What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

Apple (AAPL) : Tim Cook announces iForum. Dodds and Bryant prepare shut down operations (3 Viewers)

'bagger said:
:eek: +14.34 (2.81%)

I'm making more on this stock every morning before I get to work than I actually make in the office all day. An incredible run.
yeah, i want to buy in but am going to have to wait this one out until there is a dip to get some value.
582 and plowing forward. I think I'm moving up a tax bracket or two. :popcorn: :banned: :excited: :thumbup: :banned:

The value Bagger is that this stock will prolly be over 700 by yrs end. My last buy in (calls) was at the 515-520 level. Even then, I felt I was taking a leap of faith (massive runup). Its going to feel like this when you make the trade, because it is. Payoffs have been crazy, unlike anything I have ever experienced in the market.

 
Funny thing is that the stock should be up $130 not $30. I think Apple here at $450 is one of the best entry points I have seen in a long time. You are basically paying 12 times earnings for a company that is doubling year over year with $100 billion in cash and no debt. This year they will release a new iPad, the long awaited iPhone 5 (completely new form factor) and perhaps Apple TV. More importantly you will see Apple get tremendous traction in China and India in 2012. You have a scenario now with hundreds of millions of people around the world who have purchased an iPhone and who as a result will switch to an iMac or Macbook for their next computer. Very few of these people will ever buy a non-Apple product again for the foreseeable future. As I have said for years barring any major screw ups or a global meltdown Apple will be the world's 1st trillion dollar company in the next few years. It is currently valued at $450billion. Oh yea - one more thing: Apple will announce a dividend this year (I strongly believe this announcement will come in the next 3-6 months or sooner) and on the day it is announced we will likely see a 50-100 point move in Apple stock. Good luck
I didn't think we'd see 150 points so soon....so much more news to come :pickle:
 
Funny thing is that the stock should be up $130 not $30. I think Apple here at $450 is one of the best entry points I have seen in a long time. You are basically paying 12 times earnings for a company that is doubling year over year with $100 billion in cash and no debt. This year they will release a new iPad, the long awaited iPhone 5 (completely new form factor) and perhaps Apple TV. More importantly you will see Apple get tremendous traction in China and India in 2012. You have a scenario now with hundreds of millions of people around the world who have purchased an iPhone and who as a result will switch to an iMac or Macbook for their next computer. Very few of these people will ever buy a non-Apple product again for the foreseeable future. As I have said for years barring any major screw ups or a global meltdown Apple will be the world's 1st trillion dollar company in the next few years. It is currently valued at $450billion. Oh yea - one more thing: Apple will announce a dividend this year (I strongly believe this announcement will come in the next 3-6 months or sooner) and on the day it is announced we will likely see a 50-100 point move in Apple stock. Good luck
I didn't think we'd see 150 points so soon....so much more news to come :pickle:Although I don't think Apple will announce a dividend. With Obama dead set on raising the tax on dividends from 15% to 40%, they won't get as much bang for the buck. I do think they will announce a stock buyback, which will have the effect of raising their EPS, and rewarding shareholders.
BTW, a year ago Apple was at $350 a share. Today it closed at $590. That's up 68%. However, Apple's latest quarter had sales up 73% over the year ago quarter, and EPS up 115% over year ago quarter.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
'Ned said:
599 pre-market...
I feel like each morning I wake up, I have a scratchoff lottery ticket sitting in front of me. and I keep winning the 5K-10K big prize it offers. Selling my March calls today in all likelihood. I'll still be holding a couple deep in the money april calls and a couple of june calls that smashed through 560 a couple days ago.
 
599 pre-market...
I feel like each morning I wake up, I have a scratchoff lottery ticket sitting in front of me. and I keep winning the 5K-10K big prize it offers. Selling my March calls today in all likelihood. I'll still be holding a couple deep in the money april calls and a couple of june calls that smashed through 560 a couple days ago.
Yeah, most options have been :moneybag: for us AAPL longs. Do you do any complex options trades or are you pretty simple in your approach? I've just really started understanding and appreciating the beauty of options about 5 years ago. If you see any trades that look attractive post them here. Always interested.
 
