Pinewood Derby (1 Viewer)

My 7 year old son is having his first cub scout derby in about 4 weeks. They just gave out the cars and between Christmas and some other stuff going on we're not going to have a whole lot of time to work on this.

I wasn't in Cub Scouts so this is my first time, too. Can I do all the cuts with a coping saw?

I read that polishing the axles is key. Dry or with a compound?

What is best to use for weights? Please don't point me to a website selling some $20 set. I want to take a resourceful approach to this and not have to go out and buy a bunch of accessories.

Your car will be faster if one of the front wheels never touches the track. The main enemy to speed is friction. The less friction your car has, the faster it will be. If your car is correctly aligned and rolls straight, most of the friction you’ll find is from the wheels rubbing against the axles and the car body. By keeping one wheel of the track, it doesn’t need to turn and won’t rub against an axle head and car body. You’ll have 25% less friction because you’ll have 25% less wheels.

This according to a guy I work with, and graphite on the axle.

Cheat.

'SHIZNITTTT said:

If your car is correctly aligned and rolls straight, most of the friction you’ll find is from the wheels rubbing against the axles and the car body.

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Can I remove the wood near the wheel so it doesn't rub, or does the wheel slide on the axle? I haven't really looked at the kit yet.

'shuke said:

'SHIZNITTTT said:

If your car is correctly aligned and rolls straight, most of the friction you’ll find is from the wheels rubbing against the axles and the car body.

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Can I remove the wood near the wheel so it doesn't rub, or does the wheel slide on the axle? I haven't really looked at the kit yet.

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On the axle. There are literally 1000's of videos on youtube and websites that can give tips .

'Sarnoff said:

Cheat.

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http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/224680/youll-have-to-learn-how-to-lie-correctly-someday

'SHIZNITTTT said:

Your car will be faster if one of the front wheels never touches the track. The main enemy to speed is friction. The less friction your car has, the faster it will be. If your car is correctly aligned and rolls straight, most of the friction you'll find is from the wheels rubbing against the axles and the car body. By keeping one wheel of the track, it doesn't need to turn and won't rub against an axle head and car body. You'll have 25% less friction because you'll have 25% less wheels.

This according to a guy I work with, and graphite on the axle.

Click to expand...

Graphite is the way to go. And, buy weights and get the thing to the exact weight allowed. I used a postage meter at work to get this right. My sons first time we just built something out of the kit. First time he got to test it, it didn't even make it down the track. A dad showed me the weights and told me about the graphite. Crazy how this changes things. Sometimes it just luck. We built 3 cars together. The one we screwed up the most, turned out to be the fastest (and still got smoked by two kids who parents were automotive engineers). I was a track ref for one of the years. There was a car that was just insane. Dad forgot to remove one of the stickers from the bottom and it turned out he bought the thing, it was loaded inside the wood with Mercury that would shift from rear to front as it went down the track. My son didn't really love the whole scout thing, but we had a blast building the cars and boats.

Just tell your kid to remember, he gets to build his pinewood derby racer when he has a kid.

magnets

keep the weight low and halfway between center and rear

polish axles with fine sandpaper, also under head of axles

one front wheel off the ground

use all the weight you can, have it just barely below limit

after assembled put graphite around axles and under axle heads and roll car back and forth

do this as much as possible to build up good graphite coating

shape means absolutely nothing, build however he wants it

Pick straight axles. Many of the nails will be a little bent and you need to find 2 straight nails. I will pick my buddy's brain tomorrow and get his tips/tricks.

I still hate my dad for really not helping me with mine 35 years ago.

Good luck.

I had the most success with the TBone body style when I was a Cub Scout.

1. Pretty much cut the car in half, heightwise.

2. Shave off about a quarter of the width on each edge (so it's half as wide as originally) in between the wheels.

3. In addition, you can then cut a hole, I did in the middle and the back, where you can place the weights so that they do not stick out anywhere on the car. It's like building a secret compartment or false drawer bottom, only instead of leaving it empty and putting a door there, you fill the area with the weights.

Weights towards the back usually, iirc

Sanding is super important, as is reducing anything on the wheels that'll cause friction. I also had the most success when rounding the front and back of the car around the wheel wells.

'SHIZNITTTT said:

Pick straight axles. Many of the nails will be a little bent and you need to find 2 straight nails. I will pick my buddy's brain tomorrow and get his tips/tricks.

