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Cleveland Browns (13 Viewers)

Matt Waldman comes out of the closet as a Browns fan and discusses the overall state of the team and touches on the subject of Baker Mayfield that I think needs discussing.

Podcast  LINK >> 🎧 >>  Episode 18: Matt Waldman Joins the Show From: Nothin' but the Dawgs

The founder of Matt Waldman Rookie Scouting Portfolio as well as Senior Staff writer at Football Guys, Matt Waldman joins the guys in the studio. We learn how Matt got roped into his Browns fandom, we talk organizational alignment and how important it is, we dissect Nick Chubb in the wide zone, we talk Baker Mayfield and then dive full into the NFL draft - namely OT, WR, and TE. Be sure to stay for the "Mahalo!"

 
daveR said:
You are a poster I respect.  That being said, I stand by what I said.  You, the commissioner, and most of America are looking through emotional lenses.  Take a minute or two to review the clip of the incident and then tell me Garrett premeditatedly decided he was going to attack Rudolph with the helmet.  Tell me, after they were separated, that he was looking to attack him at all.  Tell me what he would have done if Rudolph hadn't re-engaged.  My position has never changed.  The helmet ripping was provoked, but still unnecessary.  The swinging was also unnecessary, but not premeditated -- a "heat of the moment" event.  Take your emotional out of it and tell me he's a "goon", cause he's not.

To answer your question, Yes, I believe most people in that situation would swing the helmet -- I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be able to regain calm that quickly.  Do you know, BTW, where he is & what he's doing right now?
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It’s an awesome thing that he’s doing and highly commendable. I’m not sure that it excuses/justifies what he did on the field.

After all, Harvey Weinstein donated $5M to USC to provide money for female directors.

 
GroveDiesel said:
It’s an awesome thing that he’s doing and highly commendable. I’m not sure that it excuses/justifies what he did on the field.

After all, Harvey Weinstein donated $5M to USC to provide money for female directors.
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Nope.  It doesn't.  My point is that people rushed to judgment through the emotional lens of that incident and they might want to re-think that judgment.  That's all I was ever saying. 

 
This story, in any other city would be major news. And it's just hilarious, assuming it's true...dude took an Uber from California to Louisiana with 157 lbs of weed and got busted by border patrol with a drug sniffing dog. We call this Wednesday in Cleveland :thumbup:

"According to a criminal complaint filed Wednesday by the DEA, Robinson, Bray and an unidentified third person were driving from Los Angeles to Louisiana in a rented sport utility vehicle on Interstate 10 through a remote section of West Texas on Monday. When they passed a Border Patrol agent with a drug-sniffing dog, the dog detected the scent of marijuana. The agent radioed ahead to the patrol's checkpoint in near Sierra Blanca, Texas, 83 miles southeast of El Paso.

There, the patrol stopped and inspected the vehicle, finding several large duffel bags containing vacuum-sealed black bags containing what tested positive as marijuana, the complaint stated. Also found were glass jars and packaging equipment, along with $3,100 in cash.

Agents said the unidentified passenger was an Uber driver who also drove and ran errands for Robinson and his family and friends. The passenger showed agents cellphone texts that showed Robinson had offered to pay the passenger to claim ownership of the marijuana, according to the complaint. The texts showed the passenger refused and would not have made the trip if aware of the drugs in the vehicle. The person was not charged."

 
beer 30 said:
This story, in any other city would be major news. And it's just hilarious, assuming it's true...dude took an Uber from California to Louisiana with 157 lbs of weed and got busted by border patrol with a drug sniffing dog. We call this Wednesday in Cleveland :thumbup:

"According to a criminal complaint filed Wednesday by the DEA, Robinson, Bray and an unidentified third person were driving from Los Angeles to Louisiana in a rented sport utility vehicle on Interstate 10 through a remote section of West Texas on Monday. When they passed a Border Patrol agent with a drug-sniffing dog, the dog detected the scent of marijuana. The agent radioed ahead to the patrol's checkpoint in near Sierra Blanca, Texas, 83 miles southeast of El Paso.

There, the patrol stopped and inspected the vehicle, finding several large duffel bags containing vacuum-sealed black bags containing what tested positive as marijuana, the complaint stated. Also found were glass jars and packaging equipment, along with $3,100 in cash.

