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Antonio Brown - Out of his Head - Out of the League

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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/01/12/report-not-looking-good-for-antonio-brown-this-week/

Seems there are different outside influences at play here. the league would seem to want its best players on the field. Otoh, with concussions being a huge issue and the movie out, they can't appear to minimize the risk. They need to make the system appear to work, whether it actually does or not, perception is huge.

I'd bet on him not playing but hope he's okay.

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I think he has to practice in some form tomorrow or he is ruled out if I read the concussion protocol stuff correctly. I was in the "he's playing for sure no matter what" camp. Sucks if he can't go.

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I think he has to practice in some form tomorrow or he is ruled out if I read the concussion protocol stuff correctly. I was in the "he's playing for sure no matter what" camp. Sucks if he can't go.

A veteran like AB doesn't need practice at this point in the post-season but I agree with you that it isn't a good sign if he doesn't.

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I think he has to practice in some form tomorrow or he is ruled out if I read the concussion protocol stuff correctly. I was in the "he's playing for sure no matter what" camp. Sucks if he can't go.

A veteran like AB doesn't need practice at this point in the post-season but I agree with you that it isn't a good sign if he doesn't.

I thought I read that the player has to complete certain steps to get taken out of the protocol - light exercise then actually practicing. Not sure if that can be fudged or if that is even correct.

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I think he has to practice in some form tomorrow or he is ruled out if I read the concussion protocol stuff correctly. I was in the "he's playing for sure no matter what" camp. Sucks if he can't go.

A veteran like AB doesn't need practice at this point in the post-season but I agree with you that it isn't a good sign if he doesn't.

He has to pass the first test which allows him to practice and then pass another test that will then allow him to play. So it's not that he's a vet and doesn't need the practice, he has to in order to pass protocall.

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I think he has to practice in some form tomorrow or he is ruled out if I read the concussion protocol stuff correctly. I was in the "he's playing for sure no matter what" camp. Sucks if he can't go.

A veteran like AB doesn't need practice at this point in the post-season but I agree with you that it isn't a good sign if he doesn't.

He has to pass the first test which allows him to practice and then pass another test that will then allow him to play. So it's not that he's a vet and doesn't need the practice, he has to in order to pass protocall.

No, you don't have to practice but you have to do some form of graduated excercise to get cleared to play.

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I'll be shocked if he plays at this point. Just a shame being without AB, deangelo, way less than 100% Ben. Seems like a golden opportunity of going to super bowl just slips away.

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I'm glad they ruled him out though. The Steelers fan in me wanted him to play but the compassionate person in me wanted him to sit. Good for everyone involved that they didn't try to force him back just to win a game.

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He sure is selling this fake...

(But, yeah, bummer his season, and Pittsburgh's was ended on a cheap shot. 3 games seems kind of weak now.)

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That sucks. I'm glad the team is doing the right thing, but I'm disappointed he won't play.

I don't want the Broncos backing their way into the Superbowl by injury default again...if they are going to go, I want them to have to earn it by beating the best.

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3 games seems kind of weak now.)

In light of this other transgressions, including the late hit on Max Williams the week before I always thought 3 games was disturbingly to low and I generally think most suspensions are two long.

They preach player safety is the most important thing these days and in back to back weeks he delivers cheap shots to the head plus other stuff. For the seemingly minor offenses players get suspended these days it's almost a farce he only got 3 games. I mean that's one game more than Bell got for smoking a joint in a Camaro. What a joke.

As a Steeler fan was hoping this would mean some more Coates at the very least but sounds like it's going to be a long day of DHB hand fighting with the football. Jesus.

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That sucks. I'm glad the team is doing the right thing, but I'm disappointed he won't play.

I don't want the Broncos backing their way into the Superbowl by injury default again...if they are going to go, I want them to have to earn it by beating the best.

Heh, it's not the Broncos backing their way in, it's the Patriots. ...If they can beat the Chiefs.

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That sucks. I'm glad the team is doing the right thing, but I'm disappointed he won't play.

I don't want the Broncos backing their way into the Superbowl by injury default again...if they are going to go, I want them to have to earn it by beating the best.

Heh, it's not the Broncos backing their way in, it's the Patriots. ...If they can beat the Chiefs.

