Scooby1974
Footballguy
Does anyone have access the Kiper and McShay Mock Drafts? I saw the first rounders scrolling across ESPN last night and wondered if you guys had any thoughts. Unfortunately I don't have a link.
Kiper5 - Blaine Gabbert - QB - 49ers6 - AJ Green - WR - Browns10 - Cameron Newton - QB - Redksins14 - Julio Jones - WR - Rams15 - Mark Ingram - RB - Dolphins25 - Ryan Mallet - QB - Seahawks27 - Torrey Smith - WR - Falcons28 - Mikel LeShoure - RB - PatriotsDoes anyone have access the Kiper and McShay Mock Drafts? I saw the first rounders scrolling across ESPN last night and wondered if you guys had any thoughts. Unfortunately I don't have a link.
I like Mayock okay and he knows his stuff for sure. It is frustrating that he does not release a mock draft though.Not sure, but Mike Mayock>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone on ESPN.
Fitzgerald isn't the long-term answer at QB. If you're an NFL GM of a team that needs stability at that position and you think a franchise QB is available, you have to take him. I don't know enough about Gabbert -- or any of the QBs really -- to say that he should be drafted this high, but QB is definitely an area of need for us.does anyone here like gabbert in buffalo more than in arizona? whats wrong with fitz?
Kiper5 - Blaine Gabbert - QB - 49ers6 - AJ Green - WR - Browns10 - Cameron Newton - QB - Redksins14 - Julio Jones - WR - Rams15 - Mark Ingram - RB - Dolphins25 - Ryan Mallet - QB - Seahawks27 - Torrey Smith - WR - Falcons28 - Mikel LeShoure - RB - PatriotsDoes anyone have access the Kiper and McShay Mock Drafts? I saw the first rounders scrolling across ESPN last night and wondered if you guys had any thoughts. Unfortunately I don't have a link.
Seems Miami would be a more attractive spot for Ingram. Other than Corey Dillon for a few years, seems like Belichick rotates his backs too much to produce a fantasy stud. BJGE and Woodhead would be part of the 3-headed monster with Ingram. BJGE might get the goalline carries, and Woodhead the 3rd down receptions. Then they'll ride Ingram on 1st & 2nd downs.If Ingram (or another top RB) goes to NE, I will be trading from the #2 pick up in order to grab him. Also, if AJ goes to Cleveland - I will have J.Jones as the #1 WR (if he landed in STL). Talent is important, but a young player's career can be altered permanently based on the team/environment he is drafted into.
Any WR that the Rams draft is definitely going to shoot up draft boards.~~~~~~~~I can't see Ingram falling that far to New England, not many RB's worth a first round pick this year will drive the demand and IMO, Ingram is a better prospect than Spiller or Mathews were.With the 1.1 pick in my dynasty draft I am thinking of taking Julio over AJ Green if they land on those projected teams. Browns (no QB) or Bengals (struggling QB lot of competition at WR) is not the greatest spots. The Rams is a great landing spot with Bradford developing into a good QB.
He sure isn't! He's a WR (you mean Fitzpatrick, of course).I definitely agree with the post. You just can't pass a franchise QB (IF one exists this year and I'm not sure of that). But if one is there, you're probably best served to trade Fitzpatrick to a team that is ok with a guy that wil "get the job done" but isn't ikely the next coming, and then drafting your guy. I generally don't like drafting QBs if the o-line isn't in place (I was very much against the Lions drafting Stafford...worried that they might not be able to keep him healthy and he would end up like David Carr or Joey Harrington). But in this case, the Bills have been spinning aimlessly for a long time and could use something that sticks to get them going again.Fitzgerald isn't the long-term answer at QB. If you're an NFL GM of a team that needs stability at that position and you think a franchise QB is available, you have to take him. I don't know enough about Gabbert -- or any of the QBs really -- to say that he should be drafted this high, but QB is definitely an area of need for us.does anyone here like gabbert in buffalo more than in arizona? whats wrong with fitz?
