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Conspiracy theorists suggest there was more on those tapes than what was released to the public (in terms of other forms of cheating).

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Conspiracy theorists suggest there was more on those tapes than what was released to the public (in terms of other forms of cheating).

That is what I'm trying to find out. They all think there was more on the tapes, I just want to know what they think. That seems to be a mystery.

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Bill Belichick's New England Patriots win a Super Bowl in 2001 despite fielding a roster viewed league-wide as old and one of the most undertalented in the entire NFL. Tom Brady, a game manager in 2001, emerges in 2003 and 2004 when mildly improved Pats rosters win Super Bowls despite their having the league's most games lost due to injuries by starters in both seasons.

In 2005, a new league rule is implemented which Bill Belichick breaks in 2007 by having his video assistant record opponents' signals from the wrong place in the stadium. He is briskly vilified as a cheater, and the critics demand asterisks for the adorementioned three Patriots' SB wins.

That very season, when it could be safely presumed no more 'illegal videotaping' was happening, the Patriots make such an utter mockery of their opponents that the same critics who dubbed BB a fraud now accuse him of running up scores. At this point (or since), no coach in NFL history had ever achieved such total dominance, for half a season, as to make the modern day hyper-competitive NFL look like a bad high school league (and bizarrely, have the point be underlined by his harshest critics t'boot).

The Pats cool down but still run the table, make short work of their early playoff opponents, reach the Super Bowl as the only 18-0 team in league history with the greatest offense in league history, lose a tightly contested matchup... and '18-1' becomes a favourite catcall for Patriots/Belichick haters ("hey, your team narrowly missed becoming the unquestioned GOAT, cementing the GOAT dynasty, with the GOAT coach and QB... ha ha ha, loser!"), who also revert back to the 'cheater' label, still confused as to whether Belichick is a tyrant or a sham.

In 2013, after a few years of less-pronounced success (including another narrow SB loss, another AFCCG appearance, 4 division championships, and the league's second ever 11-win non-playoff season), the critics now add another charge to the mix: incompetence.

In a league where player turnover is so high the average career lasts a mere three years, BB is incompetent because a dozen player acquisitions have been disappointing. By drafting premier TEs in rounds 2 and 4, and a stud RB in round 4, to round out the league's most potent offense with downright revolutionary elements (playcalling, hurry-up, two TE aerial attacks), BB is incompetent because he's failed to replicate this genius with his pass defense.

Despite his incompetence, he's still a bully too, as witnessed by recent Patriot demolitions of good-to-great teams: the 2009 Titans, 2010 Jets, 2011 Broncos, and the 2012 AFC juggernaut Texans... twice. And of course, thanks to a laughable lack of perspective regarding a 2007 mistake, he'll always be a sham too.

Whatever.

Certainly a one-sided view- but something I absolutely agree with...I love to hear about BB having Tom Brady. Which All-Time great coach has NOT had a great/all-time great QB?...By that thinking, every coach with a great QB should win multiple Super Bowls. Guess Sean Payton, Tony Dungy, Mike Holmgren, Don Shula (Marino era) are bums...

I think Belichick is largely a victim of: A) his own success; B) his brusqueness with the media, which is consequently all-to-happy to expound on his negatives and spin stories until they're grotesque versions of the truth (the 'spygate' nonsense is tops here).

What's really sickening is, he's actually a good man. There are plenty of stories of him helping guys out around the league--John Harbaugh owes his job to a BB reference, for instance. There's an epic ESPN story about him stopping on the freeway to help accident victims when everyone else was just flying by. The other guy who stopped got starstruck, and Belichick, busy giving first aid to a person who'd suffered head trauma, gave him a "are you F-ing kidding me?" glare. But he's an irredeemable jerk because he gives lousy interviews after tough losses.

And now, the SB Champion Baltimore Ravens, with the supposedly brilliant Ozzie Newsome at GM, get totally gutted within the first few days of free agency, and what's the big story? 'Arrogant Belichick embarrasses himself' by losing Wes Welker, despite having already replaced him a day earlier. Look at the ESPN story from a few days ago that spun Brady's lenient contract demands as proof the Patriots are finished!