None of the AFC teams look that good. The NFC should win the SB easily this year.

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That sucks. I'm glad the team is doing the right thing, but I'm disappointed he won't play.

I don't want the Broncos backing their way into the Superbowl by injury default again...if they are going to go, I want them to have to earn it by beating the best.

Heh, it's not the Broncos backing their way in, it's the Patriots. ...If they can beat the Chiefs.

None of the AFC teams look that good. The NFC should win the SB easily this year.

If the Pats make it, I wouldn't count them out or say that they're "easily going to lose". They'll be healthy and have 2 weeks off again if they make it.

Patriots are still the Vegas favourites to win the Super Bowl as of today.

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That sucks. I'm glad the team is doing the right thing, but I'm disappointed he won't play.

I don't want the Broncos backing their way into the Superbowl by injury default again...if they are going to go, I want them to have to earn it by beating the best.

Heh, it's not the Broncos backing their way in, it's the Patriots. ...If they can beat the Chiefs.

None of the AFC teams look that good. The NFC should win the SB easily this year.

If the Pats make it, I wouldn't count them out or say that they're "easily going to lose". They'll be healthy and have 2 weeks off again if they make it.

Patriots are still the Vegas favourites to win the Super Bowl as of today.

That's because Carolina, Seattle and Arizona likely have go contend with one another to get to the SB.

The AFC looked super weak entering the playoffs. Since than Brown got knocked out, DWILL never made it back, Big Ben is ailing, Maclin is out or ailing and Gronk is out or ailing. The weak sister got a lot weaker.

But to your point there is still no team in the AFC who if they made the SB I would consider "easily going to lose", I'd just likely consider them them the underdog. I don't see dominant teams that are unbeatable this year.

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As a Steeler fan was hoping this would mean some more Coates at the very least but sounds like it's going to be a long day of DHB hand fighting with the football. Jesus.

I'm hoping Ben's shoulder is healthy enough for DHB's stone hands to be a concern.

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That sucks. I'm glad the team is doing the right thing, but I'm disappointed he won't play.

I don't want the Broncos backing their way into the Superbowl by injury default again...if they are going to go, I want them to have to earn it by beating the best.

Heh, it's not the Broncos backing their way in, it's the Patriots. ...If they can beat the Chiefs.

None of the AFC teams look that good. The NFC should win the SB easily this year.

If the Pats make it, I wouldn't count them out or say that they're "easily going to lose". They'll be healthy and have 2 weeks off again if they make it.

Patriots are still the Vegas favourites to win the Super Bowl as of today.

That's because Carolina, Seattle and Arizona likely have go contend with one another to get to the SB.

The AFC looked super weak entering the playoffs. Since than Brown got knocked out, DWILL never made it back, Big Ben is ailing, Maclin is out or ailing and Gronk is out or ailing. The weak sister got a lot weaker.

But to your point there is still no team in the AFC who if they made the SB I would consider "easily going to lose", I'd just likely consider them them the underdog. I don't see dominant teams that are unbeatable this year.

I agree this is why they are still the favourites, but I was rebutting the "the nfc should win the SB EASILY this year" claim. Who knows how the AFC team will be playing come February, but if the Pats get through, I wouldn't think they'd be more then 3 or 4 point underdogs to ANY NFC team.

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I'm glad they ruled him out though. The Steelers fan in me wanted him to play but the compassionate person in me wanted him to sit. Good for everyone involved that they didn't try to force him back just to win a game.

RGIII agrees with this...

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That sucks. I'm glad the team is doing the right thing, but I'm disappointed he won't play.

I don't want the Broncos backing their way into the Superbowl by injury default again...if they are going to go, I want them to have to earn it by beating the best.

Heh, it's not the Broncos backing their way in, it's the Patriots. ...If they can beat the Chiefs.

None of the AFC teams look that good. The NFC should win the SB easily this year.

If the Pats make it, I wouldn't count them out or say that they're "easily going to lose". They'll be healthy and have 2 weeks off again if they make it.

Patriots are still the Vegas favourites to win the Super Bowl as of today.

That's because Carolina, Seattle and Arizona likely have go contend with one another to get to the SB.

The AFC looked super weak entering the playoffs. Since than Brown got knocked out, DWILL never made it back, Big Ben is ailing, Maclin is out or ailing and Gronk is out or ailing. The weak sister got a lot weaker.

