JetMaxx
Footballguy
Wishing Decoy Dez was guarded by Tryon.
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Official Dez Bryant (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Carl Eller's Dead Liver
- Start date
Very tough crowd here. I would have liked to have a td from dez last night but he looked beastly accumulating those 86 yards. Like a man amongst boys. I have no problems with him (yet). He will have his games that catapult you to a win this year. Too talented not to. Romo knows what he has in dez. A physical beast who can go up and snatch the ball over any CB.
money.never.sleeps
Footballguy
Obviously what's happened is that the physical tools that helped Dez dominate college defenses (along with a high powered offense) isnt exactly translating to the NFL game. His weaknesses with route running, recognizing coverages, breaking off patterns and finding the soft part of zones/coverages to sit down in arent being learned as quickly so it has many frustrated. I do agree with several comments that he did look better in many phases last night. He was open several times and didnt get the opportunity from Romo but the trust will come with time. Hopefully sooner than later.
For some reason I just fear that his physical tools have put an unrealistic potential in people's minds that will never equate to realized production on the field. Dez' lack of a constant pro work ethic and learning curve on what it takes be a great professional will most likely be his downfall to the huge expectations.
I hope Im wrong but at this point maybe I should pull back on what I thought Dallas was getting when they took him.
For some reason I just fear that his physical tools have put an unrealistic potential in people's minds that will never equate to realized production on the field. Dez' lack of a constant pro work ethic and learning curve on what it takes be a great professional will most likely be his downfall to the huge expectations.
I hope Im wrong but at this point maybe I should pull back on what I thought Dallas was getting when they took him.
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SameSongNDance
Footballguy
It doesn't matter if were talking about past or present AJ, were using him as an example of a physical specimen who put it all together. We're waiting for Dez to put it all together as well but it doesn't look like he'll ever reach that "elite" status. BTW, who's Andre Jackson?
I'm tired of hearing he has "elite" potential. He should have realized that potential by now. Regardless though, he's still a VERY good wide receiver and no one can doubt that.I am so on this boat. I got him cheaply in most of my drafts and I'm looking to pick him up in every other one this week at his current value. Every time the guy caught a pass he was 6 feet away from someone - separation was awesome. Romo just didn't have to bother pushing the issue for big plays to Dez when Ogletree was lining up 1:1 against their 5th CB.
The Jerk
Footballguy
Posters were still saying this about Calvin Johnson 364 days ago in these very forums. Spouting nonsense about how he's never had a 10 catch game even though two of his first four seasons he had a dozen TDs.I don't think you can look at any receiver and suggest he may someday match Calvin Johnson without sounding ridiculously optimistic, but keep in mind that it took Calvin until season five to apparently reach his peak. I was happy with Calvin in 2010, too, and thought he became the best WR in football that season, but even that was season four for Calvin.Nobody wants to hear this, but we all need to have some patience with Dez and any other younger receiver. And while it's frustrating to deal with the "tease" of having unfulfilled potential, I'd rather have the "elite" potential guy than the guy who's playing over his head if they come with the same price tag. I got Dez after 20 WRs were off the board, so it's easier for me to be patient than those who are counting on him as a top ten wideout. But TDs are almost always more sporadic for WRs than RBs. I think 4-85 is a good start, and hopefully the success Dallas had with all three WRs will have a balancing effect on defensive schemes as the season progresses.'SameSongNDance said:
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
andre had 3 straight top 10 finished before his battle with a hammy last year.I wouldnt write him off just yet.'Kboyd78 said:
Or you could just get them both in the 3rd and 4th rounds this year like I did. Those two, Percy, and Nicks litter every team I have in both dynasty and re-draft. All of their floors are very high.
DevilintheDetail
Footballguy
Due to chronic injury issues, both Nicks and Andre actually have pretty low floors compared to lots of other WRs in that range (Welker, Marshall, Bowe, etc.).
footballnerd
Footballguy
assume it had to do with LRob
bill bates hits hard
Footballguy
he got hurt last year in week 1 vs the jets. deep bone bruise. he didnt condition himself.this season is all different. hes out to make a point. hope you drafted him.'duaneok66 said:
He is in his 3rd year. This is typically the year where WRs seem to put it all together. Let's revisit this thread midway through the season and if he still hasnt had any 100 yard games and very few Tds I'll be pissed just like you guys. But for now starting off the year with 86 yards in game one as opposed to nicks' 38 yards who was drafted earlier (or Cruz' pitiful 58 yds and 3 drops)...I'll take it.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
The breakout 3rd year WR mantra isnt one for the elite WR prospects. His rookie year was better than most of those 3rd year breakout guys. The question is if he can take it to the next level, where he's annually considered a Top 10 lock type WR.
I got him in the 5th rd rt around his adp. He was definitely being drafted as more like a top 20 WR. He is my Wr2. Maybe last yet he was considered top 10 in most defts but this year his value has been adjusted. I think he will far outperform his 5th Round adp and best his numbers from last season.
