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Can we trust this Law firm? (1 Viewer)

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I haven't seen much talked about this signing, which is rare in fantasy circles anytime a RB signs with a new team and is reasonably expected to be the main workhorse.

What do you guys think will be his contribution this year? Can he have the same value as Benson has had the past few seasons?

And speaking of Benson, does anyone see him as having any fantasy relevency in 2012?

 
I think he will be a pretty good value and put up better than Benson numbers if they don't bring in more competition. I doubt you are going to hear much buzz about him.

 
'Slapdash said:
I think he will be a pretty good value and put up better than Benson numbers if they don't bring in more competition. I doubt you are going to hear much buzz about him.
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Over the last 3 years Benson has averaged 298 carries for 1143 yards and 6 TD's. How much better would you expect BJGE to do? Honest question.
 
I liked Ellis with the Pat because they were a pass first team and theier draws plays were very effective. Not sure that Ellis will have the same type of value with the Bengals. Ellis runs hard but he does not seem to be the most gifted of runners.

 
I think the apprehension is that BenJarvus, for as solid as he's been, was always perceived as a non-special player who worked well in his given role on a dynamic offense. A lot of people seemed to believe that any number of other RBs could've stepped into his role in NE and done just as well, if not better. This will be the year that you can arbitrage that perception, IF you think he can flourish in Cincinnati. I haven't made any kind of definitive conclusions myself on the guy, or his role. Let's see how the draft plays out, what the Bengals line and RB depth chart looks like, etc...

 
BJGE just plain old gets little respect. I think he is talented enough to put up the same kind of numbers as Benson if they give him the opportunity. At this time I expect his numbers to be very similar to what Benson has avereged the past few seasons.

 
'Warhogs said:
BJGE just plain old gets little respect. I think he is talented enough to put up the same kind of numbers as Benson if they give him the opportunity. At this time I expect his numbers to be very similar to what Benson has avereged the past few seasons.
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Agree with this. I like him as a solid if unspectacular fantasy contributor.
 
'MDSkinner said:
'Slapdash said:
I think he will be a pretty good value and put up better than Benson numbers if they don't bring in more competition. I doubt you are going to hear much buzz about him.
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Over the last 3 years Benson has averaged 298 carries for 1143 yards and 6 TD's. How much better would you expect BJGE to do? Honest question.
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That would be many more carries than he ever had in NE. I think those #s make sense for yards, maybe near the ceiling. I would expect a couple of more TDs. Reminds me of Rudi Johnson upside.
 
As a Pats fan, I've been able to watch him play every year he's been on the team. He doesn't do anything supremely well, but the dude has underrated rushing abilities. He's extremely strong, can break tackles, and never gets stuck behind the line of scrimmage always gaining positive yards. When he has a hole, he WILL hit it and can bust out 10+ yard runs before you know it. He's not ADP, but not many are. I've always thought that his receiving abilities were vastly underrated - he doesn't drop it when they throw it to him, its just that BB has always had more dynamic pass catchers to use (Woodhead & Faulk, for instance).

The guy scores TDs easily. When the Patriots are close, he drives it in no problem. Yeah the Patriots have a good line, but he has great vision as well. Guy should be good for them.

 
'Jason Wood said:
I think the apprehension is that BenJarvus, for as solid as he's been, was always perceived as a non-special player who worked well in his given role on a dynamic offense. A lot of people seemed to believe that any number of other RBs could've stepped into his role in NE and done just as well, if not better. This will be the year that you can arbitrage that perception, IF you think he can flourish in Cincinnati. I haven't made any kind of definitive conclusions myself on the guy, or his role. Let's see how the draft plays out, what the Bengals line and RB depth chart looks like, etc...
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Seems like Ellis and Hightower are one in the same.
 
I never felt I could fully trust him in New England. I think Cincy takes a step backward this season ala 2011 Tampa Bay. They caught some teams off guard last season.

 
His YPC was ugly last season, but he seems like someone who needs a lot of carries to get going (not unlike Benson) and the Patriots almost never game him that chance last season. When they did, he was a lot more productive. I think he's definitely underrated from a real NFL perspective (still can't get over the fact that he's never fumbled), but not so sure from a fantasy angle. He's going from a dynamic offense that kept defenses off-balance and never fully allowed them to key on the run to a team that looks promising, but also one where he'll be more of a focal point. Whether that's for better or worse remains to be seen.

If I had to guess right now: 215 carries, 850 yards, 7 td's.