But to your point there is still no team in the AFC who if they made the SB I would consider "easily going to lose", I'd just likely consider them them the underdog. I don't see dominant teams that are unbeatable this year.

I agree this is why they are still the favourites, but I was rebutting the "the nfc should win the SB EASILY this year" claim. Who knows how the AFC team will be playing come February, but if the Pats get through, I wouldn't think they'd be more then 3 or 4 point underdogs to ANY NFC team.

And, as I remember it, the same thing was said this time last year....

You gotta play the games.

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3 games seems kind of weak now.)

In light of this other transgressions, including the late hit on Max Williams the week before I always thought 3 games was disturbingly to low and I generally think most suspensions are two long.

They preach player safety is the most important thing these days and in back to back weeks he delivers cheap shots to the head plus other stuff. For the seemingly minor offenses players get suspended these days it's almost a farce he only got 3 games. I mean that's one game more than Bell got for smoking a joint in a Camaro. What a joke.

As a Steeler fan was hoping this would mean some more Coates at the very least but sounds like it's going to be a long day of DHB hand fighting with the football. Jesus.

Amazing how our tolerance has changed over the years... How many games did Ryan Clark get for his cheap shot on Welker? Or von Oelhoffen for the low hit on Carson Palmer?

I like Antonio Brown and I hate too see any player injured... Certainly, there are malicious hits and sometimes things just happen - it's a violent game.

As far as the Steeler's chance of winning - I think Wheaton can step up. Manning has been INT prone and could be rusty so this came could be real interesting.

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Amazing how our tolerance has changed over the years... How many games did Ryan Clark get for his cheap shot on Welker? Or von Oelhoffen for the low hit on Carson Palmer?

No, my tolerance has not changed one iota in over 35 years of watching football. When a player has shown a repeated history of late hits and after the whistle contact in a deliberate attempt to injure the other player I have not and never will condone that behavior.

And I've never viewed Kimo's hit as dirty and it sure was not illegal.

Edited by menobrown

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Amazing how our tolerance has changed over the years... How many games did Ryan Clark get for his cheap shot on Welker? Or von Oelhoffen for the low hit on Carson Palmer?

No, my tolerance has not changed one iota in over 35 years of watching football. When a player has shown a repeated history of late hits and after the whistle contact in a deliberate attempt to injure the other player I have not and never will condone that behavior.

And I've never viewed Kimo's hit as dirty and it sure was not illegal.

A lot of Bengal's fans might disagree. It's one of the reasons we now have rules against hitting a QB below the knees. They are in just as defenseless a position as receivers.

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Amazing how our tolerance has changed over the years... How many games did Ryan Clark get for his cheap shot on Welker? Or von Oelhoffen for the low hit on Carson Palmer?

No, my tolerance has not changed one iota in over 35 years of watching football. When a player has shown a repeated history of late hits and after the whistle contact in a deliberate attempt to injure the other player I have not and never will condone that behavior.

And I've never viewed Kimo's hit as dirty and it sure was not illegal.

A lot of Bengal's fans might disagree. It's one of the reasons we now have rules against hitting a QB below the knees. They are in just as defenseless a position as receivers.

You mean the rule commonly known as the Brady rule which they amended after this ACL, about 5 years after Palmers? Personally never considered Pollards hit as dirty either and at the time I don't think it was even against the rules, like Kimo's.

Anyone who is arguing this is not getting the difference between injuring a player trying to make a play versus trying to injury someone just for the sake of trying to injure them or simply for the sake of getting a dirty shot in on them. Both Kimo and Pollard were trying to make legitimate plays, Kimo literally crawled towards Palmer. Burfict already knew Brown did not catch the ball and was trying to inflict an injury or unnecessary shot on him. I have no problem calling out a dirty hit when I see it, even if it's a Steeler. That Ryan Clark hit you referenced was what I would term a dirty and/or unnecessary hit and if he had a history like Burfict does I'd have been fine with a multi-week suspension for him as well.

It's a fast moving violent game and even players not trying to take dirty or late hits are going to unintentionally do it sometimes. It's repeated instances of intentional behavior which the league should come down much harder on then what they just did with Burfict, who likely gets his suspension down to 2 games.

