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Death of football? (1 Viewer)

U.S. viewership of the UEFA Champions League Final has exploded in recent years. This is the seventh straight year that English-language viewing of the Champions League Final has increased in the U.S. Over the last 10 years, viewing has increased almost 10-fold, from 264,000 viewers on ESPN in 2002 to 2.6 million on FOX this year.

Soccer continues to draw an impressively young audience. Saturday's match earned a 1.8 among Men 18-34 on FOX, which is +29% higher than the HH rating. It's exceptionally rare for a sports event to be that much stronger among the younger demo than it is overall.
That's like saying that a baseball player who increases his batting average from .020 to .200 is on the way to winning the batting title. A small number times 10 is still a small number. For comparison, a Tiger-less Northern trust open final drew 6+ million viewers 2 weeks ago.Statistics don't show everything. To put the soccer ratings demographics in perspective, for the 2005-2006 PBA season,

TV ratings in the male 18-34 demographic increase by 12.5 percent...
:unsure:
 
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The bottom line is that EBF is going to stay on message, never deviate. The axiomatic truth here is that soccer is emerging and growing and given its worldwide popularity, success breeds success, and therefore, soccer now exposed, will flourish in the US. The data are coming in and support it. /end

The naysayers giggle a little, do a little flopping around, dust themselves off and say, look, we're very happy that you're happy that the best matchup the sport had to offer drew 2.5 million people. That's incredible. You pulled the equivalent of Mesa, AZ, Oklahoma City, OK, and Tulsa to all stop what they were doing and watch a bunch of sissies flop around for 2 hours of their lives that they'll never had back. THIS IS SOCCER! ENJOY IT! And, they'll all basically look back at you and ask when they can leave to go fly fishing.

Soccer is for youth. Gives them good cardio. Socializes them to play as a team. Kids that don't have any particular skill and can't make the football, baseball, or basketball teams are very welcome in soccer. In fact, if you live in the right city, there are no goals and they don't keep score because by inalienable rights, all soccer players are winners. Just run around kids, act like those foreigners you see on TV on Saturday mornings at 8:30 am. It's a growing/emerging sport, Nancy. You'll be on the front lines of something special.

That's soccer for you. In the Death of the NFL thread, not a single Basketball fan, baseball fan, NASCAR fan, or even a brave NHL fan has the audacity to give it any semblance of credence. But, never underestimate the inferiority complex. The cognitive dissonance is so engrained in the soccer fans' DNA that they have to resolve the dissonance by projecting in a vacuum the sort of cultural revolution of sport as we know it because a few hundred thousand people care week to week and, occasionally, a few more will tune in to watch the very best floppers run around like gerbils for 120 minutes...and in that time we might see 2 balls actually wind up where they were intended.

Stupid sport. I understand it, EBF. A lot more than you think understand it. It's an incredibly stupid sport, and I'm glad the rest of the world has to slog through it and not us.

 
Actually, your posts show that you don't understand it much at all.

Cultural institutions are always in flux, especially in the United States. 50 years ago the Super Bowl didn't even exist. It's foolish to assume that things can't change. Change has been a constant in the history of this country. 2012 doesn't look like 1912, which didn't look like 1812. Things move quickly. 50 years is not a long time in historical terms, but A LOT can change in that time.

Your characterization of soccer as a sport for the reject kids is actually somewhat accurate. That's what it has been in the USA for the past 40-50 years. A lot of the kids who have played soccer in this country have been the castoffs who weren't good enough to cut it in baseball/football/basketball. However, that doesn't reflect the sport of soccer in general. It's no less "soft" and "pansy" than basketball or baseball, which have huge domestic followings.

Your view reflects the limited perspective of someone whose familiarity with the game doesn't extend beyond national borders. I can understand why people who think of soccer as a joke sport played by spoiled suburban children would be skeptical of the game's domestic growth potential. It's a sensible view for people who don't know much about the sport and have spent only a limited amount of time watching the highest levels. If you don't know what's out there, you might assume that what's right in front of you is all there is.

That viewpoint is slowly, but gradually receding into history. More and more people in this country are discovering why the game is so popular around the world. Like with basketball or football, if you watch two teams full of world class athletes with incredible skill, the entertainment value can be incredible. It used to be difficult for Americans to access the elite level games on a regular basis. Now it's easy. Popularity and respect are following. Hence why I see more and more people with Messi jerseys and Man United gear walking the streets every day. The appreciation is growing. The numbers don't lie. Clinging to the past and throwing out derogatory stereotypes just makes you look like a grumpy old man, like the confused parents of the past who just couldn't understand why anyone would listen to those weird moppy head kids called The Beatles when they could have Pat Boone records instead.

 
Actually, your posts show that you don't understand it much at all. Cultural institutions are always in flux, especially in the United States. 50 years ago the Super Bowl didn't even exist. It's foolish to assume that things can't change. Change has been a constant in the history of this country. 2012 doesn't look like 1912, which didn't look like 1812. Things move quickly. 50 years is not a long time in historical terms, but A LOT can change in that time. Your characterization of soccer as a sport for the reject kids is actually somewhat accurate. That's what it has been in the USA for the past 40-50 years. A lot of the kids who have played soccer in this country have been the castoffs who weren't good enough to cut it in baseball/football/basketball. However, that doesn't reflect the sport of soccer in general. It's no less "soft" and "pansy" than basketball or baseball, which have huge domestic followings. Your view reflects the limited perspective of someone whose familiarity with the game doesn't extend beyond national borders. I can understand why people who think of soccer as a joke sport played by spoiled suburban children would be skeptical of the game's domestic growth potential. It's a sensible view for people who don't know much about the sport and have spent only a limited amount of time watching the highest levels. If you don't know what's out there, you might assume that what's right in front of you is all there is. That viewpoint is slowly, but gradually receding into history. More and more people in this country are discovering why the game is so popular around the world. Like with basketball or football, if you watch two teams full of world class athletes with incredible skill, the entertainment value can be incredible. It used to be difficult for Americans to access the elite level games on a regular basis. Now it's easy. Popularity and respect are following. Hence why I see more and more people with Messi jerseys and Man United gear walking the streets every day. The appreciation is growing. The numbers don't lie. Clinging to the past and throwing out derogatory stereotypes just makes you look like a grumpy old man, like the confused parents of the past who just couldn't understand why anyone would listen to those weird moppy head kids called The Beatles when they could have Pat Boone records instead.
Soccer has been 'the next big thing' in America since Pele was playing for the New York Cosmos 20 years ago. After that it was MLS, the World Cup hosting, and most recently the signing of David Beckham which would propel soccer into the mainstream. All along the junior ranks were over-populated. Soccer was played by more kids than any other sport in America! I'm not sure how anyone could have failed to be exposed to this insanity.So what happened? Pele retired, the world cup euphoria subsided, MLS is almost as successful as the WNBA and apparently David Beckham still plays for LA according to wikipedia. The game itself is still rooted in the 19th century. While the NFL changes its rules every year FIFA roars with glacial speed into the 1930s.People don't want to watch sports which restrict athleticism. They want to watch great athletes, fast paced action and violence. Soccer has some great athletes, but the best in the world play in the NBA, the pace of soccer is lethargic, it's not nearly as analytical as any of the American sports (especially baseball) and there is no physical contest to speak of.You want a real threat to the NFL in America try MMA. Here's a sport that was banned across the country in the mid-90s. Like you say, times change, so rather than being restricted to a dozen states in the US the UFC is now broadcast in 130 countries around the planet. There was an event in Tokyo last weekend. In a couple of weeks it will be Sydney.
 