When it comes to Bill Belichick people are in the twilight zone.

Why did you forget to mention he was banging another man's wife for a while there? Edited by Steed

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Bill Belichick's New England Patriots win a Super Bowl in 2001 despite fielding a roster viewed league-wide as old and one of the most undertalented in the entire NFL. Tom Brady, a game manager in 2001, emerges in 2003 and 2004 when mildly improved Pats rosters win Super Bowls despite their having the league's most games lost due to injuries by starters in both seasons.

In 2005, a new league rule is implemented which Bill Belichick breaks in 2007 by having his video assistant record opponents' signals from the wrong place in the stadium. He is briskly vilified as a cheater, and the critics demand asterisks for the adorementioned three Patriots' SB wins.

That very season, when it could be safely presumed no more 'illegal videotaping' was happening, the Patriots make such an utter mockery of their opponents that the same critics who dubbed BB a fraud now accuse him of running up scores. At this point (or since), no coach in NFL history had ever achieved such total dominance, for half a season, as to make the modern day hyper-competitive NFL look like a bad high school league (and bizarrely, have the point be underlined by his harshest critics t'boot).

The Pats cool down but still run the table, make short work of their early playoff opponents, reach the Super Bowl as the only 18-0 team in league history with the greatest offense in league history, lose a tightly contested matchup... and '18-1' becomes a favourite catcall for Patriots/Belichick haters ("hey, your team narrowly missed becoming the unquestioned GOAT, cementing the GOAT dynasty, with the GOAT coach and QB... ha ha ha, loser!"), who also revert back to the 'cheater' label, still confused as to whether Belichick is a tyrant or a sham.

In 2013, after a few years of less-pronounced success (including another narrow SB loss, another AFCCG appearance, 4 division championships, and the league's second ever 11-win non-playoff season), the critics now add another charge to the mix: incompetence.

In a league where player turnover is so high the average career lasts a mere three years, BB is incompetent because a dozen player acquisitions have been disappointing. By drafting premier TEs in rounds 2 and 4, and a stud RB in round 4, to round out the league's most potent offense with downright revolutionary elements (playcalling, hurry-up, two TE aerial attacks), BB is incompetent because he's failed to replicate this genius with his pass defense.

Despite his incompetence, he's still a bully too, as witnessed by recent Patriot demolitions of good-to-great teams: the 2009 Titans, 2010 Jets, 2011 Broncos, and the 2012 AFC juggernaut Texans... twice. And of course, thanks to a laughable lack of perspective regarding a 2007 mistake, he'll always be a sham too.

Whatever.

Certainly a one-sided view- but something I absolutely agree with...I love to hear about BB having Tom Brady. Which All-Time great coach has NOT had a great/all-time great QB?...By that thinking, every coach with a great QB should win multiple Super Bowls. Guess Sean Payton, Tony Dungy, Mike Holmgren, Don Shula (Marino era) are bums...

I think Belichick is largely a victim of: A) his own success; B) his brusqueness with the media, which is consequently all-to-happy to expound on his negatives and spin stories until they're grotesque versions of the truth (the 'spygate' nonsense is tops here).

What's really sickening is, he's actually a good man. There are plenty of stories of him helping guys out around the league--John Harbaugh owes his job to a BB reference, for instance. There's an epic ESPN story about him stopping on the freeway to help accident victims when everyone else was just flying by. The other guy who stopped got starstruck, and Belichick, busy giving first aid to a person who'd suffered head trauma, gave him a "are you F-ing kidding me?" glare. But he's an irredeemable jerk because he gives lousy interviews after tough losses.

And now, the SB Champion Baltimore Ravens, with the supposedly brilliant Ozzie Newsome at GM, get totally gutted within the first few days of free agency, and what's the big story? 'Arrogant Belichick embarrasses himself' by losing Wes Welker, despite having already replaced him a day earlier. Look at the ESPN story from a few days ago that spun Brady's lenient contract demands as proof the Patriots are finished!