Keep moving your stops up. Nothing goes up forever. This is a parabolic blow-off. Never short a stock in a parabolic blowoff, but be careful. It's historically almost impossible to time things perfectly....but you can be sure that the stock will plunge at some point soon. It simply has to. So be prepared to sell and take your profits.

 
How would this buyback work?

I bought 50 shares at $57 and 50 more shares at $180. Thinking about jumping off.

 
well, I was right about the dividend and buyback but thought it'd help push the stock higher. It's really been a non-event for the most part. I think eventually the value investors/funds that require dividends will trickle in here. I'm just glad we'll finally get a quarterly and reap a little reward every few months. To the people that are considering selling, don't do it unless you're looking for a short term trade. This thing is still cheap.

 
How would this buyback work?

I bought 50 shares at $57 and 50 more shares at $180. Thinking about jumping off.
What do you mean? are you asking how a buyback works in general? in simple terms, the company buys their stock in the open market.
 
How would this buyback work?

I bought 50 shares at $57 and 50 more shares at $180. Thinking about jumping off.
What do you mean? are you asking how a buyback works in general? in simple terms, the company buys their stock in the open market.
Gotcha. Was wondering if it were something I would opt into and be given incentive to sell it back to them. I might have heard that somewhere, might have also made it up.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
How would this buyback work?

I bought 50 shares at $57 and 50 more shares at $180. Thinking about jumping off.
What do you mean? are you asking how a buyback works in general? in simple terms, the company buys their stock in the open market.
Gotcha. Was wondering if it were something I would opt into and be given incentive to sell it back to them. I might have heard that somewhere, might have also made it up.
Sometimes companies will offer to buy back odd lots from retail investors (generally done with splits and such) but the majority of share buybacks are done on the open market. You won't have to do anything.
 
Nice push today, but I guess much of the dividend/re-buy news was already priced in. I expected a bigger run upon the announcement.

 
Nice push today, but I guess much of the dividend/re-buy news was already priced in. I expected a bigger run upon the announcement.
When we see posts like this, it must be time to sell. This thing is setting all time highs almost every day and you're disappointed with another 2.65% bump today? :mellow:
 
Nice push today, but I guess much of the dividend/re-buy news was already priced in. I expected a bigger run upon the announcement.
When we see posts like this, it must be time to sell. This thing is setting all time highs almost every day and you're disappointed with another 2.65% bump today? :mellow:
Apple sold 3 million iPads over the weekend. I wouldn't jump ship just yet. Obviously the company cannot keep growing at 70% a year. The curve will flatten. But recognize that it will flatten slowly, and a company which grows 20% in a year is usually a very good investment. It is not that Apple's valuation compared to EPS, is way out of line. They are at about the market average at 15, but only at 10 when you project forward.
 
well, I was right about the dividend and buyback but thought it'd help push the stock higher. It's really been a non-event for the most part. I think eventually the value investors/funds that require dividends will trickle in here. I'm just glad we'll finally get a quarterly and reap a little reward every few months. To the people that are considering selling, don't do it unless you're looking for a short term trade. This thing is still cheap.
Did you write this?
 
well, I was right about the dividend and buyback but thought it'd help push the stock higher. It's really been a non-event for the most part. I think eventually the value investors/funds that require dividends will trickle in here. I'm just glad we'll finally get a quarterly and reap a little reward every few months. To the people that are considering selling, don't do it unless you're looking for a short term trade. This thing is still cheap.
Did you write this?
That hack is copying my thesis :angry:
 
599 pre-market...
I feel like each morning I wake up, I have a scratchoff lottery ticket sitting in front of me. and I keep winning the 5K-10K big prize it offers. Selling my March calls today in all likelihood. I'll still be holding a couple deep in the money april calls and a couple of june calls that smashed through 560 a couple days ago.
Yeah, most options have been :moneybag: for us AAPL longs. Do you do any complex options trades or are you pretty simple in your approach? I've just really started understanding and appreciating the beauty of options about 5 years ago. If you see any trades that look attractive post them here. Always interested.
Sorry I somehow missed this post. I don't do anything special, no straddles, strangles, condors, etc. Although a calendar call might be worth a try. Single calls usually 2-4 months out, but i do play weekly's occasionally. I'm a cheap bastage so I try to make my plays in the 1500-3000 range. Just something I'm more comfortable with personally. My biggest regret was when i bought my first option on aaple a few yrs ago. It was an 80 call for less than 20 bucks (2k) buying me in at 100. I should have begged, borrowed, or stole to take control of those 100 shares. Would have been a cash printing press to sell a put every month or two, not to mention the 50K in value they have gone up.
 