Soccer has been 'the next big thing' in America since Pele was playing for the New York Cosmos 20 years ago. After that it was MLS, the World Cup hosting, and most recently the signing of David Beckham which would propel soccer into the mainstream. All along the junior ranks were over-populated. Soccer was played by more kids than any other sport in America! I'm not sure how anyone could have failed to be exposed to this insanity.

So what happened? Pele retired, the world cup euphoria subsided, MLS is almost as successful as the WNBA and apparently David Beckham still plays for LA according to wikipedia.

The game itself is still rooted in the 19th century. While the NFL changes its rules every year FIFA roars with glacial speed into the 1930s.

People don't want to watch sports which restrict athleticism. They want to watch great athletes, fast paced action and violence. Soccer has some great athletes, but the best in the world play in the NBA, the pace of soccer is lethargic, it's not nearly as analytical as any of the American sports (especially baseball) and there is no physical contest to speak of.

You want a real threat to the NFL in America try MMA. Here's a sport that was banned across the country in the mid-90s. Like you say, times change, so rather than being restricted to a dozen states in the US the UFC is now broadcast in 130 countries around the planet. There was an event in Tokyo last weekend. In a couple of weeks it will be Sydney.
I think the media climate has changed significantly since the days of Pele and the New York Cosmos. There was no YouTube, no ESPN3, no Fox Soccer Channel, and no FIFA video games. In short, there was almost no way for anyone with an interest in the sport to satisfy their curiosity. I think access is the key word. Now you can actually follow the top leagues as their seasons unfold. You can watch all the games or you can just catch highlights if all you want to see is goals. All of this reinforces fandom for the sport. MLS has already outlasted NASL (the American league that had Pele, Cruyff, etc). Perhaps most importantly, it's actually been getting stronger every year. Interest dropped after the initial season, when the novelty factor and World Cup fever wore off, but since then it has been rising steadily, along with the quality of play. I'll respectfully disagree about soccer restricting athleticism. Sure, the players are not as big, strong, and fast as American football players, but that is largely because the skill aspect of the sport is tremendous. If you are just big and fast, you will be useless if you can't dribble, pass, and shoot. I wouldn't say the sport restricts athleticism so much as it requires a different brand of athleticism from football/basketball, in a similar sense to how playing quarterback requires a different brand of athleticism from playing running back. When you add in complex operations like passing the ball, you eliminate all of the great athletes who don't possess the skill. But at the highest levels of the game, many elite soccer players have great physical talent and great game skill. The sport is much like basketball in that regard. The guys in the NBA aren't just tall, quick, and fast. They're tall, quick, fast, AND they can dribble, pass, and shoot.

It's the same way with players like Thierry Henry, Didier Drogba, Ronaldinho, and Nani. They have NFL type speed and quickness paired with incredible skills. I don't think of "restricted athleticism" when I watch players like this :) :

I agree that MMA is getting big, and quickly. I think it is capitalizing more on the problems with boxing than anything else. People love violence and MMA delivers that. Boxing used to give us our fix in this country, but the sport has eroded due to corruption and poor organization. MMA has capitalized.

 
Soccer has been 'the next big thing' in America since Pele was playing for the New York Cosmos 20 years ago. After that it was MLS, the World Cup hosting, and most recently the signing of David Beckham which would propel soccer into the mainstream. All along the junior ranks were over-populated. Soccer was played by more kids than any other sport in America! I'm not sure how anyone could have failed to be exposed to this insanity.

So what happened? Pele retired, the world cup euphoria subsided, MLS is almost as successful as the WNBA and apparently David Beckham still plays for LA according to wikipedia.

The game itself is still rooted in the 19th century. While the NFL changes its rules every year FIFA roars with glacial speed into the 1930s.

People don't want to watch sports which restrict athleticism. They want to watch great athletes, fast paced action and violence. Soccer has some great athletes, but the best in the world play in the NBA, the pace of soccer is lethargic, it's not nearly as analytical as any of the American sports (especially baseball) and there is no physical contest to speak of.

You want a real threat to the NFL in America try MMA. Here's a sport that was banned across the country in the mid-90s. Like you say, times change, so rather than being restricted to a dozen states in the US the UFC is now broadcast in 130 countries around the planet. There was an event in Tokyo last weekend. In a couple of weeks it will be Sydney.
I think the media climate has changed significantly since the days of Pele and the New York Cosmos. There was no YouTube, no ESPN3, no Fox Soccer Channel, and no FIFA video games. In short, there was almost no way for anyone with an interest in the sport to satisfy their curiosity. I think access is the key word. Now you can actually follow the top leagues as their seasons unfold. You can watch all the games or you can just catch highlights if all you want to see is goals. All of this reinforces fandom for the sport. MLS has already outlasted NASL (the American league that had Pele, Cruyff, etc). Perhaps most importantly, it's actually been getting stronger every year. Interest dropped after the initial season, when the novelty factor and World Cup fever wore off, but since then it has been rising steadily, along with the quality of play. I'll respectfully disagree about soccer restricting athleticism. Sure, the players are not as big, strong, and fast as American football players, but that is largely because the skill aspect of the sport is tremendous. If you are just big and fast, you will be useless if you can't dribble, pass, and shoot. I wouldn't say the sport restricts athleticism so much as it requires a different brand of athleticism from football/basketball, in a similar sense to how playing quarterback requires a different brand of athleticism from playing running back. When you add in complex operations like passing the ball, you eliminate all of the great athletes who don't possess the skill. But at the highest levels of the game, many elite soccer players have great physical talent and great game skill. The sport is much like basketball in that regard. The guys in the NBA aren't just tall, quick, and fast. They're tall, quick, fast, AND they can dribble, pass, and shoot.

