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timschochet

Dr. Gobbler welched out on his bet from year ago in this thread

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I was embarrassed and ashamed today to be a Lakers fan. But I'll get over it. Here are the 9 Lakers that were important to the team this year:Kobe Bryant How many years does he have left?Pau Gasol Terrible post season- is he still a star player?Derek Fisher Is he done?Ron Artest Any trade value?Andrew Bynum Looking at a several game suspension. One of two players with major trade value.Lamar Odom Had his best year. The other player with trade value.Steve Blake Basically worthless.Matt Barnes Role playerShannon Brown Role player.Who goes, who stays?The other key question is who is the new head coach? Will it be one of Phil's assistants or someone new? And will they stay with the triangle?Should our concern be to rebuild, or are there enough pieces to compete for a championship next year? Pretend you are Mitch Kupchak; what should you do?

Edited by timschochet

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I was embarrassed and ashamed today to be a Lakers fan. But I'll get over it. Here are the 9 Lakers that were important to the team this year:

Kobe Bryant How many years does he have left?

Pau Gasol Terrible post season- is he still a star player?

Derek Fisher Time to release him?

Ron Artest Trade? Release?

Andrew Bynum Looking at a several game suspension. One of two players with major trade value.

Lamar Odom Had his best year. The other player with trade value.

Steve Blake Basically worthless.

Matt Barnes Role player

Shannon Brown Role player.

Who goes, who stays?

The other key question is who is the new head coach? Will it be one of Phil's assistants or someone new? And will they stay with the triangle?

Should our concern be to rebuild, or are there enough pieces to compete for a championship next year? Pretend you are Mitch Kupchak; what should you do?

:mellow:

What do you mean by "release"?

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I was embarrassed and ashamed today to be a Lakers fan. But I'll get over it. Here are the 9 Lakers that were important to the team this year:

Kobe Bryant How many years does he have left?

Pau Gasol Terrible post season- is he still a star player?

Derek Fisher Time to release him?

Ron Artest Trade? Release?

Andrew Bynum Looking at a several game suspension. One of two players with major trade value.

Lamar Odom Had his best year. The other player with trade value.

Steve Blake Basically worthless.

Matt Barnes Role player

Shannon Brown Role player.

Who goes, who stays?

The other key question is who is the new head coach? Will it be one of Phil's assistants or someone new? And will they stay with the triangle?

Should our concern be to rebuild, or are there enough pieces to compete for a championship next year? Pretend you are Mitch Kupchak; what should you do?

:mellow:

What do you mean by "release"?

:goodposting: and :lmao:

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Release means I was a little drunk when I wrote that. I guess you can't release players in the NBA, I forgot. But Fish and Artest are pretty valueless at this point. What to do with them?

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Release means I was a little drunk when I wrote that. I guess you can't release players in the NBA, I forgot. But Fish and Artest are pretty valueless at this point. What to do with them?

What do you do with them? You pay them. And let them destroy cap space.

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There's a rumor that Chris Paul would like to be a Laker. Is there any conceivable way to make this happen?

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Still can't believe Luke Walton is gonna cost them almost $12 mil the next 2 seasons, averaging 1.7 PPG and 1.20 RPG. Truly a charmed life.

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Lakers brass did not consult Bryant during their coaching search, but sources say Bryant has great respect for Brown and is on board with the hiring.

This is what matters. Kobe has to buy in or this would be a failure from the jump. I'm cautiously optimistic. I thought Brown did a good job in Cleveland. I guess we'll get to see if the Brown haters were correct about his limitations, or if they were just making excuses for King James. :shrug:

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As a Laker Hater, this hiring makes me happy.

The wheels, they are a coming off!!!

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Lakers brass did not consult Bryant during their coaching search, but sources say Bryant has great respect for Brown and is on board with the hiring.

This is what matters. Kobe has to buy in or this would be a failure from the jump. I'm cautiously optimistic. I thought Brown did a good job in Cleveland. I guess we'll get to see if the Brown haters were correct about his limitations, or if they were just making excuses for King James. :shrug:
"If you're building a championship team, your DNA always has to start with the defensive end of the floor," Bryant said on May 11. "Always. I'm a firm believer in that. I don't believe in building a championship team on offense. It has to be built on defense and rebounding. Period."I never understood the Brian Shaw hype. He's not Phil Jackson any more than Shannon Brown will become Kobe Bryant when he retires.