599 pre-market...
I feel like each morning I wake up, I have a scratchoff lottery ticket sitting in front of me. and I keep winning the 5K-10K big prize it offers. Selling my March calls today in all likelihood. I'll still be holding a couple deep in the money april calls and a couple of june calls that smashed through 560 a couple days ago.
Yeah, most options have been :moneybag: for us AAPL longs. Do you do any complex options trades or are you pretty simple in your approach? I've just really started understanding and appreciating the beauty of options about 5 years ago. If you see any trades that look attractive post them here. Always interested.
Sorry I somehow missed this post. I don't do anything special, no straddles, strangles, condors, etc. Although a calendar call might be worth a try. Single calls usually 2-4 months out, but i do play weekly's occasionally. I'm a cheap bastage so I try to make my plays in the 1500-3000 range. Just something I'm more comfortable with personally. My biggest regret was when i bought my first option on aaple a few yrs ago. It was an 80 call for less than 20 bucks (2k) buying me in at 100. I should have begged, borrowed, or stole to take control of those 100 shares. Would have been a cash printing press to sell a put every month or two, not to mention the 50K in value they have gone up.
Have you thought about writing some weekly out of the money calls on your shares (assuming you own some)? Write them about mid-morning on Thursday and they expire the next day. I've been doing it for a month now and it's never even sniffed my strike price. Easy $ so far.
 
I spoke to my Edward Jones analyst a month ago. She thinks it will hit $650. I keep thinking of selling mine, but I hear nothing but good news about this company.

 
The analysts still want it to go up.

Over the past 2 years Apple has beat their own guidance by 25%-50%.

They guided at 8.50 for the current quarter. If analysts were trying to be accurate their estimates would range from $10.62 on the low end to $12.75 on the high end.

Almost none of them even have their estimate at the very low end, although they obviously know Apple will report at minimum $10.62 EPS.

They still want it to run but it's a bit shady they are purposely low balling and have no intentions to be accurate.

Analysts opinions are always laughable since their intentions aren't to be accurate but to serve an agenda. As long as their agenda is to pump up Apple it seems safe, but once the big guys pull the rug out we could see a 15-20% drop in a matter of a month.

 
Stocks don't go up forever. It will be under 500 within a few months without a doubt.
P/E back in the low 14s? Possible, but unlikely, IMO.Earnings on the 24th - I'm expecting them to beat the street due to iPad3 sales.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I'm not an AAPL hater as I have a decent amount in these guys, but where are we in relation to this?

ETA: credit to siff for giving me that pic.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
love apple as a company but LOL at people who thought the top market cap company in the world would keep going vertical.

if they don't beat the analyst low ball estimates by around 15%-20% it will tank more after earnings. Everyone expects them to beat estimates handily.

Last quarter was the perfect storm with Jobs dying a day after the iphone4s release and it being a holiday quarter. They had non-stop advertising on every network talking about apple and Jobs.

I expect a retrace into the low 500's by the end of May.

 
love apple as a company but LOL at people who thought the top market cap company in the world would keep going vertical.if they don't beat the analyst low ball estimates by around 15%-20% it will tank more after earnings. Everyone expects them to beat estimates handily.Last quarter was the perfect storm with Jobs dying a day after the iphone4s release and it being a holiday quarter. They had non-stop advertising on every network talking about apple and Jobs.I expect a retrace into the low 500's by the end of May.
If the momentum guys start dumping this, it will be a great time to buy. I own AAPL common with a very low base price so these little 100 point moves are fun but I'm looking at the big picture. The stock is still cheap. Will probably buy some calls leading up to earnings if the stock dips back to 550. This is a blip on my radar screen. Fundamentals are still sound.
 