There are a lot of people that will argue the extrme opposite (talent trumps all) but I am with you on this. It is why I shyed away from Spiller last year and its what we have learned from guys like Braylon Edwards and Lee Evans. I don't knw where you draw the line but it definitely has to be a legit factor you weigh out.If Ingram (or another top RB) goes to NE, I will be trading from the #2 pick up in order to grab him. Also, if AJ goes to Cleveland - I will have J.Jones as the #1 WR (if he landed in STL). Talent is important, but a young player's career can be altered permanently based on the team/environment he is drafted into.
Pats aren't going to draft a RB in the 1st round.Cowboys should get an impact DT, DE, or CB with their pick and could very well be in great position to trade down a bit of anyone wants to jump the Redskins for a QB and still get value. I really want them to land another OL (or 3) but the value just isn't there. I'd say if they can trade down a bit and still get an impact defender and then use that value to move up a few times later (if they have to) to get several OL I'd consider it a great draft.For fantasy ... wonder where Ronnie Brown would go. I'd be surprised if the Pats take a RB. Would the Rams be a great landing spot or just be too crowded at WR with their injured guys coming back and Alexander emerging? Green to Cleveland makes sense but without a good QB that can't be great for his value. Very few existing dynasty players at RB/WR seem to be negatively affected by this mock.
More importantly, why do you want this? To laugh at it?Mayock >>> Kiper >>> Every other person in the entire world >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>McShayAnyone have a link to McShay's first round?
That alone might be your answer. Really do they regularly draft RBs in any round?Why wouldn't the Pats draft a RB in the first round? I don't think BJGE will be there next year and didn't this team take Maroney in the first round? If they did it once they may do it again.
And the Browns do have a QB. His name is Colt McCoy. The problem is that he faces the AFC North while Bradford gets the NFC West. I think the Browns go defense though.
PS. Both guys mock drafts are going to change a million times. They are the biggest flipfloppers around. Draft hype machine is in full effect.
People just don't seem to learn from the offensive merry-go-round that is the Pats. I think people will be pulling their hair out every other week while they spread the ball around one game and run the next. Not like a RB going to NE would produce ADP #s.Ingram or LeShoure in New England = #1 rookie pick I think.
If the law firm put up 1000 yards, 4.4 ypc, and 13 TD's with a measly 12 catches for NE , how much more could a first round talent like Ingraham or LeShoure do?People just don't seem to learn from the offensive merry-go-round that is the Pats. I think people will be pulling their hair out every other week while they spread the ball around one game and run the next. Not like a RB going to NE would produce ADP #s.Ingram or LeShoure in New England = #1 rookie pick I think.
Tackling Dummies said:Not sure, but Mike Mayock>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone on ESPN.
Ronnie Brown could do that in the 10 games he plays in each year.If the law firm put up 1000 yards, 4.4 ypc, and 13 TD's with a measly 12 catches for NE , how much more could a first round talent like Ingraham or LeShoure do?People just don't seem to learn from the offensive merry-go-round that is the Pats. I think people will be pulling their hair out every other week while they spread the ball around one game and run the next. Not like a RB going to NE would produce ADP #s.Ingram or LeShoure in New England = #1 rookie pick I think.
I disagree. Strongly.Ryan Fitzpatrick > Any QB in this draft.
lol me as well, and I am a senior at Alabama...I disagree. Strongly.Ryan Fitzpatrick > Any QB in this draft.
I'm personally not sure Green is that much more talented than Jones anyway (although the consensus states he is) and I'll take a 9 with Bradford over a 10 with McCoy - and I actually kind of like McCoy.Shutout said:There are a lot of people that will argue the extrme opposite (talent trumps all) but I am with you on this. It is why I shyed away from Spiller last year and its what we have learned from guys like Braylon Edwards and Lee Evans. I don't knw where you draw the line but it definitely has to be a legit factor you weigh out.fdctrumpet said:If Ingram (or another top RB) goes to NE, I will be trading from the #2 pick up in order to grab him. Also, if AJ goes to Cleveland - I will have J.Jones as the #1 WR (if he landed in STL). Talent is important, but a young player's career can be altered permanently based on the team/environment he is drafted into.