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Better than Dunleavy at least.

Maybe that's why the Lakers leaked his name as being on the list - to keep people from being too disappointed in the eventual hire.

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Better than Dunleavy at least.

Amen.

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Better than Dunleavy at least.

Amen.
I'd rather have Tobais coach the Lakers than Dunleavy. Brown is still a bad hire. Probably very bad. He doesn't have a collection of young unproven guys (and Ilgauskas) led by James to play tight D. He's got a bunch of aging, large, slow footed, entitled vets who have a knack for taking the regular season off. Roster makeup wise, it's the complete opposite of what he had in Cleveland which he got to play hard every night but ultimately wasn't talented enough to win in the playoffs against elite talent. This is the revenge of Del Harris here.

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Better than Dunleavy at least.

Amen.
I'd rather have Tobais coach the Lakers than Dunleavy. Brown is still a bad hire. Probably very bad. He doesn't have a collection of young unproven guys (and Ilgauskas) led by James to play tight D. He's got a bunch of aging, large, slow footed, entitled vets who have a knack for taking the regular season off. Roster makeup wise, it's the complete opposite of what he had in Cleveland which he got to play hard every night but ultimately wasn't talented enough to win in the playoffs against elite talent. This is the revenge of Del Harris here.
That's a fair criticism. I hope you're wrong, and I'm sure you do too.

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Better than Dunleavy at least.

Amen.
I'd rather have Tobais coach the Lakers than Dunleavy. Brown is still a bad hire. Probably very bad. He doesn't have a collection of young unproven guys (and Ilgauskas) led by James to play tight D. He's got a bunch of aging, large, slow footed, entitled vets who have a knack for taking the regular season off. Roster makeup wise, it's the complete opposite of what he had in Cleveland which he got to play hard every night but ultimately wasn't talented enough to win in the playoffs against elite talent. This is the revenge of Del Harris here.
Way too early to make this leap. A guy can either coach or not. Anybody's who has coached for a decade + has had to adapt to changing rosters. He has coached a superstar. James had nothing but great things to say about him. I liked his demeanor on the bench when he coached, and his players seemed to play hard for him. I like Brown better than Dunleavy and a slew of others, including Shaw.

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http://www.nba.com/lakers/news/110621lakersannounce_broadcastteams.html

Longtime Southern California area broadcasters Bill Macdonald (television) and John Ireland (radio) will serve as the team’s play-by-play announcers for the upcoming 2011-12 season.

I'm glad Joel Myers is gone. I never liked his voice, look or announcing style.

I was ok with Spero Dedes, except for the way he pronounced "Scola"; sounded pretty fruity.

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The NBA thread is fine, but out of respect for those fans who either detest the Lakers or simply don't want to have to keep hearing about them at the expense of other teams, I thought it would be better to have a thread devoted to them, as we normally do around here. The questions abound, beginning, of course, with Dwight Howard. Should the Lakers trade two of their big men to get him? I say yes. We also need a point guard very badly. Baron Davis? Or is there somebody else?

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http://lakersblog.la...obe-bryant.html

Mike Brown's offense likely to use Kobe Bryant in multiple ways

It's a no-brainer that Kobe Bryant will play a large role in Mike Brown's offense. He's Kobe Bryant, and he's kind of a good player.

How he's used in the offense, however, may be different than in previous years. Brown's offense involves more high-post and pick-and-roll activity than Phil Jackson's triangle, which focused on spacing. It's uncertain what effect a prolonged off-season and an innovative procedure on his surgically repaired right knee will have on Bryant's health. We also don't know how Brown will actually handle the pecking order between Bryant, Pau Gasol and Andrew Bynum. But based on Brown's comments to the media, here are a few ideas:

1. Post-ups. Bryant has resorted more to a post-up game in the past two seasons to preserve energy and because he studied more moves from Hall of Fame center Hakeem Olajuwon. This would be a sound strategy considering he shot 49.3% from that area, according to Synergy Sports. Brown envisions Bryant receiving shots from the mid-to-high post, a spot Brown refers to as "the Karl Malone area." 2. Pick-and-roll. Bryant's not going to suddenly become Chris Paul. But this could become an effective way to ensure that Pau Gasol gets more touches. It's likely Gasol and Bryant would run these sets more than the Black Mamba would with Andrew Bynum considering the Lakers' center lacks mobility. Bryant may not be as an effective shooter in this department Synergy says he shot only 39.4% off pick-and-roll plays last season.