love apple as a company but LOL at people who thought the top market cap company in the world would keep going vertical.if they don't beat the analyst low ball estimates by around 15%-20% it will tank more after earnings. Everyone expects them to beat estimates handily.Last quarter was the perfect storm with Jobs dying a day after the iphone4s release and it being a holiday quarter. They had non-stop advertising on every network talking about apple and Jobs.I expect a retrace into the low 500's by the end of May.
If the momentum guys start dumping this, it will be a great time to buy. I own AAPL common with a very low base price so these little 100 point moves are fun but I'm looking at the big picture. The stock is still cheap. Will probably buy some calls leading up to earnings if the stock dips back to 550. This is a blip on my radar screen. Fundamentals are still sound.
Exactly. If the P/E is still in the teens, with a growth rate in the twenties, I don't really care what the price is tomorrow. Someday, it will be more.Oh, and my cost basis is in the 90s. That makes it easier to hold.
 
love apple as a company but LOL at people who thought the top market cap company in the world would keep going vertical.if they don't beat the analyst low ball estimates by around 15%-20% it will tank more after earnings. Everyone expects them to beat estimates handily.Last quarter was the perfect storm with Jobs dying a day after the iphone4s release and it being a holiday quarter. They had non-stop advertising on every network talking about apple and Jobs.I expect a retrace into the low 500's by the end of May.
If the momentum guys start dumping this, it will be a great time to buy. I own AAPL common with a very low base price so these little 100 point moves are fun but I'm looking at the big picture. The stock is still cheap. Will probably buy some calls leading up to earnings if the stock dips back to 550. This is a blip on my radar screen. Fundamentals are still sound.
Exactly. If the P/E is still in the teens, with a growth rate in the twenties, I don't really care what the price is tomorrow. Someday, it will be more.Oh, and my cost basis is in the 90s. That makes it easier to hold.
I was long from mid 09' through this year, and am now highly skeptical they can maintain their business model the bigger they get.1)their margins are huge vs the rest of the industry. This was sustainable while they were targeted at a smaller market of hardcore followers but they are mass market now. Show me an industry where one company has maintained margins grossly higher then any other in the same industry.2)customers refreshing every cycle in a more mature market won't happen, while improvements will be made after the iPhone5 with lte speeds the future improvements won't have the vast majority of their market refreshing every year.3)they are in the most competitive markets in technology, and technology moves lighting quick. Right now it's just assumed they will be the ones always leading it, that's borderline impossible to do in technology.4)Steve jobs is dead. Yes they have a deep bench, but do they have the one person who can see things from all angles and who is to computers to what Jesus is to religion. He made his employees work harder then they though possible and they would do anything to please him, you can't just replace a guy who was the godfather of personal computing. Once he found out he had cancer he tried to fit what would take most companies 20 years into a 5 year period...and he did it.Seeing these analysts just assume rapid growth and high margins over the next 5-10 years is laughable. When companies get to the top of the hill is gets a lot more difficult, competition eventually catches up, there is a reason no company's market cap just blows everyone away.Apple is my favorite company, but I don't bet my money on exceptions, and apple reaching the trillion dollar market cap over the next couple years many analysts are projecting is a HUGE exception.
 
love apple as a company but LOL at people who thought the top market cap company in the world would keep going vertical.

if they don't beat the analyst low ball estimates by around 15%-20% it will tank more after earnings. Everyone expects them to beat estimates handily.

Last quarter was the perfect storm with Jobs dying a day after the iphone4s release and it being a holiday quarter. They had non-stop advertising on every network talking about apple and Jobs.

I expect a retrace into the low 500's by the end of May.
If the momentum guys start dumping this, it will be a great time to buy. I own AAPL common with a very low base price so these little 100 point moves are fun but I'm looking at the big picture. The stock is still cheap. Will probably buy some calls leading up to earnings if the stock dips back to 550. This is a blip on my radar screen. Fundamentals are still sound.
Exactly. If the P/E is still in the teens, with a growth rate in the twenties, I don't really care what the price is tomorrow. Someday, it will be more.Oh, and my cost basis is in the 90s. That makes it easier to hold.
I was long from mid 09' through this year, and am now highly skeptical they can maintain their business model the bigger they get.1)their margins are huge vs the rest of the industry. This was sustainable while they were targeted at a smaller market of hardcore followers but they are mass market now. Show me an industry where one company has maintained margins grossly higher then any other in the same industry.