 
'Sabertooth said:
I never felt I could fully trust him in New England. I think Cincy takes a step backward this season ala 2011 Tampa Bay. They caught some teams off guard last season.
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who did they catch off guard? i guess at tenn was their best win. at seattle? vs buff? they benefited from a cake schedule and the unlikely event of 9 wins being enough to make the playoffs.they will be a much better team this yr, and will have a slightly worse record and will end up very far from the playoffs.
 
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He runs well between the tackles. He doesn't fumble the ball and almost always gains positive yardage. He was on a team that has become a black hole for running backs.

If he is given the starting role, worst case scenario I see him as undervalued. Best case scenario, I see him as extremely undervalued.

 
Bengals seem to love him. They also seem to think he can have a much bigger role in the passing game than Benson. In PPR, he should put up better numbers than Cedric did.

I suspect Bengals will be pretty flexible as to when they take a RB in the draft and it will simply depend on value and who is on the board when they pick. Clearly, that is a huge factor in his value and I see 3 scenarios:

1. I think there's about a 25% chance they end up taking a guy like David Wilson, Lamar Miller or Doug Martin in the 2nd round (if one of those 3 falls that far). That would obviously be the worst case for BJGE and would probably end up in a 50/50 type split with each guy getting 200 or so touches.

2. I think there's about a 50% chance that the Bengals look at RB in the 3rd/4th round. Maybe a guy like Chris Polk, Lamichael James, Bernard Pierce or Isaiah Pead, depending on who is available and the talent available at other positions. Something like this and I think BJGE could have pretty nice fantasy value, depending on how effective the rookie ended up being.

3. Lastly, about a 25% chance that they don't address RB until late in the draft (or not at all). In which case BJGE would almost certainly be closer to a traditional workhorse type role with 300+ touches.

 
Perspective. Think about how you may have felt when you heard the news that the Bengals picked up Cedric Benson from the bus stop he was waiting at and gave him another chance. Were you thinking "oh, this is going to be a great opportunity for Cedric to finally show his true value?" Or were you thinking "this guy's not an NFL back, isn't cut out for the league, and likely is just going to wash out in Cincy along with all the other criminals." Or were you somewhere in-between?

Chances are you feel better about The Lawfirm's skillset and/or recent production than you did about Benson back in the day. Without echoing what other posters have said herein, he has a well-rounded skill set that's not flashy but gets the job done.

Say what you will about Bernard Scott's potential - the Bengals have regularly shown an unwillingness to use him in an extended role. In regards to incoming rookies, lets not forget how good of a prospect Shane Vereen is/was and how much talent Stevan Ridley flashed at times. Still, it was The Lawfirm that was toting the rock 174 times last season.

Do I think he's going to tear it up and emerge as a top-15 back? Not necessarilly, but it's not impossible. What I like about him is he's a disrespected player going to a disrespected team. If the pre-season hype train is slow out of the station on Green-Ellis, he could represent serious value in drafts and auctions.

 
Pretty sure that the law firm will play a supporting role, not a starting one. I expect CIN to draft another back.

 
I don't recall NE role-players doing much on new teams. Maybe Branch and Cassel are clouding my judgment and i'm not remembering good ones. For me, BJGE will likely be gone before I'd consider taking him.

 
From Marvin Lewis' recent press conference:

Q: You've had a chance to see these running backs in the draft up close. What is your view of them?

ML: I think it's a good group. I think it's got some guys that have the ability to be big contributors their first three, four years of their careers. I think they have opportunity to come in—they don't necessarily have to be the first-day starters—but I think as time goes on they'll develop into being great players.

Q: Would you guys still look at a back in this year's draft?

ML: In signing the guys we've signed, we've made a commitment, but not overcommit. And to really keep all of our options open when it came to the draft. And to have an opportunity where we draft to continually build the team through the young talent. We didn't want to overcommit in any area that would take us out of that.

Nothing earth shattering and pretty much echoes what has been said in this thread. Bengals made a "commitment" to BJGE in the form of a long-term contract for decent money ($3m per). But its not an overcommitment that locks him in as the definite starter if they can find an upgrade in the draft.

Also, the first comment about the guys in the draft not necessarily being first day starters but potentially being big contributors in their first 3 or 4 years also makes a lot of sense.

I think I would maybe up my percentage (I had said 25%) on the Bengals taking a 2nd round RB just a little bit after reading this.

 
I think he'll be fine as long as Andy Dalton avoids the dreaded sophomore slump. The Bengals will add someone else (they have to), but I can still see a 900-6 season.