3. Off-the-ball. Bryant needs to do more of this because it will ensure more spacing on the floor. It'll also prove harder to guard him. "Any time you can have somebody come off screens and move somebody off the ball," Brown said, "they're harder to double-team."

4. Isolation. Brown routinely talked about ensuring Bryant receives looks in his "sweet spots." Brown never defined where those are, but Synergy tabs that the plurality of Bryant's shots last season (31.5%) came in isolation sets. Bryant's proved effective in this department, shooting 44%, but he may want to temper running isos. Doing so would conserve more energy and better ball movement.

5. Triangle. Brown may largely stay away from Jackson's offense, but says he'll still "sprinkle in bits and pieces." Brown has remained vague about which of the seven principles of the triangle offense he might use. Those principles are penetrating front-line defenders, ensuring balanced spacing, ball movement, ability to pass to any teammate at any given time, strong rebounding positioning and defensive balance, ability to change player positions and using individual talents.

Edited by timschochet

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Howard makes 18 million. Pau makes more than that by himself so I don't see that trade happening. Even if it would work, I don't think we should trade both Pau and Bynum for Howard but I think Bynum and some other pieces would be great.

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In the NBA thread Tgunz quoted an Orange County Register article which makes Bynum's offseason training sound incredible. He's working with Freddie Roach, lost 10 pounds, in the best shape of his life, etc. etc.

This has me worried now. Could those of us pushing so hard for a Howard trade (which would inevitably involve Bynum) be wrong about this?

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In the NBA thread Tgunz quoted an Orange County Register article which makes Bynum's offseason training sound incredible. He's working with Freddie Roach, lost 10 pounds, in the best shape of his life, etc. etc. This has me worried now. Could those of us pushing so hard for a Howard trade (which would inevitably involve Bynum) be wrong about this?

No. Even if Bynum is in the best shape of his life, if he's simply injury prone that won't change. And he'd still only be in the same shape as Howard is every year. Howard is better than Bynum in every conceivable way except, sometimes, scoring. But if we have Kobe, Pau, Odom, we don't really need Howard to score. He'll still get some points but his defense and rebounding will take the Lakers to another level. IMO Bynum just doesn't have that killer instinct that the best players have. He's had 6 years to get it and he just doesn't, at least not consistently.

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Lakers need a PG more than they need another center.

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IMO Bynum just doesn't have that killer instinct that the best players have. He's had 6 years to get it and he just doesn't, at least not consistently.

Unless he's faced with a midget whose team is blowing Bynum's out trying to drive the lane.

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No. Even if Bynum is in the best shape of his life, if he's simply injury prone that won't change. And he'd still only be in the same shape as Howard is every year. Howard is better than Bynum in every conceivable way except, sometimes, scoring. But if we have Kobe, Pau, Odom, we don't really need Howard to score. He'll still get some points but his defense and rebounding will take the Lakers to another level. IMO Bynum just doesn't have that killer instinct that the best players have. He's had 6 years to get it and he just doesn't, at least not consistently.

I'm all for trading Bynum in a package for Howard as well, but I think the bold is a bit much. Bynum has far better offensive "basketball" skills. Howard is just simply an athletic freak who plays hoops. When it comes to post moves, passing, free throws, etc, Bynum >>>> Howard.

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Lakers need a PG more than they need another center.

We're not trading Bynum for a PG so it doesn't matter. Nothing prevents them from going after a PG AND making this trade if it's on the table.

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When it comes to post moves, passing, free throws, etc, Bynum >>>> Howard.

Until I see otherwise (color me skeptical about the impact of Bynum's "incredible" offseason regimen), Howard is extremely more agile, with better feet than Bynum. He gets where he wants to on that side of the ball much more easily than Bynum. I don't know that Bynum is that much better than Howard when it comes to passing either.