It's the same way with players like Thierry Henry, Didier Drogba, Ronaldinho, and Nani. They have NFL type speed and quickness paired with incredible skills. I don't think of "restricted athleticism" when I watch players like this :) :

so is this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=1tQM59cIB-c#t=113s

Any time you put more restrictions on an athlete you are restricting the athleticism on display. Restricting contact (as in basketball) is one thing, but stopping people from using their hands flies in the face of human evolution.

You make a good point about access. This is why we see the NBA and NFL growing in developed countries, and the same can be expected for soccer in countries which have lacked exposure.

Interesting that you mention corruption - a major issue in Serie A a number of years ago and formerly in the EPL. MLB/NFL/NBA have been squeaky clean by comparison.

 
Lebron? Come on, man! Athletic dynamo, but ho-hum skills and he crumbles under pressure. I watched the Finals last year. He looked so scared. Meanwhile Berea and Terry were burying everything. If you just want a raw dunker, give me Blake Griffin or Shawn Kemp instead.

 
Soccer has been 'the next big thing' in America since Pele was playing for the New York Cosmos 20 years ago. After that it was MLS, the World Cup hosting, and most recently the signing of David Beckham which would propel soccer into the mainstream. All along the junior ranks were over-populated. Soccer was played by more kids than any other sport in America! I'm not sure how anyone could have failed to be exposed to this insanity.

So what happened? Pele retired, the world cup euphoria subsided, MLS is almost as successful as the WNBA and apparently David Beckham still plays for LA according to wikipedia.

The game itself is still rooted in the 19th century. While the NFL changes its rules every year FIFA roars with glacial speed into the 1930s.

People don't want to watch sports which restrict athleticism. They want to watch great athletes, fast paced action and violence. Soccer has some great athletes, but the best in the world play in the NBA, the pace of soccer is lethargic, it's not nearly as analytical as any of the American sports (especially baseball) and there is no physical contest to speak of.

You want a real threat to the NFL in America try MMA. Here's a sport that was banned across the country in the mid-90s. Like you say, times change, so rather than being restricted to a dozen states in the US the UFC is now broadcast in 130 countries around the planet. There was an event in Tokyo last weekend. In a couple of weeks it will be Sydney.
I think the media climate has changed significantly since the days of Pele and the New York Cosmos. There was no YouTube, no ESPN3, no Fox Soccer Channel, and no FIFA video games. In short, there was almost no way for anyone with an interest in the sport to satisfy their curiosity. I think access is the key word. Now you can actually follow the top leagues as their seasons unfold. You can watch all the games or you can just catch highlights if all you want to see is goals. All of this reinforces fandom for the sport. MLS has already outlasted NASL (the American league that had Pele, Cruyff, etc). Perhaps most importantly, it's actually been getting stronger every year. Interest dropped after the initial season, when the novelty factor and World Cup fever wore off, but since then it has been rising steadily, along with the quality of play. I'll respectfully disagree about soccer restricting athleticism. Sure, the players are not as big, strong, and fast as American football players, but that is largely because the skill aspect of the sport is tremendous. If you are just big and fast, you will be useless if you can't dribble, pass, and shoot. I wouldn't say the sport restricts athleticism so much as it requires a different brand of athleticism from football/basketball, in a similar sense to how playing quarterback requires a different brand of athleticism from playing running back. When you add in complex operations like passing the ball, you eliminate all of the great athletes who don't possess the skill. But at the highest levels of the game, many elite soccer players have great physical talent and great game skill. The sport is much like basketball in that regard. The guys in the NBA aren't just tall, quick, and fast. They're tall, quick, fast, AND they can dribble, pass, and shoot.

It's the same way with players like Thierry Henry, Didier Drogba, Ronaldinho, and Nani. They have NFL type speed and quickness paired with incredible skills. I don't think of "restricted athleticism" when I watch players like this :) :

Wasn't Tim Donaghy part of a major NBA point spread scandal a few years back?This thread is also starting to feel like a defense/rebuttal for soccer rather than death of football.

I'm guessing my suggestion for basketball to be the successor a horrible one.

 
The bottom line is that EBF is going to stay on message, never deviate. The axiomatic truth here is that soccer is emerging and growing and given its worldwide popularity, success breeds success, and therefore, soccer now exposed, will flourish in the US. The data are coming in and support it. /endThe naysayers giggle a little, do a little flopping around, dust themselves off and say, look, we're very happy that you're happy that the best matchup the sport had to offer drew 2.5 million people. That's incredible. You pulled the equivalent of Mesa, AZ, Oklahoma City, OK, and Tulsa to all stop what they were doing and watch a bunch of sissies flop around for 2 hours of their lives that they'll never had back. THIS IS SOCCER! ENJOY IT! And, they'll all basically look back at you and ask when they can leave to go fly fishing.Soccer is for youth. Gives them good cardio. Socializes them to play as a team. Kids that don't have any particular skill and can't make the football, baseball, or basketball teams are very welcome in soccer. In fact, if you live in the right city, there are no goals and they don't keep score because by inalienable rights, all soccer players are winners. Just run around kids, act like those foreigners you see on TV on Saturday mornings at 8:30 am. It's a growing/emerging sport, Nancy. You'll be on the front lines of something special.That's soccer for you. In the Death of the NFL thread, not a single Basketball fan, baseball fan, NASCAR fan, or even a brave NHL fan has the audacity to give it any semblance of credence. But, never underestimate the inferiority complex. The cognitive dissonance is so engrained in the soccer fans' DNA that they have to resolve the dissonance by projecting in a vacuum the sort of cultural revolution of sport as we know it because a few hundred thousand people care week to week and, occasionally, a few more will tune in to watch the very best floppers run around like gerbils for 120 minutes...and in that time we might see 2 balls actually wind up where they were intended. Stupid sport. I understand it, EBF. A lot more than you think understand it. It's an incredibly stupid sport, and I'm glad the rest of the world has to slog through it and not us.
damn soccer's got u mad bruh. mebbe chill out and do something positive.
 
Not going to happen. Had this discussion with many basketball and soccer fans/buddies of mine, feel free to ignore this long-winded opinion of the future of sport in this country.

In order for football to fail, it would have to be self-inflicted wounds. They would have to drastically alter their business model, which is currently the best in all of American sports.

Reasons why NFL is tops, and will stay that way:

1. Every game counts, unlike the NBA, or NHL.

2. Most games only on Sunday. People can count themselves as a hardcore fan, and really only watch the sport once a week. This is the #1 reason, to me. A lot of people, the kind that buy tickets and spend money on their favorite sport, don't have a lot of time. You can have kids, crazy job, and you still only have to get your sheet together once a week, and feel like you aren't missing much. People can watch every single game of their favorite team, which is rare in any other sport.