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On 7/9/2016 at 9:35 PM, FUBAR said:

Brown is basically today's Jerry Rice. 

Good comparison, but Brown being about 4 inches shorter doesn't have the TD potential Rice did. Also extra bonus to Rice for doing it an era that didn't have such inflated passing numbers. Also the difference on ypc is massive. 13.5 for Brown, 17.6 for Rice. 

Rice's first 6 seasons: 446/7866/79

Brown's first 6 seasons: 526/7093/38

 

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I am amazed at the prolific numbers Rice posted after the age of 30 years old. 

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21 minutes ago, pghrob said:

I am amazed at the prolific numbers Rice posted after the age of 30 years old. 

Rice was a god. His age 40 season wasn't that bad.

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1 hour ago, Ilov80s said:

Rice was a god. His age 40 season wasn't that bad.

Simply the GOAT.  http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/R/RiceJe00.htm

As far as AB84, he seems to have similar work ethic and skills. His talent might be just a smidgen less than Rice's, but if he has longevity with Roethlisberger as his QB and good health, then he will post similarly gaudy numbers. I doubt his career totals (or anybody else's) will approach Rice's, but if you had to project someone, Brown would be about as sure a bet to approach those lofty career stats. 

I recall Rice heaping praise on Brown’s professional game a while back. It makes sense that a great one would know a great one.

Glad Brown is a Steelers player. They should rework his deal after this season and wrap him up with more guaranteed money that rewards his league leading performances and keeps him a Steelers leader for his career.

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Rice also had the benefit of playing with 3 great QBs that racked up huge passing numbers. 

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1 hour ago, Ilov80s said:

Rice also had the benefit of playing with 3 great QBs that racked up huge passing numbers. 

true.  Ben is a damn fine QB, possible HOFer, but he's not Joe or Steve.

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1 hour ago, FUBAR said:

true.  Ben is a damn fine QB, possible HOFer, but he's not Joe or Steve.

Right and then Rice even got Gannon in his later years. Gannon was no joke in Oakland.

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18 hours ago, FUBAR said:

true.  Ben is a damn fine QB, possible HOFer, but he's not Joe or Steve.

Not Joe, but I'd submit Roethlisberger is as good a passer as Young.  Young did more with his legs, but that doesn't really affect Brown.  As far as passing #s go, they've basically played the exact same # of NFL games in their careers to this point (171 Ben, 169 Young.)  The stats :

Young - 2667/4149 - 64.3% - 33,124 yards - 232 TDs - 107 INT - YPA 8.0 - INT% 2.6

Ben - 3476/5423 - 64.1% - 42,995 yards - 272 TDs - 147 INT - YPA 7.9 - INT% 2.7

 

Roethlisberger benefits in aggregate from today's NFL being more pass-happy but on a per attempt basis, their numbers are REALLY similar.

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23 minutes ago, Evilgrin 72 said:

Not Joe, but I'd submit Roethlisberger is as good a passer as Young.  Young did more with his legs, but that doesn't really affect Brown.  As far as passing #s go, they've basically played the exact same # of NFL games in their careers to this point (171 Ben, 169 Young.)  The stats :

Young - 2667/4149 - 64.3% - 33,124 yards - 232 TDs - 107 INT - YPA 8.0 - INT% 2.6

Ben - 3476/5423 - 64.1% - 42,995 yards - 272 TDs - 147 INT - YPA 7.9 - INT% 2.7

 

Roethlisberger benefits in aggregate from today's NFL being more pass-happy but on a per attempt basis, their numbers are REALLY similar.

You might say I'm making the stats biased to reflect what I want them to, but I'd only consider Young's San Fran years vs. Ben's Steelers years.  Ben did throw for more yards, but in the other meaningful categories, Young was better.  Plus, he was a LOT better relative to the rest of the league. Steve led the league in passer rating his first four years starting, and six out of seven. Ben has never led the league in rating.  If you want to just look at the years Ben had Brown and Steve had Jerry, it's closer.  Steve had a higher completion percentage, and again led the league five times while Ben led in that category zero times.