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This reminded me of something else. Sand the nails down with high high grit sand paper and use and exacto blade to trim off the excess plastic, if there is any, where the wheel meets the car.

'SHIZNITTTT said:

Just tell your kid to remember, he gets to build his pinewood derby racer when he has a kid.

Click to expand...

'urbanhack said:

I still hate my dad for really not helping me with mine 35 years ago.Good luck.

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Years ago I supervised my nephew while he did his. I did this for safety only. One thing his organization did was have a kid's division and a father's division to minimize the fatherly interference. Totally his design in every way and he came in 1st place.It seemed that straight axles and graphite were very important.

Here's what the winners are going to do. Their dads are going to go to a site like THIS and buy what they need to make a winning car.

I can recommend THIS car chassis from experience. It's a simple enough cut that it doesn't scream "store bought". Have you kid slop some paint on there and it'll pass for home made.

Go with the lightest, thinnest wheels you can find. But be sure they started out as stock BSA pine derby wheels. We used THESE. Unless someone picks up the car and inspects the inside of the wheels, they look identical to the regular, stock BSA wheels. And modifying them by thinning the walls and such is perfectly legal. Just that most people don't have the equipment to do it really right. But what you want is that 1-gram wheel. Nothing more. NOte: these wheels are fragile. Have back-ups in case someone man-handles the rig before race time. Same with the axles.

Use these axles. Very light, hardly any friction, very fast.

You want as much of your weight on the BACK as possible. That's why the holes are drilled in the back on the chassis. And you want your car to weigh EXACTLY 5.0 ounces at weigh-in. Use tungsten weightsto get as much weight on the back as possible.

Bullet Lubeis the dry lube you want after going to all this trouble to make a kick-### car.

Finally... to bring that car up to 5.0 ounces exactly, you will need a scale similar to this one. Accurate to 0.1 grams. At the race, the officials will have such a scale.. maybe not this very same one, but perhaps something very similar. I found my scale agreed with the race officials' scale exactly.

If you follow all this, you will put together a highly competitive, and most probably winning, race car. If you try to do it on your own, you can explain to your son that this is most likely what the winning cars did, but you thought it would be a more fulfilling experience to do it all on your own.

At least this is what me and my kid did before he got kicked out. And, yeah, he won first place, and we both had a blast.

For those saying keep 1 wheel off...you must have not had someone test yours before allowing it...as they tested to make sure all 4 of my son's wheels would touch the table/track.

When they set it down on a table, if any wheel was not touching, you had to fix it before they would allow.

I echo some of the rest of this though:

-shape is not hugely important...ours looked like a typical sporty race car (kid wanted it like Lightening McQueen) lots of just plain wedges or rounded cars where the block was cut down in height.

-weights set just in front of the rear wheels worked well for us. We used cylindrical weights. Drilled a hole in the car just a bit bigger than the weights and then push them in (little super glue to have them stick). Then painted over it.

-lots of the powdered graphite inside the wheels covering the axels.

-straight axels

First time was last year...my son won his age group and then barely got out of top 3 for the troop/den or whatever...beat by the eventual winner by just a fraction of a second/inch. Very close race. He actually had beat the car that came in 2nd earlier but lost a couple times to the 1st place car...just the way the rounds worked out.

'relic said:

polish axles with fine sandpaper, also under head of axles

Click to expand...

Put the nail in a drill to spin and just use dry sandpaper?

'SHIZNITTTT said:

Pick straight axles. Many of the nails will be a little bent and you need to find 2 straight nails. I will pick my buddy's brain tomorrow and get his tips/tricks.

Click to expand...

The box came with 4 nails. I should go buy more?

'johnnycakes said:

Here's what the winners are going to do. Their dads are going to go to a site like THIS and buy what they need to make a winning car.

I can recommend THIS car chassis from experience. It's a simple enough cut that it doesn't scream "store bought". Have you kid slop some paint on there and it'll pass for home made.

Go with the lightest, thinnest wheels you can find. But be sure they started out as stock BSA pine derby wheels. We used THESE. Unless someone picks up the car and inspects the inside of the wheels, they look identical to the regular, stock BSA wheels. And modifying them by thinning the walls and such is perfectly legal. Just that most people don't have the equipment to do it really right. But what you want is that 1-gram wheel. Nothing more. NOte: these wheels are fragile. Have back-ups in case someone man-handles the rig before race time. Same with the axles.

Use these axles. Very light, hardly any friction, very fast.