Agents said the unidentified passenger was an Uber driver who also drove and ran errands for Robinson and his family and friends. The passenger showed agents cellphone texts that showed Robinson had offered to pay the passenger to claim ownership of the marijuana, according to the complaint. The texts showed the passenger refused and would not have made the trip if aware of the drugs in the vehicle. The person was not charged."
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Chris Rock - How not to get your ### kicked by the police!

 
beer 30 said:
Agents said the unidentified passenger was an Uber driver who also drove and ran errands for Robinson and his family and friends. The passenger showed agents cellphone texts that showed Robinson had offered to pay the passenger to claim ownership of the marijuana, according to the complaint. The texts showed the passenger refused and would not have made the trip if aware of the drugs in the vehicle. The person was not charged."
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wait, this worked??

 
Annual Daniel Jeremiah Combine/Scouting conference call.  

Excellent overview and a  Browns media representative calls-in around the 29:00 minute mark to ask specifically about which OT would fit the outside zone scheme that Stefanski is implementing.

Interesting since the top OT 'according to DJ' is Mekhi Becton who he thinks makes most sense going to the Giants who pick before the Browns and I agree with him since Mekhi isn't a 'great' fit for an outside zone scheme.  

Some here have mentioned 'possibly' moving down which is making more sense for the Browns since the outside zone requires a 'certain type' of athletic OT and this draft class a group who fit but would 'likely' be picked lower in the 1st round.   

Would we have trade-down opportunity?  Eh, maybe if a team were looking to move-up higher than the #10 pick and would need to get into the top-ten and then trade up again.  I am not sure a team would be targeting the #10 pick alone.  I think it would be the first part of moving up higher for a QB.

Great listen: 🎧  LINK Daniel Jeremiah Combine conference call

 
they’re picking tenth.  just take whoever is the best fit.  
 

the Browns aren’t the only team that are going to be running zone.  

 
  Quote

Browns GM Andrew Berry hinted Tuesday that the team will exercise David Njoku's fifth-year team option for 2021.

"I wouldn’t disclose any of those kind of business decisions in this setting," Berry said. "But it’s safe to say we view both those guys as very, very talented members of our roster and we look forward to seeing what they’re going to do over the next few years." The "other guy" is Myles Garrett. Something of a perennial tease through the first three years of his career, Njoku did not get along with since-fired coach Freddie Kitchens. ESPN has posited Njoku as a trade candidate, but Berry's words strongly suggest he will be staying.

SOURCE: Akron Beacon-Journal

Feb 25, 2020, 5:52 PM ET

 
amnesiac said:
translation:  we know he’s an ####### and have been looking for an excuse to fire him.  
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Saw the video this morning.  Grossi was definitely set up, but I'm not mad.  He's one of the most irritating "analysts" for a team I have ever read/heard.  Stop following him awhile ago on Twitter.  Not sorry to see him go.  With that said, the guy who left the mic on and smirked/winked into the webcam after Grossi stuck his foot in his mouth should be fired too.  He knew what he was doing, just like Sashi knew he had to unplug the fax machine before sending out the infamous trade details a few years ago.  

 
Peak said:
Saw the video this morning.  Grossi was definitely set up, but I'm not mad.  He's one of the most irritating "analysts" for a team I have ever read/heard.  Stop following him awhile ago on Twitter.  Not sorry to see him go.  With that said, the guy who left the mic on and smirked/winked into the webcam after Grossi stuck his foot in his mouth should be fired too.  He knew what he was doing, just like Sashi knew he had to unplug the fax machine before sending out the infamous trade details a few years ago.  
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You really think Hammer purposely did that?  He loves Grossi.  Hammer's the type that would just laugh at something like that before thinking of the consequences.  But I admit I don't listen to that station much anymore because of those two and not sure what they've said today about the situation.  Praying they are both fired.  

Rizzo didn't even crack an emotion.  Good for him.

 
Bobcat10 said:
You really think Hammer purposely did that?  He loves Grossi.  Hammer's the type that would just laugh at something like that before thinking of the consequences.  But I admit I don't listen to that station much anymore because of those two and not sure what they've said today about the situation.  Praying they are both fired.  

Rizzo didn't even crack an emotion.  Good for him.
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In all honesty, I don't listen to them.  I couldn't pick them out of a lineup.  Watching just the clip, you could see the guy (Hammer?) take off his headphones, put them gently on the table with the mic so it's up in the air facing Grossi who's back is turned to all of this.  Then just sits there in wait.  Once he has the soundclip he wants, he looks directly into the webcam and smirks.  Looks pre-meditated to me. :shrug:   I did chuckle when Grossi chastised him at the end of leaving the mic on.

But again, all that said, I don't listen to them.  I used to follow Grossi on Twitter, but he became too unbearable.  

