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Ghost Rider

Saints being investigated for putting bounties on players

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are ppl really mad about this? doesnt everyone on this forum complain about the "wussification" of football?

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hahah

Just asked #Panthers WR Steve Smith about #Saints bounty story. His reaction: "Doesn't surprise me. Wouldn't expect anything less from them"

Wonder why he would think that?
If Smith does not slow and at the 10 and showboat and runs across the goalline he does not get hit. If you are going to show a player up expect to pay the piper.

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This makes total sense. The year they won the superbowl, I thought they were the dirtiest defense i ever saw. Something wasn't right.

Your memory is not very good.

Atkinson & Tatum

Is the Raiders' 1976 Championship tainted? Do you think a Raiders' player or coach never paid a bounty?

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Marcellus Wiley, ex NFL player ESPN employee just said, every single team he has been on had a bounty system in place. He also said every single team in the league has one. This is no big deal!

I think Marcellus Wiley is a credible source.

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In an embarassing moment late in the Saints 2010 Wildcard playoff game, Gregg Williams was heard to say, "The next player to tackle Marshawn Lynch has to pay $10,000". After the next play Williams was heard screaming, "Dang it! I meant gets paid!!"

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Marcellus Wiley, ex NFL player ESPN employee just said, every single team he has been on had a bounty system in place. He also said every single team in the league has one. This is no big deal!

And every team in the NBA did under the table deals like the T-Wolves did with the Joe Smith ordeal.But when they were caught, they were punished...severely.It's a big deal.
Look Andy, I understand, no football and you need something but this story will go away quickly once the league understands what's what. It's a internal bonus system for making plays, every team does it and the League will not be able to hammer the Saints because they will have to hammer 31 other teams. It's a non issue.
I don't know that it's a non-issue, but if the Saints are to be penalized, the League should conduct a 2-3 year investigation of every team in the League to see if similar bounties were commonplace.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

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Is anyone going to take a guess at a punishment? I imagine a large fine(s) are guaranteed, but what about picks?

I'll take a stab:--Greg Williams suspended for at least a year (don't think it's impossible he's banned from the NFL)--The GM and Peyton suspended for 8 games or a year--Saints lose at least one first, and cap room is reduced as punishment for off-the-books payments--Not sure how the players will be handled since some of them are on other teams now
That's ridiculous.

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This could not come at a worse time for the Saints...player safety has turned into one of Goodell's main issues as well as something the media has been all over recently...even if Goodell didn't want to lay the hammer down (and I believe he does want to) he would be forced to from a PR standpoint...to not do so would make a mockery of his whole player safety campaign...he's in a position where he can send a message to both the players and organizations equally (i.e. neither side can wash their hands here)...I fully expect a very harsh punishment with a firm message that this won't be tolerated under any condition...while I'm sure other teams have done something like this it's not going to matter as the evidence against New Orleans appears to be overwhelming...

I agree that this comes at a very bad time for the Saints, especially during difficult contract negotiations by Mickey Loomis who's been mentioned in the NFL report.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

If the League were to conduct a similar 2-3 investigation of the 31 other teams in the League, the findings would be similar. The difference here is the Saints were successful and won the Super Bowl. No reason to investigate the Cleveland Browns, right?

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Is anyone going to take a guess at a punishment? I imagine a large fine(s) are guaranteed, but what about picks?

