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***Official Jays Thread*** Lots of optimism, again. (1 Viewer)

Patrick the Pirate said:
RnR said:
Patrick the Pirate said:
I think the wise move would be to trade Bautista for a couple of top pitching prospects. Bautista's value will never again be higher than right now. The catch being that who ever takes Bautista has to take Buehrle and his contract.
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Since we're playing in Fantasy Land... which team do you have pegged for taking on Bautista and Buehrle's contracts while also dealing a couple of their top pitching prospects?
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Sorry for playing in fantasy land. Will erase my post.
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Patrick the Pirate, wait...

 
I have a standing bet with a Good buddy for $1000 that the Raps or Jays win a championship before the Leafs (I hate the leafs he hates all non-hockey sports). Looking good...

 
I'm not a Colby Rasmus fan by any means but right now wouldn't he be a really good fit for the Jays? He's a left handed batter who plays CF and he's not going to cost the moon.

 
Patrick the Pirate said:
I'm not a Colby Rasmus fan by any means but right now wouldn't he be a really good fit for the Jays? He's a left handed batter who plays CF and he's not going to cost the moon.
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Pretty sure he wore out his welcome. Media have said from the start, no chance he's back.

Plus... #Pompey2015

 
Dirks, Mayberry, Smoak non tendered. Opens up $6 million in payroll but no LF platoon to speak of anymore. Bautista, Pillar and Pompey are only OF left on 40 man. Hopefully this means they're optimistic about Melky.

 
Happ traded for Saunders. I like it. Frees up about $4M in payroll, Jays have longer control over Saunders, opens up a spot in the rotation for Sanchez and somewhat addresses the OF situation (Saunders (2.4) projected for higher WAR than Melky (1.7) by Steamer for this year, though a lot of that is defensive). Saunders being a LH bat helps as well.

Justin Smoak also signed for 1 year,1 million right now he figures to be opening day 1B but tons of time for that to change.

 
Like both moves. Needed some left handers.

This opens up a spot for Sanchez in the rotation now right? Dickey, Buehrle, Hutchison, Stroman, Sanchez with Estrada long relief/6th starter.

Anything to see with Carrera? Worthy of the 4th OF spot?

David Robertson going to be the last piece of the puzzle?

 
Patrick the Pirate said:
This opens up a spot for Sanchez in the rotation now right? Dickey, Buehrle, Hutchison, Stroman, Sanchez with Estrada long relief/6th starter.

Anything to see with Carrera? Worthy of the 4th OF spot?

David Robertson going to be the last piece of the puzzle?
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Yeah as of now it looks like that for the rotation, with Daniel Norris possibly being in the mix with Sanchez and Estrada for #5. Still some rumblings that they may add another starter (in which case Sanchez may close - I don't want that to happen though). Definitely need back end bullpen help, I would suspect they add a few guys there, rather than spend it all on Robertson.

 
Being a bit of a devil's advocate here but the last two deals sent Lawrie, Barretto, Happ, Nolin, and Graveman out of town for Donaldson and Saunders.

Out of the 5 guys sent away, was there a deal for Cole Hamels in that package? Hamels costs $20M+ a season but he's a legitimate left handed ace who's been giving 200+ IP a season with pretty close to a K/IP and an ERA around 3.00 for the last 5 years. He's locked up for the next 4 years with an option in 2019.

 
Patrick the Pirate said:
Being a bit of a devil's advocate here but the last two deals sent Lawrie, Barretto, Happ, Nolin, and Graveman out of town for Donaldson and Saunders.

Out of the 5 guys sent away, was there a deal for Cole Hamels in that package? Hamels costs $20M+ a season but he's a legitimate left handed ace who's been giving 200+ IP a season with pretty close to a K/IP and an ERA around 3.00 for the last 5 years. He's locked up for the next 4 years with an option in 2019.
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Then they'd have zero money to fill out their bull-pen, 2B and bench (thanks Rogers!).

 
Cliff Clavin said:
Patrick the Pirate said:
Being a bit of a devil's advocate here but the last two deals sent Lawrie, Barretto, Happ, Nolin, and Graveman out of town for Donaldson and Saunders.