 
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Peak said:
Saw the video this morning.  Grossi was definitely set up, but I'm not mad.  He's one of the most irritating "analysts" for a team I have ever read/heard.  Stop following him awhile ago on Twitter.  Not sorry to see him go.  With that said, the guy who left the mic on and smirked/winked into the webcam after Grossi stuck his foot in his mouth should be fired too.  He knew what he was doing, just like Sashi knew he had to unplug the fax machine before sending out the infamous trade details a few years ago.  
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heard the audio, but didn’t see the video. 
 

either way, karma is a #####. 

 
OK, finally got the video to work.  wow.  i almost feel bad for Grossi.

Rizzo actually looked upset when he realized that mic was on.

 
Some interesting Combine numbers from the tackles.

Daniel Jeremiah's 2020 NFL Scouting Combine takeaways

OFFENSIVE LINEMEN

Tristan Wirfs, Iowa (No. 18 to Dolphins): The 6-foot-5, 320-pound lineman broke records on Friday night. He posted a 36.5-inch vertical jump, which is a modern record among O-linemen. He also tied the combine record for an O-lineman with a 10-foot-1 broad jump. Then he recorded a 4.85 40, which is the best time of any offensive lineman this year.

"When he's right, when he stays square and gets his hands on you, it is over with his strength. Now he has an issue every now that he'll over set. But when he stays square he finishes and it's easy. How about the ability to pull on the perimeter? Pull, locate, find your man, get on him. Now you see athleticism to be able to reach and seal off the edge, that run game, get out to the perimeter and then the movement.

"We've seen him on the right side of the line of scrimmage at right tackle. Here you see him on the left side at left tackle, able to uproot the defender, get a nice crease here down on the goal line. The major issue with Wirfs that he's had in some of the pressures that he's given up is all been oversetting."

Mekhi Becton, Louisville (No. 6 to Giants): The OL ran a 5.10 40-yard dash, the fastest time by a player weighing 350-plus pounds at the combine since at least 2003. He's ranked No. 5 in D.J.'s top-50 draft prospects.

"You can't get through him. And he uses his length in pass pro. You can't get around him. And in the run game it's an avalanche when he down blocks. He just takes everybody with him. And he's moving pretty good. When he was training in Texas, Terron Armstead went down to visit and when he walked in the room and saw him he said 'What is that?' Guys like this are just rare."

Andrew Thomas, Georgia (No. 16 to Browns): "He is quick and powerful. A dominate run blocker. Just uproots people in the run game. Pass protection and the balance was the only concern there. That's a good time for him. He's going to be a starting left tackle in the NFL I believe in Year 1. He's my 21st overall player right now."

Austin Jackson, USC (No. 34 to Colts): "He's got a chance at being a top-20 pick when it's all said and done. He's only 20 years old and just scratching the surface of how good he can be. ... This kid's very athletic. He can bend his knees, he can redirect. Just needs to get physically stronger. ... I think him having a full offseason going into the NFL, you're going to see a stronger type of Austin Jackson."

Jedrick Wills, Alabama (No. 15 to Jets): "Jedrick Wills, I believe, is the mix to be the first lineman off the board. I have Mekhi Becton, but he's right behind him. He ran just over 5.0 in the 40. You see some of that explosiveness in the vertical that shows up when you watch him on tape."
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I had been wanting Wirfs for awhile but he tested off the charts so I don't think he'll be available at the #10 spot.

Mekhi tested incredible for his size but may not be the best fit for an outside zone scheme and he 'may' go sooner than 10.

We should have three guys to choose from so if a team like Indy or the Raiders called and offered a 2nd round pick and we would still be assured of getting one of the top OTs then Berry will consider it and he should.

So much talent that will fall to the second round.   We could even double-dip at the OT spot.

-----------------------------

Dane Brugler@dpbrugler

As expected, #BoiseState OT Ezra Cleveland tested outstanding. His athleticism is why he has a chance to be drafted top-40 overall. The numbers match the tape. 4.93 40-yd dash (3rd-best) 7.26 3-cone (1st) 4.46 short-shuttle (1st) 30 bench reps (5th)

-------------------------

EDIT:  More names to consider >> Historic Offensive Tackle Class Performs Better Than Anticipated

... Matt Peart of Connecticut. At a towering 6'7" 318 pounds

...Josh Jones out of Houston is somewhat of a forgotten man for a few reasons. He didn't do many tests and he didn't put up insane numbers. His numbers were human. A 5.27 40, a 28.5" vertical and a 9'1" broad jump are all great results, especially at 319 pounds. Buzz doesn't change the fact that Jones has been an excellent tackle and had good numbers.

This doesn't include players like Jack Driscoll of Auburn, who has a nice athletic profile in the works or Saadiq Charles of LSU, who only did the 40, but ran a 5.05 at 322 pounds. It's an incredible class of tackles and the Browns should draft no less than two of them.