When it comes to Bill Belichick people are in the twilight zone.

Why did you forget to mention he was banging another man's wife for a while there?
you accidentally found a football forum -- this is what you were looking for.

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Conspiracy theorists suggest there was more on those tapes than what was released to the public (in terms of other forms of cheating).

That is what I'm trying to find out. They all think there was more on the tapes, I just want to know what they think. That seems to be a mystery.
I think it's obvious that there were a lot of supersecret signals for plays which you wouldn't want to fall into the hands of some other team.

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For better or for worse, when the league switched to an era of free agency and a salary cap, remaining competitive and keeping a team together became far more difficult.

I think many people will mostly agree who the great coaches were pre-1994. Who else could give BB a run for his money from the past 20 years?

I think this is wrong and way overblown by the media. In fact, Belichick seems to have benefited greatly from the ability to plug in pieces he picks up from free agency.

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For better or for worse, when the league switched to an era of free agency and a salary cap, remaining competitive and keeping a team together became far more difficult.

I think many people will mostly agree who the great coaches were pre-1994. Who else could give BB a run for his money from the past 20 years?

I think this is wrong and way overblown by the media. In fact, Belichick seems to have benefited greatly from the ability to plug in pieces he picks up from free agency.
it really depends on the perspective you use.

a while back I took a look at the niners a couple years prior to the cap -- that year, the final 4 teams were all in the top 7 in payroll, with the niners 25% higher than the other 3, 50% higher than league median, and 100% higher than a division 'rival'.

dynasties like the niners and steelers could monopolize players, and maybe 'roid them up, as in the case of the steelers --- those teams don't benefit by a leveling of the playing field in the way that the chumpy teams do by gaining access to these formally monopolized players in free agency, and these dynasties are what we compare belichick to.

kraft spends to the cap every year, this isn't some chumpy team feeding off scraps trimmed from the elite teams.

competing with 31 other teams for free agents is hardly any kind of advantage for belichick.

edit: to edit further, the reason belichick is forced to cobble in these free agents constantly, is because they are always turning over other players currently on their roster due to the cap, which is not a problem those 'great' teams of yesteryear had to deal with.

Edited by Kool-Aid Larry

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For better or for worse, when the league switched to an era of free agency and a salary cap, remaining competitive and keeping a team together became far more difficult.

I think many people will mostly agree who the great coaches were pre-1994. Who else could give BB a run for his money from the past 20 years?

I think this is wrong and way overblown by the media. In fact, Belichick seems to have benefited greatly from the ability to plug in pieces he picks up from free agency.
it really depends on the perspective you use.

a while back I took a look at the niners a couple years prior to the cap -- that year, the final 4 teams were all in the top 7 in payroll, with the niners 25% higher than the other 3, 50% higher than league median, and 100% higher than a division 'rival'.

dynasties like the niners and steelers could monopolize players, and maybe 'roid them up, as in the case of the steelers --- those teams don't benefit by a leveling of the playing field in the way that the chumpy teams do by gaining access to these formally monopolized players in free agency, and these dynasties are what we compare belichick to.

kraft spends to the cap every year, this isn't some chumpy team feeding off scraps trimmed from the elite teams.

competing with 31 other teams for free agents is hardly any kind of advantage for belichick.

edit: to edit further, the reason belichick is forced to cobble in these free agents constantly, is because they are always turning over other players currently on their roster due to the cap, which is not a problem those 'great' teams of yesteryear had to deal with.

I'd have to look into it more, but just off the top of my head it seems if the Patriots were stuck with the players they drafted, they would hardly be at the level we see them now.

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For better or for worse, when the league switched to an era of free agency and a salary cap, remaining competitive and keeping a team together became far more difficult.

I think many people will mostly agree who the great coaches were pre-1994. Who else could give BB a run for his money from the past 20 years?