3. Parity. Every team is a year away from competing. It's proven every single year. Next year some terrible team will make a run, turn out to not be so terrible anymore, and their long term outlook, and reputation around the league, will do a complete 180. Witness the 49ers last season. The worst-to-first storyline is much rarer in the the other sports, and American fans are such that they need to see their teams compete in order to fill the seats.

4. It's the best TV sport in the US. I really don't even think it's debatable. Hockey, it's obvious what a bad TV sport it is when you go to a game live, and see how fast and great it is. Baseball moves even slower than the NFL, and the NBA has much of he game where there is no urgency. Watching the end of a tight game between contenders, and playoff basketball illustrates just how much of the game is mailed in. The NFL, people complain about the break between plays, and talk about how much less action there is than in a soccer match. I believe this is a positive, not a negative. The break between plays in the NFL allows for three things to happen: 1) For the casual fan to get to know the players and game better, 2) for the announcers to build the hype and drama more, and 3) for the replays. As fans, with so many things happening at once, we often miss the best part of the play. A crushing downfield block, a DB making a spectacular play in the ball. One great thing about football, on every play, someone is doing something spectacular. The breaks allow people to catch things they missed, and really lets the fan appreciate what these guys are doing.

5. No competition for TV viewership. This ties into the brilliance of having all games on Sunday, as stated above, but during any other sports' seasons, they are butting heads with another sport. The NFL is so big, MLB wrings their hands in October, being very careful not to have their World Series going against NFL regular season games. The other sports have no problem scheduling games vs. each other. But no one wants any part of autumn Sundays.



Reasons why other sports will not overtake the NFL

NBA: I simply don't see the passion, nationwide, as I do for the NFL. There are massive portions of the country, where people just don't care about the NBA. And how is that going to change? The NBA made it's push with Magic/Larry/Jordan. They may not dip down in popularity, but any big jump in fandom, I don't see where this would come from. Even the cornerstone teams, like Knicks and Celtics, if they have a bad season or two, the fans clear out quick. I happen to think college hoops has a better chance of overtaking the NBA in popularity than I do the NBA passing the NFL. I think NBA players make too much money, care less about basketball than other players care about their sport, and think the fans can tell that. The least-beloved of all pro athletes.

Soccer: This is definitely opinion, but let's start with facts: We have been told for at least 30 years that soccer was the sport of the future in the US. And it is definitely still growing, the TV numbers tell us that. Having said that, those numbers had nowhere else to go than up. They should be going up. The confluence of events that would have to happen for soccer to overtake the NFL are so many and unlikely, I don't see how anyone could possibly feel it was likely:

1 The US would have to have world-class talent in it's pro league. Americans will simply not have the passion for a 2nd rate league. Look at the World Cup. There are many countries where just making the tourney is cause for national holidays. US fans are pissed of they don't make the semis. For soccer to overtake the NFL, fans need to believe they are watching the best brand of the sport. We are a long way from this happening, and I think this is the factor most likely to happen, to give you an idea of how far-fetched this is.

2. Fans will need to develop the same passion as other countries have. I didn't appreciate soccer until I was in Europe, and a lot of the excitement comes from the fanatical devotion, the religious fervor in the stands. Only big-time college football comes close. I believe it is impossible for this to happen within this, or the next, generation. Soccer had an advantage in other countries, it was the first, and in many cases, only sport that they could compete in. The US has too many other sports they compete or outright dominate, in. To a certain extent, a lot of other countries, soccer is ALL they have.

3. The US would have to win a world cup. This is obviously only opinion, but I cannot imagine soccer making a big move in the US without the US taking home the cup, and some stars being born.

4. An American Bird/Magic might be needed. A Michael Jordan of soccer, but with a Wilt Chamberlain as a rival. And they need to be playing in the states, not in the EPL. What are the chances of that happening?

 
Soccer has been 'the next big thing' in America since Pele was playing for the New York Cosmos 20 35 years ago.
I think the media climate has changed significantly since the days of Pele and the New York Cosmos. There was no YouTube, no ESPN3, no Fox Soccer Channel, and no FIFA video games. In short, there was almost no way for anyone with an interest in the sport to satisfy their curiosity. I think access is the key word.
They had national access on CBS and ABC. Their ratings were higher than they are today. Could they see 150 games? No, but there was tv access for anyone who was interested.
 
Even the cornerstone teams, like Knicks and Celtics, if they have a bad season or two, the fans clear out quick.
you picked 2 poor examples. even during the dark isiah years the garden was still selling out. nyc is a bball town.better argument would be pointing out that the grizzlies who are a very good team or the hawks who are decent dont get many fans. hell, even the heat games dont sell out.
 
Even the cornerstone teams, like Knicks and Celtics, if they have a bad season or two, the fans clear out quick.
you picked 2 poor examples. even during the dark isiah years the garden was still selling out. nyc is a bball town.
Actually, I didn't. I am from Boston, and during the Bird years, people were talking about how people had to have season tickets willed to them, or wait generations. Reggie Lewis and Len Bian die, and good seats were available all the time. Boston hoops fans are bandwagoners, and if you don't believe me, wait till next year. I was living in New York during the Isiah years, and while the Knicks always have decent attendance numbers, New Yorkers are notorious frontrunners, and if the NBA was any threat to the NFL at all, a city of 9 million should never do anything less than sellout every single home game for the Knicks.
 
The sport will be successful in the US that works the best for corporations. Football is extremely advertiser-friendly and thus network-friendly. Soccer isn't, which is why it will never be big in the US, any more than ultimate frisbee will be (and ultimate is certainly a more aesthetic game to watch than soccer).

The NBA posed a threat back in the Jordan days. It has the advantage that the players' faces are visible, which is better for marketing. It hasn't really recovered from the loss of Jordan, but there's a credible competitor there.

Baseball just isn't TV-friendly enough to succeed against football in the US. That's why football took over from baseball in the first place.

 
Even the cornerstone teams, like Knicks and Celtics, if they have a bad season or two, the fans clear out quick.
you picked 2 poor examples. even during the dark isiah years the garden was still selling out. nyc is a bball town.
Actually, I didn't. I am from Boston, and during the Bird years, people were talking about how people had to have season tickets willed to them, or wait generations. Reggie Lewis and Len Bian die, and good seats were available all the time. Boston hoops fans are bandwagoners, and if you don't believe me, wait till next year. I was living in New York during the Isiah years, and while the Knicks always have decent attendance numbers, New Yorkers are notorious frontrunners, and if the NBA was any threat to the NFL at all, a city of 9 million should never do anything less than sellout every single home game for the Knicks.
ok so ya, having high attendance numbers means fans are clearing out quick. def cool story. nice chat good sir.
 