I have to agree. None of these guys excite me. Chance are more likely that they turn out to be a Alex Smith or David Carr than Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco or Sam Bradford. My team has so many needs that I would rather go with Grossman and pick a top player like Julio Jones than one of them that wont be NFL ready for 2-3 years.Also, if there is a CBA agreement signed before the draft, the rookie RB's will fall in the draft because there are alot of FA rb's on the market and available for trade.Ryan Fitzpatrick > Any QB in this draft.
For the 5 players that Mayock ranks, this might be true. If you are interested in the draft beyond 2 rounds, he ain't your guy.Tackling Dummies said:Not sure, but Mike Mayock>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone on ESPN.
Mayock may not rank them all but if you listen to him and read what he rights about multiple players, you'll be just as informed. Mocking the later rounds is often just about as accurate as reading tea leaves. So much changes with every pick and every week.I love mocks, but they aren't he only source of info even for later rounds. Besides, what use is a mock which in the fifth round lists the players name and that's it? Which is what many mocks do past the second or third round.I like them, they at least give me an idea of what a guy THINKS a team may be looking at late. But that's about it.massraider said:For the 5 players that Mayock ranks, this might be true. If you are interested in the draft beyond 2 rounds, he ain't your guy.Not sure, but Mike Mayock>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone on ESPN.
fixedi just wonder who these guys talk to for this information? the school's SID, LOL?Buffalo Bills
Record: 4-12
Blaine Gabbert, QB, Missouri
The Bills are in need of a franchise quarterback, and with Luck not on the board, Gabbert is the best available signal-caller. He has the physical tools and football smarts to become a very good NFL QB once he makes the full transition to a pro-style offense.
Is your Mizzou contact not a fan of his pro potential?fixed i just wonder who these guys talk to for this information? the school's SID, LOL?hey draft guru fellas, talk to the position coaches please!
I am not interested in mocks for the later rounds, but I am interested in players that will be drafted in later rounds. I completely disagree that you'll be just as informed by listening to Mayock. But this isn't meant as a slam. I love Mayock, and his commentary during Senior Bowl practices, and video breakdown is probably the best stuff you'll hear leading up to the draft.Mayock may not rank them all but if you listen to him and read what he rights about multiple players, you'll be just as informed. Mocking the later rounds is often just about as accurate as reading tea leaves. So much changes with every pick and every week.I love mocks, but they aren't he only source of info even for later rounds. Besides, what use is a mock which in the fifth round lists the players name and that's it? Which is what many mocks do past the second or third round.massraider said:For the 5 players that Mayock ranks, this might be true. If you are interested in the draft beyond 2 rounds, he ain't your guy.Not sure, but Mike Mayock>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone on ESPN.
I like them, they at least give me an idea of what a guy THINKS a team may be looking at late. But that's about it.
On the contrary, I think BB will use a player to his ability - ala Corey Dillon.But, like Dillon, I wouldn't be surprised to see NE grab a veteran back, like DeAngelo Williams... and use the high pick on another position.Dawg Pound 69 said:Seems Miami would be a more attractive spot for Ingram. Other than Corey Dillon for a few years, seems like Belichick rotates his backs too much to produce a fantasy stud. BJGE and Woodhead would be part of the 3-headed monster with Ingram. BJGE might get the goalline carries, and Woodhead the 3rd down receptions. Then they'll ride Ingram on 1st & 2nd downs.If Ingram (or another top RB) goes to NE, I will be trading from the #2 pick up in order to grab him. Also, if AJ goes to Cleveland - I will have J.Jones as the #1 WR (if he landed in STL). Talent is important, but a young player's career can be altered permanently based on the team/environment he is drafted into.
I hear you, but they used to say this about WR, too. Again, I think, BB will use a player to their ability.People just don't seem to learn from the offensive merry-go-round that is the Pats. I think people will be pulling their hair out every other week while they spread the ball around one game and run the next. Not like a RB going to NE would produce ADP #s.Ingram or LeShoure in New England = #1 rookie pick I think.
I agree with you here. Mayock admittedly focuses on the top 100 or so players. ESPN is enormously larger than the NFL Network. I think Kiper has quite bit more to his disposal than Mayock does. Despite all that, has Kiper's comments on those later round picks ever helped you out at all? I don't keep track, so I don't know.I am not interested in mocks for the later rounds, but I am interested in players that will be drafted in later rounds.