I guess we'll stop referring to AJ as elite whenever he stops being elite. Getting injured does not make you not elite. When you stop being elite when you are healthy, that's when you are no longer elite.See below for a breakdown of his healthy games of late. Nothing not elite about those numbers.'Kboyd78 said:
'Chase Stuart said:'FF Ninja said:
David's right that if he's not 100% by the start of the season, that's a legit concern. But all reports indicate he will be, and this guy is an uber stud if he's healthy. I don't think Johnson's more likely to get hurt than other elite WRs, and he's a top-5 fantasy and NFL WR when healthy.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
My point was that he has Top 10 talent, good enough to be a yearly lock for that matter, but at this point only flashes it. He's been valued appropriately this year, as a 4th-5th rounder. The question, once again, is can he take that next step?!!?!
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JPeso
Footballguy
Do you think he's going to take that next step?
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
Dont know
Probably telling that he isnt on any of my 3 teams though, and he was staring me in the face in the early 5th of my last draft when I was thinking about/high on him all that day prior to the draft and thinking Id like him on at least 1 of my teams. Ending up taking McGahee over him (after going Rice, Julio, AD, Harvin with my first 4 picks), although I think went RB there more because of not only value, but the risk/question mark AD is currently.At this point, I think he's the type of player I am waiting to see have that breakout year (this or next), and then I'll be all in the following year when he's somewhat discounted - all things relative - because thats the first time he put up huge numbers.
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I find it inconceivable you would pass on Dez Bryant this year in the 5th round in any format. He's gonna go off for 1200 this year.Dont know
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
So should the 2 WRs I already took, and McGahee should have a good chance to as well since thats what he did last year in a lesser offense. There's plenty of ways to build a fantasy team, and like I said in my previous post, Ill buy Dez having that 1200/11 season when he finally puts it up.I find it inconceivable you would pass on Dez Bryant this year in the 5th round in any format. He's gonna go off for 1200 this year.Dont know
petenice15
Footballguy
The best thing that could happen to Dez is to play out his rookie contract and get out of Dallas. I dont know if it's Romo or Garrett, but for some reason they don't use him nearly as much as they should. We've all heard the he can't run routes story, but he is clearly their best offensive weapon and they should be figuring out how to get him 8-10 touches a game. Maybe I'm wrong and he's out of shape and cant run the whole route tree, but I just see a player who can do serious damage with the ball in his hands. The key is just going to be getting the ball in his hands in the first place.
JPeso
Footballguy
Because he consistently beat the DB off the LOS Wednesday, even deep into the 2nd half. No longer are route tree and fatigue issues relevant arguments for Dez. Don't get me wrong, I can understand not believing he will "take the next step," but when the next step is...right...there...it's tough to suggest there's a less than 50% chance he will take it. Redrafters have one more week to buy Dez from a league mate that believes 4/85 is a "letdown" (I have to believe they must not have watched the game). It would seem there may be several owners who would dump him, if this thread is any indication. But perhaps those that felt this week as a letdown don't own Dez? I'm not sure. I can't imagine anyone selling in dynasty if they watched the game. He looked phenomenal. 1-2 more targets and he's got 5/100/1. TDs will come. I would suggest Dez' TD rate is .7-.8 per game. Yes, he will have some games with no TDs, but that's something I can live with. I was very happy with what I saw on Wednesday, but perhaps I have goggles in to where I'm missing something I have not considered hundreds of times.
Dawg Pound 69
Footballguy
Agree with JPeso. This might be minor to most people, but I really liked that Dez wasn't overly emotional against the Giants and didn't showboat. That is a major change from his actions in his first 2 seasons. Seems like he finally gets it, assuming week 1 wasn't an aberration. With improved route running, he won't need as many targets in order to do his damage.
Bankerguy
Footballguy
The ALL 22 paints a different picture. Better routes. It will also show you rolled coverage over the top against Dez.Should Romo have forced spme balls to Dez, or should he have thrown to Ogletree who was matched up against a 5th corner? Come on.
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jdoggydogg
Footballguy
Dallas loses 27-7 yesterday, and Bryant hauls in 3 catches for 17 yards.
Tell me again about how Bryant is a stud.
Tell me again about how Bryant is a stud.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Far too early for this talk, in my opinion. Based on yesterday's game, everyone on that side of the ball is a scrub, save Miles Austin.It is clear that Romo trusts Austin and Witten more than Bryant, at this point, and that is all we really know. We knew that going into the season, and were waiting to see if Dez could earn that trust. We still are.
jdoggydogg
Footballguy
Here's the deal: with Witten and Austin, you have two of the better receivers in the game. So you'd think that defenses would need to account for Austin and Witten first. And yet, Bryant continues to underwhelm. Now, Bryant did get targeted 10 times yesterday. So we know that Romo's looking for him. But Bryant remains a tease.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Yesterday excluded, Bryant's per target numbers have always been great. The issue has always been the targets. But, Bryant's career catch rate is 60%, which is very solid, considering he is a legit deep threat, running a deep route on about 30% of his targets. Bryant did underwhelm yesterday. He had 2 drops, that I recall, and didn't seem to be open very often. But, again, it was one game. The week before, he looked great everytime he touched the ball. His routes were as advertised (the ones we could see, given the TV angles, of coure).