I think this is wrong and way overblown by the media. In fact, Belichick seems to have benefited greatly from the ability to plug in pieces he picks up from free agency.
it really depends on the perspective you use.

a while back I took a look at the niners a couple years prior to the cap -- that year, the final 4 teams were all in the top 7 in payroll, with the niners 25% higher than the other 3, 50% higher than league median, and 100% higher than a division 'rival'.

dynasties like the niners and steelers could monopolize players, and maybe 'roid them up, as in the case of the steelers --- those teams don't benefit by a leveling of the playing field in the way that the chumpy teams do by gaining access to these formally monopolized players in free agency, and these dynasties are what we compare belichick to.

kraft spends to the cap every year, this isn't some chumpy team feeding off scraps trimmed from the elite teams.

competing with 31 other teams for free agents is hardly any kind of advantage for belichick.

edit: to edit further, the reason belichick is forced to cobble in these free agents constantly, is because they are always turning over other players currently on their roster due to the cap, which is not a problem those 'great' teams of yesteryear had to deal with.

I'd have to look into it more, but just off the top of my head it seems if the Patriots were stuck with the players they drafted, they would hardly be at the level we see them now.
fa and the cap are not the same thing

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There really is no question about it: Vince F###ing Lombardi was the best coach of all-time. There's a reason why it's called the "Lombardi" Trophy.

[/endOfThread]

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There really is no question about it: Vince F###ing Lombardi was the best coach of all-time. There's a reason why it's called the "Lombardi" Trophy.[/endOfThread]

is this the reason?

Initially inscribed with the words "World Professional Football Championship" and generally referred to as the world championship trophy, it was officially renamed in 1970 in memory of legendary Green Bay Packers head coach Vince Lombardi after his sudden death from cancer and to commemorate his victories in the first two Super Bowls

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For better or for worse, when the league switched to an era of free agency and a salary cap, remaining competitive and keeping a team together became far more difficult.

I think many people will mostly agree who the great coaches were pre-1994. Who else could give BB a run for his money from the past 20 years?

I think this is wrong and way overblown by the media. In fact, Belichick seems to have benefited greatly from the ability to plug in pieces he picks up from free agency.
btw, I'm not sure what your intention was, but the fact that he can maintain a top team over a decade by turning the roster over in fa every couple years is a huge credit to him.

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Since 2000, here are the number of times each team has finished first or tied for first in their division:

12: NEP

8: PIT

7: IND, PHI

6: GB

5: BAL, SDC, NYG, SEA

4: MIA, TEN, OAK, DEN, NOS, STL, CHI

3: CIN, MIN, TBB, SFO, CAR, ATL

2: KCC, HOU, DAL, ARI

1: NYJ, CLE, WAS

0: BUF, DET, JAC

If it were so easy to manage a team, wouldn't other teams be able to do the things needed to win? Sure, the AFC East might not be the most difficult . . . but the Pats still play 10 other games a year (and the schedule is a template that rotates from year to year).

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Since 2000, here are the number of times each team has finished first or tied for first in their division:12: NEP8: PIT7: IND, PHI6: GB5: BAL, SDC, NYG, SEA4: MIA, TEN, OAK, DEN, NOS, STL, CHI3: CIN, MIN, TBB, SFO, CAR, ATL2: KCC, HOU, DAL, ARI1: NYJ, CLE, WAS0: BUF, DET, JACIf it were so easy to manage a team, wouldn't other teams be able to do the things needed to win? Sure, the AFC East might not be the most difficult . . . but the Pats still play 10 other games a year (and the schedule is a template that rotates from year to year).