You want as much of your weight on the BACK as possible. That's why the holes are drilled in the back on the chassis. And you want your car to weigh EXACTLY 5.0 ounces at weigh-in. Use tungsten weightsto get as much weight on the back as possible.

Bullet Lubeis the dry lube you want after going to all this trouble to make a kick-### car.

Finally... to bring that car up to 5.0 ounces exactly, you will need a scale similar to this one. Accurate to 0.1 grams. At the race, the officials will have such a scale.. maybe not this very same one, but perhaps something very similar. I found my scale agreed with the race officials' scale exactly.

If you follow all this, you will put together a highly competitive, and most probably winning, race car. If you try to do it on your own, you can explain to your son that this is most likely what the winning cars did, but you thought it would be a more fulfilling experience to do it all on your own.

At least this is what me and my kid did before he got kicked out. And, yeah, he won first place, and we both had a blast.

Click to expand...

$50 for a set of wheels? Good shtick.Those axles look like they have grooves in them, I'm guessing to reduce friction. I wonder if this is something I can do at home.

'shuke said:

'relic said:

polish axles with fine sandpaper, also under head of axles

Click to expand...

Put the nail in a drill to spin and just use dry sandpaper?

Click to expand...

Not a bad idea, but I'd just use some north of 250 grit and sand them by hand.

'shuke said:

'SHIZNITTTT said:

Pick straight axles. Many of the nails will be a little bent and you need to find 2 straight nails. I will pick my buddy's brain tomorrow and get his tips/tricks.

Click to expand...

The box came with 4 nails. I should go buy more?

Click to expand...

Are they straight? If not I would buy more. You don't want the friction of a bent nail.

lead shot makes a great filler weight, very granular so you can get to the max weight.

drill hole(s) fill with shot, seal with hot glue

'shuke said:

'johnnycakes said:

Here's what the winners are going to do. Their dads are going to go to a site like THIS and buy what they need to make a winning car.

I can recommend THIS car chassis from experience. It's a simple enough cut that it doesn't scream "store bought". Have you kid slop some paint on there and it'll pass for home made.

Go with the lightest, thinnest wheels you can find. But be sure they started out as stock BSA pine derby wheels. We used THESE. Unless someone picks up the car and inspects the inside of the wheels, they look identical to the regular, stock BSA wheels. And modifying them by thinning the walls and such is perfectly legal. Just that most people don't have the equipment to do it really right. But what you want is that 1-gram wheel. Nothing more. NOte: these wheels are fragile. Have back-ups in case someone man-handles the rig before race time. Same with the axles.

Use these axles. Very light, hardly any friction, very fast.

You want as much of your weight on the BACK as possible. That's why the holes are drilled in the back on the chassis. And you want your car to weigh EXACTLY 5.0 ounces at weigh-in. Use tungsten weightsto get as much weight on the back as possible.

Bullet Lubeis the dry lube you want after going to all this trouble to make a kick-### car.

Finally... to bring that car up to 5.0 ounces exactly, you will need a scale similar to this one. Accurate to 0.1 grams. At the race, the officials will have such a scale.. maybe not this very same one, but perhaps something very similar. I found my scale agreed with the race officials' scale exactly.

If you follow all this, you will put together a highly competitive, and most probably winning, race car. If you try to do it on your own, you can explain to your son that this is most likely what the winning cars did, but you thought it would be a more fulfilling experience to do it all on your own.

At least this is what me and my kid did before he got kicked out. And, yeah, he won first place, and we both had a blast.

Click to expand...

$50 for a set of wheels? Good shtick.Those axles look like they have grooves in them, I'm guessing to reduce friction. I wonder if this is something I can do at home.

Click to expand...

Go to the Scout Shop on Reading near Sharonville and buy the weights and maybe somecolored wheels if you want different ones.

Different districts may have different rules, but the Trailblazer District (N. KY) says you have to use the "official" BSA wheels. There was some uproar a year or two ago with some cars where they basically filed one of the front wheels down to almost nothing so it not only weighed less but had no prayer of touching the track. Those cars were blowing everything away at the district race (if you have the misfortune to qualify for this by being in the top 2 or 3 of your pack, try to avoid going at all costs.)

The local pack races are fun, the big district race takes forever, is boring, and you aren't going to win: one of the NASA cars will. You do not want to sit through 50-80 cars getting 4 runs each down the track to find this out.