2)customers refreshing every cycle in a more mature market won't happen, while improvements will be made after the iPhone5 with lte speeds the future improvements won't have the vast majority of their market refreshing every year.

3)they are in the most competitive markets in technology, and technology moves lighting quick. Right now it's just assumed they will be the ones always leading it, that's borderline impossible to do in technology.

4)Steve jobs is dead. Yes they have a deep bench, but do they have the one person who can see things from all angles and who is to computers to what Jesus is to religion. He made his employees work harder then they though possible and they would do anything to please him, you can't just replace a guy who was the godfather of personal computing. Once he found out he had cancer he tried to fit what would take most companies 20 years into a 5 year period...and he did it.

Seeing these analysts just assume rapid growth and high margins over the next 5-10 years is laughable. When companies get to the top of the hill is gets a lot more difficult, competition eventually catches up, there is a reason no company's market cap just blows everyone away.

Apple is my favorite company, but I don't bet my money on exceptions, and apple reaching the trillion dollar market cap over the next couple years many analysts are projecting is a HUGE exception.
5) The Law of Large Numbers works against them. The growth required is not sustainable.
 
love apple as a company but LOL at people who thought the top market cap company in the world would keep going vertical.if they don't beat the analyst low ball estimates by around 15%-20% it will tank more after earnings. Everyone expects them to beat estimates handily.Last quarter was the perfect storm with Jobs dying a day after the iphone4s release and it being a holiday quarter. They had non-stop advertising on every network talking about apple and Jobs.I expect a retrace into the low 500's by the end of May.
If the momentum guys start dumping this, it will be a great time to buy. I own AAPL common with a very low base price so these little 100 point moves are fun but I'm looking at the big picture. The stock is still cheap. Will probably buy some calls leading up to earnings if the stock dips back to 550. This is a blip on my radar screen. Fundamentals are still sound.
Exactly. If the P/E is still in the teens, with a growth rate in the twenties, I don't really care what the price is tomorrow. Someday, it will be more.Oh, and my cost basis is in the 90s. That makes it easier to hold.
I was long from mid 09' through this year, and am now highly skeptical they can maintain their business model the bigger they get.1)their margins are huge vs the rest of the industry. This was sustainable while they were targeted at a smaller market of hardcore followers but they are mass market now. Show me an industry where one company has maintained margins grossly higher then any other in the same industry.2)customers refreshing every cycle in a more mature market won't happen, while improvements will be made after the iPhone5 with lte speeds the future improvements won't have the vast majority of their market refreshing every year.3)they are in the most competitive markets in technology, and technology moves lighting quick. Right now it's just assumed they will be the ones always leading it, that's borderline impossible to do in technology.4)Steve jobs is dead. Yes they have a deep bench, but do they have the one person who can see things from all angles and who is to computers to what Jesus is to religion. He made his employees work harder then they though possible and they would do anything to please him, you can't just replace a guy who was the godfather of personal computing. Once he found out he had cancer he tried to fit what would take most companies 20 years into a 5 year period...and he did it.Seeing these analysts just assume rapid growth and high margins over the next 5-10 years is laughable. When companies get to the top of the hill is gets a lot more difficult, competition eventually catches up, there is a reason no company's market cap just blows everyone away.Apple is my favorite company, but I don't bet my money on exceptions, and apple reaching the trillion dollar market cap over the next couple years many analysts are projecting is a HUGE exception.
1)I like betting on companies that continue to make luxury like margins and have consumer traction in the mass market. There is nothing like the Apple halo. People will continue to adopt b/c they're getting a far better experience. Once you go black....2) International expansion down? hello BRIC. 3)They've been doing this for a long time. I like the odds of Apple TV being pretty :excited: and a nice near term push for the stock. 4)Steve jobs is dead. :o
 
I was long from mid 09' through this year, and am now highly skeptical they can maintain their business model the bigger they get.