I completely disagree that you'll be just as informed by listening to Mayock. But this isn't meant as a slam. I love Mayock, and his commentary during Senior Bowl practices, and video breakdown is probably the best stuff you'll hear leading up to the draft.
But he just doesn't know as many players. He doesn't discuss as many players, doesn't rank players beyond top 5, and during all-star games and pre-draft stuff, he tends to harp on a few players. How much time did he spend talking about Mike Iupati vs. every other player at the Senior Bowl last year?
I really think Kiper and Mayock are different animals, and bring different things to the table. Kiper gets a lot of flack, and I really think it's mainly because of the way he comes off. He's not great on TV. But on Day 2 of the draft, I watch ESPN, because Kiper is the guy that is gonna have actual info about the 5th round LB that just got drafted. There just isn't a guy that I know of that knows more about these players, and can recite that info at will, than Kiper.
Mayock does the X's and O's, and points out flaws in a guy's game better than anyone. But when your team takes some Appalachian State CB in the 6th, and you want to know who the heck he is, Mayock ain't the guy.
The reality is that is that the 6th round pick is an outlier and makes the team, much less breaking down film of his 2010 season. Sure, there are undrafted and late round picks that do make it, but the picks during that phase of the draft are little more than than names on a ticker. Garda pointed out earlier about reading tea leaves and that applies ideally from the first pick.Mayock does the X's and O's, and points out flaws in a guy's game better than anyone. But when your team takes some Appalachian State CB in the 6th, and you want to know who the heck he is, Mayock ain't the guy.
People like new toys. The QB class this year is awful. I would take Fitz over any of these guys and it isn't close IMO.I have to agree. None of these guys excite me. Chance are more likely that they turn out to be a Alex Smith or David Carr than Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco or Sam Bradford. My team has so many needs that I would rather go with Grossman and pick a top player like Julio Jones than one of them that wont be NFL ready for 2-3 years.Also, if there is a CBA agreement signed before the draft, the rookie RB's will fall in the draft because there are alot of FA rb's on the market and available for trade.Ryan Fitzpatrick > Any QB in this draft.
Garda was talking about mock drafts. Which I was not. Mocks are strictly coversation fodder for the pre-draft days. Something for fans to debate. You are bringing up a different point, which I don't agree with either. You are basically saying (correct me if I am wrong), "late round guys don't matter so much, so who care about Kiper's knowledge of them." Or something along those lines. And unless you have been under a rock for 30 years, you know that a LOT of people care. The draft has become a three day televised monster. That most of these players drafted after the 3rd round have little chance of success doesn't matter one tiny little bit. Fans still want to know about them. And on day three, when they go team-by-team, Kiper is they guy that can speak intelligently about every player on every teams board. Period. No one else. No one on TV, anyway. On Day Three, it's ESPN on TV, and NFL Draft Scout on the laptop. Anyone who has been following the draft for awhile, can remember a Kiper whiff. He's been there for 30+ years, for Pete's sake. There are a lot of draftnik with misguided hatred for him, when he is in fact the granddaddy of their current obsession. McShay and Mayock have their current jobs because of Kiper. And they still can't do it as good as he can, although as I said, Mayock does a different job. And Kiper still brings it. He is still the biggest draft dweeb of them all, and knows the players inside and out. Watching him rattle off info on a guy that just got picked on Day 3 is unreal. He will get made fun of, relentlessly, for pimping Clausen so hard last year. And as long as McShay gets the same static for having McCoy ranked over Suh, I am fine with that.The reality is that is that the 6th round pick is an outlier and makes the team, much less breaking down film of his 2010 season. Sure, there are undrafted and late round picks that do make it, but the picks during that phase of the draft are little more than than names on a ticker. Garda pointed out earlier about reading tea leaves and that applies ideally from the first pick.Mayock does the X's and O's, and points out flaws in a guy's game better than anyone. But when your team takes some Appalachian State CB in the 6th, and you want to know who the heck he is, Mayock ain't the guy.