Only old men will remember this but baseball, boxing and horse racing were the big 3 in pro sports. Now both boxing and horse racing are on life support. Still I don't see football dieing, if they banned upper body tackling I wonder how popular the sport would be. It would be essentially rugby with pads and a legal forward pass. The players these days are just too big and strong to allow these vicious hits to go on.

 
The sport will be successful in the US that works the best for corporations. Football is extremely advertiser-friendly and thus network-friendly. Soccer isn't, which is why it will never be big in the US, any more than ultimate frisbee will be (and ultimate is certainly a more aesthetic game to watch than soccer).

The NBA posed a threat back in the Jordan days. It has the advantage that the players' faces are visible, which is better for marketing. It hasn't really recovered from the loss of Jordan, but there's a credible competitor there.

Baseball just isn't TV-friendly enough to succeed against football in the US. That's why football took over from baseball in the first place.
It's always, always all about money. This will forever be the case. Basketball has the possibility of being advertisement friendly. Soccer, at the moment doesn't. When the advertisers find ways to push their product onto the soccer field, or onto the tv when a game is in play, then maybe the game will overtake another sport. Whether that sport is basketball, football, or baseball remains to be seen.
 
'Csonka4life said:
Only old men will remember this but baseball, boxing and horse racing were the big 3 in pro sports. Now both boxing and horse racing are on life support. Still I don't see football dieing, if they banned upper body tackling I wonder how popular the sport would be. It would be essentially rugby with pads and a legal forward pass. The players these days are just too big and strong to allow these vicious hits to go on.
Baseball shot itself's in the foot. Beyond that, it's always been a local sport.Boxing died because of ppv and the coruption that kept the best bouts from happening. If the NFL moves all it's games to ppv then it will follow the same path. Right now you get at least four free games a week and often 5-6.Horse racing was big for one reason only, it was the only way to gamble. With the expansion of casinos and online outlets, people have gone elsewhere for their gambling fix.
 
I think some of us are letting conventional thinking constrain our imaginations. Instead of arguing about what kind of sport soccer is, it could be that football's replacement as the top sport in this country hasn't been invented yet.

True, football's financial entrenchment gives it a foundation of power that its predecessors didn't have, but somebody might be dreaming up something altogether different right now, something that takes hold of the next generations, who might very well reject football and gradually replace us demographically until the remaining football fans are like those old guys at the race track, wearing bad hats and wondering why the crowd watching with us is so small.

It would be a fun exercise to brainstorm about such a game but that's probably better left for a thread in the other forum.

 
Ok, but I have watched the best in soccer play, and it's putrid. If you feel better posturing as though it's an enlightenment issue, go ahead, I don't think anyone cares. Soccer fans have been pulling this crap for years.
Everyone's entitled to an opinion. Just realize that all of the objective factors contradict your stance.- The sport is beloved across the world.- The USA's domestic league is improving.- Television ratings in the USA are improving. None of this means the MLS will overtake the NFL tomorrow, but the "soccer = boring" stuff is the same kind of stubborn close-mindedness that probably would've lead people to say eighty years ago that nobody would ever skip a baseball game to watch some strange sport called "basketball." Things change. Quickly. It wasn't long ago that MLB ruled America. It wasn't long ago that the NFL was barely a blip on the radar. It wasn't long ago that the NBA was a total joke. Why people think these fleeting institutions are set in cement is beyond me.
And this is where you FAIL. Nothing contradicts (nor can it contradict) my aesthetic interests or "stance.". You'll do a lot better prosthelitizing on your Arsenal messageboard. I'm sure you can get those 10 people all fired up about a sport that's hobbling alon in the US, eking out the LPGA in fan interest.
this is not an excellent response and anyhow cobalt just because you say you dont care about his opinion doesnt mean that anyone gives a viqueens shot of winning the superbowls chance about your opinion either so at most you have a gigantic draw and when carried through to its logical conclusion your own comment is the very reason that no one should even listen to your comment i know i just blew your mind but its ok i do that sometimes when i can actualy hit the buttons rightand the day wasnt too hard on me so take it to the bank brohan and deposit in the security box labled when you say no one can change your not caring then no one should care what you say file i know what you are thinking but it is a big box and the label has small font
 
Ok, but I have watched the best in soccer play, and it's putrid. If you feel better posturing as though it's an enlightenment issue, go ahead, I don't think anyone cares. Soccer fans have been pulling this crap for years.
Everyone's entitled to an opinion. Just realize that all of the objective factors contradict your stance.- The sport is beloved across the world.- The USA's domestic league is improving.- Television ratings in the USA are improving. None of this means the MLS will overtake the NFL tomorrow, but the "soccer = boring" stuff is the same kind of stubborn close-mindedness that probably would've lead people to say eighty years ago that nobody would ever skip a baseball game to watch some strange sport called "basketball." Things change. Quickly. It wasn't long ago that MLB ruled America. It wasn't long ago that the NFL was barely a blip on the radar. It wasn't long ago that the NBA was a total joke. Why people think these fleeting institutions are set in cement is beyond me.
And this is where you FAIL. Nothing contradicts (nor can it contradict) my aesthetic interests or "stance.". You'll do a lot better prosthelitizing on your Arsenal messageboard. I'm sure you can get those 10 people all fired up about a sport that's hobbling alon in the US, eking out the LPGA in fan interest.
this is not an excellent response and anyhow cobalt just because you say you dont care about his opinion doesnt mean that anyone gives a viqueens shot of winning the superbowls chance about your opinion either so at most you have a gigantic draw and when carried through to its logical conclusion your own comment is the very reason that no one should even listen to your comment i know i just blew your mind but its ok i do that sometimes when i can actualy hit the buttons rightand the day wasnt too hard on me so take it to the bank brohan and deposit in the security box labled when you say no one can change your not caring then no one should care what you say file i know what you are thinking but it is a big box and the label has small font
The period (.) is located next to the comma (,) which should both be to the immediate right of the /m/ on your keyboard.As for content, I don't think a GPS could localize a point to this rambling. Thanks for responding, though. :thumbup:
 