That's interesting, but I'd like to see how many times each team has made the playoffs in that same timespan. I know the Dolphins have only made the playoffs three times since 2000, and the Bills not a single time, so the Patriots have definitely benefited by being a division with two teams that you pretty much know almost every season aren't going to the playoffs. And here is the work... AFC playoff appearances since 2000:Patriots 10Jets 6Dolphins 3Bills 0 Ravens 9 Steelers 8Bengals 4Browns 1Colts 11Titans 5Texans 2Jags 2Broncos 6Chargers 5Raiders 3Chiefs 3

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There really is no question about it: Vince F###ing Lombardi was the best coach of all-time. There's a reason why it's called the "Lombardi" Trophy. [/endOfThread]

I've always thought Cy Young was overrated in baseball, he never won the Cy Young award even once.

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Lombardi coached in an easy era. Dynasties were common - no FA; no salary caps; half the coaches had no innovation when it came to offensive game calling, formations etc.

Belichik is doing it under much tougher circumstances

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It's been a good run for you, Bill. It is now over. Have a nice retirement. Your QB, who you've been riding all of these years has had it.

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http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11408205/ranking-32-nfl-head-coaches-tiers

There is no way to accurately rank the 32 NFL head coaches, but polling 30 league insiders is a pretty good place to start.

Much like the "QB Tiers" project published earlier in the offseason, I asked what I consider a balanced range of informed voters -- eight current general managers, four former GMs, four personnel directors, four executives, six coordinators and four position coaches -- to provide a 1-5 rating for every head coach.

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It's been a good run for you, Bill. It is now over. Have a nice retirement. Your QB, who you've been riding all of these years has had it.

1/10

You are kidding yourself if you think last night is gonna become the norm. The Patriots will still win the AFC East.

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It's been a good run for you, Bill. It is now over. Have a nice retirement. Your QB, who you've been riding all of these years has had it.

As much as I want the Patriots to go down, Bill is going to trade Brady and make Garoppolo into a star.

To paraphrase Blade "Always bet on Bill"

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It's been a good run for you, Bill. It is now over. Have a nice retirement. Your QB, who you've been riding all of these years has had it.

As much as I want the Patriots to go down, Bill is going to trade Brady and make Garoppolo into a star.

To paraphrase Blade "Always bet on Bill"

Trade Brady to who for what, exactly?

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It's been a good run for you, Bill. It is now over. Have a nice retirement. Your QB, who you've been riding all of these years has had it.

As much as I want the Patriots to go down, Bill is going to trade Brady and make Garoppolo into a star.

To paraphrase Blade "Always bet on Bill"

:lol:

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It's been a good run for you, Bill. It is now over. Have a nice retirement. Your QB, who you've been riding all of these years has had it.

As much as I want the Patriots to go down, Bill is going to trade Brady and make Garoppolo into a star.

To paraphrase Blade "Always bet on Bill"

Trade Brady to who for what, exactly?

Some team will give up a 1st for a future HOF QB on a cheap, non-guaranteed contract.

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It's been a good run for you, Bill. It is now over. Have a nice retirement. Your QB, who you've been riding all of these years has had it.

As much as I want the Patriots to go down, Bill is going to trade Brady and make Garoppolo into a star.

To paraphrase Blade "Always bet on Bill"

Trade Brady to who for what, exactly?

Some team will give up a 1st for a future HOF QB on a cheap, non-guaranteed contract.

Al Davis died. Oh, and Brady's contract is fully guaranteed, through 2017.

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Guest General Tso

Conspiracy theorists suggest there was more on those tapes than what was released to the public (in terms of other forms of cheating).

Wow. David, surprised you'd go there.

I think Bellichek's legacy won't be written by this generation. Way too biased with inaccuracies about the true effect of Spygate in my opinion. Too much Patriot hate out there as well.

Quite possibly the best football mind of all time. All of it overshadowed by his piss poor demeanor and all the crap above.

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It's been a good run for you, Bill. It is now over. Have a nice retirement. Your QB, who you've been riding all of these years has had it.

As much as I want the Patriots to go down, Bill is going to trade Brady and make Garoppolo into a star.

To paraphrase Blade "Always bet on Bill"

Trade Brady to who for what, exactly?

Some team will give up a 1st for a future HOF QB on a cheap, non-guaranteed contract.