Out of the 5 guys sent away, was there a deal for Cole Hamels in that package? Hamels costs $20M+ a season but he's a legitimate left handed ace who's been giving 200+ IP a season with pretty close to a K/IP and an ERA around 3.00 for the last 5 years. He's locked up for the next 4 years with an option in 2019.
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Then they'd have zero money to fill out their bull-pen, 2B and bench (thanks Rogers!).
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I don't think the Jays are that worried about their rotation to be honest, they need pitching but it's more bullpen, and now maybe some SP depth to replace Happ/Nolin

 
Northern Voice said:
Cliff Clavin said:
Patrick the Pirate said:
Being a bit of a devil's advocate here but the last two deals sent Lawrie, Barretto, Happ, Nolin, and Graveman out of town for Donaldson and Saunders.

Out of the 5 guys sent away, was there a deal for Cole Hamels in that package? Hamels costs $20M+ a season but he's a legitimate left handed ace who's been giving 200+ IP a season with pretty close to a K/IP and an ERA around 3.00 for the last 5 years. He's locked up for the next 4 years with an option in 2019.
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Then they'd have zero money to fill out their bull-pen, 2B and bench (thanks Rogers!).
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I don't think the Jays are that worried about their rotation to be honest, they need pitching but it's more bullpen, and now maybe some SP depth to replace Happ/Nolin
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Dickey, Buerhle, Stroman, Hutch, ???

Sanchez and Norris will be innings count so unless they split the season in the rotation who is number 5? And who is behind that?

 
Cliff Clavin said:
Northern Voice said:
Cliff Clavin said:
Patrick the Pirate said:
Being a bit of a devil's advocate here but the last two deals sent Lawrie, Barretto, Happ, Nolin, and Graveman out of town for Donaldson and Saunders.

Out of the 5 guys sent away, was there a deal for Cole Hamels in that package? Hamels costs $20M+ a season but he's a legitimate left handed ace who's been giving 200+ IP a season with pretty close to a K/IP and an ERA around 3.00 for the last 5 years. He's locked up for the next 4 years with an option in 2019.
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Then they'd have zero money to fill out their bull-pen, 2B and bench (thanks Rogers!).
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I don't think the Jays are that worried about their rotation to be honest, they need pitching but it's more bullpen, and now maybe some SP depth to replace Happ/Nolin
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Dickey, Buerhle, Stroman, Hutch, ???

Sanchez and Norris will be innings count so unless they split the season in the rotation who is number 5? And who is behind that?
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Sanchez threw 130+ last year, not too far off Stroman's 2013 number. Estrada would be the next one after that I would think ahead of Norris right now. After that, it's the usual Jenkins/Redmond/Hendricks/Drabek etc... long men/spot starters.

 
So, at this moment, I'm pretty happy with a presumed lineup/batting order of:

SS Reyes
C Martin
RF Bautista
1B/DH Encarnacion
3B Donaldson
LF Saunders
1B/DH Smoak/Valencia platoon
CF #Pompey2015
2B Travis/Izturis platoon

I mean sure 7/8/9 could be better, but top 6 kind of couldn't be. I mean it is RH heavy, but it's not like Martin/Bau/EE/Donaldson suck against righties.
 
Northern Voice said:
Cliff Clavin said:
Northern Voice said:
Cliff Clavin said:
Patrick the Pirate said:
Being a bit of a devil's advocate here but the last two deals sent Lawrie, Barretto, Happ, Nolin, and Graveman out of town for Donaldson and Saunders.

Out of the 5 guys sent away, was there a deal for Cole Hamels in that package? Hamels costs $20M+ a season but he's a legitimate left handed ace who's been giving 200+ IP a season with pretty close to a K/IP and an ERA around 3.00 for the last 5 years. He's locked up for the next 4 years with an option in 2019.
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Then they'd have zero money to fill out their bull-pen, 2B and bench (thanks Rogers!).
Click to expand...
I don't think the Jays are that worried about their rotation to be honest, they need pitching but it's more bullpen, and now maybe some SP depth to replace Happ/Nolin
Click to expand...
Dickey, Buerhle, Stroman, Hutch, ???

Sanchez and Norris will be innings count so unless they split the season in the rotation who is number 5? And who is behind that?
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Sanchez threw 130+ last year, not too far off Stroman's 2013 number. Estrada would be the next one after that I would think ahead of Norris right now. After that, it's the usual Jenkins/Redmond/Hendricks/Drabek etc... long men/spot starters.
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Without a doubt the Jays need to shore up the back end of the bullpen.