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Lakers need a PG more than they need another center.

We're not trading Bynum for a PG so it doesn't matter. Nothing prevents them from going after a PG AND making this trade if it's on the table.
I had Odom in mind as the tradable piece. Getting either Howard or an elite PG would be great, but I just think that if you're going to move Odom, I'd rather have the PG in return over Howard. But either one would be a huge upgrade.

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As regards point guards, we never really needed one under Phil Jackson. How many great point guards has he coached? The triangle doesn't demand a point guard. Now that the offense is changing to a more traditional one, a point guard becomes necessary.

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No. Even if Bynum is in the best shape of his life, if he's simply injury prone that won't change. And he'd still only be in the same shape as Howard is every year. Howard is better than Bynum in every conceivable way except, sometimes, scoring. But if we have Kobe, Pau, Odom, we don't really need Howard to score. He'll still get some points but his defense and rebounding will take the Lakers to another level. IMO Bynum just doesn't have that killer instinct that the best players have. He's had 6 years to get it and he just doesn't, at least not consistently.

I'm all for trading Bynum in a package for Howard as well, but I think the bold is a bit much. Bynum has far better offensive "basketball" skills. Howard is just simply an athletic freak who plays hoops. When it comes to post moves, passing, free throws, etc, Bynum >>>> Howard.
I'll give Bynum FT's obviously. We be getting another Shaq at the line with Howard, although at least he tries to improve. But you're still only talking 60% versus 68%. Howard has a higher PPG avg., FG%, and Reb. Avg. per 36 minutes. Note that I used the per 36 minute average to compensate for their differing minute allocations. Here's a good article on Howard's improving offense:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/521084-orlando-magic-is-dwight-howards-offense-finally-catching-up-with-his-defense

Bynum may be a marginally better passer but I don't think anyone is thinking about passing when deciding whether to trade these two. Lastly, I'll say this. The thing that makes me WANT this trade, if it can be done, has nothing to do with any of the stats above. It's the fact that Howard plays pretty much EVERY game. I'm extremely worried that Bynum is a china doll. The only season he's played all 82 reg. season games he only played 22 min./game. The most he's played in any other season is 65. He can't help us if he's not on the floor or if we have to monitor his minutes due to injury concerns. So, even with the slight upside Bynum MIGHT have in a couple of areas I think Howard is a significant upgrade and I'd do that deal without reservation.

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So you guys would be all for trading Gasol and Bynum for Howard?

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Lakers need a PG more than they need another center.

We're not trading Bynum for a PG so it doesn't matter. Nothing prevents them from going after a PG AND making this trade if it's on the table.
I had Odom in mind as the tradable piece. Getting either Howard or an elite PG would be great, but I just think that if you're going to move Odom, I'd rather have the PG in return over Howard. But either one would be a huge upgrade.
Odom only makes 9 mil/year so the numbers won't work. I think we need shooters more than a PG. We can have Odom or Kobe bring the ball up. If we work inside out a true PG isn't as necessary. There's a story out there that the Lakers brought in Jason Kapono for a look see. They might be able to get him for the veterans minimum of 1 million. I think that might help open up the floor in ways Fisher and Blake couldn't last year.

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So you guys would be all for trading Gasol and Bynum for Howard?

Depends on what else the Lakers would be getting back.

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So you guys would be all for trading Gasol and Bynum for Howard?

Depends on what else the Lakers would be getting back.
Really? Because I don't think it does. The answer is yes, IMO.

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So you guys would be all for trading Gasol and Bynum for Howard?

Depends on what else the Lakers would be getting back.
It be either Turkoglu or Arenas.

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So you guys would be all for trading Gasol and Bynum for Howard?

Depends on what else the Lakers would be getting back.
Really? Because I don't think it does. The answer is yes, IMO.
Wow. I know you like to take elaborate views to cause a discussion, but this is crazy.

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So you guys would be all for trading Gasol and Bynum for Howard?

Depends on what else the Lakers would be getting back.
It be either Turkoglu or Arenas.
If that's it I'd say no thanks, particularly if it's Arenas.

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