Al Davis died. Oh, and Brady's contract is fully guaranteed, through 2017.

My mistake, I was thinking signing bonus. It would be a guaranteed 3 year/24M deal.

The Chiefs gave up a 1st to get a washed up Montana. The Rams wouldn't surprise me if they did it.

Edited by cstu

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Conspiracy theorists suggest there was more on those tapes than what was released to the public (in terms of other forms of cheating).

Wow. David, surprised you'd go there.

I think Bellichek's legacy won't be written by this generation. Way too biased with inaccuracies about the true effect of Spygate in my opinion. Too much Patriot hate out there as well.

Quite possibly the best football mind of all time. All of it overshadowed by his piss poor demeanor and all the crap above.

20 years from now no one will remember Spygate will only remember the Super Bowl wins.

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Conspiracy theorists suggest there was more on those tapes than what was released to the public (in terms of other forms of cheating).

Wow. David, surprised you'd go there.

I think Bellichek's legacy won't be written by this generation. Way too biased with inaccuracies about the true effect of Spygate in my opinion. Too much Patriot hate out there as well.

Quite possibly the best football mind of all time. All of it overshadowed by his piss poor demeanor and all the crap above.

I don't remember bill ever spitting his gum at anybody

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

It's not like this is a new thing. What does BB care about the reporters? Why should he have to care about them?

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20 years from now no one will remember Spygate will only remember the Super Bowl wins.

Nope. Because someone who knows what was on the tapes and exactly how they were used will eventually spill.

Edited by wdcrob

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Conspiracy theorists suggest there was more on those tapes than what was released to the public (in terms of other forms of cheating).

Wow. David, surprised you'd go there.

I think Bellichek's legacy won't be written by this generation. Way too biased with inaccuracies about the true effect of Spygate in my opinion. Too much Patriot hate out there as well.

Quite possibly the best football mind of all time. All of it overshadowed by his piss poor demeanor and all the crap above.

Settle down

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I get a kick out of it when coaches give boring, smart ### answers to reporters. Kind of like when Popovich is a wise acre during those in between quarters interviews. Just because they are required to give them doesn't mean they have to give away information about how they run their team.

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

It's not like this is a new thing. What does BB care about the reporters? Why should he have to care about them?

Because I said it was a new thing.

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20 years from now no one will remember Spygate will only remember the Super Bowl wins.

Nope. Because someone who knows what was on the tapes and exactly how they were used will eventually spill.

:tinfoilhat:

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

It's not like this is a new thing. What does BB care about the reporters? Why should he have to care about them?

Agreed. Media coverage of the NFL hasn't helped grow the game at all leading to more money for coaches' salaries and team resources.

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

It's not like this is a new thing. What does BB care about the reporters? Why should he have to care about them?

Because I said it was a new thing.

I'm sorry. I didn't realize you were 7. My bad.

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

It's not like this is a new thing. What does BB care about the reporters? Why should he have to care about them?

Because I said it was a new thing.

I'm sorry. I didn't realize you were 7. My bad.

If I were 7, I'd use phrases like "my bad."

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

It's not like this is a new thing. What does BB care about the reporters? Why should he have to care about them?

Agreed. Media coverage of the NFL hasn't helped grow the game at all leading to more money for coaches' salaries and team resources.

Ok, sure. What does that have to do with BB providing worthwhile info? He's a robot during the season. Everyone knows this. I'd love for a reporter to suggest that Billy owes them anything. That would be special.

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

I'm sure you would hate it if the Raiders hired him

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

I'm sure you would hate it if the Raiders hired him

Pass.

What has he won since his team got reprimanded for filming opponents?

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Anyone hear his presser a little while ago? This guy is such a jerkoff. The reporters are just trying to do their jobs, and the answer to every question was:

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

"We're on to Cincinnati."

:rolleyes:

I'm sure you would hate it if the Raiders hired him

Pass.

What has he won since his team got reprimanded for filming opponents?

a ####### ####-ton of football games

other than that, I wouldn't know

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