I'll take a stab:--Greg Williams suspended for at least a year (don't think it's impossible he's banned from the NFL)--The GM and Peyton suspended for 8 games or a year--Saints lose at least one first, and cap room is reduced as punishment for off-the-books payments--Not sure how the players will be handled since some of them are on other teams now
That's ridiculous.
Not at all. I mean, unless you're a saints fan (which obviously biases you here), there is no doubt they should be punished for embracing/encouraging this behavior, and have the example set that this is not acceptable behavior at all.I'd be surprised if Williams is only suspended a year. He should no longer be associated with the NFL.Cry all you want about other teams. They're not the ones under investigation or the ones that got caught. Let's deal with the Saints here. They're in deep ####, and the sooner you accept it, the easier it will be to swallow the punishment and move on.What a waste.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

If the League were to conduct a similar 2-3 investigation of the 31 other teams in the League, the findings would be similar. The difference here is the Saints were successful and won the Super Bowl. No reason to investigate the Cleveland Browns, right?
Yep, same thing with spygate. They have to make an example out of a successful team for it to make headlines. If it were the Rams, it would barely be reported.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

If the League were to conduct a similar 2-3 investigation of the 31 other teams in the League, the findings would be similar. The difference here is the Saints were successful and won the Super Bowl. No reason to investigate the Cleveland Browns, right?
Yep, same thing with spygate. They have to make an example out of a successful team for it to make headlines. If it were the Rams, it would barely be reported.
Especially those who broke league rules to become successful teams. I think we all predicted the Saints fans would fly in and try to dismiss this. Sorry, but the hammer is going to come down very, very hard on you guys. As it should. Sucks for the fans, but they should be directing their anger at Williams, Payton, and Loomis for condoning/encouraging this b.s., not the league for leveling appropriate punishment.

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Hearing 2nd in 2012 and 1st and 3rd in both 2013/2014 and Williams banned for life.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

If the League were to conduct a similar 2-3 investigation of the 31 other teams in the League, the findings would be similar. The difference here is the Saints were successful and won the Super Bowl. No reason to investigate the Cleveland Browns, right?
Yep, same thing with spygate. They have to make an example out of a successful team for it to make headlines. If it were the Rams, it would barely be reported.
Especially those who broke league rules to become successful teams. I think we all predicted the Saints fans would fly in and try to dismiss this. Sorry, but the hammer is going to come down very, very hard on you guys. As it should. Sucks for the fans, but they should be directing their anger at Williams, Payton, and Loomis for condoning/encouraging this b.s., not the league for leveling appropriate punishment.
I'm actually not angry at all. I'm pretty happy to have experienced a the fun of championship with other fans that poured their hearts into this team for decades. Being together to experience that is the real desire we all have as sports fans. Whatever happens to the organization or players as a result of this doesn't affect me one bit - other than having everyone and their sister ask me about it as if I'm a part of the organization.

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I remember watching the NFC title game two years ago and it really looked like the Saints defense was trying to hurt Brett Favre badly. In retrospect, that was probably a game where a lot of money was collected afterwards.

This wasnt uncommon. They got late hits in on almost every single play in almost every game - it was on such a thin line.

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Great. Now Dungy is accusing the Titans of placing a bounty on Peyton Manning. (ProFootballtalk.com)

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This thread is pointless and unreadable, a bunch of people arguing because the Saints got ratted out for doing what every team does.

I'm sure someone will be naive and think every team dont.

Saints haters belive they cheated, Saints fans call it football. The bias is running insane in here.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

They are called rats.

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Hearing 2nd in 2012 and 1st and 3rd in both 2013/2014 and Williams banned for life.

That's a good start.

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This thread is pointless and unreadable, a bunch of people arguing because the Saints got ratted out for doing what every team does.I'm sure someone will be naive and think every team dont.Saints haters belive they cheated, Saints fans call it football. The bias is running insane in here.

Well, whatever. If that is, indeed, the case, the Saints are incredibly stupid for being the only team to get caught. It doesn't matter now. The league will soon provide ample reasons why it is not worth it to continue this practice.

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Hearing 2nd in 2012 and 1st and 3rd in both 2013/2014 and Williams banned for life.

That's a good start.
Again. Ridiculous.

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Hearing 2nd in 2012 and 1st and 3rd in both 2013/2014 and Williams banned for life.