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Another?Last week's game calculated out to a 80/1360 season. He is an elite redzone threat, so the TDs are coming. We need to calm down a bit, and realize it has been ONE bad game.
sbonomo
Footballguy
fitz scored 1 point....he must suck too...
Shutout
Footballguy
Someone enlighten me here. I just do not get this guy. I don't know if its the team, if its him, or whatever, but it seems like everytime I watch a Cowboys game, he appears to toy with defenders and looks unstoppable. But then if I'm not watching, hehas a pedestrian stat line. To me, he always looks great but what is really going on down there?
We Tigers
Footballguy
A very annoying week after a promising opener. The first few weeks of the season are always hard when a guy you're high on doesn't perform, because you see totally average players like Andre Roberts scoring twice and guys like Dez barely getting on the stat sheet. In Dallas, you see Austin getting the TDs. All the pieces are there--very strong route running and separation in week 1, a pile of targets in week 2--but it's not coming together yet. I think he should still be in lineups next week, though, as the Tampa secondary has been proven to be pretty vulnerable after Eli's 510-yard dismantling job yesterday.
If week 3 is nothing doing as well, then one should start to worry...
If week 3 is nothing doing as well, then one should start to worry...
Concept Coop
Footballguy
For reference, his 2011 per target numbers were better than Victor Cruz's.
Given the 163 targets that Cruz got, Dez's number equate to 97/1467/15.
That is why people are still so high on him. When he touches the ball, he is elite.
Given the 163 targets that Cruz got, Dez's number equate to 97/1467/15.
That is why people are still so high on him. When he touches the ball, he is elite.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
You're not alone. It came out last season that Dez was running the wrong routes, and couldn't be relied on to be in the right place. Without that information, what were we as fans to believe? We see him making plays everytime he touches the ball, and deduce that he needs the ball more.That is where we were, going into the season: Knowing Dez is one of the best when he touches the ball, and coupling that with reports that he is a better, more trustworthy route runner. We deduce he should get more targets. Elite per target production + more targets = Huge numbers. Until it plays itself out, I think that is all we know still, today. Yesterday didn't chagne that.
jdoggydogg
Footballguy
When Bryant has one Fitz-like game, we can have this discussion.fitz scored 1 point....he must suck too...
jdoggydogg
Footballguy
I think Bryant would do well on a team like Miami - where there aren't a lot of options at receiver. But Romo has the luxury of throwing to Witten and Austin.
Banger
Footballguy
complete enigma to me. He seems right on the cusp and is inching up but hasn't gotten there....I think he will but it's frustrating waiting for him to become what you can clearly see is there....
wiscstlatlmia
Footballguy
I've had a man-crush on Dez since his junior year at OK State... I am at the end of my rope
Maybe he isn't the all-world talent I projected him to be.
I'm not willing to give up yet, but a few more mediocre weeks and I'm probably putting him on the trade block.
If he goes off after I trade him then so be it, it is so frustrating to see him in my lineup week after week and have him let me down ...week after week.
Still has amazing potential, but sometimes you have to cut your losses on investments.
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DevilintheDetail
Footballguy
Romo didn't have a lot of time to throw against the Seahawks. When he is pressured, he throws to guys he trusts. He made an incredible throw to Ogletree under pressure this week, for example. Absolutely amazing. But he almost never throws it to Dez in those situations. My guess is that it is a combination of Dez not sticking with the play and getting open when the play breaks down and Romo just not trusting him.
netnalp
Footballguy
Could be Dez doesn't adjust his route to help the QB when the play breaks down or Romo is pressured.
sporthenry
Footballguy
I traded Dez for Colston straight up while I had Miles on my team as well. So I guess that tells you what I think. Miles should be more consistent as he seems to have a better rapport with Romo and doesn't seem to have any injury concerns but Dez will probably have some bigger weeks. Probably a true toss up but I took consistency.
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wiscstlatlmia
Footballguy
Redraft I probably wouldDynasty, I'm still holding
Avery
Footballguy
I'm hoping for a "breakout" game for him and then try to move him in my dynasty league while his name still has cache and his youth can still bring "potential" value back to me.
He could still do great, but at this point I want to mitigate my potential losses and not go down with the ship i.e. Chris Johnson style.
He could still do great, but at this point I want to mitigate my potential losses and not go down with the ship i.e. Chris Johnson style.
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