 
'Geekjock said:
Perspective. Think about how you may have felt when you heard the news that the Bengals picked up Cedric Benson from the bus stop he was waiting at and gave him another chance. Were you thinking "oh, this is going to be a great opportunity for Cedric to finally show his true value?" Or were you thinking "this guy's not an NFL back, isn't cut out for the league, and likely is just going to wash out in Cincy along with all the other criminals." Or were you somewhere in-between?

Chances are you feel better about The Lawfirm's skillset and/or recent production than you did about Benson back in the day. Without echoing what other posters have said herein, he has a well-rounded skill set that's not flashy but gets the job done.

Say what you will about Bernard Scott's potential - the Bengals have regularly shown an unwillingness to use him in an extended role. In regards to incoming rookies, lets not forget how good of a prospect Shane Vereen is/was and how much talent Stevan Ridley flashed at times. Still, it was The Lawfirm that was toting the rock 174 times last season.

Do I think he's going to tear it up and emerge as a top-15 back? Not necessarilly, but it's not impossible. What I like about him is he's a disrespected player going to a disrespected team. If the pre-season hype train is slow out of the station on Green-Ellis, he could represent serious value in drafts and auctions.
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I think this is a good post on his chances. With the bold, keep in mind that Benson put up two #16 seasons in Cincy. I think Law Firm is a better back right now. If he doesn't have a considerable time share, I am going to pencil him into the top 15.
 
Two things:

1. Cincy could have easily/cheaply signed any other free agent RB (Hillis/Bush/Tolbert/Jacobs, etc)...they chose BJGE...

2. See what they do in the draft...if the plan was to have the draft help their RB situation, they maybe could have passed on BJGE and waited and signed a Bush, Tolbert, Jacobs,etc later as a compliment to a high impact RB draft pick....they didn't sign him to sit and just punch in TD's....did they...?...maybe...

even if they take a RB in the draft I think BJGE has a solid year...I agree with the poster above who says his receiving skills may be underrated.....can't really comment on his pass protection, but it must be ok cause you never know when NE was going to pass and he had to be in on many plays that ended up being passes....

BJGE:

1. Takes care of the rock

2. Runs hard

3. Scores TD's

4. It's hard to get a true read because of the offense he just left

 
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I know they couldn't be more different as players, but I'll never forget when Derrick Ward left the Giants to go the Bucs -- he was coming off a fantastic year and many people (including me) penciled him in for more carries, bigger number, etc. Instead, his role was scaled back. Again, different players, different teams, but I don't think we can assume that BJGE was brought in to be a workhorse. Or that he'll be in a supporting role, for that matter. Time will tell.

 
I think the goal-line package for the Bengals will be much improved with Wharton and Zeitler on board. This should greatly benefit BJGE as he's most likely to have that role, even with the Bengals likely to draft a running back today.

-QG

 
BJGE is really not that good. About his only positive is not being tackled for a loss and non-fumbling. PFF ran some stats and said that Pats faced 7 or more DBs on 80 percent of plays. So BJGE was only going up against at most 5 DL and LB on a play, and he didn't have a very good YPC. When faced with 6 or more DL and LBs(which is still less than normal), BJGE had one of worst YPCs in the league.

 
'lbouchard said:
BJGE is really not that good. About his only positive is not being tackled for a loss and non-fumbling. PFF ran some stats and said that Pats faced 7 or more DBs on 80 percent of plays. So BJGE was only going up against at most 5 DL and LB on a play, and he didn't have a very good YPC. When faced with 6 or more DL and LBs(which is still less than normal), BJGE had one of worst YPCs in the league.
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Well I'm guessing Cincy thinks he is pretty good b/c they have passed on all these RBs in the draft and free agency....
 
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BJGE's stock has gone up considerably in terms of fantasy now. They got a good run-blocking OL and gave Andy 3 other receiving targets to take pressure off the run game. He'll be a good buy this year IMO.

-QG

 
His stock has definitely gone up since the draft, but the question is how far. He looks set to become Cedric Benson 2.0 for the team, likely earning around 250-300 carries this year.

Where does that rank him among dynasty RBs? I have him somewhere around RB20-25 in PPR leagues (very few receptions throughout his career). I could also see how a contender this year would have him significantly higher. What are your guys thoughts?

 
i guess you have to expect benson type numbers with an increase in tds. hes has a far better track record at the gl and the offense should move the ball a bit better. seems that he will be a better fantasy player than real life. the risk is that he is not starter quality and benefited from opposing defenses selling out on the pass with the pats.

