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QB Russell Wilson, PIT (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter ImTheScientist
- Start date
The General
Footballguy
Wilson's nerd stats like Passer Rating are crazy high, only behind Rodgers and Steve Young if I remember right. Ahead of everyone else. Guy is so good and for the most part gets credit. Everyone once and a while some writer puts up some clickbait about how he is a system QB or some nonsense. Usually it's not some meathead coach of an awful team.
MG345
Footballguy
Wasn't talking fantasy stats.
Wins I was referring to his total since entering the league.
I mean which side of the line are trying to play? He is very clearly playing better than almost every QB at this moment, and his season stats in terms of per pass are top 3 in almost every major category.
Over the past 4 years, he has outplayed pretty much everyone you listed outside of Brady and Rodgers.
MG345
Footballguy
Sorry, I don't keep up with who is a troll and who is serious. It is just funny to me how under rated RW is at this point. Not saying the Hawks are going all the way, but there isn't another QB I would trade him for. That he is still so young and showing such growth, I think people are hesitant to compare him to guys that have done it longer. But, he passes the eye test, his per pass #s are elite, and he is a leader on/off the field. What more could you ask for, other than simply time for him to catch up stat wise to the rest of the top tier guys?
And if that is your argument, that other players have done it longer, I won't disagree -- but that isn't exactly a counter point to how good RW is compared to the rest of the league NOW.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
How in the world is Ben better than Wilson right now? Ben's skill position players (even with Bell being hurt and Bryant missing the first four games) are miles ahead of Wilson's, yet Wilson is slaying him this year in performance and stats.dirtyjay said:
CapnJB
Footballguy
biju
Footballguy
Wonder what Pettine thinks now. If we weren't trying to run down the clock at the end of the game Russ could have had another TD.
He's also the tallest player to do it.Correction: He's the shortest player in NFL history to do it.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Stephen Cohen @scohenPI 5h5 hours ago
Russell Wilson joins Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Dan Marino, Aaron Rodgers and Steve Young as only QBs with 3+ TD passes in 5 straight games.
Russell Wilson joins Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Dan Marino, Aaron Rodgers and Steve Young as only QBs with 3+ TD passes in 5 straight games.
The General
Footballguy
Those bums threw interceptions.Bracie Smathers said:
biju
Footballguy
I'll wait until they are both playing and Wilson is seeing the majority of the work before anointing Wilson. This is still a run-first team.
Tau837
Footballguy
Are you really expecting Lynch back next year at this point?
The Seahawks have 1143 rushing yards in the 7 games Lynch has missed this season, an average of 163 per game. They have 923 rushing yards in the 7 games Lynch played in this season, an average of 132 per game. They just don't need Lynch any more in order to have a successful running game.
Meanwhile, the Seahawks will save $6.5M against the cap if Lynch isn't back, and it seems reasonable that they could count on Rawls as their lead RB going forward, whether they keep Jackson, Michael, and/or Brown behind him or backfill with others.
Just look at the trends, year over year. No drastic change, but there has already been a slow shift in progress.
Team passing attempts:
2012: 405
2013: 420
2014: 454
2015: 416 in 14 games in 2015, on pace for 475
Team RB rushing attempts:
2012: 429
2013: 399
2014: 388
2015: 339 in 14 games in 2015, on pace for 387
And now Wilson is having this amazing run of success, which should only encourage the team to rely upon him more in the future. IMO he has already been 'anointed.'
biju
Footballguy
I suspect they'll ask him to take a paycut (not sure how much) but also a reduction in playing time as well with him and Rawls splitting carries. The only thing I could reasonably see changing this is if we have a strong backup as well which we likely do not have on the roster.Are you really expecting Lynch back next year at this point?
The Seahawks have 1143 rushing yards in the 7 games Lynch has missed this season, an average of 163 per game. They have 923 rushing yards in the 7 games Lynch played in this season, an average of 132 per game. They just don't need Lynch any more in order to have a successful running game.