But I just fear that without that ace in the staff, how far can they actually go in the playoffs?

Realistically we are looking at a wildcard spot here. Winning the East this year is going to be tough. Not saying the Jays won't do it, it's just that it's a tough division. So in a one game loser goes home playoff, the Jays are going to pitch who? It's probably Stroman right now. And then if you get through that one, you're going to open a series with Dickey, Hutch, then Stroman again, Buehrle.

Once playoffs come, an ace is so valuable. Think Bumgarner this year.

I'm not knocking Stroman and he very well could be that ace this year but just imagine you could have put a Hamels type in front of him. Then you pitch Hamels(?) in the wildcard and open the next series with Stroman and bump Buehrle or Hutch out of the playoff rotation.

I'm leaving Sanchez out, assuming that he will have ran out of innings by then.

And I'm using Hamels as an example because it is pretty widely known that the Phillies are shopping him for a rebuild.

I just don't see winning many 5 or 7 game playoff series with the rotation that the Jays currently have.

 
It hinges on Stroman/Sanchez/Hutchison for sure. I'm happier betting on their talent, continued progression and the impact of Russell Martin. There's no chance the Jays sign Lester/Scherzer and no one else out there as a FA gives me any more confidence than what the Jays have.

Dickey can still be dominant too, you just can't ever count on it and he's as likely to throw 8 strong or get knocked out in the 5th.

 
Agree that they aren't going to land an ace via free agency. And I don't think signing a middle of the rotation Ervin Santana type is the right move either.

Dickey seemed to run into trouble around the 5th or 6th inning every single game I watched him pitch other than his second start of the season when he shut the Yankees down. His numbers were way better than my perception of him was. I don't think he's a guy you'd want starting two games of a playoff series.

 
Patrick the Pirate said:
Agree that they aren't going to land an ace via free agency. And I don't think signing a middle of the rotation Ervin Santana type is the right move either.

Dickey seemed to run into trouble around the 5th or 6th inning every single game I watched him pitch other than his second start of the season when he shut the Yankees down. His numbers were way better than my perception of him was. I don't think he's a guy you'd want starting two games of a playoff series.
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No, he's absolutely not, but Dickey/Buehrle's 400+ IP of 4 or slightly below ERA can help you get to a playoff series, if the kids are alright.

Then you do whatever it takes. If innings become an issue, I'd love to see a Dickey/Sanchez piggyback for a game. 5 innings of dancing knuckleball followed by once through the order with pure heat.

---

In other news, the Chris Collabello/Justin Smoak combo at 1B will strike fear into every pitching staff in the league.

 
A really good look here at the process of trying to get real grass into a multi purpose concrete building that wasn't designed to have grass in it. My big takeaways are 1- that there's no guarantee this actually happens, despite the stated goal of 2018, 2-that the idea of changing some of the roof panels to make them clear and allow natural light in could be a nice upgrade and 3-at some point it has to be worth considering just building a new damn stadium.

Original Article

Imagine: Sitting before you is a scale model of the Rogers Centre, roughly the size of a round roasting pan. Your challenge: to put a real baseball field in the stadium – natural grass with a dirt infield — by opening day 2018.

Your research has been thorough. Experts at the University of Guelph have determined the ideal species of grass. They have it growing on an Ontario sod farm. They say it will flourish indoors with the roof closed.

Under the right conditions, that is. Your job is to create those conditions.

So open the roof, reach in and toss out that artificial turf, which was new for the 2015 season. Haul out your jackhammer. Rip up the concrete. Install plumbing for irrigation and drainage. Dig some more to accommodate the sod and the dirt infield.

Close the roof. Strip that shiny skin from the four mammoth roof panels. It’s the original PVC membrane, circa 1989, and it’s worn out. While you’re at it, you might figure out a way to replace it with a material that lets in the light. Grass likes natural light, and right now, the closed dome shuts it out.

The scientists at Guelph say the grass will grow without natural light, but you’ll need lots of artificial light – enormous banks of mobile “grow lights” that sit about 10 feet off the ground and nourish the sod when the field is not in use. You’ll roll them around between games to focus on the worn spots, even after games played with the roof open.

