home field. 

but... really the Browns are the better team.  no Pouncey.  should be a closely called game. they should win this game but hard to say.  

IF they pull it off:  6-6

then at home against the Bengals, seriously??

no reason they can’t be 7-6 in a few weeks. 
 

at Cardinals:  3-7-1 IF they roll into Arizona on a 4 game winning streak?  
 

I know it sounds crazy, but then Baltimore at home. the Ravens are on a roll, but it’s at home?

week 17 at the Bengals, you really think they are going to care?

they could run the table and end up 10-6.  
 

will it happen?  probably not.  
 

but 8-8, 9-7, we need to give Kitchens another year. 
 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/15/2019 at 4:11 PM, MAC_32 said:

I do not understand why this is the battle you all are picking.

For my part, I like firing up @ghostguy123

I've already said I'm good with Garrett's suspension for the year. Indefinite is stupid and I think that will be walked back. My angst lies with Rudolph walking away with a $35k fine. Should have got 2 games.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, amnesiac said:

but 8-8, 9-7, we need to give Kitchens another year. 

That's where I'm at. I'll reserve judgement on Freddie to see how he handles the rest of the year but firing a coach every other year doesn't = success. We have to stick with someone eventually and Hue set precedent. If you're not firing that goof after 1-31 or whatever the hell it was Freddie can come back for round 2.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.