 
'cvnpoka said:
i guess you have to expect benson type numbers with an increase in tds. hes has a far better track record at the gl and the offense should move the ball a bit better. seems that he will be a better fantasy player than real life. the risk is that he is not starter quality and benefited from opposing defenses selling out on the pass with the pats.
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He's not as good a Benson.
 
i lean that way as well, and im a massive benson hater. maybe bernard will show up this yr, but i kinda doubt it, he looked a lot worse last yr.

 
Benson is still out there. Not a whole lot of love for Bernard Scott. If they do nothing, you have to like Scott's chances of taking advantage of a potentially ineffective BJGE. At least snagging considerably more carries than in seasons past.

 
'ChuckLiddell said:
Benson is still out there. Not a whole lot of love for Bernard Scott. If they do nothing, you have to like Scott's chances of taking advantage of a potentially ineffective BJGE. At least snagging considerably more carries than in seasons past.
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The Bengals might do a Leonardesque trade (say a 6th-rounder for someone's odd-man-out or I think there's a possibility they sign one of the vets out there. There is 0% chance they will sign Benson.-QG
 
the bengals and i even think Bill himself came out and said BGE was very adept at catching and blocking just he wasn't used that way in their offense. Woodhead was very good out of the backfield and Kevin Faulk was the premiere 3rd down back for draws/receiving and especially blocking for like 10years so their wasn't much need in that respect for BGE. he's going to more of a variety of touches. Benson had such horrible hands that Palmer/Dalton avoided them like the plague.........he's up in the class with brandon jacobs and shonne green

 
Agree with the Benson comparisons. He isn't going to kill it in the YPC department, but he's likely to get a huge percentage of the carries and the offense should be decent. He's a safe bet for cheap RB2 numbers as the roster stands today.

I'm not really buying his upside as a receiving threat until the Bengals prove they'll let their RB be something besides an offense lineman in the passing game. It seems that year after year, they prefer to keep the RB in and let the TE run free.

 
This guy gets absolutely no respect on the fantasy circuit. He should be a rock solid #2 this year and a good chance beyond...yet you will never see him on a top 20 dynasty list.

 
Can BenJarvus Geen-Ellis carry Bengals backfield?

By Gregg Rosenthal

Around The League editor

Around the League will examine one key figure under pressure on each team heading into the 2012 season. Next up: The Cincinnati Bengals.

Under Pressure: BenJarvus Green-Ellis

It's tough to replace a legend, but BenJarvus Green-Ellis only has to replace Cedric Benson. So why he is under so much pressure to perform in Cincinnati?

1. The Bengals want to run. They were a top-10 team in rushing attempts last year and fifth in 2009 when they won the AFC North. No matter what you think of Andy Dalton's arm strength, their passing game is going to be limited by a lack of receiver depth. The Bengals need to run.

(Incidentally, isn't it weird the Bengals are one of only 10 teams to make the playoffs two of the past three years).

2. BGE is coming from a system in New England that made life easy on running backs. Teams expected the pass and didn't devote resources to stopping Green-Ellis. Can he carry the load when the opponent knows the run is coming?

3. Green-Ellis averaged 205 carries in 2010 and 2011. With only Bernard Scott behind him in Cincinnati, he will be asked to do more. Green-Ellis is valuable because of his reliability -- no career fumbles -- but there is little to indicate he's a "foundation" back. He averaged only four yards-per-carry during his career.

Green-Ellis didn't have a 20-yard run all season. He only has four in his entire career. (510 carries). Those are not the numbers of a back capable of carrying a backfield. BGE is a rock solid role player that the Bengals are asking to do too much. They need a running back that can be a difference-maker.

Bengals fans may actually wind up missing Benson.
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BenJarvus Green-Ellis, Bernard Scott to share carries

By Brian McIntyre NFL.com

Over his four-year career with the Cincinnati Bengals, Cedric Benson averaged 19.8 yards per carry and had 25 or more carries in nine of his 56 games. The days of one back carrying the workload in the Bengals' offense appear to be over, however, Joe Reedy of the Cincinnati Enquirer reported Wednesday, as the team will move to a running back-by-committee approach in 2012.

A committee approach makes sense. The Bengals signed former New England Patriots running back BenJarvus Green-Ellis to a three-year, $9 million contract in March, but the "Law Firm" has never had more than 230 carries in a single season and has just two games with 25-plus carries on his resume.