One more thing. Grass sweats. (Scientists call it transpiration.). Water from the roots vaporizes from the leaf surface into the air. All of that grass will create a lot of humidity, and you’ve got to figure out a way to get rid of that sticky air or the Rogers Centre will become a sweatbox with the roof closed. So you’ll need a dehumidifier. Forget Home Depot; you need a really big one.

Now you’re ready to install the grass.

Assuming, of course, that your engineers surmounted all of those challenges and you have the budget to make it happen.

***

Except for the 2018 deadline, all of the foregoing is fantasy. The grass is not growing. The University of Guelph has not begun the serious business of testing grass species. The Jays’ engineering team continues to investigate the enormously complex logistical challenges. They have visited stadiums in Milwaukee, Miami and Arizona, among others, to see how officials there have dealt with airflow and light issues.

Of course, there is a fundamental difference between the Rogers Centre and those facilities. Those other stadiums are baseball parks, engineered to grow grass. The Rogers Centre is a multi-use indoor entertainment facility engineered nearly three decades ago without grass in mind.
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Full documents (at bottom) of discussion between Jays and University of Guelph (large areas redacted)

 
Also, it saddens me that I started this thread in 2010 and the title was Blue Jays 2012 thread at that time,and now it's 2015 and there hasn't been even a sniff of a playoff race, but I intend to keep this one going rather than start a new one, if only to read back to the glory days of Fred Lewis, and me being convinced Travis Snider was Mike Trout.

 
Northern Voice said:
Also, it saddens me that I started this thread in 2010 and the title was Blue Jays 2012 thread at that time,and now it's 2015 and there hasn't been even a sniff of a playoff race, but I intend to keep this one going rather than start a new one, if only to read back to the glory days of Fred Lewis, and me being convinced Travis Snider was Mike Trout.
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You did fall pretty hard for Mr. Lunchbox Hero.

 
I'll be curious to see what happens with Anthopolous if Duquette gets the president job.

Andy Dirks resigned to a minor league deal with training camp invite, he'll compete with Pillar for 4th OF job/Pompey insurance.

 
Jersey number news:

Maicer Izturis is switching to #13 (formerly worn by Lawrie).

Jake Fox (a non roster invite) is wearing #24 at camp, the significance being that Ricky Romero isn't even at major league camp this year (he will however make $7.5 million).

We really need spring training to get here.

 
:( Michael Saunders out till all-star break with torn meniscus after stepping on a sprinkler head.

Bautista, Pompey, Pillar the only other OFs on 40 man. Ezequiel Carrerra and a few other invitees in camp. Andy Dirks not healthy enough to be considered for it apparently.

 
It's sucks for Saunders who just seems to be one of those guys who never can stay healthy. But you'd think Toronto would have a better plan B to back up a guy who has a history of injury problems.

 
Viciedo might not be the long term answer but as it stands right now there is a possibility you could see Dioneer Navarro shagging fly balls in LF for a handful of games. He's got to be better than that.

 
Northern Voice said:
:( Michael Saunders out till all-star break with torn meniscus after stepping on a sprinkler head.
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Saunders injury was worse than expected, they had to remove 60% of meniscus, rather than repair it. Strangely, this actually reduces the recovery time (but increases chances of arthritis later in life), now estimated 4-6 weeks, back in mid-April.

 
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Northern Voice said:
Northern Voice said:
:( Michael Saunders out till all-star break with torn meniscus after stepping on a sprinkler head.
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Saunders injury was worse than expected, they had to remove 60% of meniscus, rather than repair it. Strangely, this actually reduces the recovery time (but increases chances of arthritis later in life), now estimated 4-6 weeks, back in mid-April.
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What's Canadian for bone on bone?

 
Viciedo seems like the logical move although he makes their lineup even more right handed. He's a perfectly good option against LHP.

 
Eephus said:
Viciedo seems like the logical move although he makes their lineup even more right handed. He's a perfectly good option against LHP.
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I don't get it, if Saunders is back mid April, why do you need a guy who's useless vs RHP.Feel like deals given to Santana/Viciedo should've gone to RP/2B/CF

 
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Will be interesting to see which 2 of Sanchez,Norris, Estrada become 4/5. Part of me really wants to see them go with the 2 high upside young guys, but development wise, that may be a stretch, particularly for Norris. If it's Estrada, balls will be flying out of the Rogers Centre at a record pace.

 
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