1)their margins are huge vs the rest of the industry. This was sustainable while they were targeted at a smaller market of hardcore followers but they are mass market now. Show me an industry where one company has maintained margins grossly higher then any other in the same industry.

2)customers refreshing every cycle in a more mature market won't happen, while improvements will be made after the iPhone5 with lte speeds the future improvements won't have the vast majority of their market refreshing every year.

3)they are in the most competitive markets in technology, and technology moves lighting quick. Right now it's just assumed they will be the ones always leading it, that's borderline impossible to do in technology.

4)Steve jobs is dead. Yes they have a deep bench, but do they have the one person who can see things from all angles and who is to computers to what Jesus is to religion. He made his employees work harder then they though possible and they would do anything to please him, you can't just replace a guy who was the godfather of personal computing. Once he found out he had cancer he tried to fit what would take most companies 20 years into a 5 year period...and he did it.

Seeing these analysts just assume rapid growth and high margins over the next 5-10 years is laughable. When companies get to the top of the hill is gets a lot more difficult, competition eventually catches up, there is a reason no company's market cap just blows everyone away.

Apple is my favorite company, but I don't bet my money on exceptions, and apple reaching the trillion dollar market cap over the next couple years many analysts are projecting is a HUGE exception.
1. Apple makes their high margins on production efficiencies more than MSRP. It is because Apple is mass market that they can command such high margins while being competitively priced. 2. I haven't seen any evidence that shows that Apple customers upgrade more frequently than anyone else. I think you are confusing the sudden explosive expansion of the smartphone and tablet markets with the myth of the Apple fanboy.

3. Iterative technology moves quickly, but it takes truly disruptive technology to topple an industry. Shifts like that don't happen often, it can take decades. We are only now at the dawn of the mobile "post-PC" era. Microsoft ruled the PC era for twenty-some years; not because they were the most innovative. It wasn't until the internet disrupted desktop computing were new competitors able to knock Microsoft of their throne. Now Apple has successfully launched the mobile post-PC era of computing into the mainstream. That's not to say that some of Apple's competitors won't find more success against them this era, but Apple isn't going to simply fadeaway back to niche status. They are positioned well for a long time to come. Look back at Micorsoft. For all the talk of their falling behind, they are still growing and making billions of dollars hand over fist. Apple doesn't necessarily have to lead the entire industry to continue being widely successful, especially when the market where Apple is finding their most success are still in their infancy.

4. Yes, Steve is dead. For years it was common knowledge that Apple would crumble to the ground the moment he passed away. Yet Apple has continued down the path Steve envisioned and grew to new heights. I believe the company is in great hands with Tim Cook and Jon Ive. There is no replacing Steve Jobs, but that doesn't mean his successors had no part in what Steve built and are not capable of continuing ahead.

 
Oh, and my cost basis is in the 90s. That makes it easier to hold.
Exactly.
Never understood this mentality.
(1) LOOK AT ME!!!(2) I truly believe AAPL is a solid, underpriced long-term investment. However, I also think STD is a long-term play. What's the difference? My AAPL entry in my spreadsheet fluctuates between an obscene profit and a truly obscene profit, while STD fluctuates between 30-35% losses. Let your winners run.If this were a short-term play, I'd have a very different outlook.
 
I think what is driving this, mostly, is the threat that ATT and VZW will no longer offer large subsidies for contracts. Right or wrong it's something you need to price into the stock.

 
I think what is driving this, mostly, is the threat that ATT and VZW will no longer offer large subsidies for contracts. Right or wrong it's something you need to price into the stock.
I have read about this concern, but I don't think it is currently a large enough threat to be driving the stock down. I think AAPL is just bouncing along with the general market. AAPL wasn't the only large tech stock to drop in the past few days. While AAPL fell 4% yesterday, GOOG dropped 2% and PCLN dropped almost 5%. On the upside, AAPL rebounded with the biggest single-day dollar gain in their history, +29.57 (+5.1%). :thumbup:
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top