My son is in his last year of CUb Scouts before he moves up to Boy Scouts. Every year I make him do a little more of the "body" work. At age 7 I would recommend you cut the shape on a band saw (you can find free outlines online; let him pick one) and let him sand the crap out of it by hand, prime it, paint it, etc. You will have to help make sure the wheels and axles are put on straight so it rolls decently. Everytime I try to polish the axles/wheels, I screw it up, so I just go with the nails they provide and plenty of graphite.

To do well at the local race, make sure you get to the 5 oz limit, graphite on the wheels, and put weights on top and towards the back (greater potential energy) but make sure it won't do a wheelie or jump the track.

P.S. If your son doesn't win and qualify to move on, let him play with the car afterward even if he totals it; don't be the dad who won't even let the kid carry the car around. It's probably the most fun he will have that day.

'SHIZNITTTT said:

'shuke said:

'SHIZNITTTT said:

Pick straight axles. Many of the nails will be a little bent and you need to find 2 straight nails. I will pick my buddy's brain tomorrow and get his tips/tricks.

Click to expand...

The box came with 4 nails. I should go buy more?

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Are they straight? If not I would buy more. You don't want the friction of a bent nail.

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I looked at them tonight. Seem straight and the wheels spun freely on them.

'Rustoleum said:

(if you have the misfortune to qualify for this by being in the top 2 or 3 of your pack, try to avoid going at all costs.)

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Everytime I try to polish the axles/wheels, I screw it up,

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What happens?

don't be the dad who won't even let the kid carry the car around.

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People do this, even after the race?

'Rustoleum said:

P.S. If your son doesn't win and qualify to move on, let him play with the car afterward even if he totals it; don't be the dad who won't even let the kid carry the car around. It's probably the most fun he will have that day.

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Though, I asked my son not to destroy it totally (and he didn't)...cause I knew he would want to keep it and he loves having it now as his first try at it.

Other advice...not sure if all packs do this...but they also did a vote for the best looking car (the kids voted on it)...and the top 3 got trophies for it too.

My son's looked cool to me (well him too, he picked the paint scheme and stickers he wanted on it)...but think of whats cool to a 7 year old and what they would vote for...like just a terribly painted version of a local sports team that the kids would be liking.

'shuke said:

'Rustoleum said:

(if you have the misfortune to qualify for this by being in the top 2 or 3 of your pack, try to avoid going at all costs.)

Click to expand...

I've been trying to guide my son to design a 3rd place car for 4 years and failing.Either the other dads/kids are totally inept or they are a step ahead of me...we keep finishing first or second in the den.

Everytime I try to polish the axles/wheels, I screw it up,

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What happens?I inevitably mangle the head of the nail: once by trying to use a drill/dremel, another time gouged the shaft, got superglue in one wheel when trying to fix a chunk of wood that came off the wheelwell (F1 type car design, kinda fragile and was having trouble getting the axle straight. That fouled up the axle and melted the inside of the wheel...

don't be the dad who won't even let the kid carry the car around.

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People do this, even after the race?

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I've seen donor organs get put into less-secure containers immediately post-race.

So what's the trick to getting these axles in straight? I can't imagine just hammering them into these pre-cut slots is the best way.

'shuke said:

So what's the trick to getting these axles in straight? I can't imagine just hammering them into these pre-cut slots is the best way.

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I have a little plastic template they sell for a couple of bucks to check camber/alignment, ground clearance, etc. I just push them in by hand. They usually hold well enough for the 4 "official" runs, but then again, I've been striving for imperfection.

'sho nuff said:

Other advice...not sure if all packs do this...but they also did a vote for the best looking car (the kids voted on it)...and the top 3 got trophies for it too.My son's looked cool to me (well him too, he picked the paint scheme and stickers he wanted on it)...but think of whats cool to a 7 year old and what they would vote for...like just a terribly painted version of a local sports team that the kids would be liking.

Click to expand...

My son's pack does this now, it was my suggestion. We give out 5 medals for different things, Most Original, Funniest Car, etc. These are given out to only the cars who didn't finish first in their Den and got a trophy.You should have a set of rules for the Pack. Our's include you must use the block of wood, axels and wheels in the box and you cannot use the same car as last year. As others have mentioned, sand the axels to remove bump, sand the wheels, add the weight needed to get it to 5oz. Let your son design, paint etc, he'll get much more out of it doing the work. As my boys got older, I helped them less and less. There are always those parents who build the entire car for them, it's kind of sad.

i won 1st place 3 years in a row and went to state titles all 3 years

i have the secrets that will win it for you

i still have my cars somewhere

'SHIZNITTTT said:

Just tell your kid to remember, he gets to build his pinewood derby racer when he has a kid.