One player that's worth taking a look at given the testing results he had at the combine is Danny Pinter from Ball State. He's 6'4 1/4" tall which isn't ideal for a tackle, his athleticism could make up for it. Pinter ran a 4.91 40 at 306 pounds. 
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Go to the link for the full read.

 
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ghostguy123 said:
Not gonna resign Schobert eh?
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Last year C.J. Mosley signed an enormous contract (five years, $85 million) with the Jets and Kwon Alexander signed a massive deal (four years, $54 million) with the Niners.  

C.J. Mosley out this week, possibly much longer

Jets linebacker C.J. Mosley has barely played this season, and it may be a long time before he plays again.

Mosley will miss Sunday’s game after aggravating the groin injury that already forced him to miss most of this season. And Jets coach Adam Gase said he couldn’t rule out putting Mosley on injured reserve.

That would be a major disappointment for a player who signed a five-year, $85 million contract in March. Mosley has only played in two games this season and hurt his groin in both of them.
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C.J. recorded  9 combined tackles and 1 interception last year.

49ers LB Kwon Alexander out for season with torn pectoral

...In most of eight games, Alexander had 34 tackles, an interception, a half of a sack, a forced fumble and four passes defended.
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I noted the splits of Schobert before and after Myles Garrett's suspension.

===========================================================

Posted December 24, 2019 (edited)

Joe is up for a huge payday.  We saw last year that LBers cleaned up but not many made an impact especially considering the huge paydays we saw so I took a look at what Joe did this year with Myles Garrett and without Myles.

Season split  w/Myles Garrett and without Myles Garrett.

First ten games with Myles Garrett:

66 solos (6.5 solos per game)

25 assists

6 TFL 

1 sack

2 INTs

5 PDs

Last five games without Myles Garrett:

17 solos (3.4 solos per game)

16 assists

0 TFL

0 sacks

2 INTs

4 PDs

-----------------------------------------------

This split can be explained away as poor D-Line play and him not being able to attack gaps which is reflected in the lack of TFL/Sacks and disproportionate solo VS. assists w/Myles and without him.

The scheme last year caused a ton of missed tackles IMHO as Greg Williams had a blitz on nearly every play so the linebackers were on ice skates trying to cover a lot of ground so last year Joe was one of the leaders  in missed tackles.

This year with a new scheme?

Tied for 3rd in the NFL in missed tackles on the year:

Missed tackle leaders 2019

I think Joe has to be extended because he can cover but he's still missing a lot of tackles.  

Edited December 24, 2019 by Bracie Smathers

 
Bracie Smathers said:
I had been wanting Wirfs for awhile but he tested off the charts so I don't think he'll be available at the #10 spot.

Mekhi tested incredible for his size but may not be the best fit for an outside zone scheme and he 'may' go sooner than 10.

We should have three guys to choose from so if a team like Indy or the Raiders called and offered a 2nd round pick and we would still be assured of getting one of the top OTs then Berry will consider it and he should.

So much talent that will fall to the second round.   We could even double-dip at the OT spot.
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That post was from yesterday morning. (Posted yesterday at 10:48 AM (edited))

I just saw this that was posted yesterday afternoon that said nearly the same thing.  I give credit to Pete Smith for pointing out Wirfs as the Browns target and am not saying at all that he saw my post but I find it encouraging that we came to the same conclusion after seeing how well Wirfs performed and that it makes a lot of sense for the Browns to trade down, still get a top OT prospect plus add another player especially if we wind up losing Schobert.

Tristan Wirfs A Forgone Conclusion? Could the Browns Trade Down? Possibly

...Tony Pauline of Pro Football Network is saying Tristan Wirfs of Iowa was the Browns dream target and believes his workout puts him out of their range. Further, the Browns could look to trade back and target Ezra Cleveland of Boise State.

Tristan Wirfs was the offensive tackle most coveted by the Cleveland Browns but he is assuredly out of their reach in round one now after his sensational workout on Friday night. So where do they look? It’s still very early but a source today further confirmed what I posted on Friday – the Browns likes Ezra Cleveland so trading down 8-to-10 slots in round one and then selecting the Boise State junior would be a contingency option. - Tony Pauline of Pro Football Network

... it would hardly be a surprise if the Browns were looking to move down in the draft. While plenty of people will say it's because that's what they always have done when they've been run by people who embrace analytics and math, the reality is the Browns only have seven picks in this draft and could use more assets to address a number of needs.

If the calculus for the Browns is they believe Cleveland, for what they do, is not a significant drop off, they can move down ten spots, add assets, that could make a ton of sense of them...