The smaller Bernard Scott, 5-foot-10, 200 pounds, is the projected No. 2 back. He has just two games with 20-plus carries in his three-year career, one of which coming in a spot start for Benson last season.

"I think me and BenJarvus are going to be ready to handle how many carries they want to give us," Scott said. "I think it will be pretty even, but you never know."

Together, Green-Ellis and Scott could form a productive "Thunder and Lightning" combination in the backfield. Though Green-Ellis has a bit more speed than he's given credit for, he is a strong inside runner who will be used in short-yardage and goal-line situations (24 rushing touchdowns the last two seasons). Scott, when healthy, is more of an outside runner.
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'Faust said:
BenJarvus Green-Ellis, Bernard Scott to share carries

By Brian McIntyre NFL.com

Over his four-year career with the Cincinnati Bengals, Cedric Benson averaged 19.8 yards per carry and had 25 or more carries in nine of his 56 games. The days of one back carrying the workload in the Bengals' offense appear to be over, however, Joe Reedy of the Cincinnati Enquirer reported Wednesday, as the team will move to a running back-by-committee approach in 2012.

A committee approach makes sense. The Bengals signed former New England Patriots running back BenJarvus Green-Ellis to a three-year, $9 million contract in March, but the "Law Firm" has never had more than 230 carries in a single season and has just two games with 25-plus carries on his resume.

The smaller Bernard Scott, 5-foot-10, 200 pounds, is the projected No. 2 back. He has just two games with 20-plus carries in his three-year career, one of which coming in a spot start for Benson last season.

"I think me and BenJarvus are going to be ready to handle how many carries they want to give us," Scott said. "I think it will be pretty even, but you never know."

Together, Green-Ellis and Scott could form a productive "Thunder and Lightning" combination in the backfield. Though Green-Ellis has a bit more speed than he's given credit for, he is a strong inside runner who will be used in short-yardage and goal-line situations (24 rushing touchdowns the last two seasons). Scott, when healthy, is more of an outside runner.
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WOW He was better than I thought he was! His yards per carry have to be an NFL record! :lmao:
 
'Faust said:
BenJarvus Green-Ellis, Bernard Scott to share carries

By Brian McIntyre NFL.com

Over his four-year career with the Cincinnati Bengals, Cedric Benson averaged 19.8 yards per carry and had 25 or more carries in nine of his 56 games. The days of one back carrying the workload in the Bengals' offense appear to be over, however, Joe Reedy of the Cincinnati Enquirer reported Wednesday, as the team will move to a running back-by-committee approach in 2012.

A committee approach makes sense. The Bengals signed former New England Patriots running back BenJarvus Green-Ellis to a three-year, $9 million contract in March, but the "Law Firm" has never had more than 230 carries in a single season and has just two games with 25-plus carries on his resume.

The smaller Bernard Scott, 5-foot-10, 200 pounds, is the projected No. 2 back. He has just two games with 20-plus carries in his three-year career, one of which coming in a spot start for Benson last season.

"I think me and BenJarvus are going to be ready to handle how many carries they want to give us," Scott said. "I think it will be pretty even, but you never know."

Together, Green-Ellis and Scott could form a productive "Thunder and Lightning" combination in the backfield. Though Green-Ellis has a bit more speed than he's given credit for, he is a strong inside runner who will be used in short-yardage and goal-line situations (24 rushing touchdowns the last two seasons). Scott, when healthy, is more of an outside runner.
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More "thunder and lightning". More cowbell for the bell cow.
 
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'cheese said:
Agree with the Benson comparisons. He isn't going to kill it in the YPC department, but he's likely to get a huge percentage of the carries and the offense should be decent. He's a safe bet for cheap RB2 numbers as the roster stands today.

I'm not really buying his upside as a receiving threat until the Bengals prove they'll let their RB be something besides an offense lineman in the passing game. It seems that year after year, they prefer to keep the RB in and let the TE run free.
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Very true and with Gresham and now Charles, its hard for me to think that will change unless the OC has a new idea for things but I don't know if that would be the case seeing as to how they just drafted a TE and really ignored any pass catching RBS in the draft.

I know BJGE was effective with the Pats but its a different dynamic. I really think that Scott is the guy you would want to get out into space if you are talking about using the RB as a catching threat.

 
Hey, what do you know? People are projecting Scott's carries to cut into the starter's workload. This is what, 4 years in a row now that the coaches have said this?

Thanks for posting the info because it's interesting, but I'll believe it when I see it.

 
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