Click to expand...

awesome

As a Cubmaster I can tell you that the emphasis on your derby should not be on winning but it always ends up being that way and in truth what the children understand that. The derby should be held with plenty of "meets" so that the boys have many times to see their car race; there is very little fun in being eliminated from the race early. I always try to reward a prize for the car that is overly disappointing to a child that obviously put his own time into it; best design or something. There is usually one car that does much better than the rest so that helps the children understand and then the competitions can be between friends, and such, without winning overall being the object. I also like in addition to the overall race having the individual packs have their own races, as the older boys do much better at this event. Have lots of prizes/ribbons and make sure all the kids leave with something.

As far as the car, don't shave the wood along the car by the wheels, it is gauged for the track. How the cars are placed upon the track will effect outcome; a crooked car will bounce in the channels and lose speed. I've seen the unaltered block win races but graphite and polished axles do make a difference. Share your graphite, it is Scouts remember, and make sure all the kids use the graphite in one location (it gets everywhere) and will make the floor extremely slippery. Also be ready for the "official scale" to read differently than yours, so make the last increments of weights removable so that you can add/remove weight.

Did this last year with my son - we had a blast.

After googling "Pine Box Derby tips" I was shocked at how many adults and sites were into this. Reminded me of trekkies.

message me if you want to win

I had my best results with 80% of the weight on the rear axles. And I bought 6 sets of axles before I found 4 straight ones, but I just used them every year after that. Put a dab of glue on them to keep them from shifting, but don't cover the tips so they can be inspected.

Also, resign yourself to the fact that the kid with the dad that puts the most time into his car will win. My goal was just to keep ny boy's car competitive enough to keep him interested. The best derbies are the ones where the dad cuts the car out and the kids have to do all the rest. Not too many packs like that around anymore.

'=Smackdown= said:

Did this last year with my son - we had a blast.After googling "Pine Box Derby tips" I was shocked at how many adults and sites were into this. Reminded me of trekkies.

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and so it begins . . . the ff geek making fun of the pinewood derby geek

i still have not seen any mention of the 'secret'

'gameday said:

'=Smackdown= said:

Did this last year with my son - we had a blast.After googling "Pine Box Derby tips" I was shocked at how many adults and sites were into this. Reminded me of trekkies.

Click to expand...

and so it begins . . . the ff geek making fun of the pinewood derby geek

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Making fun? Sounds like admiration to me.

'2Young2BBald said:

'shuke said:

'relic said:

polish axles with fine sandpaper, also under head of axles

Click to expand...

Put the nail in a drill to spin and just use dry sandpaper?

Click to expand...

Not a bad idea, but I'd just use some north of 250 grit and sand them by hand.

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Yes, put the nail in a drill to spin. I start by using a file to remove any spurs from underneath the nail head. Then start by sanding with 400 grit, then 800 and gradually move up to a finer grit (1600).

Good stuff in here already. Things I learned:

- jig to align wheels and get one front wheel off the track

- redrill the axle holes so you get the longest wheelbase possible

- wedge shaped car and drill 3 holes clear through above the rear axle.

- weigh all components and keep adding bulk fishing weights ($4 a roll?) until you get to the max

- in a ventilated area melt (can you say lead poison?) the lead into the holes

- polish all axles, I clamp them in a drill and use silverware polish

- very lightly polish/sand the inside of the wheels to remove any burrs (I've screwed up wheels going to far)

- I like to get a dab of glue in the axle hole before pushing the axle in, not too much or you'll get a clump on the outside that the wheel will bump

- Check the rules but get as wide of a wheel base as possible too.

Reasoning:

- lower friction with the front wheel off the track, the car must track straight though as it has one less wheel to "guide" it

- getting the long wheelbase gives stability

- weight at the rear of the car gives the greatest kinetic energy

- weight over/near the rear axle helps with tracking; I think we tried with it all the way to the rear, but, the front of the car is a bit more "floppy"

- wide wheel base delays friction that will happhen your car bumps the guide rail, the further out the wheels, the longer it'll be before that first bump

Only let the kid put stickers and crap on the car.

OK, at the risk of being compared to a Trekkie, let me give this a shot. I am a cubmaster; one of my boys has moved on out of scouting; and my younger boy is a Webelo I.