...The biggest need on the team is offensive tackle and this draft class is rich with options that not only appear capable at playing the position at a high level, but fit their scheme. This draft looks set to play out in a way that benefits the Browns, but it's up to general manager Andrew Berry to make the most of it.
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Browns need to give a first for Trent Williams. One of the best in the game. (Skins fan here, I'd like a draft pick for our rebuild please) 

 
MAC_32 said:
He's a Skins fan, the OT talent available in this crop is why trading a 1 for him even with the extra year was always a horrendous idea. 
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OF COURSE IT IS, but you guys are well, the Browns  :scared:

 
After reading Pluto's column about potentially losing Kirksey & Schobert, I wondered about their replacements.  He mentioned Takitaki & Wilson, stating that he thought Wilson was good in pass coverage.  My opinion has been just the opposite, so I'm looking for your thoughts.  I always perceived Wilson as more of a run-stuffing, traditional MLB type, while Takitaki seemed to have good mobility.  Am I wrong?  (Would hardly be the first time!)  I'm also thinking that Takitaki might be mobile enough to play SS.  Thoughts? 

 
daveR said:
After reading Pluto's column about potentially losing Kirksey & Schobert, I wondered about their replacements.  He mentioned Takitaki & Wilson, stating that he thought Wilson was good in pass coverage.  My opinion has been just the opposite, so I'm looking for your thoughts.  I always perceived Wilson as more of a run-stuffing, traditional MLB type, while Takitaki seemed to have good mobility.  Am I wrong?  (Would hardly be the first time!)  I'm also thinking that Takitaki might be mobile enough to play SS.  Thoughts? 
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That's interesting. I recall around draft time last year the knock on Takitaki was his coverage skills so while he might theoretically have the requisite athleticism, it was fairly undeveloped. He's also one of those 'hair on fire' guys who plays at a million miles an hour every play on instinct, but can be undisciplined. I have no idea how much or if he's improved on those things. I assumed he would mostly be a limited run stuffer, but the Browns drafted him high enough for me to think they see a bigger role than that for him.

Of course Wilson was drafted later and he seemed to easily move past Takitaki for a full time starting role. I think he looked pretty good but replaceable. I just don't know how Takitaki is viewed within the organisation. I'm cautiously optimistic about him for IDP, partly just because he seems like one of those guys who will put up a high rate of tackles per snaps when he's actually out there, whether that's in a full time role or not. 

 
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daveR said:
After reading Pluto's column about potentially losing Kirksey & Schobert, I wondered about their replacements.  He mentioned Takitaki & Wilson, stating that he thought Wilson was good in pass coverage.  My opinion has been just the opposite, so I'm looking for your thoughts.  I always perceived Wilson as more of a run-stuffing, traditional MLB type, while Takitaki seemed to have good mobility.  Am I wrong?  (Would hardly be the first time!)  I'm also thinking that Takitaki might be mobile enough to play SS.  Thoughts? 
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Wilson's problems are in play diagnosis. I am skeptical whether they're correctable. When he guesses right he's a play maker - in coverage, pressuring the qb, stuffing the run, edge contain, etc. But he guesses wrong with high frequency. That's troublesome in a high volume role and a deal breaker in a qb of the defense job like Scho. 

We didn't see enough from Takitaki to say anything about what he can and can't do. Even if this personnel group likes him they can't trust him. They can't reasonably justify anything more than signing a tier 2 FA and hope Takitaki beats him out. 

 
MAC_32 said:
We didn't see enough from Takitaki to say anything about what he can and can't do. Even if this personnel group likes him they can't trust him. They can't reasonably justify anything more than signing a tier 2 FA and hope Takitaki beats him out. 
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Don’t underestimate this group’s ability to completely #### everything up once again.  
 

Especially with Haslam involved.  
 

People can justify anything if they try hard enough.  

 
amnesiac said:
Don’t underestimate this group’s ability to completely #### everything up once again.  
 

Especially with Haslam involved.  
 

People can justify anything if they try hard enough.  
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I'm not under estimating anything. I think the chicken little act is stupid though. This group hasn't even been given a chance to #### it up by a not insignificant group of fans. I'm not happy about Schobert walking, but I want to see what's actually done before I criticize the action.

 
MAC_32 said:
I'm not under estimating anything. I think the chicken little act is stupid though. This group hasn't even been given a chance to #### it up by a not insignificant group of fans. I'm not happy about Schobert walking, but I want to see what's actually done before I criticize the action.
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fair enough, I was just joking.  
 

im not judging them, just not given anyone the benefit of the doubt either.  

 
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