Ok, but I have watched the best in soccer play, and it's putrid. If you feel better posturing as though it's an enlightenment issue, go ahead, I don't think anyone cares. Soccer fans have been pulling this crap for years.
Everyone's entitled to an opinion. Just realize that all of the objective factors contradict your stance.- The sport is beloved across the world.- The USA's domestic league is improving.- Television ratings in the USA are improving. None of this means the MLS will overtake the NFL tomorrow, but the "soccer = boring" stuff is the same kind of stubborn close-mindedness that probably would've lead people to say eighty years ago that nobody would ever skip a baseball game to watch some strange sport called "basketball." Things change. Quickly. It wasn't long ago that MLB ruled America. It wasn't long ago that the NFL was barely a blip on the radar. It wasn't long ago that the NBA was a total joke. Why people think these fleeting institutions are set in cement is beyond me.
And this is where you FAIL. Nothing contradicts (nor can it contradict) my aesthetic interests or "stance.". You'll do a lot better prosthelitizing on your Arsenal messageboard. I'm sure you can get those 10 people all fired up about a sport that's hobbling alon in the US, eking out the LPGA in fan interest.
this is not an excellent response and anyhow cobalt just because you say you dont care about his opinion doesnt mean that anyone gives a viqueens shot of winning the superbowls chance about your opinion either so at most you have a gigantic draw and when carried through to its logical conclusion your own comment is the very reason that no one should even listen to your comment i know i just blew your mind but its ok i do that sometimes when i can actualy hit the buttons rightand the day wasnt too hard on me so take it to the bank brohan and deposit in the security box labled when you say no one can change your not caring then no one should care what you say file i know what you are thinking but it is a big box and the label has small font
The period (.) is located next to the comma (,) which should both be to the immediate right of the /m/ on your keyboard.As for content, I don't think a GPS could localize a point to this rambling. Thanks for responding, though. :thumbup:
We all understood him fine. He said "Cobalt is a snot."
 
If anything kills my interest in football it is the lack of flow. With replays and commercials, we spend more time waiting then watching. In the span of a 3.5 hour game, there is only about 15 minutes of actual action. The rest is filler, commercials, and the over analysis of a slow-mo replay. People might say soccer is boring, but at least there is actually 90 minutes of play and extended periods without commercials.
Much prefer NFL to any soccer, but this is dead on. Any time I actually do watch soccer, I'm impressed more by the flow and constant play than anything else. There is a huge demand for that from the viewers who are turned off by the constant delays IMO. The flow at a LIVE football game is almost non-existent and as a result it's hard to keep any momentum with the fans. It seriously feels like 100 breaks for commercials when you're at the stadium and the replays seem to take hours. However, on TV, I think most of us are following multiple games most Sundays and barely notice. The trend seems to be less focus towards the live experience anyway and more catered towards TV viewers.
 
The sport will be successful in the US that works the best for corporations. Football is extremely advertiser-friendly and thus network-friendly. Soccer isn't, which is why it will never be big in the US, any more than ultimate frisbee will be (and ultimate is certainly a more aesthetic game to watch than soccer).

The NBA posed a threat back in the Jordan days. It has the advantage that the players' faces are visible, which is better for marketing. It hasn't really recovered from the loss of Jordan, but there's a credible competitor there.

Baseball just isn't TV-friendly enough to succeed against football in the US. That's why football took over from baseball in the first place.
It's always, always all about money. This will forever be the case. Basketball has the possibility of being advertisement friendly. Soccer, at the moment doesn't. When the advertisers find ways to push their product onto the soccer field, or onto the tv when a game is in play, then maybe the game will overtake another sport. Whether that sport is basketball, football, or baseball remains to be seen.
Definitely true, but I'm interested in how "advertiser friendly" the NFL on Sundays is. It's certainly TV-friendly, but with so many games on at the same time, how many people watch any commercials on a Sunday? I think as more and more people watch the Sunday Ticket, record the games and play them back on DVR, or watch the condensed games in some way, these breaks become less important and advertising while games play will become more important.Soccer will face the same problem Nascar faces today in regards to not translating on TV. Do we cater to the advertisers to keep bringing in money and growing the sport that way or do we try to cater to the viewer and recreate the event to drive up fan support. The biggest reason Nascar doesn't do even better on TV is how they've answered that question IMO.

 
The sport will be successful in the US that works the best for corporations. Football is extremely advertiser-friendly and thus network-friendly. Soccer isn't, which is why it will never be big in the US, any more than ultimate frisbee will be (and ultimate is certainly a more aesthetic game to watch than soccer).

The NBA posed a threat back in the Jordan days. It has the advantage that the players' faces are visible, which is better for marketing. It hasn't really recovered from the loss of Jordan, but there's a credible competitor there.

Baseball just isn't TV-friendly enough to succeed against football in the US. That's why football took over from baseball in the first place.
It's always, always all about money. This will forever be the case. Basketball has the possibility of being advertisement friendly. Soccer, at the moment doesn't. When the advertisers find ways to push their product onto the soccer field, or onto the tv when a game is in play, then maybe the game will overtake another sport. Whether that sport is basketball, football, or baseball remains to be seen.
Definitely true, but I'm interested in how "advertiser friendly" the NFL on Sundays is. It's certainly TV-friendly, but with so many games on at the same time, how many people watch any commercials on a Sunday? I think as more and more people watch the Sunday Ticket, record the games and play them back on DVR, or watch the condensed games in some way, these breaks become less important and advertising while games play will become more important.Soccer will face the same problem Nascar faces today in regards to not translating on TV. Do we cater to the advertisers to keep bringing in money and growing the sport that way or do we try to cater to the viewer and recreate the event to drive up fan support. The biggest reason Nascar doesn't do even better on TV is how they've answered that question IMO.
Just to throw some quickly googled numbers out there... census estimates have there being around 115 million US households. 83.2 million of them subscribed to some form of cable or satellite last year. DirecTV had about 19.9 million of those. And according to DTV there were only 1.1 million Sunday Ticket subscribers.Sunday Ticket is an important advantage for DTV specifically, but in the overall context of football watchers it's still a pretty small amount, less than 1% of households and only slightly more than 1% of those with cable or satellite TV. You can throw in some Game Rewind and illegal internet feed watchers, but I would be surprised if it made a significant difference in the number of multi-game viewers, let along whether they were skipping commercials.

So most of the football viewing public are still watching normal network feeds. They could flip to the other network for the non-prime time games, but that is about it. Also, I think we'll continue to see more product placement during games with the Budweiser Half-time Show and the like to help offset that.

 
It's amazing how all of this seems kind of like talk until it becomes just a touch personal. Found out from a friend today that a relative of his, who played in the NFL and suffered from early onset dementia due to the concussions, just took his own life because of the dementia.

It's such a difficult issue. Yeah, these guys get paid lots of money to play these days, love to play, and I love to watch them play. But with former NFL players being diagnosed with early onset Alzheimers or dementia in their 40s at a rate 19 times higher than the general public, SOMETHING needs to change. As someone that watched a grandparent suffer and waste away due to Alzheimers, I know it's a truly horrible disease. I can't imagine someone dealing with it in their 40s.