As my boys progressed through scouting we did a lot of reseach and had a lot of success. Combined, they have over 30 Pack and District championship trophies. I am often invited to give seminars and workshops and I freely give out every single bit of advice I have. I have also hosted workshops at my house and over 60 boys have built their cars in my shop, and dozens of them have won Pack and District trophies.

There are many ways to build winning cars but here are the keys I stress:

1) your son needs to decide if he wants to build a cool looking car or a fast car. Rarely is a cool looking car fast. Fast cars are generally very basic and boring. Here is an example of a simple car.

2) note that my son did not use the pre-cut axle slots. It's much better to drill new axle holes as far forward and as far back as possible. Try and find a floor drill press to do that. Don't have the front wheel extend past the front of the car.

3) try and place your weight so that the center of mass is about 3/4th of an inch in front of the rear axle. You can measure that by placing the car on the edge of a ruler to see if it balances there. Another goal is to have 1 ounce of weight on the front wheels and 4 ounces on the back.

4) file and polish axles. An easy way to do this is to put the axle in a dremmel tool or drill and get it spinning. Use a fine file to file off the ridges on the axles. Dont' take off to much material. Less is better than more. Then use wet and dry sandpaper to progressively polish the axle. Start with 600 grit and work your way up to 2500 grit. You can then use a micro polish and to put on the finishing touch. Wash and dry the axle thoroughly after that.

5) BSA changed wheels 2 years ago and the new ones are pretty good. Prior to that the old wheels had a molding bump that had to be shaved off. I wouldn't suggest messing with the new wheels unless you have access to a lathe of some sort. As a side note, don't place wheels on axles and spin them until after you've filed the axles. Otherwise the unpolished axles will make tiny grooves in the bore of the wheels that are nearly impossible to identify and remove. You should verify all wheels spin freely and don't wobble. If they wobble go to the scout store and get new ones.

6) get some high quality graphite from one of the pinewood derby websites. Place the wheel on the axle, squirt graphite in, spin the wheel hard 10 times. Repeat the process 4 times for each wheel. Graphite consists of crytals that must be crushed to be effective. Do not squirt fresh graphite on the wheels unless there is time to break it in.

7) push the axles/wheels into the axle holes. The wheel should be the width of a credit card from the side of the car.

8) roll the ar on a clean, flat surface to make sure it rolls relatively straight. If it moves towards one side or the other more than an inch over a foot you need to make an adjustment. Pull the axle and wheel out of the front hole and try and place a very slight bend in the axle. Do not do that while it is in the car or you will break off some wood. Place the axle/wheel back in and re-roll it. Rotate the axle until it starts rolling straigher.

9) put the car away and do not mess with it again until the race. Most disasters happen during this time.

Here is a thread on building an outlaw car for the dad's race. Most of the concepts also apply to building a scout class car.

By the way, despite the fact I say in a prior post it's hard to make a cool, fast car, that doesn't mean it's impossible. Here are two unusual cars we built that were very, very fast.

Elmo.

Ninja Warrior

my design was similar to an obtuse triangle and helped me win first place three years in a row

hollow the bottom mid maybe a quarter to half and inch and have weights running almost half of the car to make it the legal weight.

and without graphite dont even expect to compete

be sure to sand all the stuff down like previous posters mention

and did i say use graphite? yeah its that important

'gameday said:

By the way, despite the fact I say in a prior post it's hard to make a cool, fast car, that doesn't mean it's impossible. Here are two unusual cars we built that were very, very fast.

Elmo.

Ninja Warrior

Click to expand...

very nice

'gameday said:

By the way, despite the fact I say in a prior post it's hard to make a cool, fast car, that doesn't mean it's impossible. Here are two unusual cars we built that were very, very fast.

Elmo.

Ninja Warrior

Click to expand...

My son would love the Ninja Warrior.We are currently designing one that looks like a spider with the legs being what holds the axel/wheels.

I need to get it designed quick and try to cut it this weekend while I have access to my father-in-law's shop.

'urbanhack said:

I still hate my dad for really not helping me with mine 35 years ago.Good luck.

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Damn it. I'm in the same boat as Shuke. I suck at building and fixing stuff so I'm not looking forward to this. Luckily Cal's Supreme Master Of Cubs is my neighbor and he offered to help me. FML

'rick6668 said:

sand the wheels

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What's the trick to this?

'The Doctor said:

i have the secrets that will win it for you

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ok