That is absurd. It is only somewhat believable because it is a Goodell's decision. I am used to him giving out over the top bizarre punishments.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

They are called rats.
They have 50,000 pages of info on this from the Saints organization. Its a bit more than just a rat or two. Someone was keeping extensive records.

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This thread is pointless and unreadable, a bunch of people arguing because the Saints got ratted out for doing what every team does.I'm sure someone will be naive and think every team dont.Saints haters belive they cheated, Saints fans call it football. The bias is running insane in here.

Well, whatever. If that is, indeed, the case, the Saints are incredibly stupid for being the only team to get caught. It doesn't matter now. The league will soon provide ample reasons why it is not worth it to continue this practice.
The Saints weren't stupid for getting caught. They were successful (it was obvious that they were trying to knock both Favre and Warner out of those playoff games, which was an absolutely correct strategy - old, proficient QBs - relatively immobile - key to their teams' success - why wouldn't you want to knock them out of those games?). Then the League conducted a long investigation into the questions. I stand by my previous assertion that similar investigations of ANY of the other 31 teams in the League would reveal similar findings. Former players have confirmed this.I will not deny that I'm a Saints fan and advocate.

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I will not deny that I'm a Saints fan and advocate.

And, as one, I can imagine this is a very tough pill to swallow.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

They are called rats.
They have 50,000 pages of info on this from the Saints organization. Its a bit more than just a rat or two. Someone was keeping extensive records.
Dude. The League conducted a 3-year investigation. These 50,000 documents are not internal Saints records, they are the results of 3 years' of investigation.

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I will not deny that I'm a Saints fan and advocate.

And, as one, I can imagine this is a very tough pill to swallow.
No. It's not tough at all. I'll take the Super Bowl win, just like the 1976 Raiders took theirs, or the 1978 Steelers, or the 1967 Packers....

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

They are called rats.
They have 50,000 pages of info on this from the Saints organization. Its a bit more than just a rat or two. Someone was keeping extensive records.
Dude. The League conducted a 3-year investigation. These 50,000 documents are not internal Saints records, they are the results of 3 years' of investigation.
The best part is that this is true, and yet there are people who think this will be "swept under the table". :lmao:

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

They are called rats.
They have 50,000 pages of info on this from the Saints organization. Its a bit more than just a rat or two. Someone was keeping extensive records.
Dude. The League conducted a 3-year investigation. These 50,000 documents are not internal Saints records, they are the results of 3 years' of investigation.
You may have misunderstood my meaning, but that's my point. You think they got 50,000 pages of quotes and anecdotes from a few rats? No way.

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I'm actually not angry at all. I'm pretty happy to have experienced a the fun of championship with other fans that poured their hearts into this team for decades. Being together to experience that is the real desire we all have as sports fans. Whatever happens to the organization or players as a result of this doesn't affect me one bit - other than having everyone and their sister ask me about it as if I'm a part of the organization.

Ditto. *shrug*Given Goodell's philosophies I fully expect there to be some disciplinary action and that's warranted. They'll be made an example of. But at the end of the day the game was played between the white lines and none of this stuff affected what actually happened on the field. There's nothing any Viking fan or Saints hater can say that changes any of that.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

They are called rats.
They have 50,000 pages of info on this from the Saints organization. Its a bit more than just a rat or two. Someone was keeping extensive records.
Dude. The League conducted a 3-year investigation. These 50,000 documents are not internal Saints records, they are the results of 3 years' of investigation.
The best part is that this is true, and yet there are people who think this will be "swept under the table". :lmao:
You're right. This will not be swept under the rug.

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Seriously, I don't know how you get caught on something like this...what, do you have a secretary record these things somewhere???

They are called rats.
You misspelled "Charles Grant" and "Bobby McCray".

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I stand by my previous assertion that similar investigations of ANY of the other 31 teams in the League would reveal similar findings. Former players have confirmed this.

I missed the link to players on each of the 31 other teams saying their defensive coordinators were handing out bounties for hurting opposing players, and that their head coach was OK with it. Perhaps you could post that link again. Thank you.