Meanwhile, the Seahawks will save $6.5M against the cap if Lynch isn't back, and it seems reasonable that they could count on Rawls as their lead RB going forward, whether they keep Jackson, Michael, and/or Brown behind him or backfill with others.
Just look at the trends, year over year. No drastic change, but there has already been a slow shift in progress.
Team passing attempts:
2012: 405
2013: 420
2014: 454
2015: 416 in 14 games in 2015, on pace for 475
Team RB rushing attempts:
2012: 429
2013: 399
2014: 388
2015: 339 in 14 games in 2015, on pace for 387
And now Wilson is having this amazing run of success, which should only encourage the team to rely upon him more in the future. IMO he has already been 'anointed.'
I think people are a little too dismissive of the impact Lynch has on the defense and their preparation. As much as I like Rawls, Lynch is still much, much better than he is. Plus, we're not nearly in as dire of a cap situation so we don't necessarily need to reclaim that money. We have 32 players under contract for 2016 with nearly $30M to spare. The only situation I like is freeing up that money to re-sign Baldwin, but I still would prefer Lynch return as opposed to saving that money.
Tau837
Footballguy
Probably not the thread for this, but I disagree with the bolded. Things change quickly in the NFL. IMO Lynch is in decline and will never again be what he was 2011-2014. Meanwhile, what we saw from Rawls was very reminiscent of the best of Lynch, albeit in a small sample size. I don't see that opposing defenses would prepare significantly differently to face Lynch than Rawls, but I'm interested in an explanation on that.
Does it make sense to keep Lynch because of his locker room presence? Would he be a good mentor for Rawls (and other RBs)? I don't know the answers to these questions. Smart organizations don't get sentimental about these decisions, and Seattle is definitely a smart organization. So they would have to feel that keeping Lynch at his price gives them a better chance to win than to part ways and spend the money elsewhere.
One thing is definitely true. You don't have to be in a dire cap situation to put $6.5M to good use.
biju
Footballguy
This is the part I disagree with, or rather, I cannot definitively say. There's no information on how long his injury has plagued him (or that I could find) so this year could easily have been due to injury. Sure, you can imply this is age related and he's wearing down or that it is due to his violent running nature and eventually that will be true. I still am not convinced I've seen a fully healthy Marshawn in 2015.
You very well could be right, but I think $6.5M to ensure (as best you can) another dominant run game in 2016 isn't very much money.
Hooper31
Footballguy
Fennis
Footballguy
Not on this site, but last year I was very critical of Doug Baldwin, but his streak with Wilson is pretty incredible. He tied Jerry Rice as the only receiver in NFL history to catch 10 TD passes in four games. He also joined Cris Carter and Calvin Johnson as the only players to produce multiple receiving touchdowns in four straight games.
Even prior to this streak, he was doing (blocking, running tight routes, being his usual sure hands self) and saying all the right things by being a tremendous leader for the receiving corps.
Even prior to this streak, he was doing (blocking, running tight routes, being his usual sure hands self) and saying all the right things by being a tremendous leader for the receiving corps.
Hooper31
Footballguy
Hooper31
Footballguy
I haven't responded to some of the discussion we've had earlier this year with regard to Wilson's passing attempts. Not even sure which thread it was in. Saw this past week that Seattle is still at or near the bottom in passing attempts. I'm wondering if Wilson's increases matchup with the increases across the NFL. Even when he's been lighting it up lately he's not getting anywhere near 40 attempts in a game. Also, saw some interesting data this past week (I think via Davis Hsu on twitter) with regard to the number of plays Seattle runs compared to the rest of the NFL. The discussion revolved around Seattle's purposeful slow play to attempt to keep the number of snaps down in every game. This is in regard to keeping the defense off the field more than anything else. The short version was that Seattle's defense has played nearly any entire game less than anyone else. Just food for thought. Will respond in more detail with data when I get a chance.