The fact that the NFL embarrassed itself by performing and releasing sham studies that covered up the effects of Alzheimers should forever tarnish any legacy that Paul Tagliabue had. He had the chance to do something about this a LONG time ago and chose to cover it up and lie to the players instead. I know that Roger Goodell gets a lot of criticism for how he is handling this issue, but bravo to him for actually acknowledging it and trying to do SOMETHING. Are there other things that he should be doing? Things that aren't even that controversial (like mandating players use the safer helmets, mouthpieces, etc)? Yeah, but at least he is stepping up to the plate and trying to do something about concussions and brain injuries.

 
It's amazing how all of this seems kind of like talk until it becomes just a touch personal. Found out from a friend today that a relative of his, who played in the NFL and suffered from early onset dementia due to the concussions, just took his own life because of the dementia. It's such a difficult issue. Yeah, these guys get paid lots of money to play these days, love to play, and I love to watch them play. But with former NFL players being diagnosed with early onset Alzheimers or dementia in their 40s at a rate 19 times higher than the general public, SOMETHING needs to change. As someone that watched a grandparent suffer and waste away due to Alzheimers, I know it's a truly horrible disease. I can't imagine someone dealing with it in their 40s. The fact that the NFL embarrassed itself by performing and releasing sham studies that covered up the effects of Alzheimers should forever tarnish any legacy that Paul Tagliabue had. He had the chance to do something about this a LONG time ago and chose to cover it up and lie to the players instead. I know that Roger Goodell gets a lot of criticism for how he is handling this issue, but bravo to him for actually acknowledging it and trying to do SOMETHING. Are there other things that he should be doing? Things that aren't even that controversial (like mandating players use the safer helmets, mouthpieces, etc)? Yeah, but at least he is stepping up to the plate and trying to do something about concussions and brain injuries.
There's not much of a point to placing blame on current or past commissioners (though that will be done anyway in the forthcoming lawsuits, which is a different thing altogether). This is an inherent defect in the basic structure of the game itself, compounded by the increases in size and speed by the participants over the years. Looking forward, though many in this forum feel strongly otherwise, I don't know if the monetary rewards will ensure a deep enough player pool for the sport to retain its attractiveness to fans; increasing numbers of parents will guide their kids into other athletic venues and football may come to resemble boxing, where only a small number participate and only in front of modest crowds.Measures like eliminating kickoffs may do very little to stem the casualty count while doing real harm to the attractiveness of the game itself. I don't think football can rule-change its way out of the oncoming train wreck.I'm sorry to learn of your friend's relative.
 
Well, I'm not sure that we can blame the size of current players a whole lot. Maybe somewhat, but it's probably the game itself more than that. Most of the guys involved in the lawsuits are guys that played in the 60s and 70s when players weren't as big or fast.

 
My first thought - and then addressed in the article, is that youth, high school, and college sports are going to have fewer participants. But at the professional level, so long as there is money to be made, there will be people willing to take an injury risk.

Having a shallower pool of talent from the lack of youth football would have a huge effect on the NFL, as would the relative lack of interest.

I doubt it's the death of football, but football 30 years from now will be radically different than it is today, which is also radically different than it was 30 years ago.

Regarding soccer, the lack of popularity in the United States isn't because of any lack of action on the field. It's because there aren't enough game stoppages to allow for paid TV / Radio advertising to cover the broadcast time. Look at baseball.. talk about a lack of action! But there's plenty of opportunity for TV to sell you crap you don't need... so hence, it remains popular.

 
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If anything kills my interest in football it is the lack of flow. With replays and commercials, we spend more time waiting then watching. In the span of a 3.5 hour game, there is only about 15 minutes of actual action. The rest is filler, commercials, and the over analysis of a slow-mo replay. People might say soccer is boring, but at least there is actually 90 minutes of play and extended periods without commercials.
Those interruptions are what pays the league $20 Billion dollars through 2013
 
My first thought - and then addressed in the article, is that youth, high school, and college sports are going to have fewer participants. But at the professional level, so long as there is money to be made, there will be people willing to take an injury risk.Having a shallower pool of talent from the lack of youth football would have a huge effect on the NFL, as would the relative lack of interest.I doubt it's the death of football, but football 30 years from now will be radically different than it is today, which is also radically different than it was 30 years ago.Regarding soccer, the lack of popularity in the United States isn't because of any lack of action on the field. It's because there aren't enough game stoppages to allow for paid TV / Radio advertising to cover the broadcast time. Look at baseball.. talk about a lack of action! But there's plenty of opportunity for TV to sell you crap you don't need... so hence, it remains popular.
Again, we need to stop thinking so conventionally about soccer. Why don't Americans fix what's wrong with it (from our perspective) and make a more attractive athletic contest out of it? The rest of the world can go spit.
 
My first thought - and then addressed in the article, is that youth, high school, and college sports are going to have fewer participants. But at the professional level, so long as there is money to be made, there will be people willing to take an injury risk.Having a shallower pool of talent from the lack of youth football would have a huge effect on the NFL, as would the relative lack of interest.I doubt it's the death of football, but football 30 years from now will be radically different than it is today, which is also radically different than it was 30 years ago.Regarding soccer, the lack of popularity in the United States isn't because of any lack of action on the field. It's because there aren't enough game stoppages to allow for paid TV / Radio advertising to cover the broadcast time. Look at baseball.. talk about a lack of action! But there's plenty of opportunity for TV to sell you crap you don't need... so hence, it remains popular.
Again, we need to stop thinking so conventionally about soccer. Why don't Americans fix what's wrong with it (from our perspective) and make a more attractive athletic contest out of it? The rest of the world can go spit.
Didn't we already do that and come up with football?
 
concussions are no joke brohans ive had a few and they make you do some crazy things point is that it is big problem and they need to solve it or they will ahve to adjuste the game and then there will be all the toughguys saying you cant take that out of football but guess what you might just have to if you want to keep it playing otherwise you might end up having to watch other stuff on sunday like probably a lot of nascar and bass fishing tournaments which i guess is pretty good but it is not lord football take it to the bank

 
My first thought - and then addressed in the article, is that youth, high school, and college sports are going to have fewer participants. But at the professional level, so long as there is money to be made, there will be people willing to take an injury risk.Having a shallower pool of talent from the lack of youth football would have a huge effect on the NFL, as would the relative lack of interest.I doubt it's the death of football, but football 30 years from now will be radically different than it is today, which is also radically different than it was 30 years ago.Regarding soccer, the lack of popularity in the United States isn't because of any lack of action on the field. It's because there aren't enough game stoppages to allow for paid TV / Radio advertising to cover the broadcast time. Look at baseball.. talk about a lack of action! But there's plenty of opportunity for TV to sell you crap you don't need... so hence, it remains popular.
Again, we need to stop thinking so conventionally about soccer. Why don't Americans fix what's wrong with it (from our perspective) and make a more attractive athletic contest out of it? The rest of the world can go spit.
Didn't we already do that and come up with football?
Maybe. If that's how it transitioned, it felt pretty good for a while, too. It's been a fun game to watch. But we might need to go back to the drawing board one more time and try something that causes a little less brain damage.
 