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I'm actually not angry at all. I'm pretty happy to have experienced a the fun of championship with other fans that poured their hearts into this team for decades. Being together to experience that is the real desire we all have as sports fans. Whatever happens to the organization or players as a result of this doesn't affect me one bit - other than having everyone and their sister ask me about it as if I'm a part of the organization.

Ditto. *shrug*
:goodposting:

Anyway, it's spilled milk now. And ... (looks over at the trophy case) ... the Lombardi seems to shine just fine.

No one repeats anymore, anyway. Your team wins, you think they'll go back a few more times and win a few ... but it doesn't happen. Might have to wait 40+ years for another one :D

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In an embarassing moment late in the Saints 2010 Wildcard playoff game, Gregg Williams was heard to say, "The next player to tackle Marshawn Lynch has to pay $10,000". After the next play Williams was heard screaming, "Dang it! I meant gets paid!!"

:lmao:

Gregg's not the brightest bulb. Looks like he was doing the same thing while with the Redskins, who aren't looking too bright now either.

link

The Washington Redskins had a bounty system for big hits on opponents under former defensive coordinator Gregg Williams that was similar to the one revealed by an NFL investigation of the New Orleans Saints, four players who played under Williams said Friday.

Three of the players described a coach who doled out thousands of dollars to Redskins defenders who measured up to Williams’s scoring system for rugged play, including “kill shots” that knocked opposing teams’stars out of a game. “You got compensated more for a kill shot than you did other hits,” said one former player, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

Of the four players interviewed, only Philip Daniels, a former defensive lineman, was willing to be quoted on the record. He defended Williams’s coaching. Daniels now serves as the team’s director of player development.

:lmao:

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In an embarassing moment late in the Saints 2010 Wildcard playoff game, Gregg Williams was heard to say, "The next player to tackle Marshawn Lynch has to pay $10,000". After the next play Williams was heard screaming, "Dang it! I meant gets paid!!"

:lmao:

Gregg's not the brightest bulb. Looks like he was doing the same thing while with the Redskins, who aren't looking too bright now either.

link

The Washington Redskins had a bounty system for big hits on opponents under former defensive coordinator Gregg Williams that was similar to the one revealed by an NFL investigation of the New Orleans Saints, four players who played under Williams said Friday.

Three of the players described a coach who doled out thousands of dollars to Redskins defenders who measured up to Williams’s scoring system for rugged play, including “kill shots” that knocked opposing teams’stars out of a game. “You got compensated more for a kill shot than you did other hits,” said one former player, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

Of the four players interviewed, only Philip Daniels, a former defensive lineman, was willing to be quoted on the record. He defended Williams’s coaching. Daniels now serves as the team’s director of player development.

:lmao:
Gregg Williams is definitely a caveman.

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Anyway, it's spilled milk now. And ... (looks over at the trophy case) ... the Lombardi seems to shine just fine.

No one repeats anymore, anyway. Your team wins, you think they'll go back a few more times and win a few ... but it doesn't happen. Might have to wait 40+ years for another one :D

+1000

If anybody is expecting the fans or anybody in the organization to wring hands and navel gaze while bemoaning their "tainted" championship...be prepared to wait a really, really long time. :lmao:

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I stand by my previous assertion that similar investigations of ANY of the other 31 teams in the League would reveal similar findings. Former players have confirmed this.

I missed the link to players on each of the 31 other teams saying their defensive coordinators were handing out bounties for hurting opposing players, and that their head coach was OK with it. Perhaps you could post that link again. Thank you.
Marcellus Wiley has stated that all teams do this (most probably without direct participation of the defensive coordinator). And unless you are completely clueless, you will agree. I said that a similar investigation of any NFL team would reveal similar bounties.

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Gregg Williams is definitely a caveman.

I sense a Doc Walker listener.

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