Tau837
Footballguy
This is interesting, and I look forward to you posting more data. However, nothing you posted here seems to address anything in the post you quoted.
Kwai Chang Caine
Footballguy
I know Wilson has been red red hot but with St. Louis weak on offense and the possibility that Baldwin won't be available, would it be possible that Wilson has a pedestrian game?
Hooper31
Footballguy
Apologies. Wasn't intended to be in reference to that specific post. Just wanted to let you know that our previous discussion has been on my mind and that I plan to share some information with you. We hadn't really "debated". If I recall correctly it was more of a discussion about data and where this data leads.This is interesting, and I look forward to you posting more data. However, nothing you posted here seems to address anything in the post you quoted.
Is Wilson throwing the ball more?
Is it a factor of pass attempts in wins vs losses?
How does the Wilson data compare to the rest of the NFL?
That last one is the one that interests me more. I believe (no idea how correct this belief is) the entire league is going nuts throwing the ball. Recent data I've seen indicated that Seattle is still near the bottom in pass attempts, but there are quite a few factors involved. Davis Hsu (I think) indicated this past week that Seattle is sort of the anti-Chip Kelly. They are purposefully slow to the line of scrimmage. They want to shorten the game. Less plays on both sides of the ball. I could just go to any number of websites and look at the numbers, but its all relative. I think its more interesting to know how many standard deviations away from the mean they are instead of what their rank is. Perhaps there is very little spread and the rank is almost meaningless.
Tau837
Footballguy
This is an interesting article: OL coach Tom Cable: If Marshawn Lynch returns, he must “adapt to us”
I read it as supporting my view on this.
Tau837
Footballguy
Here is some play data:Apologies. Wasn't intended to be in reference to that specific post. Just wanted to let you know that our previous discussion has been on my mind and that I plan to share some information with you. We hadn't really "debated". If I recall correctly it was more of a discussion about data and where this data leads.This is interesting, and I look forward to you posting more data. However, nothing you posted here seems to address anything in the post you quoted.
Is Wilson throwing the ball more?
Is it a factor of pass attempts in wins vs losses?
How does the Wilson data compare to the rest of the NFL?
That last one is the one that interests me more. I believe (no idea how correct this belief is) the entire league is going nuts throwing the ball. Recent data I've seen indicated that Seattle is still near the bottom in pass attempts, but there are quite a few factors involved. Davis Hsu (I think) indicated this past week that Seattle is sort of the anti-Chip Kelly. They are purposefully slow to the line of scrimmage. They want to shorten the game. Less plays on both sides of the ball. I could just go to any number of websites and look at the numbers, but its all relative. I think its more interesting to know how many standard deviations away from the mean they are instead of what their rank is. Perhaps there is very little spread and the rank is almost meaningless.
- The Seahawks are averaging 64.2 offensive plays per game. The league average is 64.5; the league high is 70.3 (HOU); the league low is 56.9 (STL).
- The Seahawks are averaging 29.7 passing attempts per game. The league average is 35.9; the league high is 42.1 (SD); the league low is 29.3 (MIN).
- The Seahawks are averaging 31.6 rushing attempts per game. The league average is 26.3; the league high is 33.9 (CAR); the league low is 20.4 (MIA).
- The Seahawks are averaging 59.7 defensive plays per game, which is the league low. The league average is 64.5; the league high is 70.9 (PHI).
- Though they are tied for #18 in offensive plays, the Seahawks are #8 in first downs, #7 in points, and #3 in average yards per play. They are #5 in percentage of drives that end in an offensive score.
- Meanwhile, they have just 13 turnovers and they are #5 in percentage of drives that end in turnovers.
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The General
Footballguy
ImTheScientist
Footballguy
He should be MVP. Had a historic season.
The Commish
Footballguy
No comments on Wilson's latest appearance? 
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