So while I don't really disagree with you, it's worth noting just how much better Steve was in San Fran compared to the rest of the league while Ben simply wasn't as good relative to his peers.  I doubt anyone would argue for Ben being the best QB in the last decade, probably not even top 5 but nobody is going to argue against Young being in the top 2 of the 90s (Favre being the other).

[/hijack]

Back on topic - Ben will probably utilize Brown even more this year despite bringing Green in at TE.  There's simply no doubt in my mind that Brown is the best receiver in the league (with all due respect to Julio and OBJ), his QB loves him and the offense will utilize him. He is the best player in PPR leagues.

Edited by FUBAR

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Quote

Antonio Brown will not hold out of Steelers camp despite displeasure with his contract.

 

Brown is still working on the six-year, $43 million deal the Steelers gave him in 2012 after Mike Wallace rejected it. He caught 136 balls last season and collected a $1 million salary. Brown's salary this year is $6.25 million. As Brown is signed through 2017 and Pittsburgh has one of the worst cap situations in the league, an extension will probably be put off until next offseason.
 
 
Source: ESPN.com 
Jul 27 - 8:55 AM

 

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1 hour ago, Faust said:

 

Props to Brown for being a man and fulfilling his contract.

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In terms of redraft, is everyone pretty much on board with this guy as number one overall? As in, to take anyone else is overthinking and outsmarting yourself? Guy put up 1800 yards last year and didn't have Ben for 4 games. In 3 of those games, he did almost nothing so 2000 yards was definitely in reach, Ben's health appears to be the only issue.

OBJ appears to be number 2 consensus and could be a 2000 yard WR if their offense actually used him in the way Steelers use Brown. He maybe has more TD upside. Even in non-ppr, I think Brown has the edge over OBJ. The backs, Gurley and Johnson still a bit unproven, AP most proven but age may catch up. I'm waffling and lost track of my question now, so yeah, AB84 number one pick :-)

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34 minutes ago, LionOfGosforth said:

In terms of redraft, is everyone pretty much on board with this guy as number one overall? As in, to take anyone else is overthinking and outsmarting yourself? Guy put up 1800 yards last year and didn't have Ben for 4 games. In 3 of those games, he did almost nothing so 2000 yards was definitely in reach, Ben's health appears to be the only issue.

OBJ appears to be number 2 consensus and could be a 2000 yard WR if their offense actually used him in the way Steelers use Brown. He maybe has more TD upside. Even in non-ppr, I think Brown has the edge over OBJ. The backs, Gurley and Johnson still a bit unproven, AP most proven but age may catch up. I'm waffling and lost track of my question now, so yeah, AB84 number one pick :-)

I just got #1 pick so I'm in the same boat.

 At first, I knew I would take Le'Veon Bell and be done with it.  Since the suspension, I'm between Brown and trying to figure out the next RB to have a huge season.  

The running back position was such a mess in the first round last year.   Contrast that position with Brown's historic consistency and you're right, it seems like a no-brainer.   Still, I have a really hard time going WR at 1.01  

 

AB or RB??

Edited by One

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10 minutes ago, One said:

I just got #1 pick so I'm in the same boat.

 At first, I knew I would take Le'Veon Bell and be done with it.  Since the suspension, I'm between Brown and trying to figure out the next RB to have a huge season.  

The running back position was such a mess in the first round last year.   Contrast that position with Brown's historic consistency and you're right, it seems like a no-brainer.   Still, I have a really hard time going WR at 1.01  

 

AB or RB??

 

I actually like David Johnson quite a bit, reminds me of Shaun Alexander, though his track record is short obviously. Same with Gurley, passes the eye test but short track record and on a poor team too. I think you could make a realistic case to take any of the following: AB, OBJ, Gronk, Gurley, AP, Johnson, Julio. Any of them could be the one to take and there might still be a player who makes a leap (Hopkins? Lamar Miller?). 

I hear what you're saying about feeling squeamish to take a WR at one, doesn't feel quite right but the past few years, so many first round RB's get hurt or disappoint. Taking a TE feels even more crazy but Gronkowski is so much better than the next TE, barring injury, you can absolutely feel justified in taking him. Brown though has had 3 straight brilliant years and is as consistent as they come. OBJ might have more TD upside, you feel like one year he could get close to 20 td's if they really featured him.

I'm probably taking AB though, just too good and too consistent not to take him.

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