concussions are no joke brohans ive had a few and they make you do some crazy things point is that it is big problem and they need to solve it or they will ahve to adjuste the game and then there will be all the toughguys saying you cant take that out of football but guess what you might just have to if you want to keep it playing otherwise you might end up having to watch other stuff on sunday like probably a lot of nascar and bass fishing tournaments which i guess is pretty good but it is not lord football take it to the bank
Things are starting to become a little more evident now.
 
concussions are no joke brohans ive had a few and they make you do some crazy things point is that it is big problem and they need to solve it or they will ahve to adjuste the game and then there will be all the toughguys saying you cant take that out of football but guess what you might just have to if you want to keep it playing otherwise you might end up having to watch other stuff on sunday like probably a lot of nascar and bass fishing tournaments which i guess is pretty good but it is not lord football take it to the bank
The defense rests.
 
With that class action suit growing by the day, how long until Congress starts wasting taxpayer money to look into these matters?

 
Think in the near future you will see drastic reductions in the # of days where the players can go full-contact. Bet they could cut the # of days in half and it wouldn't have much affect on the quality of the game.

 
No one has mentioned (at least on page 3) that one of the key drivers of the NFL is gambling and fantasy football. Football is much more built for both of these things than the other sports and that is a HUGE driver of their popularity.

 
I coach youth football at the middle school level. If anything kills football in the years to come it will be Mom's. Can't begin to tell you how many Mom's I hear talking about pulling their kids out. As NFL players keep falling due to brain injury more and more kids will be forced to stop. Fall baseball and fall lacrosse are already getting popular here. And I have to admit that its getting harder for me to encourage football with my own sons.

 
I coach youth football at the middle school level. If anything kills football in the years to come it will be Mom's. Can't begin to tell you how many Mom's I hear talking about pulling their kids out. As NFL players keep falling due to brain injury more and more kids will be forced to stop. Fall baseball and fall lacrosse are already getting popular here. And I have to admit that its getting harder for me to encourage football with my own sons.
:goodposting:I always thought my son would play football, but the closer I get to that age, the more I am pushing him towards soccer and other sports. I love football, but the size and speed of players today is just a world of difference compared to when I played.
 
I heard an interview with Roosevelt Colvin yesterday. He said the changes in practice and year round training that is in the new labor agreement are so significant, that it may add five years to the careers of some players.

Goodell is trying to significantly reduce contact in non-game situations.

 
Kurt Warner prefers his sons not play football

Staff report Sporting News

In the aftermath of Bountygate and with mounting concerns about the long-terms effects of head injuries on NFL players, former quarterback Kurt Warner stepped forward this week to say he would prefer that his sons not play football.

Warner, a two-time league MVP who is now an analyst for the NFL Network, voiced his opinion on the “Dan Patrick Show” and on ESPN Radio’s “The Herd with Colin Cowherd.” Warner said the thought of his sons playing football “scares me.”

“They both have the dream, like dad, to play in the NFL,” Warner said on the Patrick Show. “That’s their goal. And when you hear things like the bounties, when you know certain things having played the game, and then obviously when you understand the size, the speed, the violence of the game, and then you couple that with situations like Junior Seau—was that a ramification of all the years playing? And things that go with that. It scares me as a dad.

“I just wonder—I wonder what the league’s going to be like. I love that the commissioner is doing a lot of things to try to clean up the game from that standpoint and improve player safety, which helps, in my mind, a lot. But it’s a scary thing for me.”

Warner, 40, who suffered multiple concussions in the NFL before retiring after the 2009 season, conceded he also is concerned about his own long-term health.

"I worry about the long-term effects for me personally," Warner said on The Herd. "I worry about what can happen after football, as we've seen with a number of guys. I worry about what could happen at a younger age. ... With the way things are going right now and the way guys are getting bigger and stronger and faster, I would encourage my kids to probably stay away from it, if I could."

Warner’s stance was criticized by former NFL players Amani Toomer, a teammate of Warner with the Giants in 2004, and Merril Hoge.

“I think Kurt Warner needs to keep his opinions to himself when it comes to this,” Toomer said on NBC SportsTalk via the New York Daily News. “Everything that he’s gotten in his life has come from playing football. He works at the NFL Network right now. For him to try and trash the game, it seems to me that it’s just a little disingenuous.”
 
Ravens' Pollard: Football won't exist in '20, 30 years'

By Marc Sessler NFL.com

Writer

Bernard Pollard believes the end is near for the NFL. The hard-hitting Baltimore Ravens safety has watched professional football evolve with bigger, faster players and vows the violent nature of the sport cannot be tempered by continual rule changes. He believes the equation doesn't work.

"I just truly believe, another 20, 30 years -- I don't even think football will even be in existence anymore," Pollard told KILT-AM in Houston, via CBSSports.com. "... We all know what this game is about. We know and understand that it's a violent sport."

Pollard is persona non grata in New England after wiping out the knee of quarterback Tom Brady in 2008, hovering close when Wes Welker tore his ACL during the 2009 season, and injuring tight end Rob Gronkowski in January's AFC Championship Game.

Pollard is unapologetic about the way he plays, and he's not alone.

"If somebody is going to get a knockout shot, OK, at some point somebody is going to get hit anyway," Pollard said. "If you end up getting knocked out because you're trying to get a knockout shot, it's either kill or be killed. Which one are you going to do? This is football. It's not powder puff. When Nike unveiled their new uniforms, I'm surprised they didn't have flags on the side. ... You're taking away the game of football. If a quarterback throws an interception, get his butt down or run to the sidelines. If you're going to try to make a tackle, I'm going to look for you. I promise you, I'm going to look for you."

Pollard suggested NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell has been hypocritical in his crusade to inject safety measures into an inherently dangerous sport. Pollard called last week's draft "a meat market," where teams openly seek out the strongest, fastest, most aggressive players available. Nobody is looking for safer, think-before-you-tackle defenders.

Pollard doesn't believe anybody attached to the game is about to turn down the piles of money flowing in.

"When it's all said and done, (Goodell) and (NFL Players Association executive director) DeMaurice Smith said they would take a dollar (in salary) if we were locked out," Pollard said. "We were locked out. I guarantee they didn't take a dollar. Ask them what their salaries were. Everybody wants to talk about these players lying to Roger Goodell. What about them lying to us? What about them lying to you?"

Strong words, as always, from Pollard, who admitted he doesn't want his son to play the game he plays, only to endure the fierce trail of physical ailments that come with it: "I don't want him to have go through it. I don't want to